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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-01-18

---Logopened Mon Jan 18 00:00:12 2021
---Daychanged Mon Jan 18 2021
00:00-!-Jad [~Nashmi@0002ae6d.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
00:00-!-Jad is "Jad Madi" on #tor-project #suckless #packaging #debian-xfce #debian-social #debian-rant #debian-nonupload #debian-i18n #debian-gitlab #debconf-fosdem #bash-completion #bash #debian-devel-changes #debian-apt #debian-privacy #debian-desktop #debian-dpkg #debian-gnupg #debian-academy #debian-next #debian-offtopic #debian
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00:01-!-jm_ is "." on #debian
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00:02-!-simonpatapon is "Simon Patapon" on #buddhism #debian-next #oftc #debian #bitlbee
00:12-!-mallio [~rasmus@c83-253-223-217.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #debian
00:12-!-mallio is "Rasmus Mattsson Kallio" on #debian-next #debian
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00:17-!-phorce1_ is "Gerald" on #debian
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00:29-!-preview_ is "preview" on #debian
00:31-!-Volk [~Volk@a95-94-47-32.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Quit: See you next time!]
00:31-!-Strelnikov is now known as Guest10728
00:31-!-strelnikov [~strelniko@h-4-70-21.A785.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #debian
00:31-!-strelnikov is "strelnikov" on #tor-south #tor-project #tor-mobile #tor-l10n #tor-dev #tor-bots #debian #dfri_se
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00:38-!-rootkea is "rootkea" on #debian
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00:39-!-Gerowen is "Marcus" on #debian-offtopic #debian
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00:52-!-jj5_ is "jj5" on #debian-next #freedombox-ci #freedombox-dev #debian-raspberrypi #freedombox #debian
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01:17-!-lonewulf` is "U-lonewulf-PC\lonewulf" on #linode #debian-offtopic #debian #oftc
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01:25-!-phorce1 is "Gerald" on #debian
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01:26-!-Gerowen is "Marcus" on #debian-offtopic #debian
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01:30-!-thrill_seeker is "thrill_seeker" on #debian-next #debian-es #debian
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01:32-!-Javi is "Javier" on #debian #debian-es
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01:50-!-arunpyasi is "realname" on #debian-deepin #debian #debian-lts #debian-meeting #debian-ubuntu #minidebconf-online #packaging
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01:54-!-preview_ is "preview" on #debian
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01:54-!-dust is "dust" on #debian #debian-next
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01:56-!-computer2 is "Your Name" on #debian
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02:07-!-dust is "dust" on #debian #debian-next
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02:09-!-FelixActually is "Felix" on #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian-kde #debian
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02:15-!-e-baley is "e-baley" on #debian-next #debian-offtopic #debian
02:21-!-GirL24 [~ilanekle@95.70.244.154] has joined #debian
02:21-!-GirL24 is " \xA9 Www.Kelebek.Org \xA9 " on #debian #mobian
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02:24<GirL24>http://www.ilanekle.xyz my photo look pls
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02:33-!-jar-el [~jar-el@145-132-134-198.fixed.kpn.net] has joined #debian
02:33-!-jar-el is "realname" on #debian
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02:45-!-preview is "preview" on #debian
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02:46-!-nu-c is "realname" on #debian
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02:46-!-godzilla is "致良郭" on #debian #help #tor-bots #linux #mm #oftc
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03:03<slava>he to all
03:03<slava>Hello
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03:14-!-skitt is "Stephen Kitt" on #debian
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03:21-!-Haudegen is "AP,,," on #security #debian-next #debian.or.at #debian
03:23-!-twb [~twb@2403-5800-3200-8300--a92.ip6.aussiebb.net] has joined #debian
03:23-!-twb is "Trent W. Buck" on #debian #debian-au
03:23<twb>Dumb question: does zfs-dkms break secure boot?
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03:25-!-rnm is "rnm" on @#fedora-python @#fedora-apps @#fedora-mindshare @#rockylinux-devel @#rockylinux @#fedora-test-day @#fedora-council #freenode @#ubuntu-my @#ubuntu-meeting #ubuntu @#spring #python @#mambang #lineageos @#laravel @#kde @#hexchat @#fedora-qa @#fedora-meeting @#fedora-kde @#fedora-devel @#fedora #debian @##coronavirus
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03:28-!-mambang is "rnm" on #debian
03:31<mambang> debian wsl on windows are based on which release?
03:33<twb>mambang: the version I installed in the MS store was Debian 9, but that was back when it was stable
03:33<twb>mambang: I'm not sure how to make a second instance so I can't check a fresh install
03:33<mambang>I saw the screenshot also is debian 9
03:33<twb>You can always upgrade in-place
03:33<petn-randall>mambang: According to https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/debian/9msvkqc78pk6?activetab=pivot:overviewtab it's 10.5.
03:34<twb>Since it's just the userland and ntoskrnl is providing the kernel
03:34<twb>petn-randall: thanks
03:35-!-Texou [~jp@000178ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
03:35-!-Texou is "Stoicien" on #debian-nonupload #debian-i18n #bitlbee #debian-next #debian #debian-es #debian-devel-es #debian-devel-it #debian-l10n-fr #debian-a11y
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03:47-!-towo^work is "Torsten -towo- Wohlfarth" on #kernelnewbies #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian #aptosid
03:48-!-mode/#debian [+l 730] by debhelper
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03:53-!-bpsecret is "bpsecret" on #tor-south #tor-project #tor-l10n #tor-dev #tor-bots #subgraph #rust #redditprivacy #kandoo-iran #debian-next #debian #alpine-linux
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03:57-!-chele is "chele" on #debian-next #debian
04:05<mambang>great. thanks
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04:27-!-Fraggle2 is "Christian Britz" on #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian
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04:54-!-brunoramos_ is "ZNC - https://znc.in" on #debian-xfce #packaging #oftc #help #debian-perl #debian-next #debian
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04:56<twb>boy GUI debian sure does take a lot longer to install
04:57<petn-randall>twb: Have you tried girl GUI debian?
