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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-08-21

---Logopened Sat Aug 21 00:00:03 2021
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00:17<crawler>Hello, I have a server running buster. Its SSH configured to use key-pairs only. It's getting incoming connections from clients that initiates the connection but don't proceed with the exchange. Is it possible to specify a timeout for the key exchange phase?
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00:24<tuxd3v>imMute,gravity: According with 'man systemd.unit', units are installed in '/lib/systemd/system' or in '/usr/local/lib/systemd/system'
00:28<tuxd3v>but for what I see they are in /usr/lib/systemd/system/ directory :)
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00:29<tuxd3v>the Wantedby= defines the place were the symlink will end
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00:34<RedEagle>after bullseye upgrade stardict not pronouncing word which was working fine in buster .. how to fix this ?
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00:38<jochum>Its bad I never used stardict, seems to be nice when offline.
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02:31<hohl>Does anybody here maybe has an idea for this issue/question?
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02:39<crawler>hohl I had similar issue about interface naming long ago, and I fixed it by disabling interface renaming.
02:40<crawler>Can you confirm that your interface has been renamed? execute this command and use pastebin to show the output
02:40<crawler>sudo dmesg | grep -i eth
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02:46<Marto_>hey guys, recently upgraded to deb11, but without VB cant find a way to start Whonix vm, any ideas?
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03:41<at0m>crawler: iiuc, that's what LoginGraceTime is for, in sshd_config. using only keys, too, i often set it down to couple seconds not minutes
03:43<crawler>thanks at0m
03:44<crawler>however I don't see any sign of closing the connection in auth.log after setting grace period to few seconds
03:45<at0m>and you restarted the sshd?
03:45<crawler>for sure yes
03:45<crawler>and LoginGraceTime is in effect
03:46<at0m>ok. i'll leave it to someone more inspired then. do all clients have this? ie., using different algorithms ?
03:48<crawler>I tried putty for windows, the client quits, but I cannot see that in auth.log
03:48<Tj>crawler: have you also considered MaxStartups ?
03:49<at0m>Tj: maybe they're auto-banned?
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03:49<crawler>I will look it up in the man pages, thanks Tj
03:49<Tj>crawler: is the server actually receiving the connections? have you used tcpdump to confirm?
03:49<at0m>or, throttled
03:49<at0m>and that only happens on key-based? can you allow pw based just to test?
03:49<crawler>auth.log shows the connection init, but doesn't show the termination
03:50<crawler>Unfortunately I can't do that right now
03:50<Tj>crawler: that's good then, at least it is getting through. so now you need to enable verbose logs
03:50<crawler>loglevel is set to debug3 already
03:50<Tj>crawler: if you have confirmation from the log you can ignore tcpdump for now at least - it is possible there's a TCP layer issue though so keep it in mind
03:51<crawler>what bothers me the most is that behavior is exclusively for China IPs
03:51<Tj>crawler: have you checked for other log messages from other services, not just sshd. I'd look at the overall logs for the connection period. E.g. "journalctl -b --since="5 minutes ago" for a recent attempt
03:51<crawler>and whenever I ban one, I get another 10 IPs doing the same thing lol
03:52<Tj>crawler: ahhhh the detail matters!
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03:52<Tj>crawler: so this is not a failure of your clients to complete, but of random external probing you do not authorise?
03:53<crawler>yes, I am trying to ban intruders
03:53<crawler>my ssh clients are doing just fine
03:54<at0m>you can look into fail2ban, and buster had sshguard, when this issue is solved
03:55<at0m>fail2ban sends firewall rules that start to dump repeat fail IP's
03:55<Tj>OK, that makes it easier. Best recommendation is only allow SSH inside a VPN, not on the public interface. So all your clients need to bring up a tunnel of some sort and you do not expose TCP port 22 on the public Internet. If that is not practicable then next best thing is to use a port-knocker so the authorised clients 'knock' in a pre-defined sequence of ports and then the firewall
03:55<Tj>lets them in. Best one is fwknop
03:55<Tj>I prefer to not allow connections in the first place rather than try to reactively block them
03:56<Tj>that's like playing whack-a-mole
03:56<at0m>or, move to some random high port, that keeps most those probing scripts out the logs
03:56<crawler>at0m my main goal is to add a custom regex filter in fail2ban sshd jail to ban those IPs
03:57<at0m>(the moving to high port is only obscuring the sshd, doesn't actually do anything for security)
03:57<Tj>crawler: with that approach you run the risk of the kernel's half-open connections pool being exhausted; leading to a denial of service for legit connections
03:57<Tj>crawler: think about it: do you lock your house door or wait until people walk in and try to eject them? Much easier to just lock the door :)
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03:59<crawler><Tj> crawler: with that approach you run the risk of the kernel's half-open connections pool being exhausted; <<--- excuse me, which approach are you referring to?
04:00<crawler>I like the idea of fwknop, I will read about that. Thank you so much. I am just curious about the scenario you mentioned just now
04:02<Tj>crawler: there's a DoS attack that leverage's the TCP connection process, whereby the 'client' stops talking halfway through the connection setup, after the kernel has allocated resources but before the connection is complete. Doesn't affect UDP. This is why a UDP based VPN tunnel (e.g. wireguard, openvpn) is more resiliant in terms of avoiding the entire class if TCP issues
04:03<crawler>Nice, thank you for the info. I will go deep about that
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04:05<crawler>at0m thank you for your tips. But I would like to inform you, that from my experience with fail2ban it is not that much of a safe house as I thought. A lot of stuff has to be provisioned/supervised after installed fail2ban
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05:07<ottavio>My eyesight, just like everything at my age, is deteriorating fast. Is there a program that can read a pdf/ebook and convert it into some sort of humanoid voice?
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05:13<at0m>ottavio: not familiar with any of them, but i'd search in "accessibility tools", and apt search "screen reader" returns for example "qt-at-spi"
05:13<at0m>,i qt-at-spi
05:13<judd>No package named 'qt-at-spi' was found in bullseye/amd64.
05:13<at0m>,v qt-at-spi
05:13<judd>Package: qt-at-spi on amd64 -- stretch: 0.4.0-5; buster: 0.4.0-9
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05:15<matthias>,v kmouth
05:15<judd>Package: kmouth on amd64 -- stretch: 4:16.08.0-1+b1; buster: 4:18.04.0-1; bookworm: 4:20.12.0-1; bullseye: 4:20.12.0-1; sid: 4:21.08.0-1
05:15<matthias>,v orca
05:15<judd>Package: orca on amd64 -- stretch-backports: 3.30.1-1~bpo9+1; buster: 3.30.1-1; stretch-backports-sloppy: 3.36.3-1~bpo9+1; buster-backports: 3.38.2-1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 3.38.2-1; bookworm: 40.0-2; sid: 40.0-2; experimental: 41~alpha-1
05:17<matthias>ottavio: The KDE pdf reader (okular) for example seems to have built-in speech support via speechd.
05:17<matthias>I am sure that gnome has similar support.
05:17<ottavio>matthias: tx
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05:56<Blendie>fuckers the hackers
05:58<xormor>he is from South India: Karnataka, Mangalore
05:58<xormor>he wants to hack Windows computers, and is pissed off that we use Debian.
05:58<xormor>$ whois
05:58<xormor>I will nmap him now.
05:59<xormor>Scanning ( [1000 ports]
06:00<xormor>sudo nmap -Pn -A -O -v -4
06:01<xormor>he does not seem to have the http port (80) open because I cannot browse a http server on his IPv4 host address.
06:03<xormor>Blendie: I am not too keen on his "God gabalaba" fuckery
06:03<Blendie>he left
06:03<xormor>a mere "hey fuckers" would have been enough, but now that he is spewing garbage about "god" he will get my nmap scan
06:04<xormor>yes, I am scanning whether he is still online with nmap. maybe I should use ping as well.
06:05<xormor>6 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 5117ms
06:05<Blendie>bad luck
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06:06<xormor>Blendie: is he on drugs or something? why does he want hackers after his IP address?
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06:07<Blendie>maybe he is on drugs
06:07<Blendie>no one knows
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06:55<Dresden>Wrong chat
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07:07<ZenWalker>why isn't yet bookworm at
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07:18<vv221>ZenWalker, it’s a known bug of, but I do not remember the bug report URL.
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07:27<d3vlabs>so i installed debian for the first time. Its seated in in its own paritition next to my windows 10. however during installation i got a warning about installing GRUB same partition as debian
07:27<d3vlabs>now i have no grub
07:27<d3vlabs>system just boots into windows 10
07:27<d3vlabs>no boot selection
07:27<d3vlabs>what can I do?
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07:39<amacater>d3vlabs - check to see how you are booting the OS. Is the OS booting from Legacy/MBR or UEFI? Also, Windows was there first, then Debian?
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07:41<d3vlabs>yes windows 10 first, then i installed debian on same hard drive, diff paritition
07:42<RedEagle>one package i am missing badly but available in almost every distro is zathura-mupdf
07:43<judd>Bug in wnpp (open): «RFP: zathura-mupdf -- mupdf backend for zathura»; severity: wishlist; opened: 2013-12-05; last modified: 2017-07-15.
07:43<amacater>The reason I asked - if Windows thinks it's the only OS, then the boot files are in one place. When you installed, can you remember which Grub loader it installed?
07:44<abrotman>Looks like the package has been stuck for several years .. so, if you're bored ..
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07:44<amacater>It is possible that you could use Debian boot media to reinstall grub in rescue mode
07:44<amacater>I'll leave other people to talk you through that.
07:45<d3vlabs>ok il try that. when i install grub do i install it into paritition with debian or win10?
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09:40<EmleyMoor>Been seeing this error when handling packages since bullseye: Error in file "/usr/share/applications/krita_jpeg.desktop": "jpeg/jfif" is an invalid MIME type ("jpeg" is an unregistered media type) - any action to take?
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09:41<tepozoa>what does the mimetype in that file look like? Normally they are "foo/bar" in format (like "image/jpeg") not just "jpeg"
09:42<tepozoa>I think it's trying to say there's a malformed mimetype in that desktop file
09:43<tepozoa>^ +1
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09:45<mentor>EmleyMoor: /usr/share/applications/krita_jpeg.desktop
09:45<judd>Bug in krita (open): «krita: inavlid mime type in desktop file»; severity: normal; opened: 2021-06-22; last modified: 2021-07-15.
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09:46<EmleyMoor>Fix pending? OK
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09:47<tepozoa>there's no harm in hand-editing it now on your system if you want to make the messages go away
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09:51<EmleyMoor>Is there a good way to trace the processing of the sudoers file? (the only other post upgrade problem I'm seeing)
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09:52<sherab>trying to upgrade gnome to 3.40 the terminal returns the following packages have unmet dependncies - is there a quick way to resolve all these umet dependencies?
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09:53<EmleyMoor>Are my group memberships processed in a particular order when using sudo?
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09:54<bremner>sherab: are you running stable? because I doubt it is supported to run gnome from experimental with stable
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09:54<sherab>bremner: yes I run stable.
09:54<sherab>ok so I need to move to testing??
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09:55<bremner>testing is not for everyone
09:55<bremner>but you can get advice about that in #debian-next
09:55<sherab>bremner: I
09:55<sherab>know, I was on bullseyes testing for a good while
09:56<bremner>well, if you want to run packages from experimental, #debian-next is the place to discuss
09:56<amacater>Also - testing right now today is probably still settling - everyone's changes backed up for the last couple of months have landed at once ...
