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#debian IRC Logs for 2021-12-31

---Logopened Fri Dec 31 00:00:09 2021
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00:01-!-simonpatapon is "Simon Patapon" on #debian-quebec #buddhism #debian-next #oftc #debian #bitlbee
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00:59<Brandon_IX>I've set up an nfs share but whenever I try to mount it from another machine I get an error about the host being disallowed or a privileged port needed
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00:59<Brandon_IX>I think maybe I need to do something with rpcbind?
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01:15<Gombye>Brandon_IX: What is in /etc/exports on the server?
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01:17<Brandon_IX>Gombye: I managed to connect via the commandline but not nautilus, I think it might be gvfs not supporting nfs4
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01:38<Guest9707>hello
01:38<Guest9707>is anyone is online
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01:40<petit>y
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01:55<random>How i get output in english of command line? https://paste-bin.xyz/29290
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01:56-!-eventhorizon5 is "Ryan" on #debian
02:03<twb>random: LC_ALL=C.UTF-8
02:03<twb>random: probably you want that in between "sudo" and "apt"
02:03<twb>random: alternatively, you can talk to other brasileros
02:03<twb>!pt
02:03<dpkg>Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-br ) - debian-user-portuguese@lists.debian.org
02:07<petit>!fr
02:07<dpkg>Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr or #debian-quebec. - debian-user-french@lists.debian.org
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02:08<Wulf>!en
02:08<dpkg>The language of #debian is English. We will do our best to help you regardless of your level of English but you might be more comfortable asking for help in your own language. Ask me about your language code for more information, for example /msg dpkg br ; /msg dpkg pt ; /msg dpkg es ; /msg dpkg fr ; /msg dpkg de
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02:09<twb>random: it looks to me like /var/lib/apt/lists and /var/lib/dpkg are both missing
02:09<twb>random: that sounds very very bad
02:10<Wulf>!tlh
02:10<twb>Wulf: is that the language code for Klingon?
02:13<Wulf>twb: yes. But I'm wondering why it's got 3 letters according to wikipedia.
02:13<random>twb: what i make?
02:14<twb>Wulf: ISO 639-2 is always 3 letters
02:14<twb>Wulf: ISO 639-1 used two-letter codes, but it has far fewer languages
02:14<twb>e.g. no diyrbal or woi wurrung or yorta yorta
02:15<Wulf>twb: ah, that explains it. They should've named those 639-2 (2 letters) and 639-3 (3 letters).
02:15<twb>I think they did and I got mixed up
02:15<Wulf>twb: no, you're right
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02:17<truth>Is there a command line utility that reports network activity of apps on the same command line? Like...
02:18<truth>user$ report-network-activity-of a_program
02:20<SonicR>I am trying to change permissions for a file to read-only. is this the correct procedure? http://paste.debian.net/1225334/
02:22<eventhorizon5>SonicR: chmod won't change permissions of the symlink, but the pointed-to file. In the ls command, you're listing the symlink.
02:22<hexology>(if it wasn't a symlink, the answer would be "yes")
02:22<Wulf>SonicR: unlikely. rm /etc/resolv.con; echo "nameserver 123.567.789.012" > /etc/resolv.conf; chattr +i /etc/resolv.conf
02:23<Wulf>SonicR: can be undone with chattr -i /etc/resolv.conf
02:23<SonicR>ok look. after reboot the changes i did in that file changed. i need to prevent that. any clue ?
02:23<hexology>is that file generated by connman?
02:23<SonicR>hexology: i dont know
02:24<hexology>it's in /run, so i would guess that it is... but maybe someone here who uses connman can comment further
02:25<SonicR>hexology: within that file, it reads this//// # Generated by Connection Manager
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02:27<hexology>all the more reason to suspect that it's generated and not something you can easily control
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02:28<SonicR>I had t change the nameserver ip within that file, in order to get internet working. but after reboot the nameserver reverts to the old/wrong one
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02:30<eventhorizon5>SonicR: that means it's automatically generated. You'll have to either turn that off (or erase that resolv.conf file) or change a setting in conman to fix it.
02:30<Wulf>SonicR: it will be possible to set this in the right way. But that can be quite complicated and I never even heard about "connection manager". My way is messy but just works. Well, unless your "connection manager" dislikes that it can't write the file and crashes.
02:31<hexology>Wulf: connman is like Network-Manager as far as i know
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02:33<SonicR>eventhorizon5: you think deleteing /etc/resolv.conf could be the fix ?
02:34<Wulf>SonicR: it will be recreated automatically.
02:34<eventhorizon5>SonicR: possibly, unless connman puts it back. I'd recommend seeing if you can change the IP in connman itself, maybe there's a config file. My systems usually use NetworkManager, and I have to change the settings in that app and not directly in the file.
