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#debian IRC Logs for 2019-01-02

---Logopened Wed Jan 02 00:00:03 2019
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01:51<sim590>Seems like it's not the first time it happens.
01:51<sim590>Debian developer for LXC should be aware of that...
01:51<sim590>Or should become aware rather. Anyway.
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08:40-!-ppc64 is "Dennis Clarke" on #debian
08:41<ppc64>life is hell dealing with bridged networking ... anyone have a clue about ip bridges ? any attempt to set up such a beast results in total loss of packets flowing to the world
08:43<ppc64>essentially there exists a real physical link called enp4s0 and I can see this with ip link show. If I create a layer 2 bridge with ip link add virt_br0 type bridge then that is the last of my contact with the world
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08:44<ppc64>I'll go check the Red Hat support docs and see how they do it
08:47<furrymcgee>a bridge needs two devices eth0 eth1 for example
08:47<ppc64>furrymcgee: yep ... I had also added a tun device .. I'll check that url
08:48<furrymcgee>tun or tap? tun is layer3?
08:49<ppc64>tough to say given that I have seen nothing work yet :-)
08:49<ppc64>however the process was trivial
08:49<ppc64>ip link add virt_br0 type bridge
08:49<ppc64>ip tuntap add $1 mode tap user admin
08:49<ppc64>ip link set enp4s0 master virt_br0
08:49<ppc64>ip link set tap0 master virt_br0
08:49<ppc64>that is all
08:50<ppc64>well also ... for spanning tree protocol --> ip link set virt_br0 type bridge stp_state 1
08:50<ppc64>needless to say I have ot reboot to undo the disaster
08:51<ppc64>sadly that document link is like a lot of them .. out of date. It uses brctl
08:52<furrymcgee>brctl addif br0 eth0 tap0 works just fine
08:53<ppc64>right .. but only if old brctl is what you have. I did install the pkg and it resulted in a disaster
08:53<ppc64>s oanyways ... I'll keep reading man pages .. the old brctl approach won't work on buster/sid
08:55<annadane>btw buster/sid --> #debian-next
08:55<ppc64>okay .. good to know
08:55<ppc64>okay .. have to reboot now ... again .. it has been a crappy start to the year just trying to get qemu networking going
08:56<sep>ppc64, adding a bridge on debian? just set it up in the interfaces file as normal ? man bridge-utils-interfaces
08:57<ppc64>ewww .. that is a snazzy man page
08:58<ppc64>hrmm I will make a backup of my interfaces file and try that approach .. if I reboot and return here .. it worked
08:58<sep>when going from the normal ip on interface to ip on bridge, I change the interface name in the stanca from enp4s0 to br8 (since it happened to be vlan 8 ) add the lines bridge-ports enp4s0 ; bridge_stp off; bridge_maxwait 0 ;; done
08:58<ppc64>sep: did you use STP ?
08:59<sep>that is why i turned it off :)
08:59<ppc64>hrmmm .. okay
08:59<ppc64>ah yes .. I see
09:00<sep>ohh i see in the manual that the default have changed to off in recent kernels... so probably not needed any more
09:00<ppc64>the trick here will be that the real world internal network is and the dev gw is so what I need is a few interfaces on the bridge that actually route to the real world via that def router addr
09:00<sep>but does not hurt to be explicit
09:01<ppc64>sep: excellent man page there ! wish I had seen that two coffee cups ago
09:01<sep>the bridge is the interface. you can not have ip's on the bridge ports any longer, that will break in interesing ways.
09:01<sep>if you need multiple interface you need multiple bridges basically
09:01<ppc64>sep: it did break .. in frustrating ways
09:01<sep>i have 2-3 bridges with no external interefaces for various vm networks
09:02-!-dtw is now known as Guest1576
09:02<ppc64>sep: for the moment I am only going to try a single physical link to the switch and then internal bridge can have a few tun/tap interfaces for qemu stuff
09:03<sep>ppc64, do not forget to change the interface on the auto line as well if you want it up on boot !!
09:04<ppc64>sep: er .. hold on a sec .. that config example only shows br0 on the auto line. You are suggesting to add enp4s0 there ?
09:05<sep>i normaly use one auto line per iface line, to keep things easier. iow:
09:05<sep>auto br8
09:05<sep>iface br8 inet6 manual
09:05*ppc64 *nod*
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09:06<sep>if you want br8 (ior br0 or whatever) up on boot, you need to have a auto line with that name in
09:06<ppc64>sep: what baffles me is the manual line by line setup using the ip commands. Should have been obvious .. but it wasn't
09:06<sep>if you forget just ifup br8 on console ; to test without reboot i usualy just ifdown br8 ; ifup br8
09:07<sep>probably quite doable. but you would need to clean up the ip config on the physical port before giving the port to the bridge.
