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#linode IRC Logs for 2006-02-11

---Logopened Sat Feb 11 00:00:59 2006
00:05<tronix>nfs mount?
00:20|-|adamg [] has joined #linode
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00:32<warewolf>well now
00:32|-|BB [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
00:32<warewolf>gnu java doesn't quite work very well with eclipse
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02:35[~]taupehat lets his vidcard cool off
03:01<taupehat>1AM and ALL IS WELL
03:03<tronix>4:03AM and MOST IS WELL
03:04[~]tronix suddenly realizes food would be a good thing(tm) and takes a break from debugging extensions.conf
03:12<@mikegrb>good idea
03:12[~]taupehat is in rpm dependency hell but at least he has chocolate pudding to help him through it
03:14<@mikegrb>that is what you get for choosing a distribution that uses rpms
03:15<taupehat>I'm trying
03:15<taupehat>using apt and everything
03:15<taupehat>it's mainly a 64-bit problem
03:15<@mikegrb>doesn't make rpm any better of a format
03:15<taupehat>so true, sigh
03:16<taupehat>apparently I have a new kernel
03:17|-|JonR [] has joined #linode
03:30<JonR>"load average: 8.63, 6.29, 4.09"
03:31<taupehat>I do sometimes wish nvidia drivers weren't such goobers when rebooting
03:31<JonR>something is horribly wrong here.
03:31<taupehat>with new kernel
03:31<taupehat>JonR: jeez
03:31<JonR>and yet I have 98% idle cpu
03:32<tronix>swap thrasher on another linode on the host?
03:34<JonR>I restarted apache and things are going much better now.
03:43<JonR>damn, I need more RAM, though.
03:43<JonR>spamassassin chews ram
03:44<taupehat>yes it does
03:44<taupehat>I use greylisting
03:44<taupehat>much more effective and lightweight
03:44<JonR>my mailserver setup is being held together only with a bit of luck, though.
03:44<taupehat>JonR: which distro?
03:44<JonR>I'm afraid to toss that in.
03:44<JonR>debian testing
03:45<taupehat>apt-get install postfix-gld
03:45<taupehat>that's pretty much all you have to do
03:45<taupehat>not postfix-gld
03:45<taupehat>postgrey wins
03:45<@mikegrb>not if you aren't using postfix
03:46<JonR>except for the part where I don't actually run postfix.
03:46<JonR>since I run courier.
03:46<taupehat>ahh, right
03:46<taupehat>sorry then
03:46<JonR>and my users want either spamassassin or crm114
04:01<tronix>JonR: you can also tweak apache settings... commenting out about 60% of the modules (all the ones I didn't need) helped a lot,
04:01<tronix>and ditto with forking settings
04:02<JonR>i actually want to move to lighttpd, but wordpress doesn't seem to support it yet
04:02<tronix>ahh that's unfortunate. I'm pretty much an Apache person but I've run lighttpd for v6 @ openbsd once
04:02<tronix>it was pretty good.
04:02<tronix>my needs are more estoteric so that's why I'm staying with Apache on my box... otherwise, I'd probably use lighttpd
04:10|-|jekil [~alessandr@] has joined #linode
04:33<JonR>"token_refill=100 token_max=1000"
04:33<JonR>did I get throttled down or something?
04:44<JonR>ah, it's back to normal.
04:44<JonR>if you did anything, thanks.
04:45<JonR>damn, though, spamassassin is really using up the io_tokens. I'm not sure why; I've got at least a meg of ram free.
04:53<JonR>hm. I might not have actually rebooted since caker upgraded Linode 64 to Linode 80... Gonna try that.
04:59<JonR>ah, much better.
05:06<JonR>yay, more ram.
05:07<JonR>I still wish I could replace mysql and apache with sqlite and lighty, but we can't have everything.
05:07<JonR>if only wordpress were written in python instead of php.
05:41<Dreamer3>JonR: do it
05:41<Dreamer3>JonR: i don't run apache
05:41<Dreamer3>but mysql is hard to go away from
05:53|-|BB_ changed nick to BB
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07:56<linbot>New news from forums: Hi, I have paid for the Linode 80..Account not set yet, why? in Sales Questions and Answers <>
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10:28<InsightComputer>Hello, is host 49 down?