09:56<mentor>EmleyMoor: man sudoers, see SUDOERS FILE FORMAT section
09:56<EmleyMoor>I have a vm that tracks testing but run stable on real hardware
09:57<EmleyMoor>mentor: This is not a "format" issue, it's an "order of processing" issue which is not explained in the manual
09:57<mentor>EmleyMoor: Yes, I understood
09:57<mentor>EmleyMoor: That is not my reading of the text
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10:00<EmleyMoor>My membership of "staff" seems to be taking priority over my membership of "kvm"
10:00<mentor>EmleyMoor: I believe this is explained where I said.
10:00<EmleyMoor>I need a pointer to where within
10:01<mentor>EmleyMoor: It is explained before the first subection of the place I stated.
10:01<mentor>EmleyMoor: There are 5 sentences total to look at.
10:02<Tenkawa>EmleyMoor: its in the Sudoers File Format paragrph
10:02<Tenkawa>er paragraph
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10:03<EmleyMoor>Uses last match? I got precisely the opposite performance at one point yesterday then it seemed to revert back. I will sort it as the text now implies
10:03<mentor>EmleyMoor: I know only as much as the documentation does.
10:04<Tenkawa>I think its a very badly written mechanism
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10:04<Akram>Hi all, I am trying to install buster on a raspberry pi using: . config.txt and all files seems to have an unknown encoding. Can someone help ?
10:04<Tenkawa>leaves a lot of room for collision
10:05<mentor>I do have a pet hatred of things like this where they are not written in a normal form, and the actual outcome depends on the vagaries of what's the easiest thing to implement
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10:05<Tenkawa>mentor: yeah not thought out… just thrown in
10:05<EmleyMoor>I think it should work now - while I work out an even neater way to do it
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10:07<mentor>Akram: What is saying that the encoding is invalid?
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10:07<Akram>mentor: opening with vim, the file is not human readable, looks binary, and opening it with vscode it says invalid encoding.
10:08<mentor>Akram: Is it getting uncompressed properly?
10:08<Tenkawa>Akram: thats because its a xz compressed disc image
10:09<Tenkawa>if you havent unxz the file and mounted it
10:09<Akram>mentor: I was thinking so also, I used xz -d "the-file.img.xz" , no warnings no errors
10:09<Tenkawa>did you losetup it?
10:09<Tenkawa>its a multipartition image
10:09<Akram>Tenkawa: I tried with balenda etcher which seems to uncompress it for me, and tried with xz command line
10:10<Akram>Tenkawa: what it is losetup?
10:10<Tenkawa>loopback setup
10:10<Tenkawa>ie if you run a sudo fdisk -l thefile
10:10<mentor>Akram: xz should produce a file with the .xz suffix removed
10:10<Tenkawa>you will see multiple partitions right?
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10:11<Tenkawa>a msdos one and a ext4 one
10:11<Akram>there are 2 partitions ; yes, one of 310MB the other 1.26GB
10:11<Tenkawa>those have to be loop mounted
10:11<Tenkawa>or written to media
10:12<Akram>Tenkawa: the files I am mentionning are already on the media now, SD Card
10:13<Tenkawa>did you write it to etcher "after" you unxz the img though?
10:13<Tenkawa>to the block device?
10:13<Akram>they seem to be not text anymore after being written to the media. I didn't try to mount the image to check if it is also the case before writing them.
10:14<Akram>Tenkawa: etcher seems to accept .xz files in its UI filter; so I gave it as is
10:14<Akram>but, then, I saw the files, and I rewrote using Raspberry Pi imager and by unxz the file first
10:14<Tenkawa>I have had issues with etcher and compressed files being a bit flaky
10:15<Akram>I ended up with the same results
10:15<Akram>etcher + compressed == uncompressed + raspberry pi imager
10:15<Tenkawa>I have my own suite of tools though
10:16<Akram>should I try loopback mounting the image and check?
10:16<Akram>I didn't mention that I am using a mac now, and it is the only laptop I have right now being on vacation and using 4G plan (so downloads are limited as well :( )
10:16<EmleyMoor>The way I've got it now, I should be able to use the default sudoers file :-)
10:17<Tenkawa>you can but you will need to use losetup -rP -r for readonly and -P for partitioned
10:17<Tenkawa>Akram: hmm let me see if losetup is on here (I'm on big sur too)
10:18<Tenkawa>nope no losetup
10:18<Akram>wadez-wood:Downloads Akram$ hdiutil attach -nomount 20210717_raspi_3_buster.img
10:18<Akram>/dev/disk3 FDisk_partition_scheme
10:18<Akram>/dev/disk3s1 Windows_FAT_32
10:18*Tenkawa checks homebrew
10:18<Akram>/dev/disk3s2 Linux
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10:18<Tenkawa>haahaa hdiutil… good call
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10:18<Akram>sorry for the flood
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10:21<Akram>mentor: ok, so I loopback mounted the msdos partition, and the files are correct there
10:22<mentor>I think Tenkawa has this one
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10:23<Tenkawa>yeah if that one mounts you should be able to edit the txt files and be ready to go
10:23<Akram>Tenkawa: so, now I retrying with etcher, maybe I had done something wrong with the other tool as well
10:23<Tenkawa>of course in os x you wont be able to mount/edit the ext4 one
10:24<Akram>Tenkawa: yep sure, but, I was interrested in the dos one only to setup the right boot parameter to boot with ssh and wifi and all possible things
10:24<Tenkawa>at the most.. it will be a fuse mount add on read only
10:24<Tenkawa>the ssh file and the wpa_supplicant.conf and you should be ready to go
10:25<Akram>ETA 1m10s, we will see soon
10:25*Tenkawa has 8 pi 4's running right now lol
10:26<EmleyMoor>I want to get my ThinkPad working again, but seem to have BIOS related trouble with it at present
10:27<Akram>Tenkawa: you are lucky :-D , I am in a hard constraints mode now, in a country where online shopping only starts and with shortage on many electronic parts
10:27<Akram>Tenkawa: even if you would donate me one of them :-D , sending by post is a headache, and I may be taxed for more than the value
10:27<Tenkawa>same… I was lucky enough I am in the headquarters of a big computer/electronics parts store so I got on board quick
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10:28<Tenkawa>(and its what I did for a living my entire career)
10:28<Akram>Tenkawa: awesome, it is working great now; that was the trick....xz -d
10:28<Akram>+ balena etcher
10:28<Tenkawa>cool :)
10:29<Tenkawa>have fun and enjoy
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10:30<Akram>thanks, enjoy the week-end; next steps, configure rpi and then install homeassistant and happy hacking then
10:30<Akram>oh and also enable USB boot ; I bought a small SSD before coming here
10:30<Akram>that would make the rpi more reliable and durable
10:31<Tenkawa>all I do is run mine on usb
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10:36<Akram>Tenkawa: I will log off to switch to the unconnected wifi, thanks again for your help, and maybe see you later for other questions
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10:36<Tenkawa>np good luck
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10:38<tepozoa>I use a craigslist <$100 laptop, comes with all the things <$5 in electricity/mo (more like $2)
10:39<tepozoa>does a great job at collecting dust, too
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10:45<flowriser>tepozoa, we can see that :D
10:47<tepozoa>I'm hoping it'll become rare dust and I can get rich on eBay
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10:47<EmleyMoor>Damn - can't createthe diagnostic stick, the creator says "No USB devices found"
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10:49<Tenkawa>EmleyMoor: what os>
10:49<Tenkawa>er ?
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10:49<Tenkawa>you may need to create the partition first
10:49<Tenkawa>I've had to do that for some of those utilities
10:49<EmleyMoor>The creator is for"Linux". The device *is* partitioned.
10:50<tepozoa>have you tried a different USB port? my work laptop has one under-powered port that can't handle USB thumb drives
10:50<Tenkawa>it can't seem to understand blank/raw/non-dos formatted usb drives
10:50<EmleyMoor>tepozoa: I have some that cant', and it's in one that can
10:50<tepozoa>what process are you following, wiki or...?
10:51<EmleyMoor>... - to be precise, this:
10:52<tepozoa>oh man, that looks like a sketchy setup procedure, why can't they just supply an ISO file
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10:53<tepozoa>what's the link to the download, lemme have a look at it
10:53<Tenkawa>yeah.. and its quite aged
10:53<EmleyMoor>They might - looking at other options now
10:53<Tenkawa>5 years old already
10:53<EmleyMoor>It's a quite aged machine
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10:54<EmleyMoor>I will try the .iso
10:54<Tenkawa>yeah but those diagnostics usually continue to get updated
10:54<Tenkawa>(at least from LG and HP)
10:54<Tenkawa>I can't speak for IBM/Lenovo
10:55<tepozoa>yeah it says "Bootable CD" next to the ISO
10:55<EmleyMoor>I just want to see if this picks up on a fault
10:55<tepozoa>you can generally turn any ISO into a USB boot friendly one, if it's not already in that format internally
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10:56<tepozoa>*CD bootable ISO I meant
10:58<EmleyMoor>Writing it to my stick now. This laptop is one of only two machines I deal with that has/had buster when last used
10:58<EmleyMoor>(the other will be upgraded next week - Karl will be well fascinated!)
11:00<EmleyMoor>If this fails to work I can write it to a CD
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11:03<EmleyMoor>Not run wodim for a while
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11:04<tepozoa>if you need to, you can use "isohybrid" to convert it - we used to have to do this with the older system rescue CDs which were not native USB bootable:
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11:04<amacater>EmleyMoor - what are you trying to install ...
11:04<Akram>Tenkawa: for the record, that's the SD card that is broken. Last time I tried, text files were readable and when I did additional reads they became unreadable.
11:05<tepozoa>amacater: they're build a vendor diagnostic USB stick
11:05<EmleyMoor>Not. Just want to run the diagnostics for my ThinkPad
11:05<amacater>Ah, OK, they won't be isohybrid
11:05<Akram>Tenkawa: I tried to copy even with dd and I got the same restult. I did the same on the USB ssd drive, and now works well arf :-( I will need to find another sd card to unlock me
11:05<Tenkawa>Akram: make sure you are cleanly unmounting it
11:06<Tenkawa>and running sync
11:06<Akram>Tenkawa: I didn't see also that etcher on another showed me an error about the written checksum.
11:06<Tenkawa>otherwise the buffers don't always get flushed
11:06<tepozoa>EmleyMoor: for more reference, I've had good louck just doing "isohybrid foo.iso; dd of=dev/whatever"
11:06<Akram>*on another try to write
11:06<EmleyMoor>Can't even get it to write to a CD!
11:07<Tenkawa>Akram: thats why I always have a separate terminal up so at the end of etcher's write before you remove the media you can run sync
11:08<EmleyMoor>wodim proving useless
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11:09*EmleyMoor tries unmounting the existing contests of the CD-RW
11:12<EmleyMoor>Took two goes but it looks like that helped
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11:14<tepozoa>would you say.... you turned it off then on again? :)
11:15<marwanwaleed>hi everyone
11:15<marwanwaleed>i love irc
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11:15<marwanwaleed>veeeeeery much
11:15<booda>u dont prefer matrix or discord?
11:15<marwanwaleed>i love discord
11:16<marwanwaleed>can we talk discord
11:16<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic or #moocows; or search for a chat topic of your choice at
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11:17<EmleyMoor>Hmmm... next to nothing is happening - but I'll leave it to run and see
11:17<@bremner>marwanwaleed: please stop
11:17<tepozoa>EmleyMoor: what step are you on that it's doing nothing? booting the USB?
