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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-02-05

---Logopened Fri Feb 05 00:00:25 2021
00:01-!-simonpatapon [simon@patapon.lol] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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00:01-!-simonpatapon is "Simon Patapon" on #buddhism #debian-next #oftc #debian #bitlbee
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00:03-!-kfvn is "weechat" on #debian #tor-dev #tor-project
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00:18-!-Main_ is "tp" on #cryptoparty #debian #freedombox #Qubes_OS #redditprivacy
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00:48<codex>2021 is the year of the nerd. Nerd and you best say it with awe because I'm the type of nerd that will bust yo' jaw !
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02:08<abhijit>hello
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02:28<battaglin>hello
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03:45-!-Texou is "Stoicien" on #debian-nonupload #debian-i18n #bitlbee #debian-next #debian #debian-es #debian-devel-es #debian-devel-it #debian-l10n-fr #debian-a11y
03:50<Codex>Damn , man compile icewm 2.x from source in debian stable or update to bullseye and just use apt-get ... decisions decisions decisions looking like the latter since mildly its frozen
03:51<Codex>xfce sucks man... cewm+rox+volumeicon+wicd+udiskie=fastest DE for Linux, ever. Yep, icewm alive and kicking since the 90s
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03:53-!-Fraggle2 is "Christian Britz" on #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian
03:54<jm_>heh I switched from icewm to fluxbox last year
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04:11<FH_thecat>how can I use strace, with a command that takes input from user
04:11<FH_thecat>ie, strace su - 2> zz
04:11<FH_thecat>does not work, because I don't get the prompt
04:12<jm_>strace -o /tmp/strace.txt ...
04:16<FH_thecat>jm_: thank you. That solves the output problem, but fails with authentication failure
04:16<FH_thecat>when I do su without strace, it works
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04:18<jm_>FH_thecat: yeah some system calls fail when using strace, what are you trying to debug?
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04:18-!-pamaury_ is "Amaury Pouly" on #debian #oftc #debian-next
04:20<FH_thecat>jm_: I am trying to debug:
04:20<FH_thecat>Could not read /proc/1/limits (No such file or directory), using PAM defaults
04:20<FH_thecat>the thing is, I get this error only sometimes
04:20<FH_thecat>while the permissions of /proc/1/limits do not change
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04:21<jm_>surely that file can't go away so something else might be at play
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04:22<jm_>the other way to debug it would be to try and use kernel tracing
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04:44<grove>If you can live without getting a trace of the first things the program does, and can have two terminals visible (or can live with having to change terminal to see what `strace` outputs, you can start the program in one termnial and find the pid and use `strace -p` in the other terminal
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04:49<EmleyMoor>I don't recall who it was who gave me the systemd-run stuff for limiting CPU usage yesterday but early indications suggest it may be doing exactly what I hoped.
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04:50<EmleyMoor>I might consider increasing the allowance but only if I can work out exactly how it's calculating
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04:52<EmleyMoor>The man pages suggest CPUQuota over 100% allows for more than one CPU (or, presumably, core... so I'm guessing I could try increasing it a bit from 25% if, as a method, it's successful in achieving what I need
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04:56<EmleyMoor>It's certainly holding the "plzip" that tar starts back from using vast amounts of CPU
04:56<EmleyMoor>OTOH amount written as yet is 0 bytes!
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04:59-!-jmux is "Jan-Marek Glogowski" on #debian
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05:05<EmleyMoor>My aim is to allow the full backup to run without causing my CPU to go above 60°C, and without run time exceeding 30 hours
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05:20<sandra>Not sure what packages I need on Debian 10 on late 2008 MacBook unibody. I have nvidia-legacy-340xx-driver and trying to startx → https://ellen.idiomdrottning.org/Xorg.0.log.txt
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05:24<sandra>https://ellen.idiomdrottning.org/lsmod.txt ← and here's lsmod's output
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05:36<jm_>sandra: you don't have nvidia kernel module loaded, and the other file suggests nvidia xorg driver is not installe either
05:37<sandra>jm_: right… Not sure how to fix. I have the package nvidia-legacy-340xx-driver
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05:39<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>my questions is regarding the "megatools" linux cli tools. So, I uploaded close to 50GB of content onto my free mega.nz account using 'megaput'. For free accounts, does mega.nz allow the 50GB permanently, or does it expire and downgrade to 15GB after 30 days?
05:39<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>the wikipedia article says 15GB after 30 days - but i'm not sure if this article is out-of-date and if mega.nz now allows 50GB permanently for all free accounts... could someone who knows please confirm?
