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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-08-17

---Logopened Tue Aug 17 00:00:58 2021
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00:13<lifesgood>I would like to contribute to debian somehow, may be even translation, do do I apply?
00:16<lifesgood>ok forguet
00:16<somiaj>!help
00:17<somiaj>https://www.debian.org/devel/join/
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00:18<somiaj>https://www.debian.org/intro/help
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00:34<twb>Ubuntu used to have a "how can I help" thing that listed all sorts of entry-level tasks
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00:35<twb>It has some cutesy metaphorical name like low-hanging-fruit.launchpad.net
00:35<twb>lifesgood: anyway. For translation specifically, which language(s) do you speak? We can direct you to that specific group
00:36<lifesgood>twb i am notive portuguese
00:36<lifesgood>*native
00:36<twb>luso or brasilero?
00:37<lifesgood>brasileiro
00:37<twb>lifesgood: /join #debian-br
00:37<twb>Let me look up their translation team also
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00:47<lifesgood>I subscribed my email
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00:49<twb>lifesgood: sorry I can not give better advice
00:49<twb>lifesgood: there should be a recipe somewhere, but I can't find it.
00:50<lifesgood>ok
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00:51<rajivmars>hi all. i have just installed debian 11 on my hp laptop. when i brows something from firefox or chrome browsers its not detecting any other fonts except english. inplace of other fonts the browsers are displaying square boxes. how to fix this issue?
00:52<jm_>rajivmars: well have you installed other font packages?
00:52<rajivmars>no
00:52<twb>Aha https://wiki.debian.org/pt_BR/L10n
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00:53<rajivmars>jm_ what font packages i m in need?
00:53<twb>rajivmars: "apt show task-punjabi-desktop" and look in for fonts-* in the output
00:53<rajivmars>here is a glimpse of what i am talking about https://pastebin.com/9fSAXEjF
00:54<rajivmars>twb; ok
00:54<rajivmars>twb; this is the output https://pastebin.com/8SwdfuW6
00:55<rajivmars>twb; i have only checked devnagri
00:55<twb>devanagari should be under hindi
00:56<rajivmars>whenever a devnagri fonts is needed the browsers are behaving like this
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00:56<twb>rajivmars: what languages/scripts do you want to see?
00:56<rajivmars>twb; English/Hindi/Sanskrit.
00:57<twb>OK so fonts-lohit-deva
00:58<rajivmars>twb; do i need to restart the computer after installing these fonts packages?
00:58<twb>No
00:58<twb>You might need to restart the app
00:58<rajivmars>ok
00:58<twb>rajivmars: you can test if the font is visible with a CLI command
00:58<twb>"fc-list :lang=hi"
00:59<twb>"fc-list :lang=hi family | sort -u" is a little easier to read
00:59<rajivmars>twb; thanks a lot the issue has been fixed now:)
00:59<twb>I see these at least: "Lohit Devanagari", "Lohit Marathi", "Lohit Nepali"
00:59<twb>Cool
01:00<twb>I recommend also to install "noto" font packages.
01:00<twb>(If you have disk space)
01:00<rajivmars>twb; i ok i am installing it right now
01:00<twb>fonts-noto-core at least, I think.
01:00<rajivmars>what is the name of noto font package?
01:00<rajivmars>oh.. thanks
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01:02<rajivmars>twb; the noto fonts fixed the issue completely. thank god you save me.
01:03<twb>No worries
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01:36<mrmonkey_>help
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01:37<mrmonkey_>hello
01:38-!-mode/#debian [+l 984] by debhelper
01:38<jm_>!ask
01:38<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/ See <smart questions><errors>.
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01:40<Konomi>if I'm compiling a lot of different packages/projects is it worth doing such things in a chroot to avoid having a lot of devolper packages installed on my system? (Question for long term Debian users)
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01:42<marcidy>Hi, I updated from buster to bullseye today, everything went great, except forwarding between my laptop's wifi interface and ethernet interface doesn't work now. some info: https://paste.debian.net/1207937/ I've been using this set up for a few years, and it stopped functioning right after.
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01:44<Konomi>last I checked bullseye is on 5.10 why is it that your output shows 4.9 if you upgraded?
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01:47<marcidy>not sure, taking a look
01:47<Konomi>maybe an incomplete upgrade
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01:48<Konomi>might be unrelated to your problem but still worth getting that sorted first
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01:50<marcidy>nice, yup, that at least explains the kernel, I see it in the logs: Error! Bad return status for module build on kernel: 5.10.0-8-amd64 (x86_64) will try to sort that out.
01:51<Tj>marcidy: what network management tool were you using previously (e.g. ifupdown, NetworkManager, systemd-netword) or were those disabled ? I'd check that none of those are now enabled and active because they may be countermanding your manual configuration
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01:51<Tj>marcidy: e.g. "systemctl status systemd-networkd" "systemctl status NetworkManager" "systemctl status networking"
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01:55<marcidy>Tj: they were disabled, i do it all on the command line..although im not sure what systemctl status networking used to show. Now it shows "active", others are disabled. /etc/default/networking is effectively empty, just comments
01:55<jm_>Konomi: using chroot for building certainly makes for a cleaner system
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01:55<Konomi>jm_: that was my general impression I was just hoping for some peeps with more experience using debian than I also came to the same conclusion
01:56<Tj>marcidy: if networkd is active check if it is managing those interfaces, because it will remove any manaul config instantly. "networkctl list"
01:56<twb>marcidy: coming at it cold, /sbin/sysctl -a | grep ip_forward
01:56<Tj>twb: the pastebin already shows forawarding is enabled
01:57<twb>ah sorry
01:57<Tj>that is assuming sysctl is working of course! "net.ipv4.ip_forward=1"
01:57<marcidy>Tj: systemd-networkd is not running, all three interfaces unmanaged
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01:57<twb>Yeah that all looks basically legit from first-principles basis. Sould use "nft list ruleset" or "iptables-save" not "iptables -L" though
01:58<Tj>marcidy: good!! that has cauught me out many times when I make manual changes to networkd interfaces :)
01:58<marcidy>proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward shows ip_forward is enabled
01:58<twb>On linux sysctl and /proc/sys are basically the same, so that's fine
01:58<jm_>you could use tcpdump to see if kernel forwards the packets
01:58<Tj>marcidy: have you done a tcpdump ?
01:58<twb>Yes I would be trying tcpdump and ICMP echo request/reply as next steps
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01:59<twb>I'm also assuming your hostapd.conf and dhcpd.conf are basically fine
01:59<Tj>marcidy: I do not see the config of the $WAN interface there
01:59<twb>Tj: like a call to iw(8) ?
01:59<twb>nm misread
01:59<marcidy>Sorry, it's there, line 5. I ripped that out of a bash script
02:00*enyc meows
02:00<Tj>marcidy: i mean, I do not see what configuration you're applying to $WAN
02:00<twb>BTW there is also #netfilter on Libera which handles this kind of question
02:00<Tj>marcidy: as twb said, check hostapd is working correctly, no errors in its log
02:01<twb>marcidy: please pastebin these: "ip a", "ip r", "ip rule", "nft list ruleset", "iptables-save -c", hostapd.conf, whatever dhcpd has for its .conf
02:01<Tj>marcidy: presumably client stations are able to connect to this master AP ?
02:01<marcidy>Will do. Yeah, i can connect clients and acess them fine (and they can access the AP fine, ssh, ping, etc). It's just the forwarding. will collect that info
02:02<Tj>marcidy: good :) that makes things easier, reducing the problem space
02:02<marcidy>I just raise $WAN via ip link set $WAN up; dhclient $WAN;
02:03<Tj>marcidy: the thing I always worry about when using iptables --append (-A) is you've some rules before those that trigger. For that reason I generally use --insert (-I) since by default the rule goes in at the head of the chain
02:03<jm_>not really related, but why do that manually when ifup can do that?
02:03<Tj>It would be a good plan to migrate over to systemd-networkd now; it's pretty simple config for that. We use it for our APs here so I could show example configs
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02:08<twb>You should never use "iptables" only "iptables-restore".
02:08<twb>Using iptables(8) has race conditions and is, basically, just plain broken
02:08<twb>(Although now it's a wrapper for nft, that MIGHT be fixed)
02:11<marcidy>All good advice, I cobbled this all together without ever really learning it. I tried a while back to switch to systemd but got lost, examples would be super helpful!
02:11<marcidy>here's the requested info: https://paste.debian.net/1207949/
02:11<twb>marcidy: I know lots about that
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02:16<marcidy>jm_: It started off as whatever steps I found online to do things like run an AP, then evolved a little bit so being able to set up combinations of AP/routing/dhcp and whatever for devices at work, and I kind of like doing things somewhat manually so i remember the commands.
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02:19<Tj>marcidy: have you tested whether this is just DNS? e.g. on a wifi client can you "ping 8.8.8.8"
02:19<marcidy>Tj: I cannot ping 8.8.8.8 from the client
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02:20<twb>marcidy: this is wrong: inet 192.168.3.20/32
02:20<Tj>marcidy: OK, with that ping continuing to run, on the NAt gateway see where the packets get to. "tcpdump -ni wlp2s0 host 8.8.8.8"
02:20<marcidy>whoops, that's supposed to be /24
02:20<twb>You've omitted a /24 somewhere
02:20<twb>If you use "ip a add" you also should add "brd +" if you want dhcp to work
02:20<twb>That configures broadcast mojo
02:20<Tj>that'll be the " sudo /sbin/ip addr add 192.168.3.20 dev $LAN"
02:21<twb>yes that line
02:21<Tj>it is assuming /32 in the absence of anything else
02:21<Tj>twb: good spot
02:22<twb>You're using nft as iptables so that's good.
