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#linode IRC Logs for 2006-06-14

---Logopened Wed Jun 14 00:00:40 2006
00:09<blake>i just put ip if i dont want reverse dns?
00:10<blake>like put for no reverse dns for
00:10<blake>that will work?
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01:22<gpd>is there a rule of thumb for linux compatability between linksys|dlink|netgear ?
01:23<Battousai>rule of thumb?
01:23<gpd>ie. is one company generally more supportive of Linux?
01:24<gpd>or do i just have to look up each device
01:24<Battousai>kinda gotta look up each device
01:24<Battousai>if you mean wireless
01:24<gpd>ya - wireless pc-card
01:24<Battousai>otherwise they tend to be pretty well-supported
01:24<Battousai>wireless is hairy, especially with those damn broadcom cards
01:27<Battousai>and i've encountered linksys crap where the same model card had different versions, with differing chips... those were fun times
01:27<Battousai>then i got a laptop with ipw
01:28<gpd>seems like they are not coming down in price - despite|because most modern laptops including wireless
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06:39<internat>so.. im having a blonde moment, whats the easiest way to put the numbers 1 to 10, randomly into an array
06:39<internat>so that they are in a random order
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07:44<encode>internat: ask a blonde to arrange them in numerical order
07:44<encode>then put them in the array in teh same order
07:46<JasonF>internat: using ... hehe
07:46<@mikegrb>why put them in an array?
07:47<@mikegrb>it's quite likely there is a better way to do what you want that doesn't involve putting numbers randomly into an array
07:47<encode>yeah, put them in a unsigned double instead
07:48<encode>(take a lesson from
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08:37<npmr>there are n! permutations of any set of n unique elements
08:38<npmr>all you need to do is write an algorithm that picks a number between 1 and n! randomly, and then puts a sorted set into that specific permutation
08:41<npmr> <-- here it is in php
08:53<internat>yeah.. umm im making the magic numbers game in javascript for a uni assignment
08:53<internat>i need them in an array :)
08:53<npmr>they are in an array
08:54<npmr>selection_unsort returns an array
08:54<internat>no no, i was refering to mikegrbs thing about not needing to put the numbers into an array
09:05<@mikegrb>tell your professor the requirements were bad
09:11<internat>actually its my fault
09:11<internat>we all chose the game we wanted to implement
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10:30<kriby>you seem like you should be my relative
10:45<kirbyb>my linode is cut off
10:45<kirbyb>doesnt work
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10:47<kirbyb>due to non-payment
10:47<kirbyb>I emailed the billing department
10:48<kirbyb>my credit card was stolen and I am waiting for a replacement
10:48<kriby>oh.. a payment thing.. you need mikegrb or caker for that
10:48<heidi>kirbyb: send them a ticket with an explanation
10:48<kirbyb>I did already
10:48<kirbyb>do they take american express?
10:48<kirbyb>I tried to call too
10:49<heidi>you won't get an answer by phone
10:49<kirbyb>I forget my username/passwd on the www
10:49<heidi>kirbyb: they do take american express
10:50<heidi>how long ago did you open a ticket
10:50<kriby>6 minutes
10:50<heidi>cause they give you a couple weeks with notices before shutting it down
10:50<kirbyb>hey gave me one notice
10:50<kirbyb>that was it
10:50<heidi>yes, and then they waited a couple weeks before shutting it down
10:50<heidi>do you need more than that
10:50<kirbyb>I emailed them back and let them know the deal
10:51<kirbyb>considering ive never missed a payment in 1 year
10:51<heidi>they don't accept emails, they need a ticket
10:51<heidi>for security reasons
10:51<kirbyb>its obviously strange that my credit card starts to decline
10:51<kirbyb>I dont know my user/pass
10:51<kirbyb>this sucks
10:51<kirbyb>Ill just open a tektonic account
10:51<kirbyb>@ least they communicate with you well
10:52<heidi>kirbyb: they don't make special allowances just because you didn't miss a payment in a year
10:52<kirbyb>one week and cut-off is stupid
10:52<kirbyb>all my cards were stolen
10:52<heidi>and they gave you a notice and I explained the ticket vs email
10:52<kirbyb>what am I supposed to do
10:52<heidi>and not one week
10:52<heidi>14 days from when it was supposed to be paid
10:52<kirbyb>it was one week
10:52<kirbyb>I got one notice
10:52<kirbyb>this is stupid
10:53<kirbyb>tektonic here I come
10:53<anderiv>maybe you two should take this discussion elsewhere ;-)
10:53[~]anderiv comments from the peanut gallery.