10:29<Jay-odf>InsightComputer: you might want to file a ticket if you think it's down
10:29<Jay-odf>or ping caker & mikegrb
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10:41<linbot>New news from forums: Hist 49 Panic in System and Network Status <>
10:46<linbot>New news from forums: Host 49 Panic in System and Network Status <>
10:49|-|jekil [~alessandr@] has joined #linode
11:00[~]BB thinks its strange the amount of panics Linodes seem to have
11:03<warewolf>wow my sister's back is all kinds of fucked up
11:03<warewolf>and she's 20
11:04<warewolf>she has some problem in her spine and her muscles are fucked up because of it
11:18<Jetpack>take her to a osteopath or chiropractor
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13:01<KidSock>ssh: connect to host port 22: Connection refused
13:02<KidSock>Anyone know why sshd would stop running? I guess I need a reboot.
13:09<[|^__^|]>maybe it's the /lib/tls thing?
13:09<[|^__^|]>and you don't need a reboot to restart sshd
13:18<KidSock>Well I rebooted already but how do you restart sshd without rebooting?
13:19<KidSock>And what happend with lib/tls? Is there an xploit?
13:19<[|^__^|]>sudo /etc/init.d/ssh restart
13:20<[|^__^|]>it may be different for your distro
13:20<[|^__^|]>and the 2.6 kernel for linode doesn't like /lib/tls for threading stuff
13:20<[|^__^|]>so you have to mv it to /lib/tls-somethingelse
13:21<[|^__^|]>it's not an exploit
13:21<[|^__^|]>just a UML incompatability issue
13:21<KidSock>how do you issue a command if you can't ssh into the machine
13:25<KidSock>Is the tls issue documented somewhere? That's a pretty serious thing to do. I suppose if you move it the VM get's that dir from the source image?
13:28<[|^__^|]>KidSock: log in from the lish console dude
13:28<[|^__^|]>if you move it, the system uses some other kind of threading wotzit
13:28<[|^__^|]>one that works
13:29<[|^__^|]>I don't know what the particulars are
13:29<[|^__^|]>linbot: /lib/tls
13:29<[|^__^|]>linbot: tls
13:30<[|^__^|]>"/lib/tls contains the NPTL-enabled libraries, and without the existence of this directory, it'll fall back to using /lib/i686, which contains LinuxThreads libraries. "
13:30<[|^__^|]>yeah, sounds like you're right
13:30<[|^__^|]>anyway, if sshd isn't running, you can ssh into something like
13:31<[|^__^|]>where you use your username and linode host as needed
13:31<KidSock>Yeah, I see the lish thing. Good to know. Thanks.
13:33<KidSock>Oh, wait. I'm using debian small which is 2.4. It's not that then. Nothing in the logs. I guess it was just a fluke.
13:34|-|sprouse [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
13:34<KidSock>Looking at the available images it seems they're getting fairly out of date. Are there plans to create new ones or are all efforts on Xen?
13:38|-|spr [] has joined #linode
13:40<[|^__^|]>well hangon
13:40<[|^__^|]>if you're on debian, why aren't you shabooming regularly?
13:40<[|^__^|]>surely that brings it up to date neatly
13:40<[|^__^|]>the kernel is selected through the console web pages, not by your distro
13:41<[|^__^|]>alias shaboom='sudo sh -c "apt-get update && aptitude dist-upgrade && apt-get clean"'
13:41<[|^__^|]>for reference
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13:43<KidSock>I haven't "shaboom"ed in a looong time.
13:43<[|^__^|]>that is dangerous!
13:43<[|^__^|]>I do it every day
13:43<KidSock>In the configurations page I see: My Debian 3.0r1 (Small) Profile (default) Latest 2.4 Series (2.4.29-linode39-1um)
13:43<[|^__^|]>several times a day
13:44<[|^__^|]>to get all the security fixes
13:44<[|^__^|]>you ought to install cron-apt to help the process along
13:44<KidSock>I run very little. I don't update unless I hear about an xploit in particular applications.
13:44<[|^__^|]>and yes, you selected 2.4 from your config
13:44<[|^__^|]>making it not the /lib/tls
13:45<[|^__^|]>I have selected "latest 2.6"
13:45<[|^__^|]>making the tls dir relevant to me
13:45<[|^__^|]>but I am also on the debian small image
13:45<KidSock>Ahh, I didn't know you could do that. Interesting. At the moment though, I think I'll stick with 2.4.
