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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-08-24

---Logopened Tue Aug 24 00:00:08 2021
00:00<Sqrt{not}>try to remember what else you were doing in that last successful graphical login.
00:01<AndroUser>This was an upgrade, and I did a full backup with Time Machine before I upgraded.
00:01<Sqrt{not}>what did you do before the color change.
00:01<Sqrt{not}>OK, can you step back to that working version, and the re-upgrade?
00:01<Sqrt{not}>and *then* re-upgrade
00:02<AndroUser>I ran update, upgrade, autoclean, fix broken packages, full dustribution upgrade, and every thungnlooked goidh
00:02<AndroUser>Good.
00:02<Sqrt{not}>and did it work for a while after that?
00:03<Sqrt{not}>were you upgrading from buster to bullseye? did you look at the release notes? did you also do apt dist-upgrade?
00:03-!-chuangzhu [~chuangzhu@0002c2e8.user.oftc.net] has joined #debian
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00:06<AndroUser>I then went to start, settings, desktop, and selected two options fir changing the background color. The default was only a dark option so I selected light blue, went to the browser, and everything waa frozen.
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00:06-!-seeS_ is "Craig" on #debian
00:08<AndroUser>Sqt: i did distribution upgrade yesterday. Initially it hung when reading change logs, and would not finish the upgrade. Today I ran the fix broken packages command, and everything seemed to be ok.
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00:09<AndroUser>I ran update, and upgrade before running full-upgrade.
00:09<AndroUser>dist-upgrade
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00:11<AndroUser>I would like to grab my documents folder just in case something went wrong with Time Machine.
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00:12<Sqrt{not}>AndroUser, that should be possible. in your text terminal, can you see that directory?
00:14<AndroUser>Nothing shows up with the ls cimmand
00:15<Sqrt{not}>what is your current working directory?
00:15<AndroUser>I can not see it.
00:15<Sqrt{not}>type: pwd
00:15<AndroUser>Im in root
00:15<Sqrt{not}>what ls command did you give?
00:17<AndroUser>Tried difderent ones: ls, ls -d, ls -l
00:18<Sqrt{not}>try this: ls -al /home/AndroUser/ (or whatever is your username there)
00:18<jm_>or simply ls «/home/*/»
00:18<AndroUser>Im on my cell ohone because I cant use my laptop where Bullseye is installed.
00:19<jm_>apparently too early for me, move « where appropriate
00:19<Sqrt{not}>I thought you were logged in to a text terminal on the laptop? no?
00:19<AndroUser>Now it shows up.
00:20<AndroUser>Ni, In talking to you fr AndriIRC app..
00:20<Sqrt{not}>and the cell phone is logged in as root on the laptop?
00:21<AndroUser>No
00:21<AndroUser>The root privilege is for my laptop only.
00:21<Sqrt{not}>OK, I'm confused. but you are logged in somehow to a root that can see your home directory? is that correct at least?
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00:23<Sqrt{not}>what did you mean when you wrote: [21:19:30] <AndroUser> Now it shows up.
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00:24<AndroUser>Im now in the user directory pdq, and can see the /Documents folder on my laptop.
00:24<Sqrt{not}>OK, good. so do you know how to copy that to someplace safe for your backup?
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00:25<AndroUser>After entering yiur suggested command ls /home/*/
00:26<AndroUser>I just plugged in a usb , but not sure if it is empty
00:27<Sqrt{not}>type the command: df
00:27<AndroUser>Device has two partitions
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00:29<AndroUser>There is something in there, but I dont know what it is. Its either firmware, or another install disk.
00:30<AndroUser>Yes, two partitions
00:30<AndroUser>Sda1, and sda2
00:30<Sqrt{not}>sda is probably the laptop's own disk, unless you know otherwise
00:31<crawler>lsblk
00:32<AndroUser>No, the laptop's disk is nvme01, and has six pattitions on it. I already ran lsblk
00:33<Sqrt{not}>OK good. the df command should have told you how much free space is on those sda partitions, right?
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00:34<Sqrt{not}>I'm off to naptime in a few minutes. did the df command also show you where those sda partitions are mounted?
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00:35<Sqrt{not}>AndroUser, I don't know why talking with you is so slooooow, but I am out of time. other people here may try to help you.
00:35<AndroUser>Sda1 has 100% use. Sda2 has a udev file system on it.
00:36<Sqrt{not}>that does not sound like a very good candidate for saving your backup then
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00:36<Sqrt{not}>I'm away, no more time. good luck
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00:38<AndroUser>Let me look for another disk tomorrow. I dont want to put the backup on the same disk as the Time Machine backup. Its getting late, and I need sleep.
00:38<AndroUser>Thanks for your help.
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02:21<Guest5227>Is Debian Buster still be supported with security update ?
02:21<bittin>yes
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02:21<bittin>until summer next year, and then there is LTS support for 2 years more
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02:24<Guest5227>so it's safe to use now ? As i understand security support will be provided by different volunteers group ? So maybe it will be not so fast as support from "main" group ?
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02:33<stanlog>hello
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02:34<bittin>hi
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02:44<MarkTevanian>hi everyone, I would like to know if you guys can recommend a vpn set up for debian
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02:47<mangix>MarkTevanian: WireGuard
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02:50<MarkTevanian>thnx a lot @mangix
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04:16<RoyK>,v websockify
04:16<judd>Package: websockify on amd64 -- stretch: 0.8.0+dfsg1-7+deb9u1; buster: 0.8.0+dfsg1-10; bookworm: 0.9.0+dfsg1-3; bullseye: 0.9.0+dfsg1-3; sid: 0.9.0+dfsg1-3
04:16<RoyK>,v novnc
04:16<judd>Package: novnc on amd64 -- stretch: 1:0.4+dfsg+1+20131010+gitf68af8af3d-6; buster: 1:1.0.0-1; bookworm: 1:1.0.0-3; bullseye: 1:1.0.0-3; sid: 1:1.0.0-3
04:17<RoyK>danke, judd ;)
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04:40<scorpion2185[m]>Sqrt{not}: wise choice I have 95% to /root
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04:55*vv221 no longer uses partitioning…
04:56<vv221>Everything on /, and when a path starts to get really big I plug a new disk and set a new mount point.
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05:29<jim>vv221, if you did that with lvm, you can take the storage space offered by a new drive, and add it to the / "partition"
05:29<jim>you wouldn't need mount points
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05:30<vv221>I feel much more comfortable with regular mountpoint, without the extra layer of LVM ;)
05:31<vv221>I dropped the use of partitions (the filesystem is at the disk level, with no partition table) to make my setup simpler, using LVM would got the other way.