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11:17<EmleyMoor>Blanking/writing the CD
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11:18*tepozoa nods - you're having a lot of problems in general is seems just writing to the USB drive
11:18<tepozoa>could that USB drive itself be faulty?
11:18<tepozoa>they do die/go bad
11:18<tepozoa>they're cheap
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11:19<EmleyMoor>I'm *not*, on this attempt, using one
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11:19<tepozoa>you're trying an ISO burn to CDRW?
11:20<EmleyMoor>Yes, and it looks to have completed
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11:22<EmleyMoor>Yukky screen output
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11:24<EmleyMoor>Much CD acivity
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11:25<EmleyMoor>And a cat between me and the keyboard
11:26<tepozoa>FWIW: I downloaded the iso, ran "isohybrid linux-bootable-cd-v4220.iso: and then made a dummy VM inside VirtualBox and it boots perfect
11:26<tepozoa>it complains it's not a Lenovo :)
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11:27<EmleyMoor>tepozoa: I'm running it on a Lenovo - it's proceeding but at a speed that seems poor. There do seem to be media errors, though
11:27*tepozoa nods
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11:27<tepozoa>spirit of my post: ISO seems valid and working at a very basic level, and converting it to a USB bootable /seems/ to work
11:27<EmleyMoor>When I tried from a USB stick it never booted, just returned me to a boot device chooser (the stick was listed, though)
11:28<tepozoa>vendor download does not /appear/ corrupt
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11:29<tepozoa>did you run isohybrid on the ISO (use a copy!) before writing it to USB?
11:30<tepozoa>that's a must-have
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11:30<EmleyMoor>tepozoa: No... where do you get isohybrid from?
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11:30<tepozoa>syslinux package
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11:31<EmleyMoor>tepozoa: Command not found
11:32<EmleyMoor>Ah, syslinux-utils package
11:32<tepozoa>ahhh I'm so sorry my bad
11:32<EmleyMoor>Not a problem
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11:33<tepozoa>big picture: CD ISO files have a different technical format internally than what USB bootable needs; isohybrid takes your CD-type ISO and injects the juju that USB needs to boot them
11:35<EmleyMoor>I intend one day to reinstate my "multiboot" stick, but would like to be able to UEFI-boot it
11:36<EmleyMoor>(or, its contents)
11:37<tepozoa>_nod_ that's a whole other can of worms
11:37<EmleyMoor>I tried replacing the CMOS battery on this ThinkPad - it may have made no difference, or worse, pligged something else
11:38<EmleyMoor>Still, if the box is basically serviceable I know places that might be able to sort that for me.
11:39<EmleyMoor>Booting stick
11:40<EmleyMoor>Hmm... Debian 9 based!
11:42<flowriser>EmleyMoor, I used ventoy tool with much success btw
11:42<EmleyMoor>Damn... need to find the "test it all" mode
11:42<tepozoa>:-) so it boots!
11:43<EmleyMoor>Never had trouble with it booting, just had generally crap performance once it had, in rcent boots
11:43<tepozoa>almost sounds like your CPU is stuck in the lowest speed
11:44<EmleyMoor>tepozoa, No, not CPU related. Network and/or disk related
11:44*tepozoa nods
11:45<EmleyMoor>Stress test underway
11:46<EmleyMoor>This old ThinkPad served me well for years - I just want a bit more time until I can afford something better.
11:47<EmleyMoor>I'm considering a device with tablet-like capability (a Yoga or similar) but would appreciate advice on whether it's worth it.
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11:50<EmleyMoor>I am also thinking, in the future, of a touchscreen for my desktop... but likewise...
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11:56<flowriser>EmleyMoor, newer thinkpads also run great; For desktops, an AMD Ryzen with some nvme storage and some DDR4 3000+ Mhz will run great. Also driver support is on point.
11:57<EmleyMoor>I will be replacing my desktop machine when and only when finance allows
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11:58<at0m>EmleyMoor: with 'old', how old or about do you mean? my laptop's nearing its 10y of service, and the stickers aside, it looks and feels great for my use, at least. ok, it's got SSD since the beginning.
11:58<EmleyMoor>9 years
11:58<EmleyMoor>Magnetic disk on mine
11:59<at0m>ah, lil ol' rattler
11:59<at0m>that's commonly a bottleneck
11:59<EmleyMoor>SSD under consideration, if the machine is serviceable.
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12:01<nickme>Hi. Im using a GeForce 1030 GT and Debian Buster, it seems, that there is no correct driver for this card. everything is running in the correct resolution, but videos in big windows or fullscreen are lagging while playback. I ran nvidia-detect and got this: When I install that package and reboot the machine, the highest resolution was something like 1024xfoobar but
12:01<EmleyMoor>Got my old Dell somewhere too - but the screen is wrecked on that. Thinking of selling it as spare parts.
12:01<nickme>the videos ran smooth.
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12:03<nickme>Is there a way to get both: highest resolution for the desktop and smotth running videos in fullscreen?
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12:08<flowriser>nickme, what kernel version you are running? `uname -r`
12:08<nickme>flowriser: 4.19.0-17-amd64
12:10*EmleyMoor is glad he learned a bit more about isohybrid today - that will save a lot of messing about with CDs!
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12:20<flowriser>nickme, first of all uninstall all nvidia drivers you currently have; then apt-get upgrade
12:21<flowriser>Then, follow the instructions here: Your graphics card should be in the backports of buster
12:21<EmleyMoor>I'm glad I got rid of my NVidia card, but only because it was faulty, returning duff values that crashed xorg regularly
12:22<flowriser>EmleyMoor, yes; amd gpus so much more stable. I game in 4k using proton/steam and it is amazing
12:22<EmleyMoor>I do have one EVGA NVidia card in the spares box - only keeping it because it has HDMI output.
12:23<nickme>flowriser: ok. what if i just upgrade to the new stable branch?
12:23<flowriser>nickme, that is also a possibility if you can do it
12:23<nickme>flowriser: will try ;)
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12:29<alex11>xfce and/or nvidia is a little buggy in bullseye, the panel has some weird properties
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12:31<alex11>i frankly blame nvidia i don't think it's xfce's fault
12:31<EmleyMoor>I intend to add another monitor to this machine tomorrow, but need to see what connector it needs first
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12:36<flowriser>if you get a 34'' curved screen you won't ever need another monitor
12:36<jkc>I have 2 34" flat panels.
12:36<flowriser>you are a god
12:36<EmleyMoor>I have a spare 24" - and my existing one.
12:37<jkc>No, just easily distracted.
12:37<Xinayder>I'm upgrading my debian vps, should I be concerned that I don't have aptitude installed?
12:37<EmleyMoor>(the spare has speakers and I know a more deserving place for my speakers)
12:37<jkc>No. aptitude isn't the recommended utility anyway.
12:37<jkc>Xinayder: ^
12:37<EmleyMoor>Xinayder: Only if you intend to use aptitude.
12:38<Xinayder>weird, why does the upgrade docs recommend its usage then?
12:38<jkc>I find it odd that it does.
12:38<EmleyMoor>Xinayder: "recommend"? More like "tell you what to do if you do".
12:38<jkc>I'd use apt or apt-get, personally.
12:38<EmleyMoor>What is recommended, if anything, as a "front end" these days?
12:39<Xinayder>EmleyMoor, well to me in this page it seems like "you can check your obsolete packages with aptitude (if you use apt or apt-get sorry we can't help you)"
12:39<jkc>That's because aptitude enables some extra search functionality that apt/apt-get don't.
12:39<EmleyMoor>Xinayder: That's perhaps a (minor) plus of aptitude
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12:40-!-pert is "John Scott" on #debian #debian-rant #debian-offtopic #debian-next
12:41<flowriser>you can always use apt-cache search
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12:45<EmleyMoor>Almost at the motherboard tests :-)
12:45<marwan>bye now iam busy soory
12:45<marwan>we talk tomorrow
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12:48<EmleyMoor>No motherboard or bus faults, it seems
12:48<marwan>what is the link :)
12:49<marwan>i love the irc
12:50<luna_>link for?
12:50<marwan>the debian
12:51<marwan>what is this
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12:51<marwan>ahhhh ok
12:51<marwan>what are you doing luna
12:52<marwan>iam new in the chat
12:52<luna_>marwan: listening to music on twitch and relaxing
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12:52<marwan>ahhh ok
12:52<marwan>iam hacking
12:52<luna_>or wait this is #debian on
12:52<luna_>not libera i got confused as i am in both
12:52<dpkg>You are chatting on IRC. IRC is the original group chat. Similar to platforms like Slack, Matrix, or Discord, IRC was invented in the 1980s and formalized with RFC 1459 in 1993. This channel, #debian, is for help with the debian operating system. Ask us a debian support question, or read more about IRC at or
12:52<marwan>ok my friend luna
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12:53<Izty_>Hello, I use the package "Motion" and since Bullseye, I have issues with it. I can start it fine with `sudo /usr/bin/motion` but `sudo systemctl start motion` says "motion.service: State 'stop-sigterm' timed out. Killing."
12:53<marwan>i love this chat and terminal @luna_
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12:54<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic or #moocows; or search for a chat topic of your choice at
12:54<Izty_>I previously had "pid_file /var/run/motion/" but now there is a permission issue with it. Should I keep it, should I change /var/run/motion/'s permissions?
12:55<Izty_>I don't know if it's related to my issue though
12:56<sney>Izty_: permissions are not usually the real problem. do you have any error logs from the service that you can share?
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12:58<Izty_>sney: Here is journalctl -u motion:
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12:58<Izty_>I commented out the pid_file setting
12:58<sney>Izty_: you should also take a look at /usr/share/doc/motion/NEWS.Debian.gz as it might have some information regarding the upgrade from 4.1.1 to 4.3.2
13:00<Izty_>sney: It says "Migrate to systemd instead of initscript. This no longer honours /etc/default/motion, so if you had disabled the service previously then you should run `systemctl disable motion` after upgrading to this version."
13:00<colo>is anyone of you using podman on bullseye to run "dockerized" applications? if so, can you please share impressions about the experience?
13:01<Izty_>I had the service enabled with systemctl before
13:02<marwan>hi lzty_
13:02<sney>Izty_: the service file should just be this, - I don't see where it could be getting "motion.service: State 'stop-sigterm' timed out" from
13:03<Izty_>And I'm surprised about this timeout issue because it is set to 1m 30s and when I start it with sudo /usr/bin/motion, it seems to start in la lot less than 1m30s
13:04<Izty_>sney: My file is the same:
13:04<Izty_>marwan: Hi
13:05<sney>you don't have anything overriding it in /etc/systemd/system? hm
13:05<marwan>dont talk here
13:05<marwan>this is support debian
13:05<sney>marwan: this is a debian support channel, do you have a debian question?
13:05<marwan>no thanks :)
13:06<sney>then please make noise somewhere else.
13:06<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic or #moocows; or search for a chat topic of your choice at
13:06<luna_>marwan: #debian-offtopic
13:06<marwan>iam joined
13:07<marwan>but i dont want talk in here sorry
13:07<EmleyMoor>Then don't - nobody's making you
13:08-!-mode/#debian [+l 984] by debhelper
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13:08<EmleyMoor>/part this channel if it helps
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13:08<EmleyMoor>Hmmm... my laptop just went "dead" during a hard disk test
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13:09<marwan>iam close irc now bye
13:09<EmleyMoor>Hmmm... this looks like an overheat. Laptop won't power on.