13:46[~][|^__^|] shrugs
13:46<[|^__^|]>anyway, if you haven't shaboomed in a long while then it's entirely possible that you got cracked
13:46<[|^__^|]>you really ought to do it regularly and habitually
13:54<Dreamer3>[|^__^|]: depends on what service syou run
13:54<Dreamer3>if you run like 0 exposed services like is recommended you're much safer
14:00<[|^__^|]>Dreamer3: yes, but ssh is a service too
14:00<[|^__^|]>apache is
14:00<Dreamer3>[|^__^|]: and no need to run that on a linode :-)
14:00<Dreamer3>i don't run apache :)
14:00<Dreamer3>that's crazy
14:03<Dreamer3>*downloads security updates now*
14:22<KidSock>OpenSsh hasn't had a significant security issue for several years and when they do you can be sure you'll hear about it. A lot of people run apache and I don't think they're all crazy.
14:23<[|^__^|]>past performance is no indication of future results
14:23<KidSock>The only think I'm worried about is courier IMAP. Granted it's IMAPS so that seriously limits what a remote attacker could do.
14:24<Dreamer3>i gave up apache for lighttpd :-)
14:24<KidSock>I need php.
14:24<Dreamer3>lighttpd does php
14:24<KidSock>In CGI or SAPI mode?
14:25<Dreamer3>FCGI, the only way to run any serious service :-)
14:25<Dreamer3>inline performance
14:25<[|^__^|]>well whatever
14:25<[|^__^|]>but regular shabooms are a must
14:25<Dreamer3>that's a given
14:25<KidSock>CGI doesn't support a lot of stuff. Like session management.
14:26<Dreamer3>i wast just pointing out that it's more than one thing
14:26<Dreamer3>KidSock: i don't have any problems with php apps running under lighttpd
14:28<KidSock>Good. But I doubt the CGI binding would work for me. Occasionally when I'm on the road I like to log into SquirrelMail and if you don't have session management I don't think it will work.
14:29<KidSock>Actually PHP is something to watch out for. I always put that stuff under auth and preferrably under SSL. Provided this stuff is allways encrypted a remote attacker can only try to exploit the anonymous stuff or the authentication routines.
14:33<linbot>New news from forums: Iptables problem sending mails in Linux Networking <>
14:34<[|^__^|]> <-- how to lock down PHP
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15:18<blob>hello, what's going on with host 40 right now?
15:19|-|Dreamer3 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:22<@mikegrb>host40 looks great
15:24<blob>PING ( 56 data bytes--- ping statistics ---hmm.. I can't ping, and our web and email is down... I thought this was host 40 (but I'm not the usual admin)...
15:28<@mikegrb>Red Hat Linux release 9 (Shrike)
15:28<@mikegrb>Kernel 2.4.29-linode39-1um on an i686
15:28<@mikegrb>www login: init_new_context_skas - new_mm failed, errno = -24
15:28<@mikegrb>Kernel panic: Segfault with no mm
15:28<@mikegrb>In idle task - not syncing
15:28<@mikegrb>so the linode wasn't running, I've issued a boot for it
15:30<blob>ok thanks, is this just a random glitch, or should we do something to avoid?
15:34<@mikegrb>but we will look into it more on our end
15:35<blob>thanks, this host seems to go down quite a lot
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15:55<resplin>Is caker or mgreb around?
15:55<Newsome>resplin: mikegrb was around about 20 minutes ago
15:56<resplin>Thanks Newsome.
15:56<resplin>He's a hard man to get ahold of.
16:02<resplin>Glad to see you around.
16:02<resplin>I sent an email to on Thursday.
16:02<resplin>As a follow up to the emails I sent in December about a refund.
16:03<resplin>I haven't seen the refund and was wondering how much longer it was going to take.
16:03<resplin>In late December caker told me that "I was in the queue"
16:04<@mikegrb>ok, I see the email
16:04<@mikegrb>caker handles refunds so I will make sure he hasn't forgotten you and overlooked the message
16:04<resplin>I'd appreciate it.
16:05<resplin>How long should I wait before following up (it's been two months already)?
16:05<@mikegrb>by the end of monday the refund should be put in
16:05<resplin>Great. Thanks for your help.
16:05<@mikegrb>you can pop in that afternoon/evening to confirm
16:05<resplin>Have a nice day.
16:05<resplin>I'll try.
16:06<@mikegrb>could be another day or two before it shows up on your card
16:06<resplin>Okay. I won't worry much then until Thursday.
