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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-06-06

---Logopened Sun Jun 06 00:00:16 2021
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00:15<erik_>debian
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00:20<node1>Does anyone knows how to represent on Y axis correct decimal precision using rrdtool graph.? I have tried using --alt-autoscale --lower-limit -0.00001 --rigid --alt-y-grid --vertical-label seconds -X 0 but no luck in representing original data.
00:21<node1>Please find the original data here https://pastebin.com/raw/TwNGFrt5
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00:50<plankers>/!\ ΤΗІS ϹHAΝNEᏞ ዘᎪЅ MOᏙΕᗪ ΤΟ ⅠRС.LIᏴEᖇΑ.ⅭዘAΤ #ΗAMRAᗪIO /!\
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01:21<ryouma>you'd think the bel characters would be a quick bot match...
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02:05<peace3>How do you securely delete a file on a flash thumb drive?
02:07<ratrace>peace3: shred can work on files, but taht assumes a filesystem and medium that's not copy on write. flash I think is always copy on write, so there's no way unless you wipe the entire drive
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02:32<DragonSlash>hey
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02:32<DragonSlash>any one parrot os user
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02:36<sussudio>!based on debian
02:36<dpkg>Your distribution may be based on and have software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian. We don't and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare http://futurist.se/gldt/). #debian only supports Debian and pure <blend>s; please respect our choice to volunteer here to help Debian users. Support for other distributions is off-topic on #debian, even if your own distro's channel is clueless or non-existent.
02:38<Sqrt{not}>%parrot
02:38<dselect>Parrot Linux is a distribution based on <testing> for security experts, developers and privacy aware people. It is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Support can be found in #parrotsec on Freenode or the community pages https://docs.parrotlinux.org/community. Ask me about <based on debian> and <parrot-overnight>. If you are new to linux, try using Debian: http://www.debian.org.
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02:39<Sqrt{not}>Is that channel moved from fn to libera?
02:41<sussudio>doesn't look like it
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02:44<cheako>Hello, I just had a stupid idea. The problem is that a VPS provider told me that to change plans I had to migrate my applications to another/new system/server on my own.
02:44<cheako>By plans I mean moving from paying monthly to paying yearly.
02:46<cheako>I told them I was just going to rsync root and they said there was no need to copy the OS. I told them that this was cheaper for me than finding the files for my app.
02:47<cheako>I end up needing a tool that does this allot.
02:50<cheako>I think rsync can copy by user and group names instead of uid&gid. But what I really want is for missing users and group s to be effectively copied (but using new IDs where appropriate).
02:52<cheako>Along with intelligently merging the users and groups I would want to skip hostname, merge hosts, and skip /var/log entirely.
02:52<ratrace>cheako: that's extremely more convoluted than simply copying over everything, entire root
02:53<ratrace>cheako: but.... what I'd recommend you do here, is use automation to set up and configure the new server and transfer non-packaged data.
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02:53<ratrace>that way you also create a contingency plan in case you'll have to migrate again, so you have automation in place that you just clicky-clicky again and it automagically sets itself up elsewhere.
02:53<cheako>I know, but I end up doing that allot, enough where even I alone could benefit from such a tool.
02:54<cheako>Hmm, I could have started with puppet.
02:55<ratrace>no, that's like the most complicated of them all. try ansible or saltstack
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02:55<cheako>I was once looking for a single server version... Like where you copy one folder and that'll set everything up like what puppet does.
02:55<ratrace>ansible doesn't require an agent and can be used directly over ssh. for simpler setups, it's maybe the best option
02:56<cheako>Cool
02:56<ratrace>cheako: however... what they told you is a bit misleading. you _should_ be able to simply rsync _everything_ over, and adjust config for the new devices
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02:57<cheako>That's my understanding as well... Why they don't just let me snap a disk image and start the new server from that is beyond me.
02:58<ratrace>cheako: they could be using some custom "cloudy" configuration tools that wouldn't work if simply copied over. If so, that setup is terrible and clueless and I'd recommend you find another provide.r
02:59<cheako>Now I wonder if my up is set statically in /etc somewhere.
02:59<ratrace>cheako: another possibility, are you changing also hypervisors?
03:00<cheako>I don't think so but maybe.
03:00<ratrace>"monthly" to "yearly" should have absolutely nothing to do with where the VPS is, unless you're also changing hypervisor or virtual hardware features, eg. more ram, more disk, more cpu....
03:00<cheako>If that's the case then the month long test I've been doing is pointless.
03:01<ratrace>if you're switching from OpenVZ to something like KVM, then rsyncing over might be insufficient, you'd need to install the kernel, grub, partition the drives, and who knows if and how they crippled the openvz instance to begin with.
03:01<cheako>They are using clueless cloudy software, I wouldn't put it past them.
03:01<ratrace>but if that already is kvm, then unless they did somethign stupid in the setup, you should be able to rsync over everything, and adjust configs.
03:02<ratrace>I mean it's VPS, right? You can always TIAS and, worst case, click the "Reinstall" button to get a fresh new VPS image.
03:03<cheako>All speculation aside this is a chance for me to do this again in such a way that changing providers is less painful.
03:03<ratrace>right. so, ansible or saltstack.
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03:41<kitchen>hi
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03:45-!-matthias is "Matthias Maier" on #debian #debian-paultag-fanclub
03:45<unixbsd_>hi guys
03:45<unixbsd_>I tried to run PS2 on debian, it is not working. the xorg is too old
03:46<unixbsd_>https://gitlab.com/openbsd98324/retrogaming-ps2 <-- the only way to run PS2 well on Linux is to good rolling content, with newer xorg/kernel,...
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03:48<ratrace>unixbsd_: which version do you need? tried bullseye?