05:40<sandra>I have nvidia-legacy-340xx-kernel-dkms, maybe I'll start by dpkg-reconfigure it…
05:41<sandra>That was a good idea, I'm missing kernel headers
05:41<jm_>sandra: yes do that and check if module builds
05:41<azeem>KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV: sounds like a question for mega support, not Debian
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05:44<sandra>Thank you so much jm_, I am seeing that a lot of stuff is broken with this system. I'll go address it
05:46<jm_>sandra: make sure you have kernel headers installed
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05:50<sandra>jm_: right, I saw that. I was gonna do apt install linux-headers-`uname -r` and that's when I realized my system was out of date
05:51<sandra>Thank you
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05:51<jm_>np
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06:19<sandra>Now system upgraded to 10.7! Installed headers and reconfigured the -dkms package. Building works fine, but then it gives me this error → https://ellen.idiomdrottning.org/systemd-error.txt
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06:43<jm_>sandra: it might mean this driver (version) does not support your device - have you verified that?
06:44<sandra>Oh, that might cause an "Operation not permitted error?"
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06:46<sandra>nvidia-detect → nvidia-legacy-340xx-driver
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06:47<jm_>/usr/share/doc/nvidia-legacy-340xx-driver/README.txt.gz lists exact products supported by it
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06:49<sandra>lspci -vv; zgrep GeForce\ 9400M /usr/share/doc/nvidia-legacy-340xx-driver/README.txt.gz ← seems to be right
06:50<jm_>then try loading the driver manually and see what it says (also check «dmesg -T» output), you must also make sure no kernel drivers for nouveau are loaded/attempted to load
06:52<sandra>Thank you jm_ it's missing an nvidia_current device apparently
06:54<sandra>That's what's tripping me up. It's like, whaddayamean current, I'm using -legacy?
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06:57<jm_>sandra: hmm I don't really have experience with current versions of nvidia legacy drivers, but you can check which modules got built with «find /lib/modules/$(uname -r)/updates» - I see a module named nvidia-current there, yet lsmod shows it as nvidia
06:59<sandra>Huh me too. With a hyphen instead of underscore
07:00<sandra>modprobe nvidia-current ⇒ ERROR: could not insert 'nvidia_current': No such device
07:02<jm_>that would suggest something else is using the device or that version does not support your device
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07:07<Anarka>have you restarted after install to blacklist nouveau ?
07:08<sandra>Thank you Anarka. Yeah, I've rebooted. What's the name of nouveau so I can grep for it in lsmod? Also here is modprobe nvidia -vv and -vvv respectively: https://ellen.idiomdrottning.org/modprobe-vv.txt https://ellen.idiomdrottning.org/modprobe-vvv.txt
07:10<Anarka>seems to be nouveau and isnt present in your lsmod
07:10<sandra>Thank you
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07:11<Anarka>and done that in a while so just checked https://wiki.debian.org/NvidiaGraphicsDrivers
07:11<sandra>https://wiki.debian.org/NvidiaGraphicsDrivers#Version_340.108_.28legacy_GPUs.29 but I think something has gone wrong
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07:16<jm_>well the modules have built, unless they're some old files
07:16<sandra>Right, the dpkg-reconfigure -dkms thing reported success on that front, just not on loading them
07:16<jm_>which would also explain the error seen
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07:18<sandra>The first weird thing in -vvv is that it can't find /sys/module/nvidia stuff. ls /sys/module/nvi* ⇒ no matches found
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07:19<jm_>those files will only exist if loading modules works
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07:22<sandra>ls -l on nvidia-current.ko and it's super fresh, built today (wow it's fifth already…?) at noonish
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07:23<jm_>hmm no idea what else to check, maybe try searching how to get linux running on that hardware
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07:24<sandra>Could be some secure boot thing
07:24<sandra>https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/543576/modprobe-fails-with-operation-not-permitted ← gonna try this
07:25<jm_>and secure mode is enabled? dmesg|grep secureboot
07:27<sandra>"Secure boot could not me determined (mode 0)"
07:28<jm_>apparently that means no
07:28-!-mode/#debian [+l 708] by debhelper
07:28<sandra>Thank you
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07:31<sandra>mokutil --sb-state ⇒ This system does not support Secure Boot.
07:31<sandra>So that was a dead end, sorry for wasting everybody's time with that track
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07:33<jm_>no need to apologize for that
07:34<sandra>Could be some other graphics driver, not nouveau but maybe fbdev or something that's colliding
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07:35<sandra>"Signing modules" I've never even heard of that
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07:38<jm_>hmm apparently I have "signed" kernel installed and nvidia driver built with dkms loads fine, but I am running in legacy mode, not UEFI
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07:40<sandra>uname -a ⇒ Linux hannah 4.19.0-14-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.19.171-2 (2021-01-30) x86_64 GNU/Linux
07:42<jm_>I use 5.7 from bpo, but doesn't matter -- «dpkg -l | grep linux-ima» will show if it's signed/unsigned kernel
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07:42<sandra>It's defo signed
07:42<sandra>That could be the issue!
