| --- | Log | opened Thu May 27 00:00:02 2021 |
| 00:00 | <peace> | somiaj, You asked "What type of drive is this?" Were you asking about the USB device? |
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| 00:00 | <somiaj> | peace: yea thumb drive, some drive with an extrernal power supply |
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| 00:01 | <RIVE> | Hi, good night. |
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| 00:03 | <RIVE> | I have a problem with Debian 11, can i talk of this topic? |
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| 00:03 | <somiaj> | RIVE: and what is your debian emergency? |
| 00:06 | <RIVE> | I generaly used a MacbookPro 7.1 with Debian 10 in it, i only have a problem to that laptop, i needed to once starting clothe lid tha lap sleeps and i could use the wifi in it -broacom- . |
| 00:06 | <peace> | It's a USB security dongle called "USG". USG replaces the "B" in USB to "G" to explain to protects against USB attacks called "BadUSB". A 256GB USB3.0 TDK flash drive is plugged into it. |
| 00:07 | <peace> | s/explain to/explain it/ |
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| 00:07 | <somiaj> | peace: and if you remove that secuirty dongle does the drive work fine as expected? |
| 00:07 | <RIVE> | When upgrade to Debian 11. that lap doesn't sleep or hibernate, i don know how to make that lap sleep away. |
| 00:07 | <RIVE> | Again. |
| 00:08 | <somiaj> | RIVE: so it doesn't go to sleep when y ou close the lid, what happens if you run 'systemctl suspend' |
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| 00:08 | <RIVE> | Sorry for my bad english |
| 00:08 | <peace> | somiaj, I don't know. I haven't tried. I'd be worried about BadUSB. |
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| 00:09 | <somiaj> | peace: do you not trust the flas drive? |
| 00:09 | <RIVE> | I bought a new lap today, but i have a feeling for that lap, and i want to make work right. |
| 00:10 | <peace> | somiaj, We may disagree on this, but it seems to me that since the exact same hardware works after booting, when the USB device is unplugged and replugged back in, a software bug is more likely. |
| 00:10 | <somiaj> | peace: anyways, I wonder if that dongle in the way is causing the problems, and maybe at boot it hasn't fully done whatever it does to protect and so when the kernel starts to talk to the device it just gets i/o errors since the device is doing some scan to protect you. |
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| 00:10 | <RIVE> | When i close the lid the lap, stops. but when the lips open dont do nothing. |
| 00:11 | <somiaj> | peace: now that I know about this dongle in the way, I suspect that it is causing the i/o errors and it just might be that the kernel is tryign to active the device to soon |
| 00:11 | <somiaj> | RIVE: so the system suspends but doesn't resume? |
| 00:11 | <peace> | somiaj, Do you know how to manually cause a USB bus to be rescanned for devices after booting? |
| 00:11 | <RIVE> | Yes @somiaj, does'nt resume. |
| 00:12 | <somiaj> | RIVE: what happens if you hit the power button, I have had laptops that require that, or hit a key on the key board (have you tried this yet) |
| 00:12 | <somiaj> | peace: nope |
| 00:13 | <peace> | somiaj, To be honest, no, I don't trust the flash drive. That's why USG is sold. It's hard to know in advance if any USB device is trustworthy. |
| 00:13 | <somiaj> | peace: if it isn't showing up in lsusb, seems the kernel is disconnecting it and ignoring it because it decided it is a bad device |
| 00:13 | <RIVE> | somiaj, itś the same, doesn't awake. |
| 00:13 | <somiaj> | RIVE: do you still have the 4.19 kernel from buster installed on that machine from your upgrade? |
| 00:15 | <RIVE> | No, i installed Debian 11 fron netinstall only basic, then restart and do tasksel from internet. |
| 00:15 | <RIVE> | Kernel 5.10 |
| 00:15 | <RIVE> | Gnome as GUI. |
| 00:16 | <somiaj> | RIVE: ahh so you reinstalled not upgraded? |
| 00:16 | <RIVE> | Yes. |
| 00:16 | <somiaj> | RIVE: You can manually download the 4.19 kernel, and see if it works. |
| 00:17 | <somiaj> | RIVE: I know some people have found regression bugs in 5.10, maybe you have hit one, and the older kernel works (since it worked before) |
| 00:17 | <RIVE> | Yes, i can do that. |
| 00:18 | <RIVE> | I bought a new lap today, but i want that old mac working right. |
| 00:19 | <RIVE> | I do that plugin a usb wifi that works fine, but i want that the hardware works like did in Debian 10. |
| 00:19 | <somiaj> | RIVE: for the wifi card, you are most likely missing nonfree firmware, what broadcom wifi is it? |
| 00:20 | <somiaj> | RIVE: I think broadcom need to build out of kernel driversfirmware, but let me double check if you know what chipset it requires. |
| 00:20 | <RIVE> | somiaj: let me check. |
| 00:20 | <somiaj> | I mean uses |
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| 00:22 | <RIVE> | Broadcom BMC43222 |
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| 00:23 | <RIVE> | IS the one in that old MacBook Pro |
| 00:26 | <jm_> | peace: my keyboard sometimes does not work after resume, I have a shell script I run to toggle power on given USB port, but this only works if kernel thinks device is connected (not sure about your case since I missed start of conversation) |
| 00:27 | <jm_> | peace: it's simple «echo 0 > /sys/bus/usb/devices/.../authorized» followed by echo 1 ... |
| 00:31 | <somiaj> | RIVE: https://wiki.debian.org/wl -- you'll probably want the broadcom-sta-dkms package for that card |
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| 00:40 | <awal1> | the new apt assumes the autoremove of apt-get by default now, eh? |
| 00:40 | <awal1> | new apt full-upgrade assumes the autoremove of apt-get by default now, eh? |
| 00:41 | <awal1> | not sure if that is a good idea |
| 00:41 | <erentar> | is there a good up to date packaging tutorial |
| 00:41 | <themill> | !nmg |
| 00:41 | <dpkg> | The packaging tutorial (https://deb.li/QYyI) and the New Maintainer's Guide (https://deb.li/3DiDA) are good places to start learning about Debian packaging. You should also ask me about <devref> and <policy> to understand how packages should be maintained and how they should interact with each other. Ask me about <package basics>, <mentors>, <best practices> <build without helper>. https://www.debian.org/devel/ |
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| 00:42 | <themill> | awal1: you can't have apt without having apt-get |
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| 00:43 | <awal1> | themill, i know but what i mean is that when you run "apt full-upgrade" it runs apt-get autoremove option too |
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| 00:43 | <awal1> | i mean apt full-upgrade includes autoremove |
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| 00:46 | <awal1> | apt-get only removes old kernels if asked with autoremove option |
| 00:46 | <awal1> | now apt remove those olds kernels when you run apt full-upgrade |
| 00:47 | <themill> | Do you know how many bug reports apt gets about full hard drives because of all the old kernels? |
| 00:47 | <awal1> | apt-get dist-upgrade / aptitude -full-upgrade doesn't remove them |
| 00:48 | <awal1> | i guess a lot but i just don't understand why apt should remove an old kernel if not asked |
| 00:49 | <awal1> | bcoz man doesn't explain that |
| 00:49 | <awal1> | well, not a big issue for me but not sure if that is a good idea |
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| 00:51 | <jm_> | old kernels fill /boot, which is often rather small if it's a separate fs |
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| 00:52 | <peace2> | jm_, The conversation started with https://paste.debian.net/1198967/ |
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| 00:59 | <jm_> | peace2: hmm you'd need to capture USB dump and ask someone familiar with it to figure out what really happens - the only difference I see is that when it works kernel also says Attached scsi generic sg2 type 0 and in the error case it says "Unaligned partial completion" - one finds quite some results when searching for that message |
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| 01:01 | <jm_> | usbmon.txt in kernel docs explains how to capture it, but not sure how easy it would be at boot |
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| 01:01 | <jm_> | sorry have to run now |
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| 02:48 | <Yuhua> | I assume Debian have supported NVDIMM.I can install package “ndctl” in Debian 10.9. I explored Debian wiki but couldn't find any information about which versions are supporting NVDIMM. If anyone can share with me any information about which versions of Debian support NVDIMM. I would appreciate it. |
