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#debian IRC Logs for 2011-04-26

---Logopened Tue Apr 26 00:00:18 2011
---Daychanged Tue Apr 26 2011
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00:11<kop>I've got a headless server that's got gdm3 (squeeze) running on it just in case some clueless person needs to sit down in front of it. Problem is that gdm3 and X are sucking up CPU, keeping the disk from going idle, etc. On lenny gdm2 used to quit for 5 minutes at a time. (Which would not help with idling the disks, but....) What's the right way to do something about this short of shutting down gdm3?
00:12<kop>I get lines in /var/log/syslog like:
00:12<kop>Apr 26 00:12:24 jumbo gdm3[1236]: WARNING: GdmDisplay: display lasted 0.378790 seconds
00:12<kop>Apr 26 00:12:24 jumbo acpid: client 24211[0:0] has disconnected
00:12<sney>how much cpu does an idle desktop manager need?
00:13<kop>48% of what's there.
00:13<kop>I suspect it's constantly restarting. (Looks like the X log is always new.)
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00:16<kop>I should probably report a bug. Going headless should not do this if you happen to have gdm3 turned on.
00:16<sney>yeah. or check for one that already exists, anyway
00:16<sney>if you don't need gdm3's networking features I'd suggest switching it out for a dm with a smaller footprint, like slim
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00:19<kop>sney: I guess that could help. (And what acpid has to do with anything I don't know.) Although really, as you say, how much cpu should an idle *dm use anyway?
00:19<kop>The X log is here: I'm thinking it's really X not starting because there's no monitor, or no something.
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00:21<sney>that X log looks healthy-ish
00:21<kop>Humm. That paste does not help. It just catches X in the middle of starting.
00:22<kop>Let me paste a whole one. (It says "no screens found" and dies.)
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00:24<sney>you should really direct link the raw.php version
00:25<sney>but I got it this time
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00:26<sney>hmm, maybe there's something you could put in xorg.conf.d to tell it to ignore no connected screen
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00:26<kop>sney: I'm using plain, old, pastebinit. It does the wrong thing by default?
00:28<sney>it links to, which by default is full of ads and sometimes requires you to input a captcha to see the paste
00:28<kop>sney: I like that idea. Another is to have a different boot menu entry. /etc/init.d/gdm3 seems to have some grep in it that looks for "text" in the kernel command line and if found does not start gdm. (What's with that?) But better to have something there when the monitor is plugged in.
00:29<kop>sney: That kinda sucks. It would be nice if pastebinit was not ugly that way.
00:29<sney>but if you just stick raw.php?i= in between and the paste id, it links raw text instead, without ads for windows and spam detection crap.
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00:29<sney>iirc, you can also tell pastebinit to use
00:29<kop>sney: Sounds better.
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00:31<kop>sney: I can make up a screen for X. But it would be nice if it did it's automagic should a real screen get plugged in. (There's some sort of user interface issue here that I'm not quite wrapping my head around.)
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00:32<kop>sney: Like a splash that says "ctrl-alt-backspace" to get a login and _then_ starts gdm3. It only needs to come up if there is no screen.
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00:33<Gerowen>Hey everybody
00:33<Gerowen>I'm back again, still banging my head against this crazy CPU fan
00:33<kop>Or gosh "Hit any key..."!
00:33<Gerowen>Posted a rollup of stuff I've done here if anybody has any ideas for me;
00:34<sney>kop: that sounds like a good idea! i don't know how to implement it though.
00:34<sney>kop: probably something with runlevels. maybe.
00:35<kop>sney: grep the X logs!!! ;-) (Might actually work, but I'd hope X would fail with some sort of exit code that could be used instead.)
00:36<kop>sney: In the whatever-magic the *dm uses to (re-re)start X test for the right sort of failure.
00:37<kop>If I hadn't wasted last night writing a script to email me when the cpu temp gets too high (instead of learning some sort of framework and writing a braindead plugin) I'd be up for wacking at it now.....
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00:39<kLy3ntAlyVe>so channels on irc are like private rooms on web site chats?
00:39<kop>It always seems like such voodoo inside those *dm startup paths. But then perhaps I'm just superstious.
00:40<kop>kLy3ntAlyVe: ? We have a topic. We're here to provide/get support for Debian.
00:41<kLy3ntAlyVe>I understand. sorry bout that. I figure it out on the ineternet or something. Just wanted to check this out.
00:41<kLy3ntAlyVe>have a good one guys
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00:42<catsup>kop: i think i saw that script
00:43<catsup>kop: it was fine, there's no better way
00:43<kop>catsup: There's got to be something, mon, or something, that deals with the hysteresis for me.
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00:44<kop>catsup: Those monitoring frameworks always do something to keep from getting flooded with emails.
00:44<catsup>i duno, deals with what? oh with rate limiting
00:45<kop>catsup: Right. A reset temperature.
00:45<catsup>well i guess if someone has implemented it already...
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00:46<catsup>myself, i would just touch a file when i send the email, and not send if it's under 5 minutes old -- or something like that
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01:01<Gerowen>Nobody has any ideas about my fan?
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01:08<ayaka>Gerowen, ata3: Softreset failed. I'm not sure about this, if you have sata plugs and enabled achi then will show this, never mind
01:09<Gerowen>ah ok
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01:42<kop>Damm if I can figure out how X is actually started by gdm3 (or anything at all.)
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01:42<kop>I know it's in there somewhere, but grepping for X does not help. :-P
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01:44<Arrowmaster>kop: look for xinit maybe?
01:46<kop>Arrowmaster: Looking to see how gdm3 starts X. If it's in a script I want to frob it.
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01:47<kop>Arrowmaster: I'd settle for how any *dm startup script winds up starting X itself. I'm not interested in the sessions or any of that stuff.
01:47<Arrowmaster>no idea
01:48<Arrowmaster>although if you just want to know for any *dm then you probably dont want to look at gdm or kdm but instead at xdm/slim/lxdm
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01:48<Arrowmaster>they are probably a lot smaller
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01:58<newbie_user>hi everybody....I'm trying to switch over to Debian from Windows, but want to be able to still chat with my friends and family that use the Windows Live Messenger. I know about and have tried aMSN and Pidgin, but I can't do voice or video with either of i missing an update or something or is there a better option than those two?
01:59<th>let me check whether kopete can do that
01:59<newbie_user>I've tried emensene too
01:59<kop>newbie_user: You probably want to search the repos for the right program, if nobody answers. Try typing "/msg dpkg search" or "/msg dpkg debtags" into your irc client.
01:59<kop>newbie_user: You may also want to try "/msg dpkg overview".
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02:00<kop>newbie_user: ekiga is supposed to be nice. I've no idea what it inter-operates with.
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02:01<kop>newbie_user: The <overview> factoid may give you other ideas.
02:02<newbie_user>ekiga wiki explicitly says it's not compatible
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02:07<th>according to (i can't verify this), wlm client is needed to do video chat
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02:07<prem>how to do remote installtion in debian..?
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02:08<prem>is there anything available other than network install image..?
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02:09<prem>llike having a iso image in a server and installing the machine remotely
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02:10<th>you may be able to use this:
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02:10<th>debootstrap wiki:
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02:11<prem>th, i guess debootstrap method needs a already running linux partition in the remote machine
02:12<prem>but if that is a fresh new that case which is better..?
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02:13<s_i_m>prem, in that case you will need assistance from a local admin at the remote site
02:13<th>:) that's ... i don't know what to do in such situation
02:14<s_i_m>but read the installation guide, really...
02:14<prem>s_i_m, okey.,i can get that..but how to do
02:14<th>boot debian-live iso to run debootstrap?
02:15<prem>th, i dont have any external cd/dvd drives in that lookign for some options through dhcp
02:15<prem>is it possible..?
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02:16<DX`> prem - you will need to setup a PXE boot server
02:17<kop>prem: There's pxebooting. You may be more interested in remote install over ssh. It does need somebody to boot and answer 3 to 5 questions iirc.
02:17<kop>prem: You really want to read the install guide.
02:17<prem>DX`, no issues..i can do that..but any clear doc is there..?
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02:18<dpkg>The Debian Installation Guide for Squeeze (6.0) can be found at . See also <errata> <firmware images> <installer firmware> <release notes>.
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02:19<th> this one?
02:20<th>oh, this one:
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02:27<prem>th, i will check it.,thanks
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02:50<anathema>hi, i use Debian with LXDE, i want use KDE . What i can do to chage plz ?
02:51-!-mode/#debian [+l 475] by debhelper
02:52<Torsten_W>anathema, apt-get instalöl kde-full
02:52<Torsten_W>anathema, apt-get install kde-full
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02:54<kop>!tell Torsten_W about why aptitude
02:54<anathema>tks i will try that
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02:56<DX`>!tell DX` about why aptitude
02:56<EmleyMoor>!tell DX' about selftell
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02:56<EmleyMoor>!tell DX` about selftell
02:57<DX`><- New here.. Cheers :)
02:57<chealer>!why not aptitude
02:57<dpkg>Many never use the curses frontend but it is still in the binary; aptitude is more memory intensive and slower than apt-get. Its resolver can sometimes produce unexpected results. Many features of aptitude are now in libapt and used by apt-get as well, so the differences between the two have reduced. That said, aptitude is still the best way of to get out of tight spots when running sid; for lenny->squeeze use apt-get.
02:58<th>:( i've been using aptitude since etch...
02:58<chealer>dpkg: no, why not aptitude is <reply>Although this has improved, aptitude still duplicates some APT/dpkg features. Its resolver can sometimes produce unexpected results. It also has many more frontend-specific bugs. Despite the slogan, it is quite heavy, in part due to the mix of several front-ends in a single binary package and duplication. The curses-based frontend is more memory intensive and slower than apt-get.
02:58<dpkg>chealer: okay
03:00<nevyn>r/query dpkg
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03:02<nevyn>chealer: so what is reccomended instead?
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03:03<chealer>nevyn: there is no recommendation in general. each front-end has flaws
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03:05<s_i_m>chealer, why not to be more precise, esp. wrt duplicated features? what are those, besides aptitude's own database of packages on hold?
03:06<EmleyMoor>Is there anything in Debian that can be used to design an adventure, preferably one that finishes up as Z-code?
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03:07<nevyn>EmleyMoor: there's a zcode compiler in debian umm frotz?
03:08<EmleyMoor>nevyn: As far as I know that's for running zcode
03:08<nevyn>yeah it is I'm wrong.
03:08<chealer>s_i_m: feel free to precise if it fits in a factoid. I don't know aptitude, but I believe there's that and different logs
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03:10<s_i_m>chealer, you do not know aptitude, yet you dare to touch factoid. no comments.
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03:12<chealer>s_i_m: I meant I never tried aptitude. I heard about some of its issues.
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03:14<nevyn>s_i_m: things like auto arn't well supported in non-aptitude frontends I've found
03:15<s_i_m>chealer, yes, I mean the same: you claim you never used aptitude yet you contribute to spreading FUD about it.
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03:16<anathema_>after had do apt-get install kde-full, i have a chose between gdm and kdm . I should choice what ?
03:16<chealer>s_i_m: what FUD?
03:16<dpkg>methinks fud is Fear, uncertainty, doubt. Originally invented by IBM, but now used by many others. or YAFA. or Fscking Useless Data or otherwise known as false information or mindless facts with no backup facts or
03:17<nevyn>anathema_: whichever you prefer.
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03:17<nevyn>this controls what X greeter you see.
03:17<nevyn>so the gui logon display
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03:17<nevyn>but you can start kde from gdm and start gnome from kdm
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03:19<anathema_>tkz i get kde by defaut
03:19<th>if you're going to use kde, kdm is preferable. but you can change this anytime later
03:19<th>preferable because:.... theme
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03:20<anathema_>oki tkz i was accustomed whith Ubuntu ...