03:49<unixbsd>well, I can try the newest debian
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03:50<unixbsd>what about sid? However it needs a backport kernel, we have that for SID maybe?
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03:50<ratrace>unixbsd_: which xorg and kernel version do you need at minimum?
03:50<unixbsd>ratrace: debian SID didnt work ... only archlinux can offer PS2 gaming, because it is a rolling (not trolling) distro
03:51<unixbsd>ratrace: I need at least a 5.12 to run pS2 on vulkan
03:51<ratrace>on which gpu?
03:51<unixbsd>ratrace: the surprise is that the archlinux is superbly working onm Ryzen III
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03:51<unixbsd>(mother board ryzen 3, amd)
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03:52<ratrace>unixbsd: so the APU, Vega?
03:52<unixbsd>I guess so,
03:52<unixbsd>yes it is
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03:52<ratrace>welp, if you need 5.12+, you can always use the upstream tarball and make the bindeb-pkg target to get a normally apt-installable kernel package
03:53<unixbsd>Graphics card type, Vega 8. Motherboard, Gigabyte B450M S2H. CPU series, AMD Ryzen™ 3. Processor/type, 3200G. Pc kit from renkforce
03:53<ratrace>until 5.12+ comes in through sid
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03:54<ratrace>but then, it's not just the kernel, you also need the firmware, and I'm a bit lost here as to how to get that in sync with upstream'd kernel
03:54<unixbsd> debootstrap --no-check-gpg sid . http://ftp.debian.org/debian ... and do you have teh initrd and /lib/modules somwhere?
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03:54<ratrace>what?
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03:55<unixbsd>I need the vmlinuz and initrd, and as well teh lib/modules/5.12.... something files to put into SID strap...
03:55<ratrace>and the firmware
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03:56<ratrace>unixbsd: for the kernel itself, don't mess with files manually, use the upstream tarball, make a .deb package out of it.
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03:57<unixbsd>ratrace: I prefer to install by hand. I use debian since early bo. veteran here
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03:57<ratrace>unixbsd: it's very much by hand, you need to unpack the tarball and run make on it
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03:58<ratrace>then you get a .deb and you apt-install it. which means it's part of your package management, the files are accounted for and easily upgraded when sid begets 5.12
03:58<ratrace>if you don't want the simplicity of this, and you want to make your life miserable, complicated, harder, for NO FRIGGIN REASON, then please do go ahead and cp them individual vmlinuz, intiramfs, files one by one from wherever to wherever.
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03:59<ratrace>that doesn't make you a hardcore veteran, tho. it makes you dumb. hardcore veterans know how to use tools to make their lives easier.
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03:59<unixbsd>ratrace: because your debian installer arent reliable... I prefer by hand. it works surely.
04:00<ratrace>no it doesn't
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04:00<ratrace>you'll miss something. and also the package manager is not aware of the files. you're deliberately introducing an aberation and an error into your system
04:00<unixbsd>debootstrap was created for something.
04:01<ratrace>debootstrap has nothing to do with this
04:01<ratrace>it's not in any way contradicting what I'm saying. you can debootstrap a sid, then in that sid instance, install the upstream kernel tarball'ed .deb
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04:03<ratrace>BUT AGAIN .... you ALSO need the firmware. don't forget about that part.
04:04<unixbsd>ratrace: ah, the firmware is into several debs. by hand too.
04:05<unixbsd>ratrace: well, I tried the last ubuntu with their newest kernel, it did out perform well, as does archlinux. I need to check if it was wayland or old xorg on ubuntu.
04:05<unixbsd>*did not perform well
04:05<ratrace>you can't game on wayland yet
04:05<ratrace>unless you count using xwayland but that's just xorg anyway, so why bother with abstraction
04:06<unixbsd>ratrace: ok, we can get a try your lastest debian... with installer, if you really want... which one would you recommend?
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04:07<ratrace>unixbsd: I never said you _must_ use the installer
04:07<ratrace>you said you were debootstrap'ing sid. that's okay, I use debootstrap to install debian everywhere, too. the question was of 5.12 kernel.
04:08<ratrace>,v linux-image-amd64
04:08<judd>Package: linux-image-amd64 on amd64 -- jessie: 3.16+63+deb8u2; jessie-security: 3.16+63+deb8u7; stretch-security: 4.9+80+deb9u6; stretch: 4.9+80+deb9u11; stretch-backports: 4.19+105+deb10u4~bpo9+1; buster-security: 4.19+105+deb10u9; buster: 4.19+105+deb10u11; buster-backports: 5.10.24-1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 5.10.40-1; sid: 5.10.40-1
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04:08<ratrace>sid comes with 5.10. if you want 5.12, you can download the tarball from kernel.org, and run the bindeb-pkg target to produce a .deb which you can apt install. that's what I said.
04:08<ratrace>however, firmware...
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04:14<unixbsd_>firmware helps in all cases... confirmed.
04:15<ratrace>,v mesa-vulkan-drivers
04:15<judd>Package: mesa-vulkan-drivers on amd64 -- stretch: 13.0.6-1+b2; stretch-backports: 18.2.8-2~bpo9+1; buster: 18.3.6-2+deb10u1; bullseye: 20.3.4-1; sid: 20.3.5-1; experimental: 21.1.0-4
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04:16<ratrace>seems I'm about to have a nice week ahead, tryna get RX6700XT to work on debian.......
04:16*ratrace considers installing ubuntu and pukes a little
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07:00<ravioli>/ⵑ\ TⲎⅠS CHANΝΕL ᕼAS MОVЕᎠ TO ⅠᎡϹ.LIВEᏒΑ.CHΑТ #ΗAMRADΙΟ /!﹨
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07:13<Guest1042>Is Debian popular?