10:53<kriby>you don't like to watch?
10:53<anderiv>kriby: I didn't say that :-)
10:54<heidi>anderiv: there isn't anything else to discuss, I explained why he got cut off, if he is mad, not my problem
10:55<anderiv>heidi: I know - I said it more for his kirbyb's benefit than yours.
10:56<anderiv>I'm a long-time very happy customer...stuff like this isn't going to sway my opinion of your company.
10:57<heidi>well not my company, but my hubby works there, yeah I didn't figure
10:57<anderiv>heidi...I knew you were associated somehow.
10:58<heidi>I am sorry he is having problems, but he won't get anything better from another company
10:58<heidi>mikegrb is my hubby
10:58<anderiv>so I've heard :-)
10:58[~]anderiv wishes his wife knew how to use IRC.
10:59[~]kriby wishes his wife
10:59<heidi>and since he was up all night working until 9 this morning, he won't be up to handle this
10:59<heidi>kriby: get a wife
10:59<heidi>I gotta go work my job now
11:00<gpd>tektonic = virtuoso & $20/20min support - yuk
11:00<anderiv>honestly - I've been so happy w/ linode that I haven't even ever scoped out the rest of the VPS market to see what's out there.
11:01<gpd>me too - just curious for a minute there ;)
11:02<Dreamr3>anyone using sorbs to block spam?
11:03<gpd>Sorbs are a Slavic minority indigenous to the region known as Lusatia
11:03<gpd>seems a little unkind to use them to block spam
11:04<Dreamr3>most of AOL's MX servers seem to be listed in sorbs
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11:18[~]npmr wonders why kirbyb wasn't trying to get this straightened out *before* he got shut off
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13:37<anderiv>npmr: my thoughts exactly
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15:13<blake>mikegrb: you're a reverend?
15:14<blake>you know who you look like?
15:14<blake>the guy from the office
15:14<blake>the english version
15:15<blake>well im headed to work
15:16<Battousai>steve carell?
15:16<blake>that guy lol
15:16<blake>not quite as old but ya haha
15:17<anderiv>Ricky Gervais...not steve carell.
15:17<blake>you dont see resemblance?
15:17<blake>well i gotta head to work
15:17<blake>see you later when i need mroe help setting up my linode
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15:41<anderiv>late for work yet?
15:42<blake>lol almost
15:42<blake>i gotta rush
15:43<blake>18 mins to clock in
15:43[~]anderiv is glad he doesn't have to clock in :-)
15:43[~]blake is away: work
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17:42[~]mikegrb wonders who kirbyb is, no email, no ticket
17:42<@mikegrb>kriby: it was you, wasn't it!
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18:04<TheFirst>what is it with this place being flooded by seeming prepubescent warez kiddies and idiots the past few days?
18:04<TheFirst>(hrmm suppose "and idiots" is a bit redundant?)
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18:19<JasonF>who knows
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19:17<linbot>New news from forums: What: line_ioctl: tty0: unknown ioctl: 0x5603 in Feature Request/Bug Report <>
19:34<linbot>New news from forums: What: line_ioctl: tty0: unknown ioctl: 0x5603 in Feature Request/Bug Report <>
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20:09<gpd>is there an easy way to reinstall a file from a .deb package - without 1) purging & reinstalling or 2) downloading the .deb, extracting the file with ar ?
20:11|-|avid [] has joined #linode
20:16<gpd>something like: apt-get rejigger mysql-server-5.0 ( where rejigger would check all files in deb against those installed and reinstall where different )
20:17<gpd>maybe dpkg -i --force-yes does this...
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20:33<linbot>New news from forums: Dapper upgrade breaks aptitude in General Discussion <>
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21:12<blake>I'm back from work.
21:15<blake>I set my IP to resolve reverse dns to itself.