03:21<anathema_>it's less pre-config
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03:22<th>actually it's adjustable
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03:25<th>by running: dpkg-reconfigure debconf, you can choose how much prompt for config you will get during package installation. ranging from control freaks to newbie in a hurry
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03:29<anathema_>what i should do to activate new kde ?
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03:30<th>are you in lxde now?
03:31<kop>anathema_: Your gdm/kdm will have an option before you login to select a window manager.
03:31<anathema_>yes, i try /etc/init.d/kdm restart
03:31<th>try logging out
03:31<kop>anathema_: (or maybe it's a "session". I forget.)
03:31<th>you should be able to choose what session to start in the *dm
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03:32<th>depending on the *dm theme... it could be anywhere on the screen
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03:33<anathema_>could you be more explain plz . after have do "/etc/init.d/kdm restart" that show Stopping K Display Manager: kdm...done ( not running (/var/run/ not found)).
03:33<anathema_>Starting K Display Manager: kdm.
03:33<anathema_>i should restart my session ?
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03:34<th>have you tried logging out?
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03:38<anathema>tks , that ok . now when i start an session i have choice betewen kde,lxde ...
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03:47<raylu>...aptitude is heavy because it has a larger binary? the curses frontend is more memory intensive than apt-get?
03:47<raylu>am i supposed to laugh?
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04:00<DoverOs>im a little teapot
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04:08<costas>!caffeine dpkg
04:08<costas>!beer dpkg
04:08*dpkg deftly decants a fine Gulden Drak for dpkg
04:10<solere>привет всем
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04:12<solere>есть кто живой?
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04:17<nevyn>so my built kernel tree is 6 gig this seems excessive
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04:22<DoverOs>nevyn 2 times bigger than mine
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04:24<DoverOs>although u can get them up to like 200gb if you want to
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04:29<DoverOs>nevyn you could try destroying your system
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04:30<DoverOs>and just run
04:31<raylu>hm. mine is 1.3GB... that does seem excessive. but that includes the .git stuff
04:31<raylu>which is 600MB
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05:24<jww>I'm using a fiber channel connection to a SAN, the multipaths show as /dev/sdb /dev/sdc /dev/sdd( with multipath -ll ), and /dev/sda which I can mount . does it seems ok to you guys ?
05:26<jww>ah ! I knew there was something wrong !
05:26<jww>can you tell me more ?
05:26<nevyn>jww: can you pastebin the output of multipath -l please?
05:26<nevyn>the device you want should be a dm file if you have multipathd running and configured.
05:27<nevyn>dm device rather.
05:27<nevyn>jww: so /dev/mapper/mpathN
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05:30<nevyn>right so that's /dev/mapper/mpath0
05:30<nevyn>you should refer to /dev/mapper/mpath0 when mounting formating etc.
05:30<jww>allright. so looks like someone screwed fstab. is there any troubles that can occurs because /dev/sda was mounted for a while ?
05:31<nevyn>it's the same device
05:31<nevyn>it's just a singlepath route to it
05:31<jww>I understand.
05:31<jww>thanks for your help nevyn !
05:32<nevyn>you should unmount it and restart multipathd
05:32<nevyn>sda isn't showing up as one of the paths
05:32<nevyn>perhaps because it was mounted
05:33<nevyn>so you have 2 fibres from the host to 2 switches to 4 ports on he ARRAY
05:33<jww>I think it works like that, but it's a remote setup.
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05:33<jww>I don't have physical accéss to the computers.
05:33<nevyn>look in /dev/disk/by-path
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05:34<jww>what should I look for ?
05:35<jww>( I got 4 pci-xxxx stuff that looks like the paths ).
05:35<nevyn>that's what I was checking.
05:35<nevyn>just that sda wasn't a different lun or anything
05:35<jww>so yes I should see one more path.
05:35<chiku>I add new nic carte, how can I scan it ?
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05:35<chiku>witouth reboot
05:35<nevyn>chiku: scan it?
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05:36<nevyn>chiku: how did you add it to the system with the system on?
05:36<chiku>lscpi I saw only nics already added, but not the new one
05:36<chiku>virtual machine
05:37<nevyn>chiku: does your hypervisor emulate the right pci hotplug magic?
05:37<nevyn>chiku: in dmesg of the guest is the nic there?
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05:37*nevyn hasn't ever needed to use hotplug pci.
05:37<mjt>when adding a new pci device to a vm it should appear in the vm automatically PROVIDED you've the proper pci hotplug drivers loaded
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05:38<mjt>probably acpiphp module - at least qemu/kvm uses it
05:38<chiku>from dmesg and /var/log/message I read only other nics but not the new one
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05:39<chiku>there is no scan pci ?
05:39*mjt gives up
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05:42<jww>ahah :)
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05:48<mutante>ext3 fs is mounted read-only, dmesg has stuff like "EXT3-fs error (device sda3): ext3_readdir: bad entry in directory", syslog looks normal, fsck -n gives a ton of "Illegal block number passed to ext2fs_mark_block_bitmap", finally "Error while scanning inodes (2097152): Can't read next inode
05:48<mutante>so if i'm already at "e2fsck: aborted
05:48<mutante>nothing to do besides replacing hardware?
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05:51<devil>mutante: you could have a look at what testdisk has to say (from a live cd)
05:51<devil>that way you could also save some data, if needed.
05:52<mutante>yep, thanks, at this point i just wanted to reassure myself i can say "this is broken hardware / cant fix it without replace anymore"
05:53<mutante>booting from live cd is an option but also causes downtime,so effectively not much different
05:53<devil>the errors point to dying/broken hw, yes
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05:53<devil>oh, you didnt say it was a server
05:54<mutante>yes it is, if i say "hw needs to be replaced" somebody else will do it
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05:54<devil>well, if uptime is important, replace disk and analyse afterwards
05:54<mjt>i'm not sure it's hw. the filesystem is severe damaged that's for sure, but nothing indicates (yet) the hw is bad.
05:55<mutante>mjt, yes, thats exactly what i was thinking
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05:55<mutante>but there is no tool installed to check the RAID controller (mpt-status) and nothing in the logs of the remote management card
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05:56<mutante>and i cant install now, because its already read-only
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05:56<mjt>for a start you can try a more recent e2fsprogs in a hope it'll cope with the corruption more easy (if it's not recent already)
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05:56<mjt>,versions e2fsprogs
05:56<judd>Package e2fsprogs on i386 -- lenny: 1.41.3-1; sid: 1.41.12-2; squeeze: 1.41.12-2; wheezy: 1.41.12-2; experimental: 1.41.14-1
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05:57<mutante>ok... 1.39+1.40-WIP-2006.11.14+dfsg-2etch1
05:58<mjt>if it's really etch it wont be easy
05:58<mutante>it is :/
05:59<devil>yeah, _some_ important depends
05:59<mjt>it should be easy to recompile e2fsprogs on etch
06:00<mjt>or even produce a statically-linked fsck
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06:01<mutante>on another box with rw filesystem ...
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06:14<kFreeBSDNoob>I'm trying to install "Debian GNU/kFreeBSD" with CD-only mode. Anybody know how?
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06:44<boomy>hey guys, could anyone tell me how to install skype on backtrack 4_
06:44<dpkg>BackTrack is not Debian and is not supported in #debian (ask me about <based on debian>). Try or #backtrack-linux on instead. BackTrack is a Linux distribution based on <Ubuntu> Intrepid (as of BackTrack 4), previously <SLAX>. Derived from merging two penetration-testing distributions: WHAX (formerly WHOPPIX) and Auditor Security Linux.
06:45<babilen>kFreeBSDNoob: What is the problem?
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06:49<kFreeBSDNoob>babilen: it's ok, I am redirected to #debian-kbsd
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06:50<babilen>kFreeBSDNoob: Ok, have fun!
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07:44<weatherman>Current conditions at Norfolk International Airport, VA (KORF)
07:44<weatherman>Last updated Apr 26, 2011 - 06:51 AM EDT / 2011.04.26 1051 UTC
07:44<weatherman> Temperature: 71.1 F (21.7 C)
07:44<weatherman> Relative Humidity: 86%
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08:36<funber>товарищи помогите поднять xorg на geode
08:36<dpkg>Russian speakers, please use (Pogalujsta, zajdite na) (Pazhaluista, zahodite na) #debian-russian or use English here.
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09:17-!-tychoish is "tycho garen" on #debian #debian-xen #moocows @+#linode #ikiwiki #freedombox #stringtheorists
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09:21<diederik>I'm trying to remount / as readonly, but when I try it, I get "/ is busy"
09:21<diederik>command I used: mount -n -o remount,ro -t ext4 /dev/sda2 /
09:21<diederik>so the question is: how do I remount / as readonly?
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09:22<diederik>don't know if it's relevant, but it's a debian (guest) install inside virtualbox ose
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09:41<diederik>how do I modify my grub2 entry, so / will be mounted readonly?
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09:43<diederik>on my recovery entry I see "linux /boot/vmlinuz... root=x to single"
09:43<diederik>does that mean it will be mounted readonly when choosing that option?
09:43<diederik>to single = ro single
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09:47<mobildorn>"ro" stand for "readonly", but "single" will give you single user mode, too.
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09:49<diederik>just checked the normal grub entry, and it also has ro ... dunno how to interpret that
09:49<Denali>can anybody help me?
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09:50<diederik>Denali: not if you're not saying what the problem is ;)
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09:51<mobildorn>diederik: Your root fs should be mounted ro on bootup then.
09:51<mobildorn>But the init scripts will usually remount it rw after the fsck.
09:51<Denali>im trying to get the pen to work with my tablet pc
09:52<diederik>mobildorn: didn't think of the init script thing, thanks
09:52<diederik>how can I check whether it is (still) mounted ro?
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09:53<devil>diederik: mount should tell
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09:55<mobildorn>mount reads from /etc/mtab. It could give wrong results as long as / is ro, as it cannot be updated by mount.
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09:55<diederik>devil: mount only lists /dev/sda1, which is /boot sda2 isn't in the list
09:55<mobildorn>If /proc is mounted, 'cat /proc/mounts' is more accurate.
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09:56<diederik>nvm sda2 is type "Extended", so I don't have a separate /boot
09:56<devil>diederik: sorry, i didnt read the whole conversation
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09:57<diederik>devil: your command was useful nonetheless
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09:57<mobildorn>If sda2 is extended, it is surely not /. Look for something like sda5.
09:58<diederik>sda5 is my swap partition, don't have others (in the extended)
09:58<diederik>on my host system I do have a separate /boot, but apparently not in this vbox image
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09:58<mobildorn>Ah, sorry. Misread the line about the separate /boot.
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09:59<diederik>No worries, I made the first/real mistake ;)
09:59<mobildorn>So you'll have to look at /dev/sda1 to find out if / is ro or rw.
10:00<diederik>it is rw, touch test creates a file
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10:01<mobildorn>But you still want it ro now?
10:01<diederik>mount -no remount,ro / did the trick :)
10:02<diederik>yes, I want to run zerofree on it
10:02<mobildorn>Ah. I'd suggested -l next.
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10:05<anubis>Hello, i dont know whether i am right here. i have a folder containing lots of .eps . How can i print em quickly ?
10:06<diederik> gave me the right clue/command
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10:12<mobildorn>I have some systems where I remount /usr. Never tried / yet.
10:13<diederik>mobildorn, devil: just shrunk 1,3GB off my vbox image, thanks for the help
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10:13<unsigned>anubis, if it just .ps, you can cat *ps > and print, maybe it works for eps as well
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10:14<mobildorn>Or try 'for file in *.eps; do lpr "$file"; done'
10:14<diederik>remounting / was indeed trickier then others, but apparently I shouldn't have provided a mount point
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10:16<mobildorn>I'll write a remount script in future for my '/usr is ro' installation.
10:16<mobildorn>Since squeeze even dpkg can call hooks.
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10:17<mobildorn>So I'm going to remount /usr in dpkg if it's not done already.