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| 04:34 | <locsmif_work> | Hi all. When, after an update, I get "User sessions running outdated binaries" -- and it mentions e.g. sshd, should I actually believe this warning (from 'needrestart', apparently) and reboot? |
| 04:34 | <locsmif_work> | Sorry, s/update/dist-upgrade/ |
| 04:36 | <somiaj> | Yes |
| 04:36 | <somiaj> | It can sometimes mean a libary it depends against has been upgraded, so you need to restart the service to load the new binaries into memory |
| 04:37 | <somiaj> | locsmif_work: not on debian stable upgrade should be enough, no need to dist-upgrade, but it can be used |
| 04:37 | <somiaj> | and you don't have to reboot, just restart the service |
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| 04:38 | <locsmif_work> | somiaj: thanks |
| 04:40 | <locsmif_work> | somiaj: what if it mentions/lists systemd? |
| 04:40 | <locsmif_work> | How does one reload/restart that without rebooting? |
| 04:41 | <somiaj> | use systemctl restart servicename |
| 04:41 | <somiaj> | oh wait, I don't know about that, I always reboot for systemd/kernels |
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| 04:42 | <somiaj> | There might be ways to send systemd a signal telling it to reload itself, but this is not something I'm famailr with |
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| 04:42 | <ann> | I wanna to get some useful suggestions to build an IRC for studying, can anyone help me? |
| 04:43 | <somiaj> | ann: clarify, you want to run your own ircd server? |
| 04:43 | <ann> | yes |
| 04:44 | <somiaj> | locsmif_work: https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/how-to-restart-systemd-without-rebooting-linux-when-critical-libraries-installed/, looks like systemctl has a 'daemon-reexec' command to do just that. |
| 04:44 | <ann> | thanks for your suggestion |
| 04:45 | <somiaj> | ann: why run your own irc server? You can use already running networks and create a channel? |
| 04:45 | <jm_> | pick an irc server package, install it, edit its config if needed |
| 04:46 | <somiaj> | ann: anyways, not sure if this is the best channel, but debian does have some irc server packages, like ircd-irc2, I also see ngircd, and maybe some other's |
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| 04:46 | <somiaj> | actually configuring/securing/manging an irc server might take a bit of work beyond installing |
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| 04:51 | <ann> | ok. Thanks!! |
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| 04:54 | <locsmif_work> | ann: do you actually want to build an irc server from scratch or? |
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| 05:14 | <locsmif_work> | somiaj: unfortunately, no matter I try, including sudo systemctl daemon-reexec, needrestart keeps listing various services supposedly requiring restart, then no services, but always systemd |
| 05:17 | <somiaj> | locsmif_work: hmm, here again I don't have any experience with this, I have always rebooted if my kernel and/or init (systemd) needed a restart |
| 05:19 | <jm_> | does it give more details if you run it with -v? |
| 05:19 | <jm_> | or maybe -m a |
| 05:19 | <locsmif_work> | That's a very good tip |
| 05:19 | <locsmif_work> | It says: [main] #17605 uses deleted /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpam.so.0.84.2 |
| 05:20 | -!- | lepton [~lepton@0002bd14.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] |
| 05:20 | <jm_> | for PID 1??? |
| 05:21 | <jm_> | if it's for some user session then you'll probably need to logout and login again |
| 05:22 | <locsmif_work> | More importantly, it's lying. That file exists and is perfectly fine and not deleted |
| 05:22 | <locsmif_work> | Looks like needrestart is just defective and unreliable |
| 05:22 | <jm_> | the process might have old copy loaded, is 17605 PID? which process is it? |
| 05:22 | -!- | toto_ [~toto@5.146.195.102] has quit [] |
| 05:23 | <locsmif_work> | systemd |
| 05:23 | <jm_> | try ls -l /proc/17605/fd |
| 05:24 | <locsmif_work> | Tjat |
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| 05:24 | <locsmif_work> | That's approx. 30 lines of output.. What should I look for? :) |
| 05:24 | <locsmif_work> | Or should I pastebin it |
| 05:24 | <jm_> | is libpam mentioned? |
| 05:24 | <locsmif_work> | Nope |
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| 05:26 | <jm_> | was libpam.so among the upgraded files? |
| 05:26 | <jm_> | package name is libpam0g |
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| 05:27 | <locsmif_work> | Yes, it was. That and other libpam-related packages, according to apt |
| 05:28 | <locsmif_work> | Well, not apt, but the log. |
| 05:28 | <jm_> | so it's probably not lying then :) |
| 05:28 | <locsmif_work> | But I can stat the file, view it in a hex editor, etc. ? |
| 05:28 | <jm_> | perhaps «ls -l /proc/*/fd|grep libpam» will reveal something |
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| 05:29 | <jm_> | no-one is disputing the file not being there, just that a process might have old file still opened |
| 05:29 | <locsmif_work> | Yields nothing, but like I said, it wasn't mentioned |
| 05:29 | <jm_> | run that as root |
| 05:29 | <locsmif_work> | I did |
| 05:29 | <locsmif_work> | Hmm |
| 05:29 | <locsmif_work> | But I did do a lsof earlier |
| 05:29 | <jm_> | and if you run needrestart again it still shows that file? |
| 05:30 | <locsmif_work> | And lsof *does* report systemd having /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpam.so.0.84.2 open |
| 05:30 | <jm_> | for PID 17605? |
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| 05:31 | <locsmif_work> | Yep: systemd 17605 xxxxxxxxxx DEL REG 8,1 3985 /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpam.so.0.84.2 |
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| 05:32 | <locsmif_work> | Browsing the bug reports needrestart has had several systemd related bugs before |
| 05:32 | <locsmif_work> | Oh well |
| 05:32 | <locsmif_work> | Kind of obvious because it also relates to restart services |
| 05:33 | <jm_> | right, I just checked, my method to look in /proc/.../fd does not work for these files, so yeah if lsof shows it, it's probably right (it shows you its inode and you can compare that to current inode) |
| 05:34 | <jm_> | stat /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpam.so.0.84.2 |
| 05:37 | <jm_> | or does it? not sure, I only tried it with regular file |
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| 05:41 | <locsmif_work> | jm_: that's it. I should have run lsof as root and I forgot to. It does mention /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpam.so.0.84.2 several times, but with two different inodes, one of which isn't listen in stat's output |
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| 05:41 | <locsmif_work> | And the FD columns says "DEL" |
| 05:41 | <jm_> | locsmif_work: right, so it works OK |
| 05:41 | <locsmif_work> | column* |
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| 05:45 | <locsmif_work> | jm_: apparently if I do the systemctl daemon-reexec as follows: ssh <host> 'sudo systemctl daemon-reexec' *then* it works. An interactive ssh shell blocks proper restarting somehow. |
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| 05:48 | <locsmif_work> | Well, lesson learned, I suppose. |
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| 05:53 | <jm_> | forgot that libraries are mapped in process' space, so they show up in /proc/.../maps, not in FD |
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| 05:55 | <locsmif_work> | These kind of little problems/incidents often teach me most about system internals, even I probably should have known/understood this with my present understanding |
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| 05:56 | <locsmif_work> | I wouldn't whine about a reboot, normally, but these VMs are slated to be high availability, and if any reboot is required, it's going to have to be a rolling reboot at night, for example. So therefore I want to avoid reboots where possible |
| 05:57 | <locsmif_work> | Especially since these post-apt dist-upgrade moments are probably going to require reboots often |
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| 06:04 | <erle-> | locsmif_work, there is a needrestart script that checks if any outdated binaries are running |
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| 06:19 | <jfil> | hi, is possible to use fractional scaling in debian buster (gnome 3.30.2)? |
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| 06:34 | <coc0nut> | has freenode channels closed ? or is it only my bouncer bugging? |
| 06:35 | <yarda> | freenode is a mess, i'm glad i left |
| 06:35 | <Mister00X> | coc0nut: The channel on freenode is still there I am currently joined there |
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| 06:36 | <robobox> | I think they are doing hostile takeovers if they mention Libera in the chat |
