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#debian IRC Logs for 2010-09-26

---Logopened Sun Sep 26 00:00:08 2010
00:00<Impulse>and lost the ssh connection with the power down
00:00<qq->10 Sep 26 05:59<
00:00<Impulse>and i can't reconnect with ssh on reboot
00:00<Impulse>now i'm reinstalling again
00:00<jpinx-eeepc>Impulse: is it on your desk or remote?
00:01<Impulse>the HPMV5150 is a NAS device
00:01<Impulse>it only has a network port
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00:01<jpinx-eeepc>dunno what they are, but debian installs are usually pretty straightforward
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00:02<Impulse>NAS(network attached storage)
00:03<dpkg>it has been said that reinstall is aptitude reinstall '~i' ; or COLUMNS=200 dpkg -l | awk '/^[hi]i/{print $2}' | xargs apt-get -y --reinstall install, or dpkg --get-selections > my_packages.txt , then later, dpkg --set-selections < my_packages.txt && apt-get install . See also <aptitude clone> <debian clone>
00:03<jpinx-eeepc>qq-: Sun Sep 26 11:00:31 PET 2010 - but I have no idea why it thinks Bangkok is on PET
00:04<qq->either I ;)
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00:07<tim>i've had tons of trouble with mounting partitions so the default user can access new partitions
00:08<tim>is there a guide to doing so? all the stuff i've seen doesn't help. if someone is ok to talk about it i'd really appreciate it :-)
00:08<qq->!user accessible ntfs
00:08<dpkg>To get an NTFS or VFAT file system accessible by users and groups on the local machine, man mount; man 5 fstab; and read about the umask, fmask, dmask, uid, and gid options. You'll end up sticking something like conv=auto,uid=<user>,gid=<group>,dmask=0002,fmask=0003 into your fstab's mount option field.
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00:09<jpinx-eeepc>cool factoid - cos that can be a messy thing to sort out
00:09<qq->tim, ntfs-3g partition ?
00:11<jpinx-eeepc>tim if it's ext3/4 partitions, the usual linux permissions will apply, but for 'doze fs's it's a bit more tricky - use ntfs-3g
00:13<dpkg>If you're running one of the desktop environments in Debian, then ask me about <gnome-volume-manager>, <kde automount>, or <thunar-volman>. If you want something for the command line, then ask me about <halevt>, <ivman> or <usb mount>. For a completely different approach to automounting, ask me about <autofs>.
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00:15<tim>spoke a little too soon for my current situation.... the problem is not so much with access as it is knowing how to set permissions/ownership of the mounted partition... ntfs works great, can mount it, umount it, read, write to it... have an ext3 partition that for some reason has permissions that only allow root rw, all else get read access
00:15<tim>i think it might be related to autofs, never messed with it though
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00:16<Impulse>is there a way to restart eth0 after making it static without typing ifdown eth0
00:16<Impulse>is there a ifrestart ?
00:16<tim>the ext3 partition is an external partition that just pops up when attached
00:17<tim>no clue
00:17<Impulse>ifdown will kill the ssh connection to the machine
00:17<Impulse>so i can't type ifup
00:17<pipe>Impulse: ifdown eth0 && sleep 2 && ifup eth0
00:17<tim>why not just make a script that will... yeah, something like that
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00:18<dpkg>autofs is a kernel-based automounter that mounts remote shares when directories are accessed. See and Some regard it as a hackish p.o.s. and the 5 minute default timeout for unmounting is unlikely to be what you want. If you are looking for hotplugging support for USB storage, then ask me about <automount> instead.
00:19<dpkg>If you're running one of the desktop environments in Debian, then ask me about <gnome-volume-manager>, <kde automount>, or <thunar-volman>. If you want something for the command line, then ask me about <halevt>, <ivman> or <usb mount>. For a completely different approach to automounting, ask me about <autofs>.
00:19<qq->!tell tim -about selftell
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00:22<dpkg>autofs is a kernel-based automounter that mounts remote shares when directories are accessed. See and Some regard it as a hackish p.o.s. and the 5 minute default timeout for unmounting is unlikely to be what you want. If you are looking for hotplugging support for USB storage, then ask me about <automount> instead.
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00:22<Lantizia>do experimental/proposed/backports all work like backports in the sense I have to use -t to get something from them (i.e. they won't affect normal upgrades) ?
00:23<jpinx-eeepc>Lantizia: backport is only applicable to lenny
00:23<Lantizia>how nice ?!
00:23<jpinx-eeepc>Lantizia: and man aptitude | grep -t for the details of how to use that
00:24<NOMADICUS>What about automatically accessing features of a usb device. Example, writing a script that runs in the background that waits for someone to connect a smartphone and automatically connecting to it's 3g connection?
00:25<Lantizia>I guess my question is if enabling "proposed updates" affects updates... I know I have to use -t to get a package for experimental/backports
00:25<NOMADICUS>I wrote a script that will make the connection, now I want to make it automatically start when the phone is connected and kill the process after the connection is severed.
00:25<jpinx-eeepc>NOMADICUS: I plug in my n900 and it automagically is cconnected through the laptops wifi, and that was by using a mix of network settings
00:26<qq->Lantizia, don't use experimental !!!
00:27<NOMADICUS>jpinx-eeepc: I am using easytether connect & sudo dhclient easyther0.
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00:27<Lantizia>qq-, well if it's enabled it does no harm anyway it seems... you need to specify that repository to get/update a package from it
00:27<qq->!tell Lantizia -about experimental
00:27<Lantizia>wtf - no don't tell Lantizia about experimental
00:27<Lantizia>my question is about "proposed updates"
00:28<jpinx-eeepc>NOMADICUS: I have no clue about those applications
00:28<qq->Lantizia, NO
00:28<jpinx-eeepc>,versions easytethert
00:28<Lantizia>no to what!?
00:28<judd>Sorry, no package named 'easytethert' was found in i386.
00:28<jpinx-eeepc>,versions easytether
00:28<qq->!tell Lantizia -about ssb
00:28<judd>Sorry, no package named 'easytether' was found in i386.
00:29<Lantizia>qq-, would you fucking stop it?
00:29<Lantizia>qq-, you're just spamming my PM with things I know or didn't ask about
00:29<jpinx-eeepc>NOMADICUS: what's the output of uname -a
00:30<qq->Lantizia, seems you don't know about you are talking
00:30<Lantizia>qq-, seems you can't string a sentence together
00:31<jpinx-eeepc>cool it guys - English is used here, but it's not everyone's first language
00:31<Lantizia>Again... my question is about if "proposed updates" are like backports/experimental in the sense that you need to specify the repository in your apt line to get/update a package from it
00:31<Lantizia>Nothing to do with backports/experimental... just citing them as examples
00:31<NOMADICUS>qq-: Lantizia: It seems that both of you are each only who you are.
00:31<jpinx-eeepc>Lantizia: define "propsed updates"
00:31<Lantizia>jpinx-eeepc, umm it's an official repository
00:32<jpinx-eeepc>Lantizia: what's the url - I've never heard of it
00:32<Lantizia>e.g. deb lenny-proposed-updates main
00:36<jpinx-eeepc>Lantizia: that looks to me like a complete negation of lenny being "stable" :(
00:36<jpinx-eeepc>I use volatile, but I have never heard of proposed-updates
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00:37<jpinx-eeepc>yea - I read that with some horror
00:37<Lantizia>basically I just want to know if adding it will mean I'll get things showing up in upgrade/dist-upgrade... if I need to manually update/install a package from it like with experimental/backports
00:37<Lantizia>what would be your guess?