05:31<vv221>*would go
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05:49<EmleyMoor>I like to have multiple filesystems just to help keep stuff from overflowing
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05:57<debacle>A friend is looking for a "lexware" alternative on Debian. It seems, that there is nothing, neither free nor proprietary. Nor would lexware run well under wine. Or do people here have better experience? If not, which is the "VM of the day" for running Windows on Debian (here: Gnome)? qemu?
05:58<selckin>never heared of it, what do you want to do
05:58<jim>what's lexware?
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06:02<cpaelzer>it is a proprietary software to manage the finance of small/medium business
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06:03<cpaelzer>but they ahve more than one product, debacle which one in particular are you looking for?
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06:04<debacle>cpaelzer I would need to ask them. They only said "lexware". It's about a small company, not even medium ;-)
06:05<cpaelzer>this is a decade old, maybe you can check which of the projects survived until today https://www.linux-magazin.de/ausgaben/2011/04/fibu-und-erp/2/
06:06<cpaelzer>Sorry - since lexware is rather german centric I was bluntly assuming you can read that - I hope is true as I couldn't find the same article in english
06:07<debacle>cpaelzer Perfect for me! Thnx!
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07:01<bittin>https://debconf21.debconf.org/schedule/venue/1/ Debconf Online 2021 is on
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07:16<jochum>thanks
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07:24<jochum>DasKeyboard beeing Sponsor of DebConf is so lovely, I have one of theier Products.
07:25<bittin>jochum, same here a lovely Das Keyboard 3
07:25<bittin>or Das Keyboard S or Das Keyboard classic or whatever its called now
07:25<bittin>with nice blue cherry <3
07:25<bittin>bought it as a present for my 26-27th birthday and used it for 4-5 years
07:26<bittin>so also got happy surprised when i saw them :)
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07:30<jochum>bittin: I wrote them an E-Mail right away :)
07:30<jochum>I have a newer Brown Switches one.
07:31<jochum>I wrote them, that I now will type Faster and Saner as I've seen this. ;P
07:31<bittin>heh :D
07:32<bittin>well as its a regular USB keyboard it works with both GNU/Linux, BSD, MacOS and Windows i would expect, but nice to see the keyboard company i use sponsoring the Debian conference
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07:34<tjcarter>jochum: DasKeyboard are Topre switches aren't they? (circular stems)
07:34<jochum>tjcarter: MX switches, the rest I don't know, sorry.
07:34<bittin>Cherry
07:34<tjcarter>Cherry MX, okay.
07:35<tjcarter>Ah, Happy Hacking was Topre.
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07:37<tjcarter>I've been liking Kaihua Kailh BOX switches but … they're not as robust as I'd have liked. I've beaten them into ghosting and replaced them once each. I like the click bar better than Cherry's click sleeve, but ghosting is a problem.
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07:38<jochum>Anyone in here able to paste the DasKeyboard Logo into a Tux belly? I'd like to a/some social media posts..... :)
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07:39<bittin>my keyboard has windows keys :( need to get stickers
07:39<bittin>:D
07:39<jochum>haha, mine has The logo of the keyboard :)
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07:39<bittin>mine is so old from before they did that :[
07:40<bittin>should email and ask if they can give me stickers :D
07:40<jochum>tjcarter: ghosting is no problem here at all, what about your's bittin?
07:40<bittin>nope
07:40<bittin>been working fine for several years
07:41<bittin>even bought a key cap puller to clean it sometimes
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07:45<jochum>They have a destroy our Homepage button, space invaders a like :)
07:46<ens>o/ all. getting ready for first debconf talk now.
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08:06<alexia>Good morning. Could someone help me please? I have installed Debian 11 last night, but I cannot seem to get the wifi usb stick working.
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08:10<debacle>cpaelzer It looks like most of the stuff of 2011 is dead now, but Gnucash is alive and kicking. At least that's my impression from outside. It even supports SKR03, SKR04, and SKR49 ("Standardkostenrahmen" for the sake of famous German bureaucralingo). Glad to hear, if Gnucash (esp. on Debian 10/11) is good or bad experience. I'll pass the information to my friend.
08:12<blast007>alexia: depending on the WiFi chip, you may need to install non-free firmware. check the output of 'sudo dmesg | grep -i firmware' to see if you get any hints about what is missing.
08:12<blast007>!non-free sources
08:12<dpkg>Edit /etc/apt/sources.list, ensure that the two main Debian mirror lines end with "main contrib non-free" rather than just "main", then «apt-get update». But bear in mind that you'll be installing <non-free> software. These may have onerous terms; check the licenses. See also <sources.list>.
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08:16<alexia>thanks @blast007 this is what it says
08:16<alexia>https://hastebin.com/wuvonuqivo.less
08:16<alexia>when I do that cmd
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08:36<marc>Hi, I'm installing debian 11 on a 10 GB drive. I used LVM on whole drive, with / and /home separated. I choose lxqt as DE. But the install failed at the step `choose and install softwares` (no reason given). After investigation in console I can see that there's no space left on / (3,3/3,3 GB used)... While there is a comfortable 4,6 GB available on /home.
08:36<marc>What should I do now ?
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08:41<qman>start over - boot back into the debian installer and repartition the disk with a larger / this time
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08:44<amacater>If you don't need to separate the FS, don't. Just let LVM deal with the whole thing.
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08:44<marc>qman, that's what I feared ^^ I'm redoing the previous steps right now, with everything in /.
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08:45<depesz>marc: for starters, especially given size of the disk, I wouldn't partition at all.
08:45<marc>amacater, yes, simpler that way.
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08:45<marc>thanks everyone
08:46<amacater>If this is a VM, 10G is probably fine for light use: if this is a machine where you anticipate heavy use and long term usage/data storage, you might want to get more "disk" somehow: 10G with a GUI and desktop environment might be a bit tight in a few months.
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08:51<marc>It's a VM and light usage, so I should be good, thanks.
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08:57<tepozoa>tjcarter: if you try that nvme.shutdown_timeout=8 and it works for you, holler back at me? curious about that, before you brought this up I didn't even know NVMe had a shutdown process like this. yesterday-I-learned
08:58<tepozoa>it appears there's an "abrupt shutdown" in the spec, but the Linux kernel doesn't support it yet? (or so the googletubes say)
08:59<tepozoa>offtopic: I've been using a searx instance for a month or two now and it seems to work very well for linux oriented problem searching. $0.02 https://searx.space/ for some instances
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09:28<tjcarter>tepozoa: will do, it's in my grub.cfg but I'll need a couple reboots to try it out. I'll have an idea in a day or two.