| 06:37 | <coc0nut> | its my znc bugging.. seem to have reconnected without identifying nick. and i have to close the channel window to refresh i guess.. wsa thinking something had happened since the freenode riot hehe |
| 06:38 | <themill> | I wouldn't bother trying to reconnect. |
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| 06:48 | <abdulocracy> | robobox: do you have a source for that? I'm curious |
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| 06:52 | <themill> | abdulocracy: there are plenty of logs out there on the internet -- around 720 channels. I witnessed several yesterday. |
| 06:52 | <ratrace> | abdulocracy: https://atheme.github.io/atheme-open-letter/ |
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| 06:53 | <ratrace> | https://www.gentoo.org/news/2021/05/26/gentoo-freenode-channels-hijacked.html |
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| 06:55 | <abdulocracy> | Fuck |
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| 06:57 | * | omegatron wonders how it takes, until all notices in software to freenode are adjusted and if developers make a new release just for that (such as in the configure script of ffmpeg for example) |
| 06:57 | <omegatron> | +long |
| 06:57 | <omegatron> | arrgn |
| 06:58 | <grove> | abdulocracy: You can also see https://mypastebin.com/UG7vPfwi for an example of what happened on freenode a few days ago |
| 06:59 | <abdulocracy> | Jesus |
| 06:59 | <abdulocracy> | Just moved off entirely |
| 06:59 | <abdulocracy> | Every community's made the move anyway |
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| 07:01 | <Etua> | Hello, what's the status of GTK 2 in new Debian releases since a release of GTK 4 marked the EOL of GTK 2? |
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| 07:02 | <jm_> | buster will still ship with libgtk2 |
| 07:02 | <jm_> | sorry bullseye |
| 07:04 | <Etua> | Thanks, so as far as I understand no program dependent on GTK2 will be shipped with Debian 11? |
| 07:04 | <ratrace> | I think there are some, which is why libgkt2 will be shipped too |
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| 07:05 | <kritzefitz> | Etua, at least #947713 says that there are currently no plans to remove gtk2. |
| 07:05 | <judd> | Bug https://bugs.debian.org/947713 in libgtk2.0-0 (open, upstream, wontfix): «libgtk2.0-0: is deprecated and mostly unmaintained»; severity: important; opened: 2019-12-29; last modified: 2021-05-16. |
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| 07:05 | -!- | dpkg is "apt backup" on #debian |
| 07:05 | <ratrace> | the rdepends list on buster is quite large |
| 07:08 | <jm_> | that bug page also lists many |
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| 07:08 | <ratrace> | right, so it's way more than "some" I initially thought, lol |
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| 07:11 | <Etua> | Hmm, then it's the same way as with Python 2.7 and it will stick with us a bit longer than I thought. Thank you for giving me a heads-up. |
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| 07:45 | -!- | lunc is "omnd" on #debian #oftc #help |
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| 07:48 | -!- | otisolsen70 is "realname" on #debian-nordic #debian |
| 07:50 | -!- | cpach [~cpach@h-158-174-172-12.A950.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #debian |
| 07:50 | -!- | cpach is "Carl Winbäck" on #debian |
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| 07:58 | -!- | wolfgangr is "OFTC WebIRC Client" on #debian |
| 07:58 | -!- | mode/#debian [+l 878] by debhelper |
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| 07:58 | -!- | dvs is "realname" on #debian |
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| 08:04 | -!- | XeryusTC is "XeryusTC" on #openttdcoop.dev #openttd #debian-next #debian #coopetition |
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| 08:07 | -!- | nuc_ is "realname" on #debian |
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| 08:11 | -!- | RagingMind is "purple" on #debian |
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| 08:11 | -!- | ahasenack is "Andreas Hasenack" on #debian #aide |
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| 08:20 | -!- | Ericounet is "realname" on #debian #freedombox #play.it |
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| 08:23 | -!- | kathenas is "Phil Wyett" on #debian #packaging #debian-ai #debian-next #debian-meeting |
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| 08:25 | -!- | ibx2496 is "realname" on #linuxmint #debian |
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| 08:28 | -!- | wololoer is "user" on #pipewire #s6 #alpine-linux #qemu #kvm #virt #suckless #openjdk #debian-next #debian |
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| 08:29 | -!- | stanlog is "realname" on #debian #debian-academy |
| 08:29 | <stanlog> | hello |
| 08:29 | <_zxq9_> | herro |
| 08:29 | <enkrypt> | hiya |
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| 08:32 | -!- | wololoer is "user" on #pipewire #s6 #alpine-linux #qemu #kvm #virt #suckless #openjdk #debian-next #debian |
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| 08:33 | -!- | solitario3 is "Adrian Immanuel Kieß" on #perl #open-source-java #lyx #linuxfriends #java #irssi #debian.se #debian-es #NetBSD #OpenBSD #debian-tech #linux.de #debian-java #debian-next #debian |
| 08:36 | -!- | krumelmonster [~jo@ip5f5a4a0a.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #debian |
| 08:36 | -!- | krumelmonster is "purple" on #debian |
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| 08:37 | -!- | kaitsh_ is "kaitsh" on #kernelnewbies #suckless #qemu #C #llvm #debian |
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| 08:37 | -!- | alpernebbi is "Alper Nebi Yasak" on #debian #pulseaudio #panfrost #debian-next ##panfrost-offtopic |
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| 08:38 | -!- | gelignite is "gelignite" on #debian #llvm #openttd |
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| 08:39 | -!- | trac3r is "sm00th" on #debian #strace #leprobrno #bitlbee |
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| 08:41 | -!- | Petaris is "realname" on #alpine-linux #debian |
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| 08:42 | -!- | gtristan is "Tristan van Berkom" on #debian-next #kernelnewbies #qemu #debian |
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| 08:43 | -!- | ahso is "ahso" on #debian-next #debian #debian-wsl |
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| 08:44 | -!- | solitario3 is "Adrian Immanuel Kieß" on #perl #open-source-java #lyx #linuxfriends #java #irssi #debian.se #debian-es #NetBSD #OpenBSD #debian-tech #linux.de #debian-java #debian-next #debian |
| 08:44 | -!- | krumelmonster1 [~jo@ip5f5a4a0a.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #debian |
| 08:44 | -!- | krumelmonster1 is "purple" on #debian |
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| 08:49 | -!- | nicolasbock is "Nicolas Bock" on #debian #openstack-charms #openstack-dev #openstack-dns #openstack-release #oftc |
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| 09:02 | -!- | TheRuralJuror is "AP,,," on #debian.or.at #security #debian-next #debian |
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| 09:05 | -!- | sgn_ is now known as sgn |
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| 09:06 | <bipul> | Hello |
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| 09:09 | -!- | is0ke3 is "is0ke3" on #haiku #wayland #moocows #oftc #debian |
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| 09:11 | -!- | fred1m is "Fred LE MEUR" on #debian-next #hautilstssio #freedombox-ci #debian #debian-devel-changes #freedombox #debian-social |
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| 09:17 | -!- | Xaldafax is "X" on #debian #debian-raspberrypi |
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| 09:18 | -!- | Javi is "Javier" on #debian #debian-es |
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| 09:21 | -!- | ddsys is "ddsys" on #debian-offtopic #debian-next #debian |
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| 09:22 | -!- | voyager1 is "user" on #debian |
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| 09:25 | -!- | Brainium is "brainium" on #debian-social #linux #virt #qemu #C #tor-project #debian-br #debian-kde #debian |
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| 09:27 | -!- | TheRuralJuror is "AP,,," on #debian.or.at #security #debian-next #debian |
| 09:29 | <Celelibi> | Is there a way to run a custom command after every upgrade of a given package? |
| 09:30 | <Celelibi> | Something like a postinst script, but that I configure myself on my system. |
| 09:30 | -!- | lemr [~lemr@105.160.95.121] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] |