21:15<blake>That's what I was told to do for no reverse dns.
21:15<blake>but it does resolve, to the ip.
21:15<blake>i don't want it to resolve at all.
21:15<blake>Results: =>
21:15<blake>Results: =>
21:16<blake>it should be like that
21:16<blake>caker: any ideas?
21:39<linbot>New news from forums: Slackware 10.2 in Feature Request/Bug Report <>
21:49<blake>is anybody around?
21:55<blake>anyone have a rough idea of how much b/w hlds would use in a one hour period for 16 users?
22:12<warewolf>dns reverse requests take a few days to propigate
22:12<warewolf>if you just set it, give it some time to finish
22:12[~]warewolf -c work &
22:13<@mikegrb>blake: it's not possible to have no rdns for a linode ip
22:14<@caker>also, cars+
22:14<@mikegrb>here in my car I feel safest of all
22:14<@mikegrb>I can lock all my doors and it's the only way in
22:14<@mikegrb>in cards
22:15|-|spr [] has quit [Quit: "Ah, the bounce has gone from his bungie"]
22:17<gpd>caker: does that imply motorbike-- ?
22:24<blake>The hostname you enter must have a valid A/CNAME record pointing to the IP you want to set the reverse DNS for. The A/CNAME record must be propagated and working before we will be able to find it. You may also enter the IP address if you don't want an RDNS entry for that IP.
22:25<blake>read the end of that
22:25<@mikegrb>it is worded incorrectly
22:25<@mikegrb>you will still have an rdns entry, it will just be the ip
22:25<blake>i guess its not a big deal
22:25<blake>as long as its not
22:25<blake>no offense
22:26<blake>one last thing
22:26<blake>you know how extra bandwidth is 50 cents a gb?
22:26<blake>what happens if i reach 50?
22:26<blake>you cut me off or you start charging?
22:26<blake>i wasnt too clear on that
22:26<blake>not that i think i will go anywhere near 50
22:26<blake>but just curious
22:27<@mikegrb>if you go over, you get charged 50 cents a gig
22:29<blake>can you set it up to just cut me off?
22:29<blake>like if i reach 50 just shutdown my linode?
22:29<@mikegrb>you could set that up though
22:29<blake>i'm not rich. cant afford to pay for ddos
22:30<blake>at a dollar for 1 gb
22:30<blake>they could use that up in like 2 minutes
22:30<@mikegrb>it is 50 cents for 1 gb, not a dollar
22:30<blake>well you know what i mean
22:30<blake>what im saying is
22:30<blake>only way i would reach 50 is an attack
22:30<blake>so if it went over can you setup LPM to shutdown my box at 50/
22:31<@mikegrb>[22:29] <@mikegrb> no
22:31<@mikegrb>[22:29] <@mikegrb> you could set that up though
22:31<blake>i think i will
22:31<@mikegrb>there is an xml feed with the data
22:31<blake>otherwise i could use my linode
22:31<blake>cuz i wont pay 500 bucks lol
22:31<@mikegrb>there is a sample perl and bash script in the forums
22:31<blake>i will search
22:31<@mikegrb>just set it to check every three hours or so
22:31<blake>ya, exactly
22:31<@mikegrb>and issue a shutdown if it's too close
22:32<blake>any idea how much bw hlds uses?
22:32<blake>would slowing it down help?
22:32<blake>or not?
22:32<blake>like limiting it to 3 mbps or something
22:32<blake>for speed
22:33<blake>would that help me save some bandwidth?
22:33<@mikegrb>I'd be surprised if it used 3mbps
22:33<blake>well it will use 5 mbps
22:33<blake>15 for fios player
22:33<blake>multiply by 16
22:33<blake>48 mbps
22:33<blake>or not?
22:33<@mikegrb>where are you getting these numbers? they don't seem realistic at all to me
22:34<blake>well how much b/w u think one player uses
22:34<@mikegrb>not much
22:34<@mikegrb>cpu and ram would be the main concern
22:34<blake>how much of those/
22:34<blake>of cpu and ram
22:35<@mikegrb>no clue, I don't play computer games
22:35<@mikegrb>careful, you might die of laughter
22:36<@mikegrb>also, if you trigger the script too much, it will ban you for a while
22:40<blake>When will you be adding FreeBSD?