02:22<twb>Probably want "channel=auto" these days, but meh
02:22<twb>Probably want WPA3 SAE these days, but meh
02:23<twb>Everything else in the past looks good to me
02:23<twb>Fix the /24 and brd +, restart dhcpd to be on the safe side, then start tcpdumping
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02:23*twb wanders off again
02:24<marcidy>haha, ok, will do. here's the current tcp dump for ref: https://paste.debian.net/1207951/
02:25<jm_>you need to run it on both interfaces
02:26<twb>I would also be looking at "tcpdump -pni wlan0 port bootps or port bootpc" and/or the DHCP logs, making sure DHCP looks sensible
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02:27<twb>tshark -i sshdump -o extcap.sshdump.remoteusername:root -o extcap.sshdump.remotehost:localhost -o extcap.sshdump.remotenoprom:true -o extcap.sshdump.remoteinterface:wlan0 -NdmnNtv
02:27<n00binstein>Hello! I am trying to revive an ancient laptop with 32-bit Intel CPU. Trying to install i386 variant of Bullseye on it, but I'm stuck at network detection, where the installer fails to install b43/ucode11 firmware. That happens whether I plug an USB stick with non-free firmware or use an unofficial image with firmware prepackaged. Any suggestions? Previously I was able to put Ubuntu 18.04 on this machine without much issue.
02:27<twb>...is a horrible thing that will let you run tcpdump as root but still use insecure (but better) analysers
02:28<twb>n00binstein: did the installer find the b43 firmware and then fail to use it?
02:28<twb>n00binstein: or did it not find the firmware at all
02:28<jm_>n00binstein: check if installer gives more clues on tty3/4
02:28<twb>n00binstein: check on tty4 or so, in the logs
02:28<n00binstein>It doesn't seem to be able to find it at all.
02:28<n00binstein>Will do!
02:28<twb>n00binstein: first guess: USB driver also broken, so can't see USB stick after boot
02:28<Konomi>could try the non free cd instead
02:29<n00binstein>I'm using non-free cd.
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02:29<twb>n00binstein: I recommend either use wired ethernet instead during install (if possible), or use non-free install media, or do the install elsewhere and then cp the filesystem over
02:29<Konomi>then you shouldn't need a usb stick with firemware
02:29<twb>I agree with Konomi
02:30<Konomi>find the exact point in the installer logs where it lists the firmware file it's looking for
02:30<Konomi>then we can go search to make sure that actually exists in a debian package
02:30<n00binstein>Hm, will my wifi work after that?
02:30<twb>just tail the logs and then hit retry
02:33<n00binstein>Just a moment. Now I need to figure out how to scroll the console backlog, since shift+pgup doesn't seem to be doing anything. Sorry, my user handle wasn't chosen without basis. :-)
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02:37<jm_>if you switched away then scrolling won't work IIRC
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02:38<jm_>when installing over ssh those things run in screen so there's scrollback, not sure if screen is used during regular install (it would be useful)
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02:40<n00binstein>ww
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02:42<n00binstein>Oops. It just tells me that "Direct firmware load for b43 (here go variants) failed with error -2. It then tells me to go to https://wireless.wiki.kernel.org/en/users/drivers/b43 and read it carefully, which I am doing now.
02:43<marcidy>ok, updated ip a and tcpdumps: https://paste.debian.net/1207952/ no behavior change. I restarted dhcpd on the AP, and also redid dhclient on the client as well. DHCPD logs are fine, there's a complaint that not subnets declared on enp0s25, but i dont' want it on enp0s25, so it's OK.
02:44<marcidy>I do have wireshark installed if that's any help, I don't have tshark at this second but can install it
02:44<jm_>n00binstein: check which files it's looking for and then check if they are actually on the cd
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02:46<marcidy>ping -b 192.168.3.255 doesn't return any responses to the client from the AP, but I see the pings in "tcpdump -ni wlp2s0 host 192.168.3.255"
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02:53<n00binstein>Maybe I got a hint. The cdrom has one debian package with a name suggesting it comes with a driver, whereas the firmware archive you can download from debian.org has two (one with "legacy" in its name - that one is present on the CD). The wiki page suggests installing the package should be all that's required for the chip to work.
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02:54<n00binstein>The thing is I do have two USB sticks plugged into the laptop: one with the installation media, and one with the extra firmware (prepared in a way requested in instructions on debian.org). It appears the installer doesn't see that other stick.
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03:02<jm_>n00binstein: those packages download firmware files, they are not packaged in debian
03:03<twb>marcidy: you should be seeing "DHCP DORA". I see R's but not A's. Unless that's how tcpdump displays DHCPACCEPT ?
03:03<twb>Oh well doesn't matter. the ping goes out so it's got a Good Enough ip address
03:05<twb>marcidy: do you see outgoing echo-requests on enp0s25 also?
03:05<twb>I'm running out of thins that could be wrong... rp_filter?
03:06<twb>Does this still look slightly wrong "192.168.3.0/24 via 192.168.3.20 dev wlp2s0"
03:07<twb>It should be "src 192.168.3.20" not "via"
03:07<jm_>ping does not show up in tcpdump for enp0s25 though
03:07<twb>jm_: OK. So problem is firewall on the bridge host
03:07<marcidy>twb: yes to the echo requests on enp0s25. the tcpdump in the pastebin was only on wlp2s0
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03:08<twb>marcidy: sysctl -a | grep rp_filter. Set them all to =0 temporarily.
03:08<marcidy>or, let me rephrase that. the command was: "tcpdump -ni wlp2s0 host 8.8.8.8"
03:08<marcidy>rp_filters are all 0
03:08<n00binstein>Well, I'll try to install Debian while directly plugged with an ethernet cable, then follow instructions on how to install the proprietary driver. If you don't see me again, it means it worked! Cheers for now!
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03:08<twb>Huh, I guess systemd's safer defaults are still nerfed by debian
03:09<sunkan>After upgrade to bullseye in a nspawn container (and the host) that has bind mount from the host no longer works correct giving errors about NAMESPACE. Removing Bind=/home from .nspawn config file everything works again (but no access to /home from host of course). Any ideas on how to look further into this? http://paste.debian.net/hidden/b18a060e/
03:12<twb>sunkan: were you running a backports kernel previously?
03:12<sunkan>twb: No
03:12<twb>sunkan: so you probably had a big kernel version jump?
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03:13<marcidy>twb: not sure about the DHCP DORA, I'm used to looking at the DHCP logs and they look OK with DISCOVER/OFFER/REQUEST/ACK/RELEASE
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03:13<twb>marcidy: k
03:13<twb>DORA = discover offer request accept
03:13<sunkan>twb: Yes from 4.19 to 5.10
03:13<marcidy>ah, nice, ok
03:15<sunkan>twb: But container was working after host upgrade (including kernel) but not after the userspace in the container was upgraded.
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03:16<twb>sunkan: understood.
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03:16<sunkan>twb: Needed to add Capability=CAP_NET_ADMIN to the .nspawn file though (but that seemed to be exepected behavior from what I found out)
03:17<twb>sunkan: what I would be doing next is looking for stuff in systemd-machined change notes that says something like "if you have 5.xxx or newer, make sure you do X"
03:17<twb>sunkan: ah cool, it's solved now?
03:17<sunkan>twb: No, that was just another thing I had issues with but that was after only the host was upgraded.
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03:18<marcidy>brb, rebooting
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03:19<sunkan>twb: You mean change notes from GIT or changelog.gz in /usr/share/doc ?
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03:20<twb>sunkan: yeah poke around in /usr/share/doc basically
03:20<twb>sunkan: I realize this isn't as good as "it just works"
03:21<sunkan>twb: I am looking, did glance through the docs earlier but had not seen this error at the time so may not have noticed if there is info about it.
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03:23<twb>it's often easier to find once you know what the answer is :-)
03:23<twb>I bet if you look for CAP_NET_ADMIN it'll show up quickly
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03:24<marcidy>ok, well, problem solved via some combination apt-get install linux-image-5.10.0-8-amd64, a reboot, and making those changes. Thanks everyone for pointing out the errors
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03:25<sunkan>twb: true
03:26<WizardNumberNext>good morning everybody
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03:36<sunkan>twb: Do you think it is worth trying to revert from cgroups2? Looks like it is just a kernel cmdline change to try.
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03:37<twb>sunkan: sorry, outside my skillset
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03:37<twb>marcidy: my guess is that /32 instead of /24 left some damage which a reboot cleared
03:38<WizardNumberNext>twb, marcidy, may I ask what are you talking about. I just joined and I see talk about network
03:39<sunkan>twb: I will setup a test on a separate computer and try it.
03:41<twb>WizardNumberNext: marcidy wanted to basically do tethering on a debian host
03:41<twb>WizardNumberNext: so a wifi host could use debian host's phat ethernet pipe
03:42<twb>WizardNumberNext: marcidy's script was slightly janky; after some tweaking and a reboot, it worked
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03:43<WizardNumberNext>twb, oh, I see. I usually use bridge, if there is no need for separation
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03:46<WizardNumberNext>I hope this is corect place for my question. I am trying to assemble whole Jessie mirror. The problem is, that no single place contains whole jessie release. KfreeBSD was stopped being provided on mirros at the same time, asarchitectures, which are on in LTS. LTS is easy to obtain. I have mirrored everything after weeks of pulling it from snapshots.debian.org (I am very sorry for bandwidth and latency used). I have
03:46<WizardNumberNext>everything needed. I just need to create all files which are residing in dists section. I know how to create Packages and Contents and even Release. I am clueless how to EASILY create Contents-udeb-$arch.gz. Anybody with good idea or who can point me to good source of knowldge. It is hard to ask good question on google (the less words you will use, the more you will get results, but this time it does not work to my
03:46<WizardNumberNext>advantage).
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03:50<twb>WizardNumberNext: er, surely you just want debmirror or jigdo?
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03:51<twb>WizardNumberNext: if you want a full mirror of deb.debian.org "nicely" then you need to run some crappy custom scripts which aren't in debian. #debian-mirrors knows about that
03:52<twb>WizardNumberNext: if your goal is more like "I want to install 1000 desktops without waiting for 1000 downloads", then I recommend apt-cacher-ng
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03:53<tarzeau>WizardNumberNext: there's #debian-kbsd
03:53<twb>Contents is generated by apt-ftparchive or a larger tool like reprepro. I *think* it works the same for udebs.
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03:54<twb>apt-ftparchive is not well documented and is not recommended. I only run it because I'm a grumpy old man. http://ix.io/2Sdg is my crappy in-house wrapper.