| 09:31 | <raven523> | maybe dpkg triggers |
| 09:31 | -!- | nuc [~nuc@i59F77FE3.versanet.de] has joined #debian |
| 09:31 | -!- | nuc is "realname" on #debian |
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| 09:37 | -!- | enkrypt is "enkrypt" on #debian-next #debian |
| 09:37 | -!- | l0rd_fu7 is "FREAKSHELLS - https://www.freakshells.net" on #kernelnewbies #ceph #tor-bots |
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| 09:38 | -!- | enkrypt is "enkrypt" on #debian-next #debian |
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| 09:39 | -!- | huntertur is "Hunter Turcin" on #debian-xfce #debian-vim #debian-ubuntu #debian-tech #debian-offtopic #debian-java #debian-devel-changes #debian-desktop #debian-amd64 #debian |
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| 09:42 | -!- | enkrypt is "enkrypt" on #debian-next #debian |
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| 09:47 | -!- | diogenes_oftc is "Nicolas" on #debian |
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| 09:47 | -!- | mfrisch is "Michael Frisch" on #debian |
| 09:48 | -!- | enkrypt [~enkrypt@000140b5.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian |
| 09:48 | -!- | enkrypt is "enkrypt" on #debian-next #debian |
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| 09:49 | -!- | schizo [~schizo@00021b96.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian |
| 09:49 | -!- | schizo is "me without a mic is like a beat without a snare" on #oftc #linux #debian |
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| 09:51 | -!- | mambang is "Don't Be Pussy, Dies Out curiosity" on #debian #debian-rant |
| 09:51 | <mfrisch> | Debian 11 rocks |
| 09:51 | -!- | gladk [~anton@x4db7fa8f.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #debian |
| 09:51 | -!- | gladk is "purple" on #debian |
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| 09:54 | <Celelibi> | raven523, file triggers looks promising. |
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| 09:56 | -!- | ak77 is "Ak77" on #debian |
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| 09:59 | -!- | user is "user" on #debian |
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| 09:59 | -!- | drdanz is "org.matrix:drdanz" on #debian |
| 09:59 | -!- | user is now known as Guest137 |
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| 10:04 | -!- | cusco is "trelele" on #debian |
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| 10:13 | <somiaj> | Celelibi: what is this custom command you want to run? I know some packages have their own triggers that are run in postinst scripts fromt he package, unsure of any global ones |
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| 10:28 | <r4co0n> | Celelibi, you might want to look into `DPkg::Post-Invoke` and something like this StackExchange answer: https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/236936 . Please note that I just researched the topic and never went ahead and implemented it, because of too much complexity. For my use-cases, I might as well repackage whatever I am trying to amend and add/patch the relevant parts in the postinstall. |
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| 10:29 | <Celelibi> | somiaj, Basically, this: https://github.com/SebastianSimon/firefox-selection-fix |
| 10:30 | <Celelibi> | I'd need to run it every time firefox is upgraded to patch it again. |
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| 10:31 | <r4co0n> | Celelibi, this really sounds like you should either use quilt to add your patches to the package or convince the maintainer that this patch is worthwhile.. |
| 10:32 | <Celelibi> | use quilt to maintain my own fork of firefox? Thanks but no thanks. That won't happen. I'd rather manually run the fix every time. |
| 10:33 | <somiaj> | Celelibi: what version of debian do you run? |
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| 10:33 | <Celelibi> | r4co0n, won't either convince the maintainer this patch is worth it. It's not even configurable and I guess many people wouldn't want the behavior it introduces. |
| 10:34 | <Celelibi> | somiaj, testing. |
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| 10:36 | <somiaj> | Celelibi: well testing and soon to be stable has firefox-esr which isn't updated all that often, so the manual run might not be unreasonable. It does look like you can try to deal with dpkg hooks. I do know the postinst scripts are put in /var/lib/dpkg/info/, but not quite sure how to capture modifing it before it is urn |
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| 10:36 | <somiaj> | Celelibi: this isn't something that could be done with an extension? |
| 10:37 | <Celelibi> | somiaj, doesn't looks so. |
| 10:37 | <Celelibi> | I mean, that was my first thought too, but nobody went to do it. |
| 10:38 | <r4co0n> | Celelibi, I like this solution which solves the problem by slightly relearning what you are doing: https://superuser.com/a/540855 |
| 10:38 | <Celelibi> | Also, since firefox 57 (I think), when they revamped completely the extensions system, firefox is a LOT less customizable. |
| 10:39 | <r4co0n> | Celelibi, it still requires an additional click though.. |
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| 10:40 | <Celelibi> | I'm pretty meh on this. |
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| 10:41 | <Celelibi> | The urlbar is quite wide, if I want to put the cursor at the end of the text, I just click anywhere in the blank space. |
| 10:43 | <Celelibi> | Doing do doesn't make selecting text easy. |
| 10:43 | <somiaj> | Anyways, my suggestion is just stable with bullseye, and manually run that each time firefox-esr is updated, it isn't all that often. |
| 10:44 | <Celelibi> | I indeed already use firefox-esr. I was just looking for a more permanent solution. |
| 10:44 | <r4co0n> | I am quite curious why extending urls is such a standard use-case for you. I have conditioned myself to click 2 times slowly or watch what is highlighted, in this case. |
| 10:45 | <Celelibi> | Not necessarily extending, but changing the end of it, yes. |
| 10:45 | <somiaj> | https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/199511/is-it-possible-to-install-a-hook-that-will-be-called-before-removal-of-a-packa |
| 10:45 | <Celelibi> | Like changing / adding an argument, going up one directory. |
| 10:46 | <somiaj> | teh second answer might help, looks more like but not sure on the details, so yea looks like you could write a custom script that would run if ever firefox-esr is updated. |
| 10:46 | <r4co0n> | I never noticed how broken this behaviour seems, once you notice it. |
| 10:46 | <Celelibi> | I never just erase the whole URL. If I need something different, I just use a new tab. |
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| 10:48 | <r4co0n> | You can get around the annoyance by being a sniper and just click-drag-selecting the part of the url you want to substitute. |
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| 10:49 | <Celelibi> | Aiming with the pointer is an extremely slow and cognitively demanding task. You have to do a lot of back and forth between vision and motion. |
| 10:51 | <r4co0n> | Chromium exhibits the exact same behaviour on stable.. |
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| 10:56 | <Celelibi> | Anyway, I see there are several ways to do it. Be it a package with a trigger, apt hook, or dpkg hook. |
| 10:57 | <somiaj> | I think the justification is, 'this is how it is done on windows, so we should do it this way on linux". Though it should be configurable, sucks they removed the options. |
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| 10:58 | <Celelibi> | The justification is a bit more complicated than that. They removed the option out of consistency and to alleviate the maintenance cost. Especially during automated testing which they make test every setting. |
| 10:59 | <Celelibi> | On every supported system. |
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| 11:01 | <Sark> | You know, this is something that has bugged me a lot - I didn't realize this had changed, just noticed how obnoxious it was to edit a URL. Furthermore when you click it "selects" the whole URL, but doesn't *really* select it, because it doesn't get into the middle click paste buffer. |
| 11:01 | <Sark> | Which is freaking confusing. |
| 11:01 | <Sark> | I hadn't spent the time to think about "wait, this wasn't always like this". |
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| 11:03 | <Celelibi> | Well, 15 years of habits didn't go unnoticed by my muscle memory. |
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| 11:04 | <beto> | português |
| 11:05 | <beto> | alguém que fale português? |
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| 11:06 | <maryjane_> | sim |