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09:34<Hydr0p0nX>I have a Rock Pi X (x86 SBC) that I had to pull a couple of firmware files not in the non-free repos, most of what was needed is included in the firmware-brcm80211 package. brcm/brcmfmac43455-sdio.Radxa-ROCK Pi X.txt and brcm/BCM4345C0.hcd were the exceptions, is there a ticket or something I can open to get these files added?
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09:34<erentar>is it possible to install the ubuntu prime proprietary driver on debian
09:35<erentar>*for nvidia
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09:35<nickme>with buster i had autocomplete for command options on bash and also when adb was running for paths of the devices, now after bullseye installation it is gone. can i have it back please? :)
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09:37<Tenkawa>nickme: bash-completion - programmable completion for the bash shell
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09:37<Tenkawa>you "should" be able to re-install/reconfigure that package
09:38-!-mode/#debian [+l 1003] by debhelper
09:39<Tenkawa>hmm but I don't have it installed so you shouldnt need it
09:39<nickme>Tenkawa: nice! thanks a lot! ;)
09:39<Tenkawa>I just tested autocompletes...
09:40<Tenkawa>I have seen it though be very inconsistent on my 8 systems which ones do it
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09:42<Tenkawa>also make sure it didnt switch bash back to dash
09:43<Tenkawa>ls -l /bin/bash and make sure thats not dash
09:43<Tenkawa>dash doesnt have autocomplete to my knowledge
09:44<Tenkawa>(testing now)
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09:46<Tenkawa>at least here no it does not.. it just tabs
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09:51<tepozoa>who does that
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09:52<Tenkawa>tepozoa: who does what exactly?
09:52<jelly>/bin/bash will never be dash, but /bin/sh might
09:52<Tenkawa>right.. but the default shell was dash.. not bash
09:53<Tenkawa>bash wasn't being installed by default unless you told it to
09:53<Tenkawa>it was installing dash
09:53<jelly>that does not sound like Debian
09:54<Tenkawa>(which I never understood.. I hate dash)
09:55<Tenkawa>depends on the type of install apparently
09:56<Tenkawa>non ui accounts are dash… bash for login accounts
09:57<Tenkawa>server seems to create them with non-ui settings.. semi makes annoying sense
09:58<jelly>I have no idea what you mean by non-ui settings there. adduser --system ?
09:59<jelly>a naive adduser --system blah does this on my buster: blah:x:171:65534::/home/blah:/usr/sbin/nologin
09:59<jelly>not dash.
09:59<Tenkawa>just a sec.. let me debootstrap one and it will show you a better illustration
09:59<jelly>care to show the full deboostrap command line?
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10:00<Tenkawa>once I see if it works,, you will just have to be patient
10:01<Tenkawa>jelly: you didnt see my msg over on libera
10:01<Tenkawa>thats definitely you though
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10:02<jelly>yeah it's me
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10:02<jelly>but the client I use makes it harder to look at channels from different irc networks easily
10:03<Tenkawa>heheh
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10:03<Tenkawa>small world
10:03<jelly>(so I'm usually just on libera... only here to fix the /topic)
10:03-!-mode/#debian [+o jelly] by ChanServ
10:03<Tenkawa>ok the fs is almost done
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10:04<Tenkawa>I want to see if it changes behaviour between bullseye and buster too
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10:07<tepozoa>Tenkawa: sorry that was a common idiom in the US, more urban dictionary less literal question
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10:08<Tenkawa>tepozoa: I threw out the urban dictionary 35 years ago
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10:09<Tenkawa>got me in too much trouble
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10:10-!-jelly changed the topic of #debian to: Debian 11.0 "bullseye" /msg dpkg bullseye | oldstable, Debian 10 "buster" /msg dpkg buster | Stretch (Debian 9) on limited LTS support: /msg dpkg stretch-lts | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing/unstable: #debian-next | chanlogs: /msg dpkg irclog | Community expectations: http://deb.li/conduct
10:10-!-mode/#debian [-o jelly] by ChanServ
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10:13<Tenkawa>jelly:
10:13<Tenkawa>~/bullseye# ls -l bin/sh
10:13<Tenkawa>lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 4 Aug 24 10:10 bin/sh -> dash
10:13<themill>Tenkawa: that's bin/sh not bin/bash you're looking at
10:13<Tenkawa>I know that
10:14<jelly>Tenkawa, that's fine. But /bin/bash should be a regular file
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10:14<Tenkawa>it is… but some processes get "started".. with /bin/sh and some uids get setup as /bin/dash
10:15<jelly>and having dash as sh gave significant boot speedups... around lenny :-D
10:15<Tenkawa>they are a lighter account
10:15<Tenkawa>either way it still doesn't explain why completion broke for him
10:15<jelly>I have literally 0 account with /bin/dash as login shell on any of my ansible-reachable 200 Debian systems, many upgraded in-place
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10:17<Tenkawa>I didn't say "you" would.. I said some people do. Please stop putting words in my mouth
10:17<themill>[23:43] <Tenkawa> ls -l /bin/bash and make sure thats not dash
10:17<themill>↑ that's never a thing
10:18<jelly>I mean, if "some people" do, I'm pretty sure they made that deliberately, and it wasn't Debian that made that choice for them
10:18<Tenkawa>themill: untill debian 7 actually it was
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10:18<themill>um, no.
10:18<Tenkawa>bash was optional
10:18<themill>no
10:19<jelly>bash has had Essential: yes for... uh, I can't say forever since I don't remember before etch.
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10:20<jelly>it's more likely to have /bin/sh as login shell, and that to be dash
10:20<Tenkawa>Its been too long but there "was" a version that it could be switched out and not be the primary
10:20<tjcarter>Bash was Essential: yes in bo, I think.
10:20<jelly>and old Debian releases used /bin/sh as login shell for many service accounts
10:21<themill>judd, bug #103284
10:21<judd>Bug https://bugs.debian.org/103284 in bash (open): «Bash marked as Essential: yes.»; severity: wishlist; opened: 2001-07-03; last modified: 2014-10-14.
10:21<Tenkawa>and to my knowledge dash wasn't even a thought yet
10:22<tjcarter>in 2001, ash was barely a thought in Debian.
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10:23<themill>bash was Essential yes back in 2001 "for ages"
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10:24<jelly>working at uni, we tested dash as /bin/sh in etch and lenny and I _think_ we shipped custom lenny installers with that before Debian actualized that change.
