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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-05-01

---Logopened Sat May 01 00:00:26 2021
00:02-!-cooldude [~cooldude1@server-172-81-182-182.blackhole.mycooldude.info] has joined #debian
00:02-!-cooldude is "Jordie" on #moocows #linode #debian #bitlbee
00:05-!-diogenes_oftc [~diogenes_@188.208.121.81] has joined #debian
00:05-!-diogenes_oftc is "Nicolas" on #debian
00:10-!-cooldude [~cooldude1@server-172-81-182-182.blackhole.mycooldude.info] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
00:17-!-tnewman [~tnewman@1-171-214-98.dynamic-ip.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: Ping timeout (120 seconds)]
00:17-!-tnewman [~tnewman@1-171-214-98.dynamic-ip.hinet.net] has joined #debian
00:17-!-tnewman is "Travis Newman" on #debian
00:25-!-cooldude [~cooldude1@server-172-81-182-182.blackhole.mycooldude.info] has joined #debian
00:25-!-cooldude is "Jordie" on #oftc #linode #debian #bitlbee
00:31-!-nuC_ [~nuc@i59F77FAC.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:32-!-ddsys [~ddsys@0002a5a5.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
00:34-!-nor [~nor@182.232.136.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:35-!-RedSoxFan07 [~Thunderbi@d-159-250-218-50.ct.cpe.atlanticbb.net] has joined #debian
00:35-!-RedSoxFan07 is "RedSoxFan07" on #debian-next #debian
00:35-!-jmux_ [~jan-marek@2a01:c22:7a00:5e00:a427:9b2c:768a:7f42] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
00:36-!-thomasross [~thomasros@ip-66-159-116-196.dsl.csolve.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:36-!-nu-c [~nuc@i59F77FAC.versanet.de] has joined #debian
00:36-!-nu-c is "realname" on #debian
00:59-!-sig_9 [~sig@dialup-208-98-133-190.fmtc.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:04-!-Ben [Ben@mrbenc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
01:07-!-MisterC [Ben@mrbenc.net] has joined #debian
01:07-!-MisterC is "Ben C." on #oftc #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian @#MrC
01:10-!-josheva [~oftc-webi@64-46-3-201.dyn.novuscom.net] has joined #debian
01:10-!-josheva is "OFTC WebIRC Client" on #debian
01:10-!-craigevil [~craig@00012e49.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
01:13-!-debianinside [~debian@0002b11d.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: debianinside]
01:14-!-kmshanah_ [~kmshanah@pa49-178-2-50.pa.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #debian
01:14-!-kmshanah_ is "Kevin Shanahan" on #debian
01:15-!-kmshanah [~kmshanah@pa49-178-72-13.pa.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:18-!-mode/#debian [+l 664] by debhelper
01:20-!-bagira [~bagira@0002b267.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
01:20-!-bagira is "realname" on #debian #ohiolinux #oftc
01:21-!-ftobich [~fabio@seven.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
01:24-!-os_ [~Usama@92.45.19.43] has joined #debian
01:24-!-os_ is "realname" on #debian-next #debian
01:24-!-hele [~hele@88-115-23-57.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #debian
01:24-!-hele is "hele" on #debian-next #debian
01:31-!-muppet [~muppet@1.158.15.17] has joined #debian
01:31-!-muppet is "Muppet!" on #debian
01:34-!-bagira [~bagira@0002b267.user.oftc.net] has quit [autokilled: This host violated network policy. (2021-05-01 05:34:22)]
01:34-!-Ericounet [~Eric@2a01:e0a:d0:3c20:529a:41f9:1a9c:89f1] has joined #debian
01:34-!-Ericounet is "realname" on #freedombox #debian
01:36-!-RedSoxFan07 [~Thunderbi@d-159-250-218-50.ct.cpe.atlanticbb.net] has quit [Quit: RedSoxFan07]
01:53-!-ol [~quassel@2406:e003:81f:2801:8e89:a5ff:feca:57fe] has joined #debian
01:53-!-ol is "Ol" on #debian
01:59-!-warsoul [~warsoul@00021ddc.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
01:59-!-warsoul is "Unknown" on #debian
02:01-!-warsoul [~warsoul@00021ddc.user.oftc.net] has quit []
