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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-09-17

---Logopened Fri Sep 17 00:00:11 2021
---Daychanged Fri Sep 17 2021
00:00<A|an>I didn't realize apt-get had that option
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00:02<tjcarter>apt can install a local file?
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00:02<tjcarter>when did it get that feature? 😮
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00:05<somiaj>I'm usnure if apt-get can, but apt has had it for a while now, though Id ont' think it is documented, so it is a hidden feature
00:05<somiaj>basically apt install ./foo.deb is the new dpkg -i foo.deb; apt -f install
00:06<tjcarter>somiaj: hopefully it does the dependency management before it does the dpkg -i, but yeah
00:07<somiaj>one would hope as well too
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00:14<tjcarter>somiaj: well, some people think that appimage is a better format for what it does because those explicitly do contain all their libs and havve no external dependencies (supposedly)
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00:15<tjcarter>but I've had appimages that aren't so independent as they'd like to be, and those don't have the sandboxing
00:15<tjcarter>sorry, I think I'm mixing windows
00:16<tjcarter>$ doas apt install coffee
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00:27<craigevil>that apt not apt-get can install local packages is a single line in the Reference: file:///usr/share/doc/debian-reference-en/docs/ch02.en.html#_advanced_package_management_operations_with_commandline
00:28<craigevil>apt install /path/to/package_filename.deb install a local package to the system, meanwhile try to resolve dependency automatically
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01:13<jhamlin>I'm seeing some strange behavior where when I use qt5ct to change the theme, as soon as I change focus from one window to another, the theme switches to something else. I suspect it has something to do with conflicting theme "engines?" but have not been able to figure out how to fix it. Any ideas? (Debian 11 with xmonad).
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01:51<truth>How would you fix
01:51<truth>$ curl -i -v -L 'http://blacknight.com/legal/terms'
01:51<truth>to avoid
01:51<truth>"Mark bundle as not supporting multiuse" and
01:51<truth>"HTTP/1.1 502 Bad Gateway"
01:52<truth>?
01:52<truth>curl is routed through tor.
01:52<truth>Details are at
01:52<truth>https://controlc.com/cb8cbd26
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02:10<jpw>truth> is that a debian question?
02:11<truth>jpw, Sort of. Debian has tor and curl packages.
02:12<jpw>it's not though is it. you're asking about the configuration of blackknight.com.
02:13<truth>To be precise, I want to fix how curl is called, not the configuration of blackknight.com.
02:15<jmcnaught>502 is a server-side error.
02:15<truth>A solution using another debian package, wget, would be OK too.
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02:18<truth>jmcnaught, TORBrowser does not get a 502 error.
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02:23<colo>that does not change the fact that only the server side decides your request's fate
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03:38<alku>Hello! on a fresh install of Debian 11 I am getting 'unable to start light display manager' error. Although going to another terminal I can get 'startx' working.
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03:40<alku>Output of 'lightdm --test-mode --debug is available on https://pastebin.com/W8f32etd
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03:43<alku>From syslog I think the possible error line is "debian lightdm[761]: Error getting user list from org.freedesktop.Accounts: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name org.freedesktop.Accounts was not provided by any .service files
03:43<alku>"
03:43<alku>Any idea what is missing??
03:46<Unit193>That shouldn't really be a fatal error, that's just telling you accountsservice isn't installed.
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03:52<alku>Unit193: thank you. I tried installing accountsservice, but lightdm still fails to start. I have to manually do 'startx' after logging in to another terminal
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05:04<EmleyMoor>I am trying to use the ovmf package to make a uefi secureboot guest VM (itself also running Debian), but the only combination of files I can find that even lets it boot leaves me with "not determined" when I check to see if it secure booted.
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05:29<gwalenn>hi, I need to clean my grub. efiboomgr returns 2 entries off windows and 2 entries of Debian (http://paste.debian.net/1212090) any idea ?
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07:21<EmleyMoor>Is there a guide to using virt-installer to make a secure boot VM running Debian, on a Debian host?
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07:24<jm_>try https://wiki.debian.org/SecureBoot/VirtualMachine
07:24<jm_>I remember there's one pull down menu in virt-manager where one selects appropriate firmware for secure boot
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07:25<EmleyMoor>Not getting satisfactory confirmation when I use that
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07:28<EmleyMoor>I will see if virt-manager can get me going though
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08:01<FelixActually>What encryption method does LUKS use?
08:02<ansgar>FelixActually: It can use different methods. Check with `cryptsetup luksDump <device>` or so.
08:02<FelixActually>Is there a recommended encryption method I should use?
08:03<sussudio>rot13
08:04<JPT>cryptsetup should use a sane default if you don't specify one
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08:04<rouca>sussudio: rot0
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08:08<JohnGH>Since upgrading Debian 10 to 11.0 the other day, Google Chrome has been locking up. Sometimes I can alt-tab to other apps, sometimes my whole desktop is stuck. I can sometimes fix it by killing all Chrome processes (at the worst case I SSH in to my box and kill from there) sometimes I have to init 6. Is this a known issue? is this the right place
08:08<JohnGH>to ask for help? I am using xfce4
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08:09<jm_>JohnGH: google chrome is not shipped by debian, just chromium is
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08:09<R0R0>hi
08:10<R0R0>bonjour
08:10<grove>!ask
08:10<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/ See <smart questions><errors>.
08:10<R0R0>i want set up the wlan0 on a raspberrypi4
08:11<grove>Do you actually run Debian on that?
08:12<grove>!raspbian
08:12<dpkg>Raspberry Pi OS (previously called Raspbian) is a distribution <based on Debian> made specifically for the <Raspberry Pi>. Raspbian is not Debian and it is not supported in #debian. Please use #raspbian (or #raspberrypi) on irc.libera.chat for support. https://www.raspbian.org/
08:12<R0R0>yes buster
08:13<R0R0>i dl raspi_4_buster.img.xz
08:14<R0R0>i loaded it on sd-card it start, passwd set ...
08:15<Habbie>so from https://raspi.debian.net/tested-images/
08:15<R0R0>looks not there
08:15<Habbie>where did you download it?
08:15<R0R0>https://raspi.debian.net/daily-images/
08:16<Habbie>ah, right
08:17<R0R0>it started ... but "ifconfig" unknow, ipaddress unknow too
08:17<Habbie>'ifconfig' has been replaced by 'ip'
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08:18<R0R0>ipup
08:19<R0R0>(i still using ifconfig on my lappy)
08:20<jm_>R0R0: have you tried using https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi/HowToUse ?
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08:21<R0R0>am looking
08:21<R0R0>i did ip a
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08:22<R0R0>but it dont show any ip wlan0
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08:22<R0R0>can have a try on eth
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08:25<jm_>does rpi4 come with wifi by default? i thought it does not have it
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08:27<R0R0>yes looks not
08:27<jm_>so start here https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi instead
08:28<R0R0>what i want to try is to "wake up" ethernet or wifi
08:28<jm_>wake up rpi via wakeonlan?
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08:29<R0R0>nono something like " ifconfig wlp6s0 down "
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08:29<R0R0>ifconfig wlp6s0 up
08:30<jm_>right, start by determining which wifi you have (assuming you have one) - that wiki page explains how to do it
08:31<R0R0>so " ip a "
08:33<R0R0>i been to /etc/network/interfaces.d/wlan0
08:33<R0R0>set iface inet wlan0 dhcp uncomment bssid set wifi passwd
08:34<jm_>the second page I mentioned, not the first
08:35<sussudio>R0R0: were you on the other network yesterday as "kee"
08:35<R0R0>wait , i try network-manager
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08:35<sussudio>that one ended with "<Khepra> you should expect to see kernel naming it eth0 and then udev renaming to whatever rule was chosen"
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08:39<mtj>folks, is there a way to install a list of debian packages in a text file?