10:24<Ruhangiz>Hey dear people, anyone knows why network-manager-openconnect has no installation candidate?
10:24<tjcarter>tepozoa: Going to attempt a couple of reboots
10:24<jelly>I still try crazy shells as /bin/sh from time to time. mksh is very nice.
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10:25<jelly>now that there are not so many remaining init scripts in play, it doesn't even matter a whole lot
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10:31<Sqrt{not}>Hydr0p0nX, some info and links about broadcom firmwares at https://wiki.debian.org/bcm43xx Note broadcom license terms prevent lots of its firmware from being offered by debian.
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10:32<tjcarter>tepozoa: I did get email about unsafe shutdowns after the first reboot, but … none after.
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10:33<Sqrt{not}>Ruhangiz, which debian release ? what did you do to get that message?
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10:36<tjcarter>tepozoa: I rebooted 4 times to see if it was consistent. It was, no more errors.
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10:38<tjcarter>tepozoa: I think the argument needs to be nvme-core.safe-shutdown=8 though
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10:41<tepozoa>sure, ding dong ditch me! (j/k)
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10:42<tepozoa>is there a ", tell foo ...." bot in this channel to play a message to someone on rejoin?
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10:47<jelly>dpkg, later tell jelly blah
10:47<dpkg>See you later tell jelly blah!
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10:47<tepozoa>dpkg: tell tjcarter I think it's nvme_core.foo, looked at an unrelated thing we do in that same module and it's nvme_core.multipath=N in format
10:47<jelly>probably not
10:47<tjcarter>tepozoa: it was
10:47<tepozoa>I did a help to dpkg and it was listed (tell), oh well :)
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10:51<tjcarter>For anyone having the unsafe shutdown thing … this fixed it for me. https://termbin.com/3gue
10:51<tjcarter>Just drop that in place and # update-grub
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10:53<tjcarter>Before I faceplant the keyboard, have a good $DAYTIME everyone
10:53<tepozoa>nice
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11:09<Hydr0p0nX>Sqrt{not}, I've got it working now, there are just the two files missing and sym link
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11:11<Hydr0p0nX>Sqrt{not}, firmware-brcm80211 had everything else, although I'm not sure it's really the right repo since (I think) BCM4345C0.hcd is a bluetooth driver
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12:08<bremner>I need to sync usernames + uids between two hosts for < 20 accounts. What's the simplest solution other than hand scripting it?
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12:10<mason>NIS
12:10<mason>(You didn't specify the most reasonable solution, just the simplest.)
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12:11<mason>Also insufficient context, as what you ought to do will be heavily influenced by this being a one-time operation or something that needs to recur.
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12:13<bremner>it's an ongoing operation
12:14<mason>bremner: The "correct" answer would be feeding both systems from Ansible or similar. Failing that you're going to end up programming a subset of that, although that might be more reasonable. Last time I did something like that, I reached out from a server and verified the existence of accounts across however many hosts needed to participate.
12:14<mason>A directory of any sort would probably be too heavyweight, unless it's NIS which I only mentioned as a joke.
12:16<bremner>Yeah, I already have them under configuration management, just wondering if there is a better way for this specific task
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12:24<mason>A central directory is the best way, but the most infrastructure, and it might not be worth it depending on context.
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12:28<Sqrt{not}>I condensed tjcarter's excellent /etc/default/grub.d example into a dpkg factoid: <nvme unsafe shutdown>
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13:14<hendursaga>mason: NIS being..?
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13:16<mason>hendursaga: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_Information_Service
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13:16<mason>hendursaga: It's generally unsuitable nowadays because it lacks any notion of privacy or encryption in its transactions.
13:16<sney>classic unix stuff
13:16<mason>That said, it's also simple to set up.
13:17<jhutchins>mason: I think the latest version addresses some of those concerns, but it's been largely overrun by LDAP and integration with AD.
13:18<mason>jhutchins: NIS+ is different enough to be considered a whole 'nother thing.
13:18<mason>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIS+
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13:19<jhutchins>mason: Managed an installation for several years.
13:19<mason>My condolences. :)
13:20<mason>Or maybe sympathy? Anyway.
13:20<jhutchins>We got along OK.
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13:21<mason>I never actually rolled out NIS+. Ran NIS back when it was considered reasonable. NIS+ seemed a bit too complex, but maybe that was a misperception.
13:22<jhutchins>mason: Yeah, NIS+ is very different, pretty much a ground-up rewrite enlightened by newer examples.
13:22<mason>If I were to roll out a directory today, I'd likely do something Kerberos/LDAP-oriented.
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13:22<ansgar>A managed Active Directory in the Azure cloud!
13:23<mason>While that would indeed be Kerberos/LDAP-oriented, it wouldn't probably be my first pick.
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13:24<jhutchins>ansgar: Or I could get a job shoveling manure at the stable.
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13:28<mason>,v freeipa-server
13:28<judd>Package: freeipa-server on amd64 -- sid: 4.8.10-2+b1
13:28<mason>Only Sid... Sigh.
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13:31<sney>looks like java shenanigans took 4.8 out of testing, but now there's a 4.9 out so maybe it'll get into bookworm.
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13:33<Ruhangiz>Sqrt{not} sorry I overlooked your question. I am in bullseye, and did an "apt update" afterwards "apt install network-manager-openconnect"
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13:38<Ruhangiz>This lead to the error message "package network-manager-openconnect is not available but is referenced by another package. This could mean, that the package is missing, that it has been superseded or is only available from a different source. E: For package »network-manager-openconnect« is no existing installation candidate "
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13:41<Ruhangiz>Sources list includes bullseye, bullseye-debug, bullseye-security, and bullseye-backports. All with main non-free and contrib.
13:41<Sqrt{not}>Ruhangiz, I saw later you were in #debian-next. I suspect the confusion comes from what you were sorting there, about "testing" and default release, etc.
13:41<Sqrt{not}>,v network-manager-openconnect
13:41<judd>Package: network-manager-openconnect on amd64 -- stretch: 1.2.4-1; buster: 1.2.4-2; buster-backports: 1.2.6-1~bpo10+1; bookworm: 1.2.6-1; bullseye: 1.2.6-1; sid: 1.2.6-1
13:42<Ruhangiz>And the all corresponding deb-src
13:43<Sqrt{not}>%bullseye sources.list
13:43<dselect>A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Bullseye" has three lines: "deb https://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye main" "deb https://deb.debian.org/debian-security bullseye-security main" "deb https://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye-updates main". See <deb-src> <contrib> <non-free> <bullseye-updates> and `man sources.list`.