04:57<twb>eyeroll
04:58*petn-randall badum tss
04:58<FelixActually>Have you tried buoy Debian?
04:58-!-nt1036 [~nt1036@0002a5f6.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
04:59<twb>Adding live-tasks-gnome makes the install go from 2.5 minutes to, like, 45
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04:59-!-rs200972382 is "Rudra Saraswat" on #debian
05:00<m>greeting debian 10.7 buster Cinnamon. find IBUS and Fcitx (when search find both used for input method). can i remove IBUS? or by other meaning why both was installed?
05:00<twb>m: do you know which input method you use?
05:01<twb>m: you can try "aptitude why fcitx"
05:02<m>both are active but when i quite the IBUS every thing is ok
05:02-!-shiki [~sevu@x4dbf8a81.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #debian
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05:03<m>so it's ok to remove IBUS?
05:03<twb>I guess you can try it and see what happens
05:04<m>thanks a lot for you, best wiches
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05:13<twb>aaaand the compile just crashed due to lack of space :-(
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06:24<Lantizia_>curiosity has got me wondering ... any ideas why sarge wasn't debian 4?
06:25<Lantizia_>i mean, it'd been 3 years since woody... double the number of packages... kernel 2.4 instead of 2.2
06:25<Lantizia_>but it was versioned 3.1
06:25<azeem>Debian was way more conservative with major version changes back then
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06:25<azeem>1.x to 2.0 was the libc->glibc migration i think
06:26<azeem>don't remember what 3.0 was, I think it was some contrived change already
06:26<Lantizia_>3 made sense... especially with a kernel jump of 2.0 to 2.2 (from debian 2.x)
06:26<Lantizia_>but yeah 1.x and 2.x debian - they could have been 1 version
06:26<Lantizia_>with minor revisions
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06:32<ach>sarge in gave already on magazine's dvd's
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06:36<azeem>Lantizia_: a kernel jump isn't really a major thing, compared to a glibc jump
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06:55<Guest10748>IDENTIFY
06:55<Guest10748>what
06:57<Guest10748>huh how am i supposed to register myself?
06:58<bremner>Guest10748: #oftc is the place for network help. Probably "/query nickserv" is a good start
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06:59<Guest10748>oh ok
06:59<Guest10748>thanks
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07:05<zeev>Hello, how can I block/allow specific subprocesses being launched by a process? Here is the full background: https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/627071/block-allow-specific-subprocesses-being-launched-by-a-process . Thank you very much!
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07:09<jm_>zeev: apparmor can do that
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07:10<zeev>jm_: thank you! is there an example on how to do that? has somebody tried to limit zoom specifically?
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07:13<hans_>halllo
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07:14<jm_>zeev: maybe try searching the web, I found some useful links quickly: https://debian-handbook.info/browse/stable/sect.apparmor.html https://www.secjuice.com/apparmor-say-goodbye-to-remote-command-execution/
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07:15<zeev>thank you!
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07:15<skynet_>hello
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07:15<skynet_>can you guys see my message? this verification stuff has made me a bit dizzy
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07:17<jm_>skynet_: yes we can
07:17<skynet_>ok thanks a lot
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07:22<zeev>jm_: here is what I have found, looks like related specifically to zoom: https://ar.al/2020/06/25/how-to-use-the-zoom-malware-safely-on-linux-if-you-absolutely-have-to/
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07:23<zeev>jm_: do I also need the firejail as mentioned there or is apparmor enough?
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07:23<skynet_>well firejail is like a sandbox
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07:24<skynet_>if you're going to do something dangerous well firejail is adviced
07:24<zeev>no, nothing dangerous, just limiting browser from being launched by zoom
07:24<zeev>that's it.
07:24<zeev>maybe disabling zoom's chat (if possible)
07:24<Fraggle2>I read in this channel that firejail is insecure itself.
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07:27<jm_>zeev: you don't need firejail
07:27<zeev>thank you1
07:27<zeev>!
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07:30<skynet_>yeah probably firejail isn't needed if its just like zoom
07:30<skynet_>i thought you were trying to launch Tor or something
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07:41<twb>you don't need to worry about zoom security because there isn't any
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07:42<twb>https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2020/04/security_and_pr_1.html
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07:43<twb>"[...] using ECB mode indicates that there is no one at [Zoom] who knows anything about cryptography."
07:44<twb>I have had reasonably good results with jitsi, though I do not run my own server
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07:51<skynet_>lmaow
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07:51<skynet_>yeah
07:51<skynet_>zoom is really insecure
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07:51-!-znalo is "Ambrose Andrews" on #debian #freedombox
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07:52<skynet_>lol
07:52<skynet_>i wonder how zoom has such good business
07:52<twb>I also *really* don't get why people always use the greenscreen feature
07:52<skynet_>well i dont even turn on my cam lmaow
07:53<twb>It looks awful, so I can only assume they have an even more embarrassing poster on their wall
07:53<skynet_>probably some *ahem* posters
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07:57-!-znalo is "Ambrose Andrews" on #debian #freedombox
07:58-!-mode/#debian [+l 742] by debhelper
07:58<skynet_>eh sorry i disconnected and connected a couple of times
07:58<skynet_>hexchat has had me crazy lol
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07:58-!-Haudegen is "AP,,," on #debian-next #debian.or.at #security #debian
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08:02-!-bamdad is "bamdad" on #oftc #debian-next #debian #Qubes_OS #publiclab
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08:03-!-a is "realname" on #debian
08:03<a>h
08:03<skynet_>hello @a
08:03<a>hello
08:03<a>im adnan rahman from asia
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08:04<skynet_>new to debian?