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09:08<sep>if you started with clean slate, all unconfigured interfaces it would probably be easier.
09:08<ppc64>sep: yes .. that was the last packet that I ever saw flow
09:09<ppc64>sep: I essentially did ip route flush and ip link set down dev enp4s0 and then ip addr del etc .. flush out the configure manually
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09:10<ppc64>sep: once the config is clear then this --> ip link add virt_br0 type bridge
09:10<sep>ppc64, if it is brought up with interfaces i tend to bring it down with ifdown. if it is brought up with network-manager i take it down with network manager. otherways i happen to find software that work against you in the beckground.
09:10<ppc64>sep: then create a tuntap iface with --> ip tuntap add tap0 mode tap user admin_dude
09:11<ppc64>I kill network manager at all times .. hate that stuff
09:11<sep>what is the tuntap for ?
09:11<ppc64>well qemu requires a tap interface
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09:11<ppc64>I generally live within VMware world but that won't fly to test arm7 or arm8 software builds
09:12<sep>i just let libvirt deal with all that stuff. i just give it the br8 interface in the config and it fixes all that
09:12*ppc64 No manual entry for libvirt
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09:13<ppc64>in truth I was happy all day with a single interface but qemu is a nightmare to ssh into a guess unless you have tap
09:13<ppc64> s/guess/guest/
09:13<sep>iow i never run qemu manually just via virt-manager or virsh or one of the other libvirt interfaces
09:14<ppc64>I have never seen virt-manager .. have to look that up I guess
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09:15<ppc64>hrmmm .. I see it on a RHEL boxen here ... not on debian sid ... I'll check that url
09:15<sep>it is basically ;; apt get virt-manager qemu-kvm libvirt-clients qemu-utils libvirt-daemon then run virt-manager nad you get a gui ; new vm enter br8 as network interface; done
09:16<ppc64>clearly I have been bashing my brains out the wrong way
09:16<sep>ofcourse that does require a GUI. if this is a headless server then i just run virt-manager localy and add a ssh connection to the server
09:18<ppc64>I have some headless boxen also .. however for now I will work on a desktop experimental setup which has all the toys
09:18<furrymcgee>create tap with qemu -netdev tap,id=nd1,ifname=tap1 -device rtl8139,netdev=nd1
09:18<sep>libvirt is the easy way to run qemu vm's ; virt-manager is just one of very many interfaces that use the libvirt interfaces. there is a list at:
09:19<ppc64>furrymcgee: that probably works with x86_64 but not for arm8 or ppc64 or others
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09:20<ppc64>pardon me .. just ran apt-get update / upgrade ... must reboot
09:20<ppc64>back real soon .. I hope
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09:28<ppc64>well the reboot was fine
09:32<ppc64>so then .. someone was saying something about qemu and tap ? -device virtio-net-device,netdev=usernet -netdev tap,id=usernet doesn't work .. seems one needs to be root for that
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09:36<hazaardinari>um hello
09:36<hazaardinari>i'm having a problem with the tightvnc server
09:37<hazaardinari>my systemctl service i made wont start
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09:38<hazaardinari>i followed this guide:
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09:40<hazaardinari>ok and now my terminals wont launch
09:40<hazaardinari>i'm gonna reboot brb
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09:42<hazaardinari>does anybody read me?
09:43<sep>yes, but i can not help with vnc, never used it
09:44<hazaardinari>so what do you use for remote desktop?
09:44<ppc64>sorry .. never used it
09:44<sep>can only suggest you provide more details beyond "it does not work" ; ie what does the logs say when you try to start it
09:44<ppc64>I personally avoid Digital Ocean like the disease it is and generally use rdesktop into winblows boxen
09:44<sep>hazaardinari, ssh
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09:46<hazaardinari>this is what i get when i ask for status:
09:55<hazaardinari>and now nautilus wont launch
09:55<hazaardinari>wtf is wrong with gnome
09:56<ppc64>hazaardinari: I have no clue what state your system is in but it sounds like you have a flurry of problems
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09:57<hazaardinari>and this is a brand new install
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09:57<hazaardinari>i installed it as a new year gift to myself
09:58<ppc64>hazaardinari: get a test system .. level that disk to zero and start over with a pure debian 9 install and something trivial like xfce
09:58<hazaardinari>with nothing but gnome on it, i dont even have any other big apps like adb
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09:58<hazaardinari>xfce you say...
09:58<hazaardinari>why though?
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09:59<ppc64>hazaardinari: something minimal
10:01<hazaardinari>how about kde?
10:01<ppc64>how about a quantum mechanical slip stream drive with warp engines? Are you trying to get something working? Go minimal.
10:02<hazaardinari>but kde is minimal....
10:02<hazaardinari>so i just nuke gnome?
10:02<hazaardinari>sudo apt remove gnome?