07:43<sandra>I need to sign the module
07:44<jm_>well the easy way out would be to install unsigned kernel and rebuild module
07:46<sandra>A nice clean Gordian cut
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07:48<Fraggle2>you only need to sign the module if you use secureboot
07:48<sandra>Thank you Fraggle2
07:49<sandra>Secure Boot sounds like a good idea but this old machine can't handle that
07:49<Fraggle2>that is why I use UEFI without secureboot
07:50<Fraggle2>I fiddled around with self signing but in the end I think it is not worth the effort
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07:55<matthew>Good afternoon everyone
07:55-!-matthew is now known as Guest12361
07:55<Guest12361>I require some assistance.
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07:56<jm_>!ask
07:56<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/ See <smart questions><errors>.
07:57<Guest12361>I have a problem with HDMI output
07:57<Guest12361>ed to the NVIDIA GTX 1650 Max-Q graphics card.
07:58<Guest12361>Oopsie,
07:58<sandra>Huh, installed -unsigned, rebooted, and now dpkg -l|grep linux-ima shows both signed and unsigned packages
07:59*ed_ goes to the nvidia
07:59<Guest12361>I own a Lenovo L340 Gaming laptop and due to how it is configured the HDMI port is hardwired to the NVIDIA GTX 1650 graphics card
08:00<Guest12361>So, I follow the instructions on the wiki and set the NVIDIA card as my primary GPU
08:02<Guest12361>And it worked. At the time I was running Debian v10.6, kernel 5.8 and Nvidia driver 450. But ever since I upgraded to Debian 10.7, Kernel 5.10 and Driver 455. It no longer works
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08:03<Guest12361>nvdia-smi no longer finds any devices
08:03<Guest12361>I need a second monitor for my day job
08:05<Guest12361>Any help will be greatly appreciated.
08:06<sandra>Holy Toledo I borked the system! Emergency mode! Now I need to remember / dig up the root password for this thing
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08:08<sandra>I remembered it
08:09<sandra>I should pick something more difficult to guess next time
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08:10<sandra>OK dpkg-reconfigure linux-image-`uname -r`-signed in emergency mode was the ticket
08:12<sandra>Nvidia is 99% of the problems on Linux 💔
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08:13<sandra>dpkg -l
08:13<dpkg>Files in package sandra-pr0n: /srv/sandra-pr0n/sandra.jpg
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08:14<sandra>dpkg -l|grep grep image-`uname -r` ← now shows unsigned. But same not permitted modprobe error
08:14<dpkg>sandra: You are person #1 to send an unparseable request
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08:15<SND[m]>pr0n? 😲
08:15<sandra>dpkg, you are behaving inappropriately. Please kindly STFU
08:15<dpkg>I resemble that remark!
08:15<sandra>Ops, please kick this bot
08:15<SND[m]>lol
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08:17<SND[m]>Whats goin in with dpkg? Is this real?
08:17*SND[m] rubs his eyes
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08:17<sandra>https://wiki.debian.org/IRC/DpkgBot ← I don't find anything about making porn jokes in here
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08:17<jar-el>dpkg tell me a joke
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08:18<SND[m]>s/in/on
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08:19<sandra>"I don't fond anythong about makong porn jokes in here"…?
08:21<sandra>http://www.infobot.org/guide-0.43.x.html
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08:22<sandra>dpkg, forget -l
08:22<dpkg>sandra: i forgot -l
08:22<sandra>dpkg -l
08:22<dpkg>sandra: I don't know, could you explain it?
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08:25<matthew_dunk>Don't know what happened there? I got disconnected. So I will restate my problem
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08:32<matthew_dunk>I own a Lenovo IdeaPad L340 Gaming laptop and due to how it is configured the HDMI port is hardwired to the NVIDIA GTX 1650 graphics card. So I followed the instructions on the wiki on how to set my NVIDIA card as my primary GPU. At the time and it worked. At the time I set that up, I was running Debian 10.6, kernel version 5.8.14 and NVIDIA driver 450. Ever since I upgraded to 10.7 running kernel 5.10 and NVIDIA driver 455 HDMI no longer works.
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08:33<matthew_dunk>nvidia-smi no longer finds any devices too
08:33<matthew_dunk>I need a second monitor as part of my day job
08:34<matthew_dunk>So any assistance will be greatly appreciated
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08:35<matthew_dunk>Do you require more info?
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08:35<matthew_dunk>I'll provide whatever I can.
08:36<matthew_dunk>Sorry if you already tried to help, I was disconnected
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08:38<matthew_dunk>Can anyone help?
