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#debian IRC Logs for 2019-10-15

---Logopened Tue Oct 15 00:00:57 2019
00:05-!-dboehmer___ [~quassel@p4FF65D9D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
00:05-!-dboehmer___ is "Daniel Böhmer,,," on #debian
00:07-!-apo [~apo@linuxiuvat.de] has quit [Quit: https://linuxiuvat.de]
00:07-!-dboehmer [~quassel@p57A751B8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:07-!-apo [~apo@linuxiuvat.de] has joined #debian
00:07-!-apo is "Markus Koschany" on #debian-games #debian
00:09-!-wololoer [~user@00022ff6.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.6]
00:52-!-YuGiOhJCJ [~YuGiOhJCJ@00021b1f.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: YuGiOhJCJ]
00:56-!-sadrak|work [~ostmann@p578bd1ba.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
00:56-!-sadrak|work is "purple" on #debian
01:07-!-inga [~inga@188.29.165.232.threembb.co.uk] has joined #debian
01:07-!-inga is "realname" on #debian
01:07<inga>hi
01:08-!-steven [~steven@79-100-222-26.ip.btc-net.bg] has joined #debian
01:08-!-steven is "realname" on #debian
01:08<steven>hello
01:08-!-steven [~steven@79-100-222-26.ip.btc-net.bg] has quit []
01:08<inga>by
01:09-!-inga [~inga@188.29.165.232.threembb.co.uk] has quit []
01:10-!-annadane [~annadane@mtrlpq5302w-lp130-02-70-24-205-126.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
01:16-!-Mo7Qt0 [~Mo7Qt0@insys.isnet.ru] has joined #debian
01:16-!-Mo7Qt0 is "Mo7Qt0" on #debian
01:17-!-stuh84 [~stuh84@2a04:3fc0:1:3102:215:5dff:fef4:9115] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:30-!-andrea15 [~andrea@host25-218-dynamic.181-80-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #debian
01:30-!-andrea15 is "andrea" on #kvm #openstack #lvm #virt #debian
01:30-!-ol [~quassel@2406:e006:18fc:c401:8e89:a5ff:feca:57fe] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:31-!-LouWestin [~LouWestin@louwestin.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC server is shutting down or rebooting]
01:33-!-LouWestin is "Lou The Dungeon Capturer" on #linode
01:33-!-LouWestin [~LouWestin@louwestin.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
01:38-!-preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b75:fd38:2845:cd81:1dcd] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:43-!-bnw [~bnw@113.88.113.233] has joined #debian
01:43-!-bnw is "realname" on #dot #debian-zh #debian #debian-next
01:43-!-Q-Master^Work [~q-master@2.92.128.81] has joined #debian
01:43-!-Q-Master^Work is "Vladimir Berezenko" on #debian #debian-next
01:47-!-pavlushka [~pavlushka@00021abb.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
01:47-!-pavlushka is "Pavel Sayekat" on #debian #oftc
01:48-!-Bodiro [~quassel@2a0a-a540-be72-0-9dc1-97c5-e61b-a534.ipv6dyn.netcologne.de] has joined #debian
01:48-!-Bodiro is "Bo Diro" on #debian-next #debian.de-offtopic #debian #debian-blends #debian-design #debian-community
01:51-!-imega_ [~coma@51.154.62.166] has joined #debian
01:51-!-imega_ is "coma" on #debian #ceph
01:53-!-testi [~quassel@2a02:120b:2c6a:dcc0:3ea8:2aff:fe9f:20b4] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:56-!-errst [~errst@176.239.235.50] has joined #debian
01:56-!-errst is "realname" on #debian
02:00-!-rd235 [~renzo@94-33-52-139.static.clienti.tiscali.it] has joined #debian
02:00-!-rd235 is "renzo" on #debian
02:01-!-olivierb [~olivierb@cer74-1-88-183-0-1.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #debian
02:01-!-olivierb is "Olivier Bitsch" on #debian
02:02-!-jje_ [jje@00028a46.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
02:02-!-jje_ is "ZNC - https://znc.in" on #debian #bitlbee
02:02-!-debalance [~quassel@aftr-109-90-233-117.unity-media.net] has joined #debian
02:02-!-debalance is "Philipp Huebner" on #debian #debconf-miniauditorio #debconf-auditorio
02:03-!-jje [jje@00028a46.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
02:03-!-jje_ is now known as jje
02:05-!-tdy1 [~tdy@76.10.0.154] has joined #debian
02:05-!-tdy1 is "tdy" on #debian
02:11-!-tdy [~tdy@00016994.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:14-!-rd235 [~renzo@94-33-52-139.static.clienti.tiscali.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:18-!-dzragon [~dzragon@213-66-19-137-no2275.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
02:22-!-Q-Master^Work [~q-master@2.92.128.81] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:26-!-Paperboy [~Paperboy@dslb-084-058-076-234.084.058.pools.vodafone-ip.de] has joined #debian
02:26-!-Paperboy is "Paperboy" on #debian
02:26-!-Paperboy [~Paperboy@dslb-084-058-076-234.084.058.pools.vodafone-ip.de] has quit []
02:29-!-Gromit [~jpalic@89.245.191.140] has joined #debian
02:29-!-Gromit is "Jan-Hendrik Palic" on #debian
