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#linode IRC Logs for 2015-03-02

---Logopened Mon Mar 02 00:00:35 2015
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00:02<Nathanael_>Goodnight all!
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01:10<dcraig>this computer has gone to sleep
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01:28<dcraig>yeah toast
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01:52<zifnab>i want toast
01:52<zifnab>i'm out of bread though
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02:06<MJCS->zifnab: tortilla?
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02:25<psc>quick question with NodeBalancer can I use it for an hour since I am hving a high traffic post then after the high peak is ended just remove the node balancer?
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02:25<psc>am I still going to be charge $20 or just the per hour used?
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02:27<psc>anyone Here ?
02:28<virtual>Sure - but don't know the answer to your question, not used a nodebalancer. Someone else might have...
02:29<virtual>I am not sure how you add a nodebalancer in for an hour either - there'd be some IP changes going on and stuff, right?
02:29<akerl>psc: Well, you kinda need to point DNS at it for it to be useful
02:29<psc>is there a link for tutorial?
02:30<akerl>You can add and remove NodeBalancers whenever just like you do with Linodes
02:31<virtual>akerl: does that mean the billing is per hour then? I'm not clear on that front either, so just curious to know. :)
02:31<psc>thus it also take time to propagate?
02:31<akerl>virtual: If your account is on hourly billing, everything you buy is billed hourly. If it's not on hourly billing, nothing you buy is billed hourly
02:32<akerl>psc: How many Linodes do you have to balance traffic between?
02:32<psc>hopefully its easy to confirgure haha
02:32<psc>I only have one linode
02:32<psc>but I am having a hightraffic for this week
02:32<akerl>So what benefit are you expecting to get out of the NodeBalancer?
02:32<psc>since there is a trending event
02:33<psc>is it going to manage high traffic since it will load extra connections
02:33<akerl>It routes traffic to your Linode(s)... so the traffic is still going to go through the NodeBalancer to your Linode
02:33<psc>if that is correct
02:33<psc>or I missed the point of the service?
02:33<akerl>psc: The NodeBalancer routes incoming connections to your Linodes.
02:34<akerl>If you only have 1 Linode behind it, all the connections will be routed to that Linode, just as if you didn't have a NodeBalancer
02:34<psc>oh I see I think It will not help :(
02:35<psc>I though it will balance the connections since I am having a large traffic
02:35<akerl>It does balance connections, it's just that if you only give it 1 Linode to balance them "between", it doesn't have anywhere else to balance to
02:39<virtual>psc: You might be thinking of an 'application accelerator' perhaps.
02:40<psc>virtual: do they have that?
02:41<virtual>No. At this stage, you might be better off looking at tuning your web server/web application.
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02:41<virtual>Sorry 'no. not that I know of' is a more correct answer. If they have one, then I don't know what it's called. :P
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02:41<rnowak>I have a black box that accelerates all kinds of applications in the whole wide world
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02:42<virtual>I'll buy it off you for $5.
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02:43<rnowak>it is a BoxaaS
02:44<virtual>OK, with a name like that, it must be worth at least $500,000
02:44<virtual>Perhaps it should be BaaS.
02:45<rnowak>BaaS is already taken
02:45<rnowak>while this is a revolutionary concept, innovation like hasn't been innovated before
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03:00<xar>akerl: poke
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03:56<gasp>Is linode based on aws infrastructure ?
03:58<Kyhwana>Linode uses Xen, like AWS and there's a bug in Xen that needs to be patched
03:59*nate wasn't aware "AWS infrastructure" was a virtual method >.>
04:00<Kyhwana>nate: everythings virtualised on a single box and cached
04:09<gasp>Thnx for your answer Kyhwana !
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04:16<praetorian>nate: see: heroku
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04:17<nate>praetorian: I was talking as in Xen, KVM, OpenVZ, etc :P
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04:58<James_T>Where is my hotdog datacentre
04:58<James_T>Will it come with mustard? :P
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06:54<TwoWholeWorms>So, I have a process which I started on Friday which is inserting rows into a database table. There are definitely fewer than 60,000 rows in the table because that's all there are in the source file it's processing, but the thing's still going and it's currently taking 84 (I timed it) seconds to do a single insert, and it grows with every insert. There's only one index on the table (the PK, `id` BIGINT). Anyone got any ideas why it could be slowing down so
06:54<TwoWholeWorms> drastically?
06:55<TwoWholeWorms>The same thing on my laptop and an AWS server takes about 90 minutes, but running it on the linode it's still going. :/
06:56<xar>a better forum for a question like that is dba.stackexchange
06:57<TwoWholeWorms>Didn't think of that.
06:57<TwoWholeWorms>As far as I can see, though, the config is identical on both servers. :/
06:58<xar>did you try spinning up another server, it's consistent across different hyps?
06:59<xar>like all public clouds, it's a shared tenant environment, who knows what's happening on your host.
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07:02<Pramod>Hi how many maximum IPs we can get per cloud #linode?
07:02<trippeh>Pramod: bazillions, if IPv6
07:02<Pramod>IP4 ?
07:03<HoopyCat>Pramod: you can get a /48 or so upon request
07:03<Yaakov>One per 'node unless you have a technical justification.
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07:03<HoopyCat>Pramod: for legacy IP, one unless there's a darn good reason. (there aren't many IPv4 addresses left in the world)
07:03<TwoWholeWorms>Although that's /64, not a /48 :p
07:03<Pramod>\Thanks guys
07:03<xar>the easy questions really wake people up, wow
07:04<HoopyCat>xar: no, my alarm clock does
07:04<xar>guys, on the command line, how do I change directories?
07:04<trippeh>they can be really hard on the justification, though
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07:04<Yaakov>xar: use grep.
07:04*trippeh just sat down on the "puter"
07:04<tiny>Hi. There's some downtime scheduled because of Xen Security Advisories. 12:00 AM. When is that?
07:04<lakridserne>HoopyCat: /48? I thought that was what Linode had (IPv6) - /56 and /64 is what they hand out, right?
07:04<xar>BZZZZ WRONG, the answer was awk. Please play again.
07:04<HoopyCat>xar: "vi ." will let you change the directory
07:04<Yaakov>tiny: That's midnight.
07:04<tiny>Yaakov: well that could also be midday.
07:05<Yaakov>tiny: Should be a 24-hour clock, not AM/PM.
07:05<trippeh>tiny: if looking in the manager, its in the time zone you have set on you profile
07:05<tiny>How do you know?
07:05<Yaakov>There is a convention, USUALLY followed that 12PM is noon, 12AM midnight.
07:05<HoopyCat>tiny: american public school system
07:05<lakridserne>tiny: It is the time zone you set up in your profile - confirmed by caker and also says so on the dahsboard
07:05<Yaakov>But AM/PM is an outdated bit of nonsense that ought to die.
07:05<tiny>24 hour clock format would be better.
07:06<tiny>I have an email server on one of the nodes and schedulled downtime could be as long as two hours?
07:06<HoopyCat>lakridserne: linode has a /30 for north american operations
07:06<HoopyCat>tiny: sure, if everything goes terribly wrong
07:06<xar>be prepared for a complete meltdown.
07:06<Yaakov>tiny: It could be much shorter, but there's no way to be sure.
07:06<trippeh>tiny: most are much shorter.
07:06<xar>the cool soothing green on the home page, will be blood red
07:06<Yaakov>tiny: You can migrate, and that will give you some control.
07:06<lakridserne>HoopyCat: Cool
07:07<Yaakov>It will take a shorter time to migrate to a DC that's already been done than two hours, but maybe longer than the maintenance.
07:07<tiny>Yaakov: to another Datacenter?
07:07<lakridserne>tiny: I already spinned up a new node and migrated things with 1 minute or less in downtime
07:07<Yaakov>Or, better yet, spin up a backup MTA in a dfferent DC.
07:08<Yaakov>Then you can shut it down when everything is clear.
07:08<lakridserne>When you spin up a new node, it'll most likely land on a host that doesn't need maintenance (it should, but who knows how many hosts they have that doesn't need maintenance)
07:08<Yaakov>You won't pay much.
07:08<lakridserne>Yaakov: Correct
07:09<Yaakov>If you need HA or anything like it, you need redundancy.
07:09<@jackley>tiny: lakridserne is correct, if you create a new Linode, it'll land on a host that won't require a reboot
07:09<Yaakov>It's an unfortunate thing that this maintenance is required, but it could be a lot worse if they didn't do it.
07:10<tiny>Yaakov: I understand that. I'm trying to minimise downtimes (DNS + email)
07:10<Yaakov>tiny: You can add an MX with a lower value.
07:10<Yaakov>It will automagically collect the email when your primary is offline.
07:11<tiny>Yaakov: yes, I first need to make one :) (I've just migrated) and I also server DNS
07:11<tiny>Well not just but it's on a todo list.