13:09<marwan>iam will open tomorrow okey
13:09<Izty_>sney: I don't think so. Here is what I have:
13:10<EmleyMoor>... if you want to either read or request on topic stuff, that's up to you
13:11<sney>marwan: as the dpkg bot has told you twice, you can search for other irc channels at
13:11<marwan>thats very good
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13:12<sney>Izty_: I'm not familiar with this package specifically, but browsing through the salsa repo I get the sense that there were a lot of changes made in this 4.3.2 upload. I wonder if you should back up your site-specific settings, purge the package & configuration, and install it again to start over fresh
13:13<sney>this commit alone is pretty substantial:
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13:17<Izty_>sney: That's what I'm doing. Motion wouldn't start at all so I'm using the default configuration that I edited a bit and here I am with /usr/bin/motion working but not thought systemctl
13:17<Izty_>sney: No worries though, I also asked in #motion, with no luck so far
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13:19<sney>Izty_: is it supposed to run as root or with a service account? you could try sudo -u _motion /usr/bin/motion, (where _motion is the likely service account name) and see if it gives you any more useful hints
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13:21<demo>debian rules
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13:22<Izty_>sney: I tried running it manually without sudo and, besides complaining about the log file, it looks like systemd is involved. Is it normal?
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13:23<Izty_>sney: It says unknown user _motion
13:23<bastie1977>bastie1977: test
13:23<Izty_>sney: There is a "motion" user though
13:23<sney>Izty_: that account was a guess, you would have to see what the user is on your system, or if you happen to know what user motion is supposed to run as
13:24<Izty_>sney: sudo -u motion /usr/bin/motion works
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13:24<Izty_>sney: When I sudo /usr/bin/motion, it creates its pid file as motion:motion
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13:25<sney>ok, I guess the motion binary handles its own privilege drop then.
13:26<Izty_>sney: systemctl also creates the pid file as motion:motion
13:27<sney>I'm out of ideas, hopefully someone in #motion answers you. you can also try again in here in 5 hours or so, though it tends to be more active during the week
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13:29<Izty_>sney: No worries. Thanks a lot for your time: )
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13:35<marwan>what are you doing
13:36<bastie1977>i learn to youse the irc here
13:36<bastie1977>to use the irc here, sorry
13:38<alex11>you can try asking #oftc to get a grounding in the basics
13:38<alex11>or read any irc guider
13:38<sney>marwan: please have some respect. you already know #debian is for debian support. or do you have a debian question now?
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13:39-!-rahul is "Rahul Dsouza,,," on #debian
13:39<marwan>no iam using parrot security os
13:39<dpkg>Installing Parrot or Kali on your computer will not make you into a security expert overnight. If you really want to have those skills, install a general purpose linux distro like Debian (, learn at least one programming language, and learn about networking. Eventually you may have the skills that make a pentesting distro a useful tool.
13:39<sney>you are not a hacker. and parrot is offtopic in #debian. please go somewhere else. there are thousands of other irc channels out there.
13:40<rahul>what is the name of the torrent client on debian 11 with lxqt DE?
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13:41<rahul>because if there is no torrent client then i will install ktorrent
13:41<sney>rahul: probably either qbittorrent or deluge
13:41<marwan>hi sney
13:41<marwan>!parrot magic
13:41<marwan>where is the bot
13:42<rahul>sney it is not there
13:42<marwan>answer sney where is the bot
13:42<sney>marwan: parrot is just an operating system. it does not magically turn you into a hacker. and we don't support parrot, or children pretending to be hackers, in #debian. go away.
13:42<marwan>i knowwww
13:43<sney>rahul: then install it
13:43<marwan>this is hacker opreating system
13:43<marwan>i know
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13:44<rahul>installing ktorrent
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13:44<rahul>thanks for the help sney
13:44<marwan>the parrot sec torrent installed
13:44<sney>!ops marwan needs help finding the door
13:44<dpkg>Hydroxide, dondelelcaro, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, abrotman, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Myon, Ganneff, weasel, zobel, themill, babilen, SynrG, jm_, somiaj, jelly, petn-randall, bremner: sney complains about a problem (see above)
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13:45<marwan>nooo sney i dont want any help
13:45<Izty_>sney: Someone over on #motion says it's weird that I have twice the same line in They're hinting that maybe I have two simlinks for the same thing
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13:46<tepozoa>rahul: transmission has a qt frontend as well
13:46<marwan>do you know discord
13:46<Izty_>sney: How could I investigate it? I believe motion switched to systemd starting from Bullseye so I may have some leftover from before systemd
13:46-!-debalance [] has quit [Quit: - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.]
13:46<sney>Izty_: you can 'ls -l' any file you think may be a symlink and it will tell you.
13:47<vv221>marwan, Discord is a topic for #debian-offtopic, or #debian-rant, but here we are on a Debian support channel ;)
13:47<sney>Izty_: and if you did 'apt purge motion' when it wasn't starting before, then you shouldn't have any leftover configs from pre-systemd but you could always check in /etc/motion to be sure
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13:48<tepozoa>how many cameras do you actually have?
13:48<Izty_>tepozoa: Two
13:48<tepozoa>the output you showed indicated it things you have /etc/motion camera1.conf and camera2.conf
13:48<tepozoa>OK cool
13:49<Izty_>sney: I don't know where to look for motion symlinks. There are none in /etc/motion
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13:50<Izty_>sney: I didn't apt purge motion. I do have some .conf.dpkg-dist files in my /etc/motion but I don't think they are used (no sign on them in the logs)
13:50<Izty_>I do have a /etc/init.d/motion file though
13:50<tepozoa>it /might/ me one in the old SysV (init.d) and one in systemd (unit) - try these two: "find /etc/init* -name \*motion\*" and "find /etc/systemd -name \*motion\*"
13:53<tepozoa>I think what they were saying in the other channel (by your description) indicates there might be "double startup" trying to happen, so the spirit is to look in /etc/ for all possible startup methods of "motion" scripts
13:53<Izty_>tepozoa: That's what I understood from the other channel too
13:54<Izty_>tepozoa: find /etc/init* -name \*motion\* returns one line, find /etc/systemd -name \*motion\* returns zero lines but I have disabled motion from systemd
13:54<tepozoa>what does the first line say
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13:54<Izty_>should I mv /etc/init.d/motion ~ then sudo systemctl start motion to see if it starts only once?
13:55<Izty_>tepozoa: First line is /etc/init.d/motion
13:55<tepozoa>that is the SysV startup method from pre-systemd
13:56<tepozoa>run the same command but use /etc/rc* now
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13:56<Kraus>So, uh, I think I may have screwed up the symlink for mounting my thumb drive by doing rm -r /media/user/ ... and now all contents appear gone, and my drive keeps saying it's got stuff it needs to write to that device it needs to finish before unmounting, but it never finished; simultaneously it unmounts but yet when plugged back in it automatically mounts. .... Any way I can, perhaps, make a new symlink? Is that how it works?
13:56<tepozoa>(we're looking for maybe /etc/rc2.d/S##motion symlink)
13:57<tepozoa>Kraus: /media is the mount point for the automatic subsystem called "udisks2" and it manages all that automatically (or is supposed to)
13:57<Izty_>tepozoa: Eeehm, it says:
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13:58<tepozoa>Izty_: OK that is find, those are the Stop scripts (for like when you reboot, etc.) so should not matter
13:58<tepozoa>K = kill
13:59<Izty_>tepozoa: They're the same file (same md5)
13:59<Izty_>tepozoa: Same as /etc/init.d/motion too
13:59<tepozoa>yes - those are all symlinks
13:59<tepozoa>it's how SysV works
14:00<Izty_>Ah ok
14:00<tepozoa> <- so this is ugly
14:00-!-mode/#debian [+o bremner] by ChanServ
14:00<tepozoa>they have... well, bastardized, the systemd startup to call bash instead of just starting the software
14:01-!-mode/#debian [-o bremner] by ChanServ
14:01<Izty_>tepozoa: My /lib/systemd/system/motion.service is
14:02-!-heiserhorn [~heiserhor@] has quit [Quit: heiserhorn]
14:02<tepozoa>there's has "motion -n" -- what is "-n"?
14:02-!-earthundead [~earthunde@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:04<Izty_>tepozoa: Run in non-daemon mode.
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14:04*tepozoa nods
14:04<tepozoa>so if you just run the command motion (or motion -n) without using systemd, does it start / work?
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14:05<Izty_>tepozoa: It did, yes. I can retry to be sure
14:06<Izty_>tepozoa: sudo /usr/bin/motion works fine
14:06<tepozoa>looking at their C code, they have their own internal "watchdog" which is trying to catch itself if something falls, which is probably why systemd is having a problem
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14:08<tepozoa>my suggestion will take you some time: using their file as a template, try adding some of their settings (one by one) to your systemd unit file - for example they read the file /etc/default/motion into view before starting up:
14:08<marwan>heeey iam back
14:08<tepozoa>your problem has something specific to do with their software and how it must be started under systemd
14:09<tepozoa>(which is sort of not Debian's problem, per-se)
14:09<Izty_>tepozoa: Wait, it's working!
14:09<Izty_>You are right, I shouldn't run it as a daemon
14:09<marwan>FUCK YOU BITCH
14:09<Izty_>I disabled the daemon mode in /etc/motion/motion.conf
14:09<tepozoa>marwan: was that necessary?
14:09<Izty_>And now it seems to start fine through systemd
14:09<tepozoa>there you go
14:09<marwan>IAM JOKING
14:09<tepozoa>success! go have a beer :)
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14:10<Izty_>tepozoa: You have one too :D
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14:10<Izty_>tepozoa: Thanks a lot!!
14:10<marwan>HEY LZTY
14:10-!-mode/#debian [+q *!*@] by debchange
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14:10<tepozoa>sure, it's after 12pm local time, it's "legal" (not morning) :)
14:11<Izty_>tepozoa: It makes me wonder though, why does the default config has daemon mode turned on if motion is supposed to be run through systemd..
14:11-!-mode/#debian [+o bremner] by ChanServ
14:11-!-mode/#debian [+q marwan!*@*] by bremner
14:11<tepozoa>mmmmm..... my best guess is history
14:11<tepozoa>before systemd, apps had to be their own watchdog
14:11<@bremner>marwan: you have been quieted for 1h or so in this channel
14:12<tepozoa>systemd takes all that pain away, so I'm going to guess that it's simply history of the project over time
14:12<Tenkawa>apologies for my parts/joins…. was having connectivity hiccup for a minute there
14:12<Tenkawa>found the source
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14:13<tepozoa>Izty_:so it's common now for apps to "not run in daemon mode themself" because systemd brings all of those features
14:13<Izty_>tepozoa: I mean, maybe the default config that debian ships should have daemon mode off
14:13<tepozoa>(systemd writes and manages the PID/process, etc.)
14:13-!-mode/#debian [-q *!*@] by debchange
14:13<raven523>a lot of developers haven't updated their daemons to be able to run in the foreground for service managers like systemd
14:13<Izty_>Or is the default config not shipped by debian
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14:14<tepozoa>you would have to dig into the debian package -- maybe you found a bug or something by accident? it happens
14:14<tepozoa> <- start looking around here in the package source
14:14<mason>raven523: Reasonable since the traditional mode is better-understood.
14:15*enyc meows
14:16<enyc>tepozoa: hrrrm interesting, what about running under runit and other systems? do they provide the daemon functionality similarly?