10:17<diederik>and I'll write a "prepareforshrinking" script :)
10:17<mobildorn>Currently I always forget that when I use dpkg -i to install a self-made kernel.
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10:18<mobildorn>But when using apt/aptitude, I need to remount /usr there and have to prevent dpkg from remounting ro when it's called by apt*.
10:19<diederik>mobildorn: doesn't the script section of the link I posted do what you want?
10:19<mobildorn>But I did something like that for my router box some time ago.
10:19<mobildorn>Haven't looked at it yet.
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10:20<mobildorn>My router has not much memory, so I have to stop some daemons before upgrades.
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10:21<diederik>your router is running debian?
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10:23<mobildorn>Yeah, it's just an old PC with some nics.
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10:23<diederik>ah ok
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10:26<mobildorn>It's connected to the uplink as a wifi client. Most router boxes only work as wifi/wpa server and cannot be configured as client.
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10:26<mobildorn>A simple Debian solution was faster to do than to create a new firmware for those boxes.
10:27<mobildorn>(and hope the hardware will work, too)
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10:27<mobildorn>But I'll be afk for some time now. See you.
10:27<diederik>see you
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10:40<aussa>hi, can I use synaptic to install packages?
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10:44<phillipsjk>aussa, I don't see why not.
10:45<phillipsjk>If it is not installed, you may want to try "aptitude install synaptic" in a terminal
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10:47<aussa>I mean, I need to install some program, and here:, it says there is an easy way, but I don't know if I could use it... can you check for me, please?
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10:50<aussa>is .source.tgz an extension or is it simply .tgz?
10:51<phillipsjk>You can have multiple extensions. tgz is short for "tar.gz"
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10:52<phillipsjk>You should rely to strong on them; "magic numbers" are commonly used to determine file type.
10:53<aussa>ok, but if I have a file which ends .source.tgz, I should just extract it...?
10:53<phillipsjk>*not rely too strongly on them
10:54<phillipsjk>Yes, It will probably contain a directory tree of source code.
10:54<aussa>ok ty
10:54<aussa>what is this ----> cvs login ?
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11:01<mutante>a login to a CVS server, probably to be followed by a "checkout" to fetch software
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11:29<aussa>what do I have to install to use "make" command?
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11:30<roman>Hello! I'am use Debian squeeze and have problem with usb sound card. Periodically sound is disappear from all system and help only system reboot .What's can be?
11:30<sret>been there done that
11:31*sret wipes the sweat off his forehead
11:31<sney>aussa: build-essential
11:31<sret>roman: first alsa-confg script, upload somewhere so people can see what's wrong
11:32<roman># autoloader aliases
11:32<roman>install sound-slot-0 /sbin/modprobe snd-card-0
11:32<roman>install sound-slot-1 /sbin/modprobe snd-card-1
11:32<roman>install sound-slot-2 /sbin/modprobe snd-card-2
11:32<roman>install sound-slot-3 /sbin/modprobe snd-card-3
11:32-!-roman was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use or /msg dpkg paste]
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11:33<sret>sorry alsa-info script
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11:34<gord-gbsd>(he's just been kicked for pasteflood, in case you have join/leaves off)
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11:34<sret>just noticed
11:34<aussa>how do I know if a "make" command was successful?
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11:35<philippeB>scroll up/down your terminal and check the messages :-)
11:35<aussa>there are a lot!!!
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11:36<Tiff>Look at the last ones. If it didn't build correctly you'd see it error out.
11:36<sret>look at the last line after you did a make
11:36<sret>if it errors out it'll tell you
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11:58<mehdi_>hey guys my network manager has been removed from panel how can i bring it back?
11:59<babilen>mehdi_: run "nm-applet" (alt-f2)
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12:06<sret>isnt network manager borked?
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12:07<sret>i dont have it anymore, since i first upgraded to squeeze
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12:07<s_i_m>anyone getting this: W: GPG error: squeeze-proposed-updates Release: The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG AED4B06F473041FA Debian Archive Automatic Signing Key (6.0/squeeze) <>
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12:11<s_i_m>the same warning for the experimental
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12:18<jhutchins_lt>sret: Using network manager here.
12:19<jhutchins_lt>mehdi_: Gnome?
12:19<sret>jhutchins_lt: at the time squeeze was released, network manager had some sort of issue so i didnt
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12:19<jhutchins_lt>sret: Are you using wicd instead?
12:19<sret>ive got some weird looking icon that looks like a plug
12:20<sret>wired network connection
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12:21<sret>ok thats network manager applet from the looks of it
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12:21<jhutchins_lt>nm misbehaved when I first installed squeeze, after about three rounds of reconfiguring it settled down and was fine. I did have to add the system tray to my panel so it would have a place to show up (kde).
12:21<sret>the original network manager icon was about two computer monitors right
12:21<jhutchins_lt>sret: Really don't need nm for static/wired.
12:22<sret>im on gnome
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12:25<imganquan>hi all. I have a toy program, it will print some thing out. I want to track the system calls in the toy program and save the output to a file. I use [strace ./toy > log], but the log file got the output of toy, not strace. who can tell how to save the output of strace. thanks. I know this is not a debian question, but i don't know where to ask this.
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12:27<babilen>imganquan: "man strace" → "-o filename"
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12:27<imganquan>babilen: thank you.
12:27<babilen>imganquan: Or redirect stderr to a file
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12:28<babilen>imganquan: It is confusing you know?
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12:29<imganquan>babilen: OK. thank you babilen, sorry for cross post.
12:29<mehdi_>does anyone here have gnome 3?
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12:30<toadd>I have a debian squeeze under KDE and i have set my network with the graphical tool provided by KDE. I have three pcs, this one and two others under windows. I also have a numericable box on The problem is that this address still invisible for my pc (this one)
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12:30<toadd>so maybe there is a setting i missed
12:31<toadd>i also cannot ping my pcs under windows via my debian
12:31<toadd>and cannot ping the
12:31<babilen>mehdi_: It's not ready yet --
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12:35*abcd82 sighs... somehow debian's grub too many likes installing self to first hard drive without asking, same for todays grub update, same while installing new copy of debian :( again will need to restore previous loader on sda
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12:37<imganquan>babilen: in that site, what does the last column mean? sth like "11/0", "all" ,"11/13" etc.
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13:11<zeus_>Hi all, i'm looking for a linux-kernel version 2.6.35 to boot my debian... i'd like to not install testing. Any tips ?
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13:12<kooll>zeus_: compile one ?
13:13<dpkg>it has been said that pl is polska -> #debian-pl (on Also, pl is a common extension for perl scripts and is sometimes used as an abbreviation for "packet loss".
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13:13<gredasd>ok bye:)
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13:14<zeus_>kooll: i think it's too hard for me. I'm not very expert in kernel building so i'll prefer an already packaged version. I'll use this Computer for server and i do not trust myself :-)
13:15<zeus_>the problem is that my hardware is not supported by squeeze... unfortunatly
13:17<zeus_>is it possible that in squeeze-backports there is no linux-image ? why ?
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13:33<dpkg>Test failed.
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13:37<anoosy>hi every body
13:37<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
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13:52<selbeimanti>devil: about the aligning partitions on ssd thing: i used gparted, left 1Mb free in front, and 2400Mb in back, on which i created the swap. is that ok, or do i have to align the swap too?
13:52<devil>selbeimanti: nope
13:52<selbeimanti>k thx
13:53<devil>selbeimanti: as i said, i would not put the swap on the ssd though
13:53<selbeimanti>when i told you i have only 2G, you reconsidered
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13:53<devil>no, you missunderstood
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13:54<devil>with 2 GB, i would use swap, but not on the SSD
13:54<devil>o the other hand, ram is cheap
13:54<selbeimanti>i'm planning to only use the ssd, and external hd.
13:55<selbeimanti>ok, i guess it's time for another 2G
13:55<devil>yep. and that means: 64-bit
13:56<selbeimanti>i had 64bit before; where's the limit for 32?
13:56<devil>selbeimanti: around 3.2 GB
13:56<kop>Swap is nice. You want the ram for disk caching if you've something that's sitting there doing nothing for a while.
13:57<devil>swap is nice, but not on a SSD :)
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13:57<kop>devil: Yes. YMMV.
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13:58<selbeimanti>i'm normally a fan of hibernating, for which i'd need swap, but this particular machine is on 24/7 anyhow
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13:59<devil>selbeimanti: myexperience with 2 GB ram was, that after 3-4 days of uptime it started swapping
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13:59<devil>selbeimanti: swap being eaten mostly by very many tabs is 2 browsers
13:59<devil>in my case
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13:59<devil>err, ram being eaten....
14:00<selbeimanti>for me opera eats the ram, with 40+ open tabs
14:00<devil>selbeimanti: i usualy need 3-4 times as may
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14:01<kooll>selbeimanti: just put swap. one day, you may need it, and will be mad at yourself for not putting some
14:01<mai>how do you keep track of 160 browser tabs? and why so many? :D
14:01<devil>kooll: did you understand the problem?
14:01<kooll>mai: why not ? :)
14:01<kooll>devil: yes. my advice still stand
14:02<selbeimanti>kooll: i just thought about it, i'll use a traditional hd anyway as a secondary disk, for amule. so i'll make a swap partition there.
14:02<selbeimanti>now everybody's happy :)
14:02<mjt>one can add swap later as a file not partition. on modern filesystems swap in a file works as efficient as swap-in-partition
14:02<kooll>not having swap at all as always created some kind of troubles, no matter which linux version was used. it's getting better, but it is still not there
14:02<devil>mai: i need them for work, i keep them in 2 browsers and group them. in the course of the day i close some i dont need and open new ones
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14:03<devil>selbeimanti: your SSD will stay happy, thats the important part
14:03<kooll>of course, you might be able to use something like swapspace to manage swap dynamically, too ... it might be good enough in your specific case
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14:04<mai>ok, you use some tab grouping plugin for iceweasel, then?
14:04<kooll>also, ssd happinness isn't the important part. it would matter only if swap is actually used. And if its used .... either you need more ram, or you really cannot avoid swap ;)
14:04<devil>mai: no, iw4 knows grouping by default
14:05<devil>kooll: thats why i opted for more ram
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14:06<kooll>well... even with more ram ... I've seen too many stupid bugs due to lack of swap to not put some on my computers :)
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14:07<devil>on a recently built box with 8 gb ram for first time i go without swap
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14:08<catsup>ram goes up, but disk too... linux will be faster with swap
14:09<kooll>devil: I've had bugs with 32GB ram, traceable to lack of swap. (ok, that was two years ago, I think it has been fixed now)
14:09<catsup>swap out unused pages => more memory free for disk cache
14:09<catsup>kooll: what kind of bugs?
14:09<kooll>complete lockup
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14:10<catsup>on out-of-memory?
14:10<devil>catsup: with ssd i rather put cache to /tmp
14:10<kooll>with big slowdowns before
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14:10<kooll>catsup: something wrong in the page allocation algorithm on specific cases, iirc. I don't remember the details, I'm looking for it
14:10<catsup>devil: i mean linux's in-memory disk buffer
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14:12<catsup>sometimes you shouldn't use swap... but that's usually on a tiny machine with little ram and ssd only... a big machine with big disk... more swap will speed up the disk
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14:13<devil>catsup: i doubt, a 120 GB SSD accompanied by 8 gb ram will be sped up by swap
14:13<kooll>the only 'completely swapless' boxes I use are pxe netboot ones. no swap, because the system is in ram and there's no storage devices. And even then, it helps having swap over nfs (although that has its share of bugs, too)
14:13<catsup>devil: of course it will
14:13<diederik>selbeimanti: with the -bigmem kernel you can have 64GB of RAM on 32-bit
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14:13<devil>catsup: how is that?