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03:55<WizardNumberNext>twb: I have full set of DVDs images already. debmirror won't do whole job. There is LTS for wheezy, so no powerpc, no kfreebsd in main archive. There is full archive on snapshots.debian.org and I got it too. Currently I have 3 mirrors for jessie: LTS, kfreebsd and non-LTS
03:55<twb>WizardNumberNext: what is your end goal here?
03:55<WizardNumberNext>twb: I uses to use apt-cacher-ng. It was great till it filled up my raspberry Pi 4B
03:55<WizardNumberNext>twb: to have COMPLETE mirror of debian
03:56<twb>WizardNumberNext: to what purpose
03:56<WizardNumberNext>twb: I have all releases apart from jessie ready
03:56<WizardNumberNext>twb: archive and private mirror
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03:57<WizardNumberNext>twb: I have wheezy debian-security, which you cannot find elsewhere, as I have all in one place
03:57<twb>So what, like... a museum?
03:57<somiaj>WizardNumberNext: I see jessie-kfreebsd on archive.debian.org, maybe just have a seperate mirror for kfreebsd?
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03:57<diva>join
03:57<twb>It still sounds like a means to an (unstated) end
03:58<WizardNumberNext>twb: you are quite close. This will be archive, museum and for screenshots of all releases.
03:58-!-mode/#debian [+l 990] by debhelper
03:58<somiaj>is wheezy debian-security needed, I thought they put all those packages into wheezy when they moved wheezy to archive?
03:58<somiaj>!archive
03:58<dpkg>An archive is a collection of files. 'tar', 'ar', 'cpio' are all archiving tools. This is *not* the same as compression, which is a separate operation. Debian Archives is the repository for old Debian releases, see http://www.debian.org/distrib/archive . For the package archive, ask me about <snapshot>. For old Debian <ISO> files ask me about <cd archive>. For old versions of source code see https://sources.debian.org/
03:58<diva>how to update my tools
03:58<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: yes it is there. Can you check if it contains binary-all and what date is it?
03:58<twb>diva: can you be more specific?
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03:59<diva>how to install repositories in kernel?
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03:59<twb>WizardNumberNext: well OK. I think that use case is unusual enough to talk to the mirrors team directly (#d-mirrors)
03:59<somiaj>WizardNumberNext: http://archive.debian.org/debian/ -- I also think that the LTS are merged there as well, but I'm not positive on all the details.
03:59<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: when you want to have full mirror, archive and sort of museus? Yes
04:00<diva>full mirror
04:00<WizardNumberNext>twb: thank for pointing to channel channel
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04:00<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: Sat, 09 Jun 2018 08:20:40 UTC for jessie-kfreebsd
04:01<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: and no binary-all, which makes it impossible to use debmirror
04:01<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: I c
04:01<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: I actually wrote one-liner to pull everything from archive.debian.org in jessie
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04:02<twb>wget2 --mirror --no-robots? :P
04:02<WizardNumberNext>somiej: latest jessie-kfreebsd is 2019-03-21 20:23:17
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04:02<WizardNumberNext>twb: no it was much more involved, as you don't wont to pull whole pool including all releases
04:02<twb>is archive.d.o the stuff from before the last snapshot.d.o crash?
04:03<WizardNumberNext>twb: I actually have listed all packages in sections and then wget;d them
04:03<somiaj>I'm a bit unclear on the full details, but I think when a release is copied over to archive is after it leaves LTS, so at that time all the security packages and LTS get coppied into the release, it does ahve debian-security, but this is only for older releases, since I think that was before they start just copying them into the actual release
04:03<twb>Yeah it's buzz and bo and all that
04:03<WizardNumberNext>twb: yeah before
04:03<twb>WizardNumberNext: if you're going to use wget instead of rsync I strongly recommend wget2 since that speaks HTTP/2 and can negotiate pipelines properly
04:04<somiaj>twb: archive and snapshot are fairly different, archive only contains the final packages in a release vs snapshot should contain all packages ever seen.
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04:04<twb>somiaj: so like it's essentially a snapshot of the last day before EOL?
04:04<WizardNumberNext>twb: it may have saved me from network unreachable
04:05<somiaj>twb: Though with LTS and ELTS it might contain those packages as well since now releases don't leave the main mirrors until after that
04:05<somiaj>it is a copy of teh release at the moment it is removed from the main mirrors
04:05<twb>OK
04:05<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: that is exactly the reason why you cannot get full jessie from archive. Not to mention all jessie is missing binary-all in archive, so no debmirror use
04:05<twb>I think last time I wanted that I just picked a near-enough date and used s.d.o
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04:06<somiaj>for those running older releases archive seems to work just fine for them, though as for copying the mirror, you may need more details on how to do that from archive as you said debmirror doesn't seem to work.
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04:07<twb>isn't binary-all just Architecture: all packages? Why wouldn't that be there?
04:07<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: Sat, 23 Jun 2018 10:30:18 UTC this is date for jessie on archive.d.o last jessie was 2019-07-06 09:36:16
04:07<WizardNumberNext>twb: binary-all in architecture agnostic - like scripts
04:08<WizardNumberNext>twb: it is not there and even wheezy is missing binary-all in some places
04:09<twb>Yeah so where is 0ad-data-common in jessie?
04:09<WizardNumberNext>twb: I guess it should be binary-all - I can check my own mirror
04:10<twb>WizardNumberNext: right
04:10<WizardNumberNext>twb: binary-all
04:11<twb>WizardNumberNext: so it exists but is missing somehow
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04:12<WizardNumberNext>twb: http://archive.debian.org/debian/dists/jessie/main/ look for folder binary-all
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04:13<twb>WizardNumberNext: I don't see it
04:13<twb>Am I mad?
04:13<WizardNumberNext>twb: same date https://snapshot.debian.org/archive/debian/20180623T151053Z/dists/jessie/main/
04:13<twb>http://archive.debian.org/debian/dists/jessie/main/ (missing)
04:13<twb>http://deb.debian.org/debian/dists/bullseye/main/binary-all/ (present)
04:13<WizardNumberNext>twb: and there is binary-all
04:13<somiaj>not sure why you need binary-all, all of the packages are also listed in binary-amd64 for instance, you don't really need both.
04:14<WizardNumberNext>twb: you see the problem now
04:14<twb>somiaj: I *suspect* it's just that WizardNumberNext is running debmirror with --architectures=amd64,all
04:14<twb>somiaj: and the answer is "don't do that"
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04:14<somiaj>binary-amd64 or whatever should have the list of all the packages (including those for all arches) already
04:14<twb>But the different srtucture confused me
04:15<somiaj>As for jessie, it does seem that jessie lts isn't on archive, jessie on archive is a mirror of the date it was removed from the mirrors
04:15<somiaj>!jessie
04:15<dpkg>Jessie is the codename for Debian 8, released on 2015-04-25. Security support ended 2018-05-17, repos removed from mirrors around 2019-03-24, except for <jessie-lts>. Jessie is the cowgirl in Toy Story 2. See http://wiki.debian.org/DebianJessie and ask me about <install jessie> <jessie release notes> <wheezy->jessie>. Last point release was <8.11>.
04:15<twb>somiaj: so, is it that dists/X/main/binary-all was added sometime after jessie, to reduce duplication?
04:15<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: you are correct, but you need binary-all for getting mirror using debmirror, as binary-all is mentioned in Realeas
04:15<somiaj>twb: maybe, not quite sure, but on the main mirrors and due to ELTS, maybe it was added, I don't know the mirrors well enough.
04:15<twb>k
04:16<twb>WizardNumberNext: I'm definitely mirroring jessie without any issues FWIW
04:16<WizardNumberNext>twb: no, I run debmirror with more specific architecures
04:16<somiaj>but it seems that I was mistaken, archive may not contain anything from LTS, you may have to talk to the archive team or LTS team as to why these aren't there (or maybe they will be coppied over for the few arches LTS supports once LTS is finally removed from the mirrors)
04:16<twb>Ah sorry no. Right now I only have stretch
04:17<somiaj>https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=944139
04:17<judd>Bug https://bugs.debian.org/944139 in debmirror (open): «debmirror archive.debian.org fails due to missing binary-all»; severity: important; opened: 2019-11-04; last modified: 2021-05-27.
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04:17<WizardNumberNext>twb: it depends. for LTS it is amd64,armel,armhf,i386 for just jessie it is arm64,mips,mipsel,powerpc,ppc64el,s390x for kfreebsd it is kfreebsd-amd64,kfreebsd-i386
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04:18<somiaj>seems there is an --ignore-arch-all option you can use for repos that don't have binary-all such as archive and other places
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04:19<somiaj>though also seems (last comment in that bug) someone is still having trouble
04:19<twb>debmirror's a manky perl script anyway, you can probably patch out whatever is annoying
04:19<somiaj>WizardNumberNext: this seems to be more a bug in debmirror (see the report and maybe folow it) than the fact that thigns aren't archived, as archive does contain the old releases
04:19<WizardNumberNext>twb: I wish you were right. try to use all architectures: amd64,arm64,armel,armhf,i386,kfreebsd-amd64,kfreebsd-i386,mips,mipsel,powerpc,ppc64el,s390x
04:19<somiaj>but I do agree, it appears that archive won't contain the LTS packages, so you may have to get the LTS updates from the main mirror if you want those for the supported arches.
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04:21<WizardNumberNext>somiaj: effectively to have everything you need 3 mirrors
04:21<WizardNumberNext>somiaj, twb: my mirrors are splitted by architecture and LTS
04:21<WizardNumberNext>now I am merging those into single one
04:22<twb>WizardNumberNext: why, to save space?
04:22<WizardNumberNext>I can do all whats needed apart from creating Contents-udeb-$architecture.gz
04:22<twb>Just dedup with hardlink(1) or ZFS
04:22<WizardNumberNext>twb: I efectivelly want to get in single place as on archive.d.o
04:22<twb>The files won't change often since they're dead releases, so a brute-force bodge like that will suffice
04:23<twb>WizardNumberNext: then patch debmirror to not suck I guess
04:23<twb>>shrug<
04:23<WizardNumberNext>twb: I am doing pretty much brute-force with usage of btrfs subvolume snapshots
04:24<WizardNumberNext>twb: I was thinking about that. How hard can PERL be to learn just enough to patch this out? I am writing one-liners on bash and full blown scripts too.