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07:16<ratrace>yes
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07:27<BCMM>i don't really know how to read this things - can anybody explain what the story with the lensfun transition is? https://release.debian.org/transitions/html/auto-lensfun.html
07:27<BCMM>is this the sort of thing that's just waiting for the freeze to end?
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07:41<unixbsd_>ratrace: Isn't ubuntu more popular than debian? 75 percent of users have Ubuntu, stats today.
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07:57<Isaac4499_>Hi, I have been trying to install the netinstall 32 bit i686 version of Debian 10 because I don't want to be tied down to a specific laptop or computer. I did the cp command to copy the files over but I don't know why the USB isn't being recognised as bootable as the documentation said this writing the image on its own should work fine for most users but this clearly isn't the case.
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08:01<Isaac4499_>I have attempted the other more complex methods given further on in the documentation, such as manually copying files to the USB but they are more confusing than helpful as I do not understand how to implement the other methods properly
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08:08<jelly>Isaac4499_, you don't cp the file over, you cp the _whole image_ directly onto the device for the whole usb stick
08:08<jelly>!usb install
08:08<dpkg>You can install Debian from a USB stick/thumbdrive/pen drive/key on x86 systems, as long as your system's BIOS can boot from USB. Details are in the Installation Guide, see http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/ch04s03 and ask me about <install debian> for hybrid CD/DVD images. Use http://sf.net/projects/win32diskimager/ to write images from Windows. For BIOSes not capable of USB boot, ask me about <plop>.
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08:10<jelly>Isaac4499_, did you do a command similar to "cp debian-10.9.0-i386-netinst.iso /dev/sdf" or something else"
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08:13<ratrace>unixbsd_: that was not the question
08:14<unixbsd>ratrace: debian is today bit less popular than ubuntu. it seems, isnt it?
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08:16<ratrace>unixbsd: and that wasn't the question either
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08:17<Isaac4499_>Yep, I formatted the USB in FAT32 so there was nothing on it beforehand, plugged it into my laptop running xubuntu and ran the command "cp debian-10.9.0-i386-netinst.iso /dev/sdb"
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08:21<Isaac4499_>According to the documentation that should be enough to be able to boot it on its own, right? Or do I need a bootloader because I'm not booting from an hdd or ssd?
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08:22<ratrace>Isaac4499_: the ISO is a bootable hybrid image which you copy directly to the device, as you say you did with that cp. no formatting beforehand is needed as it'd be overwritten by the cp
08:22<unixbsd>there is a grub2 that will help to boot your system. set root=( ... is the locatino where your kernel is. linux will then tell wehre is the main rootfs (/boot... dev... usr).
08:22<ratrace>so unless the ISO was downloaded badly or corrupt, it _should_ boot on your computer if it supports booting off of USB
08:23<Isaac4499_>I see
08:23<ratrace>no grub is needed to boot netinst ISO
08:23<ratrace>the image already contains isolinux (I think?) bootloader and related stuff
08:23<unixbsd>I create a nanogrub in case you need some boot loading: wget "https://gitlab.com/openbsd98324/nanogrub/-/raw/main/v2/image-nanogrub-netbsd-linux-grub-sd0a-v2.img.gz" then put in on memstick and run that grub to fix your main bootloader.
08:24<Isaac4499_>alright, I'm gonna try to boot and see what happens. If it doesn't work I'll try redownloading the iso and start again. If that doesn't work, I'll come back
08:24<unixbsd>ratrace: thanks! no grub is needed to boot netinst.. .. you read well.
08:25<ratrace>Isaac4499_: try verifying the checksum before you go through the download again
08:25<unixbsd>sometimes the EFI comes in play, but this ISO debian is solid to boot and be started.
08:26<ratrace>Isaac4499_: but most importantly check if your BIOS is capable of booting off of USB. You're mentioning 32-bit, so I'm assuming that's something old and 32-bit only? Chances are such old devices cannot boot off USB
08:26<unixbsd>32 bits?
08:26<unixbsd>what kind of pc is it?
08:27<BCMM>Isaac4499_: just to clarify, the bootloader is built in to the image. there should be no extra steps needed to make it bootable after writing the image to USB.
08:27<BCMM>did you make sure it wasn't mounted before writing the image, though?
08:27<ratrace>unixbsd: please stop with unhelpful advices that seem to always include downloading something from your GitHub.
08:28<ratrace>the ISO does not need any help from a nano, micro or macro grub.
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08:29<unixbsd>ratrace: hopefully...
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08:30<ratrace>not hopefully but not at all.
08:30<unixbsd>ratrace: you excel in reading and helping users.
08:31<unixbsd>isolinux is on debian, ubuntu uses efi grub2. I recalls as well efi/... grub2 on some debian.
08:31<ratrace>and we're in #debian
08:31<unixbsd>i let you fix his issue. good luck. I have no clue why the iso hybrid cannot boot
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08:32<ratrace>unixbsd: that's fine if you don't know. so don't suggest something taht has nothing to do with it
08:32<Isaac4499_>The vast majority of computers I will likely use are 64 bit, but I have a Dell Latitude D430 laptop that I took the original HDD out of so it'd be nice to still be able to use the laptop as it's a small laptop I can use for most things
08:34<BCMM>Isaac4499_: isn't that a core 2 duo system?
08:35<BCMM>i mean, the d430. looks like the kind of system that is capable of 64-bit (but came with 32-bit windows)
08:35<Isaac4499_>it sure is. It's actually my dad's old business laptop and I figured I might as well put it to good use seeing as it's still working just fine with its original battery
08:36<BCMM>ah sorry, i thought you were saying that was the system you wanted 32-bit Debian for
08:37<BCMM>anyway, to the actual problem: i wouldn't waste time redownloading the iso unless you know your copy is corrupt. better to just compare a checksum
08:37<Isaac4499_>yeah, I'm just in the middle of checking it now just in case (I get the feeling that yeah, it could be corrupt).