14:13<catsup>devil: at least, if you are using it enough
14:14<catsup>SSD is still slower than RAM
14:14<devil>catsup: with 8 gb ram, it wont be used (much)
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14:14<kooll>devil: rarely used pages can be swapped out, which means you have more cache, in ram
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14:15<devil>i max out with 3-4 gb ram being used
14:15<catsup>basically linux kernel can decide that you want disk pages in memory
14:15<catsup>besides faster, it will also mean less writes to your SSD (longer life)
14:16<catsup>i guess if you are not using the disk enough to fill up your cache, then you get no advantage
14:16<kooll>oh, right, more ram cache also translate to more write cache, of course. more page able to be 'dirty' at once :)
14:16<devil>catsup: i have 2 gb swap on the system (on a HDD), just not activated atm
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14:16<devil>catsup: will turn it on and see if it gets used
14:17<kooll>which will reduce the absolute number of writes (a page will be more likely to be modified more than once in ram before a sync to disk)
14:17<catsup>wait a minute
14:17<catsup>if your swap is slower than your disk, i bet it will just make it slower
14:17<catsup>than your fs disk
14:17<devil>thats what i thought, hence its off
14:18<catsup>do you have your fs journal on ssd?
14:20<devil>catsup: i do, yes. was thinking of disabling it, but decided not to
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14:20<catsup>devil: what about putting the journal on the hd?
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14:21<devil>catsup: yeah, didnt think of that yet. just bought the baby 2 weeks ago.
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14:21<catsup>i wonder how that would perform, obviously there would be a penalty
14:22<catsup>but also a big advantage so maybe worth it
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14:24<selbeimanti>how about a dedicated swap disk? something that holds 4 gigs with no moving parts?
14:24<mjt>looking at current reliability of SSDs, esp. the cheaper ones, I'm thinking about using a software raid on top of SSD and a regular drive, latter marked as a write-mostly (so it receives writes but not reads)
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14:35<whirli>hey, Im testing here. Could someone tell me what I need to convert .MPG video file to ogv?
14:36<darius>hi, i just installed debian squeeze 6.0.1a 64bit multiple times into RAID1 root partition.. and every time it stops in grub rescue after first reboot with error: file not found
14:36<darius>ls does not show any md* devices...
14:36<sney>whirli: I don't know what tools exactly, but there's a good chance you'll need the expanded stuff from
14:37<whirli>sney: I have it enabled
14:37<whirli>I just tried to convert it to .ogv with VLC but the outcome is of poor quality
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14:38<Infro>Hello, is it possible to resume a defunct sshd session?
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14:39<stderr>whirli: I would use ffmpeg.
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14:40<Infro>And I mean, without having screen first installed
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14:41<whirli>stderr: first time for me, could you point me to a guide?
14:41<stderr>whirli: ffmpeg -i input.mpg -sameq -qscale 10 output.ogv
14:41<stderr>Something like that as a start.
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14:44<whirli>stderr: Ill try that
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14:46<whirli>stderr: the original is 48,7mb and the ogv is only 5,2mb but theres not much difference in the quality. Normal?
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14:47<whirli>secondly what about the audio, it converted it to FLAC, what if I wanted it to be vorbis?
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14:48<stderr>whirli: I haven't compared MPG vs. OGV filesizes. I usually rescale the frame at the same time, so I can't compare any of mine.
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14:48<stderr>whirli: Add -ac libvorbis
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14:49<stderr>No, wait...
14:49<stderr>It's not -ac...
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14:49<whirli>no worries
14:49<stderr>But I can't remember what it is... Check the man page.
14:50<egwk>ac is for channels
14:50<stderr>-ac is audio channels, -ar is samplerate...
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14:51<stderr>I want to say -ao, but I really can't remember..
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14:51<egwk>stderr, maybe acodec?
14:52<sney>surely 'man ffmpeg' would say
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14:52<stderr>Yeah, as I said: Check the man page.
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14:54<whirli>-acodec ?
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14:58<whirli>unknown vorbis
14:59<stderr>Try: ffmpeg -formats | grep -i vorbis
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15:00<stderr>You can try either -acodec libvorbis or -acodec vorbis. Not sure which one is best (or if they're the same).
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15:01<stderr>whirli: Can you also check dpkg --get-selections | grep vorbis and see if you got the vorbis stuff installed?
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15:03<requia>I have no keyboard or mouse functionality on a fresh debian install on a notebook (externals work) my udev.conf file is emty except for a couple comments
15:05<jhutchins_lt>requia: sid?
15:07<jhutchins_lt>!udev bug
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15:08<jhutchins_lt>!sid udev
15:08<dpkg>udev 167-1 in sid is currently broken, because it tries to use /run created by base-files 6.2 which is not yet supported by the initscripts version in sid. Downgrade udev, libudev, libgudev-1.0-0 to 166-1 and base-files to 6.1 and remove /run to fix it. Install <apt-listbugs> and see #620995, #620191, #621036 and for details.
15:08<jhutchins_lt>I've heard it made it to testing as well.
15:08<jhutchins_lt>,versions udev
15:08<judd>Package udev on i386 -- lenny-security: 0.125-7+lenny1; lenny: 0.125-7+lenny3; squeeze: 164-3; wheezy: 167-3; sid: 168-1
15:08<whirli>stderr: seems to work, thanks a lot for the help! I know this isnt exactly the place for this so I appreciate the help.
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15:09<jhutchins_lt>Don't know if it's still valid.
15:10<daemonkeeper>jhutchins_lt: It is not fixed by definition, but base-files does not create /run anymore which works around the issue
15:10<devil>jhutchins_lt: 168-1 also has a bug, but not fatal
15:10<requia>well is there a fix?
15:10<devil>just a lot of nasty boot messages because /run is not there
15:11<devil>requia: remove /run
15:11<devil>if you have it
15:12<requia>just rm -r it?
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15:12<devil>requia: the one directly under / yes, not the one under /var
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15:12<requia>or rename it, renaming sounds safer
15:12<requia>thanks, rebooting now, hope this works
15:13<daemonkeeper>Well /run should be empty anyway.
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15:13<catsup>what is /run?
15:14<devil>the former /var/run, it moves to top level
15:14<devil>and creates a bit of havoc on the way
15:14<catsup>so now we have daemons that need /run, running before /var mounts
15:14<darius>how to boot squeeze into raid1 after installation, ended up in grub rescue....
15:14<devil>well, in the end its udev creating havoc
15:15<catsup>dbus is going to go on / isn't it
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15:20<Requia>works now
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15:24<darius>is it possible that grub fails becouse of ext4 filesystem ?
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15:26<devil>darius: why would it?
15:26<jhutchins_lt>darius: No, it's the raid.
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15:27<darius>I just have no more ideas why it fails to boot.. :/
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15:27<darius>i tried instaling on simple disk and then move everything to raid1, then last non raid disk is removed systems does not boot... :/
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15:29<electro>hi, i got wheezy and stable both installed, somehow i screwed up and got no bootlist at boot time, is there a package i can install to fix this? thx
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15:31<devil>darius: sounds like no gtrub installed on the raid
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15:32<darius>installer put grub on sda
15:32<darius>one of raid disks
15:33<darius>is that not enough to boot first time?
15:34<jhutchins_lt>darius: Getting it to boot on raid is not as simple as that. Have your read the install guide?
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15:34<jhutchins_lt>!tell darius about ig
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15:45<drewdavis>Installing Weezy KDE CD 1
15:46<drewdavis>I get: grub-pc failed to install into /target/
15:46<drewdavis>When I try to install grub.
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15:46<drewdavis>Found a bug report that says problem was fixed back in september.
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15:47<drewdavis>I should add, AMD64.
15:48<drewdavis>Is there a solution or should I just grab a different installer?
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15:49<kop>drewdavis: Usually you want to install the base squeeze and upgrade. Use the netinstall.
15:49<Tiff>could install grub manually post-install if you've already installed a system.
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15:50<kop>drewdavis: Just in case you're new and are choosing wheezy just to get new apps see below:
15:50<dpkg>Debian stable does not always include all the software people need or want so there is much official, semi-official, and non-official software available for stable. See . Ask me about <security>, <installer firmware>, <backports>, <squeeze-updates>, <multimedia>, <non-free>, <contrib>, <emdebian>, <debian live>. See also <grounding>, <social contract>.
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15:50<drewdavis>Tiff: Good point. I think I have a Debian live CD around here...
15:51-!-mode/#debian [+l 513] by debhelper
15:51<drewdavis>kop: Thanks. I may load squeeze and move up from there.
15:52<kop>drewdavis: If you must have the latest X/desktop then wheeze may be a good choice but there's options for regular apps. Some just like to run testing. You can do as you like.
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15:53<Class>hi folks :)) i have got my iptables in /etc/network/if-up.d/iptables so if i need to restart the iptables i need to restart networking right ? :)))
15:54<drewdavis>kop: I need a later kernel for some of my hardware (was gonna jump to sid) and backports doesn't have the kernel I need yet. I'm actually just fine squeeze otherwise.
15:54<drewdavis>kop: But what the heck. I can compile my own kernel.
15:54<Tiff>make the new kernel package yourself.
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16:00<jhutchins_lt>drewdavis: Niether wheezy nor sid are particularly stable now.
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16:00<jhutchins_lt>drewdavis: You'll probably need linux-base as well.
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16:04<darius>jhutchins_lt, as states, grub should be able to boot from RAID1 partition. also there a warning about RAID is new and van break. to what you was pointing?
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16:04<jhutchins_lt>darius: Yes, grub should work from raid1, and from encrypted volumes, but it's not point and click.
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16:06<darius>should i do it like in lenny? just install grub on every disk and make multiple boot entries from disks and not md array?
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16:06<darius>would it be safer?
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16:07<jhutchins_lt>darius: As far as I know you can get it to work from the array as from a single disk, but I don't know the details.
16:07<jhutchins_lt>I consider raid to be an unnecessary point of failure and avoid it.
16:07<jhutchins_lt>I've lost more raid controllers than I've lost disks.
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16:10<WannaFunk>hi all
16:10<WannaFunk>is there any chan were is possible to discuss about problems related to sid?
16:10<WannaFunk>a sort of sid support
16:11<devil>try here
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16:11<jhutchins_lt>WannaFunk: If you are running sid you are assumed to be above the level of irc support.
16:11<devil>some people here run sid and are aware of its probs
16:12<devil>jhutchins_lt: everyone has to learn :)
16:12<jhutchins_lt>Othere people here are aware of the problems from all of the people who should not be running sid but are anyway.
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16:13<WannaFunk>jhutchins_lt: I know, this is why I was asking if there are some dedicated chan
16:13<devil>WannaFunk: you can ask in #aptosid anyways
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16:13<WannaFunk>ok, thanks
16:13<jhutchins_lt>No, you pretty much have to just ask here and put up with the abuse.
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16:14<babilen>What's the problem?
16:14<WannaFunk>Xorg really slow
16:14<devil>a few details would come handy here
16:14<zeus_>Hi all, i'm running squeeze. I need a newer kernel (> 2.6.35) because my hardware is not supported. Can anyone tell me how can i install a newer kernel ? Can i add testing repos and install the testing linux-image ? wich is the best practice ?
16:15<dpkg>For Debian Lenny/5.0 installers with up-to-date kernels, see . The <bnx2> and <bnx2x> firmware files for Linux 2.6.32 are included in 0116 images. See also <firmware images>.
16:15<mai>hmm, factoid is old
16:15<babilen>mai: huh?
16:15<jhutchins_lt>Tell zeus_ about ssb
16:15<daemonkeeper>kmuto has nothing for Squeeze (yet)
16:16<jhutchins_lt>It's not the factoid that's old, it's kmuto.
16:16<daemonkeeper>Nonetheless, backporting the kernel works, make-kpkg as well
16:16<babilen>zeus_: You have several options. They basically fall into two categories: 1. Compile your own kernel (/msg dpkg make-kpkg) + or 2. Install a suitable linux-image-* and linux-base from testing or sid.
