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#debian IRC Logs for 2020-06-29

---Logopened Mon Jun 29 00:00:09 2020
00:01-!-simonpatapon [simon@patapon.lol] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
00:01-!-simonpatapon is "Simon Patapon" on #bitlbee
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03:46<shtrb>How can I check if it's my fan really not working or it's a module problem that it does not reporting running speed ? (audio check is not an option)
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03:47-!-schizo is "me without a mic is like a beat without a snare" on #oftc #linux #debian
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03:49-!-aidalgol is "Aidan Gauland" on #debian
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03:54-!-gtristan is "Tristan Van Berkom" on #kernelnewbies #qemu #debian #ninja-build #debian-next
03:55<Anarka>doesnt bios show it ?
03:57<Anarka>my fan also shows 0, but i can ear it anytime i use a "heavy" site :)
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04:05<shtrb>It show that it exist but not the actual value
04:05<shtrb>It show that it exist but not the actual value
04:06<shtrb>lol , that too smart debian box really didn't work enough to make the fan work, I statred 50 tabs in firefox and hit sensors and I can see the value now.
04:08<Anarka>:)
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04:45<aidalgol>I'm trying to cross build a source package for i386 on an amd64 host with debuild, and I get this error: https://paste.debian.net/1154328
04:45<aidalgol>How should I be doing this?
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05:27<GyrosGeier>aidalgol, install libstb-dev:i386 libsdl2-dev:i386 libavformat-dev:i386
05:28<GyrosGeier>for a cross build, you need build dependencies for the target, not for the host (except if they are tagged :host)
05:28<aidalgol>GyrosGeier: The i386 -dev packages conflict with... a *lot*.
05:28<GyrosGeier>then they should be fixed
05:28<GyrosGeier>until that is done, build in a chroot or a container
05:28<aidalgol>Ah, OK, then.
05:29<GyrosGeier>brb, then I'll take a look at how bad it is
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05:30<aidalgol>At least libsdl2-dev:i386 conflicts with libsdl2-dev:amd64
05:30<aidalgol>The other two may have been fine.
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05:39<GyrosGeier>mh
05:39<GyrosGeier>then it
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05:39<GyrosGeier>then it's not properly multiarch ready
05:40<GyrosGeier>SDL is nontrivial IIRC, so a chroot is your best bet here
05:40<GyrosGeier>not sure if builder can cross-build by now
05:40<GyrosGeier>*pbuilder
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05:55<aidalgol>I'll use a chroot since I've done that before
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06:36<thisisbrian>Trying this again. Good morning! I am trying to download the latest CD Image from https://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/current/amd64/iso-cd/ but everything at cdimage.debian.org is timing out. Is this a scheduled downtime?
06:37<thisisbrian> /msg dpkg 10.4
06:38<thisisbrian>ok. I give up. Obviously I do not know what I am doing. I haven't used IRC in years. I don't even know where to read the rules of this Channel. :") I will just wait longer.
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06:51<thisisbrian>Is this the right place to talk about Debian? I see a lot of people but no one talking. Ghostown lurkers?
06:52<mendel_munkis>thisisbrian: people here mostly only talk if they have a question ar an answer
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06:54<thisisbrian>Gotcha. I had so much trouble registering I was unsure if any of my questions were being seen
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07:19<mendel_munkis>for the record I don't know if it's scheduled downtime but cdimage.debian.org times out for me as well.
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07:26<dvs>mendel_munkis, what did you do to shut down cdimage??? ;-P
07:26<mendel_munkis>ping
07:26<mendel_munkis>also cdimage should redirect to a mirror correct?
07:26<dvs>so you overwheled the server
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07:30<mendel_munkis>http://www.acc.umu.se/technical/console/index.html.en seems like one of the mirror isites is having trouble.
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11:53<decafinatedtea>Hi, I installed Debian 10 on a MacBook 4,1 from 2008. I managed to get the Wifi and the i915 drivers installed. However, the computer seems to be running a little hot. Also, when I select shutdown the computer doesn't power off. What should I do?
11:54-!-hele [~hele@88-115-23-57.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #debian
11:54-!-hele is "hele" on #debian-next #debian
11:54<sney>sounds like an acpi issue. there may be something here: https://wiki.debian.org/MacBook
11:54<sney>also look into switching cpufreq governors
11:55<decafinatedtea>thanks
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12:02-!-hilt is "Bruno Ochotorena" on #debian
12:03-!-s-mutin [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
12:03-!-s-mutin is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
12:04-!-decafinatedtea [~user@108.162.134.187] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:04-!-cHawk [~cHawk@tmo-096-93.customers.d1-online.com] has joined #debian
12:04-!-cHawk is "realname" on #debian #openttd #debian-next #debian-offtopic
12:05-!-mutin-sa [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
12:05-!-mutin-sa is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
12:06-!-troyt [zncsrv@2601:681:4102:9411:44dd:acff:fe85:9c8e] has joined #debian
12:06-!-troyt is "Troy Telford" on #debian-next #debian-ipv6 #debian
12:07-!-Haudegen [~quassel@91.114.49.10] has quit [Quit: Bin weg.]
12:09-!-mode/#debian [+l 701] by debhelper
12:09-!-mutin-s [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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12:12-!-Oebele [~quassel@219-8-201-31.ftth.glasoperator.nl] has joined #debian
12:12-!-Oebele is "Oebele" on #debian
12:12-!-imega [~coma@vpn-89-206-112-11.uzh.ch] has joined #debian
12:12-!-imega is "coma" on #debian #ceph
12:14-!-mutin-sa [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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12:19-!-Brigo [~Brigo@40.181.60.213.dynamic.reverse-mundo-r.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:23-!-semeion [~semeion@0001996c.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.8]
12:28-!-s-mutin [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
12:28-!-s-mutin is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
12:28-!-quazgar_ [~quazgar@p200300cf072c50005054682cd6b1a089.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:30-!-mbond [~mbond@12.109.252.10] has joined #debian
12:30-!-mbond is "mbond" on #debian
12:32-!-pi_ [~smuxi@77.75.120.132] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:33-!-ac_laptop2 [~ac_laptop@186.2.247.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:34-!-debalance [~quassel@2a02:908:108d:cd40:201:2eff:fe70:36f] has joined #debian
12:34-!-debalance is "Philipp Huebner" on #debian #debian-devel-changes
12:34-!-cHawk [~cHawk@2a02:2455:35d:8201:c611:3205:771a:bfdd] has joined #debian
12:34-!-cHawk is "realname" on #debian #openttd #debian-next #debian-offtopic
12:35-!-ConnectingMedia [~Connectin@b2b-130-180-64-186.unitymedia.biz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
12:45-!-cyberpunk2077 [~cyberpunk@219.91.239.200] has joined #debian
12:45-!-cyberpunk2077 is "realname" on #debian
12:46-!-zyley [~zyley@00027792.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
12:46-!-zyley is "zyleyt" on #oftc #moocows #debian-offtopic #debian-live #debian-next #debian
12:46-!-cyberpunk2077 [~cyberpunk@219.91.239.200] has quit []
12:48-!-Guest983 [~magellani@c83-251-253-157.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:48-!-alllex [~alllex@2001:16b8:2ece:3300:c482:d0ac:90f3:988d] has joined #debian
12:48-!-alllex is "realname" on #debian
12:49-!-Talkless [~Talkless@hst-227-49.splius.lt] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