16:06<resplin>Thanks for your help.
16:07<@mikegrb>not a problem
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16:33<Dreamer3>oh uh
16:33<Dreamer3>one unhappy customer?
16:35|-|Narada [] has joined #linode
16:38<heidi>Dreamer3: no, he paid for a year and left early for whatever reason, just wanting the money back that he didn't use
16:40<Dreamer3>ah good
16:40<Dreamer3>i need a perm marker
16:42<Dreamer3>dry erase is just not the same
17:04<@mikegrb>they are about as opposite as it gets
17:10<taupehat>in purpose and function eh
17:13<tronix>does anybody have a recommendation for a decent Linux process watcher?
17:13<tronix>ntpd keeps dying on me :P
17:13<tronix>which I need running so that my phones do accurate call timestamps
17:14<tronix>still debugging ntpd issue but need to keep it running, in meantime
17:29<Shaun>tronix: test ! `pidof ntpd` && ntpd
17:29<Shaun>put that in a cron job or somthing that runs every minute...
17:31<Shaun>personally i dont like the ntp daemon, dont like how i cant stop it from listening.. so i just use ntpdate and run a cron syncing the time every hour...
17:31|-|Zurk [] has joined #linode
17:32<Zurk>anyone know if its possible to change the email address i signed up with ? i.e. to send all invoicing info to another email addy.
17:32<tronix>since it's my voip server, it's sensitive to sudden changes. so needs ntpd running to make tiny adjustments
17:32<tronix>cron idea is a good one
17:33<tronix>it's got a separate billing email field
17:33<tronix>(fourth one from top)
17:33<Zurk>oh hmm..thx
17:37<Zurk>also...anyone know why issuing a reboot command from the command line doesnt bring the linode up but issuing a web based reboot does ? is this a debian problem ?
17:38[~]Zurk thinks its slightly weird
17:38|-|jekil [~alessandr@] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
17:38<tronix>no it's a generic uml/linode issue
17:38<tronix>reboot command runs inside your virtual machine
17:38<@mikegrb>just linode, not uml
17:38<tronix>it does not communicate externally
17:39<tronix>so host has no way of knowing you wanted it to come back up
17:39<tronix>but when you do it via web interface... host knows you want it to come up
17:39<@mikegrb>the host needs to do some things between boots so reboot was patched in the kernel to do a halt rather then reboot
17:39<Zurk>oh. hmm. no workarounds presumably ?
17:39<tronix>ahh! didn't know about that kernel patch. neat.
17:40<@mikegrb>you can alias reboot to "ssh reboot"
17:40<@mikegrb>which will do a reboot via lish
17:40<Zurk>oh ok. thx
17:44<oneman_>mikegrb, so is XEN the future for linode, is at some point in the distant future UML will be outdated?
17:45<@mikegrb>at some point all new accounts will be xen based
17:45<@mikegrb>and exisiting users will have the option to migrate
17:45<oneman_>sounds perfect
17:46<oneman_>this is probably 6months to a year from now ?
17:46<@mikegrb>probably sooner
17:46<@mikegrb>as far as I know the only remaining hurdle is hardware logistics
17:47<@mikegrb>i.e. much more space in both datacenters for many more hosts
17:47<Zurk>whats xen ?
17:47<@mikegrb>Zurk: an alternative to uml with less overhead
17:48<oneman_>ive never really seen something as slick as you guys set up, if you can do that for XEN im sure you would get so much more business just because its a buzzword
17:48<@mikegrb>Zurk: means linodes will have much better preformance
17:48<Zurk>oh. thatll be good
17:48<@mikegrb>oneman_: the exisiting stuff all has xen support
17:48[~]Zurk notes that it would be nice to have bandwidth cut offs on linode too
17:48[~]Zurk gets nightmares about going over bandwidth limits
17:52<Zurk>any way to shut down the host automatically if its over the bandwidth limit for the month?
17:55<tronix>you'd have to write some code to monitor and do that
17:56<tronix>(at the moment)
17:56<tronix>or use snmpd to do that
17:56<tronix>but that's more overhead than just checking 'ifconfig eth0' output
17:56<tronix>from a cron job once a hour or something
17:57<tronix>(ifconfig has bandwidth usage counter)
17:59<Zurk> ifconfig counter is showing less than my lindoe web page thingy
17:59<tronix>ifconfig counter is only since the boot
17:59<tronix>boot could have been before start of month or after
18:00<tronix>so you have to also keep track of counters between midnight on 1st of month and next
18:00<Zurk>oh hmm..