08:40<mtj>like 'cat ./deb-pkgs | apt-get -y install' ?
08:40<sussudio>yes, but i forgot the factoid name...
08:40<sussudio>!backup
08:40<dpkg>A backup is something you should do *ALWAYS*. if you value your sh*t in the least. Otherwise eons of built-up data can go BYE BYE FOREVER one day if you do not; either by HD malfunction, intentional evil by crackers, mischievous glak elves invading your system, or large magnets getting out of hand. Pay the dollars for a tape system or CDR and use <tar> (optionally with bzip2 at lowest compression). See <things to backup>.
08:40<sussudio>that wasn't it.
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08:41<sussudio>!clone
08:41<dpkg>clone is probably to clone a partition or full disk, read https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/disk_cloning or see <debian clone> to make a copy of an existing system's packages
08:41<mtj> cat debian-deps | xargs -I {} sudo apt-get -y install {}
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08:42<mtj>^ ... seems to work, bit its a bit clunky :/
08:43<ansgar>mtj: apt install $(cat /the/magic/file)?
08:44<R0R0># cheerz everyone, i will be bck later with that rpi_buster ... :)
08:44<ansgar>mtj: Or if you like xargs: `< debian-deps xargs apt install`
08:44<mtj>cheers ansgar, thats much nicer
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10:25<jkc>Anyone know the default username/password for the bullseye raspberry pi image?
10:26<ansgar>jkc: https://wiki.debian.org/RaspberryPiImages says root / no password (and no remote login)
10:27<jkc>Ah, never mind.
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11:42<Mag>Hi
11:43<Mag>i'm crying
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11:43<Mag>I have a server on webtropia.com
11:44<Mag>on it i have Debian 10.10 OS with Plesk
11:44<Mag>After an reboot from Plesk
11:44<Mag>My server won't gose up
11:45<jkc>Unfortunately, systems with Plesk installed aren't supportable because of all of the changes that Plesk makes to the OS.
11:45<Mag>jkc
11:45<Mag>please
11:45<Mag>i want only reinstall GRUB
11:45<Mag>but i can't do this
11:46<Mag>now i'm logged in with Linux grml 5.6.0-2-amd64
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11:46<Mag>now i need to mount partition and reinstall GRUB to my server with Linux grml 5.6.0-2-amd64
11:47<Mag>The server has 2 NVME in RAID 1
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11:48<Mag>Uploaded file: https://uploads.kiwiirc.com/files/338086d7609457857e902cfce831b5bf/pasted.txt
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11:48<Mag>This is result of fdisk -l
11:48<Mag>can you help me with commands to reinstall GRUB ?
11:49<Mag>Please ç_ç
11:50<Sqrt{not}>%fixmbr
11:50<dselect>To reinstall <GRUB> boot to your Debian install disk/live CD, switch to the other console (Alt-F2), mount your root filesystem (mount -t ext4 /dev/whatever /target ; mount --bind /dev /target/dev ; mount -t proc none /target/proc ; mount -t sysfs none /target/sys), chroot into it (chroot /target), run "mount /boot/efi" on EFI and "update-grub && grub-install /dev/whatever". See also <rescue mode>, <dual boot guide>, <supergrub>.
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11:57<Mag>I have this partition:
11:57<Mag>Uploaded file: https://uploads.kiwiirc.com/files/624f523cf793987d09f3b1651e6ccef5/pasted.txt
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12:00<Mag>my root root filesystem
12:00<Mag>is this ? '/dev/nvme0n1p2 4096 1003519 999424 488M EFI System'
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12:01<Mag>or this ? '/dev/nvme0n1p1 2048 4095 2048 1M BIOS boot'
12:01<blast007>neither of those are your root filesystem
12:01<blast007>if would be on the RAID stuff
12:02<Mag>it's a sys folder on main OS partition
12:02<Mag>with folders var etc ecc ?
12:03<blast007>does your other NVMe disk have a working grub? maybe the system is just booting to the wrong NVMe?
12:03<blast007>I'm not familiar with doing grub recovery on a system with RAID
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12:04<Mag>blast007 ç_ç
12:04<blast007>it may be necessary to bring up the array before you'd chroot in
12:04<another>see /dev/md/*
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12:05<Mag>yes
12:06<Mag>i have /dev/md1
12:06<Mag>and /dev/md2
12:06<Mag>Disk /dev/md1: 976 MiB, 1023410176 bytes, 1998848 sectors
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12:06<Mag>Disk /dev/md2: 456,59 GiB, 490240737280 bytes, 957501440 sectors
12:07<Mag>in the mounted /dev/md2 there are all OS files and folder
12:07<blast007>my guess is that md1 would be your /boot and md2 would be either your / or an LVM volume for your other partitions
12:08<another>hint: `lsblk -f` can give you a better overview
12:08<Mag>yes
12:08<Tj>Mag: can you pastebin "( lsblk; sudo blkid )"
12:09<Mag>Uploaded file: https://uploads.kiwiirc.com/files/b174b82bb0577a52a277fca94d3f6317/pasted.txt
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12:12<Mag>It's a RAID 1 mirroring
12:12<Mag>are 2 NVME of 512 GB
12:12<Tj>Mag: the output is easier to reason with if you use my suggested commands above
12:14<Tj>Mag: is grml booted in UEFI mode (so that GRUB will be able to reinstall) ?
12:14<Mag>Yes
12:15<Mag>webtropia (my farm) gieve me grml when i choose 'rescue mode' from control panel of my farm
12:16<Mag>i think it is in UEFI mode
12:16<Mag>how can check this ?
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12:17<blast007>does this output anything? mount | grep efivarfs
12:18<Mag>efivarfs on /sys/firmware/efi/efivars type efivarfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,noexec,relatime)
12:18<nanini>after I caught a camera hidden in the ventilator of my previous work, I lost faith in humanity.
12:19<nanini>people dont respect the holy act of shit
12:20<another>nanini: active cooling for the camera /s
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12:22<nanini>if they are afraid of druging do urine twst , but for GOD respect shit act
12:22<Tj>Mag: so you'll need to reinstall grub to both devices independently
12:23<Mag> both devices ?
12:23<Mag>i want to reinstall grub only on Dedicated server with RAID 1
12:24<Mag>what do you mean for both devices ?
12:25<Tj>Mag: look at your reports; the EFI-SP's are not mirrored
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12:26<Mag>ok
12:26<Tj>Mag: so you'll need to install to both independently if you want to maintain bootability in the event of losing 1 device
12:26<Mag>EFI are only in one partition ?
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12:27<Mag>Tj How can i do this ?
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12:29<Tj>"mkdir /target; mount /dev/md2 /target; mount -t proc proc /target/proc; mount -t devtmpfs udev /target/dev; mount -t devpts devpts /target/dev/pts; mount -t sysfs sysfs /target/sys; chroot /target mount --all; chroot /target grub-install -v /dev/nvme0n1; chroot /target grub-install -v /dev/nvme1n1; chroot /target update-grub "
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12:32<jkc>That's my only major gripe about UEFI.
12:32<Mag>i run all commands
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12:34<jkc>In that command list, did the ESP get mounted?
12:34<Mag>now i try to restart server
12:34<jkc>Ah, mount all.