02:30-!-texou [~jp@000178ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:32-!-mceier [~mceier@00016a61.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:33-!-ach [~spo@ipb218f940.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #debian
02:33-!-ach is "ZNC - https://znc.in" on #spooky #debian
02:38-!-olivierb [~olivierb@cer74-1-88-183-0-1.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: olivierb]
02:39-!-MorpheusB [~morpheusb@122-129-143-1.dynamic.ipstaraus.com] has joined #debian
02:39-!-MorpheusB is "Morpheus Being" on #retroshare #oftc #debian
02:42-!-mceier [~mceier@00016a61.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
02:42-!-mceier is "Mariusz Ceier" on #debian-next #debian
02:56-!-MorpheusB [~morpheusb@122-129-143-1.dynamic.ipstaraus.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.6]
03:01-!-stuh84 [~stuh84@2a04:3fc0:1:3102:215:5dff:fef4:9115] has joined #debian
03:01-!-stuh84 is "stuh84" on #debian-live #debian
03:01-!-skitt [~skitt@skitt.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
03:01-!-skitt is "Stephen Kitt" on #debian
03:06-!-imega [~coma@vpn-89-206-114-144.uzh.ch] has joined #debian
03:06-!-imega is "coma" on #debian #ceph
03:06-!-sidmo_ [~sidmo@00026de1.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
03:08-!-imega_ [~coma@51.154.62.166] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:10-!-Mo7Qt0 [~Mo7Qt0@insys.isnet.ru] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 5.0.0 Aria http://www.kvirc.net/]
03:11-!-qwer [~irc@54.89.broadband3.iol.cz] has joined #debian
03:11-!-qwer is "alfa omega" on #debian
03:12-!-Mo7Qt0 [~Mo7Qt0@insys.isnet.ru] has joined #debian
03:12-!-Mo7Qt0 is "Mo7Qt0" on #debian
03:13-!-hydra [~hydra@154.126.57.5] has joined #debian
03:13-!-hydra is "realname" on #debian
03:13-!-hybridwipe [~null@2605:a601:aa04:6e00:e11f:5718:ff68:b67c] has joined #debian
03:13-!-hybridwipe is "realname" on #llvmlinux #qemu #msys2-ci #msys2 #debian-next #debian
03:14-!-hydra [~hydra@154.126.57.5] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
03:14-!-hydra [~hydra@154.126.57.5] has joined #debian
03:14-!-hydra is "realname" on #debian
03:15-!-hydra [~hydra@154.126.57.5] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
03:16-!-bpsecret [~bpsecret@000219a4.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:16-!-hydra [~hydra@154.126.57.5] has joined #debian
03:16-!-hydra is "realname" on #debian
03:16-!-ansel [~ansel@tmo-113-179.customers.d1-online.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:17-!-sakax [~skx@sakax.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
03:17-!-sakax is "skx" on #debian-games #tor-project #debian-live #debian-offtopic #debian
03:17-!-cootcraig is now known as Guest4942
03:17-!-cootcraig [~craig@75-163-189-76.clsp.qwest.net] has joined #debian
03:17-!-cootcraig is "Craig Anderson" on #debian
03:18-!-m8mble [~quassel@p200300CA3F013F00BA27EBFFFE7E83E8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:18-!-Kabouik [~kabouik@147.99.217.201] has joined #debian
03:18-!-Kabouik is "Konsieur" on #debian
03:19-!-bnw [~bnw@113.88.113.233] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
03:24-!-Guest4942 [~craig@75-163-160-226.clsp.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:31-!-hydra [~hydra@154.126.57.5] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
03:34-!-demo [~demo@222.173.149.75] has joined #debian
03:34-!-demo is "realname" on #debian
03:34-!-m8mble [~quassel@2001:16b8:1cff:d400:ba27:ebff:fe7e:83e8] has joined #debian
03:34-!-m8mble is "m8mble" on #debian #pext
03:35<demo>ghjhj
03:35-!-rgogunskiy [~rgogunski@185.163.156.10] has joined #debian
03:35-!-rgogunskiy is "Ruslan Gogunskiy" on #debian
03:37-!-bpsecret [~bpsecret@000219a4.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
03:37-!-bpsecret is "bpsecret" on #tor-south #tor-project #tor-l10n #tor-dev #tor-bots #rust-offtopic #rust #debian
03:40-!-qwer [~irc@54.89.broadband3.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:40-!-texou [~jp@000178ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
03:40-!-texou is "Stoicien" on #debian #debian-es #debian-devel-es #debian-devel-it #debian-l10n-fr #debian-a11y
03:41-!-qwer [~irc@54.89.broadband3.iol.cz] has joined #debian
03:41-!-qwer is "alfa omega" on #debian
03:42-!-demo [~demo@222.173.149.75] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
03:44-!-MorpheusB [~morpheusb@122-129-143-1.dynamic.ipstaraus.com] has joined #debian
03:44-!-MorpheusB is "Morpheus Being" on #retroshare #oftc #debian
03:45-!-MorpheusB [~morpheusb@122-129-143-1.dynamic.ipstaraus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
03:47-!-debalance [~quassel@00017b9a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.]