10:03<ppc64>no ... get some other box .. anything with a few G of memory and a bare bones nothing special hardware config and start over
10:03<hazaardinari>i have 4 gigs of ram and 10 gigs of swap
10:03<hazaardinari>and its a simple laptop
10:04<ppc64>well I don't know what else to say ... I am going back to fighting with arm7 here
10:05<hazaardinari>arm7 is RISC right?
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10:06<ppc64>as is IBM Power9 and ppc and sparc and RISC-V and ...
10:06<hazaardinari>i heard on linus tech tips that there was a company making open source RISC cpu's
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10:06<ppc64>there are a stack of them starting up but SiFive simple got there first
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10:08<hazaardinari>hey guess what
10:08<hazaardinari>dolphin launched
10:09<hazaardinari>gedit wont launch
10:09<hazaardinari>i think gtk is fucked
10:09<hazaardinari>i'ma go nuke gnome
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10:12<danielsh_>morning. I'm seeing occasional crashes when switching virtual terminals (Ctrl+Alt+F<1-7>). Xorg.log backtrace is identical to the one in #883453 (though I have no touchpad here but a desktop USB mouse). What workarounds are available?
10:12<judd>Bug in xserver-xorg-input-libinput (open): «xserver-xorg-input-libinput: xorg crash when waking-up from suspend to ram»; severity: important; opened: 2017-12-04; last modified: 2017-12-04.
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12:02<itd>danielsh_: are you on stable?
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12:08<danielsh_>itd, yes.
12:13<EmleyMoor>Just swapped a USB disk, but the new one hasn't appeared, for no obvious reason. What should I check? dmesg has shown action, see
12:16<EmleyMoor>Hmmm... it mounted when I clicked its name in the file manager
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12:23<itd>danielsh_: not sure about workarounds, but I'd recommend you comment on that bug. (since the bug linked in that bug resulted in a now fixed upstream bug. maybe try a newer version of *-libinput? probably need to backport it yourself though.)
12:25<danielsh_>itd, yeah, I'll comment with my observations (I have been encountering this regularly enough to have noticed patterns)
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12:25<danielsh_>itd, wait, "now fixed upstream bug"? I didn't know that. Do you have more links about that please?
12:26<danielsh_>Backporting by myself won't be a problem.
12:27<itd>danielsh_: you said #883453 that mentioned #838462 which mentioned
12:27<judd>Bug in xserver-xorg-input-libinput (open): «xserver-xorg-input-libinput: xorg crash when waking-up from suspend to ram»; severity: important; opened: 2017-12-04; last modified: 2017-12-04.
12:29<itd>(i'm not sure if those bugs are indeed related, but it might by worth a try)
12:34<danielsh_>itd, thanks for the pointer. The backtrace in 97117 doesn't mention "udev device never initialized", but the fix for it mentions VT-switching, so it's worth a try.
12:34<danielsh_>Would you recommend cherry-picking that one fix to stable? Or just picking whichever xf86-input-libinput release first includes it?
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12:37<itd>danielsh_: I don't feel qualified to recommend anything. :P (If cherry-picking works, that would be awesome and might even increase the probability of an update for stable.)
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12:43<danielsh_>itd, unfortunately, *-libinput 0.23.0-2 in stable already includes that upstream patch.
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12:49<itd>danielsh_: :/ maybe install the -dbgsym package and try to reproduce the issue? could/should result in a more descriptive backtrace.
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12:51<danielsh_>itd, I already have a non-dbgsym backtrace, I don't see a libinput.*dbg.* package
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12:54<danielsh_>actually, looking what /dev/input/event9 is, I found this match in journalctl -
12:55<danielsh_>I don't understand where that comes from; this is a regular desktop PC with a standard 101-keys keyboard...
12:57<itd>danielsh_: dbgsym is the new dbg, i think. ;
12:57<danielsh_>Can I just disable that particular input device?
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12:57<danielsh_>Yes, dbgsym is the new dbg
12:58<danielsh_>but I don't see any *dbg* libinput packages, either.
12:58<danielsh_>(not even in backports / buster / sid)
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12:58<hazaardinari>hello people
12:58<danielsh_>Ah, wait
12:58<hazaardinari>my debian wont detect my bluetooth adapter
12:58<danielsh_>I need debug mirrors in sources.list too?
12:58<itd>danielsh_: why are you looking for dbg packages if dbgsym exist?
12:58<itd>danielsh_: i think so, yes.
12:59<danielsh_>TIL :) Fixing
12:59<danielsh_>(I just did 'libinput.*dbg' in aptitude, so it would have matched both)
13:02<danielsh_>I'll catch the backtrace next time it happens
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13:03<itd>great :) good luck (and maybe someone else has further/better ideas)
13:03<danielsh_>many thanks!