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08:05-!-galex-713 is "Alexandre François Garreau,,," on #debian
08:05<skynet_>yep me too im from Asia but well Southeast Asia
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08:06-!-rnm[m] is "@mambang:matrix.org" on #debian
08:06<rnm[m]>I am from asia to. To be precise, from Malaysia
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08:07<skynet_>ay same country
08:07<skynet_>im from penang
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08:08<rnm[m]>Johor here. I am new with debian
08:09-!-YuGiOhJCJ [~YuGiOhJCJ@00021b1f.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
08:09<skynet_>ah I've been using debian for nearly 2 years lol
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08:13<blast007>!chat
08:13<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic (either freenode or oftc) or #moocows on irc.oftc.net, ##chat on irc.freenode.net, or search for a chat topic of your choice at https://netsplit.de/channels/
08:14<skynet_>sorry
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08:18<skynet_>wait dpkg where is ##chat
08:19<FelixActually>irc.freenode.net
08:20<skynet_>so this server is called irc.debian.net right?
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08:20<skynet_>irc.debian.org* sorry
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08:21<FelixActually>It's irc.oftc.net actually, irc.debian.org is a redirect to it
08:21<skynet_>oh i see
08:21<skynet_>then what is irc.freenode.net then
08:21<FelixActually>Another network
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09:44<livacious>For the people who don't know: Someone really clever figured out how to modify mmwave to see what people were typing through walls and capture passwords http://dev.ti.com/tirex/explore/node?node=AB64dFbicd2BPc23jvVjcg__VLyFKFf__LATEST
09:44<torify>!chat
09:44<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic (either freenode or oftc) or #moocows on irc.oftc.net, ##chat on irc.freenode.net, or search for a chat topic of your choice at https://netsplit.de/channels/
09:44<livacious>https://arbabianlab.stanford.edu/research/radar
09:44<torify>!say
09:45<livacious>The base implementation allows you to see through walls and capture passwords. I saw a demo of this in NYC and the person who demoed it was told not to release the source code.
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09:46<livacious>For anyone who knows someone with the right expertise you may want to consider radio communication monitoring as part of security in the future
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09:47<livacious>It's going to be the only way to make sure your passwords aren't compromised
09:47<twb>FelixActually: FYI "Freenode" and "OFTC" are IRC networks; irc.debian.org is an alias for OFTC. Most official Debian channels are on OFTC, but a few are still on Freenode.
09:47<FelixActually>Yeah, I know :)
09:48<jar-el>what does OFTC mean?
09:48<bremner>what official channels are on freenode?
09:48<mendel_munkis>Open and Free Technology Community
09:49<livacious>Both NIST and NSA were warned this is a real thing
09:49<jar-el>indeed...just saw it
09:49<jar-el>thanks
09:49<FelixActually>First two words are redundant... but oh well :(
09:49<livacious>THey hav yet to comment
09:49<mendel_munkis>and forward secrecy is a thing for a reason.
09:49<twb>bremner: maybe none now, but last time I looked some of the debian-xx language channels
09:49<jar-el>and not spied on by big tech companies
09:50<twb>bremner: /msg alis list #debian* -min 50 ===> only gives #debian-fr
09:50<bremner>livacious: please take this elsewhere
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09:51<bremner>!chat
09:51<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic (either freenode or oftc) or #moocows on irc.oftc.net, ##chat on irc.freenode.net, or search for a chat topic of your choice at https://netsplit.de/channels/
09:51<twb>livacious: are you asking how to harden a Debian system against tempest and backscatter xray wardriving?
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09:52<livacious>twb: I don't know what that is :-)
09:53<livacious>https://web.stanford.edu/~skatti/pubs/nsdi15-wideo.pdf
09:54<twb>livacious: talk to your sigint agency about physical hardening options. There's not really anything that can be done in software, except security-through-obscurity (e.g. replacing your LCD with a braille display)
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09:56<twb>livacious: it looks like you're in Eastern USA, so that would probably be https://cybercom.mil or https://nsa.gov
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10:09<livacious>Thanks twb
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11:32<Fraggle2>Nik05_: please fix your connection
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11:37<Mr_didsomething>Hi! Need some help with Debian. I, just a few minutes ago, installed gnome and I launched it and played around with it for a few minutes then I wanted to switch back to my regular desktop environment (XFCE) but now when I try to log into that it just gives me a frozen grey screen
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11:41<Mr_didsomething>Anyone?
11:41<twb>Mr_didsomething: did you already try a simple reboot?
11:42<twb>Did you look at the log of the install and see if anything was UNinstalled?
11:43<Mr_didsomething>Rebooted multiple times and tried accessing the virtual terminal window (CTRL + ALT + F5) to try and uninstall gnome (sudo apt remove —purge gnome) but it just returns with “package gnome does not exist”
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11:43-!-debalance is "Philipp Huebner" on #debian #debian-devel-changes
11:45<twb>this all happened after 7AM your time?
11:45<twb>git diff --color -U10 /var/lib/dpkg/status /var/lib/dpkg/status-old
11:45<Mr_didsomething>What? It’s 17:45 for me.
11:46<Mr_didsomething>Should I try that?
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11:46<twb>yes
11:46<twb>status-old is created around 6:30AM
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11:48<Mr_didsomething>Ah thanks will try it. Also have Timeshift installed in case that might help? Discovered quite quickly that I didn’t like gnome and now I just want to get rid of it
11:50<Mr_didsomething>I also deleted the login display for gnome gdm4 or something and managed to restore lightdm
11:50<twb>good
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11:51<twb>my approach here is to look for either important packages being removed since yesterday, or for new errors in your error logs
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11:52<twb>GUIs are full of errors so the latter is usually harder, because there's usually a zillion errors even when it is "working"
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11:53<Mr_didsomething>Well if nothing works I’ll just reinstall Debian because it’s not really that big of a deal since I’ve not saved anything important on it. Plus I read somewhere that it’ll be hard to track down every gnome package that got installed but is it still possible?
11:56<twb>Mr_didsomething: well that diff will tell you
11:56<twb>Mr_didsomething: as long as you run it before tomorrow
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11:57<Mr_didsomething>Will do. What do i do after I’ve run that command?
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11:57<twb>read the output?
11:58<Mr_didsomething>And then? *cough* *cough*noob here *cough* *cough*
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11:59<twb>OK so those that's comparing the text in two files
11:59<twb>Those two files are "what is installed right now?" and "what is installed at 7AM this morning?"