02:03-!-josheva [~oftc-webi@64-46-3-201.dyn.novuscom.net] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
02:06-!-}ls{ [~kalle@000199a5.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: real life interrupt]
02:31-!-nu-c [~nuc@i59F77FAC.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:32-!-edeak [~edeak@25.14.63.94.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
02:35-!-peregrine8 [~peregrine@45.133.172.68] has joined #debian
02:35-!-peregrine8 is "realname" on #debian-xfce #linux #debian-next #debian
02:38-!-Madatnek [~adamd@c-3f0371d5.046-15-7673745.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:47-!-mzf [~mzf@0002ab8d.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
02:47-!-mzf is "realname" on #salsaci #debian-next #debian-offtopic #debian-hpc #minidebconf-online #mini-DebConf-fr #debian
02:48-!-peylight_ [~peylight@ip40.ip-51-178-165.eu] has joined #debian
02:48-!-peylight [~peylight@peylight.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
02:48-!-peylight_ is "https://wiki.debian.org/peylight" on #debian-ir #debian-java #debian-social #debian-fasttrack #oftc #debian-games #rust #packaging #openconnect #debian
02:48-!-Madatnek [~adamd@c-3f0371d5.046-15-7673745.bbcust.telenor.se] has joined #debian
02:48-!-Madatnek is "adamd" on #debian
02:50-!-peylight_ [~peylight@ip40.ip-51-178-165.eu] has quit []
02:50-!-peylight [~peylight@ip40.ip-51-178-165.eu] has joined #debian
02:50-!-peylight is "https://wiki.debian.org/peylight" on #debian-ir #debian-java #debian-social #debian-fasttrack #oftc #debian-games #rust #packaging #openconnect #debian
02:52-!-ibx [~PA@45.83.220.203] has joined #debian
02:52-!-ibx is "realname" on #debian
02:53-!-andibmu [~andi@i5E866486.versanet.de] has joined #debian
02:53-!-andibmu is "Andreas B. Mundt" on #debian-meeting #debian #debian-next #debian-offtopic #debian-edu #debian-lan
02:55-!-wallacer [~quassel@2001:bc8:1824:9a:cafe:babe:b00b:aa01] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
02:55-!-wallacer [~quassel@2001:bc8:1824:9a:cafe:babe:b00b:aa01] has joined #debian
02:55-!-wallacer is "quassel" on #mobian #oftc #debian #bcachefs #aqi-data-share #bcache #llvm #virt #Qubes_OS #ceph-devel #badgeteam #publiclab #C #qemu #ceph #freedombox #ovirt #debian-next #mm #moocows
03:00-!-Madatnek [~adamd@c-3f0371d5.046-15-7673745.bbcust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:00-!-lukaso666 [~lukaso666@109.95.144.165] has joined #debian
03:00-!-lukaso666 is "realname" on #mobian #debian
03:11-!-totonika [~toto@aftr-37-201-215-121.unity-media.net] has joined #debian
03:11-!-totonika is "realname" on #debian-next #debian
03:15-!-zleap [~zleap3@00028cc7.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
03:15-!-zleap is "realname" on #minidebconf-online #debian-academy #debian
03:18-!-magyar [~magyar@00015973.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
03:19-!-ol [~quassel@2406:e003:81f:2801:8e89:a5ff:feca:57fe] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:21-!-awal1 [~awal1@bras-base-mtrlpq0315w-grc-22-70-55-159-196.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
03:38-!-zleap [~zleap3@00028cc7.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
03:51-!-ao2 [~ao2@host-79-23-23-183.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #debian
03:51-!-ao2 is "ao2" on #vcs-home #debian #cell
03:53-!-tomg is now known as Guest2748
03:53-!-tomg [~tomg@64-7-147-206.agas1a-dynamic.dsl.sentex.ca] has joined #debian
03:53-!-tomg is "Tom Goulet" on #debian
03:53-!-gry [~kvirc@203-129-25-247.cb8119.syd.static.aussiebb.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:54<RedEagle>what is command/tool to clean all junk file left after building/compiling packages.?
03:55<joostvb>debclean
03:55<joostvb>is one of them
03:55<RedEagle>ok
03:55-!-estelle [~estelle@2a01:e0a:5b9:7840:102:7a74:5b21:2d42] has joined #debian
03:55-!-estelle is "PEREZ Estelle" on #debian
03:56<RedEagle>its tool?