| 11:07 | <Sark> | Celelibi: I mean, I "noticed" it, but not specifically, it was one of those "huh, that's obnoxious, I don't remember this being so clunky", and not specifically noticing the exact thing that broke. |
| 11:07 | <Sark> | I wonder if there is a similar fix for Chrome. |
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| 11:10 | <Celelibi> | Sark, btw, the middle-click paste is one of the most underused feature nowadays. |
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| 11:11 | <Celelibi> | It always feel sooo cringy to see people use right-click to copy and paste. |
| 11:11 | <Sark> | Oh, I live by middle click paste. |
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| 11:12 | <Celelibi> | I know, I can't live without it. |
| 11:12 | <Sark> | And I'd always been annoyed by the click to select sort of things - like, for instance, when you go to copy the link to an image in an imgur album - clicking the field in your album "selects" the whole link - but it doesn't really, since it's not in the middle click buffer. |
| 11:13 | <Sark> | Requiring multiple clicks, then a test paste to be sure you "got" it. |
| 11:13 | <grove> | Unfortunately programs not supporting it seems to be spreading |
| 11:13 | <Celelibi> | Sark, I know the issue all too well too. |
| 11:13 | <Sark> | But yes. I use the middle button heavily. To the point where I don't even have a scroll wheel mouse, far preferring a three button mouse with the ever-useful middle click. |
| 11:13 | <Celelibi> | grove, the thing is, they don't have to support it explicitely. They only have to not do stupid things to prevent it from working. |
| 11:14 | <Sark> | Also, I found a bug in libinput for X - if you *are* using a three button mouse, it won't work with libinput, the middle button click doesn't work right. |
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| 11:14 | <Sark> | The fix is to uninstall the defective libinput and install evdev and restart X. |
| 11:14 | <Celelibi> | Isn't that just an issue of button number or something? |
| 11:14 | <grove> | Celelibi: Then the number of programs actively doing the stupid thing seems to be spreading |
| 11:14 | <Sark> | No. It knows the middle button is button 2. |
| 11:15 | <Sark> | It just does NOT report a button press event until you've already released the button. |
| 11:15 | <Sark> | It then reports a button press and release in quick succession. |
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| 11:15 | <Sark> | Making it impossible to use any middle button summoned menus. |
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| 11:15 | <Sark> | You can't get into the VT Options menu in xterm at all, for instance. |
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| 11:15 | <Celelibi> | grove, this I totally agree. So many programs and website just try to reimplement basic features. And break any system-wide behavior. |
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| 11:16 | <Sark> | If you look at it in xev you can see what's happening. |
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| 11:16 | <Celelibi> | (Looking at you firefox, not using the system default behavior of clicking into a text bar.) |
| 11:16 | <Sark> | Also, for some reason, while you have the middle button held down you can't move the cursor. |
| 11:16 | <Sark> | Chrome does the same thing. |
| 11:16 | <Sark> | And I'm not sure when it broke, but I had definitely noticed it. |
| 11:17 | <Sark> | And pasted the wrong thing so many times thinking I had "copied" the URL when it was simply selected but not selected really. |
| 11:17 | <Sark> | Inconsistent UI design is incredibly annoying. |
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| 11:18 | <Sark> | But, in short - if you *are* using a three button mouse, and find the middle button doesn't work - it's libinput. It's broken. |
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| 11:18 | <Celelibi> | Sark, so did you report a bug for libinput? |
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| 11:19 | <Sark> | I need to, I only finally figured it out yesterday. I'm not quite sure where I'd need to report that, and x.org was actually down when I had finally sussed it out. |
| 11:19 | <Sark> | Since who maintains libinput? |
| 11:19 | <Sark> | I've never filed a formal bug report before so I'm not sure. |
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| 11:20 | <Celelibi> | Usually, you use the command reportbug in debian. |
| 11:20 | <Sark> | I tried asking on the xorg IRC channel, but literally nobody replies - I think it's all just idle people? I have been connected there for a couple days and only saw a couple people asking questions and nobody at all answering. lol |
| 11:20 | <Celelibi> | It will report the bug for the debian package. Then the maintainer forward it to the upstream maintainer if it's not debian-specific. |
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| 11:37 | <somiaj> | Sark: it often varries as to best procedure when working with upstream, some upstream prefers bugs from distros, so report to debian, and if the debian matainer deems it an upstream bug they forward it. |
| 11:37 | <somiaj> | Sark: other matainers/upstream prefer you go directly to upstream, so no easy answer, but you can start with https://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting and report a bug to debian first |
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| 12:57 | <redbrass> | I'm working with repepro to create a local Apt repository, but am finding my understanding of apt repositories is weak. Any good resources? My google-foo is not finding the right stuff (yet) |
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| 12:58 | <redbrass> | Specifically I'm trying to determine the difference between updates vs pulls. When to use each, etc. |
| 12:58 | <somiaj> | redbrass: what is the point of this local repo? Custom packages or just to have a local repo? |
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| 12:58 | <somiaj> | https://wiki.debian.org/DebianRepository/SetupWithReprepro -- assuming you have seen that? |
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| 12:59 | <redbrass> | somiaj: custom packages with some overrides for external packages (compiled drivers for newer kernels, etc.) |
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| 12:59 | <redbrass> | somiaj: I saw that link. I need deeper knowledge |
| 12:59 | <bremner> | /join ##ob-fsf |
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| 13:00 | <redbrass> | Reprepro isn't really the issue, it is understanding the terminology - suites, components, updates, pulls, overrides, etc. And when/where to use each of these. |
| 13:00 | <bremner> | oops |
| 13:00 | <bremner> | how did that happen? |
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| 13:01 | <somiaj> | bremner: magic |
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| 13:01 | -!- | Haudegen is "AP,,," on #debian.or.at #debian-next #security #debian |
| 13:01 | <somiaj> | redbrass: I can't help with that, trying to think of a channel that is more appropriate (might have more devs with experience) |
| 13:01 | <redbrass> | That's where I'm at too... this is kinda specific, but kinda broad at the same time |
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| 13:01 | -!- | ax56234 is "truth" on #debian |
| 13:02 | <redbrass> | Thanks though |
| 13:02 | <somiaj> | redbrass: maybe #packaging has expereince beyond just packaing but controling repos. |
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| 13:02 | -!- | craigevil is "craig" on #debian-raspberrypi #debian-next #debian |
| 13:03 | <somiaj> | redbrass: I think #debian-mentors has people with such knowledge, but this is kinda off topic there. |
| 13:03 | <somiaj> | hence #packaging would be more appropriate since it is for packages and repos outside of debian |
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| 13:04 | -!- | ortz is "vedoggil" on #debian |
| 13:04 | <redbrass> | hmm.. won't let me join #packaging from here.. strange. Indicates I need to be id'd and verified, but I'm am... |
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| 13:04 | -!- | diogenes_oftc is "Nicolas" on #debian |
| 13:05 | <somiaj> | redbrass: You see user mode +i? |
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| 13:05 | -!- | debacle is "debacle" on #quodlibet #debian-social #debian-next #debian |
| 13:06 | -!- | ax56234 [~NickServ@208.sub-174-194-196.myvzw.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] |
| 13:06 | <redbrass> | er, no. I mean I've done the /msg nickserv identify command |
| 13:06 | <somiaj> | redbrass: According to /whois you are not identified with services right now |
| 13:06 | <somiaj> | redbrass: maybe an issue, maybe a dc/recoonect? |
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| 13:07 | -!- | ax56234 is "truth" on #debian |