12:35<Mag>nothing ç_ç
12:35<Tj>jkc: :) indeed; if it did not, then the OS config was broken or manually altered
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12:35<Mag>This damn server is still down
12:36<Tj>Mag: well, you're the server admin, that's what you're there for!
12:36<Mag>How can i check bootstrap error ?
12:36<tjcarter>jkc: That multiple disks with ESPs can and do have different data on them?
12:37<jkc>tjcarter: More that the ESP cannot be a mirror device of some kind.
12:38<Mag>@jkc are a RAID 1 'mirroring'
12:38<tjcarter>jkc: it can, but it needs to be mirrored downstream from the UEFI. Agreed it should be something UEFIs know how to do and support explicitlyy.
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12:39<Mag>How can i check boot error ?
12:39<Mag>there are a log file ?
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12:40<jkc>tjcarter: I know that it can if you hack it or manage them separately, but that's silly that should be required.
12:41<Tj>EFI-SP can be mirrored using mdadm with --metadata=1.0
12:41<Tj>(1/0 puts the metadata at the end of the block device, not the start)
12:42<Tj>but the firmware won't use the mirror, it'll read the device as set in the NVRAM or removable media path
12:42<jkc>Exactly.
12:43<jkc>And it will use ONE of the mirror devices.
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12:43<Mag>guys, how can i tell what's the problem with the server and why won't it start?
12:43<jkc>Which is fine, as long as the OS always treats them as a mirror.
12:44<jkc>Mag: What did Plesk do during the upgrade?
12:44<tjcarter>jkc: my problem is more that I don't have the ability to easily change that variable from the BIOS settings.
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12:44<tjcarter>it's almost there…
12:44<Mag>@jck nothing
12:44<jkc>tjcarter: Other than flailing around with efibootmgr.
12:44<Mag>it's only a simple reboot
12:45<jkc>And what did you do BEFORE the reboot?
12:45<tjcarter>jkc: which you must boot into something to do.
12:45<Mag>before reboot i have deleted all backup
12:45<jkc>tjcarter: Yeah, that was my way of agreeing. Hence "flailing." :P
12:45<Tj>using removable media path, as long as both devices are included in the boot order, if all the menu entries fail it just drop through to trying the removable media path on all devices
12:45<jkc>Mag: Okay, that was silly, but you said earlier that this is after a system update.
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12:45<Mag>No, sorry
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12:46<Mag>I haven't done any system update
12:46<Mag>i already had the latest version of plesk
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12:48<Mag>from grml can i read log of my server partition
12:49<Tj>Mag: you first to look at how exactly it is failing; what is seen on the remote console as it boots
12:49<Mag>nothing
12:50<Mag>my farm does not provide me with a remote console
12:50<Mag>i use putty
12:50-!-otisolsen70_ [~otisolsen@xd4ed80b5.cust.hiper.dk] has quit []
12:50<Tj>well, that's pretty useless for a remote server!
12:50<Mag>but now he doesn't even let me ping the ip
12:50<Tj>you'll need to engage their remote hands most likely
12:50<jkc>No kidding. I'd be finding a new host.
12:51<jkc>Finding a new host and stop using Plesk.
12:51<coruja>Mag: btw, just asking, why don't you ask grml support?
12:51<Mag>What do you mean by grml support?
12:52<coruja>#grml on oftc
12:53<Tj>surely the issue isn't with grml, it's with the install grml is being used to recover?
12:53<Mag>Yes
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12:53<coruja>oh, if i misread, nevermind then
12:53<Mag>If from the control panel of my farm I request 'rescue mode' I can authenticate myself via SSH with my ip but from grml
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12:53<otisolsen70>I am installing debian11 on my new computer. It does not recognize the ethernet card frmo netinst. Can I just download and unzip this firmaware.zip from here: https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/firmware/stable/current/ and put it in a folder called firmware on a USB and insert it? USB being formatted with ext4?
12:54<Tj>Mag: did you check the server logs when you mounted /dev/md2 to see if there have been any additions since the failure began? if there are no log messages since that time that tells you the server never even starts the log service, so maybe the OS never starts init
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12:55<jkc>Tj: Neither the rescue media nor the install its being used to recover are supported here.
12:56<blast007>otisolsen70: https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/ch06s04.en.html
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13:05<otisolsen70>It seems it only works if I format the USB with FAT or something like that... Would expect it to work with a linux fs...
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13:09<tjcarter>otisolsen70: there's some expectation that you can/would put the firmware on the same USB you're probably installing from,
13:09<tjcarter>also that you're having to do this from some legacy OS
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14:06<gusman>What is a good way to dump kernel messages onto another machine other than netconsole? My motherboard does not have a serial port, I cannot use netconsole because my university locks the network so heavily I cannot even ping the other device on the same subnet.
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14:09<colo>just buy a router of your own and make it do NAT between your machines and the uni network
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14:13<gusman>Easier sad than done. Not a bad idea and also could come in handy for some more stuff later on, but it is a chunk of change.
14:14<colo>if you get an OpenWrt capable device, you can even have it play netconsole/syslog receiver on its own :)
14:14<somiaj>most universities will come down on you for that too, as their policy is you cannot have routers/private networks within their network.
14:14<colo>"life finds a way"
14:15<gusman>somiaj: the real question is would they be able to tell ;)
14:16<somiaj>gusman: Most likely yes
14:17<somiaj>again depends on the network, but my university is constantly doing scans in which they would show up
14:17<gusman>huh. I wonder how. Couldn't it be made to look like any other device?
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14:17<jkc>Probing a router/firewall's WAN-facing IP isn't going to tell you that it's a router/firewall.
14:17<somiaj>one could if they knew what scans they were doing try to fool them, I'm just pointing out that in general you'll be breaking policy to do so, and they may take your network away, and of course we here at debian do not suggest breaking the law or policy of any network you are on
14:18<jkc>The easiest way to tell is to look at the MAC address. If the OUI belongs to Belkin, for example, it's probably a Linksys device. So configure the device to spoof a random MAC that's commonly found on end-user devices.
14:18<colo>gusman, I would get a coed of yours who does not have the need for it to ask if it is OK to have that kind of setup. if it's OK, (get approval, too, and) go ahead. if it's not OK according to their policy, you know that you would have to be stealthy.
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14:18<colo>HWaddrs can be faked
14:18<jkc>colo: Like I just said.
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14:19<colo>TIL: coed does not mean what I thought it means, the dictionary tells me. noted.
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14:22<gusman>somiaj: interesting, yeah I don't plan on breaking these rules, but I am interested in knowing if it would be possible to set that up without them knowing
14:24<Tj>gusman: what is your actual problem? capturing early kernel log?
14:24<sney>also, unless your use case for sending kernel messages over the network is to diagnose a crash, you could possibly set up some kind of tunnel between the machines
14:24<gusman>Tj: yeah
14:25<Tj>gusman: USB<>serial adapter?
14:25<Tj>gusman: computer with 2 interfaces between this PC and upstream router?
14:25<somiaj>gusman: it depends, and I'm sure it is possible to fool the scans.
14:26<gusman>No serial port on my machine, network won't work either. I could buy a pci serial adapter for $50 off amazon because none are nearby then wait until next wednesday and then buy a usb adapter on top of that.
14:26<Tj>gusman: is this because the PC fails to boot to userspace?
14:26<somiaj>also if your machines have extra network cards, you could just connect them directly to each other and be on a network independent (without routing) and that shuld be fine.