03:56-!-yangyan15689357297 [~yangyan15@119.185.195.4] has joined #debian
03:56-!-yangyan15689357297 is "realname" on #debian
03:56<RedEagle>command not found ! neither is package in repo
03:56-!-yangyan15689357297 [~yangyan15@119.185.195.4] has quit []
03:57-!-Human_G33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has joined #debian
03:57-!-Human_G33k is "realname" on #debian #debian-devel-changes #debian-meeting #debian-next #debian-java #debian-gitlab #open-source-java
03:57<joostvb>it's shipped with the devscripts package
03:57-!-secntech [~secntech@0002a124.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
03:58-!-diogenes_oftc [~diogenes_@188.208.121.81] has quit [Quit: vergissmeinnicht]
03:59-!-trylam [~estelle@2a01:e0a:5b9:7840:102:7a74:5b21:2d42] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:59-!-kmshanah [~kmshanah@pa49-178-67-222.pa.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #debian
03:59-!-kmshanah is "Kevin Shanahan" on #debian
03:59-!-HumanGeek [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:00<RedEagle>ok
04:00-!-Guest2748 [~tomg@64-7-151-36.border7-dynamic.dsl.sentex.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:01-!-kmshanah_ [~kmshanah@pa49-178-2-50.pa.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:02-!-f10_ [~flo@ip5b402e34.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #debian
04:02-!-f10_ is "f10" on #debian
04:02-!-menace [~someone@2001:a61:35d8:701:21ba:8634:3e5b:5247] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:05-!-Maduro51 [~4564asdf6@159.147.255.152] has joined #debian
04:05-!-Maduro51 is "Si SI" on #debian
04:10-!-nuc [~nuc@i59F77FAC.versanet.de] has joined #debian
04:10-!-nuc is "realname" on #debian
04:13-!-bentham [~bentham@7YZAAAW8A.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
04:17-!-erle- [~stephan@2a04:ee41:3:3297:fbb5:873d:bc1:f6b1] has joined #debian
04:17-!-erle- is "Stephan" on #mobian #openttd #debian #debian-raspberrypi
04:18-!-freshtube [~freshtube@94.46.24.51] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
04:18-!-bentham is "Jeremy Bentham" on #oftc
04:18-!-bentham [~bentham@8L3AAA64U.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #debian
04:20-!-pranith [~Pranith@c-107-3-165-39.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:25-!-freshtube [~freshtube@94.198.43.36] has joined #debian
04:25-!-freshtube is "realname" on #redditprivacy #debian
04:31-!-dogsleg_ [~dogsleg@212.220.200.246] has joined #debian
04:31-!-dogsleg_ is "Lev Lamberov" on #debian-social #debian-l10n-russian #debian-devel-changes #debian-meeting #debian
04:31-!-dogsleg [~dogsleg@00020bdd.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
04:37-!-dogsleg_ [~dogsleg@212.220.200.246] has quit [Quit: "IRC overdose"]
04:37-!-gateway2000 [~gateway20@cpe-172-100-180-15.stny.res.rr.com] has joined #debian
04:37-!-gateway2000 is "realname" on #debian
04:37-!-dogsleg [~dogsleg@00020bdd.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
04:37-!-dogsleg is "Lev Lamberov" on #debian-social #debian-l10n-russian #debian-devel-changes #debian-meeting #debian-haskell #debian-i18n #debian
04:46-!-chomwitt [~alexander@2a02:587:dc0a:2700:39fb:67a3:1f47:16d] has joined #debian
04:46-!-chomwitt is "realname" on #debian #debian-games #debian-social #debian-xfce #openstreetmap #qemu
04:47-!-pamaury_ [~pamaury@2a02:c7f:60fd:1100:8286:9881:abe9:3d42] has joined #debian
04:47-!-pamaury_ is "Amaury Pouly" on #debian-next #oftc #debian
04:48-!-uem01010104 [~UEM010104@p579afab2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
04:50-!-TheRuralJuror [~quassel@178.115.237.87.static.drei.at] has joined #debian
04:50-!-TheRuralJuror is "AP,,," on #security #debian-next #debian.or.at #debian
04:51-!-uem01010104 [~UEM010104@p579afab2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #debian
04:51-!-uem01010104 is "purple" on #debian
04:55-!-nuc [~nuc@i59F77FAC.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:55-!-menace [~someone@2001:a61:35d8:701:8c38:ceca:7e27:aef1] has joined #debian
04:55-!-menace is "someone" on #debian #debian-ubuntu #packaging #freedombox #virt
04:57-!-os_ [~Usama@92.45.19.43] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
04:57-!-os_ [~Usama@92.45.19.43] has joined #debian
04:57-!-os_ is "realname" on #debian #debian-next
05:00-!-menace [~someone@2001:a61:35d8:701:8c38:ceca:7e27:aef1] has quit []
05:15-!-bagira_ [~bagira@cpe-71-65-65-144.cinci.res.rr.com] has joined #debian
05:15-!-bagira_ is "realname" on #oftc #ohiolinux #debian
05:15-!-blue_penquin [~blue_penq@8A4AAAV54.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #debian
05:15-!-blue_penquin is "blue_penquin" on #debian
05:18-!-mode/#debian [+l 670] by debhelper
05:19-!-hele [~hele@88-115-23-57.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
05:19-!-finsternis [~Y@00026e28.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:20-!-bagira_ is now known as bagira
05:20-!-sh9 [~sh9@softbank060116136158.bbtec.net] has joined #debian
05:20-!-sh9 is "sh9" on #qemu #debian
05:33-!-sh9 [~sh9@softbank060116136158.bbtec.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.9]
05:34-!-gabuscus [~quassel@0002aa59.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
05:36-!-grummund [~grummund@00019318.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:39-!-gabuscus [~quassel@79.114.113.139] has joined #debian
05:39-!-gabuscus is "gabuscus" on #debian #debian-puppet
05:41-!-pamaury_ [~pamaury@2a02:c7f:60fd:1100:8286:9881:abe9:3d42] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.]