13:04<danielsh_>(yeah, I'll idle here, plus I'm subscribed to the bug)
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13:06<itd>hazaardinari: could you please provide more details? (what kind of device? what did you try? what exactly do you expect to happen? ...)
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13:23<hazaardinari>hi guys
13:23<hazaardinari>i had a brawl with gnome....
13:24<hazaardinari>i removed it but if i type gnome-session it still opens
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13:24<hazaardinari>richard stallman is haunting my laptop
13:24<hazaardinari>also my bluetooth isnt working
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13:24<hazaardinari>kde says adapters not found
13:25<hazaardinari>are the adapter drivers non free?
13:25<danielsh_>further question. The error message mentions /dev/input/event9; what is it? I have found but why would it mention rfkill there? This is a desktop computer, it doesn't have any wireless capability.
13:26<danielsh_>Can I just disable that event9 device somehow? Or prevent Xorg from talking to it?
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15:55<jhutchins_wk>danielsh_: rfkill works on other stuff like blutooth too.
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16:06<danielsh_>jhutchins_wk, This box doesn't have *any* wireless capability, not even bluetooth. The only wireless thing I have here is a cordless mouse.
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16:11<Brigo>danielsh_, then it has some :)
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16:25<jhutchins_wk>Brigo: Yeah, but those are usually self-contained.
16:29<Andersson>Hi im running debian 9.6, on a GA-Z270N-WIFI-CF motherboard, the board contains a bluetooth/wifi chip but im having trouble to get it to work. running "sudo dmesg | grep -i blue" gives the following how do i add drivers for this card?
16:31<somiaj>It is saying firmware failed to load. By default debian dosen't ship with non-free firmwareware, and you'll have to install it from debian non-free.
16:32<towo`>and that missing firmware is in firmware-iwlwifi
16:32<somiaj>looks like you'll need the firmware-iwlwifi package for that firmware. It should also help make your wifi work.
16:34<dpkg>Bluetooth is a wireless communications protocol (, about as secure as shouting. aptitude install bluez-utils; then run hidd --search as root. . For support of Qualcomm Atheros devices, ask me about <ath3k>. See also <btusb>.
16:35<Andersson>Thanks i managed to install firmware-iwlwifi restarting now to see if it helpt
16:37<Andersson>yay now it loaded! thanks for the help somiaj and towo` !
16:45<danielsh_>jhutchins_wk, Brigo: the /proc entry stays there even while the dongle is unplugged
16:46<mnuhmnuh>that bluetooth blab from dpkg mentions bluez-utils, which doesn't exist.
16:49<Brigo>bluez-tools exists, though
16:49<Andersson>i have managed to do a hcitool lescan now so bluetooth seems to work as intended!
16:49<Andersson>just installed bluez instead of bluez-utils
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20:23<Wally1>Are you the same crazy from the PSP Scene?
20:24<daurnimator>yeah... that was only what, a 15 years ago
20:24<Wally1>I'm the guy that did daedalusX64 :P
20:24<Wally1>Yeah time prevails.
20:26<Wally1>You probably can't remember that time though?
20:27<daurnimator>only in parts :P
20:27<sarnold>I love irc :)
20:27<Wally1>sarnold, were you also a PSP Scener?
20:27<sarnold>Wally1: heh, no, but I've run into old hp48 pals in random irc channels..
20:28<Wally1>I swear i've seen your nick somewhere.
20:32<Wally1>nonetheless daurnimator, great to see that nick again. I can't remember what we used to discuss but I did some quick googling and found you were in Melbourne.. Which is probably most of our discussions lol
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20:40*daurnimator never went anywhere
20:40<Wally1>I live and work in Melbourne now..
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20:42<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic, or #moocows on or ##chat on
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20:46<Wally1>sney, apologies.
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20:50<twb>What's the initrd option for mdadm "bootdegraded" called these days?
20:51<twb>I can't see it in /usr/share/initramfs-tools *at all*
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21:09<twb>I gave up
21:09<twb>Fortunately I have a spare bay in this server, so I installed BOTH the new and the dying drive at once. I've done mdadm /dev/md127 --add-spare /dev/sdc1. Once they conveyance test finishes, I'll do mdadm /dev/md127 --replace /dev/sdb1
21:10<twb>That should trigger it to resync everything to sdc1 and then kick sdb1 out of the array, at which point I can unplug it
21:10<twb>(Obvious corrolary: this means I could've done all this while the drive was on, if I'd had serial-number stuckers written on the caddies
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21:39<ppc64>hope someone knows about bridge network setup and such. Just need a bridge for qemu and tap interface and well lets just say I think I am close but always lose my network connection to the world
21:43<twb>ppc64: are you using libvirtd ?
21:44<twb>If you don't know what you're doing (and don't really need to know), I recommend use libvirtd + virt-manager to set up your qemu VMs.