02:35<SonicR>I will try deleting and get back with news after reboot
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02:40<SonicR>it worked. now there are new values for nameserver, and this time generated by network maanger. # Generated by NetworkManager
02:44<random>twb: this folders are new... i resolve... thank you
02:44<twb>random: beware, you may have other problems
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02:45<twb>random: it is likely someone did a fuckup like "rm -rf /var"
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03:48<random>twb: I did it myself, I was organizing my partitions.
03:49<twb>ah
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05:05<maxzor>How do people do to place "[1]" placeholders for links in the mailing list?
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05:13<Wulf>maxzor: manually?
05:13<azeem>maxzor: I do it manually
05:14<Wulf>maxzor: you could of course write HTML emails and convert them to text, e.g. with lynx
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05:16<zoke>https://superuser.com/questions/717946/links-to-references-in-mutt-or-vim <- seems to be a plugin if using mutt
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05:17<zoke>looks like it's a vim-plugin... so if another editor is used it won't work
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05:19<maxzor>thank you
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05:24<twb>maxzor: I do it manually.
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05:35<sukhman>hello
05:35<petn-randall>hi sukhman
05:36<sukhman>can you drink water ?
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05:37<Wulf>sukhman: no, it contains too much DHMO.
05:38<sukhman>I am drinking water from my childhood. I am too bored now.
05:38<sukhman>do you know any substitute of water ?
05:39<sussudio>!confuse sukhman
05:39<dpkg>No, what are our gouda today, sukhman? Wellies of the Monarchy of Belarus with extra cream.
05:40<sukhman>well, I consume beer instead of water but problem is that I dont remember anything afterwards
05:41<sukhman>do you have any problems in your life ?
05:42<sussudio>yes, mostly people coming in here being offtopic.
05:42<Wulf>sukhman: yes. Incapable trolls for instance.
05:43<sussudio>you know when you live in the third world when your address is "near new water tank".
05:44<Wulf>sukhman: apply yourself. Try to be more entertaining.
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05:47<sukhman>
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05:50<sussudio>really, that was sukhman's isp's address.
05:50<Wulf>sussudio: what about it?
05:50<Wulf>oh.
05:50<Wulf>:)
05:51<twb>sussudio: that's nothing. In Scotland you sometimes get tourist directions like "turn left where the library used to be"
05:52<sussudio>did they even have libraries in Rudrapur.
05:52<Wulf>twb: then hopefully the data has been in openstreetmap where you can look at old data too
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05:54<twb>sussudio: in up.in or in .bd?
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05:55<Wulf>twb: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudrapur,_Uttarakhand
05:55<sussudio>india. most of the idiots that come in here trolling are.
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05:57<twb>I guess rural .bd people can't get internet in the first place :-(
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05:59<sussudio>they're probably too busy getting flooded all the time.
06:00<Wulf>twb: 70% of .bd pop has internet access
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06:41<shiweiqian>不支持中文吗?
06:42<shiweiqian>debain 11怎么装老显卡驱动
06:42<bremner>!zh
06:42<dpkg>如果您想要以中文得到 Debian 相關的協助,請加入 irc.debian.org 或 irc.oftc.net 上的 #dot 頻道,連線與加入頻道的方法請參閱 IRC 程式之相關說明,或於網路上搜尋。謝謝您的合作!- debian-chinese-big5@lists.debian.org/debian-chinese-gb@lists.debian.org
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06:43<bremner>sorry, 中文 is the sum total of my chinese knowledge
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06:50<SonicR>My /etc/resolv.conf gets poorly configured autmatically after each reboot by network manager. i need to manually edit it in order to get the internet working. what can i do ?
06:50<towo`>configure your dns in NM or disable NM
06:51<towo`>if you run NM you haven't to edit /etc/resolv.conf
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06:52<Wulf>SonicR: already gave you a workaround.
06:53<SonicR>Wulf: u mean to delete the file ?
06:53<Wulf>SonicR: chattr +i
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06:55<SonicR>Wulf: ok , i just ran chattr +i
06:56<SonicR>so now, it should be uneditable i assume
06:57<Wulf>SonicR: yep. But I hope you replaced the symlink with a normal file.
06:58<SonicR>replace symlink with a normal file?
07:01<SonicR>Wulf: how do i replace symlink?
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07:14<Wulf>SonicR: delete it.
07:15<Wulf>SonicR: didn't I give you the commands?!
07:20<SonicR>Wulf: nope. i think i missed that part
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07:24<Wulf>SonicR: rm /etc/resolv.conf; echo "nameserver 123.567.789.012" > /etc/resolv.conf; chattr +i /etc/resolv.conf
07:26<SonicR>Wulf: https://paste.debian.net/1225355/
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07:27<Wulf>SonicR: first, chattr -i
07:28<towo`>sudo echo "nameserver 123.567.789.012" > /etc/resolv.conf such command will never work
07:28<Wulf>did I say "sudo"?