03:49-!-sasamat [~oftc-webi@00026ffa.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
03:49-!-sasamat is "OFTC WebIRC Client" on #debian #moocows #$nerds +#432 +#devoid
03:51-!-MorpheusB [~morpheusb@185.216.34.238] has joined #debian
03:51-!-MorpheusB is "Morpheus Being" on #debian
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03:56-!-sidmo__ [~sidmo@00026de1.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
03:56-!-sidmo__ is "sidmo" on #debian-next #debian-offtopic #debian-kde #debian
03:59-!-mode/#debian [+l 590] by debhelper
04:05-!-Edhil [~edhil@000266d3.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
04:05-!-Edhil is "One of the last" on #debian
04:06-!-ansel [~ansel@2003:5b:203b:100:a64c:c8ff:fef4:13a6] has joined #debian
04:06-!-ansel is "Andreas Seltenreich" on #debian
04:14-!-Bodiro [~quassel@2a0a-a540-be72-0-9dc1-97c5-e61b-a534.ipv6dyn.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Komfortabler Chat. Überall. ]
04:16-!-jmux [~jan-marek@x4d021bf7.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #debian
04:16-!-jmux is "Jan-Marek Glogowski" on #debian
04:18-!-Edhil [~edhil@000266d3.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
04:18-!-imega [~coma@vpn-89-206-114-144.uzh.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:24-!-baduck [~bad@2a01:170:1025:1:b0d4:cccb:2abe:9a42] has joined #debian
04:24-!-baduck is "Christoph Badura" on #debian
04:26-!-imega [~coma@nat-wlan-uzh-89-206-64-001.uzh.ch] has joined #debian
04:26-!-imega is "coma" on #debian #ceph
04:27-!-phdeswer [~phdeswer@85-76-2-36-nat.elisa-mobile.fi] has joined #debian
04:27-!-phdeswer is "Philippe De Swert" on #debian #emdebian
04:28-!-dboles [~daniel@054754ed.skybroadband.com] has joined #debian
04:28-!-dboles is "dboles" on #debian
04:41-!-pavlushka [~pavlushka@00021abb.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: See you on the other side]
04:45-!-mba [~mba@78.100.216.160] has joined #debian
04:45-!-mba is "Mba" on #debian
04:46<mba>hello
04:46<sasamat>mba: hello
04:47<mba>i need help with parrosec which is built on debian
04:48<thsnr>!parrot
04:48<dpkg>Parrot OS (https://www.parrotsec.org/) is a security and penetration testing distribution. It is based on Debian testing, but it is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Seek help in #parrotsec on Freenode, the community pages https://docs.parrotsec.org/community, or try the mailing lists at http://lists.parrotsec.org/listinfo. Also ask me about <based on debian>.
04:48<mba>my wifi is not working. it alternate between not managed and not ready
04:49<mba>i tried to find their chaneel here but it is not exisiting
04:49<duclicsic>it does exist, you're on the wrong server
04:49<mba>oh ok
04:49<duclicsic>this irc network is OFTC, their channel is on freenode
04:50<mba>that is embarrssing
04:50<mba>i am at freenode
04:52-!-mba [~mba@78.100.216.160] has left #debian [Konversation terminated!]
04:53-!-pavlushka [~pavlushka@00021abb.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
04:53-!-pavlushka is "Pavel Sayekat" on #debian #oftc
04:56-!-pavlushka [~pavlushka@00021abb.user.oftc.net] has quit []
04:57-!-pavlushka [~pavlushka@00021abb.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
04:57-!-pavlushka is "Pavel Sayekat" on #debian #oftc
05:01-!-cHawk [~cHawk@p4FDBF702.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
05:01-!-cHawk is "realname" on #debian-offtopic #debian-next #openttd #debian
05:01-!-koinos [~koinos@00028eff.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: leaving]
05:06-!-pavlushka [~pavlushka@00021abb.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: See you on the other side]
05:08-!-crash_ [~pi@h-58-159.A357.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #debian
05:08-!-crash_ is "pi" on #debian
05:08-!-squat [~squat@cc.reitmeir.org] has quit [Quit: squat]
05:09-!-wvdakker [~wvdakker@31.160.169.70] has joined #debian
05:09-!-wvdakker is "wvdakker" on #debian
05:12-!-jlsantos [~jlsantos@172-1-133-102.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #debian
05:12-!-jlsantos is "realname" on #debian
05:13<twb>I wonder what the "sales pitch" for parrot is. All the oss-sec people I know run kali in vbox on macos.