18:00<tronix>it's some coding work.
18:00<tronix>would I worry about it? I don't.
18:00<tronix>if you get a DoS, they will let you know
18:00<Zurk>would they charge you for it ?
18:01[~]Zurk wonders if a 10 TB DoS came in ...
18:01<tronix>they'd probably shut it down long before :)
18:01[~]Zurk hopes so
18:01<tronix>I don't recall the official answer about charges, but they've been reasonable about it
18:02<tronix>when it happened to other customers in the past.
18:02<tronix>best way to stay out of trouble is to not run really high profile
18:02<tronix>services that gets attacked a lot
18:02<tronix>and to keep system secured all the time
18:02<tronix>(patching, etc)
18:02[~]Zurk probably will get attacked since its a webserver
18:03<tronix>oh nah, you can get really attacked if you run ircd and
18:03<tronix>young kids gets mad...
18:03<tronix>a webserver, if it's not something controversial like a NAMBLA or National Socialist Party website,
18:04<tronix>shouldn't get attacked
18:04<tronix>just make sure you keep on top of patches for your httpd, php, etc
18:04<taupehat>this should make next week interesting for me at work
18:04[~]tronix peers
18:04<taupehat>we use microsoft antispyware and norton
18:05<taupehat>only 500 machines to deal with
18:05<tronix>(just read)
18:05<taupehat>not kewl
18:05<tronix>that's, uh... ugh. Thank you, Beast of Redmond.
18:05[~]taupehat utters a stream of obscenities not worthy of this channel
18:05[~]Zurk thinks its really kewl
18:06[~]Zurk wonders if symantec think so too
18:06<tronix>NAV should send out an update that flags Windows itself as a virus ;)
18:06<taupehat>fucking fuck shitfuck asshole smacktard motherfucking moron pieces of shit, etc.
18:07<taupehat>ergh, wrong chan
18:07<[|^__^|]>really, now.
18:07<taupehat>I said wrong chan, didn't I?
18:07<taupehat>that was meant for #freenode
18:07<tronix>it was certainly honest (and accurate), though.
18:07<tronix>[the comments]
18:07<taupehat>yeah, well
18:12<Zurk> do i get an application to run automagically last in the queue when the system boots ? im using the 96mb debian image.
18:12[~]Zurk wonders if he should poke around init
18:12<taupehat>look for the symlinks and make it S99.foobar
18:13<Zurk>should i edit can existing script and just add it in the back ?
18:13<taupehat>do you have an existing script?
18:13<taupehat>oh I get it
18:13<taupehat>have you ever written initscripts before?
18:14<Zurk>yup...but on redhat not debian
18:14<taupehat>similar enough
18:14<taupehat>hang on
18:14<Zurk>rc3.d ?
18:14[~]taupehat looks at his templates
18:15<taupehat>Zurk: read /etc/init.d/README
18:16<Zurk>er..that points to the policy manual...which doesnt exist on the base image
18:16<Zurk>oh hmm...
18:16[~]Zurk found it via
18:17<taupehat>there is that link =]
18:17[~]Zurk decides to patch S89cron and see what happens
18:18<taupehat>remember that by writing a real instscript, you get start|stop|restart
18:18<taupehat>if you kludge something into your existing script, you don't get that
18:22<tronix>Donald Trump, eat your heart out -- somebody apparently had an even more expensive house than you! Nearly 1/2 billion dollar residential house:
18:22[~]Zurk wonders if kludging /bin/bash -c "cd /www/bin;/usr/bin/nohup ./ &" into cron will work
18:23<tronix>Zurk: do you have a philosophical objection against copying an init script then modifying it for your needs?
18:23<tronix>I'm just curious because an init script is likely the best way
18:23<Zurk>not really...just lazy
18:24<taupehat>so this is what I bought at work this week =]
18:24<taupehat>with mobo, chip, and 3 drives =]
18:24<tronix>ahhh nice. how much'd that set you back?
18:25<tronix>4k? 5k? wondering what that kind of box goes for
18:25<tronix>would be nice to have one.
18:25<taupehat>tronix: 2K
18:25<tronix>oh wow. nice.