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11:59<twb>so the difference will tell you what has been installed/removed
11:59<twb>In principle if you reduce that difference to zero you should be pretty close to fixed
12:00<Mr_didsomething>And What command do I run to restore the morning one?
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12:06<Mr_didsomething>?
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12:07<FelixActually>Mr_didsomething: If you uninstall all the packages listed in the diff (or at least the ones relating to GNOME) then it may solve the issue
12:07<Mr_didsomething>My bad I accidentally quit oftc
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12:10<stiltz>hello - first time using IRC
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12:10<FelixActually>Stay a while; stay forever :)
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12:11<stiltz>it seemed pretty straightforward to setup. I am using IRSSI - is this a preferred client?
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12:12<FelixActually>Whatever you're comfortable with is fine, as long as it respects your freedom, which according to Wikipedia that one does :)
12:12<twb>irssi is very popular
12:12<twb>last time I actually crunched numbers it was #1 at about 30% of users
12:13<stiltz>Thanks Felix & Twb. I have installed OTR and used the "/load otr
12:13<stiltz>"
12:14<stiltz>exit
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12:15<twb>Might prefer something more modern like pidgin/finch if you want OTR
12:16<Mr_didsomething>So just to make it clear to myself: Open the virtual terminal before logging in, type in that long command, view all the recently installed programs (the gnome stuff) then just sudo apt remove —purge (all the listed things)?
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12:17<FelixActually>Yeah, just make absolutely sure you only remove GNOME stuff
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12:18<Mr_didsomething>Wonder what other things it might list since I’ve only downloaded gnome and nothing else after that
12:18<FelixActually>No idea, just a precautionary mention :)
12:19<FelixActually>Also did you type a hyphen before purge there or an em dash? For me it's displaying as an em dash and I'm not sure why, this has happened before
12:19<Mr_didsomething> No idea what an “em dash” is
12:19<FelixActually>
12:20<twb>FelixActually: its a dash the length of an em box
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12:20<Mr_didsomething>I might know the symbols but not the names. Oh yeah I always but —before purge
12:20<twb>Sorry that was for Mr_didsomething
12:20<FelixActually>- or —?
12:21<blast007>given they just used the fancy quotes, it's probably their client doing it to text they send
12:21<Mr_didsomething>Double -
12:21<FelixActually>--
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12:21<FelixActually>Maybe Konversation turns double hyphens by other people into em dashes? I have no idea
12:21<Mr_didsomething>Yes --
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12:22<FelixActually>This is very confusing but oh well :)
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12:22<Mr_didsomething>I always do -- when purging
12:23<FelixActually>In your original message it displayed as —purge for me so I don't really get what's going on there
12:23<FelixActually>I'm pretty sure it's my client but it's not doing it all the time
12:23<Mr_didsomething>Might be because I’m writing this in my phone
12:24<FelixActually>Maybe, I have no idea
12:24<FelixActually>Anyway, don't let me distract you any longer with my nonsense :)
12:24<Mr_didsomething>Np ^^
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12:36<Mr_didsomething>Is there any way i might restore it with timeshift? I got a snapshot from this mornin
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12:37<Mr_didsomething>Can I use that via virtual terminal?
12:37<Blohsh>i installed Debian lxte on a notebook hdd, it worked ok, but after 2nd reboot it says no boot parition found
12:37<Blohsh>partition*
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12:38<FelixActually>Mr_didsomething: Type man timeshift
12:38<FelixActually>Blohsh: Is GRUB showing up?
12:39<Blohsh>yes
12:39<Blohsh>i dont really remember but i think yes i saw grub
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12:40<FelixActually>Did you select the right option?
12:40<Mr_didsomething>Man timeshift then?
12:40<Blohsh>yup
12:41<FelixActually>Mr_didsomething: Read the manual page for it to see what the command would be to do the restore
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12:42<Blohsh>FelixActually: i will test again and make a video of it and show
12:42<FelixActually>Blohsh: How did you install Debian?
12:42<FelixActually>Was it a live USB/CD?
12:42<Blohsh>yup
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12:43<FelixActually>You could boot from that and verify the partitions of the hard drive with a partition manager
12:43<Blohsh>after install it said to restart i restart it worked and then on reboot it gives grub not found
12:43<Blohsh>boot* drive not found*
12:44<FelixActually>Maybe it's a hard drive failure?
12:44<Blohsh>could be
12:44<FelixActually>Did you select the correct boot device in your BIOS?
12:44<Blohsh>yup
12:44<Blohsh>is there any way to get rid of hdd failure?
12:44<Blohsh>i mean making many partitions
12:44<Blohsh>or making more swap and small partition of debian
12:44<Blohsh>it is of 250gb
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12:46<FelixActually>What do you mean?
12:46<Blohsh>it is a old hdd
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12:47<sney>sounds like "partitioning around bad sectors"
12:47<Blohsh>yup
12:47<sney>which, yes, but you're still on borrowed time
12:47<FelixActually>If it's failing then you can't really do much except replace it unfortunately
12:47<imMute>sney: dont filesystems deal with bad sectors already?
12:47<Blohsh>partition aroun bad sectors
12:47<Blohsh>thats the issue maybe
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12:48<sney>imMute: yeah it's more automatic than it once was, but if you know there's a nonfunctioning part of the disk, you can skip using it entirely
12:48<sney>it's not really a solution to anything though. it's like... a temporary jury-rig to get you through the week until the new disk arrives
12:49<sney>it's how you fix the computer you need to make a satellite phone call when you're trapped in the jungle.
12:49<Blohsh>it is having reallocated sectors count error
12:49<sney>if this doesn't describe you, buy a new disk. :P
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12:49<Blohsh>with raw value of 99 .-.
12:49<imMute>sney: also, don't most disks these days remap things anyway?
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12:50<sney>SSDs sure. I'm not aware of spinning rust having that ability.
12:50<ottavio>Is linux-image-4.19 newer than 4.9.0-14-amd64 ?
12:50<sney>yes
12:50<sney>4.19 is newer than 4.9
12:51<ottavio>I though so but I wanted to be sure
12:51<ottavio>Is that the most bleeding edge I can install on oldstable?