04:24<twb>WizardNumberNext: do you speak C?
04:24<twb>I mean crap old 90s C?
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04:25<twb>If so, crap old 90s perl is basically identical
04:25<WizardNumberNext>twb: I speak C enough to write simple programs saving me weeks of calculations
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04:25<twb>WizardNumberNext: yeah just spend 1-2 days learning enough perl to fix this script
04:26<WizardNumberNext>twb: judging by the road you lead me, it would be 1-2 days
04:26<twb>That's what I said
04:26<WizardNumberNext>twb: I speak C only when I need to use processor instead of my brain
04:27<WizardNumberNext>twb: which means few times a year
04:27<twb>WizardNumberNext: that's sufficient
04:27<twb>Just remember to "use criticism;"
04:27<WizardNumberNext>twb: I shall have a look now to see what I am against
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04:34<WizardNumberNext>PERL is quite a mix. It looks a bit like shell script, a bit like C, a bit like C++ and a bit like GROFF. What a mix!
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04:36<avu>Sometimes it also just looks like a cat ran over the keyboard.
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04:37<twb>it's just over-the-top awk
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04:42<WizardNumberNext>twb: somiaj: If anybody is interested I think I have solved problem of creating Contents-udeb-$arch.gz. Use apt-ftparchive -o Packages::Extensions::udeb. I have not tested it yet, but use of this is due to getting consistent segfaults using apt-ftparchive without database
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05:24<n00binstein>Hello, it's me again! I managed to fix my issues preventing installation of bullseye and I am currently typing it from a fresh system. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction!
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06:12<brickfat>xrdp. doesnt allow shutdown via remote
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06:14<jinnjus>'apt install iptraf' did not result in a iptraf command for me to use...any ideas? thanks!
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06:16<ens>WizardNumberNext: good luck with the perl, it's fun when you get into it. give me a shout if you need a hand.
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06:19<somiaj>jinnjus: iptraf has been removed, and replaced with iptraf-ng, which I think is also the binary nanme
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06:20<somiaj>,v iptraf
06:20<judd>Package: iptraf on amd64 -- buster: 1:1.1.4-6; stretch: 1:1.1.4-6
06:20<somiaj>jinnjus: I think the buster package you installed is justa transitional package that install iptraf-ng
06:20<jinnjus>...ah...it also required sudo so was not autocompleting...found it
06:20<jinnjus>thanks!
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06:51<mitia>hello everyone
06:52<bittin>hi
06:53<mitia>I've just installed Debian 11 (previously I had Debian 9) and I have some issues with audio
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06:54<mitia>In settings I havo no audio device. Volume controls doesn't work. But audio works.
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06:57<erle->What is the recommended way to migrate from buster to bullseye? Just change sources.lst?
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06:57<FLD>https://www.debian.org/releases/bullseye/amd64/release-notes/ch-upgrading.en.html
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06:58<mitia>In settings I havo no audio device. Volume controls doesn't work. But audio works.
06:59<mitia>Here some information: https://paste.debian.net/1207980/
06:59<tarzeau>mitia: which volume control is that?
06:59<tarzeau>mitia: depending on if you use oss, alsa, or pulseaudio, it's different for volume controls
06:59<ydbi>mitia: did you directly upgrade from 9->11?
07:00<ydbi>if yes, that's not supported and is likely to cause lots of random unexpected issues
07:00<mitia>Both keyboard controls and Settings -> Sound page
07:00<tarzeau>mitia: but is that gnome or something else?
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07:00<mitia>No, I made a new installation
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07:00<mitia>I'm using Cinnamon
07:03<mitia>@tarzeau: the default audio service in Bullseye is Pulseaudio ?
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07:08<mitia>Here some other information: https://paste.debian.net/1207981/
07:09<mitia>It seems that I'm using ALSA
07:11<jm_>alsa is the underlying layer
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08:20<marcih>is it safe to use the branch ("stable") in my sources.list instead of the codename ("bullseye")? i want to be able to upgrade to the next stable version when it comes out automatically, what issues can i expect?
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08:21<kopyking>Hello there. Would anyone be able to provide any quick tips on getting xrdp working under bullseye? I cannot figure out a way to login without recieving the "Oh No! Something has gone wrong!" message
08:21<ens>kopyking: you could try remina client. that works well for me and supports a few protocols
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08:22<kopyking>@marcih I put "stable" in all my sources.list file. The next time a new relase comes out, apt is smart enough to tell you when that upgrade is happening and ask permission before it does the upgrade.
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08:22<marcih>kopyking: Seconding ens' Remmina recommendation, it's a fine RDP client with a nice GUI.
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08:23<kopyking>I will give it a shot, but I don't think the client is the issue. The xrdp server is returning the problem.
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08:23<ens>i thought rdp was a windows thing?
08:24<kopyking>RDP is a windows thing yes.
08:24<kopyking>I cannot run remina as I'm connecting from a windows client.
08:24<vv221>14:20 <marcih> is it safe to use the branch ("stable") in my sources.list instead of the codename ("bullseye")?
08:24<vv221>No ;)
08:25<vv221>Upgrades between versions are not supposed to be done unattended.
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08:25<vv221>That’s why we have release notes.
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08:27<marcih>vv221: Thanks! What's the reason for providing the option then? What's the proper use-case for it?
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08:30<kopyking>Any other thoughts on getting xrdp/xorgxrdp running on bullseye without the error message? thank you in advance.
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08:32<marcih>kopyking: I can try it out, I've got some spare time and a free Debian 11 and Windows machine. What's the issue?
08:34<kopyking>@marcih When attempting to connect, I get a "Oh No! Something has gone wrong!" message. With the only option being to logout.
08:34<vv221>marcih, here I use it on Debian Sid, to always know the versions available in oldstable/stable/testing.
08:34<vv221>(in addition to the unstable versions I am using)
08:35<vv221>I can’t think of any reliable use case outside of Sid usage or Debian development.
08:35<marcih>vv221: Makes sense. Somewhat ':) Thanks for the clarification though, changing the source list now
08:36<vv221>I know it’s a bit confusing, it looks like an easy trap ;)
08:36<marcih>kopyking: How long are you going to be around? I've installed xrdp and will try to get it working, might take me a few
08:37<vv221>At first it sounds smart to replace the codename with "stable"…
08:37<marcih>vv221: It does! It sounds like a reasonable thing to do
08:37<vv221>Then everything breaks two years later, and you of course do not remember what is the cause.
08:37<marcih>Are upgrades from one major stable version to another not supported then?
08:38<vv221>They are, but you should do that manually, following the release notes each time. Because each major upgrade has a couple specifics.
08:39<vv221>(to contrast with the regular point updates during the life cycle of a given stable version, that can be run unattendend)
08:39<kopyking>I'm going to be around for awhile.
08:39<vv221>*unattended
08:39<grove>Only if the two stable versions you want to upgrade between are consecutive. E.g. upgrades from Wheezy to Bullseye are not supported, but Buster to Bullseye is
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08:42<marcih>vv221: So what would then be the issue with having "stable" in my sources list if I don't do unattended upgrades and just "apt update && apt upgrade" every now and then manually?
08:42<andi89gi>Hey folks! Anybody tried to follow https://wiki.debian.org/Init - and use init system on recent Bullseye release?
08:42<marcih>grove: That does make sense!
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08:45<tepozoa>kopyking: I don't spot any major changes in the xrdp release notes between the versions, you'll need to sit down and get much better debug going on - server (desktop?) side log reading in detail, and trying to get better debug details from your Windows client. That error you see is a useless bit of information to fix this problem, it's like saying oh no it's raining the ground is wet
08:45<marcih>andi89gi: I haven't tried that one but I did try https://wiki.debian.org/EFIStub which was considerably out of date: it talked about an initramfs package while buster and bullseye use dpkg triggers to generate a new initrd when it needs to
08:46<ydbi>marcih: don't use 'stable' in your sources.list
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08:48<marcih>kopyking: I don't get an error message like you, I just get a blank screen on login. May be something to do with me using Windows 10 to connect and GNOME on the Debian machine I'm connecting to. Nothing suspicious in the logs either. Sorry
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08:49<marcih>ydbi: So I've heard 😅️ Still not entirely clear on the reasoning though
08:49<kopyking>tepozoa: I understand that, I've reviewed a number of logs and I can see nothing sticking out that illustrates the problem.
08:49<ydbi>marcih: because it's not a documented option, it's just there for the devs
08:49<andi89gi>marcih: Ah okay - wondering if it may still possible and to proceed with this wiki ;)
08:49<vv221>marcih, because you will end up trying to do the release upgrade without a prior reading of the release notes ;)
08:50<vv221>Things will break, and you will end up asking for help here ;P
08:50<ydbi>it can be removed at any time, or changed to point to sid, or to oldoldoldold stable or whatever
08:50<ydbi>nothing is stable about the 'stable' option
08:50<kopyking>tepozoa: I've looked at the .xorgxrdp logs in my ~/ director, journalctl, and the /var/log directory. Are there any other places to look?
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08:51<vv221>And while there is no problem with asking help, it gets a bit tiring when dozen of people have issues with the same thing, like the buster/updates → bullseye-updates change that is explained in the release notes.
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08:51<marcih>vv221, ydbi: Sure, no worries. Just curiosity :)
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08:52<vv221>The thing is that if it automatically changes, it looks almost trivial, discouraging the prior reading of the upgrade documentation.
08:52<ydbi>marcih: where did you even find out about the 'stable' keyword? It's not supposed to be in any of the documentation.
08:52<tepozoa>kopyking: that's about where those logs would be, so let's presume (for debugging purposes) the server sees nothing wrong - that would tell us the error the client is seeing is something basic and fundamental to *it*
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08:53<tepozoa>so I would focus energy on, for example, using a different client like xfreerdp (FreeRDP) which has a wicket /log_level:DEBUG flag
08:53<tepozoa>*wicked
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08:54<tepozoa>you may need to boot a Linux device (or macOS), not sure if freerdp comes compiled for Windows
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08:54<marcih>Actually, speaking of versions: Is there any reason there are some packages missing from bullseye and have for a while now? The main one for me being "qalculate-gtk": it's in the buster repo (still labeled "stable" on packages.debian.org) and unstable, but hasn't been in buster for a while now. When buster was still testing, I was advised to add the sid repo and pin it so that testing always had precedence, but now that buster is stable I don't
08:54<marcih> suppose that's an advisable thing to do anymore...