18:25<taupehat>populated with a gig of ram, a xeon, and 3x250G drives
18:26<tronix>6 full length/height pci slots... nice.
18:27<taupehat>the chassis (with powersupply) comes in at about 900 bucks
18:27<taupehat>and SATA drives are cheap
18:27[~]Zurk woulda gone with an opteron
18:27<Zurk>xeons suck
18:27<taupehat>the one caveat to that chassis is that you _really_ want to use one of their recommended boards
18:28<taupehat>I have a friend who learned this through a good deal of blood sweat and tears
18:28<taupehat>and all their reocmmended boards are intel
18:28<taupehat>that's ok
18:28<taupehat>I need to get some 1U servers going
18:28<taupehat>check these:
18:29<tronix>we've got the precedessors to these, V20z. runs rings around our prev gen boxes. just amazing.
18:29<tronix>good remote mgmt features too.
18:29<taupehat>yeah, you mentioned
18:29<tronix>I did? cool. :)
18:29<taupehat>I'm not sure if I'll leave solaris on it though
18:29<taupehat>we're a debian shop at work =]
18:29<tronix>Debian's good. that's our OS for the Linux boxes
18:29<taupehat>for servers, anyhow
18:30<taupehat>debian still stinks mightily for desktop
18:30<fo0bar>250-GB 7200 RPM SATA Disk Drive [+ $299.00 each] <- HAHAHAHA
18:30<taupehat>no joke!
18:30<taupehat>that's the Sun Tax
18:31<taupehat>same thing for memory on those
18:31[~]fo0bar stays with supermicro
18:31<taupehat>kind of like selling a cheap inkjet printer and then charging 50 bucks for a cartridge
18:31<taupehat>the supermicro serves a different purpose
18:31[~]Zurk likes asus
18:32[~]taupehat likes asus as well
18:32<fo0bar>1U, P4 3.4 2MB cache, 1GB, 2x200GB, 3ware card for $1300
18:32<tronix>yeah, I use asus on the desktops, but got to say supermicro looks pretty good on server angle
18:32<taupehat>but if you can find as well-built a 1U opteron server for under a grand with a good warranty, show me
18:33[~]taupehat afk
18:34<fo0bar>1U, opteron 144, 512MB, $753
18:34<fo0bar>so at that level, sun is better (146 vs 144)
18:34<fo0bar>that's the cheapest supermicro opteron you can get
18:37<Zurk>shutting down a linode via the command line is ok..right ?
18:38[~]Zurk is going to test the new modded cron init script
18:39<Zurk>why does the webpage say its running when i shut it down ?
18:39<Zurk>hmm..ok refresh
18:39<tronix>shutting down via Linode CLI is fine, yes.
18:40<tronix>or lish or website. any works.
18:47[~]Zurk finds that patching cron did thetrick
18:57<Zurk>is there any way to delay a reboot ? my database takes 60 seconds to shut down
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19:09<tronix>are you doing reboot via the 'ssh <lish host> reboot' method?
19:09<tronix>you could put a sleep 90 in one of the scripts
19:09<tronix>(init scripts or the script that does the reboot)
19:10<Zurk>i ignores the sleep 90
19:10[~]Zurk thinks thats weird
19:11[~]Zurk cant get it to wait more than 20 seconds
19:11<Zurk>i put it in the init scripts
19:15<warewolf>shaving my head in the shower I managed to nick my fingernail with the razor putting three nice little fish-scale looking slits in my fingernail
19:15<warewolf>way to go mach 3
19:15<warewolf>now this is annoying to type
19:15<warewolf>I feel like a cat with tape on his feet :(
19:16<Zurk>serves you right for not using an electric
19:16<warewolf>shaving my head with an electric razor in the shower?
19:16<warewolf>also: electric razors suck.
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19:24<tronix>warewolf: heh I haven't even tried the new 5 bladed thing yet :)
19:26<tronix>I gave up on electrics long ago. they never really got a truly close cut for my liking.
19:26<warewolf>and my beard hairs are thick enough that it makes electric razors choke up on them
19:27<Zurk>bah. try a phillishave which works in wet/dry and wont choke on your beard hairs
19:31[~]Zurk wonders why -Djava.awt.headless=true needs to be specified is -server is specified anyway. grrr....sun programmers
19:33<warewolf>that philishave thing
19:33<warewolf>I have something that is almost exactly like it
19:33<warewolf>probally a previous revision of it
19:34<warewolf>mine's uh ..