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08:38<Sqrt{not}>matthew_dunk, patience
08:38<matthew_dunk>Sorry :(
08:39<matthew_dunk>I shall exercise patience.
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08:42<Sqrt{not}>matthew_dunk, how did you upgrade your kernel to that version ?
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08:44<matthew_dunk>I installed an image
08:45<Sqrt{not}>matthew_dunk, obviously, but where did you get that image?
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08:46<Sqrt{not}>!next
08:46<dpkg>Another happy customer leaves the building.
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08:49<SND[m]>dpkg -L swami
08:49<dpkg>ii swami 3.9-3 snd[m]'s private porn collection
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08:52<sandra>dpkg, forget -L
08:52<dpkg>i didn't have anything called '-l' to forget, sandra
08:55<sandra>I get that I'm being a killjoy but I've had enough people on OFTC hounding me for nudes that I got spooked for a second there. And while I can handle the occasional joke, maybe the next person can't. Just wanna build a welcoming community. IDK.
08:56<sandra>Also -L lists contents and -l lists packages IIRC.
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09:13<caravel>hi, which method/tools would you recommend nowadays to audit a root fs offline (not running)?
09:13<caravel>i.e. to build an exhaustive list of any divergences from package maintainers configs, including init
09:15<caravel>(I can imagine a long shot, diffing against a fresh reinstall until a complete match?)
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09:28<caravel>I'd assume TheRightWay® would be using e.g. debsums against a clean db from some live/PXE images, but I found no existing solution/project describing such method (or did I search for the wrong keywords ?)
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09:33<koollman>caravel: https://wiki.debian.org/CheckingDebsums (some ways to do it)
09:34<koollman>caravel: otherwise a 'classical' way is to have hindsight and have already a proper checksum db exported and check regularly :)
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09:43<caravel>thanks koollman, indeed (and somehow I missed that wiki page)
09:46<caravel>I could find so many people describing online audits -- is there so few people to care about verifying offline, or is it just that nobody cares about talking about it? :)
09:47<koollman>caravel: when you have to check offline, it's usually too late, reasonnably
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09:49<caravel>well, I would say, you can't really know that until you check offline :)
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09:58<Upwardsticks>hi everyone, i'm trying to set a static ip for a machine running cli-only buster, but when i add the address to /etc/network/interfaces and set managed to true in /etc/NetworkManager/NetworkManager.conf it still comes up with the old ip address even after reboot. am i missing something?
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10:04<koollman>caravel: in the far past, I've used software like aide or tripwire. Modern equivalent could be something like samhain, or maybe ossec (or aide, still maintained :) ). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Host-based_intrusion_detection_system_comparison
10:04<koollman>caravel: I remember thinking that samhain implementation was neat ... but I do not remember why
10:05<koollman>I think it was mostly the end-to-end integrity stuff, with db and logs signed and centralized, so it is hard to tamper with things
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10:31<caravel>koollman: thanks, I had a(nother) look at each (and more), but none does even mention simple offline file audits -- they're all sophisticated agent-based or agent-less HIDS... for online systems - right?
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10:35<koollman>caravel: pretty much. It would be a reasonable check to add to most of them. I wonder why they did not document that
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11:36<superlinuxnoob>Hello, I have recently built a PC and installed Debian. After a day or two of trying to figure out why I couldn't start Xorg, I managed to get a seemingly functional desktop. At one point, I decided I wanted to use GPU Passthrough for a project of mine. After adjusting some configurations, I rebooted my system only to realize that apparently Debian was using the card I wanted to passthrough while refusing to use the other the e
11:36<superlinuxnoob>.
11:36<superlinuxnoob>After about another day or two of fruitless package-swapping and rebooting, I didn't manage to get anywhere new. Currently my desktop seems to be stuck at 1024x768.
11:36<superlinuxnoob>Here is my configuration.
11:36<superlinuxnoob>Debian Testing (Upgraded from Debian 10 Stable)
11:36<superlinuxnoob>CPU : AMD Ryzen 9 3990x
11:36<superlinuxnoob>AMD RX 5700XT (This is the card I want to use on my regular desktop.)
11:36-!-superlinuxnoob was kicked from #debian by debhelper [flood]
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11:39<sorryaboutheflood>(Sorry about the flood, take two.)
11:39<caravel>sorryaboutheflood: :) indeed you've been kicked out because you flooded, i.e. you pasted a large multilines text at once. please note also your first phrase looks like it exceeded the max and was truncated
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11:39<bremner>and you really want to be in #debian-next for testing support
11:39<sorryaboutheflood>Oh ok thanks
11:39<caravel>then, if your OS is now debian testing, you might want to go to #debian-next
11:40<caravel>right :)
11:40*caravel lags a bit
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11:40<Sqrt{not}>!paste
11:40<dpkg>Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: https://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: https://imgbb.com/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): https://filebin.net or https://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <termbin>.