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08:38<BCMM>also, if you happen to have qemu around already, trying to boot the USB stick as a VM can be a quick and useful test
08:38<Isaac4499_>oh true
08:38<BCMM>(to investigate whether the device is actually bootable, i mean)
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08:39<BCMM>i think the question somebody raised above of whether the system is actually configured to boot from USB is a good one
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08:40<BCMM>stuff from that era is *usually* capable of it, but the option in the BIOS can be stupidly labeled sometimes
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08:40<Isaac4499_>Oh, right. I can confirm that all the computers I've been using to try to boot the USB can boot from a USB
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09:25<Isaac4499_>checksum for the iso is fine. So maybe it's getting corrupted during the copying over?
09:27<Linux-Fan>Isaac4499_: Attach the usb drive to the computer and check if any program attempts to auto-mount it. You can confirm it not being mounted by looking at the output of `mount` (or `df -h` -- this has a less cluttered output on my systems)?
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09:32<Isaac4499_>The usb drive automatically mounts when I plug it in. /dev/sdb1 (the location of the debian install), is mounted on /media/isaac/Debian 10.9.0 i386 n.
09:32<Isaac4499_>Does that mean that I haven't actually installed it to the usb drive, but somehwere on my computer's hard drive instead?
09:33<Linux-Fan>Isaac4499_: No, but it shows you are using the i386 version although it seemed that amd64 might run? Also, if during the copying before, the drive was mounted, it is quite possible to have a corrupted file system that the installer will not boot from.
09:34<Isaac4499_>oh, so should I unmount the usb drive first before copying?
09:34<Linux-Fan>Isaac4499_: Yes and check that it does not silently mount itself again :)
09:35<Isaac4499_>ok, I'll try that. Thanks
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09:45<Isaac4499_>ok, so it mounted automatically after the copying finished, I tried to boot again, but the usb wasn't detected. Maybe I'm just better off using the amd64 version instead on all this.
09:47<Linux-Fan>Isaac4499_: When you try the amd64 version, do the copy from a console session with no GUI running. This way, there will not be any interference from automounting, although I expect it not to be a major issue if automounting really only occurs after the entire transfer has finished...
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10:13<Isaac4499_>ok, it's still not being recognised on boot.....very weird.
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10:22<ratrace>Isaac4499_: seems like this automount thing is corrupting your drive
10:22<ratrace>Isaac4499_: make sure the drive is NOT mounted in any way before you cp the ISO on it
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10:29<unixbsd>On debian, I run often to avoid disasters: apt-get remove --purge -y usbmount (after each updates, ... and installation). It is also good to prevent hibernation to occur in systemd. hibernation can kill / damage your disk permanently, if it fails and press and hold power button.
10:30-!-newtons_ [~newtons@2a02:120b:2c42:7650:426c:d7b3:f035:2883] has joined #debian
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10:31-!-newtons is "newtons" on #debian
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10:31-!-Veni is "veni" on #debian #df-asso #df-flood
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10:56<Isaac4499_>Is there a way to install debian onto the same usb I have the iso on?
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10:57<Linux-Fan>Isaac4499_: In theory yes, in practice its a little difficult. I'd suggest to just pass the USB into a virtual machine and do the installation there with the ISO supplied from the host system.
10:58<Isaac4499_>ok, thanks. I managed to get the iso working (I think the usb was failing so that what was causing me issues earlier)
10:58<Linux-Fan>Isaac4499_: Glad you could work it out :)
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11:04<agoodm>⁄ǃ\ ᎢHIS CΗАΝNEᏞ HAᏚ MOᏙED ΤО IRC.LIᗷΕᎡA.CᕼΑT ﹟HАMᎡᎪᎠIO /!\
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11:54-!-VINICIUS is "realname" on #debian
11:54<VINICIUS>hi
11:54<VINICIUS>?
11:54<VINICIUS>alguem ?
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12:00-!-_cr_ is "Carsten Rosenberg" on #debian @#clamav
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12:05-!-erle- is "Stephan" on #debian-next @#antitux #debian
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12:07-!-jzz is "Johannes Zarl-Zierl" on #debian-kde #debian
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12:08-!-greenJim is "Jean-Marc" on #debian
12:11<maryjane_>Sim, as acho que este canal é apenas em Inglês ;p
12:12-!-srgrint [~srgrint@13.201.159.143.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Quit: srgrint]
12:12<maryjane_>And hi VINICIUS
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12:34<cde28>/!⧵ ᎢΗIS ⅭHΑNⲚEᒪ HАЅ MΟᏙEⅮ ᎢO ΙᎡC.LΙBΕRA.CΗАT #HAMRADІO /!\
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13:24<debian>hi
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13:34<PixlPerfect01>hi
13:35<PixlPerfect01>mx is debain based correct?
13:36<PixlPerfect01>mc linux ofc
13:36<jmcnaught>!mxlinux
13:36<dpkg>MX Linux is a popular distribution <based on debian>. It is not supported in #debian. Support is available on their forum: https://forum.mxlinux.org/. It is related to <antix>. If you are new to linux, or want a distro with IRC support, try Debian instead: https://www.debian.org/intro/why_debian
13:37<PixlPerfect01>ty
13:37<alex11>the literal answer is "yes, it is" - but yeah, support for it is not given here
13:37-!-tuxOr [~tux0r@99-72-201-62.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:37<PixlPerfect01>understood! tysm!