05:46-!-pamaury_ [~pamaury@94.0.43.66] has joined #debian
05:46-!-pamaury_ is "Amaury Pouly" on #debian-next #oftc #debian
05:53-!-d4nk [~gnu@8A4AAAVAL.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
05:53-!-grummund [~grummund@00019318.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
05:53-!-grummund is "Unknown" on #virt #debian
06:01-!-voyager1 [~voyager1@0002a22b.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
06:01-!-voyager1 is "user" on #debian
06:02-!-root [~quassel@apn-94-44-98-114.vodafone.hu] has joined #debian
06:02-!-root is "alex73" on #debian
06:02-!-root is now known as Guest2754
06:03-!-wargreen [~wargreen@2a01:e0a:8fc:e6e0:5604:a6ff:fe93:965f] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
06:05<Guest2754>/topic
06:07-!-czesmir_ is now known as czesmir
06:09-!-CkingU [~CkingU@4G4AAAKJB.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #debian
06:09-!-CkingU is "user" on #debian
06:09-!-podarcislibertarian [~podarcisl@139.47.2.146] has joined #debian
06:09-!-podarcislibertarian is "realname" on #debian
06:09-!-freshtube [~freshtube@94.198.43.36] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
06:10-!-dselect [~dselect@dselect.bot.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: ouch... that hurt]
06:10-!-Strelnikov [~strelniko@8VQAAAS1E.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:10-!-podarcislibertarian [~podarcisl@139.47.2.146] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
06:11-!-dselect [~dselect@dselect.bot.oftc.net] has joined #debian
06:11-!-dselect is "dpkg backup readonly db" on #debian
06:14-!-freshtube [~freshtube@s176125235111.blix.com] has joined #debian
06:14-!-freshtube is "realname" on #redditprivacy #debian
06:16-!-Brigo [~Brigo@40.181.60.213.dynamic.reverse-mundo-r.com] has joined #debian
06:16-!-Brigo is "realname" on #debian #debian-es #debian-next #debian-offtopic
06:26-!-gusnan_ is now known as gusnan
06:32-!-towo` [~towo@00012f0f.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
06:32-!-towo` is "Torsten -towo- Wohlfarth" on #qemu #kernelnewbies #siduction-admin #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian #aptosid
06:32-!-diogenes_oftc [~diogenes_@188.208.122.154] has joined #debian
06:32-!-diogenes_oftc is "Nicolas" on #debian
06:33-!-Mario [~Mario@net-93-144-61-22.cust.vodafonedsl.it] has joined #debian
06:33-!-Mario is "realname" on #debian
06:34-!-Mario [~Mario@net-93-144-61-22.cust.vodafonedsl.it] has quit []
06:36-!-gabriel1 [~gabriel1@0BGAAAT6D.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #debian
06:36-!-gabriel1 is "Gabx" on #security #retroshare #Qubes_OS #i2p #debian
06:36-!-jmux [~jan-marek@2a01:c22:7a00:5e00:a427:9b2c:768a:7f42] has joined #debian
06:36-!-jmux is "Jan-Marek Glogowski" on #debian
06:38-!-thiras [~thiras@24.133.81.19] has joined #debian
06:38-!-thiras is "Ant Somers" on #debian
06:44-!-Strelnikov [~strelniko@86MAAAM8T.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #debian
06:44-!-Strelnikov is "strelnikov" on #tor-south #tor-project #tor-mobile #tor-l10n #tor-dev #tor-bots #debian #dfri_se
06:53-!-CkingU_ [~CkingU@8A4AAAV7P.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #debian
06:53-!-CkingU_ is "user" on #debian #badgeteam
06:57-!-nu-c [~nuc@i59F77FAC.versanet.de] has joined #debian
06:57-!-nu-c is "realname" on #debian
06:58-!-mode/#debian [+l 677] by debhelper
07:00-!-CkingU [~CkingU@4G4AAAKJB.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
07:04<erle->Is there a potential/probable release date for Debian 11 already?