12:51<sney>,kernels
12:51<judd>Available kernel versions are: experimental: 5.10.0-trunk-686 (5.10.2-1~exp1); sid: 5.10.0-1-686 (5.10.5-1); bullseye: 5.10.0-1-686 (5.10.4-1); buster-backports: 5.9.0-0.bpo.5-686-pae (5.9.15-1~bpo10+1); buster: 4.19.0-13-686-pae (4.19.160-2); stretch-backports: 4.19.0-0.bpo.9-686-pae (4.19.118-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1); stretch: 4.19.0-0.bpo.13-686 (4.19.160-2~deb9u1); jessie-backports:
12:51<judd>4.9.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1~bpo8+1); jessie: 4.9.0-0.bpo.12-686 (4.9.210-1+deb9u1~deb8u1)
12:52<sney>from compatible debian sources, yes
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12:52<ottavio>cool
12:52-!-lkusiek [~lkusiek@2a00:f41:58f1:f4e4:8f50:f4fc:f967:f5f5] has quit []
12:52<ottavio>So why have I got 4.9.0-14-amd64 ?
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12:53<jhutchins>ottavio: You failed to do a full-upgrade when you upgraded.
12:53<ottavio>linux-image-amd64 points to 4.9.0-14-amd64 .
12:53<ottavio>I never upgraded from anything.
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12:54<sney>according to tracker.debian.org/linux the bot is wrong, 4.19 is only available to stretch via stretch-backports
12:55<ottavio> apt-policy linux-image-4.19-amd64
12:55<ottavio>linux-image-4.19-amd64:
12:55<ottavio> Installed: (none)
12:55<ottavio> Candidate: 4.19+105+deb10u8~deb9u1
12:55<ottavio> Version table:
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12:55<sney>oi
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12:56<ottavio>sorry!
12:56<ottavio>Apologies.
12:56<sney>oh, oddball separate package
12:56<ottavio>https://termbin.com/qwrd
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13:50-!-Texou is "Stoicien" on #debian-nonupload #debian-i18n #bitlbee #debian-next #debian #debian-es #debian-devel-es #debian-devel-it #debian-l10n-fr #debian-a11y
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13:54<JohnnyGuitar>Sup y'all it's me (Mr_didsomething) Thanks for the help, managed to get back into XFCE and thankfully I had a snapshot from this morning so it could remove everything from GNOME. Thank y'all so much ^
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15:24<dlazer>this is the first channel MX suggested me
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15:26<blast007>!mxlinux
15:26<dpkg>MX Linux is a popular distribution <based on debian>. It is not supported in #debian. Support is available on their forum: https://forum.mxlinux.org/. It is related to <antix>. If you are new to linux, or want a distro with IRC support, try Debian instead: https://www.debian.org/intro/why_debian
15:26<dlazer>hey,it redirected me here
15:27<dlazer>debian doesn-t wanna use hardware virtualization on my lappy for some reason
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15:29<Mister00X>dlazer: so MX send you here becaus you use debian and not MX?
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15:31<dlazer>MX comes with hexchat, and if you open it for the first time, this channel is pre selected
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15:31<dlazer>that-s why i decided to check it out
15:31<blast007>that's just because they don't bother pointing it anywhere else. they're using the settings from Debian.
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15:32-!-rasmus-mk is "Rasmus MK" on #debian-next #debian
15:32<Sqrt{not}>MX doesn't seem to have an IRC channel, they just use that forum dpkg told you about
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15:34<dlazer>looks like it, too bad it-s the only distro that will work flawlessly on my old lappy
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15:34-!-dongcarl is "Carl Dong" on #debian #ceph
15:34<Sqrt{not}>you're welcome to lurk here, and learn -- but we don't know anything about MX, so we can't answer any questions about it.
15:34<dlazer>no worries, my google-fu game is on top
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16:59<oink>hi! i'm trying to setup a cron job to run a script on reboot to mount some folders, but i'm not sure how to do it. could anyone help me?
16:59<oink>i have @reboot sleep 60 && /home/oink/mount.sh in crontab
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16:59<oink>and my "script" work when i run it manually
16:59<petn-randall>oink: I'm going to ask the real question here: Why are you not putting it in /etc/fstab?
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17:00<oink>because i tried that, and afterwards i wasn't able to boot up :S
17:00<petn-randall>oink: It's because cron doesn't have many of the environment vars set that you have in your shell. Most notably $PATH.
17:00<oink>i'm using rar2fs to mount
17:01<petn-randall>oink: I'd rather debug that issue because using a cron job instead won't fix it.
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17:01<petn-randall>oink: If you put it in /etc/fstab and then issue a mount command, what happens?
17:02<oink>give me a sec, and i'll try
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17:03<jhutchins>I think the problem may be that rarfs requires more of the system to be up than regular mounts.
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17:05<oink>petn-randall it seem to work now, but i think the issue is that the folder i'm mouning in with rar2fs also is mounted in fstab
17:05<oink>double mount, yo
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17:06<oink>ugh... that was a bad sentence
17:07<oink>ok, so i have debian in a vm in unraid. and my unraid share is mounted in the vm and then that share is mounted with rar2fs
17:07<oink>if that made it more clear :S
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17:11<oink>thats what i thought too, jhutchins, thats why i wanted to do with a cron job after reboot
17:11<oink>https://ibb.co/6FSR4gY <-- here is a pic from when i tried to reach debian after reboot with vnc
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17:21<oink>so it's not possible with cron job? why can't it run a script with a simple command when it seem to be able to run other scripts?
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17:38<petn-randall>oink: Did you read my statement about environment variables?
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17:40<oink>okay, i guess i just dont exactly understand how it works. i thought it just executed the script, and since it works manually, i figured it would work as a cron job
17:40<petn-randall>oink: Yes, it just executes the script.
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17:41<petn-randall>oink: But if you call "mount" in a script it won't know which mount you mean because $PATH is not set.
17:41<oink>then i dont understand why it wouldn't work :S
17:42<oink>aha
17:42<oink>could i use the complete path then?
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17:42<petn-randall>Yes, or you set PATH manually in the script.