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13:38<maryjane_>!pureos
13:38<dpkg>PureOS and PureOSlight are French GNU/Linux live CD distributions, based on Debian's <testing> branch. https://www.pureos.net/ Ask me about <based on debian>.
13:38<maryjane_>:p
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13:39<maryjane_>this description of PureOS is way outdated
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14:05<Scorpion>I can't use revolt now: "The URL can’t be shown".
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14:27<f0h>/!\ ТHⅠЅ CHΑΝNEᏞ ᎻᎪЅ ΜOᏙED ᎢО IRC.LIBEᎡᎪ.ᏟⲎᎪΤ #HAМᎡADIⲞ /!\
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14:41<ratrace>I can't believe alacritty isn't packaged in debian.
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14:41<AE5CP>⁄﹗∖ THΙS CНANΝЕL HAS ΜΟVΕᎠ TⲞ ΙRᏟ.LIBΕᏒΑ.ϹዘΑΤ #ΗAϺRΑDIO /!\
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14:42<UndeadLeech>Debian struggles with Rust packaging.
14:43<jmcnaught>judd: bug wnpp alacritty
14:43<judd>Bug https://bugs.debian.org/851639 in wnpp (open): «ITP: alacritty -- A cross-platform, GPU-accelerated terminal emulator»; severity: wishlist; opened: 2017-01-17; last modified: 2021-02-07.
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14:44<ratrace>I just installed the .deb for Ubuntu 18.04, and it works, no dependencies, no issue. it's a shame bullseye doesn't have it
14:44<ratrace>(Ubuntu .deb on Bullseye)
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14:45<jmcnaught>I have kitty installed which is also GPU accelerated but not written in Rust. I never use it though.
14:46<ratrace>jmcnaught: oh, kitty is a wayland term too?
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14:46-!-nmschulte is "Nathan Schulte" on #debian
14:46<jmcnaught>Oh I don't know if it uses Wayland.
14:47<UndeadLeech>Kitty supports both X and Wayland.
14:47<ratrace>yeah I'm migrating to wayland so now I have to fix one by one of programs I'd use
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14:49<nmschulte>I'm trying to use the images at https://raspi.debian.net/ to get V4l2 M2M hardware accelerated video codec on Raspberry Pi 4 -- I've built ffmpeg from source with these features enabled, but receive errors like "device not found"; no joy. Has anyone done this before?
14:49<jmcnaught>Is there a better way than "xwininfo -root -tree" to check if an application is using X or not?
14:50<jmcnaught>kitty seems to be using X, while terminator and gnome-terminal are using Wayland.
14:50<ratrace>jmcnaught: maybe you need a kitty switch or env var to get it to use wayland. like firefox needs eg. MOZ_ENABLE_WAYLAND
14:51<nmschulte>jmcnaught: I ask Sway to tell me the application shell in its window title; I'm not sure of a single CLI program to do this though.
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14:52-!-andibmu is "Andreas B. Mundt" on #debian #debian-next #debian-lan
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14:52<ratrace>nmschulte: you use sway? I'm trying to set that up too. which launcher?
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14:53<nmschulte>ratrace: I don't use a face-chooser/launcher; I just run sway from vty
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14:54<ratrace>nmschulte: I do too, and I'm talking about program launcher, not a DM :)
14:54<ratrace>how do you launch programs?
14:55<nmschulte>ratrace: oh. I use dmenu; set $menuCommand dmenu_path | dmenu | xargs swaymsg exec -- bindsym $mod+d exec $menuCommand
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14:56<ratrace>oh via xwayland? I don't want that. I wanted to port bemenu, which is dmenu-like thing for wayland, but debian packaging is more complex than summoning Satan, and I gave up
14:57<ratrace>I anyway tried using dmenu, and it didn't work....
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14:58<nmschulte>ratrace: that's no good. I build sway from src so possibly that helps me, but I don't remember issue w/ the maintained package (though that was a while back).
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14:58<nmschulte>ratrace: also, I'm not using stable or testing, so there's that.
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15:08-!-debalance is "Philipp Huebner" on #debian #debian-devel-changes
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15:11<ratrace>ogawd what a steamin pile md(adm)...
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15:11-!-ach is "ZNC - https://znc.in" on #spooky #debian
15:12<ratrace>mount /dev/md/mdboot /boot -> nothin happens, no error, no mount.....
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15:12<fs2>᜵!\ ТНΙS CᎻANNEᒪ HAS MOVЕᎠ ТO IᎡC.ⅬIᗷᎬᎡΑ.ᏟHΑᎢ #ⲎAϺᏒADІⲞ ∕ⵑ⧹
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15:26<Terremis>hi , kennt wer den end of life von debian 11?
15:27<Linux-Fan>Terremis: I do not think anyone can tell yet, cf. https://wiki.debian.org/DebianReleases
15:28<Terremis>mh ok i think ~3 jears
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15:33-!-kolbrich3 is "kolbrich" on #oftc #qemu #debian #ext4 #musl-distros
15:33<kolbrich3>/!\ ΤHIS CⲎΑNNEL HΑS MOVEᎠ ΤO IRⲤ.LІBΕRΑ.ϹⲎAT ﹟HAMRADIO /!\
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15:37<rangergord[m]>Hi. I'm sorta new to Debian. believe I ran into a bug in Debian 10 when running "apt autoremove". Several instances of: "'amd6�' is not a valid architecture name in 'Architecture' field: character '�' not allowed (only letters, digits and characters '-')". I got this several times: https://paste.debian.net/1200205/ Before I report it, thought I'd ask here in case it was a known issue or more of a mistake on my part.