00:37-!-Tardochi [~Tardochi@] has quit [Quit: Saindo]
00:37<Lantizia>*or if
00:39<Lantizia>think it's the former
00:39<Lantizia>will leave it out :D
00:39<jpinx-eeepc>dist-upgrade is deprecated
00:39<jpinx-eeepc>use aptitude
00:39<Lantizia>I thought aptitude was deprecated as well lol
00:40<jpinx-eeepc>and tbh - I would not add that to my sources.list -- packages that are uploaded directly to proposed-updates (oldstable-proposed-updates) are not monitored by the Debian security team
00:40*Lantizia thinks qq- is deprecated too but that's another story :P
00:40<qq->To use these packages with APT, you can add the following lines to your sources.list
00:40<jpinx-eeepc>Lantizia: leave out the personal attacks please
00:40<Lantizia>qq-, you think? :D
00:40<Lantizia>jpinx, that response was a lot worse - I toned it down :P
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00:42<dpkg>Sunday is the day all trolls swarm to #debian, avoid at all cost to remain sane.
00:42<Lantizia>did someone say my name? :D
00:43<Lantizia>anyway back to work! thanks for the input jpinx
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00:48<Lantizia>jpinx, don't suppose you know how to look up the keys that debconf uses per package (so I can preseed the information postfix wants using debconf-set-selections?)
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00:49<tim>qq- i think i fixed it: it was more of a permissions problem (as it seems to typically be), thing is that originally whatever program was automounting partitions created and destroyed the mount directory... i just created permanent directories for extra partitions and set permissions for them before mounting :-P
00:50<tim>whatever! just so it works!
00:51<qq->tim, nice it works
00:51<tim>thanks qq-
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00:59<qq->Lantizia, was a citation from proposed-updates page
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01:30<tomg>I regret not buying my laptop sooner and putting squeeze on it before it was frozen
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01:32<EmleyMoor>I am still having lots of problems related to permissions and ownership after I rolled this machine back to a backup after a failed update to squeeze
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01:34<tomg>I think it was frozen before I would have gotten it anyway
01:34<tomg>Emley: what kind of problems?
01:34<tomg>I wonder if your backup failed to restore permissions
01:34<EmleyMoor>Well, hal isn't starting, for one.
01:34<EmleyMoor>It restored wrong ones as far as I can tell
01:35<tomg>are they all root:root ?
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01:35<EmleyMoor>No - they are other things but often not the right ones
01:35<tomg>I think what you have is a different /etc/passwd
01:36<EmleyMoor>It may have been, at the time of the original restore
01:36*EmleyMoor is investigating that point
01:38*EmleyMoor will see if re-running the extraction of the backup now will help
01:39<tomg>I guess I mean that your /etc/passwd does not match the IDs of the files on filesystem, I'm not sure which one comes first
01:40<EmleyMoor>tomg: My /etc/passwd is as it was before. The one present at restore time will have been different
01:41<EmleyMoor>(the original restore was done under grml)
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01:44<tomg>is hal really that necessary?
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01:45<EmleyMoor>tomg: I am trying to go back to how it was before - necessity is irrelevant
01:46<tomg>Yeah I was curious for my own sake
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01:47<EmleyMoor>Besides, its presence makes things easier for the other user
01:48<tomg>so, are we on the right track with the disparate passwd files?
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01:48<EmleyMoor>It seems possible
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01:54<tomg>tar will restore the usernames to whatever uids are in /etc/passwd, uids are not stored in tar archives
01:54<EmleyMoor>Damn - got a breakage I can't fix from within
01:55<tomg>or maybe they are
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01:55<EmleyMoor>Are they stored in numeric form?
01:55<tomg>I'm looking that up right now
01:56<tomg>According to info tar --numeric-owner applies only when creating archives
01:56<EmleyMoor>Would restoring with "--numeric-owner" achieve what I am trying to do?
01:57<tomg>what do you mean you have a breakage you can't fix from within?
01:58<EmleyMoor> is damaged and I can't see a way to get it back on a running system
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01:59<tomg>oh, okay. well I still think this isn't a really difficult problem, just give it a few more minutes
01:59<EmleyMoor>Next to nothing will now run
01:59*Efreak touches EmleyMoor
02:00<tomg>you should be able to clobber the filesystem from the tar archive from a live CD, I can't think of why this is tricky yet
02:01<EmleyMoor>tomg: How does that help my current problem?
02:01<tomg>EmleyMoor: I was wrong about it applying only when creating archives
02:02<tomg>info tar, in another place, describes --numeric-owner restoring using uids only and describes your exact situations, only with rescue floppies instead of rescue CDs :-)
02:02<EmleyMoor>So, if I redid the restore again, with that option, I would get there?
02:03<tomg>I think so, and it says that numeric IDs are "_always_" saved into tar archives
02:03<EmleyMoor>Right - in that case I'm taking this system down again to try that
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02:05<tomg>as far as your question about your current problem, I assumed you were trying to restore from live CD, I was just thinking out loud
02:05<EmleyMoor>A live CD was indeed involved
02:05<EmleyMoor>Back later
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02:40<altthought>well byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee<3
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02:46<tomg>now I wish I'd said something
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03:01<Ragelor>hm... does anyone know how to add XVID-support to vlc? ... strange thing: mplayer can handle the XVID-file, while gmplayer and vlc can not ... o.O
03:01<Ragelor>i thought gmplayer is just a mplayer-gui ???
03:04<tomg>gmplayer should be able to handle any file mplayer does
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03:05<tomg>probably they all actually do support Xvid
03:06<Ragelor>they should do (...)
03:07<Ragelor>[00000305] main decoder error: no suitable decoder module for fourcc `XVID'. VLC probably does not support this sound or video format.
03:07<tomg>actually I think I'm wrong
03:08<tomg>perhaps you have two versions of mplayer installed, one you built yourself?
03:08<Ragelor>no - just typen apt-get install mplayer (...)
03:09<Ragelor>it says: "MPlayer dev-SVN-r26940" ... for both mplayer and gmplayer ...
03:10<tomg>Are you sure it works for bare mplayer?
03:10<tomg>I think that Xvid is not included in Debian for some reason
03:11<Ragelor>mplayer /home/share/MC.avi works while gmplayer /home/share/MC.avi dows not
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03:12<Ragelor>Totem is also able to play this file (...)
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03:12<Ragelor>VLC not ...
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03:15<tomg>Ragelor: I don't know what's going on
03:15<Ragelor>:) me too ...
03:15<Ragelor>just switched from ubuntu to debian ...
03:16<tomg>congratulations :-)
03:16<Ragelor>hm ... before that i switched from win98 to suse, from suse to slackware, from slackware to gentoo, from gentoo to ubuntu (...)
03:17<tomg>I still think you have different versions of mplayer installed, thoguh they might be the same actual release version, or might not
03:18<tomg>but that doesn't answer your original question, how to get Xvid support in VLC, I don't know
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03:18<Ragelor>well - i would really prefer to use vlc ;-)
03:18<Ragelor>i just tried other players and the mplayer-thing was ... 'interesting' ...