07:04-!-blue_penquin [~blue_penq@0002adcb.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
07:04-!-blue_penquin [~blue_penq@0002adcb.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
07:04-!-blue_penquin is "blue_penquin" on #debian
07:05-!-dpkg [~dpkg@dpkg.bot.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: buh bye!]
07:05-!-dpkg [~dpkg@dpkg.bot.oftc.net] has joined #debian
07:05-!-dpkg is "apt backup" on #debian
07:09-!-Linux77 [~kvirc@000292fc.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
07:09-!-Linux77 [~kvirc@230-179-233-186.raimax.com.br] has joined #debian
07:09-!-Linux77 is "KVIrc 5.0.0 Aria http://kvirc.net/" on #debian-br #cap-cc #debian-next #debian
07:15-!-hele [~hele@88-115-23-57.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #debian
07:15-!-hele is "hele" on #debian-next #debian
07:16-!-CkingU_ [~CkingU@8A4AAAV7P.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has left #debian []
07:18-!-cyril [~cyril@2a01:e0a:418:84f0:ab3f:cac6:bad0:17a8] has joined #debian
07:18-!-cyril is "realname" on #debian
07:18<another>when it's done
07:19-!-gabriel1_ [~gabriel1@0BGAAAT6R.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #debian
07:19-!-gabriel1_ is "Gabx" on #debian #i2p #Qubes_OS #retroshare #security
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07:41<Guest2761>Whos an admin on this channel?
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08:11<choozy>debhelper is, but I don't know if it's a user or bot
08:11<bremner>they left?
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09:25<richard_h>does debian (apt etc really) check package signatures when reading them from /var/cache/apt/archives? Or only on download?
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09:31<petn-randall>richard_h: Only on download.
09:32<petn-randall>richard_h: If someone can manipulate those packages on your system, they're root already, anyway.
09:33<richard_h>yes - but I was wondering about sharing them between systems. Seems like that's a bad idea.
09:33<richard_h>and I don't currently do that, for that reason.
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09:46<petn-randall>richard_h: You can use apt-cacher-ng for that, it's a much better option.
09:47<richard_h>yes, kind of. More setup involved
09:47<richard_h>since I'm using containers, it would be relatively trivial to have all the containers sharing a directory
09:47<richard_h>(and it would save space too)
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09:48<petn-randall>Good point, though you can teach apt to not cache those files, too. It's a bit more work initially, but you can then simply provision the containers the right way.
09:49<richard_h>I can't remember if I've used apt-cacher-ng, but I've used similar things (approx iirc)
09:49<richard_h>ok, thanks. Might have a play with it some day.
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09:49<petn-randall>Other option is to share that dir among containers, though I'm not sure how well apt copes with scenarios where two instances are writing to the same file.
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09:50<petn-randall>anyway, gotta go. ttyl
09:50<richard_h>that's what I was talking about before - but it allows one container to poison the cache for the others
09:50<richard_h>cheers
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10:17<olasd>petn-randall: apt locks the directory while it's installing packages (and concurrent runs *fail* instead of waiting, IIRC)
10:17<olasd>so, not exactly a compelling option
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12:48<free2>hi, if i have an encrypted /home partition made during install and want to switch from systemd to sysv, would it be able to mount the home partition properly? would i experience some problems?
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13:03<petn-randall>free2: I don't expect any, because decryption is done by cryptsetup.
13:04<petn-randall>free2: I'd keep a live image on a usb stick around, just in case, so you can easily recover *if* something does break.
13:04<free2>ok i just want to make sure, just in case
13:04<free2>so you are saying there is a possibility it won't mount an encrypted /home?
13:05<petn-randall>olasd: Does it have a lock file in the /var/cache/apt/archives, though?