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15:39<rangergord[m]>I'm also wondering, is there a way to a minimal desktop install when installing a fresh system? I just want the desktop, terminal, browser, text editor. Nothing heavyweight like Libreoffice. The installer let me select multiple entries including "Base Debian desktop system", XFCE, KDE Desktop, etc. If I just wanted a bare XFCE what would I do?
15:39<Tj>rangergord[m]: looks to be corruption in /var/lib/dpkg/status file
15:40<Linux-Fan>rangergord[m]: Can you open /var/lib/dpkg/status and check what package the line 18864 is from? Is it libarchive13? What does apt-cache policy libarchive13 tell (just in case). On my system it is obviously displaying the correct architecture amd64...
15:41<nmschulte>rangergord[m]: you can choose to not install the desktop task, and instead use e.g. apt-get at terminal to install the packages providing "a bare XFCE."
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15:42<nmschulte>you can see what packages e.g. XFCE task installs like: apt show task-xfce-desktop
15:42<rangergord[m]>and which "meta" packages would those be? I'm a Ubuntu refugee, what's the equivalent of ubuntu-desktop (and ubuntu-desktop-minimal), kubuntu-desktop, xubuntu-desktop, etc?
15:42<rangergord[m]>ah sweet, thanks
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15:45<rangergord[m]>Linux-Fan: line 18864 is libblockdev-fs2. apt-cache policy for both packages: https://paste.debian.net/1200206/
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15:49<rangergord[m]>now apt is completely broken, and --fix-broken doesn't fix it because of this error. Can I delete/regenerate this status file?
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15:53<Scorpion>I can't use revolt now: "The URL can’t be shown".
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15:56<Tj>rangergord[m]: if you're seeing corruption, try to check the kernel log for indications of I/O errors
15:56<blast007>!status-recovery
15:56<dpkg>If your dpkg status file has become corrupted, first backup the current version, and restore a backup from /var/backups/dpkg.status. If all of those are corrupted/missing, then you will have to reinstall all of the packages you currently have installed. try this: find /usr/share/doc -maxdepth 1 -mindepth 1 -type d -not -name texmf -not -name debian -printf '%f install\n'|xargs aptitude --schedule-only reinstall; aptitude install;;
15:57<rangergord[m]>tj, yeah, dmesg repeats the following line: "[776091.347687] systemd-journald[323]: Failed to send WATCHDOG=1 notification message: Transport endpoint is not connected"
15:57<rangergord[m]>I actually onyl ran an apt update (which made me notice this issue), because I saw systemd had a core dump . I had left the terminal open for a few days (idling), saw the core dump, thought "I oughta update"
15:58<Tj>rangergord[m]: that isn't as serious as I was thinking of - I was concerned you've got I/O errors on the block devices
15:58<Tj>I think you've got dodgy RAM or CPU
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16:00<rangergord[m]>it's a Virtualbox VM, so could be a bug there. But tbh I've been using Vbox for years, and this CPU for 6 months, never got anything like this
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16:01<Tj>maybe something there then, but what you're describing isn't normal
16:02<rangergord[m]>I know, I set up this system 2 months ago and never had issues
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16:07<ratrace>it's possible you had a random bit flip propagate to the disk
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16:11<Tj>feels more to me like a sticky bit in a RAM module that only gets mapped when load on RAM is high
16:11<Tj>then that gets propagated to disk
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16:12<rangergord[m]>I went through the !status-recovery instructions, but it kept pausing due to systemd issues. Did a machine reset (of the VM), since it wasn't accepting CTRL-C. Then some dpkg recovery command they told me to do, now things are normal
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16:12<Sqrt{not}>maybe time for memtest in the actual hardware computer
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16:13<rangergord[m]>I'll wait for a 2nd problem before I do that, too lazy :)
16:14<Sqrt{not}>it does look like just one bit in one line of the file (maybe duplicated as the file is archived)
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16:22<coc0nut>so.. im asking myself abit here... on all distros. started testing slackware today. been knowing about it for 10+ years, but never got into it. started my linux adventure 4 real 2-3 years ago. is there any differences in when to use slackware over debian ? or rhel/centos ? or is it just pure taste it depends on?
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16:25<rangergord[m]>coc0nut: I wouldn't use Slackware if only cause almost no one else is, I'm too old to be beta-testing. Based on my experience the only difference in any distro is which packages are installed by default / are available, which package manager is used, how long a release is supported, and how the network is configured. It's basically Debian vs RHEL (or Debian/Ubuntu vs RHEL)
16:26<rangergord[m]>That seemed harsh, it's not that it's beta-testing, it's lack of information available to solve issues, more likely for things to break, etc. I lost my tolerance. I don't like to go "oh sure, I'll spend my Sunday afternoon troubleshooting this" anymore
16:27<rangergord[m]>RHEL lost its shine when CentOS stopped shadowing its releases and became a quasi-rolling distro
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16:29<coc0nut>I see, my thoughts are that slackware in example might be good for dedicated servers like apache etc. If that is the purpose of the computer... Debians supernice repository might be a security issue when it has grown so big and automated? you never know whats happening to your computer when updating and so on. You loose the overview abit because of it... I dont know.. But still, Debian is my favorite <3 :p
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16:32<rangergord[m]>the way I see it, tens of thousands of people are using Apache on Debian, therefore more likely for bugs to be found and fixed. Meanwhile, tens of people are using slackware. :)
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16:33<coc0nut>true :) if bloat and stuff isnt an issue, I dont see why any other distros than debian exists tbh :p impressed by the survival skills of linux :)
16:35<coc0nut>had to test a few slackpkg repositories to find one still up and running
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16:40<Molly_>Hello, I'm hoping to get a bit of help I'm having an issue with my VGA controller opting for my intel GPU over my NVidia GPU. How can I enforce Nvidia GPU usage for VGA controller?