07:29<Wulf>SonicR: do that as root
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07:31<towo`>i don't see the problem, setting that wanted nameserver in NM without editing the resolv.conf
07:32<towo`>that "workaround" is a rubbisch "fix"
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07:43<Wulf>towo`: gets the job done.
07:44<Wulf>towo`: rubbish are all those tools that configure the network for you and where it's hard to understand how to get them to do what YOU want.
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08:03<SonicR_>Wulf: i guess its uneditable now as it remained the same after reboot
08:03<SonicR_>thx]
08:06<SonicR_>I want to auto login at boot time on LXDE so i edited /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf and added autologin-user = my own user. However , after reboot. it didn't work. any clue?
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09:08<spawacz>when i see *:1234 in ss -tl, it means that this socket wis listening both to ipv4 and ipv6?
09:09<spawacz>because until now i was seeing pairs of [::]:1234 and 0.0.0.0:1234
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09:10<grawity>yes, technically it means a v6 socket listening on [::] but in Linux that also accepts ipv4 as well
09:10<grawity>if ss specifically shows [::], that socket has had the "bindv6only" flag set on it, to disable the automatic-ipv4 magic
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09:29<DPA>I'm using "apt-cache show something=bla" to determine if a specific version of a specific packages is in the repos. On my PC, I get "E: Version 'abc' for 'bla' was not found", and exit code 100. But on the system I actually need this, I get "N: Version 'abc' for 'bla' was not found", and en exit code of 0.
09:29<DPA>Are there any other / better ways to check this? Why does this happen anyway?
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09:30<DPA>(The exit code 0 in the failure case is my main problem).
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09:31<aindilis>BPA: ianae but maybe could try apt-cache policy something ?
09:36<DPA>That seams to always exit with 0. I guess I could grep the "apt-cache show thing | ! grep -q ': No packages found$'", but it's not pretty...
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09:44<Sqrt{Not}>DPA, are both machines running the same debian version?
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09:45<DPA>No, one runs stable, the other one testing.
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09:57<Sqrt{Not}>DPA, maybe check the /usr/share/doc/apt/changelog.gz on testing?
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09:58<samsep01>Hi
09:59<samsep01>How Can i Join DALnet With Proxy
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10:00<sussudio>can someone kline samsep01
10:00<samsep01>stfu
10:00<sussudio>and the horse he rode in on.
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10:03<azeem>samsep01: please keep it on topic, which is Debian support
10:03<samsep01>OK
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10:15<DPA>WTF, if I just do "apt-cache show nonexistant", I get some output, but if I try to pipe it somewhere, like "apt-cache show nonexistant | cat", I don't!?!
10:16<SonicR>when i boot up my debian, the wifi starts blocked and i need to run "rfkill unblock wifi" in order to start it
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10:19<Sqrt{Not}>DPA, maybe that output is on stderr ?
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10:22<DPA>No, apt just doesn't generate the notices anymore. After all, cat just outputs what it gets, there should be no difference in output if apt doesn't do anything different.
10:23<tohoyn>DPA, the command behaves strangely
10:23<bentham>I think 'nonexistant' is a misspelling. Maybe not yours.
10:24<tohoyn>command "LANG=en apt-cache show nonexistant" gives:
10:24<tohoyn>N: Unable to locate package nonexistant
10:24<tohoyn>and
10:24<tohoyn>E: No packages found
10:24<tohoyn>but ...
10:24<sussudio>!enter
10:24<dpkg>The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked for flooding the channel.
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10:24<Sqrt{Not}>well, cat will not get any output that is on stderr, in your example
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10:25<tohoyn>after command "LANG=en apt-cache show nonexistant 2>&1 | tee test.txt" file test.txt contains only "E: No packages found"
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10:28<DPA>Yes, exactly. And on testing, 'No packages found' is just a notice, so it's not printed either.
10:29<tohoyn>maybe apt-cache contains some logic to suppress the output "N: ..."
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10:41<DPA>I think I finally have a solution. Instead of grepping for "No packages found", I grep for the oposit, "grep -q '^Package: '".
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10:58<icelupin7>hello
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10:58<icelupin7>I'm Trying to install mediainfo_21.09-1_amd64.Debian_10
10:59<bremner>in stable? that's not really supported
10:59<icelupin7>but the packages in buster is pointing towards mediainfo_18.12-2_amd64.deb
11:00<bremner>oh. in old stable is _really_ not supported
11:00<icelupin7>oh
11:00<icelupin7>ok
11:00<sussudio>why would you need a newer version of mediainfo.