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13:05<free2>i'm curious if something can break so that i can't even log in/mount partitions
13:06<petn-randall>free2: With any chance you do, no matter how minimal, there's a possibility. And you're changing out init 1, so I wouldn't be totally surprised if something might not work anymore.
13:06<petn-randall>*change
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13:06<free2>in some guide they just list a few packages that need to be reinstalled and that's it, they make it seem trivial
13:07<free2>https://linuxconfig.org/how-to-replace-systemd-with-sysv-init-on-debian-linux
13:07<free2>someone also said there's a guide on debian wiki
13:07<Sqrt{not}>of course, you can always go to your backups if there is a major problem
13:07<petn-randall>free2: Also systemd is used far more than sysv init nowadays, so I expect the latter to have more subtle bugs.
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13:08<petn-randall>free2: Eh, that guide mixes your Debian with Devuan, I would not recommend that.
13:08<free2>then i could use some other that is checked more rigorously?
13:08<petn-randall>!frankendebian
13:08<dpkg>When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. Ask me about <reinstall>
13:08<free2>right i see
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13:08<petn-randall>free2: Personally, I'd stick with systemd, but people who want sysvinit usually have strong opinions about it.
13:09<free2>well assuming i need to get packages that don't require systemd, then there's no way of changing systemd on debian?
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13:09<free2>i'm not going for sysvinit in particular, just want to use a minimal init system
13:10<free2>i want to see if i can replace it without problems
13:10<petn-randall>free2: That being said, I think it's enough to just install sysvinit on Debian, and reboot. There might be a wiki entry somewhere.
13:10<free2>right, it's possible to switch, but not to remove systemd, it remains for programs that depend on it
13:10<petn-randall>!lightweight
13:10<dpkg><mjg59> To a first approximation, when someone says "Lightweight" what they mean is "I don't understand the problems that the alternative solves". (http://mjg59.livejournal.com/136274.html)
13:10<free2>ok it is true
13:11<free2>you can't deny systemd is big on integrating everything?
13:11<petn-randall>free2: I don't understand how that can work. There's only one PID1 possible on a running system.
13:11<free2>everything is centralised
13:11<free2>right, that's what that guide is suggesting
13:12<petn-randall>free2: If you install sysvinit and reboot, there's no "systemd" that other programs can use. And it gets uninstalled anyway, because those two packages are
13:12<petn-randall>mutually exclusive.
13:12<free2>well if you run command to remove systemd, it wants to install sysvinit, so that would mean they set the package to replace systemd, maybe it means they can be replaced
13:12<free2>but then you don't remove systemd library, so programs can still use it
13:13<petn-randall>"use" how?
13:13<petn-randall>I think you are misunderstanding how libraries work.
13:13<free2>right but i'm saying the guide suggested that
13:14<free2>the guide says: Add Devuan Repositories This part isn't strictly necessary if you just want to switch the init system and leave systemd installed as a compatibility layer. That would work fine. If you absolutely don't want systemd on your system at all, you need to make some arrangements to make the things that depend on it work.
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13:14<Sqrt{not}>free2, you said "assuming i need to get packages that don't require systemd" <-- this is not the same as get packages that require init
13:14<free2>so it says you don't have to replace out systemd-dependent packages, you just switch systemd to sysvinit
13:14<free2>what do you mena?
13:14<free2>mean *
13:15<Sqrt{not}>packages that don't *require* systemd, probably can work with it anyway?
13:15<petn-randall>free2: I can't vouch for the guide, but there are a lot of common misconceptions floating around about systemd.
13:16<petn-randall>free2: At least on bullseye you can remove every single systemd package, including libraries.
13:16<petn-randall>Not sure if it's the case in buster.
13:17<free2>right i am on buster now
13:18<free2>so how is that tested, whether you can safely remove every systemd package, including libraries?
13:18<petn-randall>!tias
13:18<dpkg>TIAS is "Try It And See".
13:18<free2>just by checking if packages depend on it?
13:18<free2>like this? apt-cache rdepends --installed
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13:19<petn-randall>I vaguely remember someone saying that it also works for buster, I'm 100% sure it works for bullseye. Didn't really have a demand to test it on buster.
13:19<petn-randall>free2: You can fire up aptitude, mark sysvinit to install, mark all systemd package as "to remove", and see if the resolver is happy with it.
13:20<petn-randall>free2: But as I said, I'd have a live image or something around, just in case something breaks.
13:21<free2>i see
13:21<free2>so even if some important package says it depends on systemd, it must work with sysvinit also?
13:22<free2>it seems as if the function done by that package would be absent without systemd
13:22<petn-randall>No, there was a resolution that it's not a requirement.