03:19*astronut loves mplayer
03:19<astronut>i use it exclusively
03:19*EmleyMoor has restored everything again with the right permissions. Apart from hal, XKB and Horde's portal page, all is working
03:19<astronut>sounds like you need some gstreamer plugin
03:19<astronut>to answer your original question
03:19<astronut>i think vlc still uses gstreamer to do decoding
03:20<astronut>mplayer directly fronts the libavcodec stuff
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03:20<astronut>thoguh gmplayer should directly from libavcodec as well
03:20<tomg>EmleyMoor: Thanks for letting me know :-)
03:20<EmleyMoor>If anyone can help me track down these three problems, it would be appreciated
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03:22<tomg>Emley: Maybe I can help with hal
03:22<EmleyMoor>I try to start it from its init.d script and it says the action failed
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03:26<tomg>Emley: what's it's init script? I can't find it
03:29<tomg>Emley: actually I don't think I can help, it's too late and unfamiliar for me
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03:32<tomg>Emley: maybe try another time if no one can help now
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03:32<EmleyMoor>It's start-stop-daemon --start --oknodo --pidfile /var/run/hal/ --exec /usr/sbin/hald --
03:32<EmleyMoor>... that fails
03:33<tomg>yeah, you can run hald by itself, possibly with strace to try and figure it out
03:33<tomg>it could be bad permissions still
03:33<tomg>you could try re-installing
03:33<tomg>I mean just the package, with apt-get
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03:34<EmleyMoor>Damn - unable to write to /var/cache/apt
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03:35<EmleyMoor>Ah, missing
03:35<tomg>astronut: does he need debian-multimedia?
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03:37<EmleyMoor>Still no go
03:37<EmleyMoor>(after reinstall)
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03:38<tomg>Emley: it has a verbose mode I seem to recall from the man page, did you try that?
03:38<EmleyMoor>"it" being?
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03:40<EmleyMoor>Still fails after becoming a daemon
03:41<tomg>I mean /usr/sbin/hald
03:41<EmleyMoor>Yes - worked that out
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03:42<tomg>try daemon=no and strace, if any system calls return -1 it might be your problem
03:42<tomg>other than that I'd say try tomorrow
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03:43<EmleyMoor>I'm sure daemon=no won't help
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03:44<tomg>you can try deleting (or moving) hal-related directories and reinstalling again
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03:45<EmleyMoor>strace hald looks as though it might be helpful but I am having trouble deciphering it
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03:46<tomg>it is a bit overkill
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03:48<EmleyMoor>Looks like missing files, but are they important?
03:48<CutMeOwnThroat>did you run strace -f?
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03:49<EmleyMoor>CutMeOwnThroat: No - but I will
03:49<CutMeOwnThroat>-e open might be a useful option, too, as your problems are with files
03:50<tomg>Emley: those missing files are normal, try with -f
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03:50<CutMeOwnThroat>yes... that first output looks useless... it forks and then gets killed
03:50<tomg>and -e if you like
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03:50<CutMeOwnThroat>"-e open"
03:50<tomg>CutMeOwnThroat: So I'm not the only one who does this? :-)
03:51<CutMeOwnThroat>if you do it with enthusiasm, you might be the only one
03:51<tomg>that's hilarious
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03:53<EmleyMoor>Where can I get a plain 3-button mouse these days?
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03:54<tomg>I don't know and you can't have mine :-)
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03:55<CutMeOwnThroat>and pc shop?
03:56<EmleyMoor>Not seen a plain one for years
03:57<CutMeOwnThroat>you mean without wheel?
03:57<EmleyMoor>CutMeOwnThroat: Yes
03:57<CutMeOwnThroat>impossible to live without wheel!
03:57<EmleyMoor>It is the wheel that is causing me problems
03:58<EmleyMoor>It has its place but it's not when pasting
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04:00<CutMeOwnThroat>you can press the wheel like a button
04:00<gbsd_>you could try cutting or melting the top of the wheel away I suppose (thinking aloud)
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04:01<EmleyMoor>Yes - but I keep rolling it by accident
04:01<EmleyMoor>CutMeOwnThroat: It appears I am missing empties - thanks
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04:02<gbsd_>it it just annoyance or do you have dexterity trouble?
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04:04<CutMeOwnThroat>check if that fdi-cache file is present
04:04<tomg>I missed it, I would have asked with the die mmap_cache line was
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04:10<gbsd_>EmleyMoor: check out - note that original poster is probably a windows XP user :) might be a start to get you able to disable the scrolling anyways, the wheel movements are buttons 4 and 5 it seems
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04:21<tomg>commenting out the zaxis line disables the wheel mouse for me in X, for GPM you can just never use the middle button, the right one will paste in that case
04:23<tomg>changing "Protocol" "ImPS/2" to just "Protocol" "PS/2" works too and is probably the best solution for disabling the wheel of a wheel mouse
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04:24<tomg>well I'm going to bed
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04:28<CutMeOwnThroat>oh, he's gorn
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04:30*EmleyMoor can now confirm hal back to normal
04:31<EmleyMoor>Next, XKB...
04:31<EmleyMoor>Getting an error window when I log in... - will pastebin its text
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04:50<EmleyMoor>Got rid of that error just by resetting my keyboard settings
04:51<Mechtilde>Is Raphael Bossek here?
04:53<EmleyMoor>No layout indicator but I think I can find that
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05:16<EmleyMoor>Anyone familiar with troubleshooting horde on Debian? The front page of mine is mostly blank
05:16<petemc>check the logs
05:17<petemc>the apache logs, assuming you're using apache
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05:20<EmleyMoor>petemc: I can see access of horde3/services/portal/sidebar.php, but nothing else
05:20<petemc>the error log too?
05:20<EmleyMoor>Nothing being added to that
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05:22<petemc>php works with apache ok?
05:22<EmleyMoor>Not sure - how do I check?
05:22<petemc>create a phpinfo page
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05:23<the_kid123>Did anyone here go to SummerCon 2010
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05:24<EmleyMoor>petemc: Looks OK on the face of it - any specific points I should check?
05:25<petemc>EmleyMoor: did you create and view a phpinfo page?
05:25<EmleyMoor>petemc: Yes
05:25<petemc>try viewing horde in another browser, if you're not seeing any errors
05:26<EmleyMoor>petemc: Same on a different machine, different on the same, or different on different?
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05:27<petemc>is that a question?
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05:28<petemc>well, im sure you'll figure out how to try another browser eventually
05:29<EmleyMoor>petemc: I have tried now - same - just the left bar after logging in
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05:30<petemc>EmleyMoor: using the debian horde package?
05:30<petemc>its generally just worked for me
05:31<EmleyMoor>petemc: Yes. It worked for me until my "disaster"
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05:34<EmleyMoor>The thing is, all the things like imp and kronolith are still working - it's just the portal page that's broken
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05:36<gbsd_>it's not a javascript/noscript problem is it? I had that after a reinstall last week puzzled me for an hour or more :)
05:37<gbsd_>not horde but a nagios/cacti oprtal
05:37<EmleyMoor>gbsd_: No - unless there's something very low-level broken, js is working fine
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05:38<marcel>can somebody tell me how i get the ip-adresses of my access points. on the webinterface of my i only can see the mac-addresses. i read that access point works at osi2 level, but i don't know what this means. maybee someone can tell me that
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05:41<marcel>i searched in google but i only find ways for windows an not for the linux shell
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05:42<gbsd_>marcel: if you are install two or mroe new access points, and are looking for the web interface IP, you must turn only one on at a time, they are often set to a default IP, and will conflict until you change one
05:44<gbsd_>marcel: tell us more about what you are trying to to so we can understand better please (sorry, got to go, someone will be able to help though)
05:44<gbsd_>good luck
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05:46<marcel>the access points are working. but know i wants to change the transmit-power. the problem ist that the access point have no static ip they get the ip about the dhcp-server
05:47<marcel>and i have the problem that i don't know the ip, and so i can't change the settings
05:47<marcel>i only habe the mac-adresses
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05:51<gbsd_>marcel: ok, fast method, if you know the subnet they are on, ping the broadcast address, eg: what is your PC's ip address ?
05:52<gbsd_>marcel: depends if intelligent switches are in the way though.