11:00<sussudio>,v mediainfo
11:00<judd>Package: mediainfo on amd64 -- stretch: 0.7.91-1; buster: 18.12-2; bullseye: 20.09-1; bookworm: 21.09-1; sid: 21.09-1
11:01<icelupin7>wine debian 10 was wine.4.02
11:01<icelupin7>*for
11:01<sussudio>what does that have to do with anything
11:01<icelupin7>had worked around it and installed wine.7.03
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11:02<icelupin7>so thought there might be similar way for mediainfo
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11:03<icelupin7>newer version of mediainfo because shows metadata of files accurately
11:03<bremner>do you know this for sure? or just a guess?
11:04<icelupin7>i know this
11:04<icelupin7>because i have manjaro in a different system
11:04<icelupin7>which has mediainfo 21.09-1
11:04<bremner>ok. your options are upgrade debian, or (maybe) make yourself a backport
11:04<bremner>!ssb
11:04<dpkg>First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>.
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11:05<sussudio>https://tracker.debian.org/media/packages/m/mediainfo/changelog-21.09-1 there's no reason to get this version, unless you're into shiny new shit.
11:05<icelupin7>unfortunately i am
11:05<sussudio>then you are wasting our time.
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11:06<icelupin7>making a backport how long would it take
11:06<icelupin7>i have never done it
11:06<icelupin7>so want to know before diving in
11:06<sussudio>a "backport" with changed copyright info?
11:07<icelupin7>yeah
11:07<sussudio>the differences between the one you have installed and the one in sid are minor.
11:08<icelupin7>ok
11:08<icelupin7>fine will make do with this one
11:08<icelupin7>only
11:09<icelupin7>wonder how mediainfo team put up debain 10 release if most people are not able install it
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11:14<icelupin7>,v wine
11:14<judd>Package: wine on amd64 -- stretch: 1.8.7-2; stretch-backports: 4.0-2~bpo9+1; buster: 4.0-2; bookworm: 5.0.3-3; bullseye: 5.0.3-3; sid: 5.0.3-3
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12:06<cc>is there some simple GUI video editing program available in debian packages? I need to cut a portion (a few seconds) out of a bigger video and to crop a part of it (middle portion). I see that there is kdenlive but it has more dependencies than probably my entire system has packages installed
12:07<esselfe>I think blender can do it, not sure
12:08<jmcnaught>cc: "aptitude search ~Guse::editing~Gworks-with::video" lists others including flowblade, lives, openshot, pitivi
12:08<FLD>cc: kdenlive can also run from .appimage or flatpak or from a chroot
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12:09<jmcnaught>cc: if you do not need kdenlive after you can also remove the pacakge then run "apt autoremove" to remove the dependencies that are no longer needed
12:09<FLD>but cutting and cropping should be possible with just ffmpeg
12:09<jmcnaught>Judging by number of dependencies is a little weird though.
12:10<cc>FLD: as far as I understand cutting with ffmpeg will require precise time points as well as exact coordinates
12:10<cc>none of which I have
12:11<cc>I used to use a very nice program called avidemux but it's gone from debian looks like
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12:12<FLD>or you could see if --no-install-recommends cuts down the installation burden of kdenlive sufficiently
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12:12<FLD>i've often used the kdenlive.appimage with success
12:14<zoke>iirc shotcut is in the debian repos... pretty nice for video editing
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12:15<zoke>it may be a bit overkill for what you want to do though
12:17<bremner>FWIW, when I played briefly before christmas, I found shotcut better than kdenlive.
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12:31<cc>well, I have installed 'lives' and was able to cut the necessary part between start and end; I guess I can live without cropping
12:32<cc>PS: how fucking delightful to see yet another application that ignores $XDG_CONFIG_HOME and wants to shit directly into $HOME
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12:33*cc purges with extreme prejudice
12:33<cc>makes one think that those people deploying every application in its own container aren't crazy after all
12:34<cc>(qubes os and the like)
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12:54<icelupin7>how do i join the offtopic channel?
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12:55<FLHerne>/join #debian-offtopic
12:56<icelupin7> #debian-offtopic :Cannot join channel (Need to be identified and verified to join this channel, '/msg NickServ help' to learn how to register and verify.)
12:56<icelupin7>being shown this
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12:56<zbychuk>Why channel topic is still Debian 11.1 "bullseye" ..... ?