08:54<kopyking>tepozoa: I'm stuck with using a windows client for the time being.
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08:54<kopyking>topozoa: I'll see what I can spin up for windows.
08:54<tepozoa>yeah I get that, but for debugging you need better client debug info
08:55<tepozoa>https://github.com/FreeRDP/FreeRDP/wiki/PreBuilds <- they have Windows builds
08:55<marcih>ydbi "where did you even find out about the 'stable' keyword?": Can't remember anymore in all honesty, probably a habit from way back when 😅️ https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/apt-howto/ch-basico.en.html
08:56<ydbi>indeed, "APT HOWTO (Obsolete Documentation) "
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08:59<marcih>I'm aware, like I said, "way back when" ;)
09:00<amacater>marcih - Maybe gcalculate-gtk depended on old, deprecated GTK (or Python 2) and the version in sid had newer GTK / Python3?
09:00<amacater>That would have been a reason not to put it into bullseye once the freezes started
09:01<amacater>there should be an excuses file somewhere which will say why
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09:03<marcih>amacater: "Maybe gcalculate-gtk depended on old, deprecated GTK (or Python 2) and the version in sid had newer GTK / Python3?" Unlikely, both buster and sid have the same version, downloading that deb and manually installing it on buster works fine. "there should be an excuses file somewhere which will say why" First time I'm hearing about that, where can I find the excuses file??
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09:04<marcih>Is it this? https://qa.debian.org/excuses.php?package=qalculate-gtk Doesn't look like there's anything...
09:05<amacater>Talk to the maintainer and work out what happened is the only other thing I can think of.
09:05<marcih>Wait, here's something: https://tracker.debian.org/news/1173632/qalculate-gtk-removed-from-testing/
09:05<marcih>And from yesterday: https://tracker.debian.org/news/1246378/qalculate-gtk-282-1-migrated-to-testing/
09:05<marcih>Does "migrated to testing" mean to bookworm since bullseye is now considered "stable"?
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09:08<andi89gi>marcih: testing will be bookworm yes
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09:08<kopyking>tepozoa: OK, I've got the FreeRDP client running with a full debug log. I'm getting the same useless error message in the rdp session, and I don't see much wrong in the FreeRDP debug log (aside from the fact that the certificates are of poor quality).
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09:09<marcih>andi89gi: Do packages from testing go into stable before the next major version? Maybe in point release or backports, like new versions do?
09:09<kopyking>tepozoa: I'm thinking that the problem is on the server side - do you not believe that to be the case?
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09:10<andi89gi>marcih: packages from testing which will be the next stable release will be used yes. Backports related is mostly for the stable release (now Bullseye). If I should be wrong in explaining it, some Debian Veteran will pls correct me ;)
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09:15<tepozoa>kopyking: I'm afraid without sitting down and combing the logs I can't say where the problem might be - RDP is a bit of a hard problem to debug as a technology - for example just the /sec:<nla etc.> options for network transport are where I would start on the client side
09:15<tepozoa>"is this a NLA problem? ugh"
09:16<tepozoa>and I agree, those logs are a real hard read - I have had to go into their source code and be like "OK I read the error, but wtf does it /mean/?"
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09:17<tepozoa>my last problem turned out to be (after doing exactly the above) one of the RDP Gateway servers in a load balancer pool was off/bad/down but the client was too stupid to report the error correctly
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09:18<tepozoa>RDP is one of my least favourite things to debug :-/ I use it because I must, not because I like it
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09:18<kopyking>tepozoa: Goody gumdrops. Thankfully, my setup is far simpler. Just one server - just one client. Worked under 10. I'll keep digging.
09:19<L1Cafe>#moocows You may not change nickname while banned or moderated on a channel (+b/+q/+m) hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
09:19<L1Cafe>Oh whoops, wrong channel, ignore that ^
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09:21<tepozoa>kopyking: we went from 0.9.9 to 0.9.12, with upstream having... 4? newer releases. For all we know, you are hitting a new bug - have a look at the notes and maybe the Github issues? https://github.com/neutrinolabs/xrdp/releases
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09:54<gothenburg>Jaha
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10:11<A|an>how the f do you download the debian key-ring?
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10:14<petn-randall>A|an: `apt install debian-keyring`?
10:14<petn-randall>A|an: Or do you mean you don't have Debian installed yet and you'd like to verify the instalation images?
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10:15<A|an>I'd like to add the entire debian keyring, but...I'm simply trying to verify Bulleye
10:15<A|an>is this the way: gpg --keyserver keyring.debian.org --recv-keys
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10:16<A|an>I guess use apt
10:16<A|an>thx
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10:17<petn-randall>A|an: https://www.debian.org/CD/verify
10:17<petn-randall>That's linked directly from the downloads section.
10:17<A|an>yes, i've been purusing that
10:17<petn-randall>And at which step did you get stuck?
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10:18<A|an>gpg --keyserver keyring.debian.org --recv-keys 0x673A03E4C1DB921F
10:18<A|an>fails
10:18<petn-randall>And which error do you get?
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10:18<A|an>gpg: WARNING: server 'dirmngr' is older than us (2.2.12 < 2.2.23)
10:18<A|an>gpg: Note: Outdated servers may lack important security fixes.
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10:19<A|an>gpg: skipped "0x673A03E4C1DB921F": Not found
10:19<A|an>do I have to be root?
10:20<A|an>I do this so infrequently...I forget
10:20<A|an>last time is was rather painless
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10:22<petn-randall>A|an: No, you don't need to be root.
10:22<A|an>just installed the keyring
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10:25<holybible>Hi, I installed Debian 11 on a new computer recently and the mouse is slower than on my previous debian system, which I used from versions 7->10. Is there something that carried over between upgrades or is it some kind of configuration that I might have done at some point that is causing the mouse to be faster on my previous install?
10:25<A|an>Success: gpg --verify SHA512SUMS.sign debian-11.0.0-amd64-netinst.iso
10:25<petn-randall>holybible: You might just have to set the speed again in your GUI.
10:25<petn-randall>A|an: nice!
10:25<holybible>I'm using my old computer (the one with the faster pointer speed) and there are no use of xset
10:26<kopyking>marcih: Missed your earlier message. Thank you for trying.
10:26<A|an>and it IS painless...when get your head in the sunlight
10:26<petn-randall>A|an: Though you shouldn't list the .iso there, you want to verify the sig on the SHA512SUMS.
10:27<petn-randall>A|an: And then verify the sha512 of the iso with that file.
10:27<holybible>petn-randall: I'm using xfce4 on both of them and the GUI settings are identical for both, max acceleration, min sensitivity
10:27<A|an>I've already done the checksum verification
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10:29<holybible>Which config files are responsible for the mouse? I'm not using xset and my xinput doesn't exist
10:29<holybible>It's been bugging me for a while, I can't find a solution.
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10:29<scorpion2185[m]>how do I only download the PKGs for apt upgrade?
10:29<holybible>I even affects the mouse emulation on my keyboard
10:30<petn-randall>scorpion2185[m]: `man apt-get`, search for download-only
10:30<holybible>*It
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10:31<scorpion2185[m]>man apt doesn't have it, is -d option
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10:34<petn-randall>scorpion2185[m]: I didn't say `man apt`.
10:34<scorpion2185[m]>I checked man apt before asking here
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10:53<qidydl>anyone know if a GPG key for packages expired in the past hour or so? all of a sudden I'm getting "unknown error executing apt-key" when trying to do apt-get update
10:55<koollman_>the error wouldn't be unknown
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10:58<jhutchins>qidydl: What release are you on? Do you have any non-standard repos?
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11:05<ckosloff>Using bullseye + kde, firefox doesn't launch bc segmentation fault
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11:08<qidydl>jhutchins: buster, but now it seems to be intermittent, I'm not sure I trust that gitlab's runner thing isn't injecting commands and breaking things because I'm getting lots of weird behavior
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11:16<ckosloff>firefox seg fault
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11:44<joeDoe>anyone noticing problems with neomutt since the 11/Bullseye upgrade? The bottom of the window under the side pane isn't completely drawn, having to give my password everytime I try to send via my provider, new mail being announced in mailboxes with no new mail...
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11:47<jhutchins>qidydl: So this is a git problem, not an apt problem.
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11:48<jhutchins>joeDoe: Sounds like something happened to your profile. Perhaps an upgraded version of mutt requires a different syntax/format.
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11:53<joeDoe>jhutchins: I looked at the changes listed on neomutt website and didn't see anything like that. I think I did see something in the changes that get listed between fetching packages and starting to install them during upgrade. Can I find that list of changes after the install somewhere?
11:54*joeDoe goes to look in /var/log
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12:02<joeDoe>I didn't find the changes list I was looking for, but I did see that a new /etc/neomuttrc was installed. I have look there.
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12:03<joeDoe>But, I still like to find the changes that get listed during a run of "apt upgrade". Anyone know if that list get kept after somewhere after reading it a typing 'q' to quit the pager?
12:03<esselfe>so I resolved my 1m31s ssh login... had to set 'UsePAM no' in /etc/ssh/sshd_config
12:03<esselfe>so it's a pam problem
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12:04<esselfe>I'm not too sure about the consequences of disabling pam though
12:04<joeDoe>apparently, when the new /etc/neomuttrc got installed, the old one wasn't saved during upgrade :(
12:05<abff>d'oh
12:06<esselfe>what's weird is that login on localhost works like a charm
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12:07<Tenkawa>joeDoe: I think its in /var/log/apt/history.log
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12:07<Tenkawa>(it is on my system anyway)
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12:08<joeDoe>naw, I saw that file. That shows what packages got added/removed/upgraded, but it doesn't give the changelog for a given package.
12:09<Tenkawa>oh.. thought you were looking for the change..