12:49-!-Talkless [~Talkless@hst-227-49.splius.lt] has joined #debian
12:49-!-Talkless is "Vincas" on #debian-next #debian
12:50-!-alllex [~alllex@2001:16b8:2ece:3300:c482:d0ac:90f3:988d] has quit []
12:51-!-koinos [~koinos@00028eff.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
12:51-!-koinos is "koinos" on #debian
12:54-!-magellanino [~magellani@c83-251-253-157.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #debian
12:54-!-magellanino is "Davide Governale 0x772EBD56" on #osm-it #debian-devel-changes #debian #debian-eeepc #debian-devel-it
12:54-!-magellanino is now known as Guest2041
12:55-!-ac_laptop2 [~ac_laptop@186.2.247.129] has joined #debian
12:55-!-ac_laptop2 is "ac_laptop" on #debian
12:57-!-caravel [~caravel@000209c4.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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13:00-!-R3den-Tor [~Redentor@189.202.75.173.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #debian
13:00-!-R3den-Tor is "realname" on #debian-next #debian-mx #debian-es #debian #linode
13:01-!-sherab [~sherab_@31.127.159.102] has quit [Quit: sherab]
13:03-!-brlancer_ [~brlancer@108-222-48-24.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net] has left #debian []
13:03-!-metreo [~metreo@156.57.147.177] has joined #debian
13:03-!-metreo is "oliver" on #debian
13:03-!-jatt [~user@0001c61c.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:03-!-brlancer [~brlancer@108-222-48-24.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net] has joined #debian
13:03-!-brlancer is "Lachlan" on #debian
13:04-!-irf21k [~irf21k@2401:4900:3362:7ad2:1:0:aad9:7213] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:04-!-cd_ [~smuxi@p54b49bd4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
13:04-!-cd_ is "Your Name" on #debian
13:04-!-cd_ [~smuxi@p54b49bd4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has left #debian []
13:09-!-skitt [~skitt@skitt.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:09-!-Oebele [~quassel@219-8-201-31.ftth.glasoperator.nl] has quit []
13:10-!-jacr [~jacr@00028efe.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
13:11-!-zyley is now known as Guest2044
13:11-!-zyley [~zyley@00027792.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
13:11-!-zyley is "zyleyt" on #debian #debian-next #debian-live #debian-offtopic #moocows #oftc
13:14-!-ansel [~ansel@2003:5b:203b:100:a64c:c8ff:fef4:13a6] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:15-!-hele [~hele@88-115-23-57.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:15-!-jatt [~user@134.3.128.192] has joined #debian
13:15-!-jatt is "Jhair Tocancipa Triana" on #debian #bitlbee
13:16-!-TheRuralJuror [~quassel@178.115.237.87.static.drei.at] has joined #debian
13:16-!-TheRuralJuror is "AP,,," on #security #debian.or.at #debian-next #debian
13:17-!-rattlesnake [~rattlesna@106.220.232.139] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:19-!-mode/#debian [+l 693] by debhelper
13:19-!-Guest2044 [~zyley@00027792.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:21-!-kathenas [~kathenas@2a02:c7f:9280:e800:94de:a37f:a9be:fb3c] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
13:25-!-gdot [~gdot@p4fe1f4b2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
13:25-!-gdot is "realname" on #debian #debian-next #debian-owncloud #qemu
13:25-!-maschinenhans [~Hans@200116b82a868900d8565b847e674481.dip.versatel-1u1.de] has joined #debian
13:25-!-maschinenhans is "realname" on #debian
13:26-!-brunoramos_ [~brunoramo@94.252.122.148] has joined #debian
13:26-!-brunoramos_ is "ZNC - https://znc.in" on #oftc #help #debian
13:29-!-arnab [~arnab@node-103-220-91-28.mftrdns.com] has joined #debian
13:29-!-arnab is "realname" on #debian
13:30-!-arnab [~arnab@node-103-220-91-28.mftrdns.com] has quit []
13:30-!-totonika [~toto@5.146.194.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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13:32-!-narispo [~narispo@2a01:e0a:2a2:1590:bc83:69f7:50d5:91be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
13:32-!-caravel [~caravel@000209c4.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
13:32-!-caravel is "caravel" on #debian-next #debian
13:32-!-narispo [~narispo@37.120.204.10] has joined #debian
13:32-!-narispo is "narispo" on #debian #bcache
13:32-!-gdot2 [~gdot@p5b22e8ed.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:33-!-czesmir [~stefan@egj40.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #debian
13:33-!-czesmir is "Stefan" on #debian
13:34-!-thiras [~thiras@46.197.225.7] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:34-!-thiras [~thiras@46.197.225.7] has joined #debian
13:34-!-thiras is "realname" on #debian
13:37-!-milan [~milan@000268e7.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:38-!-hilt [~hilt@186.212.185.79] has quit []
13:41-!-kathenas [~kathenas@2a02:c7f:9280:e800:94de:a37f:a9be:fb3c] has joined #debian
13:41-!-kathenas is "Phil Wyett" on #debian-next #debian-social #debian-meeting #debian
13:47-!-rafaeldtinoco [sid244269@id-244269.brockwell.irccloud.com] has quit []
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13:56-!-Edhil [~edhil@000266d3.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: One of the last]
14:00-!-hilt [~hilt@186.212.185.79] has joined #debian
14:00-!-hilt is "Bruno Ochotorena" on #debian
14:05-!-jatt [~user@0001c61c.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:06-!-s-mutin [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
14:06-!-s-mutin is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
14:06-!-artermes27 [~artermes2@2a00:23c8:4487:a00:d436:8aef:1151:b36d] has joined #debian
14:06-!-artermes27 is "realname" on #debian
14:07-!-artermes27 [~artermes2@2a00:23c8:4487:a00:d436:8aef:1151:b36d] has quit []
14:08-!-kreyren_ [~kreyren@2620:18c::188] has joined #debian
14:08-!-kreyren_ is "Jacob Hrbek" on #oftc #debian-next #ck #gentoo #bash #debian
14:08-!-kreyren [~kreyren@00028d6a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:09-!-rafaeldtinoco [~rafaeldti@191.177.180.119] has joined #debian
14:09-!-rafaeldtinoco is "Rafael D. Tinoco" on #debian
14:10-!-artermes27 [~artermes2@2a00:23c8:4487:a00:d436:8aef:1151:b36d] has joined #debian
14:10-!-artermes27 is "realname" on #debian
14:12-!-ChubaDuba [~ChubaDuba@37.112.34.92] has joined #debian
14:12-!-ChubaDuba is "ChubaDuba" on #debian
14:14-!-jatt [~user@134.3.128.192] has joined #debian
14:14-!-jatt is "Jhair Tocancipa Triana" on #debian #bitlbee
14:17-!-Baunm [~Lord@p57a86cd1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
14:17-!-Baunm is "realname" on #debian
14:17-!-Baunm [~Lord@p57a86cd1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit []
14:19-!-andibmu [~andi@89.204.130.236] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:19-!-andibmu [~andi@89.204.130.236] has joined #debian
14:19-!-andibmu is "Andreas B. Mundt" on #debian-meeting #debian #debian-next #debian-offtopic #debian-edu #debian-lan
14:22-!-R3den-Tor [~Redentor@189.202.75.173.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit []
14:22-!-mutin-s [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
14:22-!-mutin-s is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
14:24-!-hsiangkao [~hsiangkao@00029a79.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC 1.7.5 - https://znc.in]
14:24-!-hsiangkao [~hsiangkao@47.240.82.26] has joined #debian
14:24-!-hsiangkao is "Gao Xiang" on #mm #ext4 #debian-zh #debian #bcache
14:24-!-artermes27 [~artermes2@2a00:23c8:4487:a00:d436:8aef:1151:b36d] has quit []
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14:31-!-Talkless [~Talkless@hst-227-49.splius.lt] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
14:33-!-wytchmaster [~wytchmast@2003:a:a13:3002:161e:d791:2a2c:975d] has quit []
14:33-!-adamkoeh11 [~adamkoehn@172-4-107-47.lightspeed.frsnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit []
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14:45-!-Wolfrik [~johara@2a02:c7f:701c:f200:8fe4:7b4e:428e:9725] has joined #debian
14:45-!-Wolfrik is "realname" on #debian
14:46-!-Wolfrik [~johara@2a02:c7f:701c:f200:8fe4:7b4e:428e:9725] has left #debian []