22:40<blake>I bet you would have twice as many customers if you offered it.
22:41<@mikegrb>well the name of the company is linode
22:41<@mikegrb>as in linux node
22:41<@mikegrb>and we use user mode linux
22:42<@mikegrb>once xen sucks less, we will switch to xen
22:42<@mikegrb>but still won't be offering freebsd support for the foreseeable future
22:42<@mikegrb>not until freebsd and linux can operate with a common filesystem
22:45<blake>cuz caker said
22:45<blake>"near future"
22:45<@mikegrb>that wasn't caker
22:46<blake>who said it then?
22:46<blake>oh, was it?
22:46<blake>it's a shame. is it difficult to implement it?
22:46<blake>because cheap freebsd vds
22:46<blake>would sell like hotcakes
22:46<@mikegrb>I doubt it
22:47[~]anderiv seriously doubts linode customers would double if they offerred *BSD.
22:47<@mikegrb>we will offer it when it is technically possible
22:47<@mikegrb>until then, we won't lose any sleep over it
22:47<blake>i have used vmware before
22:48<blake>what is stopping you from offering it?
22:48<anderiv>blake: vmware != UML
22:48<@mikegrb>UML will never support freebsd
22:48<blake>i'm not too sure what you're saying
22:48<blake>but im settling in with debian nicely
22:48<@mikegrb>we don't use vmware
22:48<anderiv>vmware and UML are completely different technologies.
22:49<@mikegrb>the technology we use currently will never support freebsd
22:49<blake>i know you couldnt do windows server 2003
22:49<blake>just because of the costs
22:49<blake>but that would be cool too
22:49<anderiv>...other reasons too.
22:49<blake>something else you should offer...
22:49<blake>just a suggestion
22:49<anderiv>though it will be technically feasable on Xen.
22:49<blake>and maybe you're already working on it
22:50[~]anderiv doubts it.
22:50<blake>is running multiple linode's
22:50<@mikegrb>we won't ever offer windows
22:50<blake>and i bet you're already working on it because i noticed you can choose how much ram to use
22:50<blake>no, i know
22:50<blake>because you would have to pass on the licensing fee
22:50<@mikegrb>that has nothing to do with it
22:51<@mikegrb>we are not a windows servers company
22:51<@mikegrb>we are a linux servers company
22:51<@mikegrb>our name even has linux in it
22:51<anderiv>linux uses RAM too, you know :-)
22:51<blake>well you offer what's in demand.
22:51<@mikegrb>it wasn't just because it sounded good
22:51<@mikegrb>windows vpses aren't in demand and won't be
22:52<@mikegrb>but again, that doesn't have anything to do with it
22:52<blake>that's what you offered originally, are you saying if freebsd would get you a much larger customer base you wouldn't let customers use it just because of the name of your company?
22:52<anderiv>best. conversation. ever.
22:52<blake>well i'm not going to start an argument
22:52<blake>i can see i'm getting there
22:53<@mikegrb>I would die of a heart attack if offering freebsd made any noticable difference in the number of customers
22:53<blake>you don't think it would?
22:53[~]anderiv agrees.
22:53<blake>it's far more secure oob though, right?
22:53<blake>for noobs like me
22:53<blake>that's why i like it
22:54<blake>oob = out of box
22:54<anderiv>...only as secure as the sysadmin ;-)
22:54<blake>nothing has to be done to secure it
22:54<blake>where as with redhat
22:54<blake>the second you install its vulnerable
22:54<blake>i dont know about debian etc.
22:54<blake>but i have heard freebsd is the most secure
22:54<@mikegrb>and if a sysadmin chooses freebsd becuase it is more secure out of the box, that sysadmin will have one of the most insecure servers in town
22:54<blake>mikegrb: lol
22:54<blake>you're scaring me
22:55<@mikegrb>it's not a joke
22:55<@mikegrb>it's true
22:55<blake>i prob got mad insecure shit
22:55<blake>cuz i just got the oob debian linode you provide
22:55<blake>do you atleast update the packages?
22:55<blake>for the linodes?