11:40<Sqrt{not}>sorryaboutheflood, use ^^^^ the pastebins for big amounts of info
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12:01<debianeu>hi
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12:02<debianeu>with self signed certificate, mount.davfs2 asks the user to validate the certificate on ubuntu but not on buster. any idea on how to get that validation to be asked on buster?
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12:58<lkusiek>Hi, does anyone know a relatively simple command to fully wipe a hard drive, this means wipe and overwrite to make data unrecoverable?
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12:59<imMute>lkusiek: a quick google points to the "wipe" package
12:59<bremner>depending on your opposition, shred may suffice
13:00<bremner>I.e. is the NSA or your mom.
13:00<bremner>That would of course depend if your mom is an infosec expert.
13:01<lkusiek>OK, will go for shred. Just planning to sell laptop - you never know who will buy. NSA? possibly... :). Thanks
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13:43<caravel>lkusiek: first, it depends on the media type i.e. ssd or hdd
13:44<caravel>SSD design make their erasure unreliable/unverifiable, I think
13:44<caravel>and the best we can do might be filling them up, then blkdiscard
13:46<caravel>for HDD I usually write zeros using dd over a random crypt mount (and repeat a few times)
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14:24<lkusiek>I have both SSD for system and HDD for data. I will shred hdd and replace sdd with zeros. Then format to NTFS and install Windows for sale as from experience there are not many who would like to buy a laptop with Debian...
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14:25<lkusiek>but dd I can try as well - it won't harm doing a few runs as on the end I want to destroy the data.
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14:28<lkusiek>Thanks for advice guys
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14:30<sarnold>lkusiek: don't write zeros, those compress very well, and many / most ssd firmwares will compress them all
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14:31<sarnold>lkusiek: it'd be safer to use something like /dev/urandom
14:31<sarnold>(slower, too)
14:36<lkusiek>OK, in this case what command shall I use for SSD drive?
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14:43<Mister00X>lkusiek: what about using ata-secure erase?
14:45<Mister00X>so depending on if its an nvme or a sata device you can use hdparm or nvme-format
14:45<sarnold>lkusiek: I'd use something like dd =/dev/urandom of=/dev/whatefer-you-want-to-destroy bs=65536
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14:46<sarnold>argh where'd my if go?
14:46<sarnold>lkusiek: I'd use something like dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/whatefer-you-want-to-destroy bs=65536
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14:48<Mister00X>lkusiek: if you want to have a look at ata-secure-erase for ssd's there is something on the arch wiki about it https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Solid_state_drive/Memory_cell_clearing
14:48<lkusiek>the SDD is a mSATA - so it's a SATA device
14:48<lkusiek>SSD sorry
14:49<Mister00X>lkusiek: note that ata-secure erase only works with direct sata connection so no USB connection
14:50<lkusiek>OK guys thank you for all your help, I roughly know what to do now and will research the rest on the internet based on your comments/links. My SSD is a direct SATA thank you.
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14:54<caravel>lkusiek: remember to do SMART tests after erasure, too :)
14:54*caravel bye all
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15:10<Pavlo>Hi!
15:10<sarnold>hello Pavlo
15:11<Pavlo>I`m Pavlo.
15:11<Pavlo>I from Ukraine!
15:11<sarnold>cool :)
15:12<Pavlo>I don`t speak English very vell :)
15:13<Pavlo>Bei
15:13<sarnold>that's fine; many people here speak english as a second language
15:14<Pavlo>:)
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15:49<daft_dutch>Hi, can i ask a ufw wireguard on a raspberry pi here. I get no responce in a raspberry irc channel
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15:53<wb9688>!ask
15:53<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/ See <smart questions><errors>.
15:54<daft_dutch>I have a message that wg0 is blocked by the ufw firewall but wg0 is allowed as rule
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15:58<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>hello, i have a question about using 'veracrypt': what does the "headerbak" argument to the "--mount-option" do? The description says: "headerbak: Use backup headers when mounting a volume." but I do not understand what this means...
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16:02<sarnold>KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV: my guess is it's there in case the primary header has been damaged
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16:19<grove>Have I missed something or is forced commands with SSH per user, and not per key, even though it is set on a line containing a specific key in .ssh/authorized_keys? (I would like to give two keys access to the same account on the server, but the user of one of the keys should be restricted to a specific command)
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16:19<apteryx>Hi there! Is there some guidelines to migrating an apt repository?
16:20<grove>That should be fairly straight forward, using your favourite copying tool
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16:24<Tas-sos>I have a old Debian GNU/Linux laptop and I don't want to upgrade now, can I install software ?