13:43<Ruhangiz>Yeah this created some confusion there also, but I just missed the switch of bullseye to stable.
13:44<Sqrt{not}>Ruhangiz, just to be sure, double-check the sources.list, some minor syntax changes in bullseye
13:45<Sqrt{not}>or, maybe you're all fixed now, hopefully
13:46<Sqrt{not}>I don't see bullseye-updates in your message just above here about your own sources.list
13:47<Sqrt{not}>%bullseye-updates
13:47<dselect>bullseye-updates is a suite providing updates to some packages (from <proposed-updates>) prior to a <point release>. The updates may be important bug fixes or low priority security fixes. All packages from bullseye-updates will be included in point releases. https://wiki.debian.org/StableUpdates . Not to be confused with <bullseye-security> which is for <security> updates (<bullseye/updates> was renamed and does not exist).
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13:48<Ruhangiz>The main line is: deb http://ftp2.de.debian.org/debian/ bullseye main non-free contrib
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13:54<Ruhangiz>Sqrt{not} I included bullseye-updates but still the same error message
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13:59<Sqrt{not}>Ruhangiz, if you did `apt update` before, I don't have any more guesses.
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14:00<Ruhangiz>I also changed the mirror to the official one posted above but still the same
14:01<Ruhangiz>Are you able to install it? Or is it an error only on my side?
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14:02<Ruhangiz>Thanks for your thoughts, Sqrt{not}!
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14:29<Marcelo>how are u?
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14:30<Guest5293>hi
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14:40<MarkTevanian>Hi everyone, I have a question: is it possible to use a safe free vpn on debian?
14:40<selckin>those don't exist
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14:41<MarkTevanian>true, but would u recommend one?
14:42<selckin>tor
14:42<flowriser>or just install openvpn on your own server
14:42<selckin>wireguard > openvpn
14:42<selckin>flowriser: you're paying for that server tho
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14:44<MarkTevanian>oh ok, thanks a lot dude
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14:46<MarkTevanian>does anyone know how to configure Debian terminal to look like the one on Kali Linux?
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14:47<trench>MarkTevanian: https://wiki.bash-hackers.org/start read that one and play with it yourself
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14:48<selckin>start it in a vm, and copy all the config files
14:48<MarkTevanian>awesome @trench! thank you
14:49<MarkTevanian>sure I will try that too @selckin thanks
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14:49<trench>MarkTevanian: and there is a lot of dotfiles on github.com in users repo's also .. you could check out thoose too
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14:50<MarkTevanian>yeah I was trying that the other day, but since I am a total newb on this subject ... well I got a bit lost
14:50<trench>https://dotfiles.github.io
14:51<trench>MarkTevanian: more than enough youtube video's about it too
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14:53<trench>MarkTevanian: just add another user and play with it there
14:54<trench>or install timeshift and play with your own shell
14:54<MarkTevanian>oh wow ! timeshift I will look into that
14:55<MarkTevanian>man!, Debian is just fascinating !
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16:20<alex11>anyone else having an issue with xfce where the top panel will not display certain open windows?
16:20<alex11>not sure if it could be an nvidia problem
16:22<alex11>hmm seems to sort of fix itself if you go and highlight things in the applications menu
16:23<alex11>but then mouse scroll gets weird on that panel
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16:28<jhutchins>alex11: Bullseye?
16:28<alex11>yeah
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16:53<madduck>What is a .dpkg-transfer file? Seen here: /etc/libvirt/virt-login-shell.conf.dpkg-transfer
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16:53<jhutchins>madduck: A wild guess would be an interrupted download.
16:53<sarnold>madduck: https://sources.debian.org/src/libvirt/7.6.0-1/debian/libvirt-clients.preinst/?hl=43#L43
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16:54<sarnold>madduck: (that mightnot be your specific file, but it does show the convention being used in libvirt's maintainer scripts)
16:54<jhutchins>file /etc/libvirt/virt-login-shell.conf.dpkg-transfer
16:55<jhutchins>Might have something to do with transferring data like a pastebuffer.
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16:56<madduck>ah okay, so a package-specific thing. Thanks. I thought it was a new dpkg convention
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16:58<alexia>a bit off topic but does anyone know if there's an irc or discord for PHP?
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16:58<jhutchins>!php
16:58<dpkg>PHP is a scripting language. To install, ask me about <install php>. See also <php wants me to download still>, <php mysql>, <php userdir>, <phpmyadmin>, <php gd>, <pear>, <pecl>, <newer php>, <xampp>. http://wiki.debian.org/PHP http://www.php.net/ #php on irc.oftc.net, #php irc.libera.chat.
16:58<alexia>thank you!!
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17:00<crawler>What would change a machine's ECDSA fingerprint? Where is it stored anyway?
17:01<koollman>crawler: /etc/ssh/ssh_host_ecdsa_key and /etc/ssh/ssh_host_ecdsa_key.pub, most likely
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17:01<madduck>crawler: man ssh-keygen
17:02<crawler>is there anything related to that in /var/* ?
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17:10<Guest5303>botnet?
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17:10<sarnold>crawler: yes, there's a /var/lib/dpkg/info/ directory with package maintainer scripts, this one will generate keys etc https://sources.debian.org/src/openssh/1:8.4p1-6/debian/openssh-server.postinst/
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17:19<crawler>Thank you everyone
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17:25<urk>Test
17:25<urk>I restored, and have rhe same graphics problem. At this point Im going to contact Dell. Something else is going on here.
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17:37<Sqrt{not}>urk, You were here as user Androirc previously?
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17:38<Sqrt{not}>urk, I mean you were Androuser?
17:39<crawler>yes it was him
17:39<crawler>or her
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17:43<saradbos55>oba
17:43<saradbos55>blz
17:43<saradbos55>algum br
17:43<sarnold>!pt
17:43<dpkg>Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-br ) - debian-user-portuguese@lists.debian.org
17:43<saradbos55>a vsfd ent
17:43<saradbos55>ata
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17:47<jhutchins>urk: I think I'd try disabling the common troublemakers like pci, pic, and kms.
17:48<jhutchins>apic.
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17:51<saradbos55>hum...
17:51<code78>hi friends, i have a problem with mi wired connection, this work fine only when i put manually the parameters (ip, mask, etc), but in automatic mode (dhcp) cannot connect :(((
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17:52<code78>can u help me please
17:53<mason>Hrm. Does AppArmor do network stuff in Bullseye?