14:49-!-inne__ [~inne@77.11.128.31] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:51-!-Brigo [~Brigo@40.181.60.213.dynamic.reverse-mundo-r.com] has joined #debian
14:51-!-Brigo is "realname" on #debian #debian-es #debian-next #debian-offtopic
14:51-!-hau63n [~nils@2a04:2746:d10:4c10:217:8ff:fe7d:4a5e] has joined #debian
14:51-!-hau63n is "Nils Haugen" on #debian-next #qemu #virt #debian
14:51-!-hau63n [~nils@2a04:2746:d10:4c10:217:8ff:fe7d:4a5e] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:52-!-hau63n is "Nils Haugen" on #debian-next #qemu #virt #debian
14:52-!-hau63n [~nils@s91904425.blix.com] has joined #debian
14:54-!-ao2 [~ao2@host-87-18-91-100.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #debian
14:54-!-ao2 is "ao2" on #vcs-home #debian #cell
14:54-!-random [~coffee@p5b2f22e4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
14:54-!-random is "M" on #debian
14:54-!-random [~coffee@p5b2f22e4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit []
14:58-!-irf21k [~irf21k@2401:4900:3362:7ad2:1:0:aad9:7213] has joined #debian
14:58-!-irf21k is "irf21k" on #linux #debian #C #kernelnewbies
14:58-!-RedSoxFan07 [~Thunderbi@137.103.117.100] has joined #debian
14:58-!-RedSoxFan07 is "RedSoxFan07" on #debian
14:59-!-RedSoxFan07 [~Thunderbi@137.103.117.100] has quit []
14:59-!-RedSoxFan07 is "RedSoxFan07" on #debian
14:59-!-RedSoxFan07 [~Thunderbi@d-137-103-117-100.ct.cpe.atlanticbb.net] has joined #debian
15:01-!-mutin-sa [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
15:01-!-mutin-sa is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
15:01-!-metreo [~metreo@156.57.147.177] has quit []
15:04-!-s-mutin [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
15:04-!-s-mutin is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
15:08-!-mutin-s [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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15:11-!-mutin-s [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
15:11-!-mutin-s is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
15:12-!-mbond_ [~mbond@12.109.252.10] has joined #debian
15:12-!-mbond_ is "mbond" on #debian
15:12-!-s-mutin [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:12-!-mbond [~mbond@12.109.252.10] has quit [Read error: No route to host]
15:13-!-capriott_ [~capriott@pdl-19-114.nat.cineca.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:13-!-mbond [~mbond@12.109.252.10] has joined #debian
15:13-!-mbond is "mbond" on #debian
15:14-!-dpanter [~dpanter@0002672e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
15:18-!-s-mutin [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
15:18-!-s-mutin is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
15:18-!-andibmu [~andi@89.204.130.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:19-!-mutin-s [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:20-!-mutin-s [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
15:20-!-mutin-s is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
15:20-!-mbond_ [~mbond@12.109.252.10] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:21-!-annadane_ [~annadane@bras-base-mtrlpq5302w-grc-01-69-156-32-216.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #debian
15:21-!-annadane_ is "realname" on #debian
15:21-!-mutin-sa [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
15:21-!-mutin-sa is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
15:21-!-rattlesnake [~rattlesna@106.220.232.139] has joined #debian
15:21-!-rattlesnake is "rattlesnake" on #debian
15:23-!-erremoscia [~AdminUser@host-79-54-49-247.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #debian
15:23-!-erremoscia is "Debian Live user,,," on #debian
15:23-!-maschinenhans [~Hans@200116b82a868900d8565b847e674481.dip.versatel-1u1.de] has quit []
15:24-!-erremoscia [~AdminUser@host-79-54-49-247.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit []
15:25-!-guido [~alumno@2800:810:498:8cde:d139:3e0b:c695:3f5a] has joined #debian
15:25-!-guido is "Alumno" on #debian
15:25-!-annadane is now known as Guest2050
15:25-!-annadane_ is now known as annadane
15:26-!-guido [~alumno@2800:810:498:8cde:d139:3e0b:c695:3f5a] has quit []
15:26-!-s-mutin [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:26-!-Guest2050 [~annadane@00025aa4.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:26-!-s-mutin [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has joined #debian
15:26-!-s-mutin is "Sergey A. Mutin" on #debian #qemu #bitrig
15:28-!-mutin-s [~s-mutin@85.234.114.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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15:32-!-ddsys [~ddsys@0002a5a5.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
15:32-!-ddsys is "ddsys" on #debian-next #debian-offtopic #debian
15:34-!-irf21k [~irf21k@2401:4900:3362:7ad2:1:0:aad9:7213] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:35-!-rafaeldtinoco [~rafaeldti@191.177.180.119] has quit [Quit: cya]
15:35-!-rafaeldtinoco [~rafaeldti@191.177.180.119] has joined #debian
15:35-!-rafaeldtinoco is "Rafael D. Tinoco" on @#‌#debian-next #virt #qemu #kvm #debian-qemu #debian
15:36-!-DennisTheTiger [~dennisthe@c-73-83-185-152.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:39-!-mode/#debian [+l 687] by debhelper
15:40-!-hau63n_home [~nils@2a04:2746:d10:4c10:217:8ff:fe7d:4a5e] has joined #debian
15:40-!-hau63n_home is "Nils Haugen" on #debian #virt #qemu #debian-next
15:40-!-DennisTheTiger [~dennisthe@c-73-83-185-152.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #debian
15:40-!-DennisTheTiger is "realname" on #debian-offtopic #debian
15:40-!-Guest1938 [~r00t@2a01:79d:7370:5319:81eb:f2d1:27a3:5edd] has quit []
15:42-!-totonika [~toto@5.146.194.58] has joined #debian
15:42-!-totonika is "realname" on #debian-next #debian
15:42-!-bolt [~r00t@2a01:79d:7370:5319:ad42:7d6a:78fe:cb16] has joined #debian
15:42-!-bolt is "-" on #virt #debian-next #debian #sd #oftc #qemu
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16:12<jhutchins>!mirror status
16:12<dpkg>Debian mirrors have timestamp files we use to determine how recently they have been updated. Here are some statistics the mirror maintainers provide: https://mirror-master.debian.org/status/mirror-status.html and http://ftp.de.debian.org/dmc/today/ Ask me about <mirrors>. #debian-mirrors on irc.oftc.net.
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18:01<blueskies>Hi everyone. I'm having trouble with a fresh installation of Buster. The machine is a Dell Inspiron 20 Model 3052 (it's an all-in-one with a touchscreen). It has onboard Intel graphics. An old Linux (I think it was Ubuntu or Mint, but it was old, in any case) Live CD ran fine, and the Debian installer booted and ran fine. However, when it came time to boot into the new install, GRUB loads fine, and I get a few lines of booting
18:02<blueskies>unresponsive. Booting with the 'nomodeset' boot option ends with a mostly black screen with a blinking cursor in the upper left. I can get Alt-F1 to get to a terminal, but can't tell what's going wrong or why. Can anyone give me a hand figuring this out?
18:03<blueskies>It seems like open source graphics have got to be the easiest scenario, no?
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18:04<blueskies>I mean, I've grown accustomed to issues with nvidia or amd graphics, but I thought Intel had to be a gimme.
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18:09<blueskies>I've taken several stabs at it based on post online, including nomodeset, obviously, as well as installing 'firmware-linux' in case of some kind of firmware issue, and auto-generating an xorg.conf in case that helped. Nothing has worked so far.
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18:10<petn-randall>blueskies: One way is to remove the 'quiet' linux parameter in grub, and see what error it throws.
18:10<petn-randall>blueskies: If you have installed a desktop and it doesn't start, you can also look why the daemon fails with `systemctl`.
18:10<blueskies>petn-randall: and I expect that error to be displayed on-screen during the boot process, or in dmesg or somewhere?
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18:11<blueskies>petn-randall: I installed XFCE. How do I check with systemctl? My systemd experience is virtually nonexistent.