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21:47<ppc64>twb: sorry ... just using basic ip commands to get started where the fisrt step is to have a functional bridge and understand why.
21:47<twb>bridges are managed with brctl
21:47<ppc64>there should be no valid reason why ip link add virt_br0 type bridge doesn't work .. also brctl is ye olden way
21:48<ppc64>also .. brctl .. didn't help ..
21:48<sarnold>the usual stumblnig block with bridges is that if you add an existing NIC with IP assigned to a bridge, the NIC 'loses' the IP. you've got to add the IP to the bridge if you want to keep using that IP on that NIC..
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21:48<ppc64>I have everything step by step in
21:48<ppc64>sarnold: right ... I have that in the procedure step by step
21:49<ppc64>the bridge is created with ip link add virt_br0 type bridge
21:49<ppc64>also spanning tree protocol ( not sure I need this ) with ip link set virt_br0 type bridge stp_state 1
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21:50<ppc64>so before I add an interface I flush the ip data with ip addr flush dev enp4s0
21:50<sarnold>I think turn off STP
21:50<ppc64>sarnold: yes?
21:50<ppc64>sarnold: okay ... I can try that
21:50<sarnold>iirc every switch in the network needs to have it on if any have it on, and it adds something like 40-80 seconds at startup when nothing works
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21:50<ppc64>I have a script that doe everything and another to undo it .. just trivial ip commands
21:51<lhvf>Hi, there. First time that see an annoying bug with GNOME 3.4 (yes, I know, Wheezy is EOL for now). Can someone help me to cleam Clipboard 'persistence'?
21:51<sarnold>ppc64: your pastebin looks good to me up through the TAP, where it goes beyond my knowledge :(
21:51<ppc64>one sec ... ip link set virt_br0 type bridge stp_state 0
21:52<twb>I know about STP
21:52<ppc64>sarnold: okay ... my first step is just to have a bridge and to have connection to the outside world
21:52<ppc64>twb: thou are praised amongst the heathen ! so .. STP needed at all ?
21:52<sarnold>ppc64: yeah, good first step. :) I've been meaning to try something similar to replace libvirt on my own system .. but the hassle of losing connectivity to the box when doing that specific step is the reason why I've never made it even as far as you've gone :D
21:52<twb>Suppose you have wallpoints that are on the same LAN
21:53<ppc64>actually .. let me re-run the script and then also utter brctl show
21:53<twb>Suppose an idiot user takes an ethernet cable and plugs two wallpoints together
21:53<twb>This causes a cycle in the network, which causes basically every ethernet frame to be repeated forever, killing your ENTIRE NETWORK
21:53<lhvf>Can someone help me to clean Clipboard 'persistence'? Hello, someone experienced with this persistent Bug, also when Rebooting?
21:53<twb>STP auto-detects when this happens and disables one of the two ports, automatically
21:53<ppc64>sarnold: as soon as I have this working in the "new and improved ip command way" then I shall document it
21:53<twb>You do not need STP to be turned on on every switch/port for this to work. But only the places where it is on, benefit from it.
21:54<ppc64>twb: good explanation .. it is a loop killer
21:54<twb>The downside of this, is that it takes about 20s (or 5s in "fast" STP) for a socket to "come up" once you plug it in
21:54<ppc64>twb: if I had multiple bridges then it may make sense
21:54<sarnold>ppc64: THANK YOU :D
21:54<twb>This is enough for PXE (netboot) to timeout
21:54<sarnold>lhvf: you may need to describe what it is you want to do..
21:55<twb>STP property on a bridge, merely means that STP frames get copied across the bridge, instead of being thrown away
21:55*ppc64 needs to have a long term future stable script process on buster/testing/sid for a number of reasons
21:55<ppc64>okay .. one sec .. let me modify the script. Literally called bridge magic
21:56<twb>So, to summarize all that: STP protects against one stupidity (ethernet loops) but breaks another thing (PXE). If you care more about the latter, turn it off.
21:56<lhvf>sarnold: When using Chrome, the Clipboard area was persistent, hindering me to paste anything then a given text. Also, only gnome-terminal paste something different then the mentioned text.
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21:56<lhvf>sarnold: it's a Bug. I guess that I hit it.
21:57<lhvf>]Chromium/Chrome don't have fixed it. How to clean Chrome Clipboard Area of Copy/Paste transference?
21:57<sarnold>twb: I heard that the "fast" stp modes are all vendor-specific.. is this true? what does linux bridge's stp do?
21:58<twb>sarnold: AFAIK it just relays STP frames
21:58<twb>sarnold: fast STP frames are still STP frames
21:58<lhvf>sarnold: Gedit don't paste anything than a wrong 'persistent' text. None than that is possible to paste.