16:24<Tas-sos>I issue ==> apt update
16:25<sorcerer>huh
16:25<Tas-sos>but have problems... need to comment out all lines from /etc/apt/source.list
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16:25<azeem>Tas-sos: what distribution did it say there?
16:25<Tas-sos>and just have only one for debian stretch-backports ?
16:25<sarnold>grove: any chance you've got an ForceCommand specified in sshd configs?
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16:25<Tas-sos>what can I do ?
16:26<azeem>Tas-sos: what are your problems?
16:26<Tas-sos>Debian GNU/Linux stretch
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16:26<Tas-sos>I want to install some newer kernel version - just and only this
16:27<sarnold>Tas-sos: maybe change your sources to http://archive.debian.org/ ?
16:27<azeem>stretch isn't archived yet I think
16:27<Tas-sos>basicly this package ===> firmware-atheros
16:28<azeem>so what problem do you get when you try to install it?
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16:28<Sqrt{not}>Tas-sos, stretch is still supported
16:28<apteryx>grove: the users currently using the package shouldn't be impacted by the moving of the 3rd party repo
16:28<Tas-sos>yes realy ? I also think about archive but I dont try it yet
16:29<Sqrt{not}>Tas-sos, that package is in non-free, do you have that enabled?
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16:30<Sqrt{not}>Tas-sos, also in stretch-backports if you need a newer version
16:30<Sqrt{not}>,v firmware-atheros
16:30<judd>Package: firmware-atheros on amd64 -- jessie/non-free: 0.43; jessie-security/non-free: 20161130-5~deb8u1; stretch/non-free: 20161130-5; stretch-backports/non-free: 20190114-2~bpo9+1; buster/non-free: 20190114-2; buster-backports/non-free: 20200918-1~bpo10+1; bullseye/non-free: 20201218-3; sid/non-free: 20201218-3
16:30<grove>sarnold: No
16:32<grove>apteryx: No. You don't need access to the repo to use the package, when you install it you fetch it from the repo, and then the repo is not involved any longer
16:34<sarnold>grove: dang :/
16:34<apteryx>cool, I was overthinking this it seems. Thank you.
16:34<apteryx>I thought some entries get added to a some apt file, and those entries would go stale if upstream change place
16:35<apteryx>which would cause apt to no longer find any updates or error out if it points to a non existing URL.
16:36<grove>apteryx: That's an issue, I thought you had decided on be willing to accept that
16:37<apteryx>I guess I need some redirect rules on the HTTP server
16:37<apteryx>so that when apt visits the old place it will get served the new repo; just need to figure out if and how the existing apt entries will get updated
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16:38<Tas-sos>This is the problems ==> https://pastebin.com/raw/NS3B8Ds5 ( sorry for the screenshots )
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16:38<Tas-sos>all stats when we run apt update
16:39<Tas-sos>before install the packages we want
16:40<Tas-sos>we cannot resolved
16:40<Tas-sos>:-/
16:46<Tas-sos>why accurs this problems ?
16:47<sarnold>Tas-sos: my guess -- comment out the https://... sources in your apt config
16:47<sarnold>Tas-sos: then try another apt update, apt install ca-certificates
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16:51<Tas-sos>Yes sorry, the ZoneMinder repository we commended out
16:51<Tas-sos>now we only have only the debian nothing else
16:51<kaipee>How can I make udev detect a network card?
16:52<kaipee>I'm trying to install but network card is not detected. However, the device is listed under lspci
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18:02<Sqrt{not}>kaipee, what network card? what are you trying to install, what installer exactly?
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18:03<kaipee>I got sorted, thankfully lol
18:03<kaipee>apologies for not replying
18:03<kaipee>I created a dummy network interface which let me proceed with installation
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18:04<Sqrt{not}>kaipee, OK! good job :)
18:04<matt_the_hall>hello, I rebooted Debian 10 over SSH (I had just installed a docker package). After the reboot, all I can get is a tty interface. When I try to start x, it will not start.
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18:06<matt_the_hall>the error is related to the dbus
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18:23<matt_the_hall>Anyone willing to throw me a bone?
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18:25<sarnold>matt_the_hall: did X work before? how are you trying to start it? what errors are you getting? are there more detailed errors in journalctl or /var/log ?
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18:27<matt_the_hall>I was using X before. I installed Vagrant, a docker environment. I rebooted via shutdown -r now over ssh. Debian 10 lives on a VM, and I could not restart the ssh connection to it
18:28<matt_the_hall>...so, I logged back into the server that hosts the VM. Debian was sitting there idling in a tty session
18:29<matt_the_hall>I logged in to my regular user and tried to startx, but no luck... let mw look in those log areas for more details. The log file for x has errors for dbus and systemctl, basically about not getting a reply
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18:35<matt_the_hall>no entries in journalctl
18:36<matt_the_hall>boot.log had errors with Avahi mDNS
18:36<matt_the_hall>and NFS kernel
18:36<matt_the_hall>Could those be connected issues?
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18:38<sarnold>it depends upon the errors; if ssh and avahi and nfs are all saying there's no networking in your kernel, then it feels very likely related. but maybe they're all just noise and unrelated..
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18:41<matt_the_hall>yeah it looks like there is no networking (like I can't apt update). It seems like the way I rebooted must have broken something. Is there a way to reset without having to start from scratch, or should I just kill the VM and start a new one?
18:43<sarnold>it'd really depend on figuring out what broke where to judge if this is a five-minute fix one file and reboot, or if it's somehow more than that..
18:43<sarnold>can you bring up the networking manually with ip commands?
18:44<matt_the_hall>nmcli, ifconfig not found
18:44<sarnold>try ip
18:44<sarnold>ifconfig is probably not default installed any more
18:44<duclicsic>is the interface up? 'ip link' - does it have an IP address? 'ip addr' - do you have anything in your routing table? 'ip route'
18:46<matt_the_hall>waiting for it to reboot again
18:46<matt_the_hall>i'll try those commands once it's up. If there is no network interface, then what?
18:47<matt_the_hall>could it be docker?
18:48<sarnold>if it did something like configure your system to start an ethernet bridge immediately, and use your nic, and none of the rest of your networking was adjusted for it, that'd probably lead to results like this
18:49<matt_the_hall>well the VM is set to bridged mode networking so that I can connect to it from other machines on the network
18:50<duclicsic>docker also insists on installing a bunch of awful iptables rules, which I don't believe should cause the kind of problem you're describing
18:50<sarnold>that's probably a different bridge :)
18:50<duclicsic>but without seeing the ruleset it would be hard to say
18:52<matt_the_hall>well when I run ip route I get: 172.17.0.0./16 dev docker0 proto kernel scope link src 172.17.0.1 linkdown
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18:53<matt_the_hall>and with ip link it looks like both docker and enp0s3 are down
18:53<duclicsic>how are you configuring your main interface? /etc/network/interfaces ? or something like networkd?
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18:55<matt_the_hall>whatever the default setup was when I ran the install for Debian 10
18:55<duclicsic>so try 'ifup enp0s3'
18:57<matt_the_hall>ifup command not found
18:57<matt_the_hall>and nothing in interfaces.d
18:58<duclicsic>I don't know if it's possible to install debian without ifupdown.. something seems quite wrong there
18:58<duclicsic>you're running it as root yes?
18:59<duclicsic>maybe I should have clarified that
18:59<matt_the_hall>ill try as root
18:59<matt_the_hall>I think I really broke it somehow. Was running like a normal system until the reboot
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19:00<matt_the_hall>well ok as root it says unknown interface
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19:01<duclicsic>ok.. try 'ip link set dev enp0s3 up' then 'dhclient enp0s3'
19:01<matt_the_hall>will do
19:01<duclicsic>this assumes you have a dhcp server on your local network though
19:02<duclicsic>but check the status of the interface with the original commands I suggested after that
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19:02<matt_the_hall>that seems to have worked
19:02<duclicsic>this is probably a wild goose chase since this is really just addressing the lack of network connectivity anyway
19:03<matt_the_hall>yeah totally
19:03<matt_the_hall>I'll just start from scratch. Do you think it was the reboot or the install of docker?
19:04<duclicsic>a reboot alone shouldn't break things if your system is in a coherent state
19:04<duclicsic>nor should installing docker though
19:04<duclicsic>further investiation would be required
19:05<matt_the_hall>yeah it is pretty strange
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19:07<matt_the_hall>I appreciate the help -- thank you!
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19:44<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>how does own remove a device in the '/dev/mapper' directory (so that one can remount a device using that same device file) ?
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19:54<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>(nevermind, I read up on dmsetup)
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20:05<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>is there a linux command-line-tool to test a storage device's read/write speeds - i have an NVMe drive and want to know if it lives up to the advertised speeds...
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20:08<frx774>You could use 'dd' to read a block of data from the NVMe drive, with 'dd' summarizing the throughput at the end. (And similarly for writing.) Maybe there are more specialized tools though?
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20:10<sarnold>KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV: there's several, fio, bonnie, bonnie++ -- I'm pretty sure fio is the 'best' of the bunch
20:11<sarnold>dd can be a useful simple thing to show you sequential speeds, but that's a narrow-enough view of the system that it might not be realistic for your workload
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20:13<AlexLearner>hdparm does the trick for reading too, I bet.
20:14<AlexLearner>dd, for sure. Always a good friend.
20:17<frx774>Ultimately, "measuring" filesystems can be tricky. :) Whether you are going through a particular filesystem, or directly through the block device, and sequential commands vs. parallel... you can get different values.
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20:19<AlexLearner>Yeah, ~frx774 is right
20:19<frx774>Doing 'dd if=/dev/sda1 of=/dev/null bs=512 count=1000' (using /dev/sda1) would read straight from the block device layer, right? Whereas using 'if=/some/mounted/filesystem/path/file'...
20:19<frx774>...would incur the overhead of whatever filesystem you're using...
20:19<sarnold>frx774: that command would also go through the kernel's block layer caching/buffering
20:19<AlexLearner>Would have bus latency, buffering effects on device... Could be really tricky.
20:20<frx774>sarnold: true, you're right.
20:21<frx774>It's fun to play around with. Just be careful, not to accidentally corrupt your partition/data. :)
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20:29<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>so, i unmounted the nvme, and ran: sudo dd status=progress if=/dev/disk/by-id/nvme-...-part2 1>/dev/null
20:29<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>and 'dd' is reporting around 193 MB/s - this is far less than the '3000 MB/s' read speed advertised by NVMe 3.0... so, what could be wrong here?
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20:30<sarnold>KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV: use a much larger blocksize, try bs=4096 and bs=40960 and bs=524288 and compare the speeds
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20:49<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>that's very interesting... so i removed the 'status=progress' option because I did not want any status I/O to bog down the test, and tried various 'bs=...' (2^...) values going all the way up to 4294967296, and I have not seen it go above 997 MB/s - so, that's still 1/3rd of the advertised speeds.
20:52<sarnold>KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV: those speeds usually require getting multiple requests into the queue -- dd probably doesn't do that. maybe run several at once and see what the sum of the speeds are?
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21:03<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>wow! I did 'iflag=direct', and that did the trick: 111014838272 bytes (111 GB, 103 GiB) copied, 35.9702 s, 3.1 GB/s
21:05<sarnold>let me see if I can scare up an url..
21:06<sarnold>KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV: https://tanelpoder.com/posts/11m-iops-with-10-ssds-on-amd-threadripper-pro-workstation/
21:06<sarnold>KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV: I suspect you'll enjoy at least skimming this
21:09<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>so, if direct I/O is always so-much-faster than buffered-I/O (for example, when using dd), then why would the default be buffered-I/O?
21:11<sarnold>it's complicated :)
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21:24<bole>sarnold do you have any links to help us understand why its complicated?
21:24<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>so, i ran it for a longer time to make sure it wasn't an issue of reading the same disk into the same area of memory, and it is faily consistent at that setting ( bs=16777216 iflag=direct ): 890685620224 bytes (891 GB, 830 GiB) copied, 316.746 s, 2.8 GB/s
21:26<sarnold>bole: nothing that comes to mind immediately, no; a huge number of performance issues in software can be solved by adding more caching, or providing
21:26<sarnold>hunh, where'd that newline come from..
21:27<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>but the 'bs' argument makes a huge difference, running without the bs setting which effectively ( bs=512 iflag=direct ): 1725693952 bytes (1.7 GB, 1.6 GiB) copied, 53.9207 s, 32.0 MB/s
21:27<sarnold>.. or providing APIs that allow conveniently working with smaller amounts of data and batching operations that cross privilege boundies
21:27<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>so, its the combination of 'bs' and 'iflag=direct' arguments that achieves the full/maximum speed.
21:28<sarnold>this is an excellent example -- doing IO in 512 byte blocks requires talking to the kernel 32k times more often than using 16777216 byte blocks
21:28<bole>sarnold ohh ok. then we can say debian's philosophy of stability over anything else governed that decision
21:28<sarnold>and then you just copy 512 bytes over and over again.. that's a lot of boundary checks
21:28<sarnold>bole: no, this predates debian by decades
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21:43<Tasky>Hi
21:43<KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV>within 10 minutes, copied the entire disk! ( bs=4294967296 iflag=direct ) : 1792093020160 bytes (1.8 TB, 1.6 TiB) copied, 574.47 s, 3.1 GB/s
21:43<Tasky>Anyone there?
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21:44<sarnold>hi Tasky
21:44<sarnold>KWqpk8hcYaS4nl7vgCwr3wV: wow :D
21:44<Tasky>Uh, I'm trying to install Debian on a USB, should i knstall Grub?
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21:48<Tasky>Anyone?
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21:49<sarnold>not me, I've only ever used pre-existing live images on usb
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---Logclosed Sat Feb 06 00:00:27 2021