22:55<@mikegrb>linode is an unmanaged service
22:55<@mikegrb>that means we don't touch your linode
22:55<blake>no, i know
22:55<@mikegrb>you have to do everything yourself
22:55<blake>i mean the os
22:56<blake>like lets say debian 3.1 comes out
22:56<@mikegrb>blake: what part of unmanaged do you not understand?
22:56<blake>and a week later huge exploit and patch released
22:56<blake>after that date if i installd debian 3.1
22:56<blake>will it be the patched version?
22:56<anderiv>...if you update it will be.
22:56<blake>well i will have to learn the hard way
22:56<blake>after someone defaces my site
22:56<eFUDd>firewall that man!
22:57<anderiv>debian has this sweet apt system. You should try it sometime :-)
22:57<eFUDd>"apt-cache search"
22:57<eFUDd>"apt-get install"
22:57<eFUDd>fuck that!
22:57<eFUDd>one command plz. ktnx.
22:57<blake>apt-get moo
22:58<anderiv>blake: how's Rhoade Island?
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22:59<blake>i like it
22:59|-|VS_ChanLog [] has joined #linode
22:59<blake>no, i lied. i hate it
22:59<blake>why do you ask?
22:59<anderiv>just curious.
22:59<blake>where do you live?
22:59<anderiv>wouldn't you like to know.
23:00<blake>lemme find out
23:00<anderiv>have fun.
23:00[~]mikegrb knows!
23:01<anderiv>heh - yah I called the guys at dnsstuff and told 'em to take out the records for my IP.
23:01<blake>Minneapolis, Minnesota
23:01<blake>im coming to get you
23:01<anderiv>ding ding ding.
23:02[~]mikegrb complains to arin about tw's broken rwhois server
23:02<blake>it's not broken...
23:02<anderiv>feel free :-)
23:02<blake>how is it broken?
23:02<@mikegrb>blake: uh, yes it is
23:02<blake>wait... how?
23:03<@mikegrb>ReferralServer: rwhois://
23:03<@mikegrb>try it
23:03<blake>Results: =>
23:03<eFUDd><I CAN'T HEAR YOU>
23:03|-|flatronf700B [~flatronf7@] has joined #linode
23:03[~]anderiv punches eFUDd
23:05<@mikegrb>is there a reason you are pasting that here?
23:05<blake>it was a mistake
23:06<anderiv>blake: heh - you know this is a logged channel, right?
23:06<blake>logged by fbi?
23:06<anderiv>blake: and the KGB.
23:06<@mikegrb>but they log every channel
23:06<@mikegrb>well, the NSA does it for them
23:07[~]eFUDd passes +1 361 882 5253 on to fibbie
23:07<blake>who's # is that?
23:07<eFUDd>actually, props. predates my domains :/
23:07<anderiv>eFUDd: well done.
23:07<blake>i wish i owned
23:08<blake>some asshole named blake farenthold owns it
23:08<blake>runs some huge company and doesnt even use it
23:08<eFUDd>not counting the domains i had stolen from me. ohwell.
23:08<blake>but renews every year
23:08<blake>since 1995
23:08<@mikegrb>blake: watch the language
23:08<eFUDd>yes yes. i bet he will continue to do so.
23:08<blake>why does he bother?
23:08<blake>im waiting for august 2007
23:08<blake>but im sure he will renew
23:08<eFUDd>mike, that's just sick.
23:09<anderiv>don't hold your breath.
23:09<eFUDd>I've had an old domain that was stolen from me on backorder now for 4 years. heh.
23:09<@mikegrb>eFUDd: I like the wimbledon comment
23:09<blake>eFUDd: how can you lose a domain?
23:09<blake>can't you get it back by proving it was stolen?
23:09<eFUDd>Well, I put my stuff in lots of piles.
23:09<eFUDd>Then my wife moves the piles around.
23:09<eFUDd>next thing I know, something is lost. :/
23:10<eFUDd>mike, damn. no telnet. :P
23:10<blake>my domains = secure
23:10<anderiv>blake: is that cause you're running them on FreeBSD?
23:10[~]anderiv ducks
23:10<eFUDd>someone's redirecting it through aalib I see.