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16:47<plaur>Molly_: did you see https://wiki.debian.org/NVIDIA%20Optimus ?
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16:49<plaur>coc0nut: slack at leasy used to be the work of just one person, patrik v. - it's one of the oldest distros, but i'm not sure if they have the resource to stay on top of security issues. i used to run it for a while before switching to debian in 2001
16:49<plaur>s/leasy/least/
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16:50<Molly_>plaur: I did not, reading the first line I think this might be the exact sort of thing I'm looking for, thank you
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16:51<plaur>Molly_: you're welcome, hope it works for you
16:52<plaur>coc0nut: if security is a concern i would stick with one of the big distros: debian, ubuntu lts, maybe centos-stream, especially on the server
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16:53<coc0nut>it was around those times (2001) I was introduced to slack :p not using it before 20 years later. the main reason is to learn linux abit more deeply than the simplified debian. but dont know if thats reasonable... hehe
16:54<coc0nut>like installing packages without any package manager (make install) like the old times. i have a nas with busybox on it that id like to do more stuff do. like installing nano and such
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16:55<plaur>same here, fun to see how things are made, but there was no package manager in slack back then, no dependency solving, not sure how fast are security updates
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16:55<coc0nut>i think they are coming with a new slackware version soon (slackware 15)
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16:56<coc0nut>14.2 (released 2016) is current and it was a pretty heavy "slackpkg upgrade-all"
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16:57<coc0nut>installed ufw in a package from the official repository
16:57<plaur>there's plenty to learn on debian or centos as well. if you like compiling from source, and have lots of time, you could look at gentoo :)
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16:57<plaur>or just stay with slack if you like it
16:58<coc0nut>just did slack for fun on a vm this morning. debian is what i stick with i guess
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17:05<alex11>i probably should set up ufw but i don't ever feel like bothering
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18:11<Nascher>/﹗\ ΤНІS CHΑⲚNEL ΗΑS MΟVᎬD ᎢO IRC.LΙВᎬᖇА.ⲤHАᎢ #ᕼAМRΑDΙO ∕!\
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18:24<Langley>Hello, I wanna remove Thunderbird but then it wants to install Evolution and a billion other packages, how come?
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18:26<Langley>Looks like it's because Cinnamon depends on evolution, must be a bug?
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18:27<jmcnaught>Langley: it looks like the cinnamon-desktop-environment package depends on thunderbird or evolution, it is most likely not a bug.
18:28<jmcnaught>Langley: "thunderbird | evolution | geary" (the | is OR) so you also have the option of geary if you want to keep the meta-package for cinnamon installed.
18:28<Langley>Surely it must be, there is no reason it requires an email client
18:29<Nemoder>yeah the whole point of the meta package is to bring in all the extra apps, you dont need the meta package to keep using cinnamon though
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18:30<Langley>Is there any problems in removing cinnamon-desktop-environment?
18:31<jmcnaught>You might need to mark some packages you want to keep that were previously pulled in by cinnamon-desktop-environment as manually installed so that "apt autoremove" does not want to remove them.
18:33<Langley>Sounds like a guarantee to bork my system
18:33<Nemoder>to check just read through the output of: apt-cache show cinnamon-desktop-environment
18:34<jmcnaught>I personally think it is easier to accept whatever my desktop environment's task/meta-package installs, I have enough storage that it is okay if some apps I never used are installed.
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18:36<Langley>Yeah I'll just do that, just a waste to keep and update stuff I don't want
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18:37<Langley>Thanks, bye
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22:01-!-Yodiel [~Yodiel@190-206-59-159.dyn.dsl.cantv.net] has joined #debian
22:01-!-Yodiel is "realname" on #debian
22:01-!-voyager1 [~voyager1@0002a22b.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:01-!-voyager1 is "user" on #debian
22:02-!-nuc_ [~nuc@i59F7FEA7.versanet.de] has joined #debian
22:02-!-nuc_ is "realname" on #debian
22:08-!-nuc [~nuc@i59F77FEC.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:11-!-Yodiel [~Yodiel@190-206-59-159.dyn.dsl.cantv.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:12-!-eight [~eight@0002be8e.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:12-!-eight is "eight" on #kernelnewbies #debian-next #debian
22:14-!-mbond [~mbond@99-35-18-230.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #debian
22:14-!-mbond is "mbond" on #debian
22:17-!-mayhew [~jm@47.55.124.51] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
22:19-!-allorder [~allorder@000197dc.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:19-!-allorder is "allorder" on #debian-quebec #debian
22:19-!-synthetek is "synthetek" on #oftc #qemu
22:19-!-synthetek [~synthetek@138.199.52.51] has joined #debian
22:27-!-ax5623 [~NickServ@241.sub-174-194-134.myvzw.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:28-!-RedSoxFan07 [~Thunderbi@d-159-250-218-50.ct.cpe.atlanticbb.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:28-!-CeBe [~cebe@2a02:560:4acd:e200:487e:a034:d6a7:cdae] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:28-!-mendel_munkis [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has joined #debian
22:28-!-mendel_munkis is "realname" on #debian #i2p #debian-i18n #debian-gaming #Corsair #minidebconf-online
22:32-!-Redentor [~armando@2600:3c01:e000:20c:26a:b4b9:9a0e:e249] has joined #debian
22:32-!-Redentor is "realname" on #linode #debian-next #debian-mx #debian
22:34-!-ridoan [~ridoan@37.111.219.106] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
22:35-!-mendel_munkis [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:35-!-debianinside [~debian@0002b11d.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:35-!-debianinside is "debian inside" on #debian
22:36-!-mendel_munkis [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has joined #debian
22:36-!-mendel_munkis is "realname" on #debian #i2p #debian-gaming #Corsair
22:36-!-CeBe [~cebe@2a02:560:4ad1:100:547b:3640:c38e:4067] has joined #debian
22:36-!-CeBe is "Carsten Brandt" on #debian
22:37-!-madez [~madez@ip-176-198-251-181.hsi05.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Quit: .]