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14:27<gusman>Tj: Yeah, video feed is lost so quickly, I can't decrypt drives, log in, or see kernel output
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14:28<Tj>gusman: you can get to GRUB menu?
14:28<jkc>gusman: You might be able to use netconsole.
14:29<jkc>Assuming that's still a thing.
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14:29<gusman>Tj: yes I can. I can get to grub and still boot into 5.10 fine (you helped me a ton the other day, if you remember the 5.10 grub guy) but 5.14 fails. With nomodeset I can boot into it though. Having trouble tracking down error messages once starting x however
14:29<gusman>jkc: nope, network is very locked down. Considering that router approach though..
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14:30<jkc>gusman: So skip the network. Direct connect between your two systems.
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14:30<somiaj>gusman: what about presistance journald logs? Can you get these from the previous boot?
14:30<jkc>You need messages, not network connectivity.
14:30<Tj>gusman: I'd start with editing the GRUB entry's "linux ..." line, removing any "quiet" "splash", replacing with "debug systemd.log_level=info break=top" and press Ctrl+x
14:30<gusman>jkc: neither of my systems support acting as a wap
14:31<jkc>Who's talking about wireless?
14:31<Tj>gusman: ^^^ this will stop the initrd as soon as it starts; there may still be video output at that time. If so, you can, stage by stage, work forward to find out precisely what/when it is lost,
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14:31<Tj>gusman: for other places where "break=" works see "grep maybe_break /usr/share/initramfs-tools/init"
14:31<jkc>gusman: You can't connect these via a cable?
14:31<gusman>somiaj: systemctl -b only shows boots with 5.10 no matter how far back I go even when I have tried to boot ot 5.14 in between
14:32<gusman>jkc: well I am on a laptop with no ethernet port, so I could go buy a usb adapter and an ethernet cable but again at a local store that's a solid $45.
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14:32<gusman>Looking for free solutions first x)
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14:33<Tj>gusman: use my suggestions first then
14:33<somiaj>that might be some info you can use, you know you aren't getting far enough into the system to start journald (which I think happens fairly early)
14:33<Sqrt{not}>gusman, is this the same self compiled kernel Tj helped you with in a chroot a few days ago?
14:33<Tj>it sounds that way!
14:34<gusman>Sqrt{not}: haha, yeah same guy
14:34<somiaj>I forgot, why do you need the 5.14 kernel?
14:34<gusman>It's really nothing special though. Just low latency direct from mainline
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14:34<somiaj>,kernels
14:34<gusman>somiaj: new support for my audio interface
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14:34<jkc>So you broke yourself while ricing. Good stuff.
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14:35<somiaj>gusman: although maybe not the best solution, if debian made a 5.14 kernel would you use that?
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14:35<Sqrt{not}>gusman, you know, you would actually get better help if you keep the same nick here, so we have more context what we are helping you with.
14:35<sney>there's also a 5.14 in experimental that has had (some) debian prep work done to it, that one may be worth a shot
14:36<Sqrt{not}>many of us can remember what you were trying, at least for a little while, but if we think we are lookinng at some new situation, everybody just wastes some of their time
14:36<gusman>jkc: I'm not sure how much I would attribute it to ricing, I tried with a non modified debian specific config and it didn't work either.
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14:36<somiaj>yea, that was going to be my suggestion, kernels are fairly stand alone, you could possibly download https://packages.debian.org/experimental/linux-image-5.14.0-trunk-amd64 and install it and have it working.
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14:37<Tj>gusman: have you tried adding "boot_delay=" to the kernel command-line? That sets the number of milliseconds to delay each printk() up to 10000
14:37<somiaj>I don't see any depends on that kernel that couldn't be satisfied in bullseye.
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14:37<gusman>Sqrt{not}: yeah apologies, I just keep changing it for other channels and also on account of the fact that I can't remember my previous nicks. Sorry for wasting time.
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14:38<gusman>somiaj: I would use their kernel and have tried but it does not work either. I compiled myself and tried theirs. I don't think my modifications are what is causing this.
14:39<somiaj>gusman: you installed the kernel I pointed you at?
14:39<somiaj>what doesn't work? The kernel like your issue or just the audio device?
14:39<gusman>somiaj: yes I have used that kernel specifically.
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14:40<gusman>somiaj: booting into 5.14 causes me to lose video. In 5.10 my soundcard has some pretty bad bugs that are fixed in 5.14 so I was hoping to upgrade to that.
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14:41<gusman>Tj: trying both of those solutions now, thank you
14:41<somiaj>gusman: what video driver are you using?
14:41<gusman>somiaj: amdgpu
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14:43<gusman>Tj: break=top and I do not lose video output. Dropped into busybox shell
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14:56<Tj>gusman: great!
14:56<Tj>gusman: it's a bit long-winded but now you need to boot to the other break= targets in order, until you hit the one that loses video, if any.
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14:57<Tj>gusman: these are the targets https://paste.debian.net/1212163/
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15:01<Tj>unfortunately there isn't a way to progressively change the target in the same shell, since maybe_break() calls panic() which starts a sub-shell
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15:14<R0R0>hi
15:15<sney>hi
15:16<R0R0>sussudio no i wasnt that "kee"
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15:21<R0R0>i try to install raspi buster on a raspberrypi 4
15:22<R0R0>i don't have internet
15:22<sney>use an image from raspi.debian.net ?
15:22<R0R0>https://raspi.debian.net/daily-images/
15:23<R0R0>yep
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15:31<gusman>Tj: Well it breaks right after bottom, at mountroot
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15:44<morbidbird>is there any point trying to use vim with Java and C#?
15:45<morbidbird>so much configuration
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15:45<morbidbird>and so many tools and commands to remember
15:47<gusman>morbidbird: sure if you know and like vim there are plenty of plugins and preexisting configurations out there
15:47<gusman>it may not be the most chosen path but its certainly viable and if you like vim, why not?
15:47<morbidbird>i dunno. i use vim by default, but i probably am not using it to its full potential
15:47<morbidbird>i just find the configuration too heavy, probably because i set things up once, didn't backup (dotfile repo or whatever) and couldn't bother to reconfigure
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15:48<morbidbird>for various scripting languages without good IDE support i like vim. and for haskell, etc. trying to get it working with C#, but then there's a billion keybinds.
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15:49<morbidbird>i guess i want something like a general menu with a b c choices in a hierarchy. in fact i need the same for intellij. again too many keybinds
15:49<morbidbird>- so actually the same problem with an IDE, except 0 config
15:49<morbidbird>maybe it's alzheimers coming
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15:50<babilen>Might be a better topic for #debian-offtopic, but I see the following choices: emacs, vim, vscode, language specific IDEs
15:52<tjcarter>morbidbird: most people don't use vim to its full potential. If it works for you, use it. If something else works better, go for it… Gatekeeping sucks, and free software is about choice.
15:52<tjcarter>But never let anyone tell you that you shouldn't use software unless you use it the way they want you to.
15:53<jkc>I'd try emacs, but I don't have enough appendages.
15:53<tjcarter>BTW, if you like vscode but want a version without telemetry … that exists.
15:54<tjcarter>I think it was called Codium
15:54<tjcarter>(I don't know how it compares exactly—I'm a vim user.)
15:55<Sqrt{not}>I don't think vim will improve c# very much, but that's not vim's fault
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15:58<gusman>Tj: alright so it works all the way untill break=mount
15:58<gusman>I am testing nomodeset and starting with x right now but :/
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16:00<jkc>I enjoy codium for actual projects.