12:09<joeDoe>thanks, I wasn't clear
12:09<Tenkawa>the changelog is in the package itself
12:10<Tenkawa>you might have to pull its src
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12:10<Tenkawa>varies by pkg
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12:10<joeDoe>doh!!! /usr/share/doc/neomutt
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12:11<Tenkawa>yeah thats the usual documentation path
12:11<joeDoe>thanks Tenkawa. You got me thinking
12:11<Tenkawa>np
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12:27<hdb2>for previous versions of debian I've used ufw for managing the firewall. I would like to use firewalld, but it was buggy and didn't work as well as one would hope. with bullseye, is firewalld ready for production use?
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12:33*enyc meows
12:34<bittin>meow
12:34<enyc>hdb2: mixed answers online, i wonder if a libera ##networking channel or similar might be better place to ask
12:35<enyc>hdb2: certainly bullseye has rather newer firewalld
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12:36<hdb2>enyc: yeah I ran into the same thing googling for an answer...
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12:49<istrive>hi all, good day!
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12:50<istrive>I have disabled the ipv6 on sysctl.conf but the network command test -f /proc/net/if_inet6 && echo "Running kernel is IPv6 ready" still show as ready! what am I missing?
12:50<jkc>istrive: Why are you trying to disable ipv6?
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12:51<bahamat>Maybe I'm misunderstanding the definition of ready, doesn't that imply "you can if you want to" and not "is definitely configured"?
12:52<jkc>The situations that would require one to disable ipv6 are indescribably rare.
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13:00<istrive>Can you help with how to disable it? I don't see the need to explain why...
13:00<jkc>istrive: Because its often done for no reason, or due to a misunderstanding. So if I, personally, am going to help, you should explain why.
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13:00<istrive>Thank you for your time...
13:01<WizardNumberNext>jkc: I agree
13:01<jkc>The fact that you're unwilling to explain likely indicates that you don't actually know why you're doing it.
13:01<WizardNumberNext>maybe somebody gave advice without explanation...
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13:02<istrive>if that makes you happy, go for it!
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13:04<jkc>Why would you expect people to help you if you're going to be so uncooperative yourself? How silly.
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13:08<istrive>you sound like the Dr. Rick, we need to be protected from "becoming our parents..." ;)
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13:12<tepozoa>istrive: userland is a little funky in this area, the traces of IPv6 are there because some apps compiled with IPv6 support have a bad day when it _completely_ disappears (I ran into this once, I forget which thing it was). You can test by adding `ipv6.disable=1` to your GRUB config, update-grub and reboot. This is the ultra-hard "off" switch but could result in some userland having
13:12<tepozoa>a bad day
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13:15<somiaj>istrive: users here also try to help fix actual problems, not just here is how you do things. To us this sounds like an XY problem
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13:15<somiaj>!XY Problem
13:15<dpkg>Slow down for a bit! Are you sure that you need to jump through that particular hoop to achieve your goal? We suspect you don't, so why don't you back up a bit and tell us about the overall objective... We know that people often falsely diagnose problems because they are too close to them -- it's easy to miss that there is a better way to proceed. See http://mywiki.wooledge.org/XyProblem
13:15<somiaj>so we would prefer you tell us the actual problem/goal you have, vs you just want to disable ipv6, as we may have better solutions for your problem than you currently are thinking about
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14:04<istrive>tepozoa: Thank you for the insight! I have seen that option before, but like you stated I was also hesitant to do it that way...
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14:17<kopyking>tepozoa: Got the issue from earlier today fixed. Bug in the stable version of xrdp/xorgxrdp, moved those packages to the sid version and it's good now.
14:18<somiaj>kopyking: you don't want to mix stable and sid packages, this is just asking for trouble.
14:18<somiaj>,v xrdp
14:18<judd>Package: xrdp on amd64 -- stretch: 0.9.1-9+deb9u3; stretch-backports: 0.9.8-2~bpo9+1; buster: 0.9.9-1+deb10u1; buster-security: 0.9.9-1+deb10u1; bookworm: 0.9.12-1.1; bullseye: 0.9.12-1.1; sid: 0.9.15-1
14:18<somiaj>!ssb
14:18<dpkg>First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>.
14:18<kopyking>somiaj: Agreed but this is the lesser evil.
14:18<somiaj>In stead you should backport the package from sid
14:19<somiaj>kopyking: It is always best to practice good methods to get newer software, you don't want to mix stable/sid, this is just asking for problems
14:19<somiaj>!don't break debian
14:19<dpkg>i guess dont break debian is https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian
14:19<kopyking>somiaj: is that the same thing as doing a apt -t unstable install?
14:19<somiaj>Instead you want to use proper methods to get the newer software on your system, to ensure that depends and various things aren't broken in the process
14:19<somiaj>kopyking: no it is not, apt -t unstable install on a stable system is only asking for trouble
14:20<somiaj>Also is this bug reported in the debian BTS. Unsure if it is considered grave enough to be backported and fixed in a future point release or not, but still would be nice if there was a debian bug for this
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14:22<kopyking>somiaj: I can look into filing a bug. Can you point to a webpage with the correct method?
14:22<somiaj>!reportbug
14:22<dpkg>reportbug is used to submit bugs to the Debian <BTS>. Install reportbug, then run reportbug. See http://www.debian.org/Bugs/ http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/i386/ch05s04#problem-report for some general information about using reportbug and/or for <debian-installer> bug reporting. Also ask me about <report-bugs>. http://wiki.debian.org/reportbug http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting, or <reportbug MTA>
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14:22<somiaj>though the first thing is to check bugs.debian.org/xrdp and see if it has been reported
14:23<somiaj>and make sure you include that it is present in the bullseye package, but not in the newest upstream realse, and let the matainer decide if it is grave enough to backport in a point release
14:24<somiaj>but I'm not seeing any releated bugs reported, you may also want to look at upstream, see if there is an upstream bugreport and a patch/commit for that you can share with the matainer
14:25<tepozoa>kopyking: well there we go, not the best answer we wanted but it's at least the right answer for your problem which is half the battle
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14:28<tepozoa>kopyking: there is a Closed issue on xrdp by a Debian 11 user who did the legwork for you, and they pointed at this in their comment: https://github.com/neutrinolabs/xorgxrdp/issues/156
14:29<kopyking>Yeah, that was me.
14:29<tepozoa>oh heyo
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14:30<somiaj>I thought the issue was you couldn't shutdown with xrdp, or is this a different issue?
14:31<tepozoa>different issue
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14:56<r4fkramer>Please, after creating a mount point and umounting the device, without removing the pendrive from the laptop, I cannot access the device after mounting it again.
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14:57<r4fkramer>I also need to include a device line in /etc/fstab, but I don't remember the syntax to use: https://paste.debian.net/1208022/
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14:57<r4fkramer>I'm using debian bullseye stable now
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15:03<sney>r4fkramer: see line 1 of /etc/fstab, where it says "static file system information"? that means that this file is static, as in, it does not dynamically change when you mount/unmount a disk. there is no reason to check it every time.
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15:03<sney>you might be thinking of /etc/mtab.
15:04<sney>anyway: putting a line in fstab for a portable device is not a smart approach. if you aren't using a desktop that can handle automount, try pmount:
15:04<sney>,i pmount
15:04<judd>Package pmount (utils, optional) in bullseye/amd64: mount removable devices as normal user. Version: 0.9.23-6; Size: 84.2k; Installed: 502k; Homepage: https://alioth-archive.debian.org/release/pmount/pmount; O: #897304
15:05<r4fkramer>Thank you for answering, sney. So, no need to make any adjustment in /etc/fstab, but doing it in /etc/mtab.
15:05<sney>no.
15:06<sney>/etc/mtab adjusts itself when you mount something. if you want to check a file when you mount something, you 'cat /etc/mtab'.
15:06<sney>putting a line in fstab for a portable device is not a smart approach.
15:06<sney>if you aren't using a desktop that can handle automount, try pmount
15:06<r4fkramer>yes, that's what I did when checked /etc/fstab, using 'cat'
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15:07<tepozoa>write a small udev rule for your pen drive instead of using fstab
15:07<sney>udev might be too advanced for r4fkramer, but that is also an option.
15:07<r4fkramer>Yes, understood it's not a smart approach. So, the best way is installing 'pmount' package for this case....
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15:08<tepozoa>so let's back up a moment
15:09<tepozoa>you have a drive inserted, let's say /dev/sdb1 shows up
15:09<r4fkramer>Fine tepozoa, thanks for advice, I will learn about 'udev' - despite the fact it's 'too advanced' for me.
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15:09<tepozoa>you created /mnt/drive and did "mount /dev/sdb1 /mnt/drive" (sic) and it was OK
15:09<r4fkramer>Thank you for information and support provided, sney.
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15:09<tepozoa>you then did "umount /mnt/drive" (OK) but now cannot re-mount it?
15:09<somiaj>I might be a bit too manual, but I prefer manually mounting usb drivers over automounting/udevrules/etc
15:10<somiaj>and yes, you need to clarify what you mean by you cannot access it, and how did you mount it?
15:10<r4fkramer>yes, tepozoa, that's what has happened here.
15:11<somiaj>provide actual commands you used, and any messages you got, use a pastebing
15:11<tepozoa>your paste above shows you using "umount /dev/sdb1" not "/mnt/sdb1"
15:12<somiaj>oh missed the paste, sorry
15:12<tepozoa>somiaj: they did yeah
15:12<tepozoa>OK I see
15:12<tepozoa>/dev/sdb1 7.2G 4.0K 7.2G 1% /media/r4fkramer/085A-6616
15:12<tepozoa>that's "udisks2" infrastructure behind your back that auto-mounted sdb1 on you
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15:14<r4fkramer>somiaj, did you see my pastebing ?
15:14<tepozoa>r4fkramer: did you understand what I was saying about udisks2?
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15:15<tepozoa>problem: your manual mount actions are conflicting with an automatic tooling subsystem /also/ mounting it
15:15<r4fkramer>Trying to understand your explanation, tepozoa.
15:15<tepozoa>systemctl stop udisks2 to turn that off for instance
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15:16<tepozoa>big picture: "udisks2" is the name of the auto-mounting subsystem in modern Linux
15:16<r4fkramer>tepozoa, done here
15:17<somiaj>r4fkramer: you have an automount tool running in the background, so as tepozoa is pointing out, if you want to manually mount things, you need to disable that.