19:34<warewolf>norelcro advantage
19:35<Zurk>norelcos not a phillishave
19:35<vaxen>just did some upgrade and now mysql is broken
19:35<vaxen>anyone got same problem as me on debian testing?
19:35<Zurk>vaxen: apt-get down to a previous rev
19:35[~]Zurk uses sarge
19:36<warewolf>Zurk: actually you appear to be wrong in your statement that norelcro != philips
19:36<warewolf>Zurk: and it is one L, not two, btw.
19:36<warewolf>Zurk: Philips produces norelco.
19:37<warewolf>like I was saying, I have something very similar, probally a previous revision.
19:37<Zurk>hmm..they musta bought norelco
19:37[~]Zurk wonders why they carry that line
19:38<warewolf>probally because norelco has always been a philips consumer product line?
19:38<warewolf>and that it's always been philips norelco?
19:39<Zurk>ok...ive got a HQ9190 phillishave
19:39<warewolf>alright well I have to go to work.
19:39[~]warewolf &
19:40[~]Zurk yays that awt.headless works
19:40[~]Zurk goes off to reboot
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22:18<[|^__^|]>warewolf: you ought to get a better sort of blade than a mach 3. I highly recommend a classic old double-edged razor
22:19<@mikegrb>or just don't shave
22:19<[|^__^|]>mikegrb: or bathe!
22:19[~]mikegrb does that one
22:20<[|^__^|]> <-- warewolf
22:20[~]mikegrb needed a break from the shaving three times a day in the military
22:21<[|^__^|]>that's terrible
22:21<[|^__^|]>three times a day?
22:21<[|^__^|]>that's so bad for your skin!
22:22<[|^__^|]>but I guess they made you use disposables, huh?
22:22<@mikegrb> yes
22:22<[|^__^|]>like prison
22:22<@mikegrb>I didn't spend much time living in baracks
22:22<@mikegrb>and the last time I did it was more like an apartment or hotel suite
22:22<[|^__^|]>disciplinary barracks
22:23<@mikegrb>bedroom, living room with murphy bed, kitchen area and bathroom
22:23<@mikegrb>even had tv + dvd player in both the living room and the bed room
22:23<@mikegrb>most importantly, it had an ethernet jack at the desks in the living room and bedroom
22:24<@mikegrb>much better then the three to a room, shared bathroom stuff in the buildings on either side
22:24<@mikegrb>but even when I was in A school after boot camp, I had a room shared with one other person, and that only lasted for the first bit of school
22:25<@mikegrb>once that was over, it was single bedroom with a shared bathroom with the neighbor
22:25<@mikegrb>nuclear power people get a bit spoiled in the navy
22:26<@mikegrb>the posh apartment barracks thing was at another A school
22:26<[|^__^|]>man, three times a day
22:26<[|^__^|]>that's so unhealthy
22:26<@mikegrb>but I was there as a fleet returnee so got the posh quiters
22:26<[|^__^|]>is that new?
22:27<[|^__^|]>like, did they do that when razors didn't suck?
22:27<@mikegrb>not really new
22:27<[|^__^|]>but like, did they require that in the 50s?
22:27<@mikegrb>it's not so much "you must shave three times a day" it's "you must never have stubble"
22:27<[|^__^|]>you must have dark hair
22:28<@mikegrb>and stubble == doesn't have to be visible
22:28<@mikegrb>I mean, they are more likely to notice if it is visible
22:28<@mikegrb>but if they feel like being an ass, or suspect for other reasons, it's military id scraped across the chin/cheeks
22:28<[|^__^|]>but in the navy your superior officers have a tendency to run the backs of their hands over your cheek at regular intervals
22:28<[|^__^|]>to show they care
22:28<@mikegrb>if it catches any hair...
22:29<@mikegrb>though the great thing is, at my last command, I got to be that person
22:29<@mikegrb>everyone loved working for me :>
22:30<@mikegrb>things like smoking is technically alowed when on a work party if the supervisor okays it made them like me
22:30<[|^__^|]>you'd just give everyone a big kiss to test their stubble
22:30<@mikegrb>"petty officer greb, can we smoke?"