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16:14<R0R0>exit
16:15<Otter>exit denied.
16:15<morbidbird>my fingers are too short for emacs. but i remember it was amazing for Scheme
16:15<morbidbird>sorry for off topic
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16:39<gusman>In case anyone was hanging on to the edge of their seat as I aimlessly tried to fix this.. it seems that other people are expierencing this issue ( just goes to show it wasn't my ricing ;)
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16:39<sney>some regression in 5.14 I guess? since you had the same issue with the package from experimental
16:40<sney>does it seem amdgpu specific or is it more broad
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16:40<gusman>amdgpu specific
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16:40<gusman>well actually one person using an nvidia reported it too
16:41<gusman>but the patch that allegedly caused this is here https://launchpadlibrarian.net/558064030/5.14.X-KOOPS.patch
16:41<sney>fun with the bleeding edge, heh
16:43<gusman>others report that CONFIG_UBSAN_TRAP being enabled is also causing it but they are all ubuntu users -- ubuntus ppa enabled it.
16:43<gusman>sney: haha a tad, although 5.14 is considered stable
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16:45<jkc>Bleeding edge doesn't mean its not a stable release.
16:46<sney>afaik what kernel.org considers "stable" is about making big changes to the codebase, not actual stability in use
16:46<jkc>And vice versa.
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16:59<r4fkramer>Hi all, please, I forgot accidentally my root password in an old Debian Installation (debian 7.4 wheezy). I know this channel provides support for bullseye 11.0 stable, not wheezy. Anyway, could anyone help me on this ? Recovery mode in 7 is a bit different than jessie, stretch etc.
17:01<r4fkramer>I have to edit in grub, but parameters I used in stretch for example, don't apply on this debian version.
17:01<sarnold>hey r4fkramer; the way I usually do it is to change the kernel command line at the grub boot pompt to use init=/bin/bash
17:02<r4fkramer>Hi sarnold, thank you to see you again :) Please, how do I proceed in this case ? Switch to command line option instead of 'e' option ?
17:03<zoke>r4fkramer: as sarnold says... "init=/bin/bash"... may also need "noinitrd" as a boot option
17:03<gusman>ah it seems my particular bug was fixed ~12 ago in a patch for 5.15 :) will compile and test now
17:03<sarnold>r4fkramer: I don't actually see the grub menu very often, but I think 'e' will do the job
17:05<r4fkramer>Fine sarnold. Please zoke, do I have to replace 'ro' to 'rw' and include init=/bin/bash after 'rw' on the same line ?
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17:06<zoke>r4fkramer: ro can stay... but then you need to do something like "mount -o remount,rw /" after the system has booted into a bash prompt
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17:07<r4fkramer>Ok zoke, I will maintain ro and include 'mount -o remount,rw /' is that enough ?
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17:07<StrongBit>hello
17:08<StrongBit>I have a question regarding hashcat
17:08<zoke>r4fkramer: the mount command is not part of the boot options... just to be clear
17:08<StrongBit>I need some help... If I run benchmark tests for -m 1400 (SHA2-256) I get cracking speeds of the order of 9500Mh/s - however - when I try the cracking the _real_ deal I get much, MUCH LOWER speeds
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17:08<StrongBit>I am using masks
17:08<zoke>r4fkramer: it's what you run prior to passwd or whatever you do to reset the password after boot
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17:08<r4fkramer>zoke, it's not clear. I don't know exactly what to be edited here, and how to edit
17:08<StrongBit>I get speeds of the order of 200Mh/s
17:08<StrongBit>when I try the cracking of the *
17:09<StrongBit>note: I have 4x RTX 3090
17:09<sarnold>fancy :)
17:09<r4fkramer>I'm completely lost here :(
17:10<zoke>r4fkramer: kernel command options in grub should include "noinitrd init=/bin/bash"
17:10<StrongBit>I should be getting speeds of around 9500Mh/s...... so why I am not?
17:10<zoke>r4fkramer: after that you boot and should end up in a shell as root
17:11<r4fkramer>I have ' ro single' in this line. I presume I have to edit modifications after this part.
17:12<zoke>r4fkramer: just add the mentioned options at the end of that line
17:12<r4fkramer>zoke, after 'ro single' do I include 'noinitrd init=/bin/bash' ?
17:13<zoke>r4fkramer: yes...
17:13<r4fkramer>And maintain 'ro single' ? Just to confirm, please.
17:13<zoke>r4fkramer: yes... 'ro single noinitrd init=/bin/bash'
17:14<r4fkramer>Fine zoke, thank you for Great Support (and patience, too :) ) Let me proceed here.
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17:15<sney>StrongBit: broadly, it's hard to design a benchmark for anything that actually indicates real-world performance. if you've confirmed that nvidia-driver is loaded and that you have all of the required opencl/cuda stuff, it's probably just something more challenging in your "real deal" that the benchmark doesn't reflect.
17:15<sney>StrongBit: anyway, #debian is more about general purpose OS support, so you might find more specific advice in #hashcat on libera
17:16<kali_>I want to sell bank cards
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17:16<sney>kali_: brilliant opsec, joining a public irc channel and offering to commit crimes
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17:22<r4fkramer>zoke, I entered root prompt, entered 'passwd' to rename my root passwd but it gets the following message: 'Authentication token manipulation error', and then: passwd: password unchanged.
17:23<r4fkramer>This debian version is 7.11, not 7.4, sorry.
17:23<StrongBit>sney: I only have the cuda stuff
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17:23<zoke>r4fkramer: did you do the 'mount -o remount,rw /' command prior to running passwd?
17:23<StrongBit>opencl should not be required for nvidia gpus
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17:24<sney>StrongBit: ok, I said opencl/cuda as a general catchall because I don't know the specifics. if you confirmed that you have the drivers and libraries you need, and that the program is using them, then... see the rest of the comment
17:24<r4fkramer>Oh, this command is to be written in command prompt ?
17:25<zoke>r4fkramer: yes... so you get a writable root filesystem
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17:25<r4fkramer>Fine, let me proceed here. Thank you again zoke
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17:27<r4fkramer>zoke, no space after 'remount' term ? Like this: remount,rw / ?
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17:27<zoke>r4fkramer: yup... no space there
17:28<r4fkramer>Fine !!!:)
17:29<r4fkramer>Now it says: EXT4-fs (sda2): re-mounted. Opts: errors=remount-ro
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17:30<r4fkramer>and it was changed succesfully
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17:31<zoke>r4fkramer: remount / read only and reboot, and start as normal
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17:31<zoke>r4fkramer: same mount command as before but substitute rw with ro
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17:33<r4fkramer>Now I got confused again. root password was changed successfully.
17:35<zoke>r4fkramer: yes... you're done with the minimal environment caused by the extra boot options. Reboot the system and start it up as normal with no extra options
17:37<zoke>r4fkramer: the readonly remount is optional and is more of a way to avoid fsck on old ext2 filesystems
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17:40<r4fkramer>Sorry zoke, I suffered some interruption here. Let me see if I can understand your last messages and try to reboot it.
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17:42<zoke>r4fkramer: no worries...
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17:43<r4fkramer>Before reboot, I have to type 'remount / read only' and reboot. Is that right ?
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17:45<r4fkramer>'remount / read only' with these spaces ?