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17:54<blast007>code78: is your DHCP server functioning correctly? I've seen some cheap home routers have their DHCP server stop giving out addresses until the router was rebooted.
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18:04<mason>Ah, that's a shame. AppArmour on Debian still can't do network stuff, meaning it's not useful as a network wrapper for things.
18:05<Booda>selinux is nice
18:05<mason>(See apparmor.d(5), DESCRIPTION section.)
18:05<mason>Booda: SELinux is complex. AppArmor is pleasingly simple.
18:06<mason>https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/414490/how-to-deny-applications-access-to-network-by-apparmor talks about the issue
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18:08<jhutchins>mason: Local security is simple. Network security is complex.
18:08<mason>Oh, interesting, interesting. https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/68956/block-network-access-of-a-process notes that this can be accomplished with unshare -n
18:08<mason>Makes me wonder if things can change namespaces once they're running.
18:08<sarnold>mason: be careful trusting a manpage or a three-year-old SE post about it.. better to test yourself
18:08<mason>I'm guessing not, but...
18:09<mason>sarnold: Yeah. Just wondering what the options are.
18:09<sarnold>mason: they can, setns(2)
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18:10<mason>And, it seems regular users can't unshare(1)
18:10<sarnold>That Depends
18:10<mason>My first test came back with "unshare: unshare failed: Operation not permitted" anyway
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18:11<sarnold>mason: my focal kernel uses kernel.unprivileged_userns_clone to configure this, I'm not sure if we've still got our own or if that's also upstream's name for the control
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18:12<mason>sarnold: I see that here: kernel.unprivileged_userns_clone = 0
18:12<tuxd3v>hello guys I am in Debian 11, I installed cpufreq-utils, and it reports all frequency steps but not mention the turbo max frequency 3.9Ghz
18:12<tuxd3v>it only reports 3.5Ghz as the last step..
18:12<mason>sarnold: Appears to default to '1' in Bullseye
18:12<tuxd3v>is this normal?
18:12<sarnold>mason: set that to 1 and you can probably then use unpriv namespaces in lxd, unshare -U, etc
18:12<tuxd3v>in turbo mode it should achieve 3.9Ghz..
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18:14<mason>sarnold: My confusion field has taken notice of my trying to do something interesting: https://bpa.st/APZQ
18:16<sarnold>mason: try unshare -U -r -n ping 4.2.2.1
18:17<sarnold>mason: that fails for me, too, but it fails in the networking stack :)
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18:17<mason>sarnold: Indeed, that did the trick.
18:17<sarnold>mason: the -U grabs a new user namespace, the -r asks for the 'root' mapping for your uid, so that you can then do capabilities within the namespace, and the -n the uses that CAP_SYS_ADMIN namespace capability to create a new networking namespace, and *then* the ping fails because you haven't configured the brand-new network namespace
18:18<mason>heh
18:18<sarnold>but if you fire up bash, and then do the right set if ip commands, you should be able to make it all work
18:18<mason>Is the root mapping... like, root in the world of subuid?
18:19<sarnold>yeah, that's the flavour of the thing
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18:26<tjcarter>dpkg, tell me about nvme unsafe shutdown
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18:29<tjcarter>Sqrt{not}: I decided the moment /etc/default/grub.d became a thing that /etc/default/grub ought not be touched, and that the contents of the directory should preserve anything they don't explicitly mean to change.
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18:32<fangfufu>I cannot save images as jpeg format in gwenview. I am on Debian 11.
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18:43<td>Hello! I am running a raidZ zfs installation on buster, i ran apt update/upgrade and had to rebuild the zfs module, and rebooted, now my zfs pool is empty :(
18:43<tjcarter>fangfufu: I don't use that one myself, but hopefully someone who uses KDE stuff will see that and check on it.
18:44<td>anyway to recover/troubleshoot this? Thankfully nothing super valuable but some stuff that would be annoying to get back,
18:44<mason>td: Your pool's probably not empty. I'd guess it's not mounted, even if imported.
18:45<td>https://pastebin.com/KabtDQn9
18:45<mason>td: FWIW, it's entirely reasonable to avoid DKMS. I exclusively use premade packages here, served up from a local repository.
18:45<mason>td: Could use use a different pastebin? bpaste.net or the one in the topic?
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18:46<td>gladly, https://bpa.st/ER6A
18:46<mason>Um. Maybe there isn't one in the topic. paste.debian.net or termbin.com or something
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18:46<mason>td: FWIW, that status is Just Fine. Don't upgrade your pool until you know why you want to.
18:47<mason>td: You also want to share "zfs list" because that doesn't indicate that anything's mounted... At a guess you're looking in /naspool and the mountpoint exists but there's nothing loaded up there.
18:47<mason>td: Two things: 1) it might be unwilling to mount if anything is in there, and 2) this can even be a stray dotfile in there.
18:48<td>hey, theres something https://bpa.st/UJPA
18:48<mason>td: what's 'zfs mount naspool/data' do for you?
18:48<td>cannot mount 'naspool/data': filesystem already mounted
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18:49<mason>td: 'zfs umount naspool ; zfs mount naspool/data' maybe?
18:50<mason>td: If that works, maybe you want to say 'zfs set canmount=off naspool' or 'zfs set mountpoint=none naspool' or similar.
18:50<td>https://bpa.st/LBZA
18:50<mason>Interesting. Some kind of shadowing maybe? But that's your stuff, yes?
18:50<td>Yeah, thats the folders
18:50<td>looks like somehow theres two "pools"
18:51<mason>td: No, one pool, two datasets, one below the other.
18:51<fangfufu>tjcarter: it seems that I can't save as jpeg in all the KDE image editing app. It stopped working for kolorpaint as well. I filed a bug report for gwenview, but it is being greylisted.
18:51<td>https://bpa.st/WVZQ
18:51<mason>td: 'zfs set mountpoint=none naspool ; zfs list'
18:51<td>https://bpa.st/LULQ
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18:52<mason>td: There you go. That should do what you want. Having a hierarchy is fine, but you want to be aware of what's going to try to mount and where and when and why and so forth.
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18:52<td>Not 100% sure how that got created, something got upset on the upgrade somewhere, going to do a reboot here and hope it comes back happy :)
18:53<mason>td: Lately I've been indulging in the heresy of setting everything to be a legacy mountpoint and just managing mounts through /etc/fstab. Don't tell the other ZFS people or they'll laugh at me.