22:37-!-damiano [~damiano@45.176.242.18] has joined #debian
22:37-!-damiano is "realname" on #debian
22:38-!-damiano [~damiano@45.176.242.18] has quit []
22:39-!-Surfer2011 [~quassel@87.123.114.247] has joined #debian
22:39-!-Surfer2011 is "Surfer2011" on #debian
22:41-!-madez [~madez@ip-176-198-251-181.hsi05.unitymediagroup.de] has joined #debian
22:41-!-madez is "madez" on #debian #freedombox
22:42-!-JPT [~jpt@classified.name] has quit [Quit: Hoppla!]
22:46-!-JPT is "Jan Philipp Timme" on #oftc
22:46-!-JPT [~jpt@classified.name] has joined #debian
22:47-!-XeryusTC [~XeryusTC@000128e4.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:47-!-XeryusTC is "XeryusTC" on #openttdcoop.dev #openttd #debian-next #debian #coopetition
22:53-!-rnm_ [~rnm@0002afe6.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:53-!-rnm_ is "Don't Be Pussy, Dies Out Curiosity" on #debian #debian-rant #debian-malaysia
22:55-!-XeryusTC [~XeryusTC@000128e4.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:57-!-vexed [~vx@0002a42c.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
22:57-!-vexed is "h" on #debian #asahi-dev #packaging #debian-xfce #moocows #oftc #pax
22:57-!-Redent0r [~armando@2600:3c01:e000:20c:26a:b4b9:9a0e:e249] has joined #debian
22:57-!-Redent0r is "realname" on #linode #debian-next #debian-mx #debian
22:57-!-Redent0r [~armando@2600:3c01:e000:20c:26a:b4b9:9a0e:e249] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:58-!-mode/#debian [+l 899] by debhelper
22:59-!-beencubed [~beencubed@209.131.238.248] has quit []
23:00-!-rnm [~rnm@0002afe6.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:00-!-nuc__ [~nuc@i59F77F40.versanet.de] has joined #debian
23:00-!-nuc__ is "realname" on #debian
23:06-!-wayne2 [~wayne@178.162.194.66] has joined #debian
23:06-!-wayne2 is "..." on #debian
23:06-!-nuc_ [~nuc@i59F7FEA7.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:07-!-XeryusTC [~XeryusTC@000128e4.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
23:07-!-XeryusTC is "XeryusTC" on #openttdcoop.dev #openttd #debian-next #debian #coopetition
23:07-!-Redentor [~armando@2600:3c01:e000:20c:26a:b4b9:9a0e:e249] has quit []
23:14-!-mendel_munkis_ [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has joined #debian
23:14-!-mendel_munkis_ is "realname" on #debian #i2p #debian-gaming #Corsair
23:16-!-mendelmunkis [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has joined #debian
23:16-!-mendelmunkis is "realname" on #debian #i2p #debian-gaming #Corsair
23:16-!-mendel_munkis_ [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:20-!-mendel_munkis [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:20-!-Despatche [~desp@72.11.37.193] has quit [Quit: Read error: Connection reset by deer]
23:21-!-wayne2 [~wayne@178.162.194.66] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:22-!-wayne2 [~wayne@178.162.194.66] has joined #debian
23:22-!-wayne2 is "..." on #debian
23:22-!-mendelmunkis [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:23-!-mendel_munkis [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has joined #debian
23:23-!-mendel_munkis is "realname" on #debian #i2p #debian-gaming #Corsair
23:23-!-nssy [~nssy@197.237.111.196] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:24-!-mendel_munkis [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has quit [Read error: No route to host]
23:27-!-wololoer [~user@00022ff6.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 3.0.1]
23:29-!-mendel_munkis [~mendelmun@2600:1017:b427:8c7f:3e6a:a7ff:fe42:ee38] has joined #debian
23:29-!-mendel_munkis is "realname" on #debian #i2p #debian-gaming #Corsair
23:33-!-dvs [~hibbard@00012127.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:40-!-noemijf [lepoik@2607:5300:60:21b::1] has left #debian []
23:42-!-newtons [~newtons@101.39.196.178.dynamic.wline.res.cust.swisscom.ch] has joined #debian
23:42-!-newtons is "newtons" on #debian
23:42-!-Redentor [~armando@2600:3c01:e000:20c:26a:b4b9:9a0e:e249] has joined #debian
23:42-!-Redentor is "realname" on #linode #debian-next #debian-mx #debian
23:52-!-wayne2 [~wayne@178.162.194.66] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:52-!-wayne2 [~wayne@178.162.194.66] has joined #debian
23:52-!-wayne2 is "..." on #debian
23:55-!-rojin [~rojin@106.195.67.197] has joined #debian
23:55-!-rojin is "realname" on #minidebconf-india-rex #minidebconf-india-buzz #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-india
23:55-!-rojin [~rojin@106.195.67.197] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:55-!-rojin is "realname" on #minidebconf-india-rex #minidebconf-india-buzz #kernelnewbies #debian #debian-india
23:55-!-rojin [~rojin@106.195.67.197] has joined #debian
23:55-!-nssy [~nssy@197.232.7.51] has joined #debian
23:55-!-nssy is "realname" on #debian
23:57-!-newtons [~newtons@101.39.196.178.dynamic.wline.res.cust.swisscom.ch] has quit []
---Logclosed Mon Jun 07 00:00:18 2021