05:13-!-errst_ [~errst@176.239.235.50] has joined #debian
05:13-!-errst_ is "realname" on #debian
05:15-!-war [war@2600:4040:4001:1e00::f7aa] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:15<dboles>maybe it was on a tv show like kali was on mr robot. lol
05:16<twb>The only immediate argument I could find is "parrot has libreoffice pre-installed", which is not very interesting
05:17<twb>parrot has mate (gnome2 fork) where kali has gnome3, meh.
05:18-!-squat [~squat@cc.reitmeir.org] has joined #debian
05:18-!-squat is "squat" on #debian
05:18-!-twb [~twb@203.7.155.117] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:18-!-war [war@2600:4040:4001:1e00::f7aa] has joined #debian
05:18-!-war is "war_" on #debian #debian-next
05:19-!-mode/#debian [+l 596] by debhelper
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05:32-!-xormor [~quassel@dyt4ft5lzsfnpymj1yyby-4.rev.dnainternet.fi] has joined #debian
05:32-!-xormor is "Väinämöinen" on #debian
05:33-!-Blacker47 [~Blacker47@00014f22.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
05:33-!-Blacker47 is "Blacker47" on #debian-next #debian
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05:37-!-fstd is "fstd" on #oftc #linode #debian #kernelnewbies
05:41-!-arnoldoree [~arnoldore@ranoldoree.plus.com] has joined #debian
05:41-!-arnoldoree is "Arnold Opio Oree" on #virt #qemu #debian-meeting #debian-tech #debian-kde #debian
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05:46-!-DNS is "DNS777" on @#hiphop #debian #debconf-hamburg #bash
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05:50-!-BCMM is "BCMM" on #oftc #linux #debian-kde #debian #debian-next
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05:52-!-Edhil is "One of the last" on #debian
05:59-!-qwer [~irc@54.89.broadband3.iol.cz] has joined #debian
05:59-!-qwer is "alfa omega" on #debian
05:59-!-ach [~spo@ipb218f940.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:01-!-ach [~spo@ipb218f940.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #debian
06:01-!-ach is "ZNC - https://znc.in" on #spooky #debian
06:03-!-dagg3r [~Zulu7@159.0.168.125.sta.wbroadband.net.au] has joined #debian
06:03-!-dagg3r is "purple" on #debian
06:03-!-dagg3r [~Zulu7@159.0.168.125.sta.wbroadband.net.au] has left #debian []
06:03-!-sasamat [~oftc-webi@00026ffa.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
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06:10-!-CoreDuo [~CoreDuo@216.8.161.80] has joined #debian
06:10-!-CoreDuo is "CoreDuo" on #virt #kernelnewbies #debian-next #debian
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06:15-!-Edhil is "One of the last" on #debian
06:17-!-rd235 [~renzo@renzopb-wl.cs.unibo.it] has joined #debian
06:17-!-rd235 is "renzo" on #debian
06:18-!-errst_ [~errst@176.239.235.50] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:20-!-Blue_Hat [~TwinKam20@216.10.218.162] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
06:21-!-xormor [~quassel@dyt4ft5lzsfnpymj1yyby-4.rev.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.]
06:23-!-xormor [~quassel@dyt4ft5lzsfnpymj1yyby-4.rev.dnainternet.fi] has joined #debian
06:23-!-xormor is "Väinämöinen" on #debian
06:24-!-xormor [~quassel@dyt4ft5lzsfnpymj1yyby-4.rev.dnainternet.fi] has quit []
06:27-!-xormor [~quassel@dyt4ft5lzsfnpymj1yyby-4.rev.dnainternet.fi] has joined #debian
06:27-!-xormor is "Väinämöinen" on #debian
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06:30-!-thiras [~thiras@195.174.215.70] has joined #debian
06:30-!-thiras is "Ant" on #debian #linode #tami
06:34-!-Edhil [~edhil@000266d3.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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06:35-!-Edhil is "One of the last" on #debian
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08:41<shiin>I'm getting an error during install of the firmware netboot image 10.1: /usr/sbin/debootstrap: eval: line 3: syntax error: unexpected word (expecting ")")
08:41<shiin>but looking at the debootstrap script, line 3 is blank
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08:42<shiin>there is only one eval in the 800 lines of that script, and it's not missing the close bracket
08:42<shiin>looking into google makes me think this isn't a known issue
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08:43<shiin>It happens at the end of partitioning, while the eval is in the auto proxy discovery
08:44<shiin>or is any $() also considered an eval?