18:11<petn-randall>blueskies: It will likely be shown on-screen, but if not, you can check it with systemctl.
18:11<petn-randall>blueskies: If you run `systemctl`, and scroll down, you should see a failed task coloured in red.
18:13<blueskies>petn-randall: Okay, I'll see what's going on there. I'll start with my nomodeset boot and hopefully the problem is the same in both cases.
18:14<petn-randall>blueskies: Sure, keep me updated. I'm here for another 30 minutes at least.
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18:31<bleb>can anyone help me understand how my debian is detecting the printers on my network
18:32<bleb>i think it has something to do with avahi and cups-browsed, but i installed both of those on a barebones install and my printers are not detected, as they are on an xfce install
18:32<petn-randall>bleb: It's likely happening via https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-configuration_networking
18:33<bleb>so either avahi or bonjour or both
18:33<bleb>cups-browsed mentions bonjour; avahi is running
18:33<bleb>but there must be something more that makes it work in the xfce install
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18:39<bleb>maybe i can try disabling services and see if it removes my printers
18:40<ddsys>system-config-printer ?
18:41<bleb>i thought that was a tool not a daemon
18:41<ddsys>oh right
18:42<pumpernickel>bleb so at least for my printers, I have to have bonjour active + cups-browsed which I deactivate after installing the drivers
18:43<blueskies>petn-randall: Last "normal boot message" (defined by me as starting with the little "[ OK ]") says "Starting GNOME Display Manager. Then a bunch of lines of dmesg-looking messages with timestamps, starting with a bunch of healthy looking lines about the audio devices, then later, three separate messages about my network link not being ready. Not smoking gun there, to my eye. Nothing red in systemctl, either...
18:43<bleb>pumpernickel: by bonjour do you mean avahi
18:45<pumpernickel>yes
18:45<ddsys>there is a dependency of cups called cups-daemon
18:46<petn-randall>blueskies: With `journalctl -u gdm` you should be able to see any message from gdm.
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18:46<petn-randall>I don't recall how the systemd unit is configured, it might try restarting it a few times before it's considered failed (which would mark it red).
18:47<pumpernickel>petn-randall does xfce use gdm? because the last time it was lightdm
18:47<blueskies>petn-randall: Wait, when I do 'systemctl --all', there are 7 red "not-found" items. Perhaps I should mention this is the second install attempt with the same problem. That also reminds me, this time I tried GNOME, the first time was XFCE.
18:47<blueskies>pumpernickel: Good catch, my mistake.
18:48<petn-randall>blueskies: just check if it's lightdm or gdm, then check the logs with journalctl.
18:48<blueskies>I usually use XFCE, but tried a GNOME insallation this time in case it helped.
18:48<petn-randall>always good to try some things out.
18:49<blueskies>petn-randall: And how do I determine which it is, aside from that GDM-claiming boot message?
18:51<petn-randall>blueskies: Just check which one is installed. Or did you install one after the other?
18:56<blueskies>petn-randall: No, fresh re-install. Okay, I got output from 'journalctl -u gdm'. systemd[1]: Starting GNOME Display Manager... systemd[1] Started GNOME Display Manager. gdm-launch-environment] [577]: pam_unix(gdm-launch-environment:session): session opened for user Debian-gdm by (uid=0) gdm3[557]: Child process -596 was already dead. gdm3[557] Child process -596 was already dead
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18:59<blueskies>petn-randall: Then two red lines: gdm3[557]: GdmLaunchEnvironment: Failed to set owner of /var/lib/gdm3: Read-only file system gdm3[557]: GLib-GObject: g_object_set: assertion 'G_IS_OBJECT (object)' failed
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19:01<sarnold>check dmesg, you may have filesystem corruption or disk errors that caused the kernel to remount the fileysstem read-only
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19:04<petn-randall>blueskies: What sarnold said. For the future, it's better to use https://paste.debian.net (while we still have it).
19:05<annadane>while we still have it?!
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19:06<blueskies>petn-randall: Okay, sorry, I was actually manually transcribing that, and since I wasn't pasting it didn't feel worth putting it somewhere else. Hang on, I'm rebooting and retrying. I might have done something strange without realizing it.
19:07<petn-randall>annadane: Due to abuse and the resulting overhead formorer is thinking about taking it offline.
19:07<blueskies>sarnold: Thanks, that might have been my bad. I'll retry and see if anything changes.
19:07<petn-randall>blueskies: read-only filesystem means something is broken on a more fundamental level.
19:10<blueskies>petn-randall: The thing is, <hides face> I might have done an emergency remount.... Sometimes it's less reponsive and I might have tried some sysrq stuff without it rebooting, and then might have forgotten. I'm honestly not sure, but I might have tried REISUB without getting a reboot and then gotten the alt-f2 to work.
19:10<petn-randall>blueskies: Ah, then just try a clean reboot and see the logs agian.
19:10<petn-randall>*again
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19:11<blueskies>petn-randall: I have tried rebooting, and am currently sitting in the boot sequence screen after the audio device messages and network messages, and it's not responding to alt-f2....
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19:15<petn-randall>blueskies: Check the hardware. If you get random different issues on every reboot it might be your disk failing, or bitflips in your RAM.
19:15<blueskies>petn-randall: From there it seemed completely unresponsive, but then I tried my sysrq junk again, and then it would accept alt-f2. Rebooting again, leaving quiet this time, while still adding nomodeset, because it seemed like it would more consistently let me get to a terminal before. Not that it seems to me like that should make a difference, but <shrug>.
19:16<blueskies>petn-randall: I ran badblocks on the root and home partitions just before the install. (there are also some windows partitions still on there, though I don't intend to reboot.) I have not checked RAM.
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19:17<blueskies>petn-randall: Sorry, badblocks -w, which I'd imagine should have noticed any problems (and that's why I ran it, just to make sure the HDD seems good)
19:18<petn-randall>blueskies: You can run SMART long selftests (package "smartmontools") to check the whole disk via the firmware. You can let such a test run in the background as long as you keep the machine on.
19:18<blueskies>petn-randall: pretty sure I did that first from the LiveCD I mentioned. DEFINITELY checked SMART status and it looked fine.
19:19<petn-randall>blueskies: Might be worth leaving the machine boot to the end, maybe something is stuck on boot and needs a while to timeout.
19:19<blueskies>petn-randall: Rechecking those ctl dealies.
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19:21<petn-randall>blueskies: So, what does it say?
19:22<blueskies>petn-randall: Okay, same thing with systemctl (no red) and systemctl --all (7 red "not-found"s). journalctl -u gdm gave essentially the same 5 first lines (except process -594 was already dead instead of -596 this time), and none of the red lines.
19:23<petn-randall>blueskies: Do you have a working network? Then you can send it to us via pastebinit.
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19:25<petn-randall>blueskies: `--all` is not needed and will show many things in red that are irrelevant.
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19:26<blueskies>petn-randall: The not-founds in systemctl --all are tmp.mount, auditd.service, connman.service, console-screen.service, kbd.service, systemd-update-done.service, and systemd-vconsole-setup.service
19:26<blueskies>petn-randall: okay
19:27<blueskies>petn-randall: I'll check network, not optimisting because of those not ready errors I kept getting. I'll try pinging something
19:27<blueskies>*optimistic
19:27<blueskies>petn-randall: Yes, network seems to be working
19:28<petn-randall>blueskies: then install pastebinit, and then you can pipe any content you need to it, and you only need to type the link it will output.
19:28<petn-randall>!pastebinit
19:28<dpkg>A command-line tool to send data to a <pastebin>. To paste e.g. your sources.list do "apt-get install pastebinit; pastebinit /etc/apt/sources.list"; to paste the output of a program do e.g. "dmesg 2>&1 | pastebinit". For a list of pastebin sites do "pastebinit -l". See also <pastebinit config>, <nopaste>.