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15:17<r4fkramer>Oh, thank you for information. I'll have to read all these instructions again. Tons of concepts
15:17<tepozoa>when you typed "umount /dev/sdb1" it removed /mnt/sdb1 (OK), but they udisks kicked in and re-mounted it at /media/r4fkramer/085A-6616 (the UID of that drive) behind your back
15:17<somiaj>or you can just access the device where the automounter chooses to mount it
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15:18<tepozoa>the glory of letting udisks2 doing this for you, it uses your logged-in user's permissions!
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15:18<tepozoa>doing it manually you have to do all that as root
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15:19<tepozoa>arch has a nice basic page: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/udisks
15:19<r4fkramer>Fine, somiaj, thanks for information. That's why tepozoa said my manual mount actions are conflicting with an automatic tooling subsystem - in the case, 'udisks2'
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15:21<somiaj>most desktops will install an automount untility, many will jsut use that, though of cousre it is up to you, if you want to always manually mount you can either configure udisk2 to ignore the device, or disable it
15:21<somiaj>though as tepozoa pointed out there are some nice things about autmoutning beyond you don't have to manuallyh do it
15:21<r4fkramer>So, somiaj and tepozoa, in this case, I'll always have to stop 'udisks2' through 'systemct' command whenever I reboot the system ?
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15:22<mason>r4fkramer: You might just remove the package.
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15:22<r4fkramer>Please, mason, are you referring to removing 'udisks2' ?
15:22<mason>The very same.
15:22<r4fkramer>Is that a package ?
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15:23<mason>Yes.
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15:24<r4fkramer>Ok, mason. Thanks for information and Support. Great thank you very much for attention and Great Support, tepozoa and somiaj :)
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15:26<r4fkramer>Mental fatigue makes it very difficult for me to understand more clearly and more quickly all that You inform me. But, I will calmly read all the explanations, and practice more assembling devices to consolidate this understanding.
15:26<r4fkramer>Thank you very much ! :)
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15:27<mason>r4fkramer: If you dive into plain old udev you'll probably be happy.
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15:28<r4fkramer>fine mason. It's based on more manual action for mounting and umonting devices, right ?
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15:29<r4fkramer>I prefer more manual actions, it permits you learning more rather than using automating tools for these procedures in debian
15:30<r4fkramer>So, I'll have to learn more deeply about it. Thank you mason for this other information :)
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15:34<rafaelamorim>Hello, I've just installed debian on my office computer. I don't want to install any DE, only qtile. I've managed to do that in a VM, however when I installed on my bare metal (as a web server, minimal install), I can't get my WiFi to work, it doesn't even list my network card as a wireless card. However I managed to connect fine to my router when installing, so I can't figure out why this is
15:34<rafaelamorim>happening. Tried to use iwconfig and all other solutions I found on the internet, however I think the problem really is that it doesn't detect my network wireless as "wireless". Did someone get this error or know how to fix it?
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15:34<mason>r4fkramer: Firmware maybe.
15:34<mason>rafaelamorim: ^
15:35<sney>rafaelamorim: do you know the vendor or driver of your wifi card?
15:35<mason>rafaelamorim: For instance, on my laptop here, wifi won't work without firmware-iwlwifi - Intel.
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15:36<unxguy>Probably need to get the deb package of the wireless card and install manually using dpkg or use a wired connection temp.
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15:37<sney>it is strange for it to work in the installer but not after rebooting though. you may also want to check rfkill, along with any hardware/efi switches
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15:37<rafaelamorim>This laptop doesn't have a wired port unfortunatelly. The installer has asked me for the rtw8822c_fw.bin (think that's right). The network card is a realtek I think
15:37<mason>Might have been a 'firmware' image.
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15:38<r4fkramer>mason, thank you for information.
15:38<mason>rafaelamorim: If you can get (or have) a 'live' firmware image you can fire up wifi from there and get the needed package(s).
15:38<unxguy>I have had the same issue though, wifi worked in installer not once booted in. Just installed the firmware deb and it was fine
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15:39<rafaelamorim>but how can I install the firmware with only the command line? (web server) using dpkg?
15:39<sney>rafaelamorim: that is probably packaged in firmware-realtek, which you can get from packages.debian.org as unxguy suggests
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15:40<mason>rafaelamorim: You need to either get the package on media you can read on the system without a network, or you boot with rescue media that has the relevant firmware and install from a chroot. Neither is a super-easy novice task, but you'll learn useful things doing either.
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15:42<unxguy>So you will download the firmware-Realtek deb and transfer say to a usb stick to the Debian box. Then mount and sudo dpkg -I firmware-Realtek.deb whatever it's actual name is
15:43<jhutchins>rafaelamorim: There are several very powerful tools for managing packages on the console. Synaptic is basically just a cartoon page wrapper for them.
15:43<rafaelamorim>Ok, that's a very helpful information, I've already got the file, however, What's the command line to mount the USB stick?
15:43<unxguy>Not suppose to be -I should be -i sorry on an iPad
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15:44<jhutchins>rafaelamorim: as root, run apt "update", then "apt install firmwre-nonfree/msg dpkg v firmeare-nonfree
15:44<jhutchins>Oops.
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15:45<mason>jhutchins: He has no network to do that, but he had network during install, so a rescue environment seems useful.
15:45<unxguy>Usually sudo mount /dev/sdx foldertomountto sdx should be the name that Debian gave your usb stick
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15:46<r4fkramer>mason, as far as I understand, if I remove the 'udisks2' package the system as a whole, and even the matte environment, will be severely impacted. It will be better to disable it, rather than remove it completely.
15:47<r4fkramer>https://paste.debian.net/1208024/
15:47<jhutchins>mason: Ah, thanks. Download-then-install.
15:47<mason>r4fkramer: Yeah, if you're using something that depends on it, you'll have to be trickier about nuking it. That said, since it's a set of udev rules, it's not a service you can disable per se.
15:48<mason>r4fkramer: You might make friends with dpkg-divert(1) if there's not a more elegant solution.
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15:50<r4fkramer>mason, 'making friends' with dpkg-divert ?
15:50<mason>r4fkramer: Read the man page, look at usage examples, ponder its use when looking at dpkg -L udisks2, etc.
15:51<r4fkramer>Ok, thank you very much again, mason
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15:51<mason>r4fkramer: I have to think there's a better solution, but it's one random way that comes to mind to get rid of udisks2 functionality without removing the package and without updates to the package undoing your work.
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15:54<r4fkramer>I see, maons. I'm doing some research around here too. I saw these passages that might be helpful: https://askubuntu.com/questions/1234253/can-i-disable-udisk2-service-to-reduce-boot-time-on-my-ubuntu-20-04
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16:09<Sqrt{not}>r4fkramer, why do you want to get rid of the udisks automounter again? it is much easier just to use that, than manually to do everything.
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16:19<r4fkramer>Sqrt{not} In fact, from a practical point of view, a series of automated actions is more useful, rather than executing them manually.
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16:19<r4fkramer>In my case, this concern with learning to perform actions manually has to do with the need to learn more - a way of trying to fill the knowledge gap, since I've been using Debian for some time, and should already know how to deal with these actions.
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16:20<multigestern>Hello, does anyone also having trouble with bullseye and ansible asking for python3-apt?
16:20<sney>!anyone
16:20<dpkg>Please do not ask if anyone can help you, knows 'something' or uses 'some_program'. Instead, ask your real question. (If the real question _was_ "does anyone use 'some_program'?" ask me about <popcon> instead.) See <ask> <ask to ask> <polls> <search> <sicco> <smart questions>.
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16:21<multigestern>Hello, did anyone resolve the problem with bullseye and ansible asking for python3-apt?
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16:22<sney>multigestern: seriously, describe the issue and maybe someone familiar with the python3 situation in bullseye will be able to help you
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16:23<r4fkramer>Sqrt{not} Interestingly, some totally manual actions I did successfully in Slackware years ago (wpa_supplicant device), having to edit its parameters in its config file.
16:23<r4fkramer>Today, I wouldn't know how to do this anymore.
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16:24<LostNetwork>How do I enable two network interfaces in debian? When I click the slider for one it disconnects the other.
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16:25*tarzeau can't see a slider in his /etc/network/interfaces
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16:29<mason>LostNetwork: That can entail some funny side effects. If you state what software you're using and why you want to connect to more than one network at once, folks might be able to help.
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16:30<LostNetwork>mason: Not relevant I just want to know how do I get debian from disabling one network when I enable the other
16:30<mason>LostNetwork: "Not relevant" is funny. Tell us more.
16:30<vv221>Debian does not. You network managing software does.
16:31<LostNetwork>Can you help or are you just being a pain in the ass.
16:31<mason>LostNetwork: I mean, I could tell you how I'd do it, but you might not be super thrilled with it.
16:31<mason>LostNetwork: Sure. Sure. Install ifupdown, and do a manual config of one of your networks as primary, and one explicitly set up with limited routes for the relevant address space.
16:32<mason>LostNetwork: If instead you want to bridge, install bridge-utils and configure *that* in /etc/network/interfaces. There are docs in /usr/share/doc.
16:32<vv221>(I would suggest /etc/network/interfaces.d/*.conf, with a .conf file for each bridge)
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16:33<mason>LostNetwork: If the address space on each network overlaps, you'll need to decide how much of the one to chop out for the other, and manually add routes such that as much as possible of each is reachable.
16:33<LostNetwork>Wow there really is no way with the setting GUI to have it not automaticlly disable the second interface, what POS
16:34<mason>LostNetwork: Example, you live on 10.0.5.x on one network, and the other is a /8, so you chop out your specific class C and let the larger network route all your other packets.
16:34<mason>LostNetwork: You didn't say what GUI you're using, so I answered how I'd do it with the default software.
16:34<jkc>LostNetwork: Lots of people in here can help, but your attitude isn't going to motivate them to help you.
16:35<mason>jkc: That's not fair. He motivated me to provide a fairly complete example, including a couple different use cases to accomodate the mysterious, must-be-guessed specifics.