18:53<mason>td: That was already there. Nothing to do with the upgrade. This would have bitten you on reboot either way I imagine.
18:53<td>had rebooted a number of times before with no issue *shrug*
18:53<td>trying to fight a plex issue and this happened in the process
18:54<mason>A race then. Dunno. Should be fixed now. Also note that #zfsonlinux is active and has smarter people than me that can help. :P
18:54<td>awesome tyvm :) I came from a freebsd world so it's all just slightly foreign to me
18:54<mason>td: Ah, yeah. Good stuff, all of it. I still run both.
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18:55<mason>I run everything. Because I can never decide authoritatively.
18:55<td>mason: seems happy after reboot! :)
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18:55<mason>good good
18:55<td>Yeah I love freebsd but kept bumping in to issues with various commercial apps not working quite right, finally gave up the fight for my home server. Still use it for the work servers.
18:55<dfngadjkfn>how would I add an icloud account to gnome online accounts? as the address for smtp is wrong and imap syncing doesn't work
18:56<tjcarter>fangfufu: I wonder if there's something a bit more KDE-wide going on then? Hmm…
18:56<tjcarter>Or Qt-wide
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18:56<mason>td: As for ZFS, FreeBSD 13 uses the same ZFS as Linux now, and this will continue into the future, so anything new you learn will apply directly to both.
18:56<td>oh awesome!
18:57<urk>Got a mess on my hands. I seemed to have lost most of my graphics functionality while in Bullseye so I reverted back to Kernel 4.19, but still don't have proper functionality. For one, the desktop items are not showing up on the desktop, and neither is the minimize feature in any of my programs.
18:57<urk>I would have thought that the reversion would have fixed the problem, but apparently not. What is the next step? Dell's response is install "Windows 10".. . . haha
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18:58<mason>td: If you're feeling adventurous, anyway, try custom packages. I don't trust DKMS. When I've just run an upgrade isn't the time to compile something critical. https://openzfs.github.io/openzfs-docs/Developer%20Resources/Custom%20Packages.html
18:58<urk>I am actually in Hexchat on my laptop, and that is one of the things I can open up but I don't have the minimize tools in the corners.
18:58<mason>urk: I missed where you said what graphics you're running, if you mentioned it.
18:59<td>mason: ooh this seems fun. I'll give it a spin. Thanks!!
18:59<mason>Oh, oh, you've got graphics, but the desktop environment itself is funny.
18:59<mason>td: FWIW, I do that, serve it up from a local repository, and then have a metapackage to make sure I don't upgrade to a new kernel before I have a package built for it, which ends up being relatively quick and easy.
19:01<mason>td: There are probably half a dozen better ways to do it, but https://bpa.st/EMPA
19:01<urk>mason: I have a strange problem, and not sure what to think of it. I upgrade to Bullseye, and noticed my XFCE tool menu disappeared. Thats a problem that occurred in the past, though rare, and usually easy to correct. I selected the start menu to change the dark background to something lighter since I didn't like the dark, and after selecting the color tool in the "desktop" area (start, settings, desktop, tool), the screen became frozen, and most
19:01<urk>programs would not let me enter data.
19:02<td>mason: ah thats pretty slick. I havent done any custom packages before but seems like a nice learning experiment
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19:02<urk>I reverted to kernel 4.19, and went back to Buster, but the problem persists. In both instances there is no minimize button for the programs. Additionally desktop items are not displaying on the desktop, but they are in the folder.
19:02<mason>urk: That's unusual. I wonder if some necessary package didn't make it through the upgrade, or if there's something version-specific in the config that's tripping it up. Unfortunately, I don't run a desktop environment so my guesses will probably not be super useful. But someone in here will have an idea, I'm sure.
19:03<mason>urk: Yeah, doesn't seem like a kernel issue at all.
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19:03<urk>There is nominally more functionality in 4.19, but not much. Any ideas on how to fix this?
19:03<mason>That you have graphics and a desktop at all means the kernel's fine, including modules driving your display. The issue is in the desktop software itself.
19:03<Sqrt{not}>urk, what was your process for going back to buster?
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19:04<mason>Oh, right, I missed that "going back to buster" part. That's ominous.
19:04<urk>Sqrt{not}: Restored using Timeshift.
19:04<mason>I assumed rebooting into the old kernel. I'll bow out.
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19:05<Sqrt{not}>urk, so does it work the same way as always on buster, or there is still some lingering problem?
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19:06<urk>No, there is a lingering problem. Can't minimize any screen, including Thunderbird, Firefox, Chrome, etc.
19:06<urk>Additionally the desktop items are not displaying, and one of the XFCE tool bars isn't displaying. Just on speculation, I suspect it is something with XFCE. XFCE recently had an update so I need to look into that.
19:07<urk>Minimize tool "--" isn't showing up at all.
19:07<urk>This sounds like an XFCE problem.
19:07<Sqrt{not}>urk, how much of the file system did you include in that timeshift backup/restore?
19:07<urk>Sqrt{not}: I did a full backup, and a full restore.
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19:08<urk>I am going to try rebooting, and will be back in a few minutes.
19:08<Sqrt{not}>urk, then it should work exactly the same as before, no? but you say it does not.
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19:10<urk>Sqrt: Another thing that no longer works is saved sessions. Prior to the display problem, a program left open would still appear open after reboot, but no longer.
19:10<urk>I am going to look up some tools on the net and see if I can improve the situation. I might start with the desktop not displaying.
19:11<urk>I just rebooted, and there was no improvement in the situation. However I can still use Hexchat. In Bullseye even Hexchat wouldn't work.
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19:12<Sqrt{not}>urk, if you did a full backup, full restore, it should work exactly the same as before, no? but you say it does not.
19:12<urk>I added the Firefox launcher to the XFCE menu bar since all of that disappeared with the upgrade, and it disappeared again after reboot. I suspect an issue with XFCE
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19:12<urk>Sqrt: No it does not.
19:12<fangfufu>tjcarter: this is my bug report: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=992918
19:12<Sqrt{not}>urk, so this apparently is not an exact restore of your previous buster? system
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19:13<urk>I am leaning on thinking this is an XFCE issue that corrupted with the upgrade, and the XFCE issue wan't fixed with the downgrade, but don't really know.
19:13<urk>Sqrt: It was an exact restore, but the corruption persists after the restore.
19:13<Sqrt{not}>urk, what did you do to "downgrade" exactly?
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19:13<urk>Timeshif --restore
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19:14<c0rnel1us>On my laptop I had to remove a lot of the old xfce .config files along with session related junk to get it to work correctly.