21:58<twb>lhvf: it's not a bug, it's just a property of how X selections work
21:59<twb>lhvf: as the article says, as long as you run a clipboard manager, it should Just Work
21:59<twb>lhvf: technical details are here:
21:59<twb>The reason terminal emulators pastes the "wrong" thing, is usually because you *aren't* running a clipboard manager, and it's using the "wrong" X selection
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22:00<sarnold>lhvf: since I use the PRIMARY selection all the time, and never the clipboard, I run a little program that synchronizes both together, to work around the fact that firefox recently changed which one gets used :( apt-get install autocutsel then autocutsel -f ; autocutsel -f -s PRIMARY -- and *bam* both the primary selection and the clipboard are synchronized and things work as I expect again :)
22:00<twb>sarnold: that's basically what clipboard managers do :-)
22:00<sarnold>twb: yeah; I've wondered if I would be happier with something fancier :)
22:01<lhvf>twb: How to clean X Server Clipboard Area? Because I restarted my computer, and the paste area of transference is "impregnated".
22:01<lhvf>sarnold: Works with Debian 7 GNU/Linux Wheezy?
22:01<twb>lhvf: X selections cannot persist across a restart of X. If you are seeing that behaviour, it is presumably your clipboard manager doing so
22:01<sarnold>lhvf: I assume so
22:01<twb>lhvf: find out which clipboard manager you're running, and reconfigure it
22:01<sarnold>definitely follow twb's advice instead of mine
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22:02<flymol0>hello all
22:02<lhvf>Put the glipper (, and it also doesn't resolved the problem. Maybe the problem is coming from Chrome (Chromium based).
22:02<twb>Please note that Debian 7 is end-of-lifed last year. You should upgrade to a supported version.
22:03<lhvf>sarnold, twb : Guess have I to clean Chrome cache. I'll delete the Profile. Chromium is on the list of "Broken Apps".
22:03<sarnold>lhvf: I think you'll have more success finding out which application is managing your clipboard
22:03<twb>lhvf: glipper is not in current releases of Debian. I cannot support it.
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22:04<lhvf>Gedit is with the impregnated applications on the paste Clipboard.
22:04<lhvf>gnome-terminal, no.
22:05<lhvf>Where is located the Gedit Clipboard area of transference (copy and paste)?
22:05<lhvf>The configuration file? I'll ask now on #gnome ( Network).
22:05<ppc64>twb: and sarnold .. the latest experiment with STP removed and brctl used to display state -->
22:06<sarnold>3 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 4ms
22:06<ppc64>bloody STP is still enabled ... weird
22:06<twb>ppc64: I think you should not call it "virt_" because you're not using libvirt
22:07<sarnold>how'd you get that to give you results after only 4ms??
22:07<ppc64>twb: just a name ... may call it br0
22:07-!-itd is now known as Guest1614
22:07<twb>ppc64: yes, or give it a logical name like "br-qemu" or "br-vms"
22:07*ppc64 cat | sed 's/virt_br0/bridge0/g'
22:08<ppc64>just bridge0
22:08<ppc64>regardless .. e v e r y t h i n g looks fine ... and yet ... not a packet flows
22:08<ppc64>the physical is enp4s0 however I *guess* that my default route has to be via bridge0 .. not sure
22:09<sarnold>ppc64: "state DOWN" ?
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22:09<ppc64>sarnold: damn
22:09<twb>maybe you need to turn on bridging the same way you need to turn on routing?
22:09<twb>STP being on shouldn't actually break things
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22:09<ppc64>hrmmm ... weird .. the interfaces are all set to up
22:09<twb>sarnold: good catch
22:10<ppc64>yeah ... down or linkdown or "bork bork bork" should jump out at me
22:10<twb>ppc64: also note that if you're adding a physical interface to the bridge, you should be doing IP configuration *on the bridge*, not the underlying physical iface
22:10<ppc64>there is a qemu script which does essentially the same thing I am doing manually .. I should check it
22:11<ppc64>twb: I think if we look at the output there I configure virt_br0 with an ip address
22:11<ppc64>yes ip addr add dev virt_br0
22:11<twb>ah sorry I fail at reading
22:12<ppc64>not a problem .. I madethat script as verbose as hell
22:12<twb>ppc64: you need "brd +" as well if you want broadcast packets to work
22:12<ppc64>twb: ah yes?
22:12<ppc64>I have to check the ip man page to see where that is set
22:12<twb>or at least you used to
22:12<twb>as you say, my knowledge is a bit dated :-)
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22:13<twb> here is an interfaces(5) of a production system
22:13<twb>it has like 30 VMs and 2 to 4 physical ifaces so it's a bit confusing
22:13<twb>Also it looks like it's using 802.1q
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22:15<twb>re state down, "ip link set dev X up" should suffice
22:15<sarnold>heh, may I ask about the "br0-prisoner" name? :)
22:15<twb>sarnold: we work for prisons
22:15<twb>that's the network that detainees have physical access to
22:16<sarnold>twb: aha :)
22:16<sarnold>so... STP equals very yes :)
22:16<twb>(that's actually a lab setup; the 802.1q is because several logical LANs are running over a single ethernet cable)
22:16<flymol0>Hey all, question- I'm trying to install an old game and following the instructions on a wiki page on the debian wiki, but it links to some old glib and gtk libaries which are no longer available. Any idea where I can obtain these libraries?