14:16<tepozoa>I'm afraid I am not familiar with them, sorry
14:17<tepozoa>(most of my work has been in SysV and now systemd, I kind of avoided all the others over my life)
14:17<raven523>runit, s6, and other supervisors work the same way, except they can't handle forking services as effectively as systemd can
14:17<Izty_>tepozoa: Hmm it seems that has daemon off...
14:17<Izty_>Did I change it? Hmm that's dumb of me not to remember it..
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14:18<tepozoa>Izty_: trivia! a DEB package is just a tarball within a tarball. Install "bsdtar" (my favorite) and then download the DEB file from the repo, then "bsdtar xf motion.deb" and then again "bsdtar xf data.tar.gz" and you will get all the post-processed source files to look at
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14:19<tepozoa>I usually start with the finished package and work backwards to the source
14:19<tepozoa>(for debugging)
14:20<tepozoa>bsdtar is the swiss army knife of unpacking stuff, you can throw almost any archive file at it and it's smart
14:20<Tenkawa>you dont even need bsdtar
14:20<Izty_>tepozoa: You mean I should have looked at motion.conf within the deb?
14:20<Tenkawa>ar x the deb
14:20<tepozoa>Tenkawa: sssssh, I'm pimping bsdtar :)
14:20<Tenkawa>then tar the data file
14:20<Tenkawa>heheheh ok… sorry heehee
14:20<alex11>it confuses the hell out of me it's unar and not unrar
14:20<alex11>for rar files
14:20<tepozoa>it's one of those tools that once you learn it, you start using it for everything
14:21<tepozoa>I stopped caring what an archive is and let bsdtar handle it
14:21<alex11>is it in debian?
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14:21<tepozoa>last time I looked, yeah lemme validate
14:21<Izty_>Yes, I usually use tar. I don't know the difference with bsdtar
14:21<tepozoa>package: libarchive-tools
14:22<Izty_>tepozoa: Thanks again, I'll leave now
14:22<mason>enyc: Aside from service and worker management, there's also the notion that logging benefits from the traditional facility, based services.
14:22<tepozoa>Izty_: just think curl vs. wget - tools, do different things
14:22<Izty_>Ok :)
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14:23<mason>Speaking of brave new worlds, I wish Podman were packaged. That's really the future for modern services management.
14:24<mason>I've found a couple articles on getting it all going under Debian, but it looked on the hairy side.
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14:24<Tenkawa>Source: libpod (3.0.1+dfsg1-3)
14:24<Tenkawa>Version: 3.0.1+dfsg1-3+b2
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14:25<Tenkawa>it is according to what I see
14:25<Tenkawa>Package: podman
14:25<mason>That looks like it's talking about Perl POD documentation.
14:25<sney>,i podman
14:25<judd>Package podman (admin, optional) in bullseye/amd64: engine to run OCI-based containers in Pods. Version: 3.0.1+dfsg1-3+b2; Size: 9289.9k; Installed: 36396k; Homepage:
14:26<mason>Oh! Bullseye.
14:26<Tenkawa>a million go dependencies to run those containers though
14:26<mason>Doesn't exist for Buster.
14:26<enyc>raven523: hrrm I see, I think may be mx/antix providing runit or so
14:26<mason>Alright, well, that's cool then.
14:27<mason>Tenkawa: Right, but not heavyweight root-owned daemon.
14:27<Tenkawa>true enough
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14:27<mason>Wow, I really can't type any more. s/not/no/ Anyway, that's exciting seeing it in Bullseye. Didn't realize.
14:28<mason>I almost never look here, and the default search on is just stable.
14:29<sney>there was a lot of go/rust stuff that couldn't get into buster or buster-backports because of all the go and/or rust stack dependencies that were not worth the effort to build on the older platform
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14:29<mason>Hrm, which seems to indicate that is still calling Buster stable, since it doesn't find it.
14:29<mason>...doesn't find it under stable, that is.
14:29<tepozoa>it is, I've been using it all week - testing is still bullseye
14:29<sney>yeah, there's an open bug and merge request to update p.d.o, I'm not sure what the holdup is
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14:30<sney>(except that, broadly, it's all hardcoded and needs to be changed manually)
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14:32<sney>#992258 and
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14:45<vv221>alex11, tepozoa, from my experience bsdtar (from libarchive-tools) and unar each can handle some tricky archives that the other can not.
14:46<vv221>By having both, you can handle almost anything ;)
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14:53<flowriser>sney, what is the bug page of the packages repo?
14:54<flowriser>I've been trying to search for it but I cannot find it xD
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14:57<sney>flowriser: you mean bugs against they're filed here since it's handled by the debian www team,
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14:57<sney>see specifically
14:58<flowriser>sney, thanks so much!
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14:59<flowriser>sney, do you also maybe have any idea where the www team hangs out in irc? :D
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15:00<sney>there is #debian-www, though it's not really a "hang out"
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15:01<flowriser>sney, thanks so much! :D
15:03<khimaros[m]>hey folks, i think this issue is also impacting firewalld/wireguard in bullseye and bookworm:
15:04<ham5urg_>If a pcie4 nvme is put into an pcie3-slot, will the writing speed be halfed?
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15:04<khimaros[m]>this can lead to DHCPv6 solicitations failing once the cache is full.
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15:05<sney>khimaros[m]: I see a couple bugs listed at that sound related to your description
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15:06<sney>but if they are not, please report this one as well (preferably after reproducing it in debian)
15:07<khimaros[m]>definitely reproduced :) i don't think any of those are quite the same. thank you for the tip though, i'll verify.
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15:10<EmleyMoor>Is there anything I can do to find out the model of my graphics card?
15:10<sney>EmleyMoor: 'lspci' is usually sufficient
15:10<khimaros[m]>in this case, setting `IPv6_rpfilter=no` in /etc/firewalld/firewalld.conf eliminates the issue.
15:10<sney>optionally grep for video
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15:11<EmleyMoor>That's only suggested it's one of 7
15:11<khimaros[m]>is there some way to flush the ipv6 route cache on Linux? `ip -6 route flush cache` and `ip -6 route show cache` do not seem to be relevant to `net.ipv6.route.max_size`
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15:12<sney>EmleyMoor: 'lshw -class video' is another option
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15:17<r4fkramer>Please, I am trying to use 'dd' to copy the .iso from a data rescue system to a usb drive via Debian Bullseye. But, I'm having difficulties with the correct syntax to use:
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15:18<raven523>areplace systemrescue-x.y.z.iso with systemrescue-8.04-amd64.iso in your commands
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15:18<EmleyMoor>Not much help either. I will just have to take a look at the back of the machine to find my answer
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15:19<EmleyMoor>As it is I'm shutting down to switch my main monitor anyway
15:20<sney>EmleyMoor: if you need help interpreting lspci or lshw output, you can always pastebin.
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15:20<EmleyMoor>It's not interpretation I need. It's spec - and you can't get a spec from a list of cards.
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15:25<khimaros[m]>also the result given by `lnstat -j -c1 -f rt_cache -k entries` is nowhere near max_size
15:25<r4fkramer>Thank you very much for answering, raven523. Please, is this syntax correct now ?
15:25<r4fkramer>dd if=/path/to/systemrescue-8.04-amd64.iso of=/dev/sdb1 status=progress
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15:26<raven523>dd if=/home/r4fkramer/Downloads/systemrescue-8.04-amd64.iso of=/dev/sdb status=progress
15:26<raven523>you want sdb not sdb1, assuming sdb is a USB stick
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15:30<r4fkramer>Thank you raven523, I used 'sdb1' because it was the return of 'lsblk' ('sdb1' derived from 'sdb').I had doubts about 'path' (only used 'home', an incomplete path) instead of '/home/r4framer/').
15:31<r4fkramer>And 'to' (Downloads in this case). Thank you very much for attention and Great Support, raven523 :)
15:33<r4fkramer>Now it worked here. As I always say: Debian Warriors will always be the Best! Really thank you very much, raven523 :)
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15:47<Kraus>Pardon me, one more question: what does the + sign mean sitting to the right to the permissions string? e.g.: drwxr-x---+
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15:49<Kraus>Ahh, nevermind, just happened to find the answer on superuser...
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15:52<EmleyMoor>Swapped monitor but the sound from the speakers is AWFULLY weak.
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15:53<flowriser>EmleyMoor, in my case installing the gpu drivers also made my HDMI sound work properly
15:53<markmental666>Does anyone know if the version of qtcreator in the Debian 11 repos contains the desktop build kit? I'm coming from Ubuntu where the kits weren't set up, so I had to use Qt's installer instead of apt
15:53<EmleyMoor>This is not HDMI sound
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15:54<EmleyMoor>This is ordinary sound - the speakers are built into the monitor and the output from the sound card is connected directly.
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15:55<EmleyMoor>It was half the point of trying this monitor, sadly
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15:58<Sqrt{not}>markmental666, You can check the contents at and the other packages on which it depends or suggests at:
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15:59<jhutchins>EmleyMoor: lspci should really display the sound hardwarea, lspci -nn will give you the pciid which we can run against the database.
16:00<EmleyMoor>jhutchins: I have precisely 0 queries about my sound hardware
16:00<jhutchins>EmleyMoor: pastebin the output?
16:00<EmleyMoor>0 output. 0 to do. Nothing pasted.
16:01<jhutchins>EmleyMoor: did you run it as root?
16:01<jhutchins>Hm, even as non-root I get 21 lines.
16:02<jhutchins>Is this a VM or hardware?
16:02<EmleyMoor>I didn't run it at all. It's irrelevant. The monitor's speakers are rubbish. I have no query re my sound hardware and I am not sure why you think I did
16:03<jhutchins>EmleyMoor: Ok, all yours then.
16:03<Sqrt{not}>EmleyMoor, "speaker" (alone) usually means there must be an amplifier between the signal source and the speaker. Some devices have the amplifier built in, and some don't. you can probably get a cheap amplifier that will fix this problem.
16:04<Sqrt{not}>EmleyMoor, cf. "powered speakers" and "pre-amp level signal"
16:04<EmleyMoor>There is one in the monitor, but even turned RIGHT UP, it's still garbage.
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16:14<spawacz>what is the idiomatic way to invoke a command for each line in file? the command supprorts only one argument and can't be piped to
16:14<spawacz>should i just go while read ... ?
16:14<sussudio>spawacz: ; ?
16:15<jhutchins>spawacz: For loop.
16:15<spawacz>i mean in bash
16:15<spawacz>not C ;p
16:15<jhutchins>spawacz: Yeah, while read.
16:15<jhutchins>spawacz: Bash does for and while loops.
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16:16<Tenkawa>loops are quite easy in bash
16:16<sussudio>spawacz: do you mean something like while true ; do [commands] done
16:16<spawacz>yeah i know that, but very often it happens that there is an oneliner for such things, that's why it's worth asking :)
16:16<jhutchins>!for loop
16:17<spawacz>i already did it this way
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16:17<jeremiah>`for i in 1..3 do print $i done;`
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16:18<@bremner>spawacz: maybe xargs?
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16:18<bebop>can anyone tell me why I'm getting this im 'dmesg'.... "broken atomic modeset userspace detected, disabling atomic" ????
16:19<Nivex>So this was filed a year ago: - grave caused it to get kicked out from the bullseye release. New upstream would fix. Who to ply with favors to get it uploaded and a backport created?
16:19<judd>Bug in graphite-web (open): «ImportError: cannot import name 'parse_qs' from 'cgi' (/usr/lib/python3.8/»; severity: grave; opened: 2020-06-10; last modified: 2020-08-31.