17:46<zoke>r4fkramer: "mount -o remount,ro /"
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17:47<r4fkramer>EXT4-fs (sda2): re-mounted. Opts: errors=remount-ro
17:47<r4fkramer>The same error message
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17:48<zoke>r4fkramer: it's not an error message. Just a log message
17:48<zoke>r4fkramer: now you can run "reboot"
17:49<r4fkramer>I can't reboot. 'reboot' command doesn't work now
17:50<r4fkramer>It says: better to use shutdown instead of reboot from the command line.
17:50<r4fkramer>I tried shutdown -f, but it didn't work too :(
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17:51<zoke>r4fkramer: do you have physical access to the machine? with a keyboard plugged in?
17:51<r4fkramer>yes, I'm typing directly to the note with this debian installation
17:52<zoke>r4fkramer: try pressing Alt+SysRq+b
17:52<r4fkramer>When I type 'reboot', I have the following message: WARNING: couldn't determine runlevel - doing soft reboot
17:53<LtL>r4fkramer: shutdown -r now
17:53<zoke>r4fkramer: if there is no SysRq key do Alt+PrintScr+b instead
17:53<r4fkramer>And then shutdown: /run/initctl: no such file or directory
17:53<Tenkawa>are you in a chroot environment?
17:53<r4fkramer>LtL, shutdown -r doesn't work also, I tried it before
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17:54<zoke>Tenkawa: he's in a init=/bin/bash env
17:54<r4fkramer>Ok zoke, let my try it here
17:54<LtL>r4fkramer: include 'now' maybe
17:54<Tenkawa>zoke: he should be able to give it an init 6 then
17:55<Tenkawa>it theoreticly should pick up all the env then
17:55<Tenkawa>might need to full path init binary
17:56<zoke>iirc init was quite bitchy when not running with pid 1
17:56<zoke>which would be the case here as bash should have pid 1
17:57<Tenkawa>zoke: most of the time yes... but when desperate..
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17:57<zoke>Tenkawa: when desperate... Magic SysRq key :p
17:58<Tenkawa>sysrq needs a handler..
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17:58<Tenkawa>you only get that if your kernel has it compiled right
17:59<Tenkawa>big assumption here
17:59<r4fkramer>zoke, 'Alt+PrintScr+b' but password changed is not working. I don't know what to do anymore: desperate situation this :(
18:00<zoke>r4fkramer: did you use any special symbols in the password?
18:00<Tenkawa>let me catch up on whats going on (missed the backstor).. what "are" you trying to fix?
18:00<zoke>r4fkramer: that can be an issue if keymaps don't match
18:00<zoke>Tenkawa: reseting root password on a wheezy installation
18:01<Tenkawa>do you have a live media installer?
18:01<Tenkawa>zoke: root is locked on wheezy installs
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18:02<Tenkawa>you have to use regular account
18:02<zoke>then I guess he will have to log in as a regular user and then run su to become root
18:03<Tenkawa>root account gets locked on completion of install
18:04<Tenkawa>only ones it doesn't (if I am remembering correctly) is non-gui/server installs
18:04<zoke>don't remember that part... maybe since I always installed minimal as a starting point
18:05<zoke>r4fkramer: can you log in as a regular user?
18:05<Tenkawa>and only on console there
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18:06<Tenkawa>login then su should work from console though
18:07<Tenkawa>so modify "root account gets locked on completion of install" just a bit
18:08<Tenkawa>it prevents direct login except from console unless you su
18:10<r4fkramer>zoke, I don't remember if my regular user is 'r4fkramer'. Probably not, for when I tried to rename password for this user, prompt pointed me: this user doesn't exist
18:11<r4fkramer>now, I entered again in rescue mode, and asked me root password for maintenance. I typed the password I renamed and entered root prompt.
18:12<Tenkawa>r4fkramer: do a ls /home
18:12<Tenkawa>it will show you the username that way
18:12<zoke>or 'cat /etc/passwd'
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18:12<Tenkawa>zoke: if its a small system this will save a lot to read through
18:13<Tenkawa>easier than wading through passwd if you dont know whats in there
18:13<r4fkramer>Thank you Tenkawa, I'd forgotten this command to know the regular user name
18:13<Tenkawa>np
18:13<zoke>Tenkawa: I know... just my goto way :p
18:13<Tenkawa>zoke: I hear ya
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18:14<zoke>Tenkawa: since username and homefolder name don't need to match
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18:14<Tenkawa>zoke: for 99.9% of users especially those who are in this situation... they do
18:14<r4fkramer>zoke and Tenkawa, now I entered as 'robson' user (my regular user)
18:15<r4fkramer>Let me see if I can use root user through terminal.
18:15<Tenkawa>good luck
18:15<zoke>r4fkramer: run the command 'su -' to get a password prompt and become root
18:15<r4fkramer>Thank you twice !
18:16<zoke>Tenkawa: 'getent passwd 1000' is usually a good option on a single user system
18:16<r4fkramer>Yes, zoke, I know it. The question is: is that going to work ? Let me try it now
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18:21<userT>Can someone help with a bug in a package?
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18:22<r4fkramer>zoke and Tenkawa, after lots of troubles here, finally it worked :) Thak you very much for attention, patience and Great Support !
18:22<Tenkawa>great!!! good to hear. glad we could help
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18:22<zoke>r4fkramer: glad you got it all working
18:23<Tenkawa>userT: whats up?
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18:26<userT>It's about the "caps" package specifically.
18:26<userT>Which is a dependency for the libasound2-plugin-equal package.
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18:27<userT>I don't know if ALL packages should have existing both x86 and x64 versions, or at least arch-independent.
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18:27<userT>Caps ships in both versions, but...
18:27-!-otisolsen70 [~otisolsen@xd4ed80b5.cust.hiper.dk] has quit []
18:27<userT>Both cannot coexist at same time.
18:28<userT>Because one necessarily breaks the other.
18:28<userT>Thus doing the same to libasound2-plugin-equal.
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18:28<userT>And why is this?
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18:28<Tenkawa>that needs to be addressed with the package maintainer
18:28<userT>Because both caps packages install in *exactly* the same absolute path within system.
18:28<somiaj>Most packages (except for libs) are not set up for multiarch, so due to binary conflicts you cannot install both at the same time
18:29<Tenkawa>if they need a multiarch pkg
18:29<Tenkawa>somiaj: heh beat me to it
18:29<somiaj>Yea, you could file a wish list bug with the package to ask that it be made multiarch
18:29<userT>somiaj: and why is that, if I may ask?
18:29<somiaj>userT: a combination of most binaries (except libaries) there is little reason to need two versions for multiple arches installed along with the work to set it up
18:30<somiaj>for instance there really isn't an arch depedent place to put binaries, there is just /usr/bin
18:30<somiaj>while for libs there is /usr/lib/arch-linux-gnu/ for the different linux arches
18:31<somiaj>Now as mentioned there is no reason this couldn't be setup, it is just the need for it is very minimal
18:31<somiaj>and as such both policy and president is to not make binary packages (beyond libs) multiarch
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18:38<userT>somiaj: maybe I'm failing to understand something, but that still doesn't solve my doubt of how much effort can it be to install x64 caps into /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu, and x86 caps into /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu, *instead* of both being installed in /usr/lib/ladspa/...
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18:38<userT>Because there exist the 2 versions of caps: x64 and x86.
18:38<sarnold>userT: you might have fun modifying the package to do exactly that
18:39<userT>What do you mean?
18:39<somiaj>userT: oh this is a libary? I thought it was a binary. If the libary isn't multiarch, you can file a wishlist bug for this. I'm unsure why this particular libary isn't built multiarch
18:39<sarnold>userT: make a patch to the source package, test it out, and if you get it to work, you can attach it to a bug; a patch on a bug report is often a good way to get something fixed :)
18:40<userT>somiaj: *it's built multiarch*. At very least i386 and amd64. What's wrong, at least for me, is the fact that they install in the exact same absolute path within the system, thus breaking each other.