13:22<free2>just judging by package descriptions, there are some policy kits and things for mounting, i can't be sure if those things will stop working
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13:23<free2>what is not a requirement? that important packages don't depend on systemd?
13:23<petn-randall>So there can be packages that only work with systemd, but not with sysvinit. IIRC gnome3 was such a package, but it's possible with some drawbacks in at least bullseye.
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13:24<free2>well it's common with gnome and big environments, i'm curious about other important packages, so for example logging in and mounting partitions
13:24<petn-randall>free2: To clarify: If there's a package that requires systemd as PID1, it will depend on the systemd package. So if you remove systemd, apt will also try to remove the other dependant packages. So you'll see which packages won't work with sysvinit.
13:25<Sqrt{not}>now you talk about "depends" on systemd, you can check that in the ways petn-randall has suggested
13:26<free2>alright, thank you for explaining
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13:30<free2>i wonder how could i list processes that use systemd or some systemd library, maybe using lsof?
13:30<Sqrt{not}>free2, again, like I tried to hint above, you should always have good backups, especially if you are considering major remodelling of your system
13:30<free2>ok i understand
13:31<Sqrt{not}>there are good tools that make encrypted backups
13:32<free2>petn-randall: you said earlier that there are lots of misconceptions about systemd, would you please comment on that?
13:32<petn-randall>free2: Again, use aptitude as described above.
13:32<free2>such as maybe security issues, i think there are comments like that around
13:32<free2>ok
13:33<free2>and sysvinit, you said it's not used as much, so there are bound to be some bugs, what about other init systems, is there some that is updated as much as systemd, in debian?
13:36<petn-randall>systemd is the most used one, so just by the exposure the bugs are better documented (and likely fixed). There's also openrc and upstart as PID1.
13:36<petn-randall>It seems as though upstart got dropped by Ubuntu though, as they switched to systemd.
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13:41<free2>i see, thank you
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13:45<jhutchins>petn-randall: All of the major distros switched. A lot of that infrastructure is supported by Red Hat developers, and without their work sysv/upstart just didn't have what it took to keep up with modern hardware.
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13:55<olasd>petn-randall: @ /var/cache/apt/archives lock -> pretty sure that yes
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13:56<asma>hi
13:56<free2>hi, do you need help?
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14:32<system-broke-222>so I tried making a custom debian live iso with additional preinstalled drivers/packages with live-build. And it seems I suceeded, and weirdly it works if I boot it in a UEFI Virtual machine. However, if I try to boot from usb with the iso on real hardware, the grub menu doesn't even appear and it immediatly gets into a state with flashing low resolution text with "no such device live/vmlinuz".
14:32<system-broke-222>And I no this isn't because of broken usb because
14:32<system-broke-222>If I passthrough the usb with this custom iso to a virtual machine it works correclty
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14:33<sney>there is sometimes variance between what baremetal efi will boot and what virtualized efi will boot. usually I see it the other way around (virtualized won't boot a system that works baremetal) but this could still be related
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14:38<naomilago>hi there
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14:39<free2>hi, do you need help?
14:39<naomilago>yes, i'm new to the IRC
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14:40<free2>do you need help with debian?
14:40<sney>!new2irc naomilago
14:40<dpkg>You are chatting on IRC. IRC is the original group chat. Similar to platforms like Slack, Matrix, or Discord, IRC was invented in the 1980s and formalized with RFC 1459 in 1993. This channel, #debian, is for help with the debian operating system. Ask us a debian support question, or read more about IRC at https://netsplit.de or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC
14:40<naomilago>oh, no
14:40<naomilago>i'm ok with debian
14:40<system-broke-222>Maybe I made some big mistake with building it. Basically, I first ran `https://pastebin.com/1SWxETBF`. And then I added a few packages in a package-lists file. And then I ran `sudo lb build`
14:41<naomilago>ooh, thank you dpkg
14:41<naomilago>am i wrong or we might not be using the same IRC app?
14:42<sney>there are a lot of different irc clients. it doesn't matter which one you use.
14:43<free2>join #moocows
14:43<naomilago>i'm using Quassel but would like some good looking and intuitive
14:43<free2>and #debian-offtopic
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15:12<scorpion2185[m]>how can I disable/enable desktopfolder on startup?
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15:29<somiaj>scorpion2185[m]: this will depend on your DE, are you using gnome and you want to remove icons from the desktop?