16:16<daemonkeeper>3. Wait for a backport or do one yourself
16:17<jhutchins_lt>That's right, you don't really ssb kernels, do you?
16:17<WannaFunk>Yeah, I have a dell latitude 520 (intel graphic card). After upgrading to the lates version of xorg available on the repository, xorg became very slow. It takes a lot of time to opeen menus, the poiter moves slow etc
16:18<babilen>zeus_: The latter can be achieved by i. Backporting the kernel (see /msg dpkg ssb) ii. Downloading the two packages in question and installing them with dpkg -i or iii. Adding wheezy/sid sources to your sources.list and setting the default release to squeeze (/msg dpkg default release) you can then "aptitude -t sid install linux-image-2.6-$ARCH"
16:19<daemonkeeper>To shorten the discussion: If you are happy with Debian kernels as they are (i.e. you don't want to modify something), I'd vote for babilen's second suggestion.
16:19<babilen>WannaFunk: Check your Xorg.0.log for obvious errors -- The output of "/usr/share/bug/xserver-xorg-core/script 3>&1" would come in handy too
16:20<zeus_>Ok, let's talk about the 2. option proposed by babilen. (Exclude 1. because i'm not an expert kernel builder and 3. because i'd like to use my new hardware)
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16:20<babilen>zeus_: What is there to talk about? :)
16:20<sney>zeus_: it's pretty straightforward, just download the relevant .debs from and install
16:21<babilen>zeus_: You need the linux-image-2.6.???? and linux-base packages
16:21<judd>Available kernel versions are: sid: 2.6.38-2-686 (2.6.38-4); wheezy: 2.6.38-2-686 (2.6.38-3); squeeze: 2.6.32-5-686 (2.6.32-31); lenny-backports: 2.6.32-bpo.5-686 (2.6.32-30~bpo50+1); lenny: 2.6.26-2-686 (2.6.26-26lenny2)
16:21<WannaFunk>thanks babilen, I will collect these information
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16:22<zeus_>sney: just this ? I was paranoid because i think i can't mix stable with testing (especially for kernels).
16:23<sney>zeus_: as long as you're not mixing apt repositories, if something does break it's not actually a big deal.
16:23<babilen>zeus_: It is typically no problem to install newer kernel packages. It is a bit more cumbersome these days because you also need to get linux-base
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16:23<sney>you absolutely shouldn't have both wheezy and squeeze in sources.list, which is probably what you're thinking of.
16:23<daemonkeeper>Good thing is, kernel has very few dependencies, so it is straightforward to use a newer kernel from testing/sid
16:24<zeus_>WOW ! thank you a million to babilen sney and all the people in this board !!
16:25<babilen>zeus_: You are welcome :)
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16:45<axhhshs>hi, guys!
16:46<axhhshs>thanks, for the great OS!
16:47<sney>most of the people here are just users / testers, but I'm sure any developers who might be hiding here appreciate your thanks
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16:48<daemonkeeper>Gnu/OS! :p
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16:49<axhhshs>ok, that was all I had to say , bye friends!
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16:52<ComradeHaz`>Apr 26 21:47:12 Hades modprobe: FATAL: Error inserting fuse (/lib/modules/2.6.38-2-amd64/kernel/fs/fuse/fuse.ko): Unknown symbol in module, or unknown parameter (see dmesg)
16:52<ComradeHaz`>Apr 26 21:47:12 Hades kernel: [176353.124507] fuse: Unknown symbol kstrtoull (err 0)
16:52<ComradeHaz`>Can anyone help with the above, please/
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16:52<houms>I just installed virt-manager and for some reason I only see qemu listed as virt type, when creating a new vm. BIOS shows the virt.ext. are enabled. can anyone help?
16:52<aussa>hi, I got this: "make[3]: Target `dbg' not remade because of errors." while a "make" command, how do I know what the problem is?
16:53<daemonkeeper>ComradeHaz`: Where did you get the fuse module from?
16:53<daemonkeeper>ComradeHaz`: It does not match your kernel ABI
16:53<ComradeHaz`>running unstable
16:53<houms>running virt-manager .8.7 from repo
16:54-!-Judas_PhD [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:54<ComradeHaz`>That's rather odd
16:54<ComradeHaz`>How do I further diagnose?
16:55<daemonkeeper>What exactly do you try to load?
16:55-!-arw is now known as arw_afk
16:55<houms>note I also have vbox installed, but I removed the vbox modules via modprobe
16:55<houms>yet it still only lists qemu and not kvm
16:55<ComradeHaz`>fstab entry: /mnt/tuxHome fuse comment=sshfs,noauto,users,exec,idmap=user,uid=1000,gid=1000,allow_other,default_permissions,reconnect,transform_symlinks,BatchMode=yes 0 0 0 0
16:56<ComradeHaz`>wtf are those hashes, actually
16:56<daemonkeeper>What happens if you do "modprobe fuse"?
16:57<ComradeHaz`>Should they be there?
16:57<daemonkeeper>Which hashes?
16:57<ComradeHaz`>The first line I pasted.
16:57<ComradeHaz`>" "
16:57<houms>i also added my user to the kvm and libvirt groups
16:57<daemonkeeper>sshfs is the fuse module you try to enable I'd assume
16:57<ComradeHaz`>No, sorry, modprobe yields second line I pasted
16:57<ComradeHaz`>Yes, indeed.
16:58<daemonkeeper>Can you paste a uname -a and a modinfo fuse somewhere?
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17:00<aussa>hi, I got this: "make[3]: Target `dbg' not remade because of errors." while a "make" command, how do I know what the problem is?
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17:00<daemonkeeper>aussa: Read ahead, the actual error is denoted above that error.
17:01<aussa>make[3]: *** No rule to make target `/home/andres/Programs/OpenSG/Builds/x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu-g++/BaseLib/lib-dbg/', needed by `SubLib'.
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17:01<daemonkeeper>Another line above. Please don't paste every line here though.
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17:02<ballison>is it a bad thing to EMBED a .deb inside of another .deb ? i'm building an upgrade package, and i need to support up to 3 revs back
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17:02<ballison>so I'm thinking of including the 2 previous upgrade .deb's in this .deb
17:02<ballison>or is that a bad thing?
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17:03<mjr>sounds bad
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17:03<daemonkeeper>ComradeHaz`: This looks good, could you do depmod -a and try again?
17:03-!-aroundthfur [] has joined #debian
17:03<ballison>mjr: But they way they build their' .deb's here they are just installing the details of what changed from the past version.
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17:03<mjr>sounds bad
17:04<daemonkeeper>ballison: If you don't package for Debian, you can do whatever you want ...
17:04<ComradeHaz`>daemonkeeper: same problem after depmod -a
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17:04<aussa>daemonkeeper: which line is it?
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17:05<ballison>daemonkeeper: I'm just wondering how I should do this. I could detect the current state (version of our software) and install the missing updates up until the current version.
17:06<ballison>daemonkeeper: I could put all of them into the same package if I could find a way to run each of the packages seperate postinst files.
17:06*ComradeHaz` is impressed by daemon--keeper helping 3 people at once xD
17:06<babilen>ballison: Is it necessary to apply all three updates successively?
17:06<ballison>daemonkeeper: have you have more than one postinst file?
17:06<ballison>babilen: yes
17:06<daemonkeeper>aussa: Your actuall error is before the start of your pasting
17:07<daemonkeeper>ballison: You can add a pre/postinst script which checks installed version and do a dependency based upgrade
17:07<babilen>ballison: Can't you roll that into one package for the newest version, completely remove the old package and install the new one?
17:07<daemonkeeper>ComradeHaz`: Maybe this is an upstream regression, unless you touched the module yourself?
17:08<ComradeHaz`>Nope, not at all. Far too noob for such messing :)
17:08<ballison>babilen: I wish. they have a base install, and each upgrade installs like 10-20 new files.
17:08<ComradeHaz`>No bug reports afaict.
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17:08<ballison>babilen: and does a couple mysql alter tables to add new columns
17:08<ComradeHaz`>Not yet, anyway
17:09<daemonkeeper>ballison: The Debian way to handle this, is to aggregate updates in postinst.
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17:10<ballison>daemonkeeper: I've taken apart the pervious versions and have them install into /usr/local/share/software_name/1.2/ , 1.3, 1.3.1... and so forth for each version
17:10<daemonkeeper>ComradeHaz`: If you didn't touch the kernel yourself, you may file a bug report by providing the modinfo / uname output.
17:10<ballison>and inside each is a "install_files" which lists all the files that that version update installs.
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17:10<babilen>ballison: Keep in mind that every single package you create should either depend on other packages or be completely independent. It should be installable on its own and you should be able to remove it completely. Therefore: Create a *single* package for the newest version and make sure that the installation works.
17:10<ComradeHaz`>daemonkeeper: never filed a bug report before. Not really sure how to!
17:10<daemonkeeper>ComradeHaz`: Use the reportbug tool
17:11<ballison>babilen: But the package needs to assume that you are running version 1.2, version 1.3 or version 1.3.1
17:11<babilen>!tell ComradeHaz` about reportbug
17:11<babilen>!tell ComradeHaz` about report-bugs
17:11<aussa>daemonkeeper:, there have been a lot of warnings in the process :S
17:11<ballison>and each one of those versions had their own .deb's. this is the first one where we've tried to roll all the updates for each into one package.
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17:12<daemonkeeper>aussa: The actual error is still before your paste. You may provide the full make output :)
17:12<babilen>ballison: There are no "update" packages in that a package of version X.Y.Z depends on another version of the same package of version X.Y.Z-1 being installed.
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17:14<aussa>daemonkeeper: what if I scroll up til the moment I can't scroll up anymore?
17:14<daemonkeeper>aussa: make > output 2>&1
17:15<daemonkeeper>Will catch output to a "output" file
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17:15<daemonkeeper>ballison: Why do you actually assume a given version is installed, i.e. what do you need to do upon upgrade?
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17:17<babilen>ballison: So: Create three packages (if you have to) -- Make sure that you can install and remove each of these packages independently of each other. You therefore have to create a comprehensive postinst for each version where newer versions also contain snippets from older versions. Just make sure that the packages are independent of each other.
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17:32<daemonkeeper>aussa: /home/andres/Programs/OpenSG/Source/Base/Xml/OSGXmltokenizer.cpp:86: error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope - This is a programming error / library incompatibility
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17:33<aussa>so... what does that mean? there is nothing to do?
17:34<sney>it means you have to talk to the OpenSG people about their buggy software.
17:34<daemonkeeper>You may contact the upstream author of the program you are about to compile. Provide it your debug output, ./configure line if applicable and they need to fix it
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17:41<aussa>I found this link:, in it, there is a repository to get it, but it is for ubuntu... can't I access it, or get it some other way?
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17:42<daemonkeeper>You can install Ubuntu packages in Debian. Don't need to say this is completely unsupported
17:42<daemonkeeper>And may have side effects / damage your system somehow.
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17:43<daemonkeeper>Probably you don't want gutsy though which is $old
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17:49<jhutchins_lt>aussa: Put it this way, you can install SOME ubuntu packages in Debian. Others WILL hose your system.
17:50<jhutchins_lt>aussa: Also, don't expect to be able to upgrade a Debian system that has Ubuntu packages installed.
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17:52<aussa>ok ty
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17:56<babilen>aussa: I would suggest to write to the ML and ask about your problems: -- They are probably able to spot errors faster than we are. Good luck!
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17:58<aussa>thank you
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18:04<gpm>hi. i'm trying to use grub-mklayout to make a dvorak one (using a file i generated with ckbcomp us dvorak) but when i do it says "Unknown keycode 0x79" (no quotes). I'm lost. Any clues?
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18:08<Vlam>If I installed gnome-core on a system without a desktop environment then used aptitude unmark auto gnome-core, could I uninstall say Evolution without removing the whole desktop environment?