| 13:07 | <redbrass> | probably a PEBKAC error. |
| 13:08 | <redbrass> | (PEBKAC = Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair) |
| 13:08 | <somiaj> | My beard is grey enough I am aware (: |
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| 13:09 | <redbrass> | Understood, posted the definition for the logs.. and anyone who may not have heard the term. |
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| 13:09 | <redbrass> | I also like the ID10T protocol as an explanation.. :) |
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| 13:09 | -!- | jaqque is "When you are a god, you don't have to have reasons" on #debian |
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| 13:10 | <sney> | if you're going to be here a lot you might as well set up certfp, it doesn't require any dialogs with a bot to identify: https://www.oftc.net/NickServ/CertFP/ |
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| 13:11 | -!- | holmgren is "Magnus Holmgren" on @#debian-se #debian |
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| 13:11 | <redbrass> | Regardless. the phrase "packaging" may have lead me to the right resources. Found https://wiki.debian.org/Packaging - which includes a link to the Debian New Maintainers Guide at https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/index.en.html |
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| 13:13 | <somiaj> | ahh that guide has info about repos, I figured it was more about just creating packages, not hosting them |
| 13:13 | <redbrass> | Thanks Sney. I'm checking out that link. I'm using Konversation which isn't listed on that page (or I'm blind), but I'm sure I can translate things as needed. |
| 13:14 | <sney> | right, it's just ssl stuff. I'm sure konversation has support. |
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| 13:14 | -!- | sgn- is "sgn" on #musl-distros #alpine-linux #debian #oftc |
| 13:14 | <redbrass> | somiaj: yep - that's the problem with the google searches too - the results seem to think I want to know more about creating packages. I need to know more about the repos themselves. |
| 13:14 | <sney> | konversation's own manual may have info on sasl external or certfp too |
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| 13:15 | <redbrass> | I seem to recall setting up SSL before on a previous computer, so it is just a memory/time thing.. |
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| 13:21 | -!- | redbrass is "Shawn" on #debian |
| 13:23 | <redbrass> | what do you know. Just had to reconnect to the IRC server with SSL, and things work more better. I can /join #packages now, for instance. |
| 13:23 | <redbrass> | hehe.. except it is just me in that room (so not the right channel...) |
| 13:24 | <somiaj> | redbrass: packaging not packages |
| 13:24 | <somiaj> | redbrass: I think you need to replace the fleshy thing between chair and keyboard |
| 13:25 | <A|an> | !dpkg |
| 13:25 | <dpkg> | [dpkg] the program used by Debian to install and remove packages, "man dpkg". Also ask me about <reference>. The main info bot in #debian is also called dpkg; ask me about <dpkgbot>. |
| 13:25 | <redbrass> | just saw that.. I also found https://wiki.debian.org/IRC that lists the common Debian channels. I see a few there that may apply for me topic |
| 13:25 | <A|an> | !dpkgbot |
| 13:25 | <dpkg> | Please visit http://wiki.debian.org/IRC/DpkgBot to learn how to effectively search the factoids database for FAQ, and not flood in the channel with !tell <who> about <what>. Also ask me about <msg the bot>. We ask that you learn to search for yourself first, unless it is a specific problem. Many questions are asked repeatedly, and the factoid database can be of great help to you. Ask me about <search dpkg>. |
| 13:25 | <somiaj> | redbrass: what other ones were you thinking? I didn't see any that I felt were appropriate? |
| 13:26 | <somiaj> | A|an: and of course you can /msg dpkg win A|an |
| 13:26 | <A|an> | thx i've kinda forgotten some details |
| 13:26 | <redbrass> | I was thinking #debian-apt, or #debian-mirrors |
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| 13:27 | <somiaj> | maybe, though again I think #debian-mirrors is more for mirrors not custom repos, but don't cross post to much, give each channel some time first |
| 13:27 | <redbrass> | BUT, I'm gonna start with that new maintainers guide - That seems to be on target for my task. We *are* creating a custom distribution for our hardware, afterall... |
| 13:28 | <redbrass> | somiaj: I'm an old hat at IRC - I very rarely ever cross post. |
| 13:29 | <sney> | I bet the documentation for dak, mini-dak, debmirror etc explains some terms and distinctions that reprepro may not |
| 13:29 | <redbrass> | well, at chatting with IRC, I'm still noobish with IRC details ( / commands and such. I know /join, /leave, etc...) |
| 13:30 | <redbrass> | sney: I found that most of the docs assume an understanding of the key terms already. I settled on reprepro last week after looking at the options. (and partly because my coworkers have some experience with reprepro) |
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| 13:31 | -!- | gozer667 is "gozer667" on #debian |
| 13:31 | <sney> | ah, that's unfortunate. well, hopefully you find your answers |
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| 13:40 | <gozer667> | somiaj: https://linuxize.com/post/create-a-linux-swap-file/ |
| 13:41 | <somiaj> | gozer667: do you have a question about that, or tagging the wrong person? |
| 13:41 | <dob1> | what is the help channel for this network? |
| 13:41 | <dob1> | #oftc? |
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| 13:41 | -!- | pavlushka is "Pavel Sayekat" on #debian #oftc |
| 13:41 | <somiaj> | dob1: yes #oftc is the main network channel |
| 13:41 | <gozer667> | Nope, you asked about how to activate swap |
| 13:41 | <somiaj> | gozer667: I didn't, think you confused me with someone |
| 13:41 | <dob1> | somiaj, thanks, sorry it was a stupid question |
| 13:42 | <gozer667> | Sorry |
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| 13:42 | -!- | jnavila is "jnavila" on #debian #po4a #debian-next |
| 13:42 | <gozer667> | Mixed you up with r4fkramer |
| 13:42 | <gozer667> | Sorry again |
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| 13:44 | <somiaj> | gozer667: no problem, just figured I'd hope you respond to the correct person. |
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| 13:45 | <Sqrt{not}> | gozer667, that question was a couple days ago! and we sorted it out with his swap partition |
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| 13:46 | <gozer667> | Sqrt{not}: thanks for the info, was no visable to me |
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| 13:47 | <Sqrt{not}> | gozer667, no problem, sometimes the channel gets a lot going all at once, and can be hard to follow |
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| 14:00 | <scorpion2185[m]> | !release |
| 14:00 | <dpkg> | Debian 10 "Buster" was released on 2019-07-06. It is now considered "stable". Ask me about <install debian>, <stretch->buster> to upgrade from Debian 9 "Stretch". See http://www.debian.org/releases/ or <release history> for other releases. For updates from the Debian Release Team, see http://release.debian.org/ |
| 14:00 | <scorpion2185[m]> | how was that command to check status of testing? |
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| 14:01 | -!- | somiaj is "somiaJ" on #debian-next #debian |
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| 14:02 | -!- | voyager1 is "user" on #debian |
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| 14:04 | <ratrace> | !wwbr |
| 14:04 | <dpkg> | Now Debian "Bullseye" is the current testing branch as of 2019-07-06 and it will be released "when it's ready." |
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| 14:05 | -!- | morbidb1rd is "realname" on #openttd #C #debian #debian-next #llvm |
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| 14:06 | -!- | somiaj is "somiaJ" on #debian-next #debian |
| 14:06 | <scorpion2185[m]> | any idea of when? |
| 14:06 | <bentham> | scorpion2185[m]: feel free to set up a betting pool |
| 14:07 | <jmcnaught> | !bullseye pool 1 |
| 14:07 | <dpkg> | ! antto=2021-07-07 räträcé=2021-06-13 jëlly=2021-06-06 themíll=2021-09-01 |
| 14:07 | <bentham> | someone beat me to it :) |
| 14:07 | -!- | somiaj [~somiaj@0001c892.user.oftc.net] has quit [] |
| 14:07 | <scorpion2185[m]> | !bullseye pool 2 |
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| 14:07 | -!- | somiaj is "somiaJ" on #debian-next #debian |
| 14:08 | <Sqrt{not}> | bullseye bet |
| 14:08 | <Sqrt{not}> | !bullseye bet |
| 14:08 | <dpkg> | To add a bet to the <bullseye pool>, /msg dpkg bullseye pool 1 =~ s/!/! yournick=yyyy-mm-dd/ and when "bullseye pool 1" is full, create "bullseye pool 2" and update this factoid. |