05:53<gbsd_>marcel: another method is to use nmap and scan the network
05:53<gbsd_>marcel: another is to look at the dhcp server leases
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05:54<marcel>okay i pinged the broadcast and know i have some ips. i try if some is the right
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05:57<marcel>it works, thanks. now i know what broadcast mean :-) great
05:57<gbsd_>marcel: yes, doesnt always work, somne swicthes suppress broadcast pings to prevent flooding
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05:58<gbsd_>oh, i forgot to mention, you do "arp -a" after the ping -b to see the arp table IPs vs macs
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06:55<EmleyMoor>I am hoping I can get the horde front page fixed today...
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06:59<gbsd_>EmleyMoor: still no joy? - btw did you see our posts about disabling the mouse wheel further up a few hours ago?
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07:05<chturne>Really puzzled, just finished installing debian using the netinst image, and grub doesn't even show up... my computer just hangs after all the bios messages, can anyone guide me on what to check for?
07:06<chturne>I have encrypted disks, which I'm new too. I didn't encrypt the /boot parition tho
07:07<locklace>grub may not have gotten installed properly for some reason, maybe try reinstalling it
07:07<locklace>!reinstall grub
07:07<dpkg>See Boot a CD like <grml>, mount your disk read/write, (mount boot partition into your / partition if applicable,) mount -o bind /dev/ /your/root/dev; chroot /your/root; mount -t proc none /proc; grub-install /dev/foo (you may need to edit /etc/mtab and/or /boot/grub/ Also ask me about <fixmbr> <rescue mode>.
07:08<gbsd_>also, if you have more than one physical disk inside the box, is the bios set to boot from the disk you (think that..) you installed grub onto?
07:08<chturne>gbsd_: MY bios doesn't give me an option of which disk to boot from, I have four disks, and my bios only has a "boot from: Harddisk" option :/
07:08<gbsd_>oh lovely :)
07:09<chturne>Maybe the bios is scanning thru all my disks trying to find something it can boot?
07:09<Tommos>you can also install grub to all the mbr's maybe :)
07:09<chturne>Tommos: No thanks ;p
07:10<gbsd_>yeah, try the order, but I put grub on all disks, all mbrs the whole lot :) easy life
07:10<chturne>Really? Hah, I thought that was a joke... Hrrmm.
07:10<gbsd_>we rarely install/reboot though
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07:12<chturne>Well, what seems most likely atm is what locklace hinted at, I guess grub is on the wrong disk, but I don't understand how this could have happened...
07:12<chturne>(never happened to me before)
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07:14<locklace>i've had the installer write grub to the usb stick instead of the hard disk before
07:15<chturne>locklace: lol!
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07:19<le0>nice day to all! (here is 08:19)
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07:23<chturne>Yay! I got it to boot :-)
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07:24<chturne>But now I think the keyboard has defaulted to american english, but I need british english to decrypt my drives... Grr!
07:24*chturne finds an american schematic
07:24<gbsd_>the @ and " catch me out every time
07:24*EmleyMoor has a British Dvorak keyboard
07:25<locklace>!congratulate chturne
07:25<dpkg>Hugs & Puppies chturne, you did it!
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07:26<chturne>dpkg: Puppies! Thanks :p
07:26<dpkg>chturne: parse error: dunno what the heck you're talking about
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07:26*EmleyMoor prefers kittens
07:26<chturne>Didn't notice that was a bot :-)
07:26*chturne slaps himself
07:26<locklace>dpkg: are you a bot?
07:26<dpkg>i haven't a clue, locklace
07:26<dpkg>somebody said dpkg was the program used by Debian to install and remove packages, "man dpkg". Also ask me about <reference>. The main info bot in #debian is also called dpkg; ask me about <dpkgbot>.
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07:32<chturne>Uh oh... It seems my password should be the same on american or british keyboards.. What on earth has happened here. I can't decrypt my drives. Doh!
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07:36<chturne>And my root password seems to have changed... Only my user account password works. This is funny :-D
07:42<gbsd_>is your keyboard on a table or in your lap? (thinks: keybounce)
07:43<gbsd_>i get that problem a lot in bed
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07:46<chturne>gbsd_: Nah, this isn't me typing it in incorrectly. I've tried many times, either I managed to enter the wrong password in the setup (twice!?), or the installer has done something wrong. Though I suspect its the former. I'm using loop-aes, so not sure if there is some kind of configuration error
07:46<chturne>Might reinstall using dm-crypt.
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07:48<gbsd_>I used to set stupid user's passwords at night from bed (oncall) and the bounce in my lap (plus the quilt) was pretty repeatable for some keys
07:49<chturne>gbsd_: Haha. Well, I'm not sure how I can fix this. I think for newb like me, I ought to reinstall using the recommended defaults.
07:49*chturne learns his lesson
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07:50<gbsd_>oh, err, kernel keymap?
07:50<gbsd_>doesnt luks load at the kernel time?
07:50<chturne>I'm not using luks
07:50<chturne>(as far as I know)
07:50<gbsd_>lol k
07:50<jpinx-eeepc>chturne: look carefully at your reasons for encryption
07:51<gbsd_>got my head in BGP here, not really following these channels sorry
07:51<chturne>jpinx-eeepc: I want to protect myself from the English government.
07:51<gbsd_>btu you have to hand the keys over anyways
07:51<jpinx-eeepc>chturne: use a good password and change t daily
07:52<chturne>jpinx-eeepc: But how would that help if someone stole my hdd?
07:52<dpkg>paranoia is probably good for you, or doesn't mean they aren't out to get you, or you should assume they are, though
07:52<jpinx-eeepc>chturne: ;)
07:53<gbsd_>it's not that govt that's the problems, it's the laptop theives ;)
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07:53<jpinx-eeepc>chturne: you will get more hassle from the thief using all your accounts ;)
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07:53<jpinx-eeepc>unless you are a spy the govt couldn't give a rats fig about you
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07:55<chturne>jpinx-eeepc: Well, i'd like to encrypt my disks. Just /var, /tmp, swap and /home
07:55<jpinx-eeepc>and even if you are . you can't be much of one if you're screwing up encryption and looking for help in a public irc channel over a non-secure connection where anyone can who-is you and get your postal address.
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07:55<chturne>jpinx-eeepc: I'm learning about encryption....
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07:56<gbsd_>..the hard way :)
07:56<jpinx-eeepc>chturne: would you like me to order you a pizza delivery to prove the point? ;)
07:56<chturne>I'm not a spy
07:56<chturne>jpinx-eeepc: Will you pay for it?
07:56<jpinx-eeepc>hell no :P pay on delivery
07:57<chturne>gbsd_: Yeah, since when was learning easy? ;p
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07:57<gbsd_>when I were a lad we used to use 45 baud and 5fgs
07:58*chturne wipes the tears from his eyes and starts the installation again
07:58<chturne>where's that fsking puppy!
07:58<jpinx-eeepc>chturne: learn it the eaasy way - make a partition called "test-encrypt" and fill it with secrets and then encrypt itt and then crash it , reformat ait and recover it ;)
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07:59<chturne>jpinx-eeepc: Yeah, that's probably a better idea. But I've just started growing chest hairs, and want to show my computer who is boss.
07:59<jpinx-eeepc>chturne: you already know not to use characters in a password that can not be repeated on all keyboards ;)
08:00*jpinx-eeepc is totally hairy and the computer "still" wins a round or two ;)
08:00<gbsd_>funny _++
08:01<jpinx-eeepc>chturne: do the practice pice - please - the only reason for encrypting everything is to get good aat re-installations. ;)
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08:02<chturne>jpinx-eeepc: I know you're right :/... I'll take your advice on my second try. I don't even have anything sensitive to protect, unfortunately.