12:56<Sqrt{Not}>so, you need to send that message to NickServ
13:00-!-mode/#debian [+o bremner] by ChanServ
13:00-!-bremner changed the topic of #debian to: Debian 11.2 "bullseye" /msg dpkg bullseye | oldstable, Debian 10 "buster" /msg dpkg buster | Stretch (Debian 9) on limited LTS support: /msg dpkg stretch-lts | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing/unstable: #debian-next | chanlogs: /msg dpkg irclog | Community expectations: http://deb.li/conduct
13:00<dvs>zbychuk: I've been wondering that for weeks
13:01<@bremner>td: s/11.1/11.2/
13:01-!-mode/#debian [-o bremner] by ChanServ
13:01<dvs>(and now for Libera.chat...)
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13:12<tohoyn>icelupin7: you probably need to register your nickname
13:12<icelupin7>finished it just now
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13:17<icelupin7>should i upgrade to stable?
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13:18<tohoyn>do you have oldstable?
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13:20<sussudio>don't let icelupin7 become a repeat of buster_broken...
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13:20<icelupin7>yeah
13:21<icelupin7>most applications which i used need backports
13:21<tohoyn>if your hardware is not very old I recommend upgrading to stable
13:21<icelupin7>ok
13:22<icelupin7>I'm not that familiar with upgrading
13:22<icelupin7>will have to look it up
13:22<tohoyn>sussudio: did the problem of buster_broken get solved?
13:23<icelupin7>https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/update-upgrade-debian-10-to-debian-11-bullseye/
13:23<icelupin7>would this do?
13:23<Sqrt{Not}>dpkg buster->bullseye
13:23<dpkg>Read (at least) the upgrading chapter of <release notes> https://deb.li/39cyD . TL;DR: In /etc/apt/sources.list change "buster" to "bullseye", fix the line for security updates (see <bullseye-security>), remove stable-specific lines like buster-backports. apt update && apt upgrade --no-new-pkgs && apt full-upgrade. 3rd party repos like <dmo> cause problems with upgrades. If working over ssh, upgrade ssh first, see <bullseye ssh upgrade>.
13:23<sussudio>tohoyn: after uninstalling the packages that kept it from upgrading, i think so.
13:24<tohoyn>icelupin7: looks ok
13:24<tohoyn>icelupin7: it is basically apt update, apt upgrade, and apt full-upgrade
13:25<jmcnaught>Following the instructions in the release notes is recommended (linked above).
13:25<jmcnaught>Most people also want to know what is new and things to look out for, also in the release notes.
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13:30<tohoyn>icelupin7: of course you must update sources.list before apt update
13:30<icelupin7>yeah understood
13:31<icelupin7>data should be backed up?
13:31<tohoyn>yes
13:31<icelupin7>ok
13:31<tohoyn>but I recommend reading the release notes first
13:32<tohoyn>even though the instructions there are rather complicated
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13:32<icelupin7>ok
13:32<icelupin7>visually nothing changes right?
13:33<tohoyn>I don't know.
13:33<tohoyn>I use Ubuntu and I have debian testing and sid installed in virtual boxes.
13:34<icelupin7>ah ok
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14:10<Spellbinder>×tamp
14:12<dvs>???
14:15<sussudio>&trampstamp
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15:35<aindilis>isn't there some package one can install that helps to harden one's debian system? I can't recall what it's called.
15:35<sussudio>apparmor?
15:35<aindilis>hrm
15:35<aindilis>it was like apt-get install security-harden or something
15:36<sussudio>i don't know if selinux is still a thing.
15:36<sussudio>,i selinux
15:36<judd>No package named 'selinux' was found in bullseye/amd64.
15:36<sussudio>,i apparmor
15:36<aindilis>it took care of much of the hardening process
15:36<judd>Package apparmor (admin, optional) in bullseye/amd64: user-space parser utility for AppArmor. Version: 2.13.6-10; Size: 624.7k; Installed: 2554k; Homepage: https://apparmor.net/
15:36<sussudio>that's what she said?
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15:36<aindilis>was waiting for it
15:36<aindilis>*harden*
15:36<aindilis>apparently
15:37<aindilis>https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=all§ion=all&arch=any&searchon=all&keywords=harden
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15:37<sussudio>,i harden-doc
15:37<judd>Package harden-doc (doc, optional) in bullseye/amd64: useful documentation to secure a Debian system. Version: 3.19+nmu1; Size: 941.4k; Installed: 8791k; Homepage: https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/securing-debian-howto/
15:38<aindilis>srry for dumb question, but where'd it go? apt-cache doesn't show it
15:39<RichardC>Hey everyone. I'm running Bullseye but my /etc/os-release is showing Bookworm/sid. Any thoughts as to why?
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15:40<dvs>RichardC: you installed a package from sid?
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15:41<RichardC>dvs: most likely. I have since removed the package and the entry pointing to sid from /etc/apt/sources.list.d
15:42<dvs>RichardC: but the dependencies of that package are still installed.
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15:42<RichardC>ah, possibly. I've run apt update and autoremove since, nothing to do.