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| 14:11 | -!- | Lrrr_ is "François-Denis Gonthier,,," on #debian |
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| 14:13 | -!- | kathenas is "Phil Wyett" on #debian #packaging #debian-ai #debian-next #debian-meeting |
| 14:16 | <scorpion2185[m]> | !bullseye pool 1 |
| 14:16 | <dpkg> | ! scorpion2185=2021-08-25 antto=2021-07-07 räträcé=2021-06-13 jëlly=2021-06-06 themíll=2021-09-01 |
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| 14:17 | <bentham> | You might lose the bet |
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| 14:17 | -!- | catman370 is "catman" on #linux @#catman #debian |
| 14:17 | <ratrace> | yeah the pool is 100€ each. you'll have to pay up |
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| 14:26 | <somiaj> | I think june has been a soft target, though seems they are having a little more trouble on the rc-bugs than anticpiated |
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| 14:26 | -!- | _Noisytoot is "Ron" on #debian #oftc #debian-next |
| 14:26 | -!- | _Noisytoot is now known as Noisytoot |
| 14:27 | <somiaj> | https://bugs.debian.org/release-critical/other/testing.html -- though progress is being made, and note at some point the release team just starts removing packages (if they aren't core) if they aren't fixed |
| 14:27 | <bentham> | 'failed' |
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| 16:11 | <peace2> | somiaj, Thanks for chatting about recognizing a USB device at boot. I tested another operating system, flash drive inserted into the USB firewall dongle, and disabling USB port security in the BIOS. The USB device is still only recognized after booting and unplugging it and replugging it into the port. |
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| 16:34 | <karaka> | Hi folks, where I can check why my ip is blocked by salsa.debian.org? I cannot even ping 209.87.16.44 from my ip but it works from mobile connection or for others in my country. |
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| 16:37 | <peace2> | karaka, Maybe https://wiki.debian.org/Teams/DSA |
| 16:38 | <karaka> | Thank you peace2 |
| 16:39 | <karaka> | Maybe I also ask if there is a way to get git clone https://salsa.debian.org/debian/pkg-collectd.git |
| 16:39 | <karaka> | but not from salsa which blocks me? |
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| 16:39 | <karaka> | (Maybe there is a mirror or something.) |
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| 16:49 | <somiaj> | peace2: I think it has something to do with your dongle still. I don' |
| 16:50 | <somiaj> | peace2: I am not familar with the hardware, so no guess as to what it is doing, but I think for some reason during boot it is proving ernous information to the kernel causing it to not be able to read the actual device and giving up. Have you tried this on another computer/mobo? Do you have another security dongle you could try? |
| 16:50 | <somiaj> | peace2: as someone else mentioned maybe you can force the kernel to retry by messing with /sys or /proc, out of my experience. |
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| 16:53 | <peace2> | somiaj, Thanks for suggesting testing the dongle in another computer,a different dongle and forcing the kernel to retry. They all make sense to me, and retrying seems easiest. |
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| 16:53 | <Linux-Fan> | peace2: Forcing the reset of an USB device can be done by means of `usbreset` from package `usbutils` |
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| 16:56 | <peace2> | Linux-Fan, Thanks |
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| 17:04 | <Linux-Fan> | peace2: You're welcome. StackOverflow has some usage instructions (the tool does not seem to have a manpage or `--help` screen): https://askubuntu.com/questions/645 |
| 17:04 | <peace2> | Linux-Fan, Yes, I was just looking for usage instructions. |
| 17:05 | <Linux-Fan> | peace2: It is really a low-level bare-bones program and expects you to supply the device file as its only parameter. |
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| 17:07 | <peace2> | sudo usbreset /dev/bus/usb/002/003 |
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| 17:07 | -!- | root is "root" on #debian |
| 17:07 | -!- | root is now known as Guest203 |
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| 17:10 | <Linux-Fan> | peace2: That looks about right, did it work? |
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| 17:10 | <peace2> | Linux-Fan, I don't know. I copied it from https://askubuntu.com/questions/645 |
| 17:11 | <Linux-Fan> | peace2: :) You'll have to change the numbers (002/003) to point to the correct USB port. The askubuntu suggests to use `lsusb`. In case you cannot identify which port is which, try attaching a known working device there and re-run the `lsusb` to see which number on the bus it got. |
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| 17:16 | <peace2> | Linux-Fan, Yes, lsusb sees the USB dongle's path after unplugging and replugging it back it. |
| 17:16 | <peace2> | s/back it/back in/ |
| 17:17 | <peace2> | Linux-Fan, https://paste.debian.net/1198967/ |
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| 17:19 | <Linux-Fan> | peace2: I wonder if it is possible to dervice the correct bus/device numbers from the dmesg. |
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| 17:20 | <Linux-Fan> | peace2: It might be easier to just rely on the `lsusb`? |
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| 21:30 | <ortz> | I'm trying to install debian. I used the live gnome dvd to install it. The live-system xorg works fine, but when I boot from the hard drive I cannot get gdm3 to work |
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| 21:31 | <matthias> | ortz: What is the last thing you see on screen? Did you see a blue grub menu where you selected to boot Debian? |
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| 21:33 | <ortz> | i saw grub. it wasn't blue. This is buster btw. |
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| 21:33 | <matthias> | ortz: and after that? |
| 21:34 | <ortz> | it boots. it tries to run Gnome. Screen goes blank except for a cursor at top left. Stays that way for a long time and then eventually returns back to the terminal with all the init messages |
| 21:34 | <ortz> | at which point i can switch terminals using alt-right-arrow and log in |
| 21:35 | <ortz> | i have live system booted right now |
| 21:35 | <ortz> | xrandr says XWAYLAND0 connected |
| 21:36 | <ortz> | i'm not sure if the hd system is using wayland or x11 |
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| 21:36 | <ortz> | i tried pasting somebody's xorg.conf from a forum, that made no difference. They have a similar laptop (x200 tablet). |
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| 21:38 | <ortz> | i don't know how to view gdm/xorg log messages |
| 21:38 | <sney> | ortz: that gpu may need firmware, what's the cpu generation / how old is it? (lenovo has reused x200 a few times so that's not enough info) |
| 21:39 | <ortz> | the adapter has pci id 8086:2a42 |
| 21:40 | <ChromaCat248> | > xrandr says XWAYLAND0 connected@ortz iitm that means it's using wayland and not xorg |
| 21:40 | <ortz> | intel mobile 4 series integrated graphics |
| 21:40 | <ChromaCat248> | carriage return character doesn't work on irc i guess |
| 21:40 | <sney> | !i915 firmware |
| 21:40 | <dpkg> | Some Intel UHD GPUs made after 2015 require firmware from userspace for all features to be enabled. This includes Skylake, Kabylake, Broxton, Cannonlake and possibly others. Ask me about <non-free sources> and install firmware-misc-nonfree to provide. |
| 21:40 | <ortz> | ChromaCat248: yes, but that's the live-dvd boot. I'm not sure what the hd boot is trying and failing to use. |
| 21:40 | <ortz> | i don't know how to configure it one way or the other |
| 21:41 | <sney> | wayland and xorg will both work with intel hardware as long as the driver support is there. try installing the firmware package and see if that fixes it. |
| 21:41 | <ChromaCat248> | are you using an nvidia card |
| 21:42 | <sney> | not with an 8086 pciid, that's all intel |
| 21:42 | <sney> | it could be optimus, but I doubt it with a tablet form factor |
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| 21:42 | <ortz> | dpkg -l 'firmware*' # on the live system shows only firmware-linux-free installed. Is that the one to check if present on the hd system? Or is the i915 firmware package named differently? |
| 21:42 | <dpkg> | No packages found matching 'firmware*' # on the live system shows only firmware-linux-free installed. Is that the one to check if present on the hd system? Or is the i915 firmware package named differently |
| 21:43 | <sney> | ortz: as dpkg said above, the package is 'firmware-misc-nonfree' and you will need non-free sources to install it |