18:41<somiaj>that isn't multiarch
18:41<somiaj>a package that supports multiarch can have versions from multiple arches installed
18:42<somiaj>that package has two bugs, and it is just this, make it multiarch
18:42<somiaj>https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=739124
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18:42<somiaj>But here is no response from the maintainer about this, and this is an old bug. So might just be a package that needs some help
18:43<userT>Is the maintainer nowhere to be found?
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18:45<somiaj>I do see one of the maintainers has retired from the team. I'm not quite sure, but yea it appears that this package just isn't multiarch, and partly because someone needs to do the work to make it so
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18:45<somiaj>if you feel like helping out, here is the salsa page, https://salsa.debian.org/multimedia-team/caps
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18:55<userT>I wonder if that contact email still works...
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18:58<sarnold>userT: it looks like it gets a fair amount of use https://lists.debian.org/debian-multimedia/2021/09/threads.html
18:58<sarnold>granted a lot of that might be from robots but still
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19:03<userT>...
19:04<somiaj>userT: which contact email? It appears this is a known issue, also appears it has been known for a while. You could add to the bug asking what the status of this is, or you could help out and submit a patch.
19:05<somiaj>but probably better to use the bug vs send emails directly, also the maintainer whose name is on the package is the one that appears to have retired from the team.
19:06<userT>somiaj: I mean the email appearing at very bottom of your last Debian link.
19:07<somiaj>userT: that README probably comes from upstream, and wouldn't be a part of creating the debian package.
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19:32<userT>In another different thing, I have a problem with a game that simply refuses to search and read its required libraries from any locations other than the ones specified at the time of its compilation (as far as I understand it).
19:32<userT>I.e., some specific directories hard coded in the game, and of course system's standard library locations.
19:33<userT>Not even LD_LIBRARY_PATH or LD_PRELOAD work, and the binary has no setuid nor setgid at all.
19:33<userT>Where can I find help regarding this stuff?
19:35<sarnold>games can do Funny Things because they either think they know better, or as some sort of antipiracy attempt.. you may or may not have options, here
19:35<sarnold>the patchelf package will probably let you edit the rpath used in the executable
19:36<sarnold>cleaner, if it works, would be to fiddle with /etc/ld.so.preload -- but that would affect *all* processes, so it's not exactly clean
19:37<sarnold>but if the libraries are in an odd location, /etc/ld.so.conf.d/ files might be best
19:37<sarnold>it depends upon what the problem is..
19:38<userT>sarnold: I do run the game through command line, and I already tried prefixing it with LD_PRELOAD=whatever/directory. No dice.
19:38<userT>I even also tried patchelf already.
19:38<userT>But here I found something even worse:
19:39<sarnold>dang. maybe they supplied their own loader, or maybe these libraries are loaded with dlopen() or their own dlopen-ish implementation
19:40<userT>Listing binary's default rpath with patchelf or chrpath gives just this: $ORIGIN.
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19:40<userT>Which should mean that binary should search in the same directory binary is.
19:40<userT>Yet this is NOT the case.
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19:41<userT>Because I tried putting all required libraries there, and game insists in looking them in /usr/lib...
19:42<userT>Ok, it was not game's own message, seemingly, but an error "ALSA lib [something].c:[some number]: cannot load shared library..."
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20:00<userT>sarnold, somiaj: ???
20:00<sarnold>userT: no luck? :(
20:01<sarnold>userT: have you straced the game? I wonder if that'll work..
20:01<sarnold>userT: it might not, game devs are cranky about that kind of thing
20:02<userT>sarnold: were you able to read my last messages?
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20:10<sarnold>userT: the last I saw was: Fri 17 23:42:03 < userT> Ok, it was not game's own message, seemingly, but an error "ALSA lib [something].c:[some number]: cannot load shared library..."
20:11<userT>sarnold: yes, that.
20:11<userT>sarnold: "strace" the game?
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20:13<sarnold>userT: yeah; strace prints out every syscall a process makes. it's *huge*. it's my go-to debugging tool when log files don't have what I need.. try 'strace ls' to get a feel for it, then try it 'strace -o /tmp/game.out -f gamename' .. and then read through /tmp/game.out to see everything it tried to do
20:13<userT>Thanks. I may try that then.
20:14<Guest6877>i'm using cdebootstrap -f minimal bullseye bullseye and apt ist being installed?
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20:18<richard_h>is there a general way to tell what package added a user/group (if it was added by a package), and then what the intended use is?
20:19<richard_h>similar to how I can "dpkg -S /file/name" to find out what package installed a file
20:20<sarnold>grep -r <username> /var/lib/dpkg/info/ is a good starting point
20:20<richard_h>good point
20:21<richard_h>so unsurprisingly, the sambashare group was added by the samba package
20:21<sarnold>heh now it's a bit harder..
20:22<richard_h>yes, the postinst file doesn't tell me what it's for
20:22<richard_h>one guess is that I could use it to group-own my samba shares ...
20:23<richard_h>but if that's not the intended use, it might conflict with some other purpose
20:23<richard_h>I guess I should just create a new group if I want one, and leave it alone
20:24<aloo_shu>maybe the manpage is going into it
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20:28<userT>sarnold: what's the -f option for? "For following forks"?
20:29<sarnold>userT: yes, it's pretty common for more-complicated applications to have a bunch of processes cooperate
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20:30<userT>Oh.
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20:33<userT>Thanks for your help.
20:34<sarnold>good luck userT :)
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21:13<jcbjoe2021>whats teh diffrence from libre irc support and oftc irc support. i know oftc has been around for a while
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21:14<danielssan>jcbjoe2021: do you mean libera? if yes, oftc and libera are just different irc servers
21:14<jcbjoe2021>i don't want to ask the same questions in oftc and have someone on librec say why are you asking questions in two diffrent places
21:14<jcbjoe2021>thanks danielssan
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21:15<coruja>official debian irc support is here on oftc
21:15<jcbjoe2021>Question is it best to run debian in virtual box on my mid 2018 macbook pro. or can i install debian straight up?
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21:17<danielssan>vm, afaik macbook pros (with touchid and touchbar are still a hassle to get running)
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21:18<jcbjoe2021>Dam!
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21:19<coruja>jcbjoe2021: it's rather a linux issue in general, independent from which dstribution you want to try
21:19<coruja>distribution
21:20<coruja>(they asked for arch linux before too)
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21:26<danielssan>is there an easy way to tell debian/rules binary to use more cores? using this method on my pc takes multiple hours in comparison to make -j8 deb-pkg (talking about the linux kernel)
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21:27<sarnold>danielssan: what tool are you using to build the package now?
21:28<danielssan>sarnold: i was using the tutorial on the debian wiki page, which tells me to fakeroot debian/rules binary
21:28<Tenkawa>danielssan: what kind of machine?
21:29<sarnold>danielssan: aha; try fakeroot debian/rules binary -j8
21:29<danielssan>and with that it still uses all 8 threads, but only up to 50% (and the utilization goes up and down) in comparison to make which uses all 8 threads at 100% all the time (which takes about 20 mins? or so
21:29<danielssan>sarnold: ryzen 5 2400G
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21:30<Tenkawa>you can pass a env var into that too that acts as a debootstrap header.. I'd have to look it up though.. its in all my build scripts
21:30<ChmEarl>export MAKELEVEL=9
21:31<Tenkawa>I run -j 54 for my cluster here
21:31<Tenkawa>for my distcc+ccache cluster
21:31<danielssan>so is MAKELEVEL=9 for 9 threads or 8?