15:42<RichardC>How would I go about cleaning this up?
15:43<dvs>downgrading is not supported
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15:44<RichardC>Well mystery solved, I guess
15:44<RichardC>Thanks
15:44<aindilis>so I take it harden has been permanently removed?
15:45<dvs>np
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15:47<sussudio>https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=782978
15:47<judd>Bug https://bugs.debian.org/782978 in ftp.debian.org (closed): «RM: harden -- RoQA; no longer useful»; severity: normal; opened: 2015-04-20; last modified: 2015-05-21.
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15:50<aindilis>sussudio: TY!
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15:51<aindilis>I guess I'll add "harden" functionality to my agent oriented programming use cases. see ya in 10 years when I finish :)
15:52<aindilis>can't start today cause of a friggin papercut
15:53<dvs>Just in time for Debian 16
15:53<aindilis>lol
15:53<aindilis>http://jason.sf.net
15:53-!-the4oo4 [~the4oo4@shenzhou.whatbox.ca] has quit [Quit: bye]
15:54<aindilis>provides some much needed agency to my projects, I was never going to be able to implement agency on my own
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15:59<random_>how i create an folder default in my home?
16:00<random_>i use xfce4.
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16:10<random__>reply me, by here.
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16:14<dvs>"a folder default" doesn't make any sense to me.
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16:15<zoke>dvs: you're not alone
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16:33<qrpnxz>i accidentally deleted /etc/hosts, there a script/way to regenerate the default?
16:33<Sqrt{Not}>random__, I usually make new subdirecories using the command line. But the robot will give you some links for help about xfce
16:33<qrpnxz>sorry to interrupt
16:33<Sqrt{Not}>!xfce
16:33<dpkg>Xfce is a pretty nifty Desktop Environment. Lightweight, fast, compact. To install, ask me about <install xfce>. https://wiki.debian.org/Xfce http://wiki.xfce.org/faq http://www.xfce.org/ #xfce on irc.libera.chat.
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16:37<DPA>I haven't followed the discussion, but to install xfce, I wouldn't install xfce4 like the wiki suggests. Instead, I would install task-xfce-desktop. I think that's the same thing an installer would do.
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16:42<zoke>qrpnxz: looks like it's created by the netbase post-install script
16:42<qrpnxz>ty sir
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16:43<zoke>qrpnxz: '/var/lib/dpkg/info/netbase.postinst configure' seems to do the trick
16:44<qrpnxz>epic, you are awesome
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16:46<Sqrt{Not}>random__, xfce's file manager is thunar
16:46<Sqrt{Not}>%thunar
16:46<dselect>Thunar (originally Filer) is a file manager for the X Window System, included with <XFCE> since version 4.4. Install the <thunar-volman> package to enable automatic management of removable media. http://docs.xfce.org/xfce/thunar/faq http://docs.xfce.org/xfce/thunar/start
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18:33<nurupo>why packages with cron files don't depend or recommend cron? e.g. https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/apt-listbugs
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18:52<raven523>nurupo: you can use those packages without cron. apt-listbugs provides a systemd .timer unit, so systemd can execute it on a schedule, and systemd is assumed to be installed on current debian systems
18:53<raven523>that package probably has functionality that works without cron or systemd too
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19:01<nurupo>raven523: but it also doesn't depend on systemd
19:02<raven523>probably because it's assumed that every system has systemd and the timer-based functionality is optional
19:02<Karlton>not sure why lennart thought it was a good idea to reimplement cron inside of pid 1
19:02<nurupo>><raven523> that package probably has functionality that works without cron or systemd too <-- right, but neither of cron or systemd are recommended or even suggested
19:02<nurupo>kind of find that weird
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19:03<nurupo>raven523: is it allowed to assume that though? i thought i could change my init to non-systemd
19:04<raven523>using other inits isn't officially supported or officially banned
19:04<Karlton>I use sinit instead of systemd
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19:05<Karlton>it's not supported, but pretty easy to boot with init=/usr/local/sbin/(alternative init)
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19:06<raven523>apache2 doesn't depend on systemd either even though it arguably needs an init system to start it at boot for it to be useful
19:07<raven523>but you could just run it from a shell or a different init or supervisor
19:07<nurupo>isn't that what recommended and suggested packages are for?
19:08<raven523>arguably, yes
19:08<raven523>but it's assumed that everyone has an init system
19:08<raven523>and everyone does have an init system
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19:09<bremner>nurupo: do you actually have a practical problem, or is this a theoretical discussion?