08:44<shiin>in which case there are many, and the line isn't clear
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08:54<shiin>so it specifically happens in the "install the base system" step, I ran into it in expert mode as well
08:57<bremner>shiin: are you using the stable installer?
08:57<bremner>oh, you say you are. weird.
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09:02<shiin>Downloading 10.0 now to retry with that.
09:07<shiin>Now anna is complaining about a bad sha256 checksum.
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09:13<shiin>Next try with the firmware iso-dvd 10.1. In theory it should run into the same debootstrap eval error.
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09:16<rob_debian>Hi all, please, where python is storaged in Debian ?
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09:19<rob_debian>I know 'python' itself is a programming language; but, is there just one specif place that applications written in Python are storaged in Debian Linux ?
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09:27<tarzeau>rob_debian: storaged? put on the filesystem?
09:27<tarzeau>rob_debian: apt-cache search ^python3- shows you most python packaged software, and dpkg -L python3-whatever shows where the files are?
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09:27<tarzeau>it's stored, not storaged btw
09:30<rob_debian>'apt cache search python 3' or 'apt cache search python' aren't working here....
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09:37<tarzeau>rob_debian: what are you trying to find?
09:38<c05t4> /msg NickServ help
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09:40<rob_debian>Hi tarzeau, nice to meet you !:) Well, just one doubt that I had when reading about 'man python'
09:40<rob_debian>it says here: Python is an interpreted, interactive, object-oriented programming language that
09:40<rob_debian> combines remarkable power with very clear syntax.
09:40<tarzeau>rob_debian: and you can't just type "python" in a terminal?
09:41<rob_debian>So, I Imagined it was a binary...
09:41<rob_debian>oh, yes, just one moment, please.
09:41<tarzeau>binarys are installed by debian packages, which dpkg can make you a list of
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09:46<shiin>Yes. Same error with the dvd rather than netboot cd.
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09:54<bremner>shiin: how are you writing these images to a USB key / media?
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09:56<shiin>bremner: dd if of
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10:00<bremner>hmm. should work.
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10:13<shiin>I also tried it with the official netboot image now. This time anna complains about the sha256 of the firmware from a separate USB.
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10:15<bremner>I don't know "anna"
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10:15<shiin>anna's not nearly apt, a part of the installer as far as I understand
10:17<shiin>I'm going to try a 9.11 netboot now.
10:28<rob_debian>Fine tarzeau, sorry not answering you before, a bit busy here.
10:29<rob_debian>Thank you very much for Attention and Great Support :)
10:29<rob_debian>that's what I imagined: so, they are located (binaries written in python) in /bin/
10:30<rob_debian>I suppose
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10:32<shiin>It happens with 9.11 too, and it with a different USB.
10:32<shiin>But I did install Stretch on this machine before, with netboot.
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10:43<shiin>I must be using fdisk or dd or something wrong. Or my linux computer has issues. Because I got it to work with macos now using diskutil.
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11:21<jack>dd can be tricky
11:22<jack>rufus is good
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11:44<xormor>I think I have a NAT, if not that, then a sort of a firewall. How do I let my neighbor in my computer via the Internet, or should I use a Wi-Fi or a WLAN? I want him to be able to log in via ssh, and play a game called omega-rpg.
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12:07<blast007>jack: tools like rufus and unetbootin can break the debian installer
12:07<blast007>win32 disk imager doesn't mangle the image
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13:46<sqrt{not}>shiin: one question - are you using "netinst" images for your installs, or actually doing "netboot" ? 2 different things....
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13:53<jhutchins_wk>xormor: You probably need to set up port forwarding on the router/firewall. Forward something other than port 22 to 22 on your machine. You might want to consider some hardening/lockdown to restrict what outside users can do.
13:54<DusXMT>xormor: You can buy a public IP address for an extra fee from your ISP, although keep in mind that if your neighbour can log in, so can others; whenever I'm at my dorm where we have public IPs, I get a dozen unsuccessful login attempts in my /var/log/auth.log every few minutes
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14:00<jhutchins_wk>DusXMT: Change the port ssh is listening on.
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14:01<DusXMT>jhutchins_wk: Eh, they'd need my private RSA key, as well as the passphrase to unlock it, to be able to get in :) And even if I changed the port, who's preventing them from port-scanning?
14:01<DusXMT>This is security by obscurity
14:02<sarnold>it's also a decent way to avoid ~million writes to your hard drive each day :)
14:02<DusXMT>sarnold: good point!
14:02<jhutchins_wk>DusXMT: Changing the port helps prevent DOS attacks from overloading your server. Even if they don't succeed, the auth system has to process each attempt, and that can generate enough load to take the server down.