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16:20<spawacz>xargs my_command < file invokes the command only for first line
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16:20<jhutchins>Nivex: You could update the bug report with a link to the upstream changelog that says it's fixed, and request a backport.
16:21<Sqrt{not}>bebop, what hardware, and what debian version?
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16:21<jhutchins>bebop: Possibly your hardware doesn't support that feature. Does your system work ok in spite of this?
16:22<spawacz>xargs -L1 work tho
16:22<bebop>yes other than cups.socket failing
16:22<Nivex>jhutchins: someone already noted in the bug that upstream fixes it. It seems like the maintainer has abandoned the package.
16:22<bebop>it's a print server
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16:24<Sqrt{not}>bebop, what commands/actions cause that message to appear in dmesg?
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16:25<bebop>Sqrt{not}: dmesg
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16:25<bebop>about 30 lines of broken atomic
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16:26<Sqrt{not}>bebop, that's not what I asked. dmesg just shows the output of what is already logged . what action or program causes that message to appear in dmesg log?
16:26<bebop>I do not know
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16:27<Sqrt{not}>bebop, does it appear as soon as you start the computer?
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16:28<bebop>I know what it is.
16:29<bebop>it is vnc running and when it boots there is no monitor... I can disregard it
16:30<Sqrt{not}>OK, good job :) And thanks for telling us what you learned.
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16:45<markmental666>Thanks for the info Sqrt{not}, i installed the apt version and it had the same kit issue as Ubuntu, but i found out how to fix it by manually specifying my Qt version in the kit settings since qtcreator doesn't detect that I have Qt automatically
16:47<raven523>maybe you
16:47<raven523>maybe you are missing some -dev packages
16:48<markmental666>I installed qtbase5-dev with it, thought that would do the trick but i guess not
16:49<markmental666>at least its working now though
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16:50<marwan>hi Andro
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16:50<marwan>hi wallacer
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16:51<marwan>can anybody answer mmeee
16:51<tallship>hi marwan
16:51<marwan>heeeey man
16:51<marwan>how are you
16:52<dpkg>This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic or #moocows; or search for a chat topic of your choice at
16:52<marwan>ahhh ok
16:52<marwan>iam talking in terminal
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16:54<FUCK>hey mero
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16:54<marwan>hey FUCK
16:54<Guest5004>how r y
16:55<marwan>fine , y
16:55<marwan>hi sherab
16:55<marwan>can anybody answer
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16:57<marwan>heeeeeeeeey anybody answer
16:57<towo`>no, you haven't asked a question
16:57<marwan>how are you
16:57<towo`>does it matter?
16:58<towo`>this is a support channel
16:58<marwan>ahhh ok
16:58<sussudio>time for another * bremner sets mode: +q marwan!*@*
16:58<marwan>how are you broooo
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17:00<marwan>hi user
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17:00<marwan>what are you doing
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17:01<user85375>Trying to figure out how to define a manual interface in /etc/network/interfaces
17:01<marwan>iam exiting the terminal
17:01-!-marwan [~marwan@] has quit [Quit: leaving]
17:02<user85375>Did I speak with a bot? :P
17:02<sussudio>user85375: do you mean a static ip address
17:02<Tenkawa>user85375: bunch of examples on that link
17:02-!-marwan [~marwan@] has joined #debian
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17:02<user85375>No, I meant an interface that isn't auto or allow-hotplug
17:03<user85375>I want it down until I ifup it
17:03-!-juan_ [] has quit []
17:03<marwan>hi user
17:03<Tenkawa>dont put auto or allow-hotplug… simple
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17:03<marwan>hiiiii user
17:03<user85375>so just enp42s0 ?
17:04<marwan>i want your mastercard user85375 hahahahahhaha
17:04<Tenkawa>yeah you just define your int.. then when you are ready. ifup/ifdown
17:04<marwan>hi tenkawa
17:05<Tenkawa>like mine are statics:
17:05<Tenkawa>iface wlan0 inet static
17:05<Tenkawa>with the info afterwards
17:05<marwan>i know what is wifi
17:05<Tenkawa>then I can use ifup and ifdown
17:06<marwan>tenkawa i want tell you something
17:06-!-jfoy [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:06<marwan>i want tell you something
17:07-!-ddsys [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
17:07<marwan>hey user
17:07<marwan>what are you doing
17:07<Tenkawa>user85375: did that work for you?
17:07<Tenkawa>(pending its not this machine)
17:08<marwan>i want friends please
17:09<user85375>it worked :)
17:09-!-ngaio [~ngaio@2601:245:c700:2c06:8181:47af:d3b4:a2c0] has joined #debian
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17:09<marwan>ahhhh iam leave the irc
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17:10<user85375>i'm working around the inability to bridge my WiFi connection in KVM :P
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17:11<Tenkawa>yeah KVM can be a bit picky
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17:11<Tenkawa>XEN as well
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17:16<mangoduck>hello, can anyone help me get wifi working on my macbook, which is running Debian?
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17:17<sney>mangoduck: macbook wifi is usually b43, this page will have the information you need if so
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17:18<BastardOperatorFromHell>Hi user0099, is sshguard no more available in bullseye?
17:18<user0099>hi voyager1
17:18<mangoduck>the wiki is giving me 403 forbidden. I've looked there before, but it all assumes you have an internet connection, which I don't.
17:18<mangoduck>it says to use apt and stuff, but obviously that doesn't work
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17:18<user0099>okkkkk mangoduck
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17:19<mangoduck>I downloaded the non-free drivers. I even downloaded the unofficial installer with the non-free firmware on it.
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17:19<mangoduck>but when it asks me to pick my driver, none of them work
17:19<mangoduck>and when I try "none of the above" to find firmware on the usb, it can't find it.
17:19<sney>mangoduck: yeah, broadcom wifi is difficult with that because it uses a downloader to get the files you need, as debian can't distribute them
17:20<user0099>iam hacking bank
17:21<sney>!ops please ban marwan aka user0099
17:21<dpkg>Hydroxide, dondelelcaro, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, abrotman, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Myon, Ganneff, weasel, zobel, themill, babilen, SynrG, jm_, somiaj, jelly, petn-randall, bremner: sney complains about a problem (see above)
17:21<user0099>iam hacking baaaank
17:21<Typhome>Anyone got snapd core installed on Debian 11 (bullseye)? I am having trouble with it.
17:21<user0099>i dont love debian 11
17:21<Typhome>Fresh Debian 11 install too
17:21<ydbi>Typhome: what sort of trouble?
17:22<user0099>i love parrot security
17:22<Typhome>One second, getting output for you
17:22<Blendie>i use 11 since december, no isssues
17:22<plaur>mangoduck: b43 manages about 2.9MB/s on my old MacMini, but it's pretty stable. a USB stick can be an alternative, but many of them overheat and lose connection
17:22<Typhome>ydbi: Please see output:
17:22<ydbi>Blendie: I use 12 since last week, no issues either
17:23<mangoduck>the problem is this macbook doesn't have an ethernet port
17:23<user0099>iam going to the link
17:23<Blendie>12 is stilll very testing
17:24<plaur>mangoduck: you can extract the firmware on another computer and put them to an usb stick. or use a USB ethernet adapter
17:24-!-mith_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:24<plaur>them -> firmware files
17:24-!-hele [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:24<ydbi>Typhome: I don't know how to debug that one, the error message is not very informative
17:24<mangoduck>I tried that, but the installer doesn't detect the files
17:25<ydbi>mangoduck: describe where you put those files exactly, with what exact name
17:25<plaur>mangoduck: sure, if the other computer doesn't have broadcom. :)
17:25<ydbi>the instructions are really bad
17:25<user0099>iam install ngrok
17:25<Blendie>obi wan is always with us
17:26-!-alex [] has joined #debian
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17:26<user0099>hey alex
17:26<user0099>how are you
17:26<Blendie>check the light saber, we're taking another way back
17:26<mangoduck>so, I'm using the unofficial iso with the firmware already in it, supposedly. however, I also have another usb with all the ".deb" files from the firmware.tar.gz from
17:26<Blendie>screw the aliens chasing us
17:26<user0099>can anybody answer me FUCK
17:27<user0099>iam booooooooooooooooooy
17:27<sney>mangoduck: the b43 firmware isn't in that tarball, because only broadcom can distribute it.
17:27<plaur>mangoduck: you'll need to use some manual steps on the other computer, as described in
17:27<jhutchins>sney: This is a technical support channel for Debian. Please take the idle chat elsewhere, like #moocows.
17:27-!-user0099 [~marwan@] has quit [Quit: leaving]
17:27<sney>jhutchins: ... blind
17:27<Blendie>and you wont be as cool as us by peeling potatos
17:27<sney>someone still needs to ban him, he's going to come back
17:28<sney>he's been leaving and coming back all day
17:28<Maulkin>sney: okies.
17:28<mason>Saying /ignore *!*@ worked for now. Requiring registrations might be useful.
17:28-!-mode/#debian [+o Maulkin] by ChanServ
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17:28-!-mode/#debian [+b *!*@] by Maulkin
17:28<mason>That works too.
17:29<sney>qed b/w perfect timing
17:29<mangoduck>thank you. the wiki said to use fwcutter and the proprietary driver, but made no mention whatsoever on 1) how to do that or 2) that I would need to find the driver myself and it wasn't in the tarball
17:29<Typhome>Is down for anyone else?
17:29<@Maulkin>Blendie: This is for Debian support, can you take general chatting to #debian-offtopic, or #moocows please?
17:29<Typhome>I wonder why my freshly installed Debian 11 can't connect to it
17:29<Blendie>sure, it just happened
17:29<@Maulkin>Thank you!
17:30<plaur>mangoduck: i only tried the propritary driver once, it got unstable connection on the mac mini, and not even faster than b43 - just buggyier :)
17:30<mangoduck>oh, uh, this says it's instructions for 802.11b/g/n. mine is 802.11ac, will that be a problem?
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17:31<tepozoa>the b43 "fwcutter" downloads *all* the firmware for all the variations, it should be OK
17:31-!-mode/#debian [-o Maulkin] by Maulkin
17:31<plaur>mangoduck: the page is old. depending on which hardware you have, you might even be able to use b43-open. it's worth a try with b43 though, the firmware files should all be there
17:31<tepozoa>getting this b43 working is one of the hardest, weird things to work through
17:33<Typhome>ydbi: got it fixed, i had to add firewall rule to accept tcp established connections
17:33<tepozoa>how I did it: use the bw43cutter tool on a working device (even a cloud server works) and make a tarball of /lib/firmware/b43 and /lib/firmware/b43legacy. Use the full ISO installer to install a debian system, then put the above downloaded/tarballed firmware onto a USB, plug into the laptop and then untar to /lib/firmware/b43 and b43legacy
17:33<plaur>mangoduck: one more thing, you might occasionally get b43 timeouts on boot, and WiFi doesn't work. the workaround is to suspend and wake up the system (never had to do this on macOS, but b43 is kinda reverse-engineered for the 4321 chip version I have)
17:34<mangoduck>awesome, thank you
17:34<tepozoa>this b43 is the hardest chip to get working, it's in a lot of laptops
17:35<tepozoa>Broadcom is not open source friendly with the firmware :(
17:35<ydbi>Typhome: how did you even have internet connectivity without that firewall rule?