19:09<raven523>well, everyone running on a full machine. if you're running debian in a container like docker then you don't need an init system because docker itself starts the services
19:10<Karlton>you might be running sysvinit and openrc for service management
19:10<Karlton>those all you can still install with apt iirc
19:11<Karlton>I haven't tried to run those since jesse though
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20:07<nurupo>><bremner> nurupo: do you actually have a practical problem, or is this a theoretical discussion? <-- just trying to understand why packages that have cron functionality don't depend on cron in any way, either as depends, recommends or even suggests
20:07<nurupo>my theory was that perhaps if a package has a high enough priority (cron has "important" priority) it's assumed that it will be installed, but no one has mentioned that and the discussion got derailed to systemd timers and inits
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20:08<nurupo>so i haven't learned anything useful and my question is still unanswered
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20:26<xloem[m]>nurupo's concern sounds like a packaging error that people haven't had capacity to address?
20:27<Sqrt{Not}><bremner> nurupo: do you actually have a practical problem, or is this a theoretical discussion? <nurupo> my theory was ...
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20:29<xloem[m]>well it sounds like nurupo ran into something that didn't work and was frustrated, but i'm aware there are a lot of open bugs and debian needs to prioritise to what helps the majority of users
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21:09<nurupo>xloem[m]: i'm not saying that it's a packaging error
21:13<nurupo>also, i didn't run into anything
21:14<nurupo>just trying to learn about debian
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22:11<tyzef>hi, can a user that doesn't exist on an operating system gets permissions to work that operating system's files?
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22:11<tyzef>somebody told me about User IDentifier
22:12<tyzef>or am I force to create that user into that operating system ?
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22:20<another>who would you give permissions to?
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22:25<tyzef>another, i have two computer on a local network... let say User1 on PC1 and User2 on PC2... user1 want to send his /home to pc2 but gets permission refused because user1 is not on pc2
22:26<tyzef>i want to transfer by ssh
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22:27<dvs>tyzef: so create user1 on pc2 and make sure that the User IDs are the same.
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22:29<tyzef>dvs, so no other way, right ?
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22:30<dvs>tyzef: not that I can think of
22:30<Gombye>tyzef: User2 is unable to access user1's files, or you are not able to send the files in the first place?
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22:32<tyzef>i get such an error :
22:33<tyzef>rsync: [receiver] mkstemp /file/user1 failed: Permission denied (13)
22:34<Gombye>tyzef: Try using root@pc2 instead, where 'pc2' is whatever the actual address is.
22:36<tyzef>Gombye, yeah I got that idea too, easy right ? both debians have Mr Root... but somebody told me not to use Root to Root for a rsync transfer by ssh due to security reason ? or I missed understood
22:37<Gombye>If you are trying to send a directory to /home as a non-root user, you will get permission denied, because other users do not have permissions to create files in /home.
22:37<tyzef>oops, I forgot one point
22:39<tyzef>on pc2, there are 3 hdd, one for /system and 2 for files stocking... so I : "mount /dev/sdb1 /mnt" or "mount /dev/sdb1 /home/user2/mnt" but in both cases same error
22:40<tyzef>I have tried root1 to root2 and it works
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22:43<tyzef>on that local network, I have 4 computers, I am thinking of adduser a common user for each machins to make it simple
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22:44<Gombye>tyzef: Perhaps the security concern was allowing remote root logins at all. If no one else has access to your local network, though, that would be an issue.
22:44<Gombye>s/would be/would not be/
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22:48<Gombye>tyzef: You could do that, but keep in mind that if you are trying to, for example, send /home/user to /home on a different computer, you will first need to create that directory as root and change the ownership. Then you will be able to send the contents of /home/user to /home/user on the second computer as a non-root user.
22:53<tyzef>well
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23:00<tyzef>guys, thanks for your attention and making it clear to me, now have to go to that physical life, bye bye everyone \o/ !
23:01<dvs>no you don't ;-P
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23:02<tyzef>lol
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23:24<hemebond>Can someone please help me understand which version of Firefox I should have on my system? As far as I know I'm using the "testing" repos but apt-cache policy doesn't show a repo URL for "firefox".
23:25<hemebond>It also looks like firefox-esr is _the_ Firefox package that should be used.
23:25<dvs>,v firefox
23:25<judd>Package: firefox on amd64 -- sid: 95.0.1-1
23:26<hemebond>I should be on 95? I don't understand how I'm still on 80.0.1 then, and still getting updates.
23:26<dvs>hemebond: firefox-esr is the version being used in stable
23:26<dvs>,v firefox-esr
23:26<judd>Package: firefox-esr on amd64 -- stretch-updates: 60.6.3esr-1~deb9u1; stretch: 68.10.0esr-1~deb9u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 68.10.0esr-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 68.10.0esr-1~deb9u1; buster: 78.14.0esr-1~deb10u1; buster-security: 78.15.0esr-1~deb10u1; bullseye: 78.15.0esr-1~deb11u1; bookworm: 91.4.0esr-1; sid: 91.4.0esr-1; bullseye-security: 91.4.1esr-1~deb11u1
23:26<hemebond>dvs: That's what I thought but it's actually newer than the "firefox" I have installed.