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14:03<Patavat>looking for i2p configuration help for debian buster. Any ideas or pointers?
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14:05<DusXMT>Although given that I don't really host any service on this laptop, and that it has a mechanical hard drive (so I don't have to worry about the limited write cycles of flash storage), I think it'll be fine. Will definitely keep this in mind for any production machine or a machine with an SSD
14:07<sarnold>DusXMT: the only hard drive I've ever had die on me was a mechanical drive in a firewall; back then, I logged every packet that my firewall denied (omg it's hard to imagine even thinking of this today). I took the drive apart when it died, and found some nice grooves worn in the disk, I presume from where the system was always writing logs and then writing compressed logs at the end of each day.. heh
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14:09<tidux>logging every packet? was that dialup?
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14:11<sarnold>tidux: IKR? hehe.. I wish I could remember what that connection was, but anywhere between 10 and 100mbps wouldn't surprise me, it was a very early cable internet connection
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14:38<rob_debian>Please, who knows how many packages there are available for debian stable ? Official site only refers to more than 59000...
14:38<merlin1991>i'm having weird random issues and suspecting my memory. so I installed memtest86 but regardless of what grub entry I boot (of the memtest86, memtest86+ ...) the display stays at the grub debian image with no further output
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14:45<aloo_shu>rob_debian: you could probably hammer together a little script that is counting the lists of free/main contrib & non-free, if dpkg or apt-cache don't even offer similar functionality - aptititude does offer some counts, too
14:45<sney>merlin1991: try downloading a separate memtest image to a usb stick and boot from that directly
14:45<merlin1991>sney: do you happen to have trustworthy links?
14:46<aloo_shu>rob_debian:the man command is your friend
14:46<sney>https://www.memtest86.com/download.htm
14:46<rob_debian>Hi aloo_shu, thank you for information !
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14:51<aloo_shu>i.e. man <command> in a terminal, is showing the usage manual of <command>, with all options etc, usually navigation is like the less parser, i.e. space for next page, ret for next line, home, end, next page, previous page and arrow keys are working, as well, q leaves, / initiates a search... 'man man' will tell the basics about man itself
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14:57<xormor>there is an alternative to "man" called "info", but it needs to be installed with "sudo apt install info" or with another package manager, be it graphical (windowed) or terminal-based. there is a useful package manager called "synaptic" btw.
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14:58<merlin1991>sney: thanks
14:58<free2>hello i am now using 4.19.0-6-amd64 after the upgrade to Debian 10.1 and i experience weird visual glitch when switching from desktop to TTY what could be the case with this?
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15:00<free2>some things like parts of windows or window icon display in a distorted way in the top left corner
15:01<aloo_shu>true, xormor , but most of the times, info pages are either missing, or identical to man pages, with a little more to learn for navigation - grub would be the only exception I've come a across, where info is much more complete - and if there is more info in info, the man page is typically saying so, apart from being more easy to navigate for a beginner
15:01<sarnold>btw if you have to read info files, I find pinfo way less terrible
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15:05<aloo_shu>I'm finding man is having the best ratio of learning effort required / user autonomy, cli literacy gained
15:06<sarnold>yeah, much less informatoin is trapped in 'info' these days. once upon a time info was the only place to learn about gcc's various -f flags, for example, but now that's all in the manpage
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15:07<aloo_shu>highest probability to kick off a positive motivational feedback loop for a noob, imo, i.e. first time you manage to solve a lil problem yourself consulting man pages, you're hooked, in a good sense
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15:09<aloo_shu>in that sense, what's most disturbing to me, are pages of the sort 'foo invokes foo, this page is a stub, have a good day, the debian project' :)
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15:10<aloo_shu>or, on a more general level, the attitude of 'the source is the documentation
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15:12<aloo_shu>in an ideal world, a pkg shouldn't go live on repo w/o complete documentation, but I can see how that'd be too high a bar in practice atm
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15:28<jhutchins_wk>aloo_shu: In order for there to be documetation, someone has to step up and write it.
15:29<jhutchins_wk>There is also http://tldp.org, and a number of Debian wikis.
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15:30<aloo_shu>thx
15:30<jhutchins_wk>aloo_shu: Also /usr/share/doc/<package>.
15:30<aloo_shu>also, I know
15:31<jhutchins_wk>Man pages are pretty useful, but they can be hit-or-miss, from the blank stubs to obtuse discussions of the theory behind the program that really aren't helpful.
15:31<jhutchins_wk>It's a volunteer effort.