19:14<urk>I ran lsblk to double check that the data was there, and that I had the right data location. Everything seemed to go normal.
19:14<Sqrt{not}>urk, yes but timeshift can be configured to say how much is saved/restored.
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19:14<urk>Sqrt: I restored everything.
19:14<Sqrt{not}>urk, then why does it not work the same as before?
19:14<urk>Or at least I thought I didn' I am going to pursue this as a problem with XFCE. However, the syslog in Bullseye indicated a problem with the windows "X" manager.
19:15<urk>Sqrt: Its the curse.
19:15<urk>Maybe because of a past life regression?
19:15<urk>Either that or the planets are not in alignment.
19:16<tjcarter>fangfufu: 👍 Maybe someone here will have a more immediate response. I'd go grab the package and see if I could duplicate your result, but I'm doing about four things just now. Once I've accomplished about two of 'em, if nobody else has yet, I'll have a look.
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19:16<tjcarter>At least I can try to confirm if it's just your system doing something odd.
19:17<tjcarter>,v gwenview
19:17<judd>Package: gwenview on amd64 -- stretch: 4:16.08.3-3; buster: 4:18.04.0-1.1; bookworm: 4:20.12.3-2; bullseye: 4:20.12.3-2; sid: 4:21.08.0-1
19:17<tjcarter>Ah that's going to make it harder.
19:17<fangfufu>ah cheers, thank you so much!
19:17<Sqrt{not}>urk, it sounds like you now have a mixture of restored buster stuff, mixed with leftover bullseye stuff
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19:17<fangfufu>tjcarter: why is it going to make it harder?
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19:18<tjcarter>fangfufu: bullseye 4:20.12.3-2, sid 4:21.08.0-1
19:18<tjcarter>I'm running sid here, so I can test the sid version easily, but several things KDE-related did get an update, that included, so it may work for me in sid but not for you in bullseye. I haven't got a bullseye machine handy atm.
19:19<fangfufu>oh I would be grateful if you could tell me if it works on sid.
19:19<urk>Sqrt: It sounds like it. I am going to run some checks to see if there were any remnants, but it is still possible something was copied over to both during the upgrade.
19:19<fangfufu>I am happy to partially upgrade to sid.
19:20<fangfufu>I can always pin certain packages to a low priority. I know it is not advised and everything. I have once downgraded from Testing to Stable, that was a few years ago, on the system I am using right now.
19:20<fangfufu>This installation is 7 years old.
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19:20<tjcarter>fangfufu: sid … isn't an "upgrade".
19:21<tjcarter>I mean the packages are newer, sure
19:21<tjcarter>But within 4 days of bullseye going gold, the maintainer of debianutils BROKE X.
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19:22<fangfufu>X as in the X server?
19:22<fangfufu>I heard people default to wayland these days
19:22<tjcarter>failed to do a cursory check for packages on his own system using an (obsolete) tool in debianutils before removing it.
19:22<pdq>Had to log off because computer won't let me minimize the screen, nor move a program http://paste.debian.net/1208928/ Looks like Buster to me.
19:22<tjcarter>thing called tempfile
19:22<tjcarter>x11-common uses it!
19:23<fangfufu>Hh I see. This is why I stick to stable. I used to run testing.
19:23<tjcarter>Yeah, like I said, sid is not really an "upgrade"
19:24<tjcarter>There's reasons to use it, but unless you're confident in your ability to fix things and don't mind a nearly daily reboot … sid's not for you.
19:24<pdq>Sqrt: I can't move any program with my mouse. I have to close it in many cases to continue working on other things.
19:25<pdq>No errors show up with update, nor upgrade. Not sure what to think of it all.
19:25<pdq>System is clean.
19:26<pdq>I am leaning on something wrong with XFCE since a hardware display issue wouldn't have necessary caused the minimize feature to disappear.
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19:30<pdq>From the looks of things, I can use just one browser at a time. No minimize control.
19:32<pdq>I need to close this session so that I can do something for work in a browser. Its blocking my view due to the display corruption. Please memo serve me if you have any ideas on how to fix my problem.
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20:39<sirmanuel>HI guys, How ca I install the encoder acc? is missing and videos do not sound
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20:50<sussudio>,i libavcodec57
20:50<judd>No package named 'libavcodec57' was found in bullseye/amd64.
20:50<sney>58 in bullseye
20:50<sussudio>sirmanuel: install libavcodec*
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20:54<r4fkramer>Hi all, please, I'm trying to send technical information to provide any support to a person who uses debian in his job (all users administer windows workstations; he's the only one who administer a debian workstation in his job. If possible, thank you anyway: https://paste.debian.net/1208934/
20:56<sarnold>r4fkramer: strange
20:56<r4fkramer>Hi sarnold, My idea is: if he is more and more successful as a debian user on a network still predominantly based on windows, over time the more users, or the IT Manager himself will end up liking the idea of migrating all machines, from windows to debian .
20:57<sarnold>r4fkramer: has your friend done the same 'assign an IP address' thing on their machine? they can set an ip with the 'ip' command, the manpage is ip-address
20:57<sarnold>r4fkramer: heh, probably not, people barely know how to use their windows computers, but they *do* know how to do what they've been taught. teaching everyone how to do things from linux instead is a huge cost
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21:00<r4fkramer>I'll ask him, sarnold, thank you for assistance :) I agree with you, sarnold. It would be trying to get everyone out of an already known 'comfort zone'.
21:00<r4fkramer>Anyway, it could be done - some private or governmental institutions in this country ended up being migrated to debian in this way.
21:02<r4fkramer>Brazilian Army was an example: the entire Network of this institution is currently based on Debian (I don't know if Stretch or Buster ).
21:02<sarnold>r4fkramer: oh, sure, germany had some sucessful projects like this :) but it was planned, it took years, they educated thousands of people..
21:03<r4fkramer>Let's say that only a single person caused the Brazilian Army to 'expel' Windows Servers, replacing all of them with Debian Servers.
21:05<r4fkramer>Yes, I have this conscience. in this case it will also likely be a long-term migration project, not something to change right away. But, everything has to have a beginning, right
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21:05<r4fkramer>sarnold, I'll ask him about the question you have explained here :)
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22:14-!-Celelibi_ is "Alors, il est beau mon whois ?" on #syslinux #linux #idle #llvm #debian-next #debian
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22:21<jhutchins>Is there a #debian-offtopic on OFTC?
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22:25<sney>jhutchins: of course.
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---Logclosed Wed Aug 25 00:00:09 2021