23:27<hemebond>My Firefox just got updated to 80.0.1 and it's broken. It is also older than what I find in the packages.debian.org
23:27<dvs>hemebond: version 80 isn't available in Debian (currently)
23:28<hemebond>Thanks, that makes sense. Now I need to figure out how I got it installed.
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23:28<hemebond>If I installed it manually I don
23:28<hemebond>don't know why or how it got upgraded.
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23:31<hemebond>dvs: Is firefox in Debian at all? I only see firefox-esr.
23:31<dvs>only firefox-esr
23:31<hemebond>Aaaah, I see. Okay thank you very much for clearing that up. I'll switch to firefox-esr.
23:35<awal1>firefox is in sid. version 95.0.1-1
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23:35<gooseman>Happy new year, everyone.
23:36<hemebond>awal1: sid is unstable? Is that right? And so it's not in 'testing' at all?
23:36<awal1>yes
23:37<awal1>according to judd it is only in sid (unstable)
23:37<awal1>,v firefox
23:37<judd>Package: firefox on amd64 -- sid: 95.0.1-1
23:38<awal1>that is what i have in my sid
23:38<hemebond>I wonder if it was removed or I installed it manually.
23:38<awal1>run aptitude why firefox
23:39<hemebond>i task-desktop Recommends firefox | firefox-esr
23:39<awal1>you got the answer so
23:39<hemebond>Judging by the wiki it looks like I must have downloaded and installed it manually somehow. But I don't know why it would get updates (no apt source and all that).
23:40<hemebond>Unless it was removed from repos.
23:41<awal1>bro, your aptitude said your firefix was installed as a recommended pkge by task-desktop
23:41<hemebond>How can it be installed if it isn't in the repo?
23:42<hemebond>Which is why I'm thinking it was removed from the repo. Still, all clear now, thank you.
23:42<hemebond>I'll use firefox-esr from now on.
23:43<awal1>it was in the main repo when it was installed
23:43<awal1>logically
23:43<hemebond>Yeah, must have been.
23:43<gooseman>I'm running Debian 11 with Xfce 4.16 on a Dell Latitude E6420 laptop, and I'm trying to figure out why the HDMI port is not working for me. I would rather diagnose the software before diagnosing any hardware. I know my HDMI cable and external monitor are fine, because another machine can use them successfully. :)
23:43<gooseman>When I run `lspci | grep -i hdmi`, I only see an *Audio device.* When I run `xrandr | grep -i hdmi`, I see no results. This does not change before or after unplugging/plugging the HDMI cable. The laptop has an old NVidia card, and I installed the appropriate driver (through `nvidia-detect`). Unfortunattely that did not work, either.
23:43<gooseman>What else can I (or should I) try? I'm open to your suggestions.
23:45<gooseman>Oh, I've also already looked at https://wiki.debian.org/InstallingDebianOn/Dell/LatitudeE6420 . I didn't find anything related to my issue there.
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23:50<awal1>#817954
23:50<judd>Bug https://bugs.debian.org/817954 in src:firefox (open): «Keep Firefox out of Debian releases»; severity: serious; opened: 2016-03-12; last modified: 2020-06-14.
23:50<hemebond>Hmm, yeap, that's probably about the time I switched to 'testing' repos.
23:51<hemebond>I didn't think I'd get updates but I guess I don't understand how apt works.
23:52<awal1>try apt-mark
23:52<awal1>mark firefox as manually installed then purge it
23:52<awal1>not sure if it will work
23:52<awal1>then install ff-esr
23:53<hemebond>I've removed 'firefox'. It's "residual-config" now.
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23:54<awal1>it is not a good idea upgrade a full system from stable to testing. better upgrade from a minimal system then install stuff of the branch you in
23:54<awal1>purge the residual stuff
23:54<awal1>try aptitude purge ~c
23:55<awal1>but be carefull with the output/what you are doing
23:55<hemebond>Thanks, I think I'll leave it as-is for now unless it causes issues.
23:55<awal1>you scared&lol
23:55<awal1>?
23:55<hemebond>Of course. Broken things too many times 😆
23:55<awal1>try simulating
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23:56<awal1>aptitude -s purge ~c
23:56<awal1>-s you tell aptitude to just simulate
23:56<awal1>you can even try that without root, just as regular user
23:57<hemebond>What is ~c?
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23:58<hemebond>Wow, that command would break everything.
23:59<awal1>read here https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/aptitude/ch02s04s05.en.html
---Logclosed Sat Jan 01 00:00:10 2022