17:35-!-markmental666 [~mm666@2600:6c64:433f:f249:aa4b:8736:bc6:3f73] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
17:36<plaur>most laptop thanfully don't use broadcom. one using atheros or intel wifi is much better supported, with open-source drivers
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17:36<sney>realtek is also common, and *usually* not a big deal to support
17:36<plaur>yes, indeed
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17:38<Typhome>ydbi: good question
17:38<plaur>mangoduck: you could also get a small USB stick for WiFi, I got an asus n150 nano, which is fast, but tend to overheat when transmitting all the time, even if few data like mp3 streaming. it's only 7 euro over here
17:39<mangoduck>thank you for the advice, but I'd like to get this working
17:39<mangoduck>I am confused. I am trying to find the drivers I need, but they talk about the Broadcom STA drivers and the b43 open source drivers...
17:39<mangoduck>I mean, I'd like to use the open source drivers, but I already have those from the firmware tarball.
17:39<plaur>it'll work, just not that fast
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17:40<plaur>mangoduck: firmware != drivers
17:40<tepozoa>mangoduck: two parts to the puzzle, a driver (kernel module) which provides the high level functionality, and a "firmware blob" which is the closed source firmware file loaded on the fly by the driver
17:41<mangoduck>so, I need to install both?
17:41<plaur>the drivers run inside your kernel on the intel cpu. firmware is written by the driver in the broadcom chip, like a program for the broadcom "cpu" in the wifi chip
17:41<tepozoa>what you are fighting is the firmware blob download - Broadcom made the license so, so bad that no Linux distros can put it in the install
17:42<tepozoa>every Linux distro has this problem with that hardware
17:42<plaur>after the firmware is loaded, the driver will be able to communicate with the broadcom chip
17:42<tepozoa>I have one laptop with it :(
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17:43<tepozoa>Once I went through the pain you are going through, I have made sure to save a copy of /lib/firmware/b43 in my backups for the next time(s)
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17:43<mangoduck>thank you all for you help. I'm still confused. what's the first step? drivers or firmware?
17:43<tepozoa>the driver is a kernel module which is generally already there on your system but just does not load/work
17:44<plaur>mangoduck: the drivers already exist in debian, b43 is part of the kernel, but it needs the firmware to work
17:44<tepozoa>you are working on adding the firmware
17:44<mangoduck>so, I don't need to download the proprietary driver from Broadcom?
17:44<mangoduck>where do I find the firmware?
17:45<tepozoa>I used a $5 cloud server, installed "b43fwcutter" (whatever it's name is) and ran it, then downloaded the files from the cloud server manually
17:45<plaur>simply copying the ucode11.fw or whatever they are called in /lib/firmware/b43 is normally enough - that's what the installer does, extracting the firmware files from the broadcom proprietary driver and writing them to the right directory
17:45<mangoduck>oh okay
17:45<mangoduck>so, I DO need the proprietary drivers, and then I need to use fwcutter to extract the firmware
17:46*tepozoa nods
17:46<tepozoa>and the tool in the repo will do that for you
17:46<plaur>that's the tarball, if you follow the instructions in the link i sent
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17:48<plaur>mangoduck: you could also tether you laptop to your smartphone as an access point, to run b43-firmware-installer
17:48<mangoduck>those instructions started with compiling fwcutter from source and that confused me
17:48<mangoduck>plus I can't wget from the macbook in question because it doesn't have internet access
17:48<plaur>probably easier than following the manual steps on a could server
17:48<mangoduck>I have fwcutter on this computer now
17:48<mangoduck>and I'm downloading the tarball
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17:49-!-mm666 is now known as markmental666
17:49<plaur>fwcutter is already in debian, you don't need the first part about compiling from source
17:50<mangoduck>command not found
17:50<mangoduck>that's fine, I'm doing it on this computer
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17:54<mangoduck>okay, so I used fwcutter to get a bunch of .fw files. I put those in /lib/firmware?
17:55<BastardOperatorFromHell>:( can I install/use old version without issues? E: Unable to locate package sshguard
17:57<@bremner>BastardOperatorFromHell: you could try !ssb
17:57<dpkg>First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>.
17:57<BastardOperatorFromHell>Let me check, ty
17:57<@bremner>sshguard is in testing and unstable
17:57<sney>since it's in bookworm it may get into bullseye-backports eventually
17:57<@bremner>yep. you can always write cc the maintainer to request
17:57<BastardOperatorFromHell>I had added backports in my apt sources
17:58-!-mode/#debian [+l 981] by debhelper
17:59<plaur>mangoduck: mine are in /lib/firmware/b43
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18:00<@bremner>BastardOperatorFromHell: the backport doesn't exist yet, so you could either request it, or make yourself, as outlined above
18:01<binaryhermit>hmm, does the default install have a sources.list that refers to "bullseye" or one that refers to "stable"
18:02<binaryhermit>(AFAIK, both would work the same way until bookworm comes out when option #2 would upgrade you to bookworm)
18:02<sney>"stable" in sources.list has been officially advised *against* since... etch?
18:02-!-user_ [] has quit [Quit: user_]
18:02<sney>!stable sources.list
18:02<dpkg>Despite the fact previous installers, countless websites and /usr/share/doc/apt/examples/sources.list (prior to apt 0.9.6) will tell you to do this, do *not* use "stable" in your sources.list; use the release code name instead (e.g. "bullseye"). Upgrading between releases has not been trivial for a decade; make sure you read the <release notes> and ask me about <buster->bullseye>, <jessie sources.list>.
18:03<binaryhermit>it should "work" but I understand (and agree with) why it'd be advised against
18:03<sney>right, it works until it's time for a surprise
18:05<mangoduck>okay, I copied the files to /lib/firmware, but still no wifi. The instructions say some stuff about the different drivers, then tell you how to switch drivers. I guessed I was supposed to do that, so I gave it a shot, but modprobe gives the error "FATAL: Module bcma is in use"
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18:05<binaryhermit>s/\'s time for a surprise/doesn't/
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18:05<binaryhermit>I had to reinstall for reasons, went with the bullseye image, and it says bullseye in sources.list
18:06<jochum>mangoduck: you need to have the right name for the files, then unload/load bcma
18:06<binaryhermit>err, on linode on a server that was previously the default buster image that as far as I can tell referred to "stable"
18:06<mangoduck>what name for what files?
18:06<binaryhermit>(this kinda spilled over from #debian-next for anyone who's confused)
18:06<mangoduck>why would I load bcma after unloading it? I thought I wanted to use b43
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18:07<jochum>mangoduck: ok, then b43 and by name i mean a firmware file doesn't get autodetected but the driver has a name for it.
18:08<jochum>mangoduck: I can dig it up or you can in manpages or kernel source
18:09<BastardOperatorFromHell>I see
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18:09<jochum>plaur: can you post "ls -lR /lib/firmware/b43"
18:10<mangoduck>jochum: I don't understand what I'm looking for
18:10<mangoduck>the name of one of the firmware files I put in /lib/firmware?
18:10<mangoduck>I have a list of them
18:10<mangoduck>what do I do with the name once I find it?
18:10<mangoduck>the only other step the instructions say is to use modprobe, but I can't use "modprobe -r" because it says the stuff is in use
18:11<jochum>mangoduck: never did that, I hope plaur is here and helps you.
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18:12<jochum>mangoduck: modprobe -r b43 gives bcma in use?
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18:13<mangoduck>I rebooted and tried again. I was able to run "modprobe -r b43 bcma", "modprobe -r brcmsmac bcma" and "modprobe -r wl"
18:13<mangoduck>then I ran "modprobe b43" but nothing happened
18:13<jochum>mangoduck: go look at the syslog it often tells which firmware is missing
18:13<jochum>or dmesg
18:14<plaur>mangoduck: dmesg will normally tell you if the firmware is recognized
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18:16<mangoduck>I see a few "FOUND UNSUPPORTED PHY (Analog 12, Type 11(AC), Revision 1)
18:16<plaur>something like this should appear if you search for b43... b43 ssb0:0: firmware: direct-loading firmware b43/ucode11.fw
18:16<mangoduck>probe of bcma0:1 failed with error -95
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18:16<plaur>maybe you have a newer chip than what b43 supports
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18:17<mangoduck>I did "dmesg | grep firmware" but nothing related came up
18:18<mangoduck>so, are newer macbooks just incapable of wifi?
18:18<sney>broadcom-sta-dkms might be ok
18:18<mangoduck>sney: thank you, but I don't know what that means
18:18<plaur>mangoduck: see here for supported pci ids
18:19<sney>Apple never meant anyone to run anything other than OSX on their hardware, of course. any linux compatibility is by accident.
18:19<plaur>mangoduck: broadcom-sta-dkms is the proprietary driver
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18:19<jochum>so just apt install it and fine?
18:20<mangoduck>unsupported. it says "wl" is an alternative.
18:20<sney>since it's dkms it also requires a toolchain.
18:20<mangoduck>what's that mean?
18:20<sney>wl is what you get from broadcom-sta-dkms
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18:20<sney>wl is the driver, broadcom.. is what the package is called
18:20<plaur>sney: they support windows, providing drivers for the touchpad and other tgings (that used to be called bootcamp). linux is another story - but i'm glad debian works on my old mac mini
18:21<mangoduck>so, I tried all the modprobe -r again, then did "modprobe wl" but it says module wl not found
18:21<plaur>mangoduck: it means you have to install a large amount of compilers, libs and headers needed to compile the kernel support
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18:22<sney>if you have a debian dvd-1 iso, the compilers/headers will be on that, then you just need a couple of extra packages from p.d.o
18:23<mangoduck>why would a live dvd have compilers/headers that the installed OS doesn't have?
18:23<mrjpaxton[m]>Hey everyone, I'm using Debian 11 stable, trying out the Bluetooth again. It works a lot better now, but I've been getting some occasional errors line-by-line with my mouse, that read "profiles/input/hog-lib.c:report_value_cb() bt_uhid_send: Invalid argument (22)". It causes my mouse to stop working for a few seconds before starting up again. Any ideas about this? The bluetooth is Atheros AR9462+Atheros AR3012 Bluetooth, using the
18:23<mrjpaxton[m]>`firmware-atheros` proprietary drivers/firmware.
18:24<sney>mangoduck: because not every package is installed on every system. the dvd images contain packages that you could otherwise install through apt-get if you had an internet connection
18:24<plaur>mangoduck: sney pobably meant the first install dvd, not the live one
18:24<sney>and yeah I didn't say live
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18:25<mangoduck>ok, I'm confused
18:25<mangoduck>I'm supposed to mount the dvd iso, and get the packages off of that?
18:26<mangoduck>why can't I just download the packages?
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18:26<mangoduck>it seems like it would be a lot of manual work either way
18:26<sney>I thought you don't have an internet connection?
18:26<jochum>mangoduck: you have LAN access?
18:26<sney>the dvd iso can be configured as an apt source
18:26<mangoduck>sney: oh, I didn't know that
18:26<mangoduck>no, not internet
18:26<mangoduck>not on the machine
18:27<plaur>mangoduck: apt will do that for you if you installed tom the *installation* dvd. but as i said, spending 7EUR will get you a fully supported asus n1580 nano stick, probably a better use of your time
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18:28<user01>is there a way to kill a chromium tab from the command line?
18:29<mangoduck>I'm disabled and have like no money. Plus, I don't see why I should have to pay for a wireless adapter when my laptop has one already. I can't be the first person in the world to do this. I don't understand why I need to do all this compiling and stuff. Why can't someone just upload the already compiled drivers somewhere?