08:03<jpinx-eeepc>chturne: keep learning - you're doing fine ;)
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08:07<gbsd_>remote reboots get severely screwed up by encryption, which is why I avoid it most of the time. It hangs waiting for your passphrase before it will boot further
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08:45<gbsd_>sounds like a cyborg to me
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09:15<marcel>hello, at home i have a wlan network with a and two access points. now i want to know if my laptop automatically search the best connection from these three points. and i want to know if there are a command which shows me the quality to all access points. with the command iwlist wlan0 scanning i only get the quality of the connection i actually use... thanks
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09:20<dvs>marcel: iwlist wlan0 scanning shows the link quality for all networks within range
09:20<dvs>for me
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09:29<Garp>Question: Debian Lenny - Gnome desktop: I would like to have the gnome mount mechanism to mount my USB volume with shortname=lower, what should I do? Thanks.
09:30<cahoot>I'd try put that as mountoption in gconf-editor
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09:30<marcel_>dvs okay but i must diconnect from the current connection that i can see the other connections
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09:30<marcel_>dvs: are there other ways, where i musn't disconnect
09:31<dvs>marcel: I don't
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09:32<Garp>cahoot: Thanks for the help; I jsut ran gconf-editor (as user) I couldnt find where to put it. Any help? Thanks.
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09:32<Garp>cahoot: I have no 'storage' under 'system' how could that be? Thanks
09:33<cahoot>gnome-volume-manager missing? (just a guess)
09:34<marcel_>dvs: do you know i can solve this problem maybe i habe the wrong settings
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09:35<dvs>marcel_: i'm guessing it's the driver itself. nothing you can do.
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09:36<gbsd_>marcel, do you run X? i think wicd gives you a readout in dBm, not sure though
09:37<gbsd_>and I'm unsure how it gets the info for the gui, sorry
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09:37<Garp>cahoor: good guess! Thanks: < cahoot> gnome-volume-manager missing? (just a guess)
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09:37<Garp>cahoot: thanks you very much.
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09:38<marcel_>i solve the problem i must run the command with sudo
09:38<Garp>cahoot: I was browsing the web, and getting the same solution as the one youy gave me (or direct wrting in the system conf files) but couldnt find them and didnt understood why.
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09:39<cahoot>Garp: actually, judging from my setup, it seems the option you wanted is set as default
09:40<Garp>cahoot: not in my casde :( got ALLL UPPERCASE :(
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09:40<cahoot>not so pretty
09:41<Garp>cahoot: despite gnome-volume-manager being added still no key for that...
09:41<cahoot>no storage?
09:41<Garp>cahoot: (no 'storage' under system)
09:41<Garp>yes :(
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09:42<cahoot>then I'm stumped
09:42<Garp>cahoot: where should the flat file reside?
09:42<Garp>cahoot: I mean teh xml in the global conf ?
09:43<cahoot> gconf-editor does no better?
09:43<hi>hello sir i am new to linux plz tell me how to add dvd in apt repository
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09:43<Garp>cahoot gconf-editor gives me: system/dns_hd gstreamer http_proxy proxy smb
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09:44<Garp>hi: do you mean you want to be able to read encrypted (as usually commecial video dvd are) dvds ?
09:45<hi>debain 5 dvd set
09:45<amphi>hi: what are you trying to do?
09:45<Garp>hi: ha ok? Sorry, I dunno, I never used dvds to install debian
09:46<hi>i have 5 dvd set of debian 5 lenny
09:46<hi>i want install software from that dvds
09:48<Garp>desperate solution: mount -t vfat -o shortname=lower /dev/sde1 /mnt/EOS_DIGITAL
09:48<Garp>cahoot: I did it by hands :( But automount is sooo conveniant
09:48<dvs>apt-cdrom add
09:49<cahoot>Garp: ok I just use gphoto2
09:49<Garp>cahoot: well, I prefer to copy all images somewhere by rsync.
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09:49<amphi>hi: as dvs said, use apt-cdrom
09:50<hi>i want to save all 5 dvds in my apt repositories
09:50<hi>is it possible
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09:51<amphi>hi: yes; read man apt-cdrom
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09:57<AWRyder>Afternoon. I'd like to ask something but I have no idea where to start by.
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09:59<AWRyder>I'll get back to this later. Don't actually have much time.
09:59*AWRyder idles.
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10:00<hi>can u tell me how to configure nfs in debian
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10:01<amphi>hi: try
10:07<gbsd_>hi: and but it might be slightly out of date
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10:08<Deepa>is there any way to make my eeepc 901 into a wireless access point?
10:09<amphi>Deepa: if the wifi driver supports master mode, otherwise not AFAIC
10:09<amphi>er, as far as I know
10:10<Deepa>how do I figure out which card I have and/or if the driver supports master mode?
10:10<amphi>lspci will show the card, and the docs for the driver should say what modes it supports
10:11<gbsd_>lspci -v is a good start to find the card
10:11<Deepa>rt2860 it is
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10:12<hi>if usb use modprobe
10:12<amphi>my old ipw2200 did support master mode, the iwlagn driver for this card doesn't, as far as I know
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10:12<amphi>most do not, I think
10:12<gbsd_>there used to be a daemon called hostapd for some older cards, add that to a search with rt2860 and see, maybe you need to compile it in as an extra
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10:13<Deepa>the open source rt2860sta driver does apparently not support master mode
10:13<gbsd_>I'm very unfamiliar with eee h/w
10:13<Deepa>but the windows version seems to do >.<
10:16<Deepa>hi, no it does not support master, no it's not USB
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10:17<hi>how u attach your wifi card
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10:17<Deepa>hi, but since you were so certain that it supported master mode, I'd be happy to hear how to enable it
10:17<Deepa>it's an internal card
10:17<amphi>mini-pci presumably
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10:18<Deepa>Seems likely, it shows up in lspci
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10:20<hi>go in gnome desktop and select on network icon configuration
10:20<hi>on panal
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10:20<amphi>Deepa: someone in the other channel just posted - that's not acting as an AP, but might be useful
10:20<Deepa>hi, I'm using xfce and wicd did not successfully create an ad hoc network
10:21<Deepa>amphi, it's unfortunately not, my android phone cannot recognize ad hoc
10:22<amphi>that's somewhat pathetic IMHO - adhoc is much more 'standard' than master
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10:23<Deepa>what a silly idea I got
10:24<Deepa>I'll host the network on the phone and connect here :D
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10:25<hi>u should use gnome
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10:26<hi>deepa wt do u do
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10:29<cat>only that wicd disconnects the wired when I connect wireless
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10:30<hi>can u use gnome
10:31<Deepa>that's no solution
10:32<hi>i configure my wifi i gnome which was failed in kde
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10:34<hi>at which stage u r facing problem
10:34<Deepa>Trying to create an adhoc wlan
10:35<Deepa>from wicd
10:36<amphi>I've only ever done it manually with iwconfig, which was quite easy
10:36<hi>but ttp:// is good
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10:45<vik>plz tell me how to configure samba in debian
10:45<dpkg>Samba is a Unix implementation of Windows file/print sharing (the SMB/CIFS protocol). Documentation resources: , . Backported Samba 3.4.8 packages for Lenny are available, ask me about <bdo>. #samba on See also <swat>.