18:10<Vlam>Or is there another solution to install GNOME then uninstalling a program that came with it but keep the GNOME environment?
18:11-!-adi [~adi@2001:470:b471:0:59f3:66f0:a105:6698] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:11<babilen>Vlam: You could install gnome-session which is the metapackage that depends on the bare essentials of GNOME -- You can then remove packages as you please and "aptitude unmarkauto" those you want to keep
18:12<Vlam>Alright let me get my laptop and run through that
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18:14<babilen>Vlam: Take your time :)
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18:17<Vlam>I'm going to do a reinstall because I have a ton of packages on here
18:18<Vlam>It's only used for browsing the web so it doesn't matter
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18:21<babilen>Vlam: If you think it is easier that way … have fun!
18:21<Vlam>Yeah I'm picky on my systems
18:22<mjt>there's also a whole lot of things pulled by Recommends:
18:22<babilen>Vlam: Just don't install the desktop task, but built it package by package.
18:22<babilen>mjt: For good reasons
18:22<mjt>sometimes, yes
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18:22<mjt>(I yet to see such a reason myself ;)
18:23<Vlam>What's the difference between gnome-core gnome-desktop-environment and gnome-session packages?
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18:23<Vlam>Seems redundant
18:23<sney>different dependencies
18:23<Vlam>Does gnome-session of the least
18:24<sney>personally I just skip gnome altogether when I don't want a huge software suite full of crap I'm not going to use
18:24<sney>so I'm not sure, but aptitude would be able to tell you, via the 'show' command and others
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18:24<Vlam>I like gnome I just don't like how many packages are installed with it
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18:26<babilen>Vlam: gnome-session is the smallest of the metapackages
18:26<babilen>!install gnome
18:26<dpkg>To install GNOME: install the 'gnome' package to install everything, 'gnome-desktop-environment' for GNOME as defined by upstream, 'gnome-core' for a bit less and 'gnome-session' for the basic components actually needed to run a GNOME session. You will need Xorg installed as well, ask me about <install x>.
18:27<babilen>Vlam: See also the discussion of #608098
18:28<Vlam>!install x
18:28<dpkg>To install X in Debian Lenny and later releases: "aptitude update && aptitude install xorg". You may also want to install a desktop environment - ask me about <install gnome>, <install kde>, <install xfce>, <install lxde> - or a window manager, ask me about <window manager>. To configure your X server, ask me about <xorg config>.
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18:28<Vlam>I wondered, in the debian installer, at the bottom where it lists the extra stuff you can select what is System Utilities?
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18:39<loply>Evenin folks
18:39<loply>Just a general question - how long would one expect the majority of UK residents to see new DNS data for a .net domain if the registrar submits the change in real time?
18:40<loply>I seem to have observed that domains take no more than 30 minutes usually, but not sure about .net
18:41<sney>.net is usually between 4 and 24 hours I think
18:41<sney>that's full propagation anyway
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18:42<loply>I have a live server which has gone FUBAR and the only way to switch to the backup is by changing the DNS, but the live server will almost certainly be fixed by 10/11am tomorrow.
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18:52<Vlam>That seems like a complicated problem loply
18:53<loply>Actually I've just realised we don't even have SSL certs for the backup server (which is on a different IP) so that whole backup server is not so much use anyway
18:53<loply>should really devise a new strategy for that one.
18:54<Vlam>I just wondered, why would anyone use Ubuntu Server? When they could use Debian which is probably much better
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18:55<babilen>Vlam: Longer support comes to mind -- apart from that: nfc. But I am not familiar with Ubuntu. They probably also sell support contracts.
18:55<subh>how to use xchat
18:56<subh>i want to register my name for IRC
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18:57<babilen>subh: /msg nickserv help register
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18:59<daemonkeeper>Vlam: In contrast to Debian Ubuntu provides SLA, a guaranteed maintenance period and a lot of vaporware.
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19:00<daemonkeeper>Note this discussion is off topic here.
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19:01<loply>Anybody suggest any common reasons why a server wouldn't reboot after being upgraded from Lenny to Squeeze? I presume it's a GRUB or kernel issue but it's remote and I have no interface to it now that it's offline
19:01<loply>...just waiting for the out of hours guy to arrive at the data centre to hopefully Press F1...
19:01<daemonkeeper>That's a shot in the dark, plenty of reasons are possible.
19:02<homaar>grub issue
19:02<daemonkeeper>grub, udev, hardware, firmware issues, a hanging init script, ...
19:02<Vlam>Yeah my server has gone down for random reason but the data is not critical so I force shut it off lol
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19:02<Vlam>Well gone offline when I rebooted and never came back
19:02<loply>GRUB should be pretty easy to sort and seems the most likely (I guess?)
19:02<loply>firmware/drivers would be a bit of a nightmare
19:03<mobildorn>Hehe. Just today I had problems to boot my desktop. One daemon decided to replace its self-signed cert (the old one expired) and there wasn't much entropy while booting.
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19:03<loply>I hate entropy problems, I seem to run into that one loads...
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19:03<homaar>i had also some grub issues but didn't run it remote
19:03<mobildorn>Took me some minutes to type lots of nonsense to get it running.
19:03<homaar>seval times
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19:04<loply>I did wait a long time for possible entropy or disk-checks to complete...
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19:04<homaar>tune2fs is also helpfull
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19:05<sney>loply: what upgrade instructions did you follow? did you upgrade the kernel and udev before the rest?
19:05<mobildorn>I set my fsck intervals to different prime numbers. Reduces the risk that there's more than one fsck per boot.
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19:06<loply>sney: Nope... I did read those instructions, but I tried just doing dist-upgrade right away on two VM's first (before reading the instructions) so I thought better the devil you know, and went for it...
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19:07<loply>everything was running fine after the upgrade but before the reboot
19:07<sney>yeah, that is most likely what did it. serious udev incompatibility
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19:08<loply>in what sense? hardware related?
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19:08<homaar>can anyone tell me a link / hint about auto load of usb devices in newer releases? i only find old usbmgr / hotplug stuff
19:08<sney>it's been about 4 months since I last dealt with one so I'm a little fuzzy on the details but iirc it is also libc6 related. you *need* to be running 2.6.32 and the new udev before you can upgrade the rest of lenny to squeeze
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19:09<loply>sney: If I do a dist-upgrade though it will install the new udev and libc, prior to rebooting and bringing the new kernel online
19:10<mjt>and new libc can be installed independently of everything else
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19:10<lodurr_>someone know how to install 0bda:8176 Debian 64 bits??
19:11<sney>look, you can ask devs about the mechanical details of it. all I know is: doing a dist-upgrade with no preparation often breaks the system, while upgrading kernel/udev first, rebooting into the new kernel, and THEN doing the dist-upgrade always works.
19:11<loply>Hmm fair enough... fingers crossed.
19:11<cthuluh>also, updating dpkg and apt first is a good idea too
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19:12<sney>,pciid 0bda:8176
19:12<judd>[0bda:8176] is 'Unknown device' from 'Unknown vendor' with no known kernel module in squeeze or in sid. See also
19:12<loply>I think I just figured since my two VM's were more or less clones of the live server (excepting hardware differences) that it would work, was always a slight gamble though.
19:12<sney>lodurr_: what device is that?
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19:12<lodurr_>i do the dist-upgrade and doesnt work :S
19:13<sney>lodurr_: what is 0bda:8176?
19:13<sney>lodurr_: ask questions in the channel please.
19:13<lodurr_>.sney ok
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19:14<sney>lodurr_: in squeeze, a lot of network adapters need firmware now.
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19:15<homaar>can anyone tell me why i can't find /etc/hotplug/* - is usbmgr / hotplug replaced my an other program?
19:16<cthuluh>never heard about it
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19:16<homaar>i talk about usb hotplug and how it works
19:16<cthuluh>but yeah, udev + hal should deal with this kind of issue
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19:18<sney>lodurr_: please ask questions IN THE CHANNEL. I will not answer your private messages.
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19:19<sney>lodurr_: it looks like a realtek adapter. the driver isn't listed on the debian wiki. do you know what it used before? also, does lsusb show anything other than the usb id?
19:19<lodurr_>lsusb show -- ID 0bda:8176 Realtek Semiconductor Corp.
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19:23<mjt>cthuluh: please let hal rest in peace already :)
19:25<dpkg>[rtl8192su] r8192s_usb is a Linux kernel module produced by the rtl8192su staging driver, supporting Realtek RTL8188SU, RTL8191S and RTL8192SU 802.11n USB wireless LAN chipsets. Enabled as of linux-2.6 2.6.32-10 (x86 architectures only). Firmware is required (RTL8192SU/rtl8192sfw.bin), ask me about <realtek firmware> to provide. Not to be confused with the <rtl8192u> driver. See also <r8712u>.
19:25<sney>lodurr_: ^ this is what you need it seems
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19:25<sney>lodurr_: the driver is already in your system, it just needs the firmware-realtek package from non-free.
19:26<mjt>provided dmesg agrees :)
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19:33<loply>apache had put an interactive prompt for an SSL cert private key up during boot... for god sake.
19:34<loply>£150 callout fee well spent.
19:34<cthuluh>do not put a passphrase on your ssl key
19:34<lodurr_>sney: with apt-get install ??
19:34<mobildorn>Or don't start apache on boot.
19:35<loply>I have no idea why but one of my certs has one? God knows how or when it happened. I might actually just remove that cert as it's a deprecated URL and not many (if any) users should have that URL bookmarked any more.
19:35<mobildorn>file-rc makes it easy. Or a policy thingy.
19:35<cthuluh>lodurr_: yes, provided you have the non-free section set up in your sources.list
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19:41<lodurr_>i have ---- deb squeeze main contrib non-free
19:41<lodurr_>deb squeeze/updates main contrib non-free and do the update and doesnt work
19:43<cthuluh>what does''aptitude search firmware'' say?
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19:48<cthuluh>so you have the firmware-realtek package installed
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19:49<cthuluh>lodurr_: please remind me what was your actual probem
19:50<lodurr_>cthuluh: i try to install 0bda:8176 in my Debian 64 bits
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19:51<lodurr_>cthuluh: Airlink Ultra Mini USB Adapter
19:51<cthuluh>hmm, ok
19:51<mjt>it appears the dmesg is missing still...
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19:55<cthuluh>lodurr_: post your dmesg no a pastebin
19:55<brobinson>having trouble with statip ip on 6.0.1, all configure well but on reboot i get stuck at "Starting NFS common utilities: statd"
19:55<cthuluh>lodurr_: then, look at this:
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19:56<lodurr_>cthuluh, sorry
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19:56<lodurr_>cthuluh, i try this steps but doesnt work i think but is because is 64 bits
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19:57<cthuluh>then I can't help
19:57<lodurr_>cthuluh, oks dont problem thanks anyway
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20:02<lodurr_>cthuluh, where put my dmesg? if not use pastebin?
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20:03<cthuluh>use a pastebin
20:03<lodurr_>cthuluh, ok
20:03<mobildorn>He tried to type "on", not "no", I believe
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20:04<cthuluh>uh, right 8)
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20:07<cthuluh>seems like your usb wifi key is recognized
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20:07<cthuluh>[ 102.553147] wlan0: associated
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20:07<cthuluh>perhaps unstable, but recognized
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20:08<lodurr_>because i have another usb wireless. but is really bad. the other works better but not in my Debian lol
20:09-!-PIrr [] has joined #debian
20:09<cthuluh>ok so you have wireless access?
20:09<lodurr_>I unplug the other and made the dmesg
20:09<lodurr_>yes in this moments with the another usb
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20:10<lodurr_>also i have connected the realtek
20:10<cthuluh>before the dmesg?
20:11-!-tuhin [~tuhin@] has joined #debian
20:11<cthuluh>ok, I see. anyway, you got a usb wifi key that works. be happy with that
20:12<tuhin>i installed Debian Live LXDE 6.01 in hdd, why the only source for packages is the CD itself?!!