22:17<twb>sarnold: on the actual switches we have "port security" enabled anyway, which is means that two adjacent ports can't talk to one another at all
22:17<sarnold>twb: oh, very nice
22:18<ppc64>twb: well I will be happy if I can ping my local router .. with icmp or anything
22:18<twb>sorry, not port security
22:18<ppc64>perhaps I should remove the tuntap interface entirely for now and just have a bridge and enp4s0
22:18<twb>port security says "switch port 12#34 only allows mac dead.beef.babe; if you see any other device, turn the port off"
22:19<twb>I meant "port isolation"
22:19<ppc64>twb: that feels pretty secure until someone figure out how to override the physical mac address to feedbadcaffe
22:19<twb>ppc64: it's merely defense in depth
22:19<ppc64>always a good idea
22:20<ppc64>i have seen security by obscurity and security by massive tangle of cables on the walls and floor .. both will slow you down
22:20<twb> I think is describing it
22:21<ppc64>anyways ... I am going to remove the tuntap interface entirely and see if I can just have the bridge and enp4s0 working
22:21<twb>ppc64: have you considered just using qemu's userspace networking
22:21<twb>ppc64: that bypasses ALL of this crap
22:21<ppc64>also need to reset the interface index numbers back to sane levels like 3 4 5
22:22<sarnold>iirc qemu's userspace networking doesn't do icmp at all :(
22:22<ppc64>twb: the userspace slirp works but only in one direction. it is useless for daemons and server testing
22:22<twb>guest gets its own private address from qemu, masquerading, dhcp, dns provided by qemu. You can forward ports as needed.
22:22<twb>ppc64: just set up port forwards
22:22<ppc64>did that ... no go
22:22<ppc64>thou shalt not pass
22:22<twb>Well, it works for me
22:23<ppc64>twb: really ? you can ssh into the guest ?
22:24<twb>Did you try to port forward to a privileged port as a non-privileged user (no CAP_NET_BIND)?
22:24<ppc64>I tried everything except slaying a black cat under a full moon on my mothers birthday
22:25<ppc64>that comes next
22:25<twb>Here's some old notes...
22:25<ppc64>felt bridge work was more reasonable
22:26<ppc64>this fails --> -device virtio-net-device,netdev=usernet -netdev user,id=usernet,hostfwd=tcp::10000-:22
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22:26<ppc64>I can ssh out from the guest but nothing flows in
22:27<twb>the hostfwd part handles forwarding host's 2022 to guest's 22
22:28<ppc64>twb: that looks similar to what I have and I did install debian testing onto qemu fine .. no packets flow
22:28<twb>ppc64: check firewall
22:28<ppc64>I best look over your notes
22:28<ppc64>firewall was the first place I looked .. then a coffee cup .. then a bottle of scotch
22:29<twb>Note that you always need both -net nic and -net user
22:29<twb>You're using -device and -netdev which might work the same, but I just don't know
22:29<ppc64>well it is a RISC-V test system
22:29<ppc64>however I also have plain jane x86_64
22:30<sarnold>my head hurts :)
22:30<twb>AFAIK qemu-system-* should all handle this the same way
22:30<sarnold>someone named ppc64 using a risc-v..
22:30<twb>But I haven't tried anything but x86_64 for a long long time
22:30<ppc64>sarnold: man .. you should see the hardware I deal with
22:30<twb>ppc64: you got a hifive?