10:46<vik>or bind
10:46<dpkg>it has been said that bind is the Berkeley Internet Name Daemon, a Domain Name System (DNS) server. To install: "aptitude install bind9 bind9-doc". See also <bind9 lenny>, <bind9 chroot>. #bind on
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10:46<vik>how to configure bind
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10:48<vik>how to install fonts
10:48<amphi>you have used up your allowance of questions for today
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10:49<vik>i need some answers from some days
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10:51<vik>ok sir plz tell me how to set system volume
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10:54<vik>ok sir plz tell me how to set system volume
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10:55<vik>ok sir plz tell me how to set system volume
10:55<cahoot>!debian reference
10:55<dpkg>The Debian Reference will answer most of your questions about Debian. The latest version (v2) is at . Read it after installing Debian and before asking for support, as it is the closest thing Debian has to a manual. You can install this too, the package name is debian-reference: 'aptitude install debian-reference'
10:55<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
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10:57<vik>plz help me
10:58<ml|>dpkg repeat
10:58<dpkg>Please don't immediately repeat your question if no one answers it. If no one answers, that means that either no one knows the answer to your question, no one is willing to answer it, or you haven't provided enough information. Ask me about <ask> or <sicco> if you need help phrasing your question. If you don't get an answer here, go ahead and try asking your question on
10:59<vik>ok sir plz tell me how to set system volume
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10:59<petemc>vik: alsamixer
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11:07<vik>alsamixer great
11:07<vik>any other way
11:08<cahoot>why? not content with the advice?
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11:21<the_kid123>Hello all, did anyone go to SummerC0n 2010?
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12:02<Lantizia>hey can anyone remind me of that command that tells me why a package got installed?
12:02<Lantizia>ah nevermind! aptitude why it was :)
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12:30<bino>good afternoon
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13:04<gbsd_>hmm, Tiscalli/F2S/Opal not well in my neck of the woods
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13:11<Lynxx>someone with ubuntu ?
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13:12<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian, and it is unlikely to live up to Debian's standards (see <Debian policy>). Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu ( instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian>.
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13:14<Lynxx>i need configure the Xorg.conf by hand and i cant
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13:14<ichdasich>Lynxx: !ubuntu ;-)
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13:17<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian, and it is unlikely to live up to Debian's standards (see <Debian policy>). Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu ( instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian>.
13:17<ichdasich>Lynxx: :-)
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13:17<Lynxx>hallo ichdasich
13:18<Lynxx>hilfe ,bitte?
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13:18<bremner>!de Lynxx
13:18<f8l>!de > Lynxx
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13:20<Lynxx>for fill up the Xorg.conf , any way ?
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13:25<bremner>Lynxx: we don't know what version of Xorg is installed in your Ubuntu. You need to ask in #ubuntu on
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13:25<Lynxx>bremner version about X ? omg
13:26<Lynxx>I just created it with gksudo /.../...
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14:32<jesperj>an encrypted Debian installation on a hdd can be backedup by using dd to copy the hdd to a file like backup.img right?
14:32<pipe>Yes, but it's not good practice
14:32<jesperj>pipe: why not (and what IS if so)?
14:32<pipe>You shouldn't image encrypted containers
14:33<pipe>Because there are some crypto attacks that can be easier if someone gain access to the backup and the new data
14:33<pipe>If a known file has changed, for example a bootloader
14:33<pipe>It's probably mostly theoretical, but still
14:33<jesperj>I'll have the copy of the system in a truecrypt volume though :)
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14:34<pipe>Ok, that should probably work, hope you have the keys to the backup in a safe place though, and I mean that as "you won't lose it"
14:34<pipe>An encrypted backup without the key isn't very useful :P
14:34<jesperj>if not using dd, then how should I do it instead? I need to make a backup of the system though and be able to restore the hdd exactly how it was on the original hdd
14:35<pipe>If you actually really need to restore it exactly, then dd is fine
14:35<jesperj>pipe: *nods* very true *keeps keys safe*
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14:36<jesperj>pipe: yeah I think I have that need. I want a full copy of the system so if anything goes wrong I'll be able to restore a backup so the hdd is "exacly like before"
14:36<jesperj>hmm I think I said that allready (long day here)
14:37<pipe>Another "problem" with backing up an encrypted volume is that it's impossible to compress
14:37<jesperj>ok so, a dd image of the hdd might make an attack easier to crack the encryption. what would you suggest instead?
14:38<jesperj>that's ok
14:38<pipe>Well, if you keep the backup in another encrypted container with a different key, then there's no problem I guess
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14:39<jesperj>even if it were the same key would it matter? (I do use different keys but still)
14:39<jesperj>I mean the copy would still be inside the encrypted container
14:39<jesperj>so how would it matter?
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14:39<pipe>It would probably not matter, it would have different salts
14:40<jesperj>ok. you're just being careful. that is wise
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14:40<jesperj>better too safe than sorry
14:40<jesperj>thank you for the input pipe
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14:59<andersom_cruz>hi wverybody
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15:01<andersom_cruz>how are you???
15:01<andersom_cruz>anything problem with your servers??
15:01<pipe>yes, it keeps exploding
15:01<andersom_cruz>i'm inspired today...
15:01<andersom_cruz>what the matter???
15:01<andersom_cruz>what your plobem
15:02<pipe>I installed the lhc package which turned it into a large particle accelerator
15:02<andersom_cruz>i don't undersatand, explain again
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15:03<andersom_cruz>a large paticle accelerator???
15:03<pipe>then the server started to spin very fast and now it just keeps colliding with itself
15:03<andersom_cruz>are you a cientist?
15:03<pipe>all the bits
15:04<pipe>not really
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15:10<tomg>that was weird
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15:15<dpkg>Sunday is the day all trolls swarm to #debian, avoid at all cost to remain sane.
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15:16<jesperj>that was FUN
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15:18<dpkg>Looks like someone is having a case of the mondays!, or see <tuesday>
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15:18<pipe>Soon monday here anyway.
15:18<jesperj>bye for now. thanks for the input pipe.
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16:02<valessio> now with +3k debian users reports.
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16:32<IvyKing>hi , can some one tell me how do i start a process during boot before login
16:33<tomg>sure, what kind of process do you want?
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16:35<IvyKing>i want to run watch dog , before login
16:36<IvyKing>i configured watch dog , but it only runs if i use nodm for some reason
16:37<tomg>how can you tell it's running or not running?
16:37<IvyKing>if i try to login via tty , the watchdog times out and reboot
16:37<IvyKing>if i enable nodm , no reboots occurs
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16:38<tomg>do you mean the watchdog package when you say watch dog or watchdog?
16:38<IvyKing>yes watchdog package
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16:41<tomg>I never heard of nodm before now, but I think it might be stopping watchdog from starting, like you say
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16:42<pipe>nodm is great
16:42<pipe>I run it on my HTPC and my phone
16:43<pipe>And it sounds weird that it should do anything, it really only starts up X
16:43<tomg>Is nodm merely a way to have X started and logged in without a dm?
16:43<tomg>what kind of phone do you have? :-)
16:43-!-kaziem [] has joined #debian
16:43<pipe>neo freerunner
16:43<tomg>holy carp, it runs Debian
16:43<IvyKing>i want to try starting the process before the login , may be that would fix it
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16:44<pipe>tomg: everything runs debian with enough tweaking ;)
16:45<tomg>Ivyking: I don't know how nodm works, but you can move it up in the boot order by changing its name in /etc/rc2.d/
16:45<tomg>I mean you can move up watchdog
16:45<IvyKing>ok , will try that now
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16:46<tomg>pipe: I live in Canada and we have a more limited smartphone selection, I would like to run Linux on a smartphone, not necessarily Debian, but don't even know if that's possible, or if I can do it ... in any reasonable amount of time
16:46-!-vizor [~vizor@] has joined #debian
16:46<pipe>tomg: I'm not the best person to ask this, because I really don't care about smartphones, I've never bought one, and I only installed debian on this because someone gave me the phone for free. :P
16:47<tomg>that's the best way :-)
16:47<IvyKing>get yourself one n900 , it runs maemo , u can install shr , debian , meego , debian , ubuntu on it..