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17:44<jhutchins>oink: Always use the complete path in scripts, and it's best not to use things like environment variables.
17:44<oink>but since the script works manually, without path, just ./mount.sh, shouldn't that work wiht crontab too then?
17:44<jhutchins>oink: No.
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17:44<jhutchins>oink: When you run the script from your shell, it uses your environment. Cron does not.
17:44<petn-randall>oink: It works because in your shell $PATH is set. Run `echo $PATH` in your shell to understand.
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17:53<oink>aha... got it! sorry for being a bit slow here :S
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17:54<oink>can i do /user/local/bin/rar2fs <commands> in the script then?
17:54<oink>nvm
17:54<oink>it worked now :D
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17:54<oink>thanks a lot guys
17:55<oink>appreciated it
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18:01<tecnico>Hello!
18:02<tecnico>Can anyone read me, or do I need to register in order to be read?
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18:02<Mister00X>we hear you
18:02<Mister00X>s/hear/read
18:02<tecnico>@Mister00X thanks
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18:04<tecnico>I'm having trouble to install Debian 10, and I believe it's related to the presence of my graphics card. The screen glitches heavily when I choose MATE, and I can't understand anything. When I choose GNOME it works, then freezes completely when I try to open any program. What to do?
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18:05<Brigo_>tecnico, some more information would help, like what graphi card you have.
18:06<Brigo_>tecnico, also, check logs for errors.
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18:06<tecnico>Brigo_, I cannot check any log because the system does not behaves correctly.
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18:07<Brigo_>tecnico, even in text mode?
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18:08<tecnico>Brigo_, I did not try text mode. I know it exists, but I don't use it for a long time. Anyway, I never could make something useful from it.
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18:08<tecnico>Brigo_, my graphics card, according to my Debian 9 installation, is (lspci): 05:00.0 VGA compatible controller: NVIDIA Corporation G72 [GeForce 7200 GS / 7300 SE] (rev a1)
18:09<Brigo_>tecnico, is that an old one or a new one?
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18:10<tecnico>Brigo_, a very old one. I bought the cheapest available on the store. It was enough to generate video output and even play Minecraft.
18:11<tecnico>(second-hand)
18:11<Brigo_>this link says your graphic is supported by the legacy nvidia driver: https://packages.debian.org/sid/nvidia-legacy-304xx-driver
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18:11<Brigo_>tecnico, are non-free repos available?
18:12<Brigo_>i guess you are using nouveau driver without dkm (which is configured in the bios)
18:12<tecnico>Brigo_, the install says that only free repos are available during the install because Debian is free software.
18:12<Brigo_>tecnico, well, yes, but there is a non-free repository available with non-free stuff, like nvidia drivers, steam, etc.
18:12<tecnico>Brigo_, how can I choose to install this driver during the Debian installation? Or is it possible to install later, even with all the glitches bugging the screen?
18:13<Brigo_>tecnico, nvidia or nouveau?
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18:13<tecnico>Brigo_, I don't understand your question. Are you asking me which company manufactured the graphics card?
18:14<Brigo_>tecnico, which driver do you want, nouveau (the open one) or nvidia (the propietary one)
18:14<tecnico>Brigo_, I don't have a preference. It just needs to work.
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18:16<Brigo_>tecnico, i think both are going to work one configured properly. For nouveau, as i said, you need to change some value in the bios. I think that will be the easy path.
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18:16<tecnico>Brigo_, thinking a bit more, I think using a open/free/libre one will be better than using a proprietary one.
18:16<tecnico>Brigo_, what do I need to do on the BIOS?
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18:17<jhutchins>!nvidia
18:17<dpkg>Where possible, Nvidia graphic processing units are supported using the open source <nouveau> driver on Debian systems by default. To install the proprietary "nvidia" driver, see https://wiki.debian.org/NvidiaGraphicsDrivers or ask me about <nvidia dkms>, <nvidia legacy>; installing this directly from nvidia.com (i.e. with <nvidia-installer>) is _not_ supported in #debian, please go to #nvidia on irc.freenode.net.
18:18-!-mode/#debian [+l 735] by debhelper
18:18<Brigo_>change some value, the name depends on the bios manufacture, it is called KMS in linux.
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18:19<jhutchins>Brigo_: You generally do NOT need to change anything in the BIOS to run Linux on Nvidia.
18:19<Brigo_>jhutchins, we are talking about nouveau
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18:19<tecnico>Brigo_, Key Management System?
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18:20<jhutchins>tecnico: You're probably going to have to solve this from the console, not try to do the GUI.
18:20<jhutchins>tecnico: Kernel Mode Switching.
18:21<jhutchins>tecnico: You'll probably want to boot to multi-user target so there's no GUI.
18:21<jhutchins>There's a factoid with the exact syntax if somebody remembers what the key is.
18:22<Brigo_>!multi-user.target, i think
18:22<Brigo_>!multiuser.target, i think
18:22<blast007>!multi-user.target
18:22<dpkg>Under systemd, graphical.target runs a <dm> and multi-user.target doesn't. You can add «systemd.unit=multi-user.target» to the kernel params to skip the DM once, or run «systemctl set-default multi-user.target» to change permanently. See also <nodm>.
18:22<Brigo_>!multi-user.target
18:22<dpkg>Under systemd, graphical.target runs a <dm> and multi-user.target doesn't. You can add «systemd.unit=multi-user.target» to the kernel params to skip the DM once, or run «systemctl set-default multi-user.target» to change permanently. See also <nodm>.
18:23<Brigo_>i just saw it in the other debian support channel and forgot. :(
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18:24<tecnico>Wait, I'm doing some research on KMS for my motherboard.
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18:27<tecnico>Brigo_, no success on finding "KMS" on the manual of my motherboard. Do you have any guess about how it could be named on an ASUS motherboard?
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18:28<Brigo_>tecnico, not at all, sorry, I only know it is a common issue with nvidia cards and nouvau, and with so little information it is my best guess.
18:29<tecnico>Brigo_, which other information I could provide to you?
18:29<Brigo_>logs, mostly
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18:30<tecnico>Brigo_, how can I get logs?