23:10<blake>thats a good dn
23:11<@mikegrb>eFUDd: it just prints a soccer field and then yells at you and says they start 10 mins prior to kickoff
23:11<eFUDd>that's what i saw anyway.
23:11|-|flatronf700B [~flatronf7@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:11[~]eFUDd eats some Wakahato Okinomi Yaki
23:12<blake>eFUDd: what bnc are you using?
23:12<blake>gotbnc or psybnc?
23:12<eFUDd>Go away.
23:12<blake>rude to your fellow customers
23:13<eFUDd>No sir. That was forceful, not rude.
23:13<eFUDd>Rude is still a few ticks on the meter away.
23:13<blake>Why don't you like me/
23:13<eFUDd>Besides, I do'nt have to be nice to someone who buys a burger from the local mcdonalds just because I'm there taking a dump, do I?
23:14<blake>good point
23:14<eFUDd>blake, I am not using any bnc.
23:14<blake>i noticed
23:14<blake>you're just using ssh to get on irc
23:14<eFUDd>Actually, I'm whistling into a modem.
23:14<blake>did you use debian?
23:15<eFUDd>once, when I printed it out on paper then went to a Mcdonalds.
23:15<blake>cuz i cant compile wafter apf-get gcc
23:15<blake>matbe i nee
23:15<blake>apt-get install build-essential
23:15<blake>will that work?
23:15<@mikegrb>eFUDd: you said you were working on getting up to 2400bps, how is that going? You were thinking you might need an oxygen tank to help, right?
23:15<eFUDd>mikegrb, Yes. Unfortunately. BUT I managed to get in touch with Garth Brooks last week...
23:15<eFUDd>his crew knows how to do it all up right cause they used that trick for his songs.
23:15[~]caker eFUDd < eFUDd> Actually, I'm whistling into a modem.
23:15<@caker>^-- funny
23:16<blake>caker: can you tell me if i can run hlds?
23:16<blake>i know i'm allowed, i mean is it possible?
23:16<anderiv>blake: you're still on this hlds thing, huh?
23:16<blake>with my cpu / ram / bandwidth
23:16<@caker>I'm sure you can, but good luck getting it to run well within your resources
23:16<blake>figured someone miught know
23:16<anderiv>blake: give 'er a try...what's the worst that can happen?
23:16<eFUDd>blake, Historically when someone wanted to get from say, A to B, they realized that their legs were getting tired on the return journy.
23:17<blake>well its a 400 megabyte wget, thats alot of b/w
23:17<@caker>massive swap thrashing is probably the worst
23:17<eFUDd>That someone pondered on that a while.
23:17<eFUDd>Ultimately, he produced the wheel.
23:17<eFUDd>Now what if you were that person.
23:17<eFUDd>and HLDS was the wheel.
23:17<eFUDd>we'd all be screwed
23:17<blake>rude to fellow customers :'(
23:17<eFUDd>blake, my point is, sometimes one just needs to _try_ something.
23:18<blake>ya, i know
23:18<blake>good point
23:18<eFUDd>Didn't I suggest putting me on ignore yesterday?
23:18<blake>was that you?
23:18<blake>someone did
23:18<eFUDd>You remember in the Matrix, where they talekd about silverware and claimed there was no spoon? What they really meant to say is "There is no clue."
23:22[~]eFUDd has been REing the protocol/interface for the BetaBrite Prism 80x7 LED sign
23:23<eFUDd>stupid manufacture refuses to release an API. I hereby claim that in order for it to interact with the other software on my computer, I need to reverse engineer it.
23:25<blake>you just owned them
23:28<blake>i'm having a huge problem getting two ip's to work
23:28<blake>on my debian machine
23:28<blake>do i use both gateway?
23:28<blake>or just one?
23:28<eFUDd>good luck!
23:28<blake>haha, why do you say that?
23:28<blake>you have 2
23:30|-|Battousai [] has joined #linode
23:33<blake>i am elite. got it?
23:34<anderiv>I believe you mispelled that.
23:37|-|linbot [~supybot@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:38<blake>misspelled what?
23:39<blake>is debian 3.1 fairly secure oob?
23:39<blake>anything major i should do with it
23:39<blake>or should i be ok?
---Logclosed Thu Jun 15 00:00:21 2006