19:29<blueskies>petn-randall: Okay, which output would you like. (will install now)
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19:33<blueskies>petn-randall: Okay, installed. You'd like output of "systemctl | pastebinit" and "journalctl -u gdm | pastebinit"?
19:37<blueskies>systemctl : http://paste.debian.net/1154427/ journalctl -u gdm : Uh, this one is not working? It's just giving http://paste.debian.net/
19:38<blueskies>petn-randall: journalctl -u gdm seems to be getting more interesting, though. Now it has a bunch more lines.
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19:40<blueskies>petn-randall: I think the additional lines are generated when I alt-f1 to where GNOME is supposed to be. Doing it and coming back added like 8 lines about the session opening, closing, only lasting less than half a second, and child processes already being dead
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19:42<blueskies>petn-randall: I can't tell why "journalctl -u gdm" is failing to give a working link. It whines a bit about a DeprecationWarning, but it did the same thing for systemctl and still worked.
19:46<blueskies>Does anyone know why "sudo journalctl -u gdm | pastebinit" would just return "http://paste.debian.net/" instead of an actual pastebin link? It works fine for other commands piped into it.
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19:47<blueskies>... and "sudo journalctl -u gdm" does have output...
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19:54<blueskies>Would someone using GNOME and who has pastebinit installed (or doesn't mind installing it real quick) mind checking if "sudo journalctl -u gdm | pastebinit" gives them back a working link?
19:54<petn-randall>blueskies: Maybe the interaction with sudo is causing problems?
19:55<blueskies>petn-randall: I don't have permissions without it, and sudo worked for systemctl. I can "sudo su" still, right? If so, I can try that first.
19:55<pumpernickel>I assume that pastebinit would need sudo to read the contents or? as everything after | doesn't have sudo rights
19:55<petn-randall>blueskies: `sudo -i` is better, as it also sets the $PATH correctly.
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19:56<petn-randall>pumpernickel: It seems as though the output redirection doesn't work, though, as pastebinit only does that when it doesn't get any input.
19:57<blueskies>same problem after getting a root prompt with sudo -i
19:57<pumpernickel>hm, setting up a vm for a sec
19:57<petn-randall>blueskies: But `journalctl -u gdm` does output something when run without redirection, right?
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19:58<blueskies>petn-randall: Yes.
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20:00<blueskies>Both with sudo and after sudo -i.
20:01<petn-randall>blueskies: You could try logging in via ssh from your current machine and then copy/paste the content.
20:02<petn-randall>blueskies: I have to head for bed, but maybe someone else here can jump in and continue helping.
20:02<blueskies>petn-randall: No ssh-server currently installed, and I'm rather unfamiliar with ssh, so frankly, I'd rather manually transcribe the most relevant bits, since that seems easier. Is that the main output you'd still like, or are there other commands that seem relevant?
20:02<blueskies>petn-randall: Okay, thanks very much for all the help so far. Sleep well!!!
20:03<petn-randall>Thanks, and finger's crossed that you can resolve your issue!
20:03<blueskies>Thank you!
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20:05<blueskies>If anyone has been following along and wouldn't mind jumping in, I'd certainly appreciate it. It does seem weird to me that I have had what seems to be more or less the same symptoms with both GNOME (gdm) and XFCE (lightdm) installations. The problem seems the same, though I didn't get as far into troubleshooting it with XFCE, since I just tried GNOME and hoped it might change something.
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20:06<pumpernickel>blueskies let's get first that journalctl -u gdm output :)
20:06<blueskies>pumpernickel: Thanks very much for trying to verify my pastebinit problem! I'll be interested to see if you run into the same difficulties.
20:06<blueskies>pumpernickel: Definitely.
20:06<blueskies>pumpernickel: If you think it's worth me starting to manually transcribe it, I can get started now.
20:07<pumpernickel>blueskies do you see anything that's standing out from that output?
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20:12<blueskies>pumpernickel: Yes, but I'm not sure what it means, really. It says a sesssion was opened, then says twice that "Child process -594 was already dead." That's about all it said, until later when I went back to Alt-F1, which seemed to trigger another set of similar, but different messages. It gives a rapid fire sequence containing "session opened", then "session closed", then "display lasted .495645 seconds", then "Child process -13
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20:13<blueskies>pumpernickel: And then it does that several more times, presumably retrying while I was in Alt-F1, repeating more or less that same sequence of events, though there's some variation of the order, one line missing here or there, etc. But it seems to be doing the same thing.
20:14<pumpernickel>well, with alt+f1 you trigger a new session from gdm (as gdm lives on f1) gnome then on f2.
20:15<blueskies>pumpernickel: Okay. Uh, so is it a problem that the terminal I'm using is F2, or is that okay and GNOME would take it over if it wanted it?
20:16<pumpernickel>blueskies that's fine
20:16<blueskies>pumpernickel: and should I be staying away from F1?
20:16<pumpernickel>blueskies no it doesn't matter, as it would just still run on f1 (you would 'lose' your output on that tty)
20:16<blueskies>pumpernickel: I guess I'm wondering if the child process SHOULD already be dead or if that's the problem, and why these "sessions" only last about half a second
20:17<blueskies>pumpernickel: Though obviously if I were capable of troubleshooting it, I already would have, so feel free to take it in whatever direction you think is most likely to get somewhere.
20:20<pumpernickel>blueskies so at least I can verify your bug with pastebinit ;)
20:20<blueskies>pumpernickel: Well, boo to the bug, but yay to the fact that it's not me. :)
20:21<pumpernickel>blueskies I guess we have to see what happens with gdm :/ so now is the question, do you want to transcribe it (or learn ssh in like 3 mins ;) )
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20:21<blueskies>pumpernickel: I was thinking, is there possibly a workaround by piping through something else first? What can I pipe through that wouldn't screw up the process? I thought "more" might add interactivity that would get in the way, but something along those lines?
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20:22<blueskies>pumpernickel: Wait wait wait. Maybe output to file then cat it to pastebinit or something?
20:23<blueskies>pumpernickel: Please remind me of the proper syntax to do something like that?
20:24<pumpernickel>blueskies there is, but somehow that doesn't work for me
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20:26<blueskies>pumpernickel: Same here, what the heck is going on. I did "journalctl -u gdm > output.txt" and then "pastebinit -i output.txt" and still got that http://paste.debian.net/ output even though output.txt is good
20:28<pumpernickel>blueskies I found probably the issue
20:28<blueskies>pumpernickel: "pastebinit -Ei output.txt" gives the same empty link, but outputs the content of output.txt to the standard output.
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20:29<pumpernickel>it's something with paste.debian.net. so if we use another one, it's just 'pastebinit -b paste.ubuntu.com -i output.txt
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20:30<pumpernickel>blueskies ^
20:31<blueskies>pumpernickel: Thanks! http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/vP7Ss4XvrG/
20:31<blueskies>pumpernickel: Sorry, was transcribing the link
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20:33<pumpernickel>blueskies no issues :) I thought you didn't see it
20:33<blueskies>pumpernickel: As you can maybe tell from the timestamps, only the first 6 lines of that paste were there before I started going back to Alt-F1
20:33<pumpernickel>could you see if there is an xorg.conf file in /etc/X11/
20:33<pumpernickel>or /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d
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20:35<blueskies>pumpernickel: Neither, though one of the things I tried before coming here was auto-creating one as per https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-desktop-74/xorg-problem-but-what-problem-4175627757/
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20:36<blueskies>pumpernickel: Not that it would necessarily be created correctly automatically if there are already problems with the default config?
20:37<blueskies>pumpernickel: I also tried installing "firmware-linux" in case there was anything missing there - no help. I can only get to this console at all by booting the "nomodeset" kernel option. Since it's an all-in-one machine, I also ran into this and tried what they suggested: http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=83765
20:38<pumpernickel>blueskies did you install firmware-linux with the non-free repo enabled?