18:29<sney>license problems, and they need to be abi compatible with the running kernel so that's a lot of already compiled drivers
18:30<user01>one tab seems to have frozen chromium and i have data in the other tabs
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18:30<decoder>anyone here who uses vivaldi browser as their default?
18:30<dpkg>"Does anyone have X or use Y?" is taking a poll, not asking a good question that IRC helpers can answer. Don't do it or sussudio's army of militant badgers will hurt you. Also see <ask> and <bad polls>.
18:30<dvs>mangoduck: you unfortunately have one of the worst supported WiFi adaptors for Linux
18:30<plaur>mangoduck: sorry about that, i thought 7EUR is no big deal for anyone. perhaps you could borrow a USB wifi stick from a fiend. or a USB ethernet adapter
18:30<sney>anyway: use apt-cdrom to add the dvd to your sources.list, then 'apt install build-essential', then get broadcom-sta-dkms from packages via your usb stick or whatever, then install broadcom-sta-dkms from the command line.
18:30<sney>and it'll probably just go.
18:31<mangoduck>sney: thank you! that's just what I needed to know
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18:31<sney>oh, and linux-headers-amd64 too (from the dvd)
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18:32*jochum learned from sney
18:32<user01>it is frozen just saying waiting for . . .
18:32<user01> . . .
18:33<user01>and i cant switch tabs
18:33<sney>user01: iirc chromium does have some command line switches, maybe look through 'chromium --help' and see if it has any subcommands etc for killing a specific tab
18:33<sney>otherwise you might just have to nuke the whole browser process
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18:35<blast007>user01: can you bring up the Chromium task manager with Shift+Esc?
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18:36<user01>blast007, yes
18:36<jim>hi, I'm trying to find the hexchat plugins dir, where the python/ should be if the hexchat-python3 package is installed
18:37<jim>oops, lemme check something
18:37<user01>blast007, oh wait . . . no
18:37<sney>on debian that's /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/hexchat/plugins/
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18:37<user01>blast007, i had opened chrome to google
18:38<user01>blast007, control panel in chromium not popping up
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18:40<jim>sney, do you also know where the file python/ is?
18:41<sney>jim: hexchat's python plugin is .py scripts for hexchat would be in ~/.config/hexchat/addons
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18:43<jim>sney, ok, I looked in that dir, and python/ (needed for the plugin) is not in that dir
18:43<sney>where did you get the idea that "python/" is needed for the hexchat python plugin?
18:44<jim>sney, from this (among other things):
18:45<jim>I'm just looking for where debian puts that
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18:45<user01>i saw something that wmctrl -c "page title" might do it
18:45<user01>but i cant see page title
18:45<jim>it doesn't look to be in the hexchat-python3 package
18:46<user01>oh i know i could go to it in another browser -- assuming that one doesnt freeze too
18:46<sney>that's a source file, it must be compiled into the .so
18:46<jim>I'm just looking for where debian puts that. which dir and which package
18:48<sney>I stopped being the hexchat maintainer before the cffi or meson changes, so this took a second, but here:
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18:49<user01>oh nope it said not running :)
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18:49<sney>jim: in this file, and hexchat-plugin.h are used as the input for the script to create python.c, which is then compiled into the plugin
18:50<nickeroo>Hi guys. What software would you recommend to me to control Wi-Fi connections with on Debian (connect, disconnect, etc)?
18:50<sney>jim: this is common for hexchat where text changes become part of the distributed binary, not a text file on disk.
18:50<sney>nickeroo: network-manager? connman?
18:50<nickeroo>I'm on a fresh install. And I had to manually get my Wi-Fi working. But I do not want to go through that process again for when I'm in public. So is there anything that simplifies that?
18:51<nickeroo>Which one is more suitable in your opinion?
18:51<sney>they're both fine. which desktop environment are you using?
18:51<Sqrt{not}>mangoduck, I'm way behind in the scrollback, but it looks like you put your firmwares in directory /lib/firmware/ but it really should go in a subdirectory: /lib/firmware//b43/
18:51<nickeroo>sney: none. just i3
18:51<sney>Sqrt{not}: I think they determined that the nic is too new for b43
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18:52<sney>nickeroo: ok, try connman-ui
18:52<nickeroo>Thanks for the recommendation!
18:52<nickeroo>It should be simple to use right?
18:53<sney>yes, it'll have the same functions as any reasonable wifi widget
18:53<nickeroo>Sounds good :)
18:53<user01>d'oh it finally said not responding and it killed
18:53<user01>bye bye data
18:54<jim>sney, I'm looking at that patch, and I'm seeing that it may have already been applied... if not, and I find the file, and the patch is -not- applied, and I make the (one-char) change, would I have to "compile" something in order for the change to take effect?
18:54<somiaj>nickeroo: I personally use wpa_gui and have wpa_supplicant in roam mode
18:54<sney>jim: yes.
18:55<sney>jim: you can see the state of hexchat in debian here,
18:55<jim>so the file is where, in the hexchat source package? (and -not- in any installed binary package)
18:55<nickeroo>somiaj: Should it come already installed or?
18:56<sney>right, it's in the source, and it gets compiled into during the package build process
18:56<nickeroo>I have wpa_passphrase , wpa_action , wpa_cli , wpa_supplicant already. But no wpa_gui
18:57<jim>I just want to see line 201 of that file, and if it's got a 1 instead of 0, would be useful to know what version of that package
18:57<sney>ok, so click the salsa link I just shared, and find the file ??
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18:57<jim>oh, salsa is debian's "github/lab"?
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18:58<sney>amazing the things you can find out if you click links
18:58<Sqrt{not}>sney, OK, it just looked to me like the FW was installed in wrong place, and they wouldn't run dmesg | grep firmware to see what it really wants
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19:07<jim>sney, there's no in that... I even tried find file
19:08<sney>jim: huh, weird, it's in the changelog. and the patch must have been applied because we wouldn't be able to build with python 3.9 othwerwise. (python 3 plugin works fine here on bullseye)
19:09<jim>sney, any idea when it was applied?
19:09<sney>jim: here you go, for the bullseye package
19:09<jim>wrt release of bullseye
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19:10<sney>the python3 cffi changes were 2.14.3-4, which was in....
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19:10<jim>sney, ok, found the patched line
19:10<jim>so wayyy before release?
19:11<jim>ok, thanks...
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19:11<jim>I may be back, beware and quake in your boots!
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19:50<Typhome>Installed mailutils and sendmail but "echo hello | mail -s test" does not seem to send any email, GMail is empty
19:50<Typhome>on Debian 11 (bullseye)
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19:52<sney>gmail's spam filter often nukes messages from sendmail tests. look in your /var/log/mail.log to see if it sent correctly, and check gmail's spam folder
19:54<Typhome>Aug 22 01:50:33 Debian-1100-bullseye-amd64-base sm-mta[33601]: 17LNoXtC033599: 17LNoXtC033601: DSN: Service unavailable
19:56<sney>(also, if you didn't *need* sendmail-brand-sendmail, postfix is more modern and easier to configure/debug, while accomplishing the same tasks.)
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20:25<jhutchins>Typhome: I think any mailer you install is going to require configuration before yuu cn send mail.
20:26<jhutchins>Typhome: I would also test step-by-step instead of trying a one-line command.
20:28<Typhome>sney guess was right, Google Mail rejected any emails
20:28<Typhome>550-5.7.1 [2a01:4f9:3a:27ed::2] Our system has detected that this message does 550-5.7.1 not meet IPv6 sending guidelines regarding PTR records and 550-5.7.1 authentication. Please review 550-5.7.1 for more information 550 5.7.1 . b8si4181629ljo.67 - gsmtp
20:28*sney used to run a production mail server
20:28<sney>been around this barn a _few_ times
20:29<@bremner>Typhome: you might want to get the basics working with a less hostile smtp recipient
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20:38<insufficient-entropy>In Kmail seeing sent messages flagged as "unread" since upgrade to Bulls Eye on one machine. I know there was an Akonadi issue, but it has since been fsck and vacuumed. Anyone have any idea where to go next?
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20:46<is>Hello! The<distribution>/<package name> URL format breaks with bookworm, since bookworm exists as a package in sid.
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20:47<is>The URL format itself is not broken, the server (wrongly) assumes that I am specifying two packages on URL
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20:48<sney>is: wow, that's impressive. the best place to report this is the email address listed below your error message
20:48<sney>#debian-www has some of the same people too
20:48<is>Will do. Just joined the channel, thanks.
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20:52<argentwolf>Could someone 'gently' direct me to where I might acquire instructions on how to add search to thunar?
20:54<insufficient-entropy>Hmm, I cleared out all the old (and weird) messages in the Trash folder using "expire" and the akonadi fsck stopped reporting the unreferenced files, which it claimed to have moved to "lost+found" but never did.... hmm
20:55<insufficient-entropy>That seems to have sorted the issue. I fear corrupting influence of spam (as the unreferenced files were spam messages mostly).
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21:55<jim>hi... ok, the final thing about hexchat in bullseye, is there's a weird bug, when a hexchat user inputs a single word, the word array (at least in the interface to python scripts has an empty list {repr is [])
21:56<dpkg>reportbug is used to submit bugs to the Debian <BTS>. Install reportbug, then run reportbug. See for some general information about using reportbug and/or for <debian-installer> bug reporting. Also ask me about <report-bugs>., or <reportbug MTA>
21:56<jim>when I run the hexchat on head, it works fine
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23:19<mangoduck>hey, it's me again. if anyone is curious, the solution was 1) use dpkg to manually install the broadcom-sta-dkms package, and 2) use modprobe to disable the other drivers and enable wl
23:20<mangoduck>I have a new problem, tho. there's only like one repository in my sources.list.
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23:20<mangoduck>I just did a fresh install, and as soon as it was finished, I checked the sources.list and all there is is bullseye-security
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23:21<mangoduck>any idea why that is? I'm thinking that because I didn't have wifi during the install, and I couldn't setup a mirror during the install, that it just didn't put the repos in the sources.list
23:21<maher>i just upgraded to bullseye - I don't have a /usr/bin/python - should I just make this a symlink to /usr/bin/python3? or will Bad Things happen?
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23:23<raven523>maher: install python-is-python3
23:24<sney>mangoduck: correct, when the installer can't find a network it doesn't set up internet sources.
23:24<sney>!bullseye sources.list
23:24<dpkg>A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Bullseye" has three lines: "deb bullseye main" "deb bullseye-security main" "deb bullseye-updates main". See <deb-src> <contrib> <non-free> <bullseye-updates> and `man sources.list`.
23:24<maher>raven523: thanks
23:25<mangoduck>sney: awesome, thanks again!
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23:25<sney>also if you needed to disable the other b43 drivers with modprobe, you will probably want to do that permanently with blacklists
23:25<mangoduck>I saw something about that while I was googling around. Thank you, I'll look into that.
23:26<sney>you can do that by creating a text file in /etc/modprobe.d/ like b43-blacklist.conf, and each line is 'blacklist' followed by the name of the module you want to prevent loading
23:26<sney>make sure to regenerate your initramfs afterwards.
23:26<mangoduck>oh, that saves me some time, thanks
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23:36<mangoduck>sney: when I run modprobe to unload drivers, I use "modprobe -r b43 bcma". I'm not sure what the "bcma" part is. Do I need to put that in the blacklist file? or will just "blacklist b43" suffice?
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23:44<mangoduck>oh, apparently bcma is another driver. I'm guessing the "modprobe -r" was doing two at a time, so I'm blacklisting b43, brcmsmac, and bcma
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---Logclosed Sun Aug 22 00:00:05 2021