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16:36<vv221>I’m happy to know I now have that in my IRC history, because this is actually quite close to my own setup ;)
16:36<vriaeros>hello
16:36<LostNetwork>Sorry your GUI doesn't have a name. In the default OS configuration it is just settings and network.
16:36<vriaeros>I have a problem with my sound output it shows dummy device
16:36<mason>vv221: I can provide more random detail if you ever need it. I've had to do some unfortunate/funny things with my networking from time to time.
16:36<imMute>mason: classes havn't been a thing for decades.
16:37<imMute>and having overlapping subnets is Very Bad.
16:37<mason>imMute: There's generally no ambiguity at all. Routes are selected first-come first-serve.
16:38<mason>It's far from ideal, but the real world intervenes sometimes.
16:38<imMute>mason: there's definitely ambiguity.
16:38<mason>imMute: Where? Give me an example.
16:38<imMute>mason: to use your example, if I want to talk to 10.0.5.42, amd I talking to the one of the /24 or the one on the /8 ?
16:38<mason>imMute: You're talking to the one on the /24 because most specific route wins.
16:38<imMute>right. so how do I talk to the one on the /8?
16:39<mason>You don't. Hence my saying it's not ideal.
16:39<imMute>and that's what I mean by Very Bad.
16:39<mason>We agree, then.
16:39<vriaeros>any help?
16:39<mason>vriaeros: Add your user to the 'audio' group maybe?
16:39<mason>and log out/in?
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16:42<mason>imMute: Correction/addendum. If you REALLY want to talk to a host in the /8 you can add a device-specific /32 for that host.
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17:04<alyssa>> On Debian 11 and newer, you're required to use the free and open-source Panfrost/Lima drivers included in Mesa instead of the proprietary drivers documented in this article.
17:04<alyssa>This sentence amuses me greatly :-)
17:04<sney>haha, nice
17:05<alyssa>From https://wiki.debian.org/MaliGraphics
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17:05<alyssa>Admittedly I'm not sure how I feel about shipping Mesa 20.3 in stable for Bifrost support but I'm just glad we're shipping at all :-)
17:07<alyssa>Both of the hacks documented here were inadvisible, but not needed on newer Mesa releases from 2021 ... I guess we'll see Mesa 21.2 in Bookworm soon https://wiki.debian.org/PanfrostLima#Configuration
17:07<sney>we've had mesa backports in the past too, so if that becomes necessary, it could happen again
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17:10<alyssa>It should be ok.. Bifrost support debuted in 20.3, but with the caveat of only supporting OpenGL ES 2.0.
17:11<alyssa>I don't remember what stability was like. I guess we'll find out if debbugs fills up 😇
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17:11<alyssa>Midgard (older) was already shipping OpenGL ES 3.0 in 20.3 and should be fine.
17:12<alyssa>(Bifrost was bumped to ES3.0 in 21.0, and both were bumped to ES3.1 in 21.2.)
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17:50<rtmq>Hello. Is anyone using Debian-11, Bullseye?
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17:50<jkc_>rtmq: I'd imagine many are. Best to just ask your question.
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17:51<rtmq>I cannot login using flashback/metacity. There is no option to do so at the login screen.
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17:56<sney>rtmq: gdm3 hides the session type menu, it's in the gear icon next to the password field
17:58<rtmq>Thanks sney. That is for Debian-10 Buster. But for Debian-11, the gear is gone.
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17:58-!-indy is "Got ZNC?" on #debian #kernelnewbies #postmarketos #panfrost #s6 #bpftrace #alpine-linux #automotive #alpine-devel #postmarketos-lowlevel #postmarketos-porting #postmarketos-devel #urwid #openocd #ohm #oftc #nouveau
17:59<rtmq>I checked to install flashback, and to be sure, I tried to download it later. The system reported it was up to date.
17:59<sney>huh, did they move it into a corner like the other display managers?
17:59*sney uses sddm
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18:04<rtmq>The tool was way off in the bottom right corner. Thanks sney.
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18:05*alyssa just updated said wiki page
18:06<sney>nice, consistency.
18:06<jhutchins>alyssa: ++
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18:08<alyssa>jhutchins: I'm not sure what that means.
18:09<himesama>idk if this is a useful comment to anybody but i tried every dm a few y ago and found all of them to be inaccessible for my case (idr details but likely font sizes, colors, etc.). so i use getty, i.e. no dm is possible. (and fluxbox.) getty is solid. (although console is stillwhite on black.)
18:09<jhutchins>alyssa: It means you did the right thing and paid it foward by updating the wiki page.
18:09<alyssa>jhutchins: Oh :)
18:09<alyssa>jhutchins: I was worried I'd be outed as a dirty upstream developer 😋
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18:11<alyssa>(Despite developing the upstream software, I run debian's 20.3 mesa from bullseye on my personal laptop. But if 'adventurous' users insist on moar features, I'd much rather they get a newer upstream version than enable dangerous debug flags on an old version.)
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19:10<llocani>hola
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19:12<alyssa>saludos
19:13<alyssa>llocani: El canál #debian-es es hispanohablante.
19:13<llocani>Estoy luchando con mi notebook con xfce debian buster para que reconozca que tengo conectado un monitor externo.
19:13<llocani>Ah, ok, muchas gracias
19:13<sney>(o use ingles aqui)
19:13<alyssa>de nada
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19:15<llocani>Hello. I'm looking for some help. I'm using xfce debian buster in my notebook and i can't get the external monitor working
19:15<llocani>Can somebody help me?
19:16<sney>what happens when you try?
19:18<llocani>When i start session with the external monitor connected the resolution of my monitor in the notebook is 720x640, when y start the session without the monitor connected the resolution is 1368x768 (as allways)
19:18<llocani>In both ways the external monitor display as if its not connected
19:18<llocani>Looking for signal
19:18<llocani>this el xandr when i start with the monitor connected
19:18<llocani>xrandr: Failed to get size of gamma for output default
19:18<llocani>Screen 0: minimum 640 x 480, current 1368 x 768, maximum 1368 x 768
19:18<llocani>default connected 1368x768+0+0 0mm x 0mm
19:18<llocani> 1366x768 0.00
19:18<llocani> 1024x768 0.00
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19:19<sney>that +q function is hostile, can we get debchange to not do it
19:20<somiaj>Yea, I was surprised by it too, I know it is a short timer, but debchange and debhelper don't need to be both triggering on floods
19:21<ydbi>is /usr/bin/host still deprecated?
19:21<ydbi>in buster, the package description said it was deprecated, but in bullseye the bind9-host package is priority:standard
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19:21<sney>ydbi: first I've heard of it being deprecated.
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19:22<llocani>sorry
19:22<sney>llocani: if you want to paste >2 lines, use a site like https://paste.debian.net/
19:22<llocani>ok, i will
19:24<llocani>well here is my xandr output when y connect the monitor before start a session
19:24<llocani>https://paste.debian.net/1208045/
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19:24<llocani>In both ways i get only one output, but sumething is recognized because the resolution changes
19:24<ydbi>sney: https://packages.debian.org/buster/bind9-host says DNS lookup utility (deprecated)
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19:25<sney>llocani: interesting that xrandr doesn't show 2 outputs. what kind of laptop is this, and what is the video adapter?
19:27<ydbi>,i --release buster bind9-host
19:27<judd>No package named '--release' was found in buster/amd64.
19:27<ydbi>,i bind9-host --release buster
19:27<llocani>this is a sony vaio e series
19:27<judd>Package bind9-host (net, standard) in buster/amd64: DNS lookup utility (deprecated). Version: 1:9.11.5.P4+dfsg-5.1+deb10u5; Size: 264.9k; Installed: 359k; Homepage: https://www.isc.org/downloads/bind/
19:28<llocani>I think this line says the video adapter
19:28<llocani>01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Park [Mobility Radeon HD 5430/5450/5470]
19:28<llocani>@sney
19:28<sney>ydbi: well, the (deprecated) note has been removed in 9.16.15-1 package, so I guess along with the newer upstream version it's no longer considered deprecated
19:29<sney>llocani: great, do you have the 'firmware-amd-graphics' package installed?
19:30<llocani>sney: no, i'm installing it now
19:30<llocani>sney: done
19:30<sney>llocani: ok, reboot and see if it works now
19:30<llocani>Ok, thank you in advance
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19:36<llocani>sney: it worked like a charm. Thankyou very much
19:37<sney>llocani: np, enjoy
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19:39<TobiX>sney: bind9-host is strange. It seems the (deprecated) note was only ever added to the debian/buster branch in git, it's totally missing on other branches...
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19:40<sney>going off the changelog, it looks like it had quite the crew of maintainers in 2019, possibly some wires got crossed
19:40<TobiX>sney: Here is the commit: https://salsa.debian.org/dns-team/bind9/-/commit/336ed6adb20e1c9fd6f082a428361fd736171a52
19:40<sney>ok, so #729561 ?
19:40<judd>Bug https://bugs.debian.org/729561 in bind9-host (closed, patch): «bind9-host: unhelpful package description»; severity: minor; opened: 2013-11-14; last modified: 2018-06-21.
19:41<sney>hm, not particularly enlightening
19:42<TobiX>Yeah...
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20:58<lechner>Hi, anyone have issues with cutting & pasting from Firefox ESR lately?
20:58<somiaj>are you just selecting text, or hitting ctrl-C afterwards?
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21:01<jmcnaught>lechner: are you using Wayland?
21:06<lechner>jmcnaught: yes, under sway
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21:07<jmcnaught>lechner: you probably just need to restart firefox to get it copying to the clipboard again, I think it is this bug: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1631061
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22:06<lechner>jmcnaught: yes, thank you! that worked.
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22:10<tomreyn>is anyone around who can tell packages.d.o that stable=bullseye?
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22:20<somiaj>tomreyn: Not that I know of here, and I suspect this is a known issue so I would just wait
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22:25<somiaj>yea, it is known, here is the bug report, https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=992258
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22:30<sney>there's a merge pending, I guess they are just making sure there are no mistakes before publishing it https://salsa.debian.org/webmaster-team/packages/-/merge_requests/21/diffs
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22:53<jmiller>hi all
22:53<sney>hi
22:53<jmiller>:)
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---Logclosed Wed Aug 18 00:00:13 2021