| 21:43 | <ortz> | that's not what dpkg said. It said *free*, not nonfree |
| 21:43 | <sney> | the dpkg channel bot, I mean. this message again: |
| 21:43 | <sney> | !i915 firmware |
| 21:43 | <dpkg> | Some Intel UHD GPUs made after 2015 require firmware from userspace for all features to be enabled. This includes Skylake, Kabylake, Broxton, Cannonlake and possibly others. Ask me about <non-free sources> and install firmware-misc-nonfree to provide. |
| 21:44 | <ortz> | ok |
| 21:44 | <ortz> | well, i'll boot the hd system now |
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| 21:46 | <ortz> | it's at the blank with cursor screen now |
| 21:47 | <sney> | so switch ttys, log in, enable non-free, install that package, reboot and see what happens |
| 21:47 | <ortz> | x200 is much older than 2015 though so the dpkg bot message doesn't sound like it applies |
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| 21:50 | <ortz> | installing firmware |
| 21:50 | <ortz> | should i reboot after this |
| 21:50 | <ortz> | or is there a better way to test |
| 21:51 | <sney> | reboot is quickest. while you're there, check dmesg for any errors |
| 21:51 | <ortz> | i keep getting superblock last mount time is in the future |
| 21:51 | <ortz> | at every boot |
| 21:52 | <ortz> | okay at blank with cursor screen |
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| 21:52 | <sney> | last mount time in the future could be that your clock isn't being set correctly, maybe the bios battery is dead, it shouldn't break the gui though. |
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| 21:53 | <ortz> | okay, no change. firmware-misc-nonfree did not fix the issue. |
| 21:53 | <sney> | from your cli login, can you 'dmesg | nc termbin.com 9999' and link here? |
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| 21:54 | <ortz> | is that going to expose any security sensitive info |
| 21:55 | <sney> | unlikely, it's just the kernel trying to configure your devices. |
| 21:56 | <sney> | the internet is full of people's dmesg pastes and I've never heard of it being a vector, in 20ish years |
| 21:56 | <ortz> | https://termbin.com/X0om |
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| 21:57 | <ortz> | https://termbin.com/x0om |
| 21:57 | <ortz> | first link has wrong case X |
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| 21:57 | <sney> | got it |
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| 21:58 | <ortz> | also not long ago, i got the live system built-in wifi working with rtl8192se driver, but now that built-in wifi doesn't seem to exist in either hd system or live dvd system. I'm using a usb ath9k wifi |
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| 21:59 | <ortz> | i guess the hardware went out to lunch |
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| 21:59 | <sarnold> | I don't recall seeing this before: [ 2.212014] Unstable clock detected, switching default tracing clock to "global" |
| 22:00 | <sney> | "unstable clock detected" plus the superblock error, your bios battery is almost certainly dead, and it might be keeping the internal wifi disabled by default every time you boot since the cmos can't save |
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| 22:02 | <sarnold> | that'd make sense; those firmware / acpi errors (marked with 'bug' in the dmesg) look like they may also be relevant; if you can apply firmware updates I wonder if that'd help anything? |
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| 22:04 | <sney> | yes, the newest bios from lenovo (even if it's from 2012 or whatever, if it's newer than the one you have now) may improve compatibility - there's nothing video specific in this log, though. it detects i915 and seems to load without complaint. |
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| 22:05 | <sney> | annoying that debian live works and the local install doesn't. d-live is full of surprises sometimes. |
| 22:05 | <ortz> | the live-dvd manages to enable the gui fine, so there ought to be a way to configure the hd system to do the same thing without a firmware update |
| 22:07 | <sney> | what does 'systemctl status display-manager' tell you? |
| 22:07 | <ortz> | live-dvd gnome isn't perfect though, on boot it goes to an "oops something went wrong" message, but clicking okay and letting it log back in fixes the issue |
| 22:07 | <sarnold> | I don't know specifics of the debian installers, but I think I've heard it's pretty common to use something like a generic "vesa" driver for install, and then switching to the 'good' driver leads to trouble on reboot |
| 22:08 | <ortz> | sney: active (running) no apparent errors |
| 22:08 | <ortz> | i used the non-graphical installer |
| 22:09 | <ortz> | it's available fromthe live-system boot menu |
| 22:09 | <sney> | I wonder if the "oops something went wrong" is gnome failing to use wayland (default) and falling back to xorg is what works |
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| 22:09 | <ortz> | well xrandr says XWAYLAND0 so the fallback is probably wayland |
| 22:10 | <sney> | in systemctl output, is there any indication of wayland or xorg, maybe in the CGroup section? |
| 22:11 | <ortz> | i don't know how to find cgroup section of systemctl output |
| 22:11 | <sney> | from display-manager status a minute ago |
| 22:11 | <sney> | it would be right above the log snippet |
| 22:11 | <ortz> | it says journal has been rotated since unit was started |
| 22:11 | <ortz> | no log output |
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| 22:13 | <sney> | on my system, sddm refers to xorg or x11 a couple times in that output. I don't use gdm3 or gnome so it's a guess, but it should still say what it's launching. |
| 22:13 | <ortz> | how do i view the rotated log |
| 22:15 | <ortz> | journalctl -a shows a whole lot of failures to bind to /tmp/.X11-unix/X....: No suchfile or directory |
| 22:15 | <sney> | journalctl -b -u gdm3, most likely. |
| 22:15 | <ortz> | what's supposed to make the /tmp/.X11-unix/* socket? |
| 22:16 | <ortz> | also unmounting /tmp gives an error messageon shut down. Also, /tmp is ext2. |
| 22:16 | <sney> | that would be X |
| 22:16 | <ortz> | is it bad to let /tmp be ext2 ? |
| 22:16 | <sney> | it's fine for /tmp to be on disk, it's stuff like /run that is a ramdisk |
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| 22:21 | <ortz> | The config in /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/x11.conf |
| 22:21 | <ortz> | indicates the sockets will be deleted after 10 days |
| 22:22 | <ortz> | maybe my invalid clock is thinking more than 10 days have gone by and causing the sockets to be deleted |
| 22:22 | <sney> | it could be, maybe, what happens if you 'startx'? |
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| 22:23 | <ortz> | i have EE messages |
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| 22:23 | <ortz> | including "Failed to loadmodule "intel" (module doesnot exist, 0) |
| 22:24 | <ortz> | i deleted xorg.conf |
| 22:24 | <ortz> | and start is now working when run as user |
| 22:25 | <sney> | there was an xorg.conf? there shouldn't be |
| 22:25 | <sney> | was that there when you installed? |
| 22:25 | <ortz> | i made one earlier trying to make things work |
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| 22:25 | <sney> | ah, ok. |
| 22:25 | <ortz> | well startx got me all the way to a gnome-shell screen with no issue |
| 22:25 | <ortz> | i'll reboot now |
| 22:26 | <sney> | ok. so wayland is failing, and debian-live probably has some secret extras that make it work in that environment only. |
| 22:26 | <ortz> | maybe the issue will be fixed without the xorg.conf and with the firmware package and whatever |
| 22:26 | <ortz> | hm |
| 22:26 | <sney> | if you do this, https://wiki.debian.org/GDM#Disabling_Wayland it won't even try to start wayland |
| 22:26 | <ortz> | yeah xrandr does not say wayland in my startx session |
| 22:27 | <sney> | of course, by running startx you explicitly started X, not wayland |
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| 22:32 | <ortz> | well |
| 22:32 | <ortz> | i disabled wayland as suggested by your wiki link |
| 22:32 | <ortz> | now it boots to gui |
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| 22:32 | <sney> | nice! |
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| 22:36 | <ortz> | sbin is not in my path when i become root |
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| 22:36 | <sney> | !buster su |
| 22:36 | <dpkg> | In buster, su no longer overrides PATH by default, requiring that you use "su -" or "su -l" for login shells (which is not really a new thing at all...). See https://wiki.debian.org/NewInBuster#Changes for details. |
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| --- | Log | closed Fri May 28 00:00:04 2021 |