20:38<blueskies>pumpernickel: yes
20:41<pumpernickel>blueskies the forums doesn't even load :/
20:42<blueskies>pumpernickel: linuxquestions and forums.debian.net just loaded for me.
20:42<pumpernickel>lq was fine, but debian.net is just timing out :/
20:44<blueskies>pumpernickel: keeps loading quickly for me. I saved the link from days ago, too, so it's not like it's cached here or something. (private browsing, too)
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20:44<blueskies>pumpernickel: haha, hang on, let me paste it into pastebin... :)
20:46<blueskies>seems somewhat readable, though not as good as the forum: http://paste.debian.net/1154433/
20:46<pumpernickel>is there another OS on that system?
20:46<blueskies>pumpernickel: Yes, Windows 10. It hasn't been booted since its partition was shrunk and debian was installed
20:47<pumpernickel>blueskies or rather, do we know 100% that it's a intel gpu? because I can remember that back in the day, intel used sometimes non intel gpus for atom stuff.
20:47<pumpernickel>but sounds like it should be as that SOC was introduced 2015
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20:48<pumpernickel>to see do 'lspci | grep VGA'
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20:49<pumpernickel>but yeah, looked into it, so it should be, but even intel ark is imho not clear on that
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20:51<pumpernickel>blueskies when you had lightdm installed, did you look also into the journalctl stuff?
20:51<blueskies>pumpernickel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/7PSHPmYHVW/
20:52<blueskies>pumpernickel: No, hadn't really gotten this far with troubleshooting, since I was hoping just installing with GNOME instead might help
20:53<pumpernickel>blueskies because I assume, there is some misconfiguration, so gdm can't find the display
20:54<blueskies>pumpernickel: The screen is a touchscreen, and while I prefer XFCE and haven't used GNOME in a long time, I figured it might be worth trying out for allegedly better(?) touchscreen support
20:54<blueskies>pumpernickel: Can we find logs to confirm that?
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20:55<blueskies>pumpernickel: It did seem to work about the same way, though, as far as getting stuck on a black screen. :) And I believe I tried nomodeset with the same-ish results I'm getting with gdm
20:55<blueskies>pumpernickel: as far as blackish screen with cursor and then being able to switch consoles
20:57<blueskies>pumpernickel: Is the "journalctl -u gdm" the extent of error logs for gdm? If it were having trouble finding a monitor, etc, would it be shown there, somewhere else, or nowhere? As far as you know?
20:57<pumpernickel>could you post the whole 'sudo cat /var/log/messages | pastebinit -b paste.ubuntu.com
20:58<blueskies>pumpernickel: I *am* suspicious that the monitor might be the problem, in that it's doubly weird in my mind, being all-in-one (system is Dell Inspiron 20 Model 3052 if you didn't see that earlier) and a touchscreen
20:58<pumpernickel>blueskies yeah I looked a little bit into it
20:58<pumpernickel>but as it's still a monitor in the first place ;)
21:00<blueskies>Yeah, seriously, I mean it worked fine for the text installer, worked fine for a 5-10 year old (probably?) Live CD, open source graphics, I don't know what to say!
21:01<blueskies>pumpernickel: That command is taking its sweet time, for whatever reason.
21:01<pumpernickel>blueskies it's probably a lot of output
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21:03<blueskies>pumpernickel: I can download a disc image faster! :)
21:04<pumpernickel>blueskies yeah that sounds a little bit weird now, if it's still not done
21:07<blueskies>pumpernickel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/QqjJSX4XKn/ Worked better when I just did -i /var/log/messages for some reason. pastebinit seems a bit buggy
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21:07<blueskies>pumpernickel: The one with cat piped in is still hung up
21:07<pumpernickel>blueskies hm, k
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21:12<pumpernickel>blueskies very interesting :)
21:13<blueskies>pumpernickel: Hopefully that's good?
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21:13<blueskies>pumpernickel: What is going on with lines 708-713 of that log? Those shouldn't even be from this boot, and it look like the timestamps agree with me?
21:14<blueskies>pumpernickel: Oh wait, is this multiple boots?
21:14<blueskies>pumpernickel: I assumed that cleared on reboot.
21:14<blueskies>pumpernickel: I'm used to dmesg
21:14<pumpernickel>blueskies no those are multiple boots
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21:15<blueskies>pumpernickel: Ok. You have me in so much suspense with the "interesting", by the way.
21:15<pumpernickel>so somehow xorg, has issues with interacting with your gpu
21:15<pumpernickel>so did you test out the backports kernel blueskies?
21:16<pumpernickel>so we can rule out the driver that's in 4.19
21:16<blueskies>pumpernickel: Well, that's definitely bad, but I'm definitely very pleased that we at least have a direction to look into now, rather than my random searches.
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21:16<blueskies>pumpernickel: That's a newer one, yes? No, I haven't. Happy to try, though, if you wouldn't mind giving me the command. I believe I have the backports repo enabled.
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21:17<pumpernickel>so first we need to enable the backports repo
21:17<blueskies>pumpernickel: This really is a fresh install. It was dont with the netinst image, so it should be rather updated, but since the install, all I've really done is fail to boot and install pastebinit
21:17<pumpernickel>if you look into /etc/apt/sources.list there should be a backports line, if not it should be
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21:18<pumpernickel>'deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ buster-backports main contrib non-free'
21:19<blueskies>I thought the installer asked me and that I said yes, but it doesn't seem to be in sources.list, so I may have misremembered and been thinking of non-free or something.
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21:21<pumpernickel>blueskies normally it should ask, maybe you didn't say it should enable
21:22<blueskies>pumpernickel: it's added now, in any event
21:22<pumpernickel>so after you added that line apt update and then after that 'sudo apt install -t buster-backports linux-image-amd64'
21:22<pumpernickel>blueskies and don't forget to remove the nomodeset if it was set permanentally ;)
21:24<blueskies>installing, and no, I've been adding the nomodeset every time, since hopefully it was only temporary... :)
21:24<pumpernickel>yeah just making sure
21:26<blueskies>pumpernickel: while installing, lots of warnings for "possible missing firmware" regarding i915, which I believe is the graphics. I definitely installed firmware-linux, but it might have been before reinstalling with GNOME. Should I install that, too?
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21:27<pumpernickel>blueskies wouldn't hurt to see if it's installed or not
21:27<pumpernickel>so just try to reinstall
21:28<sqrt{not}>blueskies, do you have non-free in your sources.list* ?
21:28<pumpernickel>he said yes sqrt{not}
21:29<blueskies>Yes, thanks
21:29<blueskies>And I'm getting firmware-linux-nonfree coming along for the ride
21:29<sqrt{not}>OK good
21:30<pumpernickel>blueskies if the reboot doesn't work (into gdm) could you post the messages again
21:30<blueskies>When installing this round, though, I"m still getting "possible missing firmware" warnings, though. Related to modules i915 and r8169
21:31<blueskies>pumpernickel: Okay, rebooting
21:31<pumpernickel>it shouldn't matter, apt is just pointing out that there could be missing firmware that affects your system.
21:33<blueskies>pumpernickel: Does it do that even if I just installed it? Or did I not just install it?
21:33<blueskies>pumpernickel: no luck on reboot, I'll boot back into nomodeset, hang on
21:33<pumpernickel>damn blueskies
21:34<pumpernickel>it does it when you installed it ;)
21:35<blueskies>i couldn't agree more
21:35<blueskies>I love debian, but it's always doing this crap to me. Usually the culprit is amd or nvidia graphics, and I thought I'd be home free with intel!!! :(
21:36<blueskies>How could it possibly not work? Not super cutting edge hardware, open drivers...
21:36<pumpernickel>blueskies imho, i am on an amd system and couldn't be more happy as also the drivers are open source
21:36<pumpernickel>blueskies that's a good question
21:36<pumpernickel>maybe some regression that wasn't found out
21:36<pumpernickel>or bug ;)
21:36<pumpernickel>rather
21:39<blueskies>Okay, all the same outputs?