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21:31<Tenkawa>rule of thumb is 1.5*cores
21:32<Tenkawa>er threads
21:32<sarnold>don't overlook memory though
21:32<danielssan>how come? because when I use j8 it uses all 8 threads on 100%
21:32<sarnold>if you've got a 32 thread machine with 16 gigs of ram that'll be a bad time :)
21:32<jcbjoe2021>stupid mac. when it goes to sleep it disconnects me from irc
21:32<Tenkawa>sarnold: memory is rarely a problem
21:32<Tenkawa>sarnold: I've never ran ouy
21:32<Tenkawa>er out
21:33<jcbjoe2021>danielssan: i will install virtualbox and run debian. dam! i will just run it fullscreen
21:33<danielssan>jcbjoe2021: buy better hardware ;)
21:33<Guest6877>what's the root password if i run /sbin/init after cdebootstrap?
21:33<sarnold>Tenkawa: I used to suggest using the amount of memory, in gigabytes, as an input, but lately toolchains just drink so much memory, I think assuming 1.5 gigs per process is more like it
21:33<jcbjoe2021>danielssan: yep
21:34<coruja>jcbjoe2021: you may also run another one with arch linux ;)
21:34<sarnold>I keep thinking I ought to put together an nproc-alike tool that takes machine memory into consideration too, but .. lazy.
21:34<Tenkawa>sarnold: I've got 16gb on the largest node and it has never used more than 2gb during a compile because of the distribution.. if the compile is using up 1.5gb its not releasing ram properly or its over committing jobs
21:35<Tenkawa>sarnold: I run 20-30 builds a week
21:35<jcbjoe2021>coruja: yep i will run debian and arch
21:35<Tenkawa>minimum
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21:36<Tenkawa>cpu and disk io are much bigger concerns
21:36<jcbjoe2021>bbl
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21:36<sarnold>Tenkawa: I wonder if ccache is saving your bacon there :) running 56 jobs on a 16 gig machine sounds very unusual
21:36<Tenkawa>he left but I feel that guy's mac sleep discon pain
21:37<sarnold>yeah :(
21:37<Tenkawa>sarnold: you didn't read obviously
21:37<Tenkawa>I said ccache + distcc
21:37<Tenkawa>I run a 10 node cluster
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21:38<Tenkawa>the largest nodes have 16gb of ram
21:38<Tenkawa>a few have 8gb.. most have 4gb
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21:41<sarnold>Tenkawa: so how many processes run at once on that 16 gig machine?
21:41<Tenkawa>haahaa... it was running a couple hundred one afternoon
21:42<sarnold>wow
21:42<Tenkawa>its a dedicated build server
21:42<sarnold>when I bought a decent-sized dual xeon machine with 128 gigs the first thing I did was try out a bunch of defconfig kernel builds; make -j 300 was fastest
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21:42<Tenkawa>ps auxww | wc -l
21:42<Tenkawa>273
21:42<Tenkawa>273 just right now
21:42<sarnold>how many are gcc / ld / etc ?
21:43<sarnold>vs just run of the mill sshd bash etc
21:43<Tenkawa>let me look
21:43<sarnold>I was honestly surprised I had any performance improvements beyond -j 150 or so -- I expected everything beyond about that to be worse :)
21:44<Tenkawa>mostly all others atm
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21:45<Tenkawa>the problem is it hits 90C+ temp on the primary node
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21:45<Tenkawa>even with 2 turbine fans
21:46<Tenkawa>but it can build a cross arm kernel in under 6 min
21:46<Tenkawa>by itself
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21:46<Tenkawa>the rest of the arm cluster can do it even quicker
21:46<jcbjoe2021>the debian site looks diffrent
21:46<Tenkawa>jcbjoe2021: oh?
21:47<Tenkawa>yeah it does
21:47<Tenkawa> Last Built: Sun, Sep 12 23:27:33 UTC 2021
21:47<Tenkawa>changed 5 days ago
21:48<jcbjoe2021>im exicted all over again. just downloaded the debian net install iso. this will be fun
21:49<coruja>jcbjoe2021: a debian installation usually is a quite smooth ride
21:49<Tenkawa>cheers all.. time for me to head out
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21:54<jcbjoe2021>installing in virutalbox isn't the same as installing it on realhardware. nothing like having a second computer running while your main computer is installing linux. using your second computer to irc and get help when your stuck lol
21:55<coruja>or be able to read the installation guide :)
21:56<jcbjoe2021>yep, old school lol
21:56<jcbjoe2021>i remember installing gentoo took like 3 days
21:56<jcbjoe2021>according to steve jobs i was holding it wrong lol
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22:02<jcbjoe2021>i haven't tried kde since like kde 6 whenver that was
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22:04<Urk>What is the best emulator for trying out Kernel 5.10 while running Kernel 4.19?
22:04<Urk>I have a free moments while I am on hold at work, and figured I should look into this since I do want to stay with Debian if possible.
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22:05<Urk>I assume it is going to be something similar to QEMU, but I recall there was something better, but I don't remember the name.
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22:05<dvs>I guess that means you're running buster.
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22:14<jcbjoe2021>so i need help go figure. i tried to be cute and use a diffrent password then the ones i've used for years. i forgot my root password and regular user password? is there a recovery i can boot into and change the root password?
22:15<jcbjoe2021>or use the live cd
22:15<sney>!ifrp
22:15<dpkg>For GRUB: 1) press 'e' to edit the kernel setting in the grub command line (add 'init=/bin/sh' to the end of it) 2) 'fsck' your root file system, 3) 'mount -o remount,rw /', 4) 'passwd root' 5) 'mount -o remount,ro /' 6) 'reboot -d -f' (exec /sbin/init should work); For LILO: 1) 'Linux init=/bin/sh' at the LILO boot prompt (hold Shift while booting), steps 2-6 are the same; For yaboot: 1) 'Linux init=/bin/sh' at yaboot prompt.
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22:16<jcbjoe2021>thanks i love linux :D
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22:51<jcbjoe2021>i installed kde cinnamon and some other desktop managers or display managers but im stuck in gnome. anyway to switch between them? do i need to do something or can i find this in the login screen?
22:52<sney>there is a menu in the corner of the login interface that will let you change the session type
22:53<sney>if you're on buster, the menu is a little gear option next to the password field instead.
22:53<jcbjoe2021>im on debian 11
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22:54<jcbjoe2021>found the gear
22:54<jcbjoe2021>thanks
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23:43<jcbjoe2021>i don't know where to start. virtualbox is running gnome fine but when i type something in say chromium it stutters like this jjjjjjjjjmmmmmm i have 3d acceleration checked and i have it at 256 ram
23:43<jcbjoe2021>any ideas?
23:43<jcbjoe2021>gnome says adapter for video is unknown. i have already installed guest additions
23:44<sney>are you using xorg or wayland with gnome?
23:45<jcbjoe2021>sney: i forgot those terms
23:45<jcbjoe2021>im in virtualbox that's all i know
23:46<sney>when you select the gnome session at the login menu, does it say "gnome" or "gnome (xorg)"
23:47<jcbjoe2021>let me look
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23:48<jcbjoe2021>i will brb gotta go get. keyboard lol
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---Logclosed Sat Sep 18 00:00:42 2021