15:32<aloo_shu>making documentation a condition for a pkg to go onto repo, would be more a form of giving documentation a higher priority without assuming more volunteers to appear; it would be a lever
15:33<aloo_shu>a working definition of 'complete' would be all flags and arguments explained as mandatory, and a "FILES' section as highly desirable
15:35<aloo_shu>i.e. such a rule would make the difference whether a volunteer is merely getting waited for passively, or if a pkg maintainer would have an _active_ interest in sourcing that volunteer, lest his pkg be rejected
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15:36<aloo_shu>but I'm admittedly theorizing
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15:39<DusXMT>aloo_shu: Regarding man and info, GNU has a policy of generating "man pages" from a --help listing and then mentioning the texinfo page, which is... meh.
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15:40<bremner>that's not a policy in Debian, but a kind of lazy default
15:40<bremner>the mentioning of the info page is in the default output of help2man, so if you don't edit it...
15:41<DusXMT>I mean, sure, texinfo is more expressive, but so are formats like .pod (perl documentation), which can be used for generation of HTML, PDF and man page documentation :)
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15:42<bremner>aloo_shu: I don't think we want to introduce more blockers to making stable releases, or we will just stop doing it.
15:42<DusXMT>Personally, I think help2man isn't a particularly helpful tool, the user can invoke --help on their own, it's kinda silly to lead them on by making it seem like there's more
15:44<aloo_shu>in my world, that would be enough if the help text is comprehensive enough, e.g. ffmpeg, youtube-dl, image magick would come to mind as pretty complete, busybox' built in help applets would stand for a minimum that's at least help you to remember essentials you've once known, but is often incomplete
15:47<jhutchins_wk>DusXMT: Who would be able to know if every flag was documented?
15:47<jhutchins_wk>ER, aloo_shu ^
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15:47<aloo_shu>personally, I'm fine with mans being identical to --help output as a minimum, if complete enough, because - I'm getting a parser without having to pipe output myself, -I'm having everything in one place, -I can search man pages with -k and -K
15:48<aloo_shu>jhutchins_wk: who's normally having the responsability to check if a pkg is meeting debian requirements?
15:48<aloo_shu>might involve looking at sources
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15:49<aloo_shu>but then, probably a relatively easy to find 'case' statement
15:51<aloo_shu>I mean, I could turn it around and make it a security issue: what if a command is having undocumented backdoor flags? uuh huuh - just to make the point that it's not unreasonable to want to know the full scope of a command, for more that one reason
15:51<aloo_shu>s/that/than/
15:52<jhutchins_wk>aloo_shu: You are.
15:53<jhutchins_wk>aloo_shu: You have access to the code, you can see if everything in the code is documented.
15:53<jhutchins_wk>aloo_shu: You should not be demanding that somebody ELSE donate their time to make the documentation up to your standards.
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15:54<sarnold>loads of commands have undocumented flags
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15:54<bremner>aloo_shu: feel free to file bugs on packages with bad man pages. suggestions and patches are both welcome.
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15:58<bremner>you could try to get debian policy revised, but that attempt will fail with 99.99999999% probability
15:59<bremner>debian is bottom up, policy is suppose to follow current practices as much as possible. So first fix the packages.
16:02<aloo_shu>jhutchins_wk: you are correct, that IS what I am, not demanding, but suggesting, i.e. I am making the case for the user who isn't a coder, but still would like to use the cli - if you are putting this user off, you could as well trash desktop help systems, and send everybody to #learntocode - i.e. on what grounds would you deny the cli user a documentation system? why is debian having man and
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16:02<aloo_shu>info at all, could as well drop it, and tell ppl to configure their pkg management to dl source pkgs by default
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16:05<jhutchins_wk>Build a system that any idiot can use and only an idiot will want to use it.
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16:06<aloo_shu>the person who is getting interested in man pages, is just at the threshold of emancipating himself from idiocy - that's the precise reason why I'm giving this importance at all
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16:07<aloo_shu>a year later, he might write bash scripts, 3 years later, contribute code - if his first encounter was reasonably motivating
16:08<sqrt{not}>I think there's more documentation about all things cli, than most casual new users ever read. I don't think anyone is "deny[ing] the cli user a documentation system?