21:39<pumpernickel>the messages should be the one that is needed ;) as it has everything in it
21:39<blueskies>Yay, thanks :)
21:39<blueskies>One sec
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21:41<blueskies>pumpernickel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/7f2KkcvQQC/
21:43<blueskies>pumpernickel: Oh yeah, all kinds of gdm3 junk in there, huh... Also, I looked it up and r8169 seems to be the (or at least a) network card, and i915 is something intel graphics
21:43<blueskies>pumpernickel: regarding the "possible missing firmware"
21:45<pumpernickel>blueskies welp, so at least in the logs, you always booted with nomodeset (no boot without it)
21:46<blueskies>pumpernickel: That seems strange. I mean, I do get a couple lines of output on the screen after grub before the screen goes black, even on the normal boot
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21:47<pumpernickel>blueskies could you edit the entry (while booting) (pressing e when you select which entry you want to boot) and make sure that the line with vmlinuz is without nomodeset
21:47<blueskies>pumpernickel: And I wouldn't think a graphics failure would be able to interrupt it so early.
21:48<blueskies>pumpernickel: It's not there by default, which is what I let boot, and for this current boot I had to add it. I'm certainly happy to confirm and retry, though.
21:48<pumpernickel>hm blueskies that's fine then
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21:49<pumpernickel>so just to see what's there could you post /var/log/Xorg.0.log
21:49<pumpernickel>but the weird part is, x is trying every single type of generic driver (as there is no specific intel one (because of nomodeset) and fails
21:50<blueskies>hang on, I was trying it again. it wasn't there, just "ro quiet". And I was semi-wrong about getting "a couple lines of output" since the only lines are loading the kernel and loading the initramfs
21:51<blueskies>pumpernickel: let me reboot back into nomodeset and I'll give you that in a minute
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21:51<pumpernickel>sure
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21:54<blueskies>pumpernickel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/3x3NV3DRVG/
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21:56<pumpernickel>blueskies so no more clues in that output than in /messages
21:57<blueskies>pumpernickel: :(
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22:00<pumpernickel>blueskies i will test sth out for a sec
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22:02<blueskies>blueskies: I truly don't get how it could possibly have so much trouble with this hardware when the installer and a very old livecd work for it. I mean, I'm pretty sure they just booted right up. Are you fairly sure we shouldn't look into the "possible missing firmware" angle to make sure it's not, in fact, missing?
22:02<blueskies>haha, i just @ed myself.
22:02<blueskies>pumpernickel: ^
22:03<annadane>!pal blueskies
22:03*dpkg points at blueskies and laughs
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22:03<blueskies>I accidentally @ myself!
22:03<pumpernickel>blueskies so one last try then, we can go figure out the firmware ;)
22:03<pumpernickel>'sudo Xorg -configure' blueskies
22:04<blueskies>pumpernickel: Hey, you are more knowledgeable than me and you're being kind enough to give me your time. We can seriously do whatever you want.
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22:06<pumpernickel>'sudo mv /root/xorg.conf.new /etc/X11/xorg.conf'
22:06<pumpernickel>'sudo systemctl isolate graphical.target'
22:07<blueskies>pumpernickel: Uh, yada yada yada "Configuration failed." yada yada yada. Want output?
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22:07<pumpernickel>sure blueskies
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22:10<blueskies>pumpernickel: D'oh. I'm not competent enough to get the output into pastebinit or a file. Hang on, I'll keep trying to figure it out.
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22:11<pumpernickel>blueskies it should be at the end of the command 2> file.txt
22:12<blueskies>pumpernickel: what does the 2> do? I tried >
22:13<pumpernickel>2 is the normal output, > redirects it to, and because you give it a file, it creates a file with that content of 2 :)
22:13<pumpernickel>there is also error output etc ;)
22:14<sarnold>1 is stdout, 2 is stderr
22:15<pumpernickel>ahh almost right xD
22:15<blueskies>Ah, okay, I maybe get that. Thanks again sarnold
22:16<blueskies>pumpernickel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/SvMSZvbscN/
22:18<pumpernickel>blueskies could you again pastebinit the new /var/log/Xorg.0.log
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22:18<blueskies>sarnold: Is there a good way to know if what I'm seeing on my screen is from stdout or stderr? Or a catch-all command that would just lob whatever is being put onto my terminal as a result of my command into a file?
22:19<blueskies>pumpernickel: Sure, one sec. Do you by any chance want the xorg.conf.new, too? it did create one, apparently
22:19<sarnold>blueskies: the 'script' command is a bit like that last thing, but be warned that it logs *everything* -- passwords, backspaces, etc.
22:20<pumpernickel>blueskies yes would be nice
22:20<sarnold>there's no good way to 'know' what comes from stdout and what comes from stderr except by redirecting them -- you'll get a feeling for which tools emit what messages to which location, but it's less standard than you'd like
22:22<blueskies>pumpernickel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/rczc3Jd8wh/
22:23<blueskies>pumpernickel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/YKPhNrkyck/
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22:24<blueskies>sarnold: So the old "take a guess" method is the "official" method, huh? Weird. And thanks!
22:25<pumpernickel>blueskies, so I guess I know what happens, but I have no idea about how to fix it
22:25<blueskies>pumpernickel: hit me
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22:26<pumpernickel>blueskies afait, X sees multiple screens (probably your touchscreen oO), and that's why X configures the display wrong. But honestly no idea how the config should look like to fix it
22:26<sarnold>blueskies: if you're good at guessing, it's not bad :) but "try it and find out" is more reliable
22:27<pumpernickel>blueskies especially the last section of the /xorg.conf.new tells alot about what X thinks it should look like (in comparison how it really is)
22:27<blueskies>pumpernickel: would it be possible to boot the live cd that worked, run xorg -configure on there, and copy the xorg.conf to the real installation? Since apparently the live cd has a better idea what's going on? Or is that not likely to work either?
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22:28<pumpernickel>blueskies well, what Live cd/usb are we talking about? I guess it really depends (as the structure could be different (for the conf))
22:29<blueskies>sarnold: Potato potahto! :) But meanwhile I have to try to remember "2>" is gonna be the thing in weird cases I run into even less than needing to redirect stdout to a file!
22:29<sqrt{not}>you might try using the live CD calamares installer, which should install whatever is running,
22:29<blueskies>pumpernickel: Some mint one, I think? Hang on, I can check
22:29<sqrt{not}>!calamares
22:29<dpkg>Starting in Debian 10 Buster, the Calamares installer is included in the debian-live boot images. The (somewhat unreliable?) normal installer is also included, as one of the choices in the first menu after boot. Once in the live system look for an Install Debian icon, or type: sudo calamares See https://jonathancarter.org/2019/10/17/calamares-plans-for-debian-11/ and https://averagelinuxuser.com/debian-10-calamares/
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22:29<sqrt{not}>oh, OK, never mind, I thought we were talking about a debian live cd
22:30<blueskies>sqrt{not}: I used the netinst cd, which did boot fine, but is the text installer, so I'm not positive how well it could figure out my graphics situation, really
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22:32<blueskies>pumpernickel: Linux Mint 18.1 - I'm looking for a decent link to versions, etc
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22:33<pumpernickel>blueskies at least the image is not too old ;)
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22:34<pumpernickel>blueskies I thought you would now present a stick from 2010-2012 :p
22:34<blueskies>pumpernickel: Yeah, I must have downloaded a new one more recently than I thought. There's also I chance I used an older Ubuntu CD. I can try to boot if we're done with output from the install for the time being.
22:35<blueskies>pumpernickel: But at the moment, do we think the "correct" xorg.conf will get things working?
22:35<blueskies>pumpernickel: I mean, I could always try newer and older livecd's if the method is somewhat sound
22:35<pumpernickel>blueskies yes
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22:38<blueskies>pumpernickel: Oh man, it might have actually been the ubuntu 12.04 livecd that was also sitting by it. In fact, the more I think about it, the more likely that is.