18:30<tecnico>dmesg?
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18:31<Brigo_>there is 2 crucial: /var/log/Xorg.0.log, a text log, and journal from systemd, you can check it with journalctl -b
18:33<tecnico>Brigo_, fine, and I get into console by pressing F10 or CTRL+X before logging in?
18:33<Brigo_>CTRL+1 should suffice.
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18:34<tecnico>I'll try. How can I know what is relevant? As I only have one computer, I'll need to copy the messages on paper to later type them here.
18:34<tecnico>(turn off, exchange hard disk, turn on, turn off, exchange hard disk, turn on again)
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18:36<Brigo_>tecnico, Xorg.log marks the error with a leading EE, journalctl in red. If they are related to a graphic card ...
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18:37<Brigo_>tecnico, have you internet connection at least? if so you can try termbin:
18:37<tecnico>Brigo_, fine, I'll look up for these EE or red messages and inform you about them.
18:37<Brigo_>!termbin
18:37<dpkg>you can paste to termbin.com from terminal via: nc termbin.com 9999 < /path/to/file
18:38<tecnico>Brigo_, I have internet connection, I'm chatting with you, ain't I?
18:38<Brigo_>with the faulty system i meant.
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18:38<tecnico>Brigo_, it's the same PC, why wouldn't it have connection?
18:38<tecnico>(just another hard disk)
18:39<Brigo_>configuration problems?, just as with the graphic card.
18:39<Brigo_>can't you mount both disk? and access the logs from there ...
18:39<tecnico>Brigo_, I'm not sure.
18:39<Brigo_>then forget about it :)
18:39<tecnico>Brigo_, I could mount both.
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18:40<Brigo_>if you can mount the other disk in this system you can read the logs.
18:41<tecnico>Brigo_, fine
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18:44<tecnico>I'll need to reset the PC in order to detect the disk I connected. Until soon.
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18:45<elynafly>hello
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18:48<tecnico>Brigo_, mounted the other disk /log directory, right?
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18:52<tecnico>Brigo_, which file do I need to check?
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19:00<tecnico>jhutchins, can you help me with the log?
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19:09<Brigo_>tecnico, /var/log/Xorg.0.log
19:09<Brigo_>and /var/log/syslog
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19:09<Brigo_>you can paste them using termbin:
19:09<Brigo_>!termbin
19:09<dpkg>you can paste to termbin.com from terminal via: nc termbin.com 9999 < /path/to/file
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19:10<tecnico>Brigo_, there is nothing on /var
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19:11<tecnico>Maybe because I chose to have the directories on different partitions? /log is on a partition and /var on another
19:11<Brigo_>debian saves the logs in /var/log, if they are not there something really crazy is going on.
19:11<Brigo_>i don't know how you partitioned your disk.
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19:12<tecnico>I chose the option where the directories are most separated from eachoter.
19:12<tecnico>I think this would help me if the system corrupter.
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19:12<tecnico>At least is what people do on Windows: keep the user folder on a partition, and the system on another, so they can reinstall the system without the risk of loosing personal files.
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19:13<tecnico>Brigo_, on /log there is a "syslog" file and a "Xorg.0.log" file.
19:14<Brigo_>those should be the files.
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19:15<tecnico>Brigo_, here are them: https://termbin.com/na83 and https://termbin.com/vguo
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19:17<tecnico>Brigo_, do you need that I point out which lines have a red block when opening on nano?
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19:18<Brigo_>tecnico, no, thanks, the xorg looks right
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19:21<Brigo_>tecnico, i don't see any errors.
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19:23<tecnico>Brigo_, ok, any idea?
19:24<Brigo_>yes, in the Xorg.0.log there is this line: 30.998] (II) NOUVEAU(0): Setting screen physical size to 361 x 203
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19:24<Brigo_>don't look very right.
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19:27<H-var>omfg I was trying to create a symbol of wind for like 4 hours, and then I finally made it, and then I closed gimp, and looked at my wallpaper, and realized I drew the debian's logo haha
19:27<H-var>too much debian
19:27<blast007>Brigo_: wouldn't the "physical size" be actual dimensions, not pixels? possibly in mm?
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19:29<Brigo_>blast007, don't think so
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19:30<blast007>xrandr shows my physical screen size in mm. 520mm x 330mm
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19:32<Brigo_>blast007, yes, maybe you are right, not really sure.
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19:33<blast007>I have similar values in my Xorg log: [ 37.214] (II) intel(0): Setting screen physical size to 508 x 317
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19:34<Brigo_>if i have to trust this logs i would say the system is working pefectly fine graphic wise.
19:34<blast007>might just be that nouveau just doesn't work well enough
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19:39<tecnico>blast007, any idea?
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19:43<Brigo_>nouveau working pourly could be an explanation, but it use to work very well with old cards.
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19:44<Brigo_>tecnico, you can try nvidia drivers, but i don't know how would you get it working from your crashing system.
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19:46<tecnico>Brigo_, I think it is worth a try.
19:46<tecnico>I could enter terminal mode and do some dpkg?
19:47<Brigo_>tecnico, check the wiki: https://wiki.debian.org/NvidiaGraphicsDrivers
19:48-!-mode/#debian [+l 719] by debhelper
19:48<blast007>you could read through the Arch Linux page for Nouveau if you want to troubleshoot that more. Much of the Arch wiki is relevant to Linux in general. https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Nouveau#Troubleshooting
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19:50<tecnico>Brigo_, I'll read
19:50<googolplexer>hello?
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19:50<tecnico>blast007, thanks, I'll read too
19:50<H-var>sup
19:50<Brigo_>tecnico, good luck.
19:50<googolplexer>i have no idea where this place is
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19:52<sney>!irc
19:52<dpkg>IRC is Internet Relay Chat, the means to provide #debian to its patrons. Debian IRC channels are listed at http://wiki.debian.org/IRC . Please read http://wiki.debian.org/GettingHelpOnIrc . Ask me about <irc tutorial> and <faq>. See also <debstats> and <irclog>.