16:48<amphi>yes, n900 looks nice - expensive toy, though
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16:49<tomg>never though I'd see esd on a phone
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16:51<IvyKing>in rc2.d , all items start with S01<name> ,S02<name> , S03<name> , watch dog is in S03 , should i change it to S01 ?
16:51<pipe>If you need to tweak this stuff, it's not a reliable watchdog at all
16:52<pipe>"oops I installed some unrelated package, my critical watchdog now stopped running"
16:52<tomg>If it's S03 and not S89 like it is on my system, I don't have any more ideas
16:53<IvyKing>i will try to rename it and see what happens
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16:58<IvyKing>ah well , i took a closer look , watch dog keep alive deamon is actually stared before login , but for some reason , it is also stopped before login
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17:15<bremner>moby: try !list
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17:18<jawnsy>is there any way to move your system to LVM (excluding /boot and /sbin maybe) without making your system look like BSD and mounting /home, /var, etc as separate volumes?
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17:18<astronut>jawnsy: you mean jus thave / on LVM?
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17:19<astronut>FYI you only need /boot seperate, /sbin can live on /, everything needed in it is included in the initramfs on /boot
17:19<jawnsy>I tried just creating a new partition as LVM, copying everything over to it.. but when I rebooted, I don't think it managed to find /boot, so I just got a blinking cursor :/
17:19<astronut>you have /boot seperate?
17:19<astronut>did you regenerate your initramfs?
17:20<jawnsy>heh, yes, I suppose that was the crucial trick I was missing.. my answers are no and no
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17:20<jawnsy>is there a tutorial that talks about how to do this?
17:20<jawnsy>the only one I found seems to be for Fedora Core 3, and is telling me to mount stuff like /home and /var on separate LVM volumes
17:20<pipe>the reason it does that is because lvm makes such a thing easier
17:21<jawnsy>pipe: makes what easier?
17:21<pipe>splitting partitions
17:21<astronut>jawnsy: just ignore the /home and /var part
17:21<jawnsy>I'm not sure doing this even has all that much value to me, as it is, the system is running inside a VM.. so I can resize the "disks" as needed anyway
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17:21<astronut>but you need a seperate /boot
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17:21<astronut>what's your starting point?
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17:22<astronut>runnign system, new install?
17:22<jawnsy>running system, with lots of crap on it
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17:22<jawnsy>but I have a backup of the image, so I can revert all the fiddling I did with it today
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17:22<astronut>what's the partition setup?
17:23<jawnsy>well, it *was* just whatever came with Debian, but now I've gone and fucked it up (which I can revert, of course)
17:23<astronut>there are several defaults
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17:23<jawnsy>at this point, I have a system with a separately mounted /var and /home so far
17:23<jawnsy>hmm.. well, everything is on /
17:23<jawnsy>except /tmp, which is on tmpfs
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17:24<astronut>no /boot?
17:24<jawnsy>and /dev which is on devpts, /proc on procfs...
17:24<astronut>the thing is, you need tons of space to handle the partitions
17:24<jawnsy>the /boot is under /, it's not separate
17:24<astronut>the problem is you can't really do a non-destructive conversion
17:24<astronut>which means you need enough space to play with your partitions
17:24<jawnsy>well, I can just add a new "disk" as this is in VMware
17:24<astronut>it's doable but requires a lot of juggling and a decent bit of spare disk
17:24<astronut>so your best bet is to add a second disk
17:25<astronut>partition that the way you want
17:25<astronut>and move stuff over
17:25<astronut>then get rid of the original disk
17:25<pipe>You also need to fight with grub
17:25<pipe>Which is impossible
17:25<astronut>pipe: it's not as bad as lilo
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17:25<astronut>easist way is to copy stuff over, chroot and run grub-install
17:25<jawnsy>well, I guess I should back up and really be asking: is LVM useful for someone running a system in VMware (who is thus able to resize VMware disks anyway)?
17:26<astronut>jawnsy: why do you want it?
17:26<astronut>snapshot stuff can be useful
17:26<astronut>but i guess vmware does that too
17:26<pipe>Sounds quite useless, you can snapshot in the vm
17:27<jawnsy>I just needed snapshots for schroot/sbuild, though it occurs to me that I can just use a separate VMware disks "physical volume" for those chroots, and leave my system as-is
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17:33<ComradeH1z`>Hi all, running Debian Unstable and I am suffering from what is essentially this bug: Anyone know how to fix this?
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17:34<pipe>ComradeH1z`: Do you need to connect braille displays to your computer
17:34<pipe>So purge the brltty package if possible
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17:35<ComradeHaz`>Oh, I'm sorry, I pasted teh wrong link.
17:35<ComradeHaz`>Mine is SYSFS{}= will be removed in a future udev version, please use ATTR{}= to match the event device, or ATTRS{}= to match a parent device, in /etc/udev/rules.d/025_logitechmouse.rules:20
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17:36<pipe>Is that a bug?
17:36<pipe>What does that break?
17:36-!-floe_ [] has joined #debian
17:38<ComradeHaz`>Well, it get's spammed like mad to syslog whenever udev is restarted
17:38-!-jivesh [] has joined #debian
17:38<ComradeHaz`>(and has been for months now)
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17:40<ComradeHaz`>Hmm, I think I am actually safe just to remove that set of rules
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17:42<ComradeHaz`>Well, I've deleted it, hopefully that'll be OK :D
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19:07<jawnsy>can I install an amd64 chroot in an i386 Debian install?
19:08<pipe>That's a very good question.
19:08<jawnsy>I hope you can, or I'll have to reimage my machine :/
19:08<jawnsy>well I don't have to, but it'd be nice to be able to test with amd64
19:09<abrotman>qemu might be an optoin
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19:11<bzed>jawnsy: you can, if you run an amd64 kernel
19:11<bremner>jawnsy: chroot doesn't change the kernel
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19:12<bremner>I guess in principle you might be able to install an amd64 kernel on your i386 install. Never done it, don't know the details.
19:13<cthuluh>I doubt it could work, but I'm curious, so if you try it, please tell us :)
19:13<jawnsy>I guess I could upgrade to an amd64 kernel
19:13<jawnsy>btw, anyone have opinions on apt-cacher-ng vs approx vs all the other ones? :)
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19:13<bremner>I'm happy enough with approx
19:13<pipe>I recently tried some, can't remember what I ended up using
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19:14<jawnsy>bremner: does Approx let you share /var/cache/apt/archives ?
19:14<jawnsy>bremner: apt-cacher ng has some feature that lets you delete unneeded files, where they aren't being referenced by any index files anymore
19:14<jawnsy>I just want something that will share as much as possible between my system and my chroots
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19:15<cthuluh>I'm happy enough with apt-cacher-ng :)
19:15<pipe>I think I just realized that with my fast network and only a handful of machines, any proxy or cache didn't make any difference
19:15<bremner>jawnsy: don't know about the first; just run your system through approx then
19:15<pipe>Do you use them for other purposes?
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19:15<jawnsy>bremner: but that doesn't stop apt from cluttering /var/cache/apt/archives -- or can you disable caching in apt-get? I guess you can in some file...
19:15<bremner>pipe: when you use chroots to build packages, you fetch the same packages over and over again.
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19:16<pipe>bremner: Ah ok
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19:16<bremner>jawnsy: I guess so. Never cared enough about disk space to investigate
19:16<pipe>Computer hardware today is too cheap :(
19:17<jawnsy>meh, not to poor people.
19:17<pipe>Maybe if you define "poor" as living in africa or some plac
19:17<jawnsy>lol, I live in Canada, and am actually not THAT poor.. I just can't justify spending my money on computers and related stuff when I have lots of other expenses I need to worry about
19:18<pipe>But I mean.. one TB of storage is 10 hamburgers :P
19:18<pipe>or something..