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22:39<blueskies>pumpernickel: and I'm stuck in black screen on the mint thumb drive, though I'm inclined to give it a minute since it's a live image
22:40<pumpernickel>blueskies sure, let's see. if it's 12.04, I don't know how much I can help :/
22:42<blueskies>pumpernickel: Well, it can't really hurt to try the xorg.conf, right? I mean worst case is no boot and remove it again from the command line, right? Or maybe I should see what it does for xorg.conf and attempt to hand-move the settings to the file I pasted you to try to maintain any new formatting?
22:44<blueskies>pumpernickel: Is it good or bad that the disc would probably be older than the system? Would it be simply detecting the monitor or whatever in a basic way that works, or is it probably a bad default way that doesn't properly account for the correct drivers, etc which didn't exist then but might need to be used now?
22:44<pumpernickel>blueskies one or the other :). but as it is a live image, I don't know if the config file is laying around on the image :/
22:45<blueskies>pumpernickel: If it's not, I could maybe just -configure it, right?
22:46<pumpernickel>blueskies no, as xorg is running, and it need to be shut off ;)
22:46<blueskies>pumpernickel: Oh geez, or maybe it's before that became an option. I don't remember those days too technically.
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22:47<pumpernickel>blueskies back then I used linux, but I had no idea what I was doing xD
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22:49<blueskies>pumpernickel: Fair to say that's where I'm at, though I've been using Linux for a long time now. It's just that I get enough of a superficial understanding to scrape by, and then it all gets pulled from underneath me over time (*cough* systemd *cough*)
22:52<pumpernickel>blueskies at least for me it was easy in the beginning (that was around 2000), then because I kinda lost interest in linux (games) it got really hard (but since I am on 100% linux (since 13-14) it's getting easier after reaching a certain understanding of how basic linux works. and systemd is just a new way to interact with it (and imho not that
22:52<pumpernickel>too different to the old system)
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22:57<blueskies>pumpernickel: Still working on booting that Live CD to try to see what's up. First time failed due to (reading between the lines) 8-year-old CDR. :) Seems to be getting there this time. I'll check /etc/X11/ first.
22:58<pumpernickel>blueskies let's hope :)
22:58<binaryhermit>...ubuntu 12.04? *shudder*
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22:59<binaryhermit>the idea of using software that's been EoL for... 3+ years at this point?
23:00<pumpernickel>btw 12.04 is still supported by canonical :P
23:00<pumpernickel>binaryhermit ^
23:00<binaryhermit>...not that anyone asked me, but I'd be very careful putting something that old on the internet
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23:00<binaryhermit>pumpernickel: when did people not paying a ridiculous amount of money for security updates last get security updates for 12.04?
23:01<sarnold>heh, it's been *one* company getting 12.04 updates for more than a year at this point..
23:01<blueskies>binaryhermit: Not installing. I was only using it for checking the hard drive, etc. I grabbed the closest Live CD and used the SMART tools, etc. I dont' think I even had the network cable plugged in at the time. But it did make the graphics work, which seems to be a problem with newer images for whatever reason.
23:01<binaryhermit>ahh, you're fine, then
23:02<binaryhermit>Sorry, I've kinda been a jerk online recently
23:02<pumpernickel>binaryhermit idk about you, but what do you define as ridiculous money?
23:02<blueskies>binaryhermit: Haha, no problem. I appreciate the warning.
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23:03<binaryhermit>pumpernickel: I somehow thought it was more https://ubuntu.com/advantage
23:03<pumpernickel>binaryhermit: destop $25, virtual server $75, server $225
23:03<binaryhermit>and it seems it's free for 14.04 for up to 5 machines
23:03<binaryhermit>mea culpa
23:03<blueskies>pumpernickel: Anyway, no /etc/X11/xorg.conf I'll look around a little and see if I can stumble onto anything helpful.
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23:03<pumpernickel>and on top of that you even get livepatches for the kernel ;)
23:04<pumpernickel>blueskies sure
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23:04<pumpernickel>blueskies i'll be back in about 20 mins.
23:05<blueskies>pumpernickel: okay, thanks for all the help so far!
23:05<binaryhermit>livepatching the kernel's not really that important to me, but I see the allure
23:05<binaryhermit>anyway, this is probably a bit too offtopic for here, which is my fault
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23:18<pumpernickel>blueskies so found anything? ^^
23:20<blueskies>pumpernickel: no, not yet. and I accidentally locked myself out of the session by trying Alt Ctrl F1 and getting to a graphical login (and I don't know the login credentials for the livecd). So I'm rebooting. Almost back up.
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23:22<blueskies>pumpernickel: Meanwhile, I'm trying to look up if there's a good way to output xorg's running config. You were right about it not letting me -configure while it was running, by the way. I was trying to get to another console so maybe I could kill X and try to -configure from there.
23:23<blueskies>And I locked myself out. I think Ubuntu runs (or at least used to) in F7, and it wouldn't let me go back to that one. All the other ones were graphical logins
23:23<pumpernickel>blueskies yeah, the old X was using F7
23:24<blueskies>See, more stuff I used to have some idea about! :)
23:25<blueskies>pumpernickel: Okay, so what did you mean by "especially the last section of the /xorg.conf.new tells alot about what X thinks it should look like (in comparison how it really is)"?
23:26<pumpernickel>blueskies so after browsing a little bit, it should maybe look like a little bit like that https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/vJ4twdXZVj/
23:26<pumpernickel>and now compare it to yours :)
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23:29<blueskies>pumpernickel: Okay, so even after -configure, the only entries should be variations from what it was already doing by default? Or something like that?
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23:31<blueskies>Not a full-on explicit description of the correct config?
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23:31<pumpernickel>blueskies yeah, I mean your xorg.conf has like 6 display entries with all of them having no 'size' as in pixels
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23:32<pumpernickel>blueskies but honestly I am not 100% sure if it would even fix that, as there has to be a reason why he can't figure out how big the screen is.
23:33<blueskies>Hm.
23:33<aloo_shu>afaik, what Xorg is putting into xorg.conf when using -configure, is _not_ identical to, and may be far from, what it is guessing for itself when running without a conf file
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23:34<pumpernickel>aloo_shu so we would need to write our own conf file?
23:35<aloo_shu>it just means it's become more difficult to find out what works
23:37<pumpernickel>ugh, kk thanks aloo_shu
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23:39<blueskies>aloo_shu: Any idea how to tell what it IS guessing when running without a conf file? I have a system that's not working with a fresh Buster install, and it seems like the monitor config might be to blame. I can get an old Ubuntu Live CD (12.04) to work. Is there any way to tell what those settings are in order to *try* to translate those over to an xorg.conf in the Buster installation?
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23:42<aloo_shu>if you find out, tell me
23:43<blueskies>:)
23:52<pumpernickel>blueskies if you still want to test (at some point) the firmware files https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/ZrHdmdjTWR/ here is a short paste (3 commands) what to do ;)
23:53<blueskies>pumpernickel: Do you know if there's a way to kill x in a live cd so that I could run Xorg -configure? According to https://www.dell.com/support/home/en-us/drivers/supportedos/inspiron-20-3052-aio , the system "supports" Ubuntu 14.04, which would at least be slightly more modern?
23:53<blueskies>pumpernickel: Certainly, if you think it's worth trying.
23:55<pumpernickel>Blueskies imho I don’t think so, but why not testing it, it should be a quick test (maybe 5-10 mins)
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23:57<pumpernickel>There should be a command xkill -a (the a for killing all x processes)
23:59<aloo_shu>you could try get a different virtual console first, with ctrl+alt+F4 for example
23:59<blueskies>pumpernickel: Okay, working on the firmware
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23:59<blueskies>Yeah, that's what I was wondering, where do I need to get to first so I don't kill everything out from under me? Or would it drop me to a console?
---Logclosed Tue Jun 30 00:00:06 2020