16:08<DusXMT>aloo_shu: I'd say "google is your friend" to them. man pages are definitely useful, but they are undoubtably extra work that a volunteer might not have to spend
16:08<DusXMT>*have the time to spend on
16:09<DusXMT>Also, when it comes to APIs, more and more developers are moving towards doxygen-style documentation instead of man-pages, and it makes sense, it's easy to keep the documentation up to date
16:10<DusXMT>(since the documentation also documents the code itself)
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16:11<aloo_shu>I personally, was making my biggest steps forward while I was in an offline setting. I actually let synaptic export dl scripts and executed them on my phone when I was in town and had wifi. slackware turned out to be my best friend for linux learning in that time, apart from man pages, there were the LINUX-HOWTOs, the slackbook, and a LOT of READMEs just in the convenient places
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16:13<DusXMT>Well, those still exist, no one is taking them away. If you feel like contributing documentation, I'm sure the developers will be delighted
16:14<aloo_shu>can't really comment, since I don't know doxygen, but in theory, translating between man, info, navegable html and other formats, should be the least burden, if the formats to translate between are well defined
16:14<DusXMT>aloo_shu: doxygen-style documentation relies heavily on hyperlinks
16:15<DusXMT>But you can indeed access it offline, by installing -doc packages and directing your web browser to /usr/share/doc/lib<name>-doc/
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16:17<aloo_shu>DusXMT: I might at some point, I'm having a relatively stable connection today, and text based would be somethin I could even do on my less energy hungry tablet - that's kond of the catch, I'm hardly running linux, not enough solar power for many laptop hours, except some debian in a chroot, where the host kernel seems to nail me to wheezy
16:19<DusXMT>well, there are text-based web browsers like w3m (used to be installed by default in Debian), that tend to work reasonably well with this kind of documentation :)
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16:20<DusXMT>(eg. right now I invoked '$ w3m /usr/share/doc/libusb-1.0-doc/html/index.html', and was able to browse through it reasonably well)
16:21<aloo_shu>in my experience, man is _far_ more complete than html entries under /usr/share/doc - info can use links, afaik, for man, you'd have to collect them in the see also section and add the right man section. info is indeed more universal, it just has gone out of fashion
16:22<DusXMT>aloo_shu: I guess it depends on what kind of project it refers to. If it's a library, then it's highly probable that the html documentation will be far better (since it's often generated from the code itself)
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16:23<aloo_shu>I mean, I'd be happy to use elinks or something, but I'd want a central top of hierarchy entry, into which pkgs would have to put their links at install time, or trigger a script, just like the man db now
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16:25<aloo_shu>since I'm not a coder, it's cli tools and standards and interfaces that interest me, i.e. sections 1,4,5,7,8 of man,but rarely 3 and 3p or 2
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16:27<DusXMT>aloo_shu: Well, in that case, if any of them is missing, to file a bug report, or a merge request upstream is appropriate.
16:27<aloo_shu>and that's also what I'd be looking up in /usr/share/doc - but between doc, man and info, there'd be a lot of potential for unnecessary duplicates. iirc, info and man can share to some extent
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22:27-!-dboehmer is "Daniel Böhmer,,," on #debian
22:29-!-preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b75:fd38:2845:cd81:1dcd] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:30-!-dvs [~hibbard@00012127.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:30-!-gnumoksha [~gnumoksha@2001:470:1af1:101::1438] has joined #debian
22:30-!-gnumoksha is "@gnumoksha:matrix.org" on #debian #debian-devel-br #debian-br
22:33-!-semeion [~semeion@0001996c.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.6]
22:35-!-hankoosh [~hankoosh@128.234.161.5] has joined #debian
22:35-!-hankoosh is "HaNkOoSh" on #debian
22:36-!-dvs [~hibbard@00012127.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:36-!-dvs is "realname" on #debian
22:40-!-hankoosh [~hankoosh@128.234.161.5] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:41-!-thelastjedi [~quassel@101.249.56.141] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:42-!-hankoosh [~hankoosh@128.234.161.5] has joined #debian
22:42-!-hankoosh is "HaNkOoSh" on #debian
22:53-!-thelastjedi [~quassel@101.249.56.141] has joined #debian
22:53-!-thelastjedi is "thelastjedi,,," on #debian
22:59-!-sakax [~skx@sakax.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:01-!-eamanu [~eamanu@181.92.79.117] has joined #debian
23:01-!-eamanu is "realname" on #debian
23:01-!-eamanu [~eamanu@181.92.79.117] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:05-!-Blue_Hat [~TwinKam20@216.10.218.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:07-!-eamanu_ [~eamanu@181.90.54.7] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:19-!-SWAT [~swat@swat.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
23:19-!-SWAT is "Unknown" on #debian
23:25-!-tdy1 [~tdy@76.10.0.154] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:29-!-hbautista [~hbautista@fixed-189-203-149-84.totalplay.net] has joined #debian
23:29-!-hbautista is "Héctor" on #debian-mx #debian #osm-es #oclug #archlinux #debian-es
23:31-!-Blue_Hat [~TwinKam20@216.10.218.162] has joined #debian
23:31-!-Blue_Hat is "TwinKam20" on #debian
23:35-!-anonymous_ [~anonymous@190.242.24.229] has joined #debian
23:35-!-anonymous_ is "anonymous" on #debian
23:36-!-anonymous_ [~anonymous@190.242.24.229] has quit []
23:38-!-deltron [~deltron@00018077.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:38-!-dvs [~hibbard@00012127.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:55-!-PoPpiLLs [~damion@2602:306:cfb5:aaf0::48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
---Logclosed Wed Oct 16 00:00:59 2019