22:30<sarnold>ppc64: indeed I'd quite like that :) how'd you get a risc-v? :)
22:30<ppc64>PA-Risc HP SuperDomes and Oracle Sparc and yes I have SiFive gear and
22:31<ppc64>sarnold: the first step is to toss money at it and also be a member of the RISC-V Foundation
22:31<twb>I threw out all my sparc pizza boxes
22:31<sarnold>ppc64: aha! :)
22:31<ppc64>twb: these are Oracle M-class servers running Fujitsu SPARC-VIII+ killed cpus
22:32<ppc64>or killed
22:32<ppc64>same thing these days with sparc
22:32<twb>I sorta fantasize about having a hifive board in a pitop as my main computer, but I'm nowhere near hipster enough for that
22:32<twb>I just run $200 chromebook (on Debian, obviously)
22:33<ppc64>I have the printed specs here on my desk ... already have runnable FreeBSD and am working on Debian sid but it is a bitch to deal with and qemu is faster to create and destroy
22:33<twb>ppc64: for cross-compiling note that you can use qemu CPU-only emulation mode for easier chroots &c
22:33<twb>ppc64: less overhead than a full VM
22:33<ppc64>I am sort of like everyone else and waiting for NVidia to release a multi-core RV64G on 7nm chip tech
22:34<twb>I had a tegra2 a while ago, but generally nvidia annoys me too much to buy any of it
22:34<ppc64>anyways ... I am still glaring at a seemingly trivial bridge config and getting ... tired of it
22:35<ppc64>nvidia is all about the money
22:35<twb>ppc64: I don't suppose you tried doing it via interfaces(5) yet? :-)
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22:35<ppc64>I do have a quadro card in the machine that I am futzing with here however
22:35<ppc64>hrmm ... nope .. I started with basic ip commands
22:36<ppc64>twb: take a look at cat /etc/qemu-ifup if you have it
22:36<ppc64>if the ip commands exist then the script defaults to that
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22:37<twb>It should be using -o instead of that awk shit
22:38<twb>Never mind, -o isn't needed for ip r
22:38<ppc64>yeah ... I just did that # ip route ls | awk '/^default / {for(i=0;i<NF;i++) { if ($i == "dev") { print $(i+1); next; } } }'
22:38<twb>it's also assuming there's only one default route
22:38<ppc64>just says ... duh ... enp4s0
22:38<twb>which is not a safe assumption
22:38<ppc64>well ... time to march to the kitchen ... brb
22:39<twb>One one of my hosts I have "default dev ppp0 scope link" and "default dev ppp1 scope link"
22:39<twb>and "ip rule" dispatches between them before the default rule lands
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22:42<ppc64>I am definately pushing my comfort zone here ..
22:42<ppc64>oh also .. I have an ASUS TinkerBoard on my desk and that thing runs great
22:43<ppc64>Linux arm7 4.4.132+ #1 SMP Tue Oct 23 18:03:49 CST 2018 armv7l GNU/Linux
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22:44<ppc64>what that thing needs is memory
22:45<twb>I was impressed that the hifive had 8GB ECC RAM, on a dev board
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22:46<ppc64>sorry ... I only have FreeBSD to boot there at the moment
22:47<ppc64>okay .. well ... my day started early and I am at the point where I just want to call it a day ...I shall return tomorrow and hope like hell twb that you are around
22:48<twb>I'm not on tomorrow
22:48<ppc64>or the next day
22:48<twb>ppc64: you can email me at
22:48<ppc64>one sec ...
22:49<ppc64>in a moment ... if I have a working interface :-) you may get an email from or similar
22:49<twb>I won't be back on IRC until monday 1100 hours TZ=Australia/Melbourne, and I'm not normally in #debian, only #debian-au
22:52<ppc64>fired email your way
22:52<ppc64>once a few network items are sorted you can ssh into a RISC-V machine if you want
22:53<twb>ppc64: yeah I see it
22:53<twb>is it RISCV on die, or FPGA?
22:53<ppc64>not an FPGA
22:53<ppc64>or not only FPGA
22:53<twb>FPGA for the PCIe backplane or something, right?
22:54<ppc64>the SiFive guys have done a lot of good work
22:54<ppc64>there are expansion buses but be damned if I have any of that working yet
22:56<ppc64>okay .. I am going bork bork bork out the door .. hey twb ? what temperature is it down there ? 40C ?
22:56<ppc64>a frosty -11C here in central Canada
22:57<ppc64>I had a lot of Sun friends down there ... we got a lot of work done back in the OpenSolaris days . Now all I want is ZFS to work flawlessly and otherwise it is history
22:57<twb>Those are in Celsius, even though the stupid government doesn't write the C
22:58<ppc64>well I no longer have a browser going so I'll just hummm Beds Are Burning by Misnight oil and thing of 45C
22:58<twb>I use ZOL because despite SPL being annoying, it's less annoying than re-learning how to interact with *BSD
22:58<ppc64>two great exposts from Aussie land : Paul Hogan and Margo Robbie
22:58<sarnold>ppc64: 24.4C and 60% humidity, sounds about right
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23:00<twb>Our primary exports are urania, coal, bauxite, and ferrite
23:00<ppc64>and beer
23:00<twb>I doubt we export 10,000 Petajoules of Margot Robbie every year
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23:05*ppc64 looks up peta prefix
23:06<ppc64>okay ... I have to move along now
23:06<ppc64>twb: thou are praised above the network packets in layer 2 !
23:06<ppc64>I just made that up .. no clue what I am trying to say ... you get the point
23:07*ppc64 gets ready to shove off
23:07<twb>ppc64: go home :P
23:07<ppc64>thanks for playing y'all
23:07<ppc64> enough is enough
23:07*ppc64 enters low priority sleep mode
23:07*ppc64 &
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