07:11<lakridserne>Yeah. Some of my clients bitched about it when I sent an email out about the maintenance, when I wasn't sure if I'd be able to jump around it at that time yet... Now, I was able to jump around it, but still - even if it was down for the full 2 hours, it'd still be far better than Linode doing nothing and being hacked
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07:12<HoopyCat>tiny: DNS shouldn't matter too much, since you've already got a secondary nameserver on a different linode (and thus different host). incoming mail will be retried, unless it's spam, in which case it probably won't
07:12<Yaakov>Well, office for me.
07:12<Yaakov>Good luck with your email, all email stinks on ice.
07:12<lakridserne>tiny: You can create a new node, take a snapshot of your old node, restore to the new node, and swap IP's - that way you'll be able to jump around it for now... But you really should set up another MX record on another server
07:13<tiny>lakridserne: yes, I should create secondary MX
07:14<tiny>So DNS shouldn't be a problem since it's beeing "hosted on Linode"
07:14<HoopyCat>tiny: are you running your own DNS servers?
07:15<tiny>HoopyCat: no, I just remembered. I'm using Linode's DNS server configured trough web pannel.
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07:15<tiny>This server is so low maintenance that I forget :)
07:15<HoopyCat>tiny: ah, in that case you're totally fine. (those are running on hosts which will be rebooted as well, but that's why there's six of them)
07:17<tiny>any good guide for creating secondary MX server with syncing and all?
07:17<Meyer^>tiny: You can also resize to a larger one and then resize back
07:17<Meyer^>if you want to do the maintenace "now"
07:18<tiny>I created the first one from here without using mysql. Just plain text files. Working great.
07:20<tiny>Thanks for all the suggestions. I'll cook something up.
07:22<HoopyCat>and now, to the office of science!
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07:29<tiny>So what kind of XEN SAs are we talking about here?
07:31<Cromulent>gah I hate it when you fix one thing on your website and another thing breaks - clearly my unit testing is not at all comprehensive :|
07:31<Peng>tiny: They're embargoed.
07:31<Peng>tiny: We'll find out how bad the disaster wasn't on the 10th.
07:31<tiny>I see.
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07:33<hawk>Peng: There's a bunch of announcements in the pipe with different dates, aren't there? Is it one specific that is really spectacular?
07:33<axody>hi I have 2 separate linode accounts. One I recieved info saying the linodes need rebooting for security update etc. The other account I haven't had anything.... should I just keep an eye out for email?
07:33<hawk>(based on
07:35<lakridserne>axody: You can also log in to your control panel and see the times for maintenance now
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07:39<Peng>hawk: we don't know
07:39<Peng>hawk: The providers have usually been saying "several vulnerablities" and "the tenth", and when I first looked only two had CVEs, which might imply they were the worst, or just hte oldest.
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07:51<axody>lakridserne: thanks
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08:38<Kobian>Hello guys, good day. Any news on when will the SG location be launched?
08:40<felixjet__>stupid Lish timeouts everytime
08:40<arlen>use lish ssh
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08:52<Nathanael>Good morning. At least here it is anyway.
08:53<lakridserne>Hi there Nathanael
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09:12<Nathanael>Morning lakridserne
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09:22<lakridserne>Nathanael: How's it going?
09:23<Nathanael>snow is melting here. Almost ready to get started on starting up my first Linode instance. brand new customer here :)
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09:27<SNy>Hmpf! Arlen fscked up the quest again!
09:27<mattmcc>Hrm. Had a node enter its maintenance window at 2:00 UTC, but nothing new in the host job queue in the control panel..
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09:28<mattmcc>Past hardware/Xen host ugprades were generally good about providing progress information.
09:29<Nach>This may seem like a ridiculus question, but is there anything that can be done to enable vmx CPU extension on a Linode server?
09:29<k^^>Hello, happy Linode user here. Quick question: moved resized my Linode from 2G to 4G today. After that the VPS seems slower. One process (importing products to woocommerce was always around 10 minutes. Sometimes 9, sometimes 11. Now the same proces is around 30 minutes(27,30 etc). Is that normal?
09:30<mattmcc>(Er, 14:00 UTC even)
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09:35<lakridserne>k^^: Each host node has a different load, but I wouldn't expect that kind of change. I'd definitely ask support what's going on there
09:35<pyruvate>mattmcc: The time given is only a window, so I figure the process may not have started yet for your host. It's not expected to take the whole two hours.
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09:37<k^^>Thank you lakridserne , I will wait until tonite (maybe it is temporary), and if it's still slow I will ask support.
09:38<mattmcc>pyruvate: I get that, but I've always seen an indicator of when the node was actually taken down in the linode manager in the past.
09:38<Nach>This may seem like a ridiculus question, but is there anything that can be done to enable vmx CPU extensions on a Linode server?
09:39<pyruvate>Is it already down?
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09:39<mattmcc>It was listed as 'stopped' at the very beginning of the window, even though it remained online for 17 minutes after that.
09:40<mattmcc>Went down without notice in the manager, and was already back online for a couple minutes before a notice showed up in the manager.
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09:42<pyruvate>Odd. Maybe that's because it's a host reboot and not a guest one.
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09:43<mattmcc>So overall it was down for 17 minutes, not terrible.
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09:44<mattmcc>Er, 15.
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09:59<Cromulent>does team viewer encrypt connections?
10:03<+linbot>New news from status: Scheduled Network Maintenance - London <>
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10:18<Nathanael>If i start my first linode now, will it be already updated, or will it be taken down for a few minutes like I've been reading everyone talk about?
10:19<Peng>if you create a new node now, it'll be on already-updated hardware
10:19<sandeep>it'll be on an updated host
10:19<Nathanael>ok. Thanks :)
10:22<EyePulp>ain't no party like rolling Xen reboot party.
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10:34<Ubik>EyePulp: Yeah, now we just need an official Xen Reboot Party streaming radio station. :P
10:35<Ubik>Problem is, we'd have to spin the Icecast instance up somewhere *else* so it wouldn't get rebooted mid-party. ;)
10:35<akerl>I've been running around my house shouting "It's Raining Xen", does that count?
10:35<Ubik>akerl: yep, good enough
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10:50<EyePulp>I assume people who don't want to wait for the hammer to fall should be firing up new nodes and doing an ip swap
10:52<kovshenin>EyePulp: that's what we're doing, yes
10:52<kovshenin>IP swap takes about a minute or two
10:52<akerl>Something something high-availability
10:53*EyePulp gets to work on an automation script
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10:53<Eugene>Meanwhile i'm just sitting here, patiently waiting my reboots.
10:54<Eugene>I might add a userstyle to rid myself othe horrible alert box though
10:54<Peng>THe abuse alert box is the same but, like, RED.
10:55-!-Bdragon [~bdragon@2001:470:c37f:30:f2de:f1ff:fe5a:8ef3] has joined #linode
10:55<Eugene>There, blessed silence once again.
10:56<Peng>Hope you don't miss out on a different type of important alrt in the future :\
10:56<Eugene>It helps that I don't care
10:56<Eugene>Remember: uptime is a measurement of unpatched vulnerabilities
10:56<Yaakov>I keep my uptime at around 12 seconds.
10:56<Yaakov>I haven't been compromised yet.
10:57<Peng>Eugene: pm?
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11:01<Nathanael>I assume it's best to run "do-release-upgrade" after installing the LAMP stack?
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11:01<Peng>Nathanael: What why are you doing that.
11:01<kovshenin>it's best not to install a lamp stack and use nginx instead
11:02<akerl>Nathanael: If you just installed things, but you're somehow already running an older distro release... how'd that happen
11:02<Peng>Nathanael: What do you think do-release-upgrade does?
11:03<Nathanael>i assumed it upgraded to the latest versions. - yes, i know, never assume anything!
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11:04<Nathanael>upon initial login, it said there were like 60 things that needed upgraded and many of which were security related.
11:05<akerl>`apt-get update` and `apt-get upgrade`
11:05<akerl>do-release-upgrade is for hopping between distro releases (12.04 -> 14.04 and the like)
11:05<akerl>It's the difference between getting maintenance done on your car and trading it in for a newer model
11:06<Nathanael>ahh.. :)
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11:13<Ubik>Is it normal to have to reboot the Linodes in question after an IP swap?
11:13<akerl>Only if they're really old
11:14<Ubik>Ah. And of course all of mine were really old (I was going 32->64 bit), so that's probably why.