15:30<nelsonjr>hello everybody
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15:50<AM0rE>sorry
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15:57<scorpion2185[m]>somiaj: depend on my DE? I use gnome and I want to enable icons
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15:57<scorpion2185[m]>desktopfolder always start by default.
15:59<jmcnaught>scorpion2185[m]: do you have gnome-shell-extension-desktop-icons installed? You can manage extensions in the Tweaks app.
15:59<scorpion2185[m]>desktop folder is an amazing package for desktop icons and more.
15:59<scorpion2185[m]>No the package desktopfolder
15:59<scorpion2185[m]> * desktopfolder is an amazing package for desktop icons and more.
15:59-!-AM0rE [~oftc-webi@0002b3ac.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:59<scorpion2185[m]>It doesn't depend on the DE.
16:00<scorpion2185[m]>,v desktopfolder
16:00<judd>Package: desktopfolder on amd64 -- buster: 1.0.10-1; bullseye: 1.1.3-1; sid: 1.1.3-1
16:00<scorpion2185[m]>,v desktopfolder
16:00<judd>Package: desktopfolder on amd64 -- buster: 1.0.10-1; bullseye: 1.1.3-1; sid: 1.1.3-1
16:01-!-thomasross [~thomasros@ip-66-159-116-196.dsl.csolve.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:01<scorpion2185[m]>I can't find a site because of the name
16:03<somiaj>there might be docs in /usr/share/doc/desktopfolder/, though this isn't software I am familar with, wonder if it has an autostart .desktop file you can enable/disable.
16:04<scorpion2185[m]>there aren't autostart files in autostart.
16:04<scorpion2185[m]>I just thought I can search github desktopfolder
16:04<scorpion2185[m]>it's amazing , especially for gnome users (no desktop by default)
16:04-!-ol [~quassel@2406:e003:81f:2801:8e89:a5ff:feca:57fe] has joined #debian
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16:06<scorpion2185[m]>or openbox
16:07<jmcnaught>scorpion2185[m]: desktopfolder appears to have /etc/xdg/autostart/com.github.spheras.desktopfolder.desktop which would make it autostart, deleting or moving that file might stop it from autostarting.
16:08<scorpion2185[m]>I checked only the home. thanks
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17:20<slavasaki>anyone online?
17:22<rob_rock>y
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17:23<Sqrt{not}>slavasaki, 670 in this channel, including you
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17:43<jhutchins>slavasaki: Did you have a support question?
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18:53<kingsley_>Can you suggest a nice, user friendly, file manager that can 1.) sort files various ways (for example, by last modification time, creation time and name) and 2.) then when a tall, dark, handsome Debian user clicks on the file's name with his mouse's pointer, the file manager automatically opens the file with an appropriate app to reveal the file's contents?
18:53<kingsley_>If so, which file manager would you suggest?
18:55<jhutchins>Most of the popular desktops have FMs that will do that. xfce has thunar, which works just fine.
18:56<petn-randall>Gnome's file manager can do that, too, same for KDE.
18:56<jhutchins>kingsley_: There are things you can do to tune what app opens a file, including the "Preferred Apps" configuration under Settings.
18:57<kingsley_>Thanks
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19:43<MMsoportePc>hola
19:44<dvs>ciao
19:44<Sqrt{not}>ho ho
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19:44<dvs>!next
19:44<dpkg>Another happy customer leaves the building.
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21:26<NoNicknameLeft>Hello everyone! I have this question, what's up with debian releases and freezes? My apt pulls from sid and experimental, yet when there are these freezes for getting stuff into stable, the situation in sid is really boring and stuff doesn't break or update or anything, at least it seems so to me. Can someone enlight me please?
21:26<NoNicknameLeft>Thanks
21:27<themill>!slushy
21:27<dpkg>When a <testing> release becomes frozen, <unstable> tends to partially freeze as well. This is because developers are reluctant to upload radically new software to unstable, in case the frozen software in testing needs minor updates and to fix release critical bugs which keep testing from becoming <stable>.
21:28<NoNicknameLeft>Ah ok, that's how it is. Lastly, why is the command for this called "slushy"?
21:28<themill>partly frozen?
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21:28<NoNicknameLeft>Oh, you guys are so smart
21:28<themill>https://release.debian.org/bullseye/freeze_policy.html may also be of interest
21:29<NoNicknameLeft>Many thanks!
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22:36<Epakai>on an encrypted install with lvm, the boot spends a lot of time looking for the volume group. Can I cut that down somehow?
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---Logclosed Sun May 02 00:00:27 2021