20:13<cthuluh>because you didn't configure other sources
20:13<tuhin>i installed from Live USB mose so i cant update from CD
20:13<lodurr_>thanks but I have to use it next to the router like as cable
20:14<tuhin>cthuluh: shouldn't it be preconfigured to update from debian server???
20:14<cthuluh>tuhin: no???!!!???
20:15<tuhin>then what i m supposed to do?
20:15<sney>!squeeze sources.list
20:15<dpkg>The list of repositories for installing packages is /etc/apt/sources.list and has lines like "deb squeeze main" and "deb squeeze/updates main". Be sure to run "aptitude update" after editing sources.list. Also see <mirrors> <apt-spy> <squeeze updates> <squeeze security> and "man sources.list".
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20:15<sney>^ do that
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20:15<cthuluh>thanks a lot, sney...
20:15-!-gmarselis [~gmarselis@] has joined #debian
20:16<gmarselis>last night a sysadmin saved my life....
20:16<sney>we're handy like that
20:17<lodurr_>cthuluh thanks and sorry anyway
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20:19<tuhin>deb testing main contrib non-free , deb sid main , deb testing main non-free , deb testing non-free I added these in that sources.list and started aptget update and upgrade
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20:19<gmarselis>tuhin: proceed to alt.sysadmin.recovery
20:19<cthuluh>ewww, testing + sid
20:20-!-gmarselis is now known as project2501a
20:20<retrospectacus>tuhin: foolish! did you consider what you were doing?
20:20<project2501a>tuhin: ^C ^C ^C NOW
20:20<sney>tuhin: so you installed 6.0.1 which is squeeze (stable), then you just randomly picked a different repository? why?
20:20*retrospectacus goes home. GL :)
20:20<tuhin>i just installed LXDE DEbian6.01 and the only source is the CD (i have n CD)
20:21-!-lodurr_ [~lodurr@] has quit [Quit: Saliendo]
20:21<tuhin>i got those sources from one in irc
20:21<project2501a>man, i don't wanna go to the data center at 4am...
20:21-!-lodurr_ [~lodurr@] has joined #debian
20:21<tuhin>how to cancel project2501a ?
20:21-!-lodurr_ is now known as lodurr
20:22<sney>tuhin: well if it's just downloading you can ctrl+c
20:22<tuhin>those repositories are bad?
20:22<sney>those repositories don't match your system, so it can easily break everything
20:22<sney>at least it's a new install so you can just reinstall if it's too late
20:23<project2501a>tuhin: it's like making a tuna fish sandwich and adding beans and sand.
20:23-!-Caroll [~caroll@] has joined #debian
20:23<project2501a>sure it looks good, but would you eat it?
20:23<tuhin>so which repo should i update to 1st?
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20:24<tuhin>the ones which dpkg bot said?
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20:25<tuhin>canceled it , DLed 12 MB only
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20:25<project2501a>tuhin: what do you mean which repo? what do you need to update?
20:25<tuhin>so , why the sources.list only had the CD to update from
20:26<tuhin>usual update that evbody do in debian
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20:26<project2501a>hmmm. did you not ask to add a network mirror during installation?
20:27<tuhin>i saw no such option
20:27<project2501a>ok, you did not load the network mirror module during installation
20:27<tuhin>i selected /boot , / and /home and started
20:27<tuhin>so i have to run the install again?
20:28<tuhin>also it doesn't seem to recognize and USB Flash drive!
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20:28<project2501a>if by recognize, you mean "automatically mount" , then yes, it does not.
20:28<tuhin>it says the file system is bad or something
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20:29<tuhin>so what did i miss and what is the remedy
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20:31<project2501a>tuhin: you missed about 100 pages of reading.
20:31<project2501a>did you chose the expert installation option?
20:32<project2501a>well, if the filesystem is bad, it's bad.
20:32<tuhin>i choose LIVE then selected installer from Desktop
20:32<tuhin>only all USB Flash drive is said to be bad
20:32<project2501a>see, kids. this is what ubuntu does to you...
20:33<tuhin>it can read other HDD partitions fine
20:33<tuhin>they r EXT4, ntfs and fat32
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20:35<tuhin>project2501a: Debian is running fine....
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20:40<tuhin>cthuluh: sney , retrospectacus pls just tell me what i have to do ? i have canceled that update and rebooted it fine
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20:40<tuhin>i didnt see any option asking to setup packages/update source....
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20:55<AbsintheSyringe>I need someone who's running wheezy to run "lsb_release -r" for me and tell me the output
20:56<project2501a>Release: Testing
20:56<project2501a>Release: testing
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20:56<tuhin>project2501a: what shall i do?
20:56<AbsintheSyringe>priyesh, tnx
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21:04<Vlam>I just extracted the latest from Adobe and put it in my browsers plugin directory and it just eats resources. Before it did not eat this much but it's insane, I go to YouTube and it takes a few seconds to start to scroll down the page and takes like a minute to even go to the link to watch the video.
21:04<Vlam>My whole system becomes slow
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21:09<Vlam>Uses about 25-35 CPU according to System Monitor
21:12<willwh>hey guys, is there a way to halt a core dump?
21:12<willwh>a buddy of mine is on the phone in a panic
21:12<willwh>a running process crashed and is currently writing around ~ 50Gb or so
21:13<Vlam>ctrl c?
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21:16<phillipsjk>A core dump should not exceed memory+swap AFAIK
21:16<willwh>Vlam: don't think so, process alrdy terminated
21:17<babilen>Vlam: And you know about flashplugin-nonfree, don't you?
21:18<Vlam>Yes I heard that it's an old version and you should use the latest
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21:19<phillipsjk>I install Adobe flash in the ~/.mozilla/plugins directory as a limited user.
21:19-!-hardwalker [] has joined #debian
21:19<Vlam>Maybe it's the latest version because I'm doing exactly the same thing I did a few weeks ago
21:20-!-kFreeBSDNoob [] has joined #debian
21:20<babilen>Vlam: You get the newest version directly from Adobe.
21:20<Vlam>With flashplugin-nonfree package?
21:20-!-sagitarius [~sagitariu@] has joined #debian
21:20<kFreeBSDNoob>someone knows a debian release working for a 128MB RAM and 20GiB?
21:21<Vlam>Debian should work on that with a desktop environment but it would be very limited
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21:24<kFreeBSDNoob>No problem.
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21:24<Vlam>I'm only using about 1GB on my brand new system that i just installed GNOME on
21:25-!-Vlam [] has quit [Quit: Vlam]
21:25<babilen>kFreeBSDNoob: A minimal install should easily meet those requirements
21:25-!-Vlam [] has joined #debian
21:25<willwh>kFreeBSDNoob: try fluxbox, or openbox
21:25<willwh>or maybe don't use a gui ;]
21:25<willwh>apt-get install lynx
21:25<willwh>I am joking ofc... :]
21:25<Vlam>Try lxde or xfce
21:25<cthuluh>ratpoison ftw
21:26<willwh>xfce even a little high
21:26-!-Archie [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
21:26<willwh>I do love it though :]
21:26<Vlam>The slowest machine I have is a Celeron M laptop so I wouldn't know
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21:26<babilen>kFreeBSDNoob: What need to run on that box?
21:27<Vlam>babilen: I have installed flashplugin-nonfree and YouTube is working perfectly
21:27<babilen>Vlam: hehe
21:27<kFreeBSDNoob>I just need a simple Window 2000 capability with Wine support (also includes gnumeric).
21:27<babilen>Vlam: Remember to run "update-flashpluin-nonfree --install" once in a while to keep it up-to-date
21:28<willwh>kFreeBSDNoob: you're going to struggle to do that
21:28<kFreeBSDNoob>Ok, I'm going to go lower in my expectations.
21:28<babilen>kFreeBSDNoob: How exactly is that "simple" -- You need X and wine. But yeah, go for a lightweight WM (awesomewm, fluxbox, dwm, wmii, xmonad, openbox) and install what else you need.
21:29<Vlam>Yeah WINE will hate that machine
21:29<kFreeBSDNoob>that sucks, hahaha.
21:29<phillipsjk>A few years ago I was running some simple programs in wine with only 96MB.
21:30<Vlam>How do I get my networks BSSID?
21:31<kFreeBSDNoob>Does lightweight WM support Wine, flash, java, and gnumeric?
21:31<Vlam>I don't think that support is dependent on your WM
21:32-!-PIrr_ [] has joined #debian
21:32<phillipsjk>The "heavy" WMs just take more RAM for eye candy :)
21:33<Vlam>Wait never mind I can use the BSSID or MAC Address
21:33-!-Vlam [] has left #debian []
21:33<kFreeBSDNoob>As long it can do a 'classic-like' windows 2000 appearance, that's okay with me.
21:33<kFreeBSDNoob>WM are OS, right?
21:34<tuhin>hi babilen
21:34<phillipsjk>icewm or xfce may be close
21:34<tuhin>why its so hard to get help here]
21:35-!-Vlam [] has joined #debian
21:35<kFreeBSDNoob>I'm sometimes waited for long periods to receive the steady help.
21:36<Vlam>I can't use gnome-network-manager to configure my devices, if I remove /etc/network/interfaces will my machine generate a new one and gnome-network-manager will work agian?
21:36<kFreeBSDNoob>phillipsjk: So I should go for icewm or xfce?
21:36<Vlam>icewm is lighter thatn xfce I htink
21:36<tuhin>iasked for help and got little help
21:36<tuhin>alot lighter that xfce
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21:37<Arrowmaster>Vlam: /etc/network/interfaces is not autogenerated
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21:38<kFreeBSDNoob>So which WM OS have GUI and wine support (including flash and java)?
21:39-!-cdlu [] has quit [Ping timeout: 600 seconds]
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21:39<tuhin>Mint10 and LMDE
21:40<phillipsjk>WM is a Window manager. If you are not using a Desktop Environment, you can even change Window managers on the fly.
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21:40<kFreeBSDNoob>That's good to know.
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21:41<Vlam>So some how gnome-network-manager works with no /etc/network/interfaces file
21:41<nevyn>Vlam: nm doesn't use /etc/network/interfaces
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21:42<Vlam>Ah well apparently it disconnects and reconnects once in a while by it self for some odd reason
21:42<dpkg>Linux Mint is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Please use their forums at or join #linuxmint-help on for support. Linux Mint is variously based on <Ubuntu> with a "Linux Mint Debian Edition" (LMDE) also available, based on <testing>. See also <based on debian>, <mintppc>.
21:43<nevyn>Vlam: gnome-network-manager uses network manager
21:43-!-Pitxyoki [] has quit [Quit: Pitxyoki]
21:43<nevyn>kFreeBSDNoob: what do you mean by OS?
21:44<kFreeBSDNoob>I mean operating system, like the Windows 2000 or XP.
21:44<nevyn>kFreeBSDNoob: debian.
21:44<Vlam>nevyn: I don't understand what you mean by "network manager"
21:45<nevyn>Vlam: /etc/init.d/Network-manager
21:45<kFreeBSDNoob>there's too many alternatives for me to run though, but yeah, I recognize debian as a OS.
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21:45<phillipsjk>For GUI and Wine support, you need X11R6 ( a Window Manager or Desktop environment.
21:45<nevyn>Vlam: nm == network manager a system daemon that trys to ensure there's a route to the internet that works at all times
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21:46<nevyn>is wine stable and 64bit clean ?
21:46-!-negro-jei [~negro-jei@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:47<nevyn>Vlam: gnome-network-manager is a controll app for the daemon
21:47-!-jeflui [] has joined #debian
21:47<nevyn>Vlam: make sense?
21:48<Vlam>I can't connect using it when /etc/network/interfaces file exists but I can when it doesn't
21:48<nevyn>the interactions between ifup/down (/etc/network/interfaces) and network manager are varied and complex.
21:49<nevyn>Vlam: I suggest you pick one or the other.