19:52<sney>googolplexer: read this^ and read the channel topic, that will help you figure it iout
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19:55<googolplexer>oh so i just talk to random people
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19:56-!-coruja is "Markus Meyer" on #frickelplatz #debian-next @#blobot #debian
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19:59-!-uos_eric2023 is "Quassel IRC 用户" on #debian
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20:00-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
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20:01-!-user is "user" on #debian
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20:05-!-Nik05 is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
20:06-!-Nik05 is now known as Guest10808
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20:12-!-Celelibi is "Alors, il est beau mon whois ?" on #qemu #llvm @#linuxfr #linux #debian
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20:20-!-nix^tlgl is "I Luv Break Fix" on #debian-next #debian
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20:20-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
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20:21-!-user__ is "user" on #mobian #debian #publiclab #ceph #debian-next #freedombox #oftc #aqi-data-share #badgeteam #mm #C #bcache
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20:23-!-ax5623 is "realname" on #debian-next #debian #linux
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20:25-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
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20:29-!-nighthawk is "realname" on #debian-social #debian
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20:30-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
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20:33-!-Celelibi is "Alors, il est beau mon whois ?" on #qemu #llvm @#linuxfr #linux #debian
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20:45-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
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20:54-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
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21:02-!-Celelibi is "Alors, il est beau mon whois ?" on #qemu #llvm @#linuxfr #linux #debian
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21:05-!-nyku is "nyku [them/him]" on #debian
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21:07-!-silver is "Jesse Lee Morgan" on @#experimental #oftc #moocows #C #mm #linux #neurodebian #debian-nginx #debian-next #debian @#debian-support #debian-devel-changes #minidebconf-online #debian-meeting #debconf-cambridge
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21:08-!-tnewman is "Travis Newman" on #debian
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21:09-!-Nik05 is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
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21:12-!-ax562 is "realname" on #debian-next #debian #linux
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21:14-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
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21:19-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
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21:19-!-j_f-f is "J\xF6rg Frings-F\xFCrst" on #debian-xfce #debconf-miniauditorio #debconf18-taiwan #debian #debian-ubuntu
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21:39-!-phorce1_ is "Gerald" on #debian
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21:43-!-catman370 is "catman" on #debian #linux #bitlbee
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22:09-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
22:09<VeiN>hi all. I just installed Debian in VMWARE Player so I can get my feet wet with Linux. I was told to use Debian because it is popular.
22:09<VeiN>I do have one problem I hope someone can help with. It didn't like my audio device.
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22:13<ach>!open-vm-tools
22:13<ach>su pw apt install open-vm-tools
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22:14-!-Nik05 is now known as Guest10817
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22:25-!-}ls{ is "nobody" on #kvm #qemu #debian-nginx #debian-lan #debian-kde #debian-django #debian
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22:36-!-sixpiece is "realname" on #debian
22:36<sixpiece>hello
22:36<sixpiece>I cannot get the sound to work in my user account but it works fine in root
22:36<sixpiece>administrator
22:36-!-AngryGoy [~user@0BGAAEQZ9.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:36-!-AngryGoy is "user" on #debian
22:36<sixpiece>well at least that's 1 less goy
22:36<dvs>sixpiece: is your user part of the audio group?
22:37<sixpiece>yes it is
22:37-!-nuc_ [~nuc@200116b82a9e8001482ebdcf7cda7b21.dip.versatel-1u1.de] has joined #debian
22:37-!-nuc_ is "realname" on #debian
22:37<sixpiece>I think there might be the wrong driver selected I don't know how it works exactly to edit
22:37<sixpiece>I know freebsd a little bit better not necessarily so great
22:37<sixpiece>and windows a bit better as well but not so great in either per se
22:38-!-AngryGoy [~user@0BGAAEQZ9.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit []
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22:38-!-AngryGoy is "user" on #debian
22:39<skynet_>what is your audio driver
22:39-!-AngryGoy [~user@0BGAAEQ0C.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit []
22:39<skynet_>snd-hda-intel?
22:39<sixpiece>Realtek
22:39-!-Nik05_ [~Nik05@85.150.134.175] has joined #debian
22:39-!-Nik05_ is "Nik05" on #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-next
22:39<skynet_>should be using the snd-hda-intel driver then
22:39<skynet_>its a bit problematic
22:39<sixpiece>but it says under pavucontrol that it's soundblaster and I think under amixer or whatever alsamixer it says ensoniq
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22:41<sixpiece>I'm not sure why but it is muted under pavucontrol
22:41<sixpiece>it works under root
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22:43-!-CeBe is "Carsten Brandt" on #debian #packaging
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22:43<twb>My notes make this file etc/initramfs/post-update.d/zz-flash-kernel-efi
22:44<twb>...but that dir doesn't exist! Did I screw it up? I can't see where that file *should* be
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22:45<sixpiece>is that for me ?
22:46<twb>No
22:46<twb>Hrm:
22:46<twb>$ apt-file search post-update.d ==> lilo: /etc/initramfs/post-update.d/runlilo
22:46<sney>twb: config directories that would be empty by default are often not created at all. I see that dir referenced by 2 different packages though, so it should be... yeah
22:46<twb>suggests that IS or at least WAS a valid path
22:46<twb>I was deeply suspicious because there is /etc/initramfs-tools
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22:49<sixpiece>it's funny cause I studied freebsd like I am doing now for debian
22:50<sixpiece>I learned it ok and then I became much smarter with Windows even
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22:50<sixpiece>which is funny
22:50<sixpiece>like I didn't even use my video card it was plugged in but my monitor was plugged into the intel hd graphics card
22:50<sixpiece>and not my 4gb video card
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22:50-!-Student is "*Unknown*" on #debian
22:51<sixpiece>and I figured that out cause of freebsd trying to figure something out
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22:52<sixpiece>also not sure why but I find this debian environment possibly better for concentration
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23:01<sixpiece>so it's impossible or what?
23:01<sixpiece>what can I do to make this work?
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23:15<sixpiece>it tells me dpkg not available
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23:16<sixpiece>apt-get install dselect
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---Logclosed Tue Jan 19 00:00:01 2021