22:30<@mikegrb>"If you give me one"
22:30<@mikegrb>also "We have to work until 1600 no matter how much we get done, take your time, no need to kill yourself"
22:31<@mikegrb>we had lots of working parties though
22:31<@mikegrb>Ivan did several billion dollars in damage to the base
22:31<@mikegrb>schools were suspended and students spent their days clearing debris from various areas of the base
22:32<@mikegrb>the posh barracks were uninhabitable
22:32<@mikegrb>luckily, I had moved off base just before the hurricane came
22:32<@mikegrb>though still had to go get some stuff from my apartment
22:36<[|^__^|]>20:31 <@mikegrb> Ivan did several billion dollars in damage to the base
22:36<[|^__^|]>I read that as "The Russkies"
22:36<@mikegrb>shhh, don't tell anyone
22:37<[|^__^|]>took me a while to realize it was a hurricane
22:37<@mikegrb>it was the cause for my son being born by flashlight in a hospital operating room
22:37<@mikegrb>for some reason the genious that designed the place didn't think lighting in an OR needed to be connected to the generators
22:38<@mikegrb>that place sucked
22:39<@mikegrb>since the water wasn't drinkable, rather then expect people to not be morons, they turned off all the water to the building
22:39<@mikegrb>this means no toilet flushing
22:39<@mikegrb>each nurses station had one of those giant rubbermaid trashcans with water
22:39<@mikegrb>when you needed to flush, you wheeled it to your room and scooped water into the toilet
22:40<@mikegrb>the high humidity and no a/c resulted in inches of water on the ground in some places despite being mopped hourly
22:40<@mikegrb>the place smelled like a disreputable nursing home
22:41<@mikegrb>which is even worse then a reputable nursing home
22:41<@mikegrb>I got free food in the cafeteria though :>
22:41<@mikegrb>they thought I was a paramedic
22:42<@mikegrb>since I was in my coveralls (the uniform the paramedics use) and had my 2M ham radio with me
22:42<@mikegrb>s/paramedics/navy paramedics/
22:44<[|^__^|]>good thing they never tapped you for service
22:44<@mikegrb>well, I did direct a few ambulances
22:44<@mikegrb>and dispatched one
22:44<@mikegrb>that's why I had the ham radio with me
22:45<@mikegrb>there was a special needs (ie people who need electricity to live... old people with O2 and the like) about 5 minutes from the hospital
22:45<@mikegrb>I worked there for several shifts
22:45<@mikegrb>ham radio is used to talk between shelters, hospitals, and the county emergency managment offices
22:46<@mikegrb>since my wife was in the hospital I wasn't in the normal rotation but they would call me to go work at that shelter so that the person there could sleep some, or relieve someone else to sleep
22:47<@mikegrb>the way in was quite involved with various streets blocked and what not
22:47<@mikegrb>the first time I left was when an ambulance was inbound
22:47<@mikegrb>they couldn't figure out how to get to the shelter
22:47<@mikegrb>so I told them I'd meet them at their location and show them in
22:47<@mikegrb>ended up doing that several times
22:48<@mikegrb>POTS didn't work
22:48<@mikegrb>cell phones actually had a better chance of working then landline phones
22:48<@mikegrb>but that was very spotty
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23:21<warewolf>(ham radio)++
23:21<warewolf>(ham radio)++
23:25<tronix>heh mikegrb... reminds me of the time we had a nasty ice storm here
23:25<tronix>power in the entire region -- gone
23:26<tronix>so... was at work... dealing with stuff
23:26<tronix>work was on UPS power (and a big diesel generator feeding it)
23:26<tronix>we soon got water pouring in
23:26<tronix>'cause the toilets were across the hall... and some idiot
23:26<tronix>didn't hook up the sump pumps to the building UPS.
23:27<tronix>so we got an electrician on-site at 2am, with firefighter crews using extremely bright lights from their trucks for illumination
23:27<tronix>while the electrician wired up stuff.
23:27<tronix>that was interesting. ;P
23:28<tronix>the ice was falling down so fast. It took me 30 mins to scrape off just enough ice to see while I drove
23:28<tronix>but by the time I arrived home, 30 mins later...
23:28<tronix>completely coated with ice again, and pretty thick. :P
23:29<tronix>my boss, from arizona, said that he'd never heard trees cracking (due to weight of heavy ice on branches) before :)
23:29<tronix>until he was stuck in town during this storm.
23:30<tronix>I haven't been lcuky enough to see a sandstorm in AZ yet, earthquakes in CA, or hurricanes in the gulf coast. yet?
---Logclosed Sun Feb 12 00:00:52 2006