19:19<pipe>5 movie tickets
19:19<jawnsy>I don't eat out much, nor do I go to the movies often
19:19<astronut>those are expensive hamburgers
19:19<pipe>Yeah, McDonalds is comparatively expensive in Sweden
19:20<jawnsy>astronut: I assume he means restaurant hamburgers, so $10/each is about right, and $100 total... a 1TB USB disk can be had for $90 or so after tax
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19:20<jawnsy>astronut: and 1TB internal drives are like $80 after tax now
19:20*astronut would say $6 for a restaurant burger
19:20<jawnsy>man, where do you live?
19:20<jawnsy>I am jealous.
19:20<jawnsy>well, fuck Canada then.
19:21<astronut>damnit, now i want a burger
19:21<jawnsy>you'd better not
19:21<jawnsy>or I'll be mad
19:21<jawnsy>since you can get them so cheaply (relatively)
19:21<pipe>579 SEK for 1TB internal SATA, and I think about 60 SEK for a Big Mac menu.
19:22<astronut>how many SEK to the dollar?
19:22<pipe>google knows.
19:22<jawnsy>AND fast internet
19:22<jawnsy>AND the women...
19:22<jawnsy>though, I guess I could also say, AND the ridiculous taxes ;)
19:22<pipe>1 U.S. dollar = 6.81811984 Swedish kronor
19:22<pipe>Yeah well, as someone said.. I like paying taxes, with it I buy civilization
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19:23<jawnsy>the rich people here have civilization as well
19:23<jawnsy>it's just kinda shitty for everyone else
19:23<dpkg>#debian is primarily a support channel for Debian users. Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic and take longer discussions and non-support questions to #debian-offtopic. Imagine the chaos if each of the hundreds of people in the channel felt the need to wander off topic for a few minutes every day.
19:24<jawnsy>meh, this discussion is TOTALLY on topic. we were just talking about how disk space is so cheap, and wondering if double-caching is happening with apt + approx
19:25<pipe>Any discussion about tax rates and class difference is bound to explode :P
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19:25<jawnsy>pipe: may I PM you? I had a question about .se :p
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19:34<tomg>I wish somebody hadn't said f--- Canada
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20:01<Sebasarenas>alguien puede ayudarme
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20:02<Sebasarenas>Help me please
20:02<abrotman>just ask your question
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20:02<Sebasarenas>Do you speak spanish?
20:03<dpkg>Este canal es de soporte tecnico en Ingles para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en espanol, por favor ingrese a #debian-es con /join #debian-es tecleado en la linea de chat.
20:05<Sebasarenas>how to enable java script?
20:06<pipe>That is a quite strange question
20:06<pipe>Where do you want to enable it?
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20:16<CutMeOwnThroat>neuronal overload
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20:22<EmleyMoor>Anyone familiar with horde on Debian? I need to activate the applications after reinstalling and am not sure how. They are configured.
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20:27<abrotman>EmleyMoor: IIRC you manually edit the registry.php
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20:44<EmleyMoor>abrotman: I can't see what to edit there
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20:45<abrotman>EmleyMoor: it's been awihle .. but i vaguely recall you uncomment the stanzas for the apps you want to use
20:45<EmleyMoor>They are already uncommented
20:46<kcynice>There is no sound of the front audio output, why and how to resolve it?
20:46<abrotman>EmleyMoor: did you login as admin and configure horde at all ?
20:46<abrotman>!alsa checklist
20:46<dpkg>1) add yourself to the 'audio' group (log out and log in again) 2) use alsamixer and unmute channels and raise levels (also try muting some channels & toggle jack sense) 3) arts or esound stopped? 4) OSS modules unloaded? 5) speakers on? 6) modprobe snd-pcm-oss 7) does "aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav" work for root? Test your sound with aplay and a wav so codec issues don't confuse the situation. See also <list alsa users>.
20:47<EmleyMoor>abrotman: Yes, I just redid the configuration
20:48<kcynice>but, it works well about the output from the motherboard
20:49<EmleyMoor>kcynice: It may be a different channel on the mixer, maybe one you have to manually add to the mixer you are using
20:49<kcynice>use alsamixer?
20:49<EmleyMoor>kcynice: That may help
20:49<EmleyMoor>(I think that shows them all)
20:50<kcynice>i have adjust all the channels to max sound level
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20:50<EmleyMoor>Checked muting and jack sense?
20:50<kcynice>im sorry, what jack sense is?
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20:52<EmleyMoor>kcynice: To do with what happens when, for instance, headphones are plugged in
20:53<kcynice>see the log messages about my headphones plugged in?
20:54<kcynice>by the way, i have turn on all the playback options in alsamixer and adjust them to max sound 100
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21:05<EmleyMoor>kcynice: Try muting a few things - that sometimes works as a toggle between outputs
21:06<abrotman>maybe it is physically not connected ?
21:06<EmleyMoor>That's another possibility
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21:09<kcynice>the front and back both work well under windows. ok, i will try muting somethings
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21:13<Lantizia>hey is there a way of regenerating /etc/hosts?
21:14<Lantizia>I've found that if you install debian without dhcp - the hosts file is correct with the local IP addres
21:14<Lantizia>install with dhcp and it's not correct... even if you change to static later
21:14<kcynice>the problem still
21:14<kcynice>thanks, all. I give up
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22:12<dundee>Hello any Debian user out there use python?
22:13<dundee>I need help in setting up my environment
22:13<dundee>I am using Debian Lenny
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22:15<dundee>Any help with setting up a development environment for python?
22:15<jawnsy>apt-get install python2.3 or whatever
22:15<jawnsy>I dunno, I don't use Python, I'm a Perl guy :)
22:16<dundee>basically I need help in setting up either vim or emacs
22:16<dundee>I have python already installed
22:17<jawnsy>same deal, apt-get install vim
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22:18<jawnsy>or aptitude I guess :)
22:19<dundee>Well probably I didn't ask the question correctly.
22:19<abrotman>python is already installed
22:19<dundee>I need to configure vim or emacs to code in python
22:19<dundee>I have both text editors installed and also python
22:19<abrotman>dundee: did you try to edit a and then ":syntax on" ?>
22:20<dundee>I have syntax highlighting but that's just about it...
22:20<dundee>I need autocomplete, code completion....etc
22:20<dundee>basically I need some IDE features but don't want to use the bloated IDEs that already exist
22:21<abrotman>so emacs isn't bloated ? :)
22:22<dundee>maybe.. :-)
22:22<dundee>I see you are a vim guy
22:22<abrotman>but i don't use the autocomplete stuff .. so i wouldn't be much help .. i'd guess google would have some stuff though
22:22<dundee>Well to be honest I have started to learn the two but find myself using vim more
22:23<abrotman> .. maybe something like that (no i didn't read the whole thing, use caution)
22:25<dundee>This link seems cool....I guess I was too lazy to search :-)
22:25<dundee>But thank you abrotman
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22:33<pipe>I remapped tab to complete in vim
22:34<pipe>I doubt that's a good idea in python..
22:34<pipe>In C and perl I rely on vim's excellent auto-indentation
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23:20<islam4all>I guess people still use IRC
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23:21<pipe>what's IRC?
23:21<pipe>Sounds dangerous
23:21<islam4all>Internet Relay Chat
23:21<islam4all>I guess
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23:37<tomg>Lantizia: You regenerate /etc/hosts with vi ;-)
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23:38<pipe>ed is the standard editor!
23:39<tomg>I don't want a viitor or an emacsitor! those aren't even words!
23:44<tomg>I'm going home. Good night.
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23:50<neep3r>hey all
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---Logclosed Mon Sep 27 00:00:11 2010