21:49<Vlam>Well I'm running a laptop and I will be on several networks so I can't keep eding the /etc/network/interfaces file
21:49<phillipsjk>nevyn: Wine does not completely match MS Windows yet, if that is what you are asking.
21:49<nevyn>Vlam: I use network manager on workstations and laptops and interfaces on servers and appliances
21:49<nevyn>phillipsjk: not what I'm asking
21:49-!-debsan [~debsan@] has joined #debian
21:50<nevyn>does wine successfully run applications when run on amd64 linux
21:50<willwh>Vlam: also there is wcid too
21:50-!-noCloudsDotOrg [~javier@] has joined #debian
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21:50<nevyn>there is wcid which is something similar.
21:50<Vlam>I tried using that and it never used the IP I specified
21:50<dpkg>from memory, wicd is Wireless Interface Connection Daemon, a wired and <wireless connection manager>. A backported package is available for Lenny, ask me about <bdo>. See also <netdev>. #wicd on
21:51*nevyn likes network manager. but it can be a little baroque
21:51<kFreeBSDNoob>phillipsjk: Thanks for cleaning up the alternative list.
21:51<Vlam>Is there a way to make my computer not warn me for a missing /etc/network/interfaces file
21:51-!-Matze_ [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
21:52<nevyn>Vlam: make it an empty file or reconfigure nm to manage interfaces listed in /etc/network/interfaces
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21:52<Vlam>How can I tell it to configure that file?
21:53<nevyn>Vlam: in /etc/NetworkManager.conf or similar manageifupdown=false change to true. (it's something like this.)
21:53<Vlam>Yes this is my /etc/network/interfaces file: Does it all look ok?
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21:55<DAV710>Vlam: I heard ifscheme makes easy to switch between different networks
21:55<dvs>Vlam: If you want wicd to manage your wlan0 interface, you have to remove all references to wlan0 from interfaces
21:55<kFreeBSDNoob>Did anyone have experience with the X11R6.8.1 before?
21:55<phillipsjk>nevyn: no.
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21:56<nevyn>phillipsjk: yeah that's what I thought.
21:58<DAV710>Vlam: You can use that with /etc/network/interfaces
21:59<kFreeBSDNoob>I got .gz files, do I just extract them before burning?
22:01<nevyn>kFreeBSDNoob: what exactly are you trying to do?
22:01-!-Vlam [] has quit [Read error: No route to host]
22:02<kFreeBSDNoob>I am getting input about installing X11R6.8.1.
22:03<nevyn>kFreeBSDNoob: apt-get install xorg-server-full or something similar?
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22:04<nevyn>kFreeBSDNoob: you do not want to build X11 from source unless you know what you're doing.
22:05-!-dav__ [~dav@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:06<kFreeBSDNoob>okay, I was about to do that.
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22:08<babilen>!tell kFreeBSDNoob -about install x
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22:10<kFreeBSDNoob>I'm going to look for early debian releases.
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22:11<babilen>kFreeBSDNoob: So you run into performance problems?
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22:12<kFreeBSDNoob>Yeah, I tried the kFreeBSD, but I am limited to only the text console.
22:13<kFreeBSDNoob>I have to ignore the swap space option as well.
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22:13<babilen>Why is that? Swap seems to be a good idea with the amount of RAM you have.
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22:16<kFreeBSDNoob>kFreeBSD took almost all of the disk space, leaving about 153 MB for swap space. I must assume that the 6.0 release was too much for my machine.
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22:16<babilen>kFreeBSDNoob: I don't believe that a minimal kfreebsd install needs 20GB -- You certainly installed more than that.
22:17<Vlam>There's no way it should used that much
22:17<babilen>Absolutely no way
22:17<Vlam>Debian needs at least like what 768 mb or something?
22:18<catsup>uh no
22:18<catsup>more like 100
22:18<catsup>however i suspect kFreeBSDNoob means that the installer partitioned almost all of the disk space
22:18<Vlam>With the GNOME
22:19<catsup>if it's "with [this or that optional component]" then it's not "minimal"
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22:21<kFreeBSDNoob>Isn't there like a standard gui?
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22:23<Vlam>There's X but that looks like Windows 3.1 lol
22:23<catsup>lol, this malware-infected windows machine has a compromised explorer, (even though internet explorer is supposedly disabled), that plays random radio ads from the internet (lol what?). killing explorer.exe shuts off the sound, but the desktop icons disappear. windows rules.
22:24<Vlam>Well explorer should get rid of the icons if I remember right if you kill it
22:24<Vlam>I've never had malware on my Windows machine
22:24<catsup>yeah, well the point is, they implemented their desktop using a web browser
22:25<Vlam>Internet Explorer and Explorer are not the same
22:25<babilen>kFreeBSDNoob: The standard GUI is Gnome. Wouldn't recommend that with your resources though.
22:25<catsup>so there's no way to shut off the web browser without decimating the system
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22:26<Vlam>Well the task for Internet Explorer is iexplore.exe and the task for Explorer is explorer.exe
22:26<reklipz>Vlam: by default, yes
22:26<Vlam>You can "uninstall" IE by using Windows Features on or off (Vista and Windows 7) not sure about XP
22:26<catsup>yeah i disabled IE
22:26<babilen>May I suggest ##windows on ?
22:26<Arrowmaster>prior to vista, they used most of the same components though
22:27<Arrowmaster>so you really couldnt remove IE
22:27<catsup>but explorer is still connecting to web sites and running javascript
22:27<catsup>and when those web sites have errors, a dialog box pops up that says internet explorer
22:28<Vlam>Who knows the malware probably did something crazy like that
22:28<Vlam>I'd just format the hard drive with the Windows disc and reinstall Windows or some Linux distribution (depending on what the user is like) but anyways the topic here is Debian :P
22:29<catsup>i'm not asking for windows help
22:29<catsup>just making fun of windows
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22:30<babilen>catsup: → #d-ot please or #moocows or ##windows please :)
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22:30<Vlam>If I wasn't a gamer I would probably run Debian on all my machines
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22:30<catsup>i do run debian on all my machines
22:30<twb>Is there an easy way to list (e.g. in aptitude's UI) upgradable packages *only* if the upgrade is more than just a Debian version bump?
22:31<twb>When I'm tracking sid and I'm on a slow connection, I don't want to bother upgrading stuff that isn't a substantial change
22:31<babilen>twb: Can't think of a search pattern for that.
22:31<twb>babilen: yeah, it's... nontrivial
22:31<twb>babilen: short of a awk or perl oneliner or something
22:33<babilen>well, another day -- good night
22:35<kFreeBSDNoob>does anyone know how to set up a irc server?
22:36<Vlam>No idea, I don't see a point if it's just going to be personal
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22:36<Vlam>You want to make a linux irc server?
22:37<kFreeBSDNoob>You are right, Vlam. I witnessed some subjective horrors (even got banned from a channel).
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22:37<kFreeBSDNoob>I guess so, windows work too.
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22:38<catsup>kFreeBSDNoob: debian includes a number of irc servers you can install
22:39<catsup>e.g.: dancer-ircd ircd-hybrid ircd-irc2 ircd-ircu ngircd
22:39<kFreeBSDNoob>that's good to know.
22:39<catsup>apt-get install one and read the documentation
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22:47<jcress>how does one troubleshoot wireless connectivity issues with network-manager in gnome. I'm able to connect to some networks (unreliably). Networks known to be good/reliable using this laptop and another with previous debian installs. currently using testing and firmware-b43-lpphy-installer via apt
22:48<Vlam>You could try WICD to make sure it's not network manager
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22:49<Vlam>I doubt network manager is the problem though
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22:49<jcress>vlam: sure, my question is, how do i figure out what hte problem is
22:49<chrisreich>One school of thought is that everything is suspect until proven to be working.
22:49<jcress>do connection attempts write a lot somewhere
22:50<chrisreich>how long ago were the previous Debian installs working for you?
22:50<nubfilter>anyone using ZFS on a non-boot drive?
22:50<catsup>jcress: ignore 'network-manager'
22:51-!-mode/#debian [+l 471] by debhelper
22:51<Vlam>I'm not very good troubleshooting in Linux, jcress the other guys would help more :P
22:51<catsup>jcress: in a terminal run 'iwconfig', see if you have an essid associated
22:51<jcress>catsup: yes
22:52<jcress>catsup: i do, there is an essid and some other information
22:52<catsup>do you have an ip address (ifconfig)?
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22:53<catsup>your configuration is almost certainly fine, if it works intermittently
22:54<catsup>about all you can do is maybe change some parameters with iwconfig (broadcast power), or just re-associate whenever you lose association (i have to do this a lot on some machines...)
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22:55<jcress>catsup: what is reassociate
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22:55<jcress>catsup: and this laptop had good working wifi before I put a new hard drive in and reinstalled testing
22:55<catsup>set essid with iwconfig and it will try to reassociate with the access point
22:55<catsup>dmesg will show some output about that
22:55<jcress>catsup: howto? iwconfig?
22:56<catsup>iwconfig [dev] essid [essid]
22:56<Vlam>usually wl0 or wlan0 for dev
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22:57<catsup>wrt installing testing -- maybe you should use a different kernel version than the one you have
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22:57<catsup>but your userspace is probably fine
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22:57<jcress>currently on
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22:58<catsup>what were you using before?
22:58<jcress>i think
22:58<jcress>for some reason it installed -bigmem for me
22:58<jcress>i dont remember installing it
22:58<jcress>but now when I installed it just installed vanilla 686
22:59<catsup>were you using some kernel from debian testing?
22:59<jcress>i was
22:59<jcress>i installed 6, changed sources.list and did dist-upgrade
22:59<catsup>but i guess you don't know what version
22:59<jcress>it was .38-2-686-bigmem
22:59<jcress>if i remember correctly
23:00<catsup>well maybe it's just a coincidence then
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23:00<catsup>maybe the install overheated the card and borked it
23:00<jcress>does the bigmem kernel
23:00<jcress>make a difference ^
23:00<jcress>i may as well install it anyway?
23:00<catsup>won't hurt
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23:01<catsup>it's not impossible that it would fix it, it would just be unlikely
23:01<jcress>dunno how to physically test the card without installing some non-unix os and replicating the problem
23:02<catsup>well you said it was associated
23:03<catsup>very odd that it would not work then
23:03<catsup>you can also try unloading and reloading the kernel module
23:03<catsup>i have to do that regularly on my old laptop :\
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23:12<kFreeBSDNoob>which kernel module is that btw?
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23:14<th>hi, i want to run hdparm -B 255 /dev/sda on resume, where should i place the script?
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23:22<jcress>I have new information re: my wifi issues. in dmesg i find 'b43-phy0 controller RESET (DMA error) .." ... "phy0: wlan0: no probe response from AP.."
23:23<jcress>Also, "ERROR: this defice does not support DMA on your system. It will now be switch to PIO'
23:24<jcress>hope i'm not flooding
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23:26<ussa>hi, need help to see a windows media player stream...
23:26<rking>ussa: tried mplayer?
23:26<ussa>can I use vlc for that? :S
23:27<rking>ussa: vlc is a video player, and mplayer is another. I would try both if I found a troublesome video
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23:27<ussa>the thing is, I don't how to get the actual link to the stream...
23:28<rking>ussa: where is it?
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23:29<rking>ussa: Did you try to view source?
23:29<wisconsin>hi, why does apt-cache not show udeb packages like
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23:30<ussa>ok, got it, vlc do work, thank you
23:30<rking>ussa: Good deal
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23:50<jcress>trying to get the wifi working for my bcm4312, a couple of places say the wl driver works better. So, removed b43 module (and other conflicting) and modprobe wl, reboot. Now, the interface is called eth1 and there's no essid in /sbin/iwconfig /sbin/iwlist says 'eth1 interface doesnt support scanning' and network mannager applet says 'disconnected' underneath wireless
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---Logclosed Wed Apr 27 00:00:50 2011