11:14<akerl>There's a subset of Linodes from the far past that predate the thing where they made reboots no longer necessary for IP Swaps and such
11:14<Ubik>bet that's me
11:15<kovshenin>you'll still need ifdown eth0 && ifup eth0 or dhclient or service networking restart or whatever to get the updated IPs working on both nodes
11:15<akerl>Note: once you reboot this time, you won't have to do it again for IP swaps and such in the future
11:18<gparent>that explains why 'no you won't have to reboot' didn't quite work
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11:20<zifnab>ssh question: is there a way on a server to set something up like 'if trying to log into first.last, actually log into zifnab'
11:21<zifnab>i realize i could use .ssh/config on the client side, but is there a server side solution?
11:21<akerl>Probably could do terrible things in PAM, but "not really"
11:21<zifnab>i could also set the uid to 0, then do terrible thing sto the shell
11:22<zifnab>can you hvae a setuid shell?
11:23<zifnab>(because if so, i could always do a setuid/setgid in a c wrapper that launches bash as the correct user)
11:23<akerl>This seems like the beginning of a story that ends with "wow, that's a really interesting botnet I'm part of"
11:26<Nathanael>"SSH key pair authentication" recommended?
11:26<Eugene>You can have multiple entries in passwd with the same uid
11:27<Eugene>The first one is what'll be returned for the name
11:27<akerl>Nathanael: Yes
11:27<akerl>Eugene: that's.... kinda terrifying
11:27<akerl>I wonder how many things make assumptions about that
11:27<Eugene>How so? It's no different than forward vs reverse DNS.... A, B, and C implies D, but D only implies A.
11:28<Eugene>(yes, you can have multiple PTRs.... even MORE things break with that)
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11:31<akerl>Well yea, I'm not suggesting that you're wrong, just that I bet *lots* of software devs didn't know that was a thing and thus have made lots of assumptions about it
11:32<Peng>Next month: akerl and Eugene inspire a new sudo CVE
11:32-!-tiny [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
11:33<Eugene>"CVE finding" is mostly "realize that an off-by-one error fixed three Major Versions Ago can be exploited on basically everything except Gentoo"
11:33-!-coxn [] has quit [Quit: lol imma change hypervisors]
11:33<Peng>and OpenBSD
11:33<Eugene>And then the RH/Debian guys run a bunch of `git cherry-pick` and its done
11:34<Peng>Who was the OpenBSD person who posted a rant on their blog about how long release and support cycles encourage what Eugene just said? tedu?
11:34<Peng>or phk?
11:34<Eugene>That glibc thing being an excellent example of how the process works
11:34<Eugene>With the notable exception of somebody screwing it up
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11:35<Eugene>No clue, I don't trust people with three-letter usernames
11:35<wltjr>what is up with the reboots, I got my email last night, first one was supposed to be rebooted tomorrow, but I just got notice it was done today....
11:35<Eugene>Check the timezones
11:35<wltjr>I guess the rest will be rebooted when ever and not at the time I was told...
11:35<wltjr>I did, I converted from UTC to EST
11:36<Eugene>Maybe the host is just eager
11:36<Peng>It's a host, not a dog
11:36<wltjr>hopefully the rest will be at times we will see
11:36<DrJ>wltjr: curious, how long was it down?
11:37<wltjr>DrJ: no clue its not up so, I have to look into what is going on
11:37<akerl>wltjr: Are you sure it didn't just boot and your system failed?
11:37*DrJ is hoping when his servers go down it isn't too long
11:37<wltjr>also looks like i was off, they did it at the right time, schedule for 11am, got email at 11:30 EST it was done, not to see why its not up and running
11:39<wltjr>going there now, its odd, initial dashboard with all hosts shows completed, the host job queue shows host initiated restart
11:39<Eugene>Just means you're stuck in the queue. There's lots of Linodes on a host, if they all booted at once there'd be pandemonium on the I/O controller
11:39<@caker>his Linode is already booted - not stuck
11:39<Peng>It should say the boot job isn't complete yet, if you haven't been booted yet.
11:40<Peng>Good morning
11:40<Eugene>Oh, then you're fine. Have a cookie!
11:40<Eugene>Dangit, now I want cookies. And there's boxes of thin mints in the cupboard
11:40<Eugene>Curse you, girl scouts
11:44<wltjr>the host is up and running all is well looks like about 10 or so minutes for reboot, been up 23 minutes, reboot at 11EST and its 11:43, think it took vpn a sec to reestablish over ipv6 or something not sure
11:45<wltjr>only have 1 other during business hours, the rest are after hours thankfully
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11:53<MajObviousman>ok, time to cover old ground
11:53<MajObviousman>what's the best DNS registrar that actually does DNS SEC?
11:54<hawk>As in they can do signed delegations?
11:54*MajObviousman has been using namecheap, but they still haven't figured out DNSSEC, and can't even give an ETA
11:58<hawk>Gandi is an option at least. I don't know which ones you may classify as "good" in the first place.
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12:00<Eugene>I hear Godaddy does DNSSEC
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12:02*MajObviousman stares at Eugene
12:02<Ubik>Aren't they all bad by default?
12:04<hawk>Ubik: Well, they tend not to be brilliant, I'll give you that. They're not all equally bad, though.
12:04<Ubik>hawk: some just suck less, I guess
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12:08<Eugene>DLV is also an option
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12:09<gthutch>Anyone available to answer a general inquiry?
12:09<akerl>This is the user community. If you have a question, you're welcome to ask it
12:09<gthutch>I used a promo code on my sign-up just now and don't know how to check if it was applied
12:09<akerl>A promo code or a referral code?
12:09<gthutch>Promotional code
12:10<akerl>Look in the Account tab, see if you have monies?
12:10<gthutch>Well it was supposed to be 30% off
12:10<gthutch>And I added $20 to my account
12:10<gthutch>Just not sure where I'd see the 30% off or whatever
12:10<akerl>30% off doesn't sound like a thing
12:10<akerl>Where did you see that?
12:11<gthutch>but not the 30% one on rmn
12:11<akerl>Pretty sure those are all 100% bogus
12:11<akerl>those "promo codes" are referral codes
12:11<akerl>People put them in there hoping you'll use them as referral codes so that the person who owns the code can get money
12:12<gthutch>I got played lol
12:12<gparent>well you didn't lose anything
12:12<gthutch>but i gained this L
12:12<gparent>you gained a wonderful vps
12:12<gthutch>for sure
12:12<gthutch>i was going with linode regardless
12:13<Eugene>And a great huge love
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12:13<gthutch>My Linode is currently being created, once this is finished I can choose which Linux distrub and all
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12:14<Cromulent>this is going to annoy a lot of web masters
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12:15<gthutch>Paid advertising is the only reilable way to do things IMO
12:15<Eugene>I wonder how the Time Cube page will rank under that system
12:15<gthutch>SEO changes at the drop of a dime
12:15<Cromulent>I wonder if that'll mean the republicans websites will be dropped down the rankings
12:15<gthutch>It would mean politicans would be on google page 10, period
12:15*HedgeMage wonders how that heuristic works with fiction web sites
12:15<gthutch>Even for searching their own name
12:16<Cromulent>yeah my website isn't really fact based - more opinion based (its a music website) not sure how I'll rank if it is facts only
12:16<gthutch>random question
12:16<gthutch>"Swap Disk" ?
12:16<gthutch>what is that
12:16<gthutch>when deploying image
12:16<HedgeMage>gthutch: swap is disk space where memory can be paged out to make more room in RAM.
12:17<Cromulent>gthutch: it uses hard drive space to page data from RAM to hard drive to free up RAM space or move rarely used data from RAM
12:17<gthutch>ah like virtual memory basically
12:17<Cromulent>gthutch: yeah kinda although Linux is pretty clever how it manages it
12:17<gthutch>awesome ty
12:17<gthutch>also what distrub of linux do you all prefer?
12:18<Cromulent>debian or Ubuntu LTS
12:18<gthutch>i've used centos 6 in the past
12:18<HedgeMage>gthutch: given that you are unlikely to do a suspend-to-disk on a server, it's not important to have a ton of swap...just enough to let almost-never-used stuff come out of ram and give the server time to alert you if you filled your ram up.
12:18<Cromulent>mainly ubuntu LTS
12:18<HedgeMage>gthutch: Depends on the use case. I have Gentoo, Slackware, and Ubuntu in use on various things.
12:19<Cromulent>my OS choice is ubuntu LTS and OpenBSD for servers and Arch Linux for desktops
12:19<gthutch>I'll be hosting landing pages, wordpress blogs
12:19<gthutch>But I'll be using paid advertising so driving a decent amount of traffic
12:19<gthutch>Taboola, Outbrain, etc
12:20<gthutch>Ubuntu LTS?
12:20<Cromulent>LTS = Long Term Support
12:21<Cromulent>5 years of support for each LTS release
12:21<gthutch>Awesome getting it setup now
12:21<gthutch>Man I've got an unmanaged dedi with another host right
12:21<gthutch>And I'm starting to think I setup something wrong on it
12:21<gthutch>Cause it's using like 1.5GB of ram doing nothing
12:21<gthutch>Only has a few pages on it, havent uploaded much yet
12:21<nate>memory leak perhaps? Also make sure you're not looking at like reserved memory :P
12:21<Cromulent>so LinkedIn apparently thinks I should be a professional print - software and services salesman
12:22<gthutch>CentOS 64bit 6, running webmin
12:22<gthutch>for my panel
12:22<nate>Cromulent: yeah I get stuff like that every once in a while
12:22<Cromulent>ugn don't use panels
12:22<nate>I got one yesterday for hospital administration
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12:22<gthutch>what you guys are like
12:22<gthutch>ssh only kinda guys?
12:22*nate uses webmin
12:22<gthutch>thats what my programmer says
12:22<gthutch>he's like man i dig ssh
12:22<gthutch>if you want the panel i'll install for you
12:22<gthutch>but im cool w/ this
12:22<gthutch>i was like o_O
12:23<nate>I don't mind SSH, but for quick/generic stuff (like managing my DNS) I'll take webmin any day :P
12:23<gthutch>so could webmin cause that?
12:23<gthutch>the memory usage
12:23<gthutch>or nah
12:23<nate>what, 1.5GB? not unless you got it doing some funky shit
12:23<gthutch>nothing really
12:23<nate>I used to run webmin on the 512MB linodes without an issue
12:23<gthutch>honestly i'd share the link with you but
12:23<gthutch>im not sure i hardened it well
12:23<warewolf>back in my day, I ran e-mail, jabber, mysql, apache, etc - on a Linode 64.
12:23<dzho>run top
12:23<nate>I'm a security auditor/IDS guy for a living, what could I possibly do oh wait...
12:24<gthutch>here's from webmin
12:24<gthutch>CPU usage 0% user, 0% kernel, 0% IO, 100% idle
12:24<gthutch>Real memory 1.57 GB used, 7.65 GB total
12:25<gthutch>am i reading it wrong maybe
12:25<nate>No that's showing actual in-use, look at the process list and sort by memory
12:25<Cromulent>gthutch: free -m
12:25<Cromulent>might be showing cached memory or buffers
12:26<Cromulent>free -m will show you exactly
12:26<Nathanael>followed directions for setting up my Linode. Anyone need done before it will accept an FTP connection?
12:26<+linbot>Please use SSH/SCP/SFTP/rsync-over-ssh instead of FTP:
12:26<gparent>you would need to install a FTP server
12:26<gparent>and run it
12:28<Nathanael>got it. Needed to use SSH file transfer protocal
12:29<Cromulent>you can download government papers from WW2 in England and I managed to get hold of a set of files detailing the psychological warfare methods the British used against the Germans in the battle of normandy in 1944 - pretty cool stuff
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12:33<gthutch>MySQL 1270456 kB
12:33<gthutch>thats a lot of memory for mysql isnt it
12:33<gthutch>to be using
12:33<Cromulent>yeah might want to tune MySQL a bit
12:34<Peng>Well, depends on what it's doing.
12:34<gthutch>essentially nothing right now
12:34<gthutch>im using debian
12:34<gthutch>not debian
12:34<nate>gthutch: Roughly 1.2GB there, you probably have it tuned for reserving a lot
12:34<gthutch>whats that mysql drop in
12:34<gthutch>using percona
12:36<Cromulent>am I the only one that finds the last few days of a website development project much harder than the earlier development work?
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12:36<nate>gthutch: if you're doing a single server set up, mariadb is probably a better choice
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12:47<ldlework>Cromulent: Yes, but seeing a project to the end, will embiggen any man's pride. Stick with it.
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12:51<rolpo>Can anyone show me a speedtest-cli outpiut
12:52<gparent>rolpo: couldn't you run it and get one?
12:52<rolpo>i dont have a server yet
12:53<akerl>speedtest-cli seems to be for perf testing what pingdom is for monitoring: an interesting idea that fails to account for how reality works
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13:03<Cromulent>ldlework: yep just need a couple of late nights to get it done - will also need to work out how I am going to go about paying third parties though which might be a bit of a head scratcher
13:05<rolpo>is it possible for someone to run the test ?
13:05<rolpo>i worry about the bandwidth that i would be available
13:06<Cromulent>rolpo: the pricing shows the bandwidth available for each plan
13:07<Cromulent>the 1GB plan for instance has 125Mbit bandwidth outbound and 40Gbit bandwidth inbound
13:08<rolpo>yes but is this guarantee?
13:08<@caker>We don't control the Internet - so, once it leaves us you're at the mercy of the tubes and your customer's ISPs
13:10<+linbot>New news from forum: RAID card failure - all data was lost in Customer Testimonials <>
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13:13<rolpo>caker: sure but allot of providers says 250Mbit but when you buy you realize that is under 100Mit
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13:14<nate>rolpo: Every aspect of the internet is by all intents a theoretical maximum speed, very few things truly guarentee you the absolute max they advertise
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13:14<rolpo>thats why i asked for a speedtest-cli output.
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13:15<rolpo>just to have it as a reference
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13:17<gparent>rolpo: even if the speedtest said 1 mbps, that would not mean your linoed is incapable of reaching higher throughput
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13:21<rolpo>gparent: i dont disagree with that but at least i will now something
13:21<Peng>Linode runs a solid network. You can probably usually get 250 Mbps, if that's what your plan is.
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13:22<Peng>But, that won't do you any good if you're on a satellite Internet conection in the middle of the Pacific.
13:22<gparent>rolpo: you will know the performance of speedtest, and nothing about Linode. :)
13:24<rolpo>ok but you dont help me
13:25<arlen>because it's dumb
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13:26<trippeh>I usually get 400-1000Mbps to/from linodes in london over the internets
13:26<trippeh>internally at linode I've seen 10Gbps
13:26<trippeh>its fine
13:27<rolpo>trippeh: thank you
13:28<rolpo>can you also make a test run with speedtest-cli
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13:29<gthutch>so im installing nginx right now
13:29<gthutch>and editing the config file or whatever
13:30<gthutch>do i have to manually delete all those # signs?
13:30<gthutch>or do i have to add the # sign to each line that i add?
13:30<gparent>lines that begin by # are comments
13:30<gparent>they are ignored by nginx
13:30<gthutch>but everything in this dang file has it
13:30<gthutch>so i'd have to delete everything?
13:30<gthutch>hold on i'll ss
13:30<gparent>I just told you, they're comments
13:30<gparent>Theyre ignored by nginx
13:30<gparent>You do whatever you want
13:32<Cromulent>gthutch: they are just comments giving you examples
13:33<rolpo>what plan do you have ?
13:33<Peng>rolpo: Helping you is what we've been doing the whole time.
13:34<Peng>gthutch: Default nginx.conf files tend to contain a lot of commented-out nonsense and examples. And, worse, uncommented nonsense and examples.
13:35<Peng>gthutch: You should read hte docs, learn what it all does, and then delete most of it.
13:35<trippeh>speedtest-cli seems a bit wonky tbh. it doesnt run for nearly long enough
13:35<Peng>no, really?
13:36<Peng>Shocked, I am.
13:36<trippeh>that upload perf is nearly double of the plan limit
13:36<Cromulent>my ISP cheats with speedtest by having their own internal server used for speedtests so that the speedtest never touches the public internet
13:36<Cromulent>always get your so called max speed that way so customers don't complain
13:37<Peng>I'm kind of impressed.
13:37<trippeh>so no isp's can have their own speedtest server? woulnt be many servers then :)
13:37<Peng>It's surprising when ISPs are both clever and evil at the same time.
13:38<trippeh>speedtest client SHOULD probably be smart enough to discard server in same AS
13:38<trippeh>rolpo: this was the 2GB plan
13:39<rolpo>do you run a webserver to try download a big file from there ?
13:40<+linbot>New news from forum: fedup Fedora 20 to 21 failing on Linode in General Discussion <>
13:40<Peng>rolpo: Why?
13:41<gparent>Cromulent: I wish every ISP did that
13:43<Kyhwana>5/w 40
13:43<Kyhwana>also lols at github
13:43<rolpo>Peng: for testing the upload
13:43-!-seanh-corona1 [~Adium@] has joined #linode
13:43<gparent>rolpo: the only thing you'll get from speedtest-cli are numbers much lower than what Linode can actually support.
13:43<buhman>rolpo: you can download big files from Linode's servers if you want
13:43<Peng>rolpo: That mostly tests how much your OS's TCP implementation sucks at high-latency transfers.
13:43<Kyhwana>(Their cdn/assets server cert has expired so no CSS/etc
13:44<Peng>Kyhwana: oh gosh
13:44-!-AlexK [] has joined #linode
13:45<AlexK>Hi there. I had some questions about the 2GB plan listed here:
13:45<AlexK>I was wondering if I could have 5 IP Addresses with my plan?
13:45<+linbot>Each Linode comes with 1 public IPv4 address and 1 public IPv6 address. Additional IPv4 addresses are $ 1 per month, and require technical justification. A /64 or /56 of IPv6 can be routed to your Linode at no charge.
13:46<AlexK>Thank you. I was hoping to have CentOS 6 as an Operating System. Is that option available?
13:46<trippeh>rolpo: 245Mbps from London to Norway. Pretty much exactly what it says on the tin.
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13:47<Peng>AlexK: Um.... CentOS 6 might still be deployable, but it's old as heck, isn't it?
13:47<rolpo>trippeh: thank you
13:47<akerl>Peng: I thought that was a feature?
13:47<trippeh>starts in 12 minutes 33 seconds halp
13:48<AlexK>I see that CentOS7 is available. That would certainly work for me.
13:48<Peng>Oh, good. I thought you wanted 6 specifically.
13:48<rolpo>can i install gentoo on the vps ?
13:48<Peng>rolpo: Yes.
13:48<AlexK>How long do it take to provision the VPS'
13:48<Peng>AlexK: Sorry, the page I linked to only lists the most recent distros. Linode usually keeps the last one or two versions also available to deploy, though not alwas.
13:48<AlexK>No problem, Peng
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13:49<Peng>How long? Not long. Usually a few minutes.
13:49<trippeh>less nowadays
13:49<trippeh>I rarely wait longer than a minute
13:49<Peng>I was counting the typing and clicking, too.
13:49<rolpo>Peng: it starts with installation or i am chrooted ?
13:49<AlexK>These do not come with control panels correct? I'm looking to manage everything via CLI.
13:50<Peng>AlexK: Correct.
13:50<Peng>AlexK: Though you can get a control panel if you want.
13:50<trippeh>AlexK: they are plain linuxes out of the box. No control panels by default
13:50<Peng>rolpo: You press a button and Gentoo appears.
13:50<akerl>That's scary
13:50<gparent>All the good parts of using Gentoo, without the ba... that doesn't sound right.
13:51<rolpo>Peng: so its not like mounting and iso image and boot the server
13:52<Peng>rolpo: It's like having ninjas install Gentoo on your computer.
13:53<Peng>rolpo: You can also do it from scratch if you want.
13:54<AlexK>I am going to be managing 4 web sites. For MySQL management and Data Analytics I am hoping to have the following: 1 IP for each of the 4 websites & 1 "management" IP for Email and Application functions to the VPS itself. If I provide the registration info for the domains, and my plan for using the IPs, how long would it take to get the IP Addresses provisioned?
13:54<laser`>Why do you need an IP for each website?
13:54<laser`>You can have multiple websites per IP
13:55<laser`>(will probably be the answer to your request)
13:56<rolpo>Peng: its on kvm ?
13:56-!-AnMaster [] has quit [Quit: ZNC -]
13:56<Peng>rolpo: Xen
13:56<AlexK>True. Until recently, I used Go Daddy VPS' and I had an IP per website. Go Daddy has since removed this policy and for the sake of simplicity (not having to edit the configs for my apps) and general identification, I'm looking to keep the multiple IPs.
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13:57<laser`>I suspect that, given the shortage of IPv4 addresses, that won't pass muster
13:57<trippeh>starts in 2 minutes 51 seconds mommy I'm scared
13:57<AlexK>laser: in the event that it did get approved, the process of having the IPs provisioned is pretty quick???
13:58<laser`>iirc yeah
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13:58<laser`>you just have to reboot to make them available to your node
13:59<Peng>laser`: no, no reboot anymore
13:59<laser`>ah, I'm out of date!
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14:00<AlexK>Thanks for the help team. I'm all set.
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14:01<Kyhwana>AlexK: good luck getting any extra IPs
14:02<Kyhwana>esp not for websites. Use SNI
14:05<Kyhwana>No, SEO and HTTPS work fine with SNI
14:05<trippeh>eeek, "In Progress"
14:05<Peng>nice knowing you(r VPS)!
14:05<laser`>Ah yeah, mine just went down as well
14:05<laser`>Well, my personal one
14:06<rolpo>are plans upgradeable ?
14:06*laser` should probably have made a note of all the different timings
14:06<Eugene>How close to the start mark is that?
14:06<trippeh>I made a clone just in case. In addition the the usual "on a different continent" backup
14:06<trippeh>to the even
14:06<laser`>Eugene: Almost bang on the hour
14:06<Eugene>Oh, weird.... the Backups column isn't in the /linodes list anymore.
14:06<Peng>rolpo: yes
14:06<trippeh>Eugene: 1 minute over here
14:06<Eugene>Is that going to be permanent?
14:07<trippeh> (unknown) at 20:01 ...
14:07<rolpo>whats cpu the servers has ?
14:07-!-seanh-corona1 [~Adium@] has joined #linode
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14:08<Karrde->cyrix 6x86
14:08-!-AlexK [] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
14:09<Peng>rolpo: E5-2680 v2
14:10<trippeh>hehe "An issue affecting the physical hardware this Linode resides on has been detected."
14:10<trippeh>minor UI issue there ;)
14:12<Donatello>I'm guessing you guys also didn't see the usual shutting down entry in the job queue on the Dashboard?
14:12-!-sqpat [~sqpat@2601:9:3404:2d00:d099:6adc:844f:12bb] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:12<laser`>Yeah, I didn't Donatello
14:12<Donatello>Cool, thanks
14:12-!-sqpat [~sqpat@2601:9:3404:2d00:d099:6adc:844f:12bb] has joined #linode
14:12<Donatello>Who else is doing an all nighter?
14:12<trippeh>It did send a shut down event to the vm, however.
14:13<Peng>I don't remember what hte job queue showed, but the manager uptime figure wasn't reset to 0. :D
14:13<nate><Kyhwana> No, SEO and HTTPS work fine with SNI
14:14<nate>Technically speaking some search engines it's mixed with
14:14<nate>But at the very least google (which is the only one most people care about) works fine with SNI
14:14<laser`>Only got one node today, and I've no reason to believe it shouldn't survive a reboot, so just need to wait for Nagios to clear once the box comes back up (and as this is my Nagios box, for the external monitoring system to give me a green that Nagios is back up)
14:14-!-rolpo [] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
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14:14<Donatello>So what time estimates are we looking at for the maintenance, I really hope it is nothing close to 2 hours?
14:15-!-Cromulent [] has joined #linode
14:15<Peng>It will probably usually be much less.
14:15<trippeh>2 hours is the linode cover their ass if something goes wrong estimate
14:15<Peng>My WAG would be to expect 15-60 minutes.
14:16<Cromulent>awesome XFCE 4.12 released :) looking forward to that hitting Arch Linux soon
14:16-!-bfoote [] has joined #linode
14:17<Kyhwana>nate: then those search engines are bad and should feel bad
14:18<Peng>Does Googlebot do TLS 1.2 fleet-wide yet?
14:18<nate>Kyhwana: I think it's just a case of slow rollout across their entire network, I know bing and yahoo both have some SNI-lacking occasionally
14:18<nate>Peng: They say it does, but there have apparently been some results otherwise
14:19<Kyhwana>well, yhey nees to fix it, as sslv3 isnt a thing anymore. tho i guess theres still tlsv1 in ie8/xp which doesnt do sni i dont think? or does it?
14:19<trippeh>looks like vm's are starting up now
14:19<Peng>It's alive! Maybe!
14:19<nate>Kyhwana: Indeed, IE 6-8 on XP has no SNI, they also have abhorrid TLS support (RC4 based and a crappy 3DES)
14:19<Donatello>Ok, my first host took around 16-18 minutes in case anyone else is still waiting for theirs to get hit.
14:20<+linbot>New news from forum: Update blocked by new relic problem in General Discussion <>
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14:20<laser`>Mine's still down :( (london823)
14:20*Kyhwana should reboot both his before hand to makr sure they come up, his maint window is during sleep time
14:20-!-sqpat [~sqpat@2601:9:3404:2d00:d099:6adc:844f:12bb] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:20<Donatello>laser, what size is it?
14:21<Donatello>Not sure if it will make a difference...
14:21<trippeh>my dash says running now but its not up yet.
14:21<Peng>Larger size should probably be faster.
14:21<Donatello>My first one is 4GB...
14:21<Peng>nate: "crappy 3DES"?
14:21<trippeh>ping reply!
14:22<trippeh>20 minutes
14:22<nate>Peng: Yeah I think it's like 112-bit max or something
14:22*nate double checks
14:22<Kyhwana>peng: its slow!
14:22<trippeh>aand services back up
14:22<nate>Peng: Yeah the two 3DES ciphers IE8 supports (RSA and DHE) are both 112-bit
14:23<nate>amusingly they're the 2nd strongest set of ciphers that IE8 supports on XP
14:23<Peng>nate: Yeah, but 3DES is infinitely better than RC4.
14:23-!-steveski [~steveg@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:23<nate>with the RC4 ones being the 'strongest'
14:23<nate>Peng: True, but when you factor there's no SNI support, I don't see a reason to load up 3DES at all in my configs :P
14:23<Peng>RC4 isn't strong.
14:24<nate>Peng: I meant by IE's order-preference
14:24<nate>RC4 MD5 and RC4 SHA1 are IE's highest-preference ciphers respectively
14:24<nate>followed by DES-CBC3-SHA
14:24-!-bfoote [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:25<nate>from there it puts a bunch of 56-bit and 40-bit ciphers as preference
14:25<nate>IE8 on Vista+ though is fine
14:26-!-Consdale [] has joined #linode
14:27<laser`>Yay I'm back
14:27<Cromulent>oh that's interesting is the first website I've ever seen in the wild that had publically auditable SSL certificates
14:27<Eugene>What do you mean "auditable" ?
14:28<Cromulent>Eugene: open in chrome - click on the SSL text click on the connection tab and then click on the transparency link
14:28<Cromulent>Eugene: also read the text
14:28<Eugene>I see "but does not have public audit records"
14:29<Eugene>Is this what you're talking about?
14:29<Cromulent>Eugene: hmm strange I see "and is publicalky auditable"
14:29<Eugene>Probably a newly-rolled-out cert
14:29<Cromulent>Eugene: yes that is what I'm talking about
14:29<Eugene>The serial number for the end cert I'm seeing is ‎1a c8 5e b7 ae c3 51 3c d8 0d 85 38 5e cf d2 08
14:35<v0lksman>if I spin up a new host right now does it have the security patch already in play?
14:35<v0lksman>IE can I self migrate my hosts to new hosts to avoid any downtime as mandated by the emails sent this weekend?
14:35<v0lksman>arlen: those yesses are for me? :)
14:36<nate>Cromulent: I don't see auditable records, says non to me
14:36<Cromulent>nate: strange what version of chrome are you on?
14:37*laser` sees auditable
14:37<v0lksman>well that certainly makes this more paletable. is there any way to confirm on the new node that I'm safe from the required outage?
14:37-!-seanh-corona1 [~Adium@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
14:37<Cromulent>nate: I'm on 40.0.2214.115 64bit
14:37-!-seanh-corona [~Adium@] has joined #linode
14:37<arlen>caker said all new ones are patched
14:38<nate>40.0.2214.115 m
14:38<trippeh>v0lksman: it shows in the manager, no maintenance required
14:38<trippeh>on the list of linodes
14:38<Cromulent>nate: weird - shows just fine for me on fully patched arch linux system
14:39<nate>Windows, perhaps some sorta difference
14:39<Cromulent>ah maybe
14:39<Cromulent>laser`: are you on linux as well?
14:39<laser`>No, OSX
14:39<zifnab>suprised there isn't more 'omg why cant i move maintenance'
14:39<zifnab>so i guess i'll start
14:39<zifnab>omg why cant i move maintenance
14:40<laser`>Yeah, I have 2 nodes going down at once which is annoying :( although at least they're not two nodes serving the same system
14:40<nate>It appears they only effect EV certificates anyways
14:43<trippeh>yikes, got 5 linodes scheduled for the same day
14:43-!-kaare_ [~kaare@] has joined #linode
14:43<Eugene>Moar linodes!
14:44<trippeh>luckily at night
14:44<trippeh>relative to our users ;)
14:45<SlosHeD>says here my linode will be rebooted on 2015-03-03 2:00:00 PM UTC
14:45<SlosHeD>what is UTC?
14:45<akerl>A timezone?
14:45<laser`>No, it is a timezone
14:45<SlosHeD>could be why im asking :P
14:46<v0lksman>so 20 minutes to migrate what size?
14:46<sirpengi>yes, UTC is a timezone
14:46-!-devcomp [] has joined #linode
14:46<wltjr>ask google
14:47<Peng>What, are we voting?
14:47<SlosHeD>why couldnt they of just stuck with GMT
14:47<SlosHeD>that i knew
14:47<@caker>UTC is GMT ...
14:47<sirpengi>because standards
14:47<wltjr>because computers use UTC not GMT
14:48<trippeh>SlosHeD: log into the manager, then you get times from the timezone your profile is set to.
14:48<Peng>Leap seconds, I think. Wikipdia covers it.
14:48<SlosHeD>i coulda swore i did that already
14:49<SlosHeD>This setting converts the dates and times displayed in the Linode Manager to a timezone of your choice. Your current timezone is: AST
14:49<SlosHeD>thats the one right?
14:49<wltjr>wish I knew about the local time when you log in, I converted them all myself from email, but I did have to do pst and est
14:50<wltjr>I guess its a good sign if I rarely have to log into my account
14:51<zifnab>SlosHeD: UTC is GMT, hint: PST is UTC-9
14:51<zifnab>or somewhere around there
14:51<SlosHeD>Alaska time is -9
14:51<Eugene>-8, until its -7
14:51<zifnab>pdt/pst is utc-9, dont remember which one
14:51<Eugene>Which is next sunday?
14:51<zifnab>fuck dst
14:51<zifnab>is it?
14:51<zifnab>do i lose sleep?
14:51<Eugene>Yeah, hour gone
14:51<v0lksman>anyone have any idea how much downtime per gig of used storage as I assume there is a direct correlation?
14:52<SlosHeD>spring forward...
14:52<zifnab>v0lksman: for the maintenance, htere is none
14:52<zifnab>v0lksman: for a server transfer, its relatively fast, last one i did was ~50MB/s
14:52<gparent>I prefer to use the unit "MinuteGig"
14:52<zifnab>i prefer using hogshead to measure everything
14:52<v0lksman>zifnab: so the outage is 20 minutes per instance? regardless of size?
14:52<zifnab>work is 2 kilohogsheads away
14:54<gparent>zifnab: there's no set time per instance.
14:54<gparent>v0lksman: too!
14:54<v0lksman>uhg....this is a zoo
14:54<laser`>Took my instance closer to 30 minutes
14:55<v0lksman>laser`: size?
14:55<laser`>but I don't see why that should matter
14:55<laser`>nodes aren't being migrated, just hosts patched and rebooted
14:55<zifnab>its the equivelant of 'kill all vms' 'apt-get upgrade' 'reboot'
14:56<gparent>laser`: maybe you can run a speedtest-cli too?
14:56<v0lksman>hrm...I thought I saw 2 of my nodes on the same host having different schedules
14:56<zifnab>v0lksman: they have different windows
14:56<psandin>the factors are phase of the moon, and two dice rolls (where you are in the shutdown queue, and where you are in the start up queue)
14:56<Nathanael>if i log into linux and start a new screen. isn't the old one still there? Ctrl+a N doesn't bring any up and I'm in the minecraft command line, so I can't use linux commands any longer. ?
14:56<zifnab>because every linode in existance needs to be rebooted to fix this
14:56<zifnab>doing all that at once is a terrible idea
14:57<Peng>Nathanael: Um...
14:57<v0lksman>zifnab: right but if the host itself is being rebooted then my guests will go down just patching the hosts doesn't add up in that scenario
14:57<zifnab>your guests are on different hosts
14:57<Peng>Nathanael: Did you reattach to the same screen session or start a new one?
14:57<laser`>they have to reboot the hypervisor for the patch to apply
14:57<psandin>you can't patch a running hypervisor, that ^
14:57<Peng>(Amazon can)
14:57<zifnab>well you *can*
14:57<zifnab>its just messy as hell
14:57<v0lksman>zifnab: I'm reviewing that now...pretty sure I had 2 guests on the same host with different windows
14:57<Nathanael>Peng: started a new one. screen -S mc
14:58<zifnab>v0lksman: heh, might be worth looking into. i've made multiple nodes at once, and they've all gotten different hosts
14:58<Peng>Nathanael: Well, that won't have affected any other sessions.
14:58<v0lksman>Peng: that's what I'm worried about. I have a feeling my client is going to force me to move this there....
14:58<zifnab>Nathanael: screen -r brings back sessions, if you don't know
14:59<zifnab>v0lksman: realistically, even amazon should hav downtime
14:59<zifnab>you still need to do thing slike kernel updates
14:59<zifnab>which, while you can do live with ksplice, i think are probably better done with a reboot still
14:59<laser`>Yeah, my employer has a lot of AWS nodes, they did something very similar a while back
14:59-!-bmn [] has quit [Quit: obai]
14:59<Nathanael>zifnab: I'm in the minecraft command line now, so linux commands don't work unless i exit the minecraft session
15:00<zifnab>Nathanael: yup :) just letting you know
15:00<laser`>Nathanael: Ctrl+A D to disconnect
15:00<Peng>Nathanael: Open a new screen window, then? Ctrl+A c?
15:00<Peng>I'm not sure what's going wrong here.
15:00<v0lksman>laser`: any idea when? Would be nice to have the ammo...I'm not delisional and have been doing sys admin long enough to know there are time...Been with Linode for 7 - 8 years and have never been through this. But my clients are clients and they can crank all they want
15:00-!-gko [~gko@2400:8900::f03c:91ff:fe70:e605] has quit [Quit: ZNC -]
15:00<laser`>a few months ago, I think
15:00<zifnab>v0lksman: do you remember the aws outage of 2010
15:01<Peng>There was another bunch of nasty XSAs, what, in 2013 or 2014?
15:01<zifnab>databases died for an afternoon, s3 went offline soon after
15:01<v0lksman>zifnab: yes that was a failure outage...I'm talking about planned rolling outages with no flexibility on window
15:01<Peng>there was only one AWS outage in 2010?
15:01<laser`> something like that
15:01<Nathanael>laser` - thank you. Ctrl+A D worked. :)
15:01<zifnab>after that you do screen -r to reopen it
15:01<zifnab>screne is great
15:02<zifnab>v0lksman: hopefully whatever SLA you have with the clients states 'planned maintenance does not count towards the uptime gaurantee'
15:02<zifnab>so you can just email them, say its unavailable for up to 2hr on $DATE at $TIME, and if they have a complaint, redirect them to the contract
15:02<zifnab>this isp thing has ruined me
15:03<v0lksman>zifnab: I don't have SLAs cause I'm not the host...I just manage the hosting.. Subtle but keeps my ass clean.. :)
15:03<akerl>I think you're thinking of XSA 108
15:03<zifnab>works well enough
15:03<v0lksman>they just aren't happy with my choice in providers... :P
15:03<zifnab>i still have access to a linode256
15:04<v0lksman>(at this time, they've been happy to date...hahah)
15:04<zifnab>its last restart was a kernel panic 6 months ago
15:04<zifnab>before that it was about 2 years
15:04<zifnab>tbh linode's pretty great - most providers don't do the thing
15:04<zifnab>i stll can't get work to set one up, because 'then we are admitting fault to an outage, which costs money'
15:04<kovshenin>zifnab: they omit posting a lot of things on that blog :)
15:05<zifnab>sure, but its better than nothing
15:05<v0lksman>zifnab: yeah...I've put most of my clients here and am fine even with this outage. Just a PR nightmare (for me and them!!!!) that I need to mitigate
15:05<zifnab>kovshenin: they opened a ticket for me once when a host locked up
15:05-!-subleq [~gavin@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:05<zifnab>i wouldn't have noticed my node was offline otherwise
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15:06<v0lksman>is it possible to port an IP from one node to another?
15:06<kovshenin>yeah, we're the ones usually opening tickets with them, because they haven't noticed our node lost ping :)
15:06<gparent>v0lksman: yes, within a DC>
15:06<zifnab>v0lksman: as long as they're in the same datacenter
15:06<kovshenin>v0lksman: yes, dashboard - remote access - IP swap
15:06<gparent>you create a new node, do IP swap, and they will exchange UP
15:06<gparent>IP too
15:06<v0lksman>kick ass...there is my answer
15:06<zifnab>so you could bypass this downtime by making a new node, copying your current config exactly, then swapping IPs
15:07<zifnab>as new hosts aren't effected
15:07<kovshenin>note that swapping IPs takes about a minute, and you also need to make sure the new node knows about the new IP address when it's active by restarting networking, or issuing dhclient
15:07<v0lksman>yep...that's my solution...I can control the downtime that way and it's all me me me
15:07<zifnab>you could also just move the IP to a nodebalancer and do two backend boxes
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15:08<zifnab>(i'm assuming the nodebalancer hosts have been patched already)
15:08<kovshenin>v0lksman: good plan, just did it on about 12 nodes in the past 48 hours, downtime ranged from 56 seconds to 3 minutes
15:10<+linbot>New news from forum: Linode Critical Xen Maintenance in General Discussion <>
15:13<v0lksman>kovshenin: also lets YOU (or me) to control my own downtime and windows... :)
15:14<kovshenin>for the most part of it yes, our first node was scheduled a reboot in about 24 hours after the announcement over the weekend
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15:17<dmuk1>"An issue affecting the physical hardware this Linode resides on has been detected." - what does this mean?
15:17<akerl>Pretty much what it says
15:17<akerl>There was an issue with the host server
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15:19<zifnab>tl;dr: the host is fucked up
15:19<zifnab>they'll probably move you to a new host
15:19<zifnab>(or brief outage while the host is fixed)
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15:30<v0lksman>is it possible to have backup images moved from one node to another?
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15:30<v0lksman>not restored but backup history
15:37<v0lksman>and just to be clear but a restore of a backup does not need patching correct? It's the container of the guest not the OS on the guest right?
15:37<akerl>It is an exact replica of the full set of disk images that existed when the backup was taken
15:37<Eugene>My understanding is that newly deployed Linodes will go onto patched hosts, yes
15:37<Eugene>This includes from a Backup
15:38<Eugene>The guest OS inside should get the usual `yum update` cycle, but that's your own business
15:38<Eugene>(and besides, doesn't everyboyd have nagios whining at them to install updates every hour?)
15:39<gparent>im sure everyone has ACK'd and ignored it by now yes
15:40<+linbot>New news from forum: Linode Critical Xen Maintenance in General Discussion <>
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15:45<Peng>Yeah I have mail filters configured to send anything matching "updat" or "CVE" straight to the bitbucket
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15:48<Ubik>For good measure, I went ahead and subscribed to the security lists for all distributions we use in house, and set up procmail to save those to /dev/null
15:48<Ubik>keeps the inbox tidy
15:49<Eugene>We have about the same at work.... the nagios alerts are all disabled, but we pretend like we care about the page that has them listed.
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16:05<Ubik>Eugene: We have the alerts on (for now), but let sales get wind of any of them and you have phones ringing off the hook, etc. demanding that *we* fix someone's broken stuff that's broken as a result of Level 3 cutting a fiber link, etc.
16:05<Ubik>Very rarely is it actually something *we* need to fix.
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16:09<Eugene>ain't that grand.
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16:27<Nathanael>If i added a linode to my account for a few seconds, but did nothing with it and just removed it, will i be changed for 1 hour?
16:27<Nathanael>literally like 10 seconds
16:28<Nathanael>three cents I'll never see again
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16:31<buhman>Nathanael: have you *ever* been invoiced for $0.000083 ?
16:32<Peng>I hate when Amazon rounds something up to the nearest cent.
16:32<MJCS->I've been invoiced for a few cents
16:32<purrdeta>buhman: yes, I have.
16:32<MJCS->had to restore a backup to a temp server, get some files and delete it
16:32<psandin>purrdeta: tarsnap?
16:33<MJCS->I wish linode would just let you attach a backup image as a read only drive
16:33<purrdeta>Rackspace actually. After a few months of testing on an account they got pissy about my accumulated total of $0.03
16:33<buhman>MJCS-: you can do that if you don't allocate 100% of your plan to disk images.
16:33<buhman>(with reboot though)
16:33<purrdeta>I probably could have gotten a "credit" since I worked there at the time, but I payed it anyway to then make fun of them :P
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16:34<MJCS->buhman: I allocated 100% to disk image
16:34-!-MJCS- is now known as MJCS
16:34<purrdeta>Their system wouldn't allow me to make a payment of less than $1... so they had to do it manually... and they did.
16:34<buhman>purrdeta: yes
16:35<Peng>Linode, on the other hand, invoiced me 10 or 20 cents all the time.
16:35<therock247uk>$1? o_O lol
16:35<MJCS>$0.03 with credit card transaction fees cost them 7 cents so they lost 4 cents
16:35<purrdeta>I was kind of surprised they ran it, actually.
16:35<Peng>They should've docked your pay $0.03
16:37<MJCS>I got a letter in the mail once for a medical bill of $0.14 (or something less than that)...I laughed because the postage cost way more
16:38<MJCS>Then they kept sending me letters to pay it
16:38<Cromulent>MJCS: I hope you gave them a 20% tip :P
16:38<MJCS>after 8 letters I called em
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16:38<Peng>Was the bill legit?
16:39<MJCS>The strep throat test cost more than my provider would cover
16:39<Peng>$0.14 more?
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16:39<MJCS>or something less than a quarter
16:39<psandin>did you mail them 14 pennies?
16:39<Cromulent>save the pennies and the pounds look after themselves as the saying goes - looks like companies are taking that phrase to heart :)
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16:40<MJCS>Nope. Never paid it out of principle
16:40-!-jrthib [] has quit []
16:40<psandin>tragic, mailing them pennies would have been funnier
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16:43<gthutch>Have a few more noobie question for you guys
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16:43<gthutch>Just setup my domain in the DNS Manager on Linode (registered domain on GoDaddy) and it seems to have routed well, when i go to my .com it brings up the nginx default page, is that right?
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16:44<Peng>gthutch: If that's how you've configured Nginx. Sounds like everything DNS-wise is working.
16:44<gthutch>So now just to edit the nginx config file to point where I want?
16:44<Peng>More or less
16:44<gthutch>dude you knock ping and pong out of the water
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16:54<Nathanael>Addition fee for "Private IP"? I just clicked the link and boom, it was done. ?
16:54<akerl>No fee
16:55<Nathanael>ah. got it. that's an internal ip.
16:55<gthutch>so far, for me , this chat room has made all the difference in the world
16:55<gthutch>you guys are fantastic, as is this community in general
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16:58<nate>Nathanael: If you're looking for a public IP, you're gonna have to have a -really- good reason
16:58<nate>er extra
17:00<+linbot>New news from forum: Linode Critical Xen Maintenance in General Discussion <>
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17:09<Orqoo[Paul]>nate, is "ssl" a good enough reason? :P
17:09<akerl>Why not use SNI?
17:09<Kyhwana>lrn2 SNI
17:09<Kyhwana>Orqoo[Paul]: no
17:10<Orqoo[Paul]>akerl, i know you could use sni, hence the :P
17:10<+linbot>New news from forum: Linode Critical Xen Maintenance in General Discussion <>
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17:17<gthutch>550 Permission Denied while uploading via FTP; set folder and subdirectories to 775
17:17<gthutch>Is that an issue with the FTP users privileges you think?
17:17<akerl>Probably, but you really don't want to use FTP
17:18<gthutch>What would you recommend?
17:19<gthutch>As a replacement for FTP
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17:20<gthutch>can i disable regular FTP completely and just use SFTP?
17:20<akerl>You can uninstall FTP
17:20<akerl>SFTP is based on OpenSSH, and is available by default on your Linode via that daemon
17:21<gthutch>port 22 by def?
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17:27<Nathanael>whats the reasoning behind keeping the swap disk size at 256mb ?
17:27<@caker>instead of?
17:27<@caker>why 512?
17:27*caker shrugs
17:27<akerl>I use 11MB
17:28<Nathanael>documentation says, "We strongly recommend using the default size.", which for the lowest linode plan it defaulst to 256. wasn't sure if 512 would be better for a minecraft server. SSDs are fast anyway
17:29<akerl>Nathanael: If you're hitting swap hard, you generally have a problem that more swap will not solve
17:29<ctpdump>might be worth in having a read about swappiness
17:29<Nathanael>k. thnaks
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17:37<Kel>Dies Linode support adding persistent volumes to an existing server?
17:38<Kel>I cannot see this anywhere in the UI, and I am worried about needing extra storage later on
17:38<Kel>hopefully without rebuilding the whole server
17:39<akerl>Kel: All volumes are persistent
17:39<Kel>That's good. But, can I "rent" additional storage and mount it on a server?
17:40<Kel>I am running a server on Joyent right now, and they have the same policy.
17:41<Kel>Makes the other guys more attractive.
17:42<@tasaro>Kel: You can resize your Linode to a larger size (that comes with more disk space) without needing to rebuild from scratch:
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17:55<Ubik>FWIW, unless I am just having a brain fart, the maintenance times listed in Linode Manager for systems on Sunday (the 8th) do not properly calulate local time from UTC (for those of us who have DST.)
17:55-!-Jordack [] has quit []
17:56<Ubik>(i.e. something at noon UTC will tell me 7AM, when it should be 8AM, since on Sunday we go from -5 to -4)
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17:59<Trinity>is there a reason why when you scale linodes up from 1GB - 96GB the Storage available increases pretty linearly but once you have to add extra storage it is pretty much flat? as in less data per cost
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18:00<Trinity>i.e isnt it more economical to scale from linode 4gb to 8gb rather than increase the available space through linode manager -> extra?
18:01<Trinity>and is there any way to purchase extra data space or is extra the only way to do it, and those are the final prices
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18:01<lakridserne>Trinity: Extras are not available on hourly billing. But yeah it has always been more economical to upgrade to a higher plan
18:01<Eugene>Resize to a bigger Linode.
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18:05<Trinity>is there any other way I can get more space? $320 a month is a bit expensive and I need more than 500gb
18:07<lakridserne>Not from Linode - some people use Amazon S3
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18:16<nate>Trinity: If it's going to be stuff people are accessing a lot, I'd say take a glance at keycdn
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18:20<Eugene>Wow, that's actually really affordable.
18:20<James_T>Trinity: that's a good price for >$500GB
18:20<James_T>(I mean, that could get you several 2TB HDD's a month)
18:22<Eugene>Looks like they operate cheapest as a Cache, rather than like S3.... but hey, that works.
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18:23<trippeh>leaking memory like a boss
18:23*trippeh mumbles
18:24<nate>Eugene: ?
18:25<nate>You talking keycdn?
18:25<Trinity>James_T, thanks, ill take a look at it, but i dont think i need a CDN, running a server on this linode and it will be only one reading data locally
18:25<nate>Yeah they're prices are pretty awesome
18:25<nate>there's no such thing as wrong for tired people
18:25<James_T>using a cdn on top of buckets would cut costs too, tho :p
18:26<nate>we even have a little get out of grammar jail card and all
18:26<nate>though actually
18:26<nate>so hah!
18:26<Eugene>Hey, CDNed CDN!
18:27<James_T>Eugene: S3 isn't really a CDN tho is it?
18:27<James_T>in a sense
18:27<Eugene>CloudFront is
18:27*lakridserne CDNs Eugene
18:27<James_T>cloudfront on top of S3 yeah?
18:27<Eugene>If I needed to move a pile of TB on the cheap I would just solicit free mirrors in #linode.... which is what I've done.
18:27<Eugene>It serves from a bucket, yes
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18:28<James_T>keycdn does spdy... where is their HTTP/2 support
18:28<James_T>FREE SSL!?
18:28<Eugene>A fleet of 1GBs using s3fs caching to /var should be able to serve a /lot/ of data, for cheap.
18:28<James_T>Eugene: oh yeah, exploiting the free downloads on linode to cache
18:29<nate>James_T: Probably hoping the spec will actually get finished properly first before they implement it :(
18:29<James_T>Eugene: keycdn will let me put my free wosign cert into them
18:30<James_T>nate: firefox and chrome have already implemented it with compulsory encryption
18:30<James_T>same with google on their servers
18:30<nate>James_T: Well it's not really compulsory, HTTP/2 is https only by design, it's too bad it's literally just SPDY v4
18:31<James_T>SPDY/4 will deprecate HTTP/2
18:31<James_T>but will -actually- be TLS-only
18:31<nate>James_T: HTTP/2 IS SPDY4
18:32<nate>You literally enable HTTP/2 support in Chrome via --enable-spdy4
18:32<James_T>the spec for HTTP/2 apparently dropped the compulsory encryption part
18:32<nate>That doesn't even make sense to me
18:32<James_T>and opportunistic TLS :(
18:32<nate>the entire point to SPDY is wrapped around https
18:33<nate>Opportunistic was never really in anyways
18:33<James_T>(basically the ability to do ssl over port 80 with... what was the magic... STARTTLS?)
18:33<nate>Which is one of the major gripes many (including myself) have with HTTP/2
18:33<James_T>Would be lovely if it had STARTTLS support
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18:34<James_T>since you don't need ugly redirects to upgrade then
18:34<nate>And it should have, it had been talked about for years, and then google was like "Why don't we just wrap this around our next SPDY? MAGIC!" and everyone was like "OH SHINY" and just settled for it
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18:35<Eugene>Oh noes, big corporations writing internet standards. The horror! The horror!
18:35<nate>I mean people even basically -handed- it to them
18:35<buhman>time for http/3
18:35<nate>there were -three- separate draft models for STARTTLS over the potential HTTP/2
18:35<nate>every one of them basically ignored
18:35<nate>going back at least three years
18:36<James_T>most ircd's and clients support STARTTLS ;P
18:36<buhman>http/2 is obsolete
18:36<nate> is the most current one
18:36<nate>buhman: Might as well be imo
18:36<nate>more so seeing as they rolled back to keeping http:// support
18:36<nate>I mean you put http:// support in and this literally has become just a glorified SPDY4 protocol
18:37<nate>Except that it's "optional" now
18:37<Eugene>I'm just waiting for this whole mess to get figured out and then I'll turn it on when it hits CentOS 9 or so.
18:37<Eugene>Chasing the latest standard is for devops
18:37<nate>I'd rather someone other than myself try getting it working on lighttpd
18:37<nate>I