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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-04-27

---Logopened Tue Apr 27 00:00:20 2021
00:01<lhvf[m]><richard_h "I'm sure there's a mobile one to"> I'm already using Element (in an Android Smartphone) Client right now. The Desktop version of Element I've never touched in my life.. :) .
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00:02<richard_h>what I mean is, I'm sure there's a room for the Android version of Element :-)
00:02<richard_h>(there is, I just found it with a search)
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00:13<lhvf[m]>> what I mean is, I'm sure there's a room for the Android version of Element :-)
00:13<lhvf[m]>I'll support helping the Project, futurely. When I accessed a Room last time related to the Client, randomly one Developer guy already putted on me the avaibility and responsibility 'to test new resources and features', 'the screen Mobile alignment', and many others interface intrínsic details that I've never myself take much attention and feel some difference. But I do have a register on GitHub (or yet *GitLab*) to help that guys, and Vector
00:13<lhvf[m]>Community / Element Client, if I'd know where I could start anyway.. Too many detail for a first repaired detail.
00:14<lhvf[m]>* > what I mean is, I'm sure there's a room for the Android version of Element :-)
00:14<lhvf[m]>I'll support helping the Project, futurely. When I accessed a Room last time related to the Client, randomly one Developer guy already putted on me the avaibility and responsibility 'to test new resources and features', 'the screen Mobile alignment', and many others interface intrínsic details that I've never myself take much attention and feel some difference. But I do have a register on GitHub (or yet *GitLab*) to help that guys, and Vector
00:14<lhvf[m]>Community / Element Client, if I'd know where I could start anyway.. Too many details for a first repaired detail.
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00:16<lhvf[m]>* > what I mean is, I'm sure there's a room for the Android version of Element :-)
00:16<lhvf[m]>I'll support helping the Project, futurely. When I accessed a Room last time related to the Client, randomly one Developer guy already putted on me the avaibility and responsibility 'to test new resources and features', 'the screen Mobile alignment', and many others interface intrínsic details that I've never myself take much attention and feel some difference. But I do have a register on GitHub (or yet *GitLab*) to help that guys, and Vector
00:16<lhvf[m]>Community / Element Client, if I'd know where I could start anyway.. Too many details for a first repaired sort of details looked part..
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00:29<twb>Why would "flock /run/x" fail with EBADF?
00:29<twb>Oh I'm an idiot
00:29<twb>"flock /run/x echo hello" works OK
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03:59<FelixActually>Why is it necessary for a package's dependencies to include "conflicts: [the package itself]"?
04:01<twb>FelixActually: that's usually related to packages that change names
04:01<FelixActually>I see
04:01<twb>FelixActually: e.g. if "foo" is dead and "foo-ng" replaces it, foo-ng might have Provides: foo Conflicts: foo Replaces: foo
04:01<twb>This prevents them being installed at the same time
04:02<twb>it also makes upgrades smoother somehow?
04:02<twb>#packaging knows more than me
04:02<FelixActually>I think I understand
04:02<twb>yaaaaaaay
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04:28<Tas-sos>Hello Debian GNU/Linux community o/
04:29<Tas-sos>If I want to setup a firewall, the firewalld its need to unistall something else from my Debian cloud 9 ?
04:29<Tas-sos>Whats your opinion for "secure setup" ?
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04:32<twb>Tas-sos: firewalld is only needed if you need several systems to edit the same firewall
04:32<twb>Tas-sos: if you just need a hand-written firewall, you can use nftables or iptables directly
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04:56<Tas-sos>twb: Thanks for your opinion about iptables and nftables - I also love the basic configuration in "low" level
04:57<twb>Tas-sos: OK great
04:57<twb>Tas-sos: the place to get help with that is #netfilter on freenode
04:57<Tas-sos>but, in this approach now, I want something more general and "easy"
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04:57<twb>Oh OK
04:57<Tas-sos>twb: Oh thanks about the #netfilter channel!
04:57<twb>I don't know much about firewalld
04:58<Tas-sos>so, in this approach the firewalld is the better approach ?
04:58<twb>IT's from Red Hat, so other RH things like GNOME and libvirtd and systemd integrate to it
04:58<twb>The ubuntu equivalent is ufw, which I have used before
04:58<twb>There is also shorewall which is for doing very complicated firewalls
04:59<twb>ufw is easy to do simple rules with
04:59<twb>If you just want to say "allow ssh from anywhere; block everything else", ufw is easy
05:00<twb>Also: if you want an intrusion prevention system (i.e. detect and block attacks), I recommend using sshguard. You can use fail2ban instead, which is more flexible but slower and has stupid defaults.
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06:10<klein>Hi there. I have a package dependency question. My package depends on a specific (old) version of several packages. My "Depends:" line looks like "A (= $version), B (= $version), C (= $version)". I cannot install my package though because A itself also depends on B and C and so, when apt tries to install A as a dependency of my package, it tries to install $newversion of B and C. Unfortunately, packages A, B and C are not my own pack
06:10<klein>ages. Is there a way to tell apt to install all dependencies and their specific $version at the same time?
06:11<klein>I could configure apt pinning, but that is somewhat tricky in my environment.
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06:23<twb>klein: what is this package?
06:23<twb>klein: and yes, it's "apt install ./foo.deb"
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06:30<Tas-sos>Thank you very much for the rich answer and the information you give me! I really appriciate it!
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06:31<Tas-sos>I am use Fail2Ban but I think now is a good time to try the sshguard
06:31<twb>I have been very happy with it
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06:46<klein>twb: it's a custom package with let's say "legacy company software" *sigh*
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06:57<GyrosGeier>hi
06:58<GyrosGeier>I have a machine with systemd now at work, and my usual setup with gpg-agent as ssh-agent no longer works because starting ssh-agent seems to be systemd's responsibility now
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07:00<GyrosGeier>how would I, as a user, indicate to systemd that I'd like to use gpg-agent exclusively?
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07:06<bremner>You want to disable systemd starting gpg-agent?
07:07<twb>GyrosGeier: what you're doing already should Just Work still
07:08<twb>GyrosGeier: /usr/lib/systemd/user/ has .socket files for gpg to be the ssh agent. It will start them if anything talks to that socket.
07:08<twb>GyrosGeier: if you want to control that, run your own gpg agent (or ssh agent) as normal, and set the SSH_AUTH_SOCK variable to point to YOUR socket
07:09<twb>Oh PS: if you run GNOME3, it is actually gnome-keyring-daemon rather than gpg-agent that wins by default
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07:10<FelixActually>I just plugged an external hard drive in and the light on it is on, it's making noise, but it won't show up anywhere. How am I supposed to safely remove it?
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07:17<twb>FelixActually: USB?
07:17<FelixActually>Yes
07:17<twb>FelixActually: spinning rust, or SSD?
07:18<FelixActually>It's not an SSD
07:18<twb>OK.
07:18<twb>It's proooobably fine to just yank it, but.
07:18<twb>If you are worried you can look in /sys/bus/usb and find the device and its hub
07:18<twb>and manually depower them
07:18<twb>possibly you can also find the device in /sys/block, or blkid, or lsblk, and eject or power it down gracefully
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07:20<FelixActually>I'm not sure how to do any of that :(
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07:21<FelixActually>But nothing seems to show up in lsblk
07:21<FelixActually>Nothing except the usual stuff I mean, my internal hard drives
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07:23<twb>if it were me, I would just yank it
07:23<twb>unless it was the last copy of a porn collection or something
07:23<FelixActually>It's either a good hard drive or a bad hard drive and I need to figure that out so I can send the bad one back and get a replacement
07:23<FelixActually>Which has backups on it
07:24<twb>FelixActually: unless your USB adapter understands SMART, you can't do that
07:24<FelixActually>I already did
07:24<FelixActually>But I forgot which is the bad one
07:24<FelixActually>I ran a testdisk scan on both of them and one was taking way longer, so clearly it was the one with a problem
07:24<FelixActually>But I can't remember which drive it was
07:24<twb>look at the serial number on the sticker?
07:25<FelixActually>I didn't note those down
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07:25<FelixActually>They're different colours anyway
07:25<twb>FelixActually: if you had SMART you could issue a self-test
07:25<twb>instead of buggerizing about with userland tests
07:25<FelixActually>All I know is that one was transferring way slower than the other
07:25<FelixActually>I ran a testdisk test and it was going to take 15 hours for one, while only taking 8 for the other
07:25<FelixActually>So clearly one has a problem as they're the same
07:26<twb>That could just as easily be a crap bus
07:27<FelixActually>I used the same USB port for both cases to rule that out
07:27<FelixActually>And the same cable
07:27<twb>Your HDD has built-in diagnostic tools and if you show a failed SMART self-test, the RMA will happen immediately
07:27<FelixActually>I already sorted it out
07:27<twb>And the SMART self test takes 2 to 5 minutes
07:27<FelixActually>I just need to know which is the one to wipe
07:27<twb>So you've just wasted 15 hours
07:28<FelixActually>Well I'll go back in time and tell my past self not to do it then
07:28<FelixActually>Can you please help me figure out how to depower the USB port?
07:28<twb>FelixActually: lsusb, lsusb -t
07:28<twb>FelixActually: work out which one it is, then find it in /sys/bus and echo 0 > .../power
07:29<twb>might be .../power/state or something, I don't remember
07:29<twb>if you're SSH'd in, you can probably just power off all USB devices
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07:29<FelixActually>In /sys/bus/usb/devices/ I have a bunch of numbers and then usb1 to usb8
07:30<FelixActually>And two of them are connected since I have a mouse and keyboard plugged in
07:30<FelixActually>Bus 007 Device 002: Mouse
07:31<FelixActually>Bus 002 Device 002: Keyboard
07:31<FelixActually>I don't know what that means though
07:31<FelixActually>What it relates to
07:31<FelixActually>Wait, now my drive is flashing
07:31<FelixActually>I think it turned itself off
07:31<twb>FelixActually: "bus 7 device 2: mouse" means that the 2nd device on the 7th bus is a mouse
07:32<FelixActually>I don't understand this
07:32<FelixActually>I've had this issue before, plugging in a hard drive and it just won't show up
07:32<FelixActually>I had to restart for it to work
07:32<FelixActually>I just unplugged it since it turned itself off, plugged it into the other port and still nothing
07:32<twb>OK looking at my system...
07:32<GyrosGeier>twb, for me it seems to start ssh-agent instead
07:33<twb>Bus 001 Device 002: ID 04ca:7070 Lite-On Technology Corp. Integrated Camera
07:33<twb>So I probably want something like "echo off >/sys/bus/usb/devices/usb1/power/control"
07:33<twb>I haven't done this for a long time so I don't know the exact defailt
07:33<twb>*details
07:33<GyrosGeier>and when gpg talks to the gpg-agent socket, gpg-agent is started, but in systemd mode
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09:22<psusi>is it possible to boot the netinst iso and have it go toram, and listen for an ssh connection to proceed with the install remotely?
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09:28<gabuscus>psusi: are you looking for this maybe? https://tomasz.ciborski.com/debian-installation-over-ssh/
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09:29<psusi>gabuscus: found that... appears to be outdated... now looking at https://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Remote
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09:29<psusi>kind of surprised that I have to rebuild d-i myself to enable the network console
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09:33<psusi>I was hoping to just have to pass the right kernel command line parameters
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10:11<psusi>I guess I need to write my own rant about existing guides being useless now... you don't need to rebuild anything you just need the right preseed settings to enable the net console...
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10:23<jhutchins>psusi: That would be a nice step. Especially if you dated the post and cited versions where it had been verified.
10:23<jhutchins>psusi: One of the problems of the web is that no matter hoe obsolete, nothing ever goes away.
10:25<jhutchins>psusi: Actually, leave off the rant about existing guides. You might note the obsolete ideas, but focus on positively instructing the current procedures.
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10:44<jhutchins>psusi: I suppose that if any of the existing guides allows comments, you could not there that they're obsolete.
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10:45<Tas-sos>I try to setup a firewall for my Debian GNU/Linux 10 (buster)
10:46<Tas-sos>and I want to setup it via nftables because it is the basic/default in Debian GNU/Linux..
10:46<Tas-sos>but, because I installed the latest version from backports,
10:47<Tas-sos>apt install nftables/buster-backports
10:47<Tas-sos>now every time in reboot, I have this probles.. :-/
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10:48<Tas-sos>https://i.imgur.com/NkvWVAp.png
10:48<Tas-sos>https://i.imgur.com/oqIiN2m.png
10:48<Tas-sos>Ff.. why ? What can I do for that ?
10:48<Tas-sos>now a simple reboot takes about ~5 min for example to be done
10:49<Tas-sos>before this its only takes ~1 min ( max! )
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10:49<jhutchins>Tas-sos: Why do you want an on-host firewall?
10:51<Tas-sos>you mean about a machine who set a firewall for all other machines.. ? No, I don't have this case now
10:52<Tas-sos>I want to setup a very basic ( secure ) firewall for a machine..
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10:56<scorpion2185[m]>Can I make a file in /var only readable?
10:57<scorpion2185[m]>when I restart the system something changes it back.
10:58<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: /var is for variable data... it's supposed to be changable
10:58<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: better to figure out what changes the file and why
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10:58<scorpion2185[m]>not all /var only a file /var/lib/*/user/file
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10:59<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: by convention all data under /var is expected to be changable by whichever application owns/creates the file
11:00<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: regardless of subfolder(s)
11:00<scorpion2185[m]>Is there a way to make that file onyl readable?
11:01<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: apart from the usual chmod?
11:02<scorpion2185[m]>yes, I used the nautilus properties . I thought about fstab but I don't know if can help
11:02<zoke>fstab has nothing to do with single files
11:02<jhutchins>scorpion2185[m]: What file in particular?
11:02<zoke>there is always the possibility to set the immutable flag...
11:03<scorpion2185[m]>/var/lib/accountsservice/users/<some-user>
11:03<zoke>but that may break whatever application that changes the file
11:03<scorpion2185[m]>IS accountsservice that changes the file?
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11:04<jhutchins>scorpion2185[m]: From what to what?
11:05<scorpion2185[m]>It changes the value SystemAccount
11:06<scorpion2185[m]>I made it only readable and it works until I reboot the pc.
11:06<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: what is the uid of the user?
11:06<scorpion2185[m]>0
11:06<scorpion2185[m]>(root)
11:06<zoke>that is considered a system account since uid < 1000
11:07<zoke>why do you need it treated otherwise?
11:08<scorpion2185[m]>I built accountsservice changing minimum uid 1000 to 0 but maybe I miss something.
11:08<scorpion2185[m]>I also saw heristic (?) check minimum uid 500.
11:10<zoke>why?
11:11<zoke>what's the purpouse?
11:11<scorpion2185[m]>Since I ma syadmin I run as root
11:11<zoke>what?!
11:12<zoke>so the goal is to have root show up in gdm3 or what?
11:12<scorpion2185[m]>Yes that's the goal
11:13<zoke>the typical sysadmin approach would be to have a user account and use su/sudo for sysadmin tasks
11:14<zoke>logging in as root from gdm3 is just bad practice imo
11:14<scorpion2185[m]>Some people told me so but I would really like to do so
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11:14<zoke>the easy solution for you is to configure gdm to allow root logins
11:15<scorpion2185[m]>how? It allows root but don't show it in the user list, after I removed a root check in /etc/pam.d
11:16<zoke>do you have the "not listed?" option in gdm?
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11:18<zoke>but really... su/sudo is the way to go about sysadmin tasks
11:18<scorpion2185[m]>User list is enabled , other user is in the list
11:19<zoke>all users with uid >= 1000 shows in the list by default
11:19<e500>Hi, anybody has encountered problem with current debian net inst with the network adapter?
11:19<scorpion2185[m]>Is that "not listed" option?
11:19<scorpion2185[m]>What command can I use for immutable flag?
11:20<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: have you tried the Include option for gdm3 config?
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11:21<Sqrt{not}>e500, what problem ?
11:21<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: https://wiki.debian.org/GDM#Removing_autologin_in_gdm3_and_getting_more_verbose_output_in_GDM
11:21<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: look at the [greeter] section
11:22<Sqrt{not}>scorpion2185[m], as others have told you, it is a bad idea to run as root all the time. don't do it!
11:23<zoke>Sqrt{not}: he seems eager enough to shoot himself in the foot... why not provide him with a gun to do it :p
11:23<Sqrt{not}>!tell e500 -about anyone
11:23<e500>Sqrt{not}, the link is up, the cable is ok, the ip is static and correct... I can't ping any ip address in my network.
11:24<e500>I can't figure out witch is the problem?
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11:24<scorpion2185[m]>I checked that file on my system there is no [greeter] section, thanks.
11:24<scorpion2185[m]>I' ll try to use Include=root, user1
11:24<Sqrt{not}>e500, are you having a problem while running the netinst installer, or do you have a problem after starting the installed system?
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11:25<e500>Sqrt{not} both, during netinst process and after.
11:26<scorpion2185[m]>On some distros by default there is only root no normal users.
11:26<scorpion2185[m]>Why can't Debian support it better?
11:26<Sqrt{not}>e500, if you get to "after", it sounds like the network must be OK during the install?
11:26<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: those distros expect a real sysadmin to create all the relevant user accounts
11:27<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: debian just helps you out during the install with creating an inital account for said sysadmin
11:27<e500>Sqrt{not}, I've installer via USB, (this is server no-gui install).
11:28<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: so that hw/she can go about the proper way of using su/sudo when in need of elevated priviledges
11:28<e500>dmesg is clean
11:28<Sqrt{not}>e500, are you using a "netinst" version of the installer? what is the name of the .iso file you copied to the USB?
11:29<e500>Sqrt{not}, let me check.
11:29<scorpion2185[m]>I think that for example Kali is designed to be used as root, root log in is enabled on gnome.
11:29<scorpion2185[m]>And Puppy linux devs think like me
11:30<e500>Debian GNU/Linux 10.9.0 "Buster" - Official amd64 NETINST - 20210327-10:38
11:30<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: kali is a special case distro which is not intended for everyday use outside of its design parameters which are pentesting
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11:31<Sqrt{not}>e500, OK good. Are you saying the installation process works OK, but when you are running in the new installed system, you need help to configure the network?
11:33<e500>Sqrt{not}, I've configured the network card with /etc/network/interfaces and then checked with "ip a" and seems ok.
11:34<zoke>e500: how about ip route? is there an entry for the local lan?
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11:34<e500>routing is ok for the local lan and default route on eno1
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11:35<e500>I'm looking for a method/command to inspect the problem... the I'll try to install debian9
11:35<zoke>e500: taking eno1 as this is a physical machine
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11:36<zoke>e500: any vlan configuration on the switch ports perhaps?
11:36<scorpion2185[m]>e500: When I installed Deb 10 (many times) I needed to start over to fix connection problems
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11:38<e500>zoke, no
11:38<e500>scorpion2185[m], interesting ...
11:38<e500>Ok, thanks for the support!
11:39<scorpion2185[m]>*Sometimes I needed to start over the installation
11:39<scorpion2185[m]>(od the many times)
11:40<scorpion2185[m]>and obviously using Include = root, user1 didn't work.
11:40<scorpion2185[m]>Now i resintalled the accountsservice package, maybe is the minimu uid check so
11:41<Maulkin>scorpion2185[m]: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gdm-list/2010-March/msg00022.html
11:41<Maulkin>scorpion2185[m]: The root account isn't functional as a normal user account in various ways
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11:44<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: root login over ssh has also been disabled by default for quite some time now. For good reasons. Use a regular account and su/sudo
11:45<Simone_>hi, my connection via internet, has stop to work, if i give you some output maybe you can help me, but i need help for the command to give in emulator
11:45<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: the only valid place for a direct root login would be at a local tty in emergency situations
11:45<zoke>scorpion2185[m]: and absolutely not an X session
11:46<Sqrt{not}>e500, sounds like you are almost there. I don't think you need to reinstall. maybe give us a little more detail, and try to figure out what is slightly off in your new install
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11:52<e500>Sqrt{not}, I can't find a command or a log to inspect the problem. I'll try with deb9, then with deb10 with the offline version, so I can install ethtool
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11:55<Sqrt{not}>e500, the networking system evolved somewhat between deb.9 and deb.10 take a look at: https://www.debian.org/releases/buster/amd64/release-notes/index.en.html and https://wiki.debian.org/NewInBuster
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11:57<Sqrt{not}>e500, or... stay here and tell us more about the problem.. there are many here who can point you to helpful tools or helpful logs.
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12:00<zoke>e500: 'ip link' shows state as UP?
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12:01<e500>ip link ... eno1: <BROADCAST,MULTICAST,UP,LOWER_UP> mtu 1500 qdisk pfifo_fast state UP mode DEFAULT group default qlen 1000
12:02<zoke>looks about right
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12:07<Sqrt{not}>e500: how does `ip route` look?
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12:28<e500>Sqrt{not}, thanks
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12:50<blast007>"tap0901 error: Failed to uninstall driver: The operation completed successfully. (Code 0x00000000)" ERROR: Success!
12:51<blast007>And then it aborts the uninstall... ffs...
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12:51<blast007>oh, wrong channel, sorry :)
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12:52<blast007>(The OpenVPN client would probably be much smoother on Debian, though...)
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14:01<xcc6>hi. can someone share a link or tell me what packages i need to install after doing "dpkg --add-architecture i386" to be able to run a 32 bit executable? i search online but get old articles from long ago
14:03<coc0nut>doesnt it depends on what the 32 bit executable depends on? sounds abit weird to me, but im not a debian professional, im a novice ;o
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14:04<xcc6>no i think it should just be some basic 32 bit library but i can't fine what it is on debian's wiki
14:05<cc>what happens when try try running it?
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14:05<cc>and what is your native architecture?
14:06<xcc6>it just says "no such file or directory" even though there really is. and when i file "file" on it, it says it's a "ELF 32-bit LSB executable"
14:06<xcc6>when i *run
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14:09<scorpion2185[m]>Maulkin: That gnome mai lis from 2010, gnome 2 days.
14:09<scorpion2185[m]>Now gnome 3 works fine with root
14:10<sarnold>xcc6: you'll also need to install whatever libraries and loaders that it needs
14:11<sarnold>xcc6: try ldd on the thing; it might not work, in which case objdump can do it (objdump is the much better tool anyway, I just don't know the arguments necessary off the top of my head)
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14:13<xcc6>sarnold: ldd says it's "not a dynamic executable". i found something online that said i can install ia32-libs but is see that's no longer in debian. so it sound like there's some generic 32-bit libraries package that replaced it which i need
14:14<xcc6>https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/ia32-libs
14:15<Maulkin>scorpion2185[m]: It doesn't. polkit, dbus and systemd have edge cases where it being run as root will confuse it being in a user session compared to a system one.
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14:17<Maulkin>In any case, you're kinda on your own if you want to log in as root through gdm.
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14:21<apkef>xcc6: can you tell us the name of the excecutable
14:22<xcc6>yes, it's wine. it comes with a 64 bit executible and a 32 bit one. it's the 32 bit that i am having trouble with. this was installed through the wine package in debian repos
14:23<xcc6>and i know it sounds obvious to use the 64 bit version instead, but apparently the windows app i am launching is 32 bit so i need to use the 32 bit executible
14:24<apkef>after add-architecture i386 did you do "apt update"?
14:25<scorpion2185[m]>Somebody gave some help...
14:25<scorpion2185[m]>only becasue you don't like/share the idea doesn't mean that you mustn't help
14:25<xcc6>yes apkef
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14:26<coc0nut>why dont apt have a command like: alias aptup='apt update ; apt full-upgrade ; apt autoremove ; apt autoclean ; apt clean'
14:26<coc0nut>:p
14:27<apkef>xcc6: apt install wine32 ???
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14:29<xcc6>apkef: oh good idea, let me try
14:31<xcc6>yea that's also wanting to install about a hundred i386 packages as dependencies so that looks like the solution. thanks apkef
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14:36<sarnold>xcc6: oh bugger :( what does 'file' think of your executable?
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14:38<xcc6>sarnold: wine: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version 1 (SYSV). but after adding the i386 architecture i got it working thanks to apkef by installing the 32 bit version of wine which grabbed its own 32 bit dependencies
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14:38<sarnold>xcc6: oh nice nice nice :D
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14:43<jhutchins>coc0nut: Because that would be easy enough for a user who wanted it to configure.
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14:52<coc0nut>jhutchins, its nice tho! i feel like Mr Robot :)
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14:54<jhutchins>There are good reasons for doing it manually and observing the output.
14:56<coc0nut>yeah offcourse, always nice to have options!
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15:25<psusi>hrm... d-i appareently now installs under a subvol named @rootfs when you use btrfs... I thoguht that used to just be called @
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15:33<psusi>hrm... can you not get the standard iso image to loop mount its image from a hard disk instead of a cdrom?
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15:40<sarnold>psusi: the usual use case for the iso is to dd the thing to a usb memory stick; 'loopback' feels like the place where you might have gone wrong, that shouldn't even be necessary, assuming I've guessed your question correctly
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15:44<psusi>don't have a usb stick... trying to boot a vps and install from image on hard disk
15:45<psusi>it looks like yuo're supposed to download hd-media/ kernel and initrd... is the iso-scan d-i component not included in the normal image?
15:45<sney>the normal image always works fine for my vm installs
15:45<psusi>I think it was on Ubuntu so you could just pass command line arguments from grub to tell the installer where the iso image was on the hard disk
15:45<sney>it's hybrid, it works as both iso or usb-media, and qemu can boot it directly without doing any weird stuff with mounting the image
15:46<psusi>sney: sure.. when you have a console... vps has no console
15:46<sarnold>does debian have any cloud-instance media that you could just boot directly into and pass in a user-data to cloud-init?
15:46<sney>sounds cheap lol
15:46<psusi>and when you can configure the vm to boot from the iso
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15:46<sarnold>eg skip the installer entirely
15:46<psusi>vps comes with preconfigured images you boot the instance from, skipping the installer... I'd like to get it to boot the installer
15:47<sney>there are images on cloud.debian.net but the last time I saw someone try that, there were issues with logging in
15:47<sney>er, cloud.debian.org
15:47<psusi>can't get amzon to boot into custom install images
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15:47<psusi>hence the need to take an existing image, modify it to boot the iso, and preseed it to enable the net console
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15:48<psusi>I tried the hd-media kernel/initrd but for some reason, iso-scan says it can't find the iso image I put in the root
15:48<sney>maybe if you put mini.iso in /boot, you could chainload it from grub? https://www.gnu.org/software/grub/manual/grub/html_node/Chain_002dloading.html
15:49<psusi>that's essentially the idea
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15:49<psusi>I've done that with Ubuntu in the past but having a hard time getting it to work with debian
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15:51<sney>to your original question, yes, the debian iso does mount with loopback: https://paste.debian.net/1195420/
15:52<psusi>that's interesting... the kernel image aparently doesn't have the xen blockdev driver in it... it still sees the hard disk as /dev/sda instead of /dev/xvda
15:52<sney>if yours isn't, maybe it's a mangled download
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15:52<psusi>yes, grub can boot the kernel, but I can't get the installer to work after that
15:52<psusi>says it can't find the installation medium
15:53<psusi>also that paste just showed you mounting the image, not booting it
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15:56<sney>the "cannot find installation medium" error is a common result of tools that unpack the installer iso and modify it, too. you're probably seeing essentially the same thing - which is why I wonder if you can't chainload grub to boot *the iso*, chainloading the isolinux bootloader, rather than trying to reverse-engineer it.
15:56<psusi>nope... image boots just fine normally
15:57<sney>nono, I mean that by mounting the image and trying to boot its components, you're getting the same result as those tools that don't understand how the image it supposed to work
15:57<sney>this ubuntu doc skips over some of the details but there might be useful clues within: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Grub2/ISOBoot
15:57<psusi>it seems that the normal initrd only looks for the image on a cdrom drive and won't recongnize it on a hd... tried the hd-media version and it seems to be doing an iso-scan to find the iso, but won't find it
15:57<psusi>I'm thinking maybe it's because its on btrfs and I put it in the real root instead of under /@rootfs?
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15:58<psusi>or maybe I just need to preseed to tell it the actual path to the image
15:59<psusi>oh damnit... the installation medium does not contain the btrfs kenrel module?!
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16:00<sney>it should, btrfs in the list of available filesystems. it's probably just in a separate udeb.
16:01<psusi>right... and that udeb is in the pool which is inside the iso which d-i needs to load in order to find the iso
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16:08<psusi>got to love circular dependencies
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17:39<spib>hey all, can I ask a question about xscreensaver on debian here?
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17:41<sney>yes
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17:42<spib>thanks. So I am having some trouble having the Screen Lock after the Xscreensaver kicks in, using wayland. is there any way of using xscreensaver and being prompted to log in again?
17:44<spib>following man xscreensaver i have disabled all locking/dimming in gnome. This is the error it gives after running "xscreensaver -nosplash" which is also enable on login: > locking is disabled (Cannot lock securely under Wayland)
17:45<sney>aiui, xscreensaver relies on xorg to function effectively as a screen locker. that error is not surprising at all
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17:47<spib>so... I have to choose between gnome or the beautiful xscreensaver
17:48<spib>or configure something different than wayland\
17:48<sney>gnome with xorg is already on your system, select it at login
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17:48<spib>well, i will be right back then
17:48<sney>in gdm3 iirc there is a little menu next to the login button and the password field
17:48<spib>:)
17:49<spib>that does ring a bell
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17:51<spib>well, yep that did the trick!
17:51<spib>awesome
17:51<sney>great!
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17:52<spib>now i just have to disable logging in using wayland. if it does, it will never lock
17:53<spib>thank you sney!
17:53<sney>np
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17:53<sarnold>there's got to be a way to lock the screen in wayland; it just might not have the cool galaxy effects or ants etc
17:53<sney>gdm3 will save the session type on its own, now that you are logged in to gnome on xorg that will continue to be the default
17:54<spib>fair enough, i could try enabling the screen lock in gnome gui, and see if they can still live together in harmony when in xorg
17:54<spib>ah that does make it a lot easier
17:56<sney>xscreensaver's "hacks" are individual binaries, so it stands to reason that someone could use them with a native wayland locker, after some modification of course
17:56<sney>a cursory web search doesn't turn up any evidence of this existing yet. but I'm sure there's demand for it.
17:57<spib>yeah in their man page (xscreensaver) they say gnome uses an inferior, older version of xscreensaver, but their manpage does look a bit dated!
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17:58<sney>jwz (the inventor of xscreensaver and arguably the father of the modern web browser) is known for editorializing in his man pages, haha
17:58<spib>"For the better part of a decade, GNOME shipped xscreensaver as-is, and
17:58<spib> everything just worked out of the box. In 2005, however, they decided
17:58<spib> to re-invent the wheel and ship their own replacement for the xscreen‐
17:58<spib> saver daemon called "gnome-screensaver", rather than improving xscreen‐
17:58<spib> saver and contributing their changes back. As a result, the "gnome-
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17:58<sney>yeah, don't do that
17:58<spib>oops! thats a new line
17:58<spib>haha
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17:59<spib>yeah it sort of reads like a tabloid
17:59<spib>but it's very expansive and well written
18:02<spib>interesting
18:02<spib>using at least two of his products right this moment
18:02<spib>:)
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18:06<spib>thanks again, and apologies for the spam
18:06<spib>good night
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18:24<DGF>Hi. Does anyone has any suggestions for software that repairs USB after burning ISO image to boot linux?
18:27<gr_wity>depends on how the USB broke, exactly
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18:30<DGF>gr_wity: I don't really know... I just know that if I insert the usb into the pc(mac) it says "computer couldn't read the connected device" and when I go to disk utilitys it shows the external disk (usb) only has 2.3mb but it had 16GB
18:31<DGF>I used some software to burn the iso image into the usb
18:32<sney>wiping the partition table would probably do it, there is the 'wipefs' tool, or anything that can edit partitions
18:35<DGF>I tried to do https://www.easeus.com/partition-master/restore-usb-flash-drive-to-full-capacity.html (the mac steps) but it didn't work. wipefs is for Linux, are there any software for mac/windows (it's what I'm currently using)
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18:35<sney>this is #debian, all of our recommendations will be linux tools
18:36<sney>osx should be able to cat /dev/zero > /path/to/usb/device and that'll probably erase the partition table, but 0 promises that it'll actually have the right effect.
18:37<sney>tl;dr: find a mac channel and ask them
18:37<gr_wity>if the issue is the computer not recognizing the partition table, careful usage of /dev/zero will work, as it overwrites the partition table and everything... but if the issue is the USB stick's flash controller dying, nothing will help
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18:39<sney>windows typically expects a usb drive to only have 1 partition, so it's common for it to only recognize the 1st partition if a multi-partition image was used. I'm assuming osx is doing the same thing here.
18:39<DGF>Since people here probably had the problem there could be people that know how to do it in mac/windows. The problem was after installing Debian iso, that's why I'm here. I doubt some mac/windows forum knows about that since mac/windows users don't really need to go around and burng iso images...
18:41<sney>and overwriting the first part of the disk with zeros will erase the partition table, which will make your disk utility see it as blank. I just can't be sure because for all I know, OSX does some shenanigans that prevent you from writing data directly to a block device.
18:41<sney>ask your mac/windows support people how to erase the partition table, then. that's the important task.
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18:46<DGF>Well, I'm on the linux people since I use the 3 OS, I'm just affraid on doing it on Linux with command line since I don't really know what I'm doing and might erase all disk
18:46<sney>#debian is for debian support only.
18:47<sney>you already have the linux recommendations: use wipefs, or cat /dev/zero > /path/to/usb/device . (these do the same thing.)
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18:49<sney>if you are afraid to do it in linux, then go to freenode and ask in ##windows or ##apple how to erase a partition table.
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18:53<DGF>This is a debian question since it happen after installing it... It should be something that the Debian support should be prepared to asnwer (at least in their website, if they are trying to bring people from other OS - which they are...). Thanks anyway tho
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18:57<Sqrt{not}>I see they left already, but can't fdisk be used to create a brand-new partition table on a USB stick?
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18:58<sney>they were asking for tools to do it in osx or window
18:59<Sqrt{not}>they said "I use the 3 OS, I'm just affraid on doing it on Linux with command line since I don't really know what I'm doing" -- maybe I misinterpret, but sounds like they could try a linux command
18:59<Sqrt{not}>anyway, all theoretical at this point.
18:59<sney>wipefs is a linux command, with 1 step. and their response to that was "wipefs is for Linux, are there any software for mac/windows (it's what I'm currently using)"
19:00<sney>indeed
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19:00<sney>it'd be ideal if those other OSes could concieve of a removable drive with more than one partition, but that's even more theoretical
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19:05<TobiX>It would be nice if the suggested "flash burning" tools (Etcher, Win32DiscImager, etc.) would also provide a simple "reset" or "wipe" button
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19:08<TobiX>dpkg: usb install
19:08<dpkg>You can install Debian from a USB stick/thumbdrive/pen drive/key on x86 systems, as long as your system's BIOS can boot from USB. Details are in the Installation Guide, see http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/ch04s03 and ask me about <install debian> for hybrid CD/DVD images. Use http://sf.net/projects/win32diskimager/ to write images from Windows. For BIOSes not capable of USB boot, ask me about <plop>.
19:09<TobiX>Could someone remove the last sentence? Those systems are a subset of oooooooold non-64-bit systems :D
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19:59<jminty>easy disk encryption pass change?
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20:02<jminty>Lello lello
20:03<sney>your vague question is probably answered somewhere on https://wiki.debian.org/LVM
20:03<sney>if it isn't, try describing the whole issue
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20:22<jminty>i know my password, I want to change the password
20:23<jminty>i was looking for an easy command like lvmchange or passwd
20:26-!-czesmir [~stefan@aecz119.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:27<sney>the wiki page linked above indicates that it's cryptsetup luksChangeKey <device>
20:27<sney>you omit the -S argument so it doesn't add a second passphrase
20:28-!-jminty_ [~jminty@45.87.214.106] has joined #debian
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20:31<jminty_>maybe im just not seeing it, backing up is the same as change out?
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20:32-!-}ls{ is "nobody" on #kvm #qemu #debian-nginx #debian-lan #debian-kde #debian-django #debian
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20:36<jminty_>seems like a perfect way to make a install
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21:09-!-thiras is "Ant Somers" on #debian
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21:18-!-j_f-f is "J\xF6rg Frings-F\xFCrst" on #debconf18-taiwan #debian #debian-xfce #debian-games #debconf-miniauditorio #debian-ubuntu
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21:37-!-dlehn4 is "David I. Lehn" on #debian #vtluug
21:37-!-arand [~arand@c-0a01235c.05-662-7570703.bbcust.telenor.se] has joined #debian
21:37-!-arand is "Martin Erik Werner" on #debian-next #debian-games #debian
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22:06-!-nuc is "realname" on #debian
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22:18-!-sedimentary is "realname" on #debian
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22:22-!-cer-0 is "0" on #debian #tor-south
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22:38-!-cer0 is "cer0" on #debian #tor-project #tor-south
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22:44-!-secntech is "tp" on #tor-project #suckless #redditprivacy #Qubes_OS #privacytech #freedombox #debian #cryptoparty
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22:47-!-cer-0 is "cer0" on #debian #tor-south
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22:47-!-Surfer2011 is "Surfer2011" on #debian
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22:49-!-cer-0 is "cer0" on #debian #tor-south
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23:04-!-cer-0 is "cer0" on #debian #tor-project #tor-south
23:04-!-cer-0 is now known as cer0
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23:07-!-nyov is "nyov" on #debian-offtopic #oftc #debian #luakit
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23:43-!-leosilva is "leosilva" on #debian
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23:48-!-agentcas1y is "Mark" on #debian #freedombox #debian-next #mobian
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---Logclosed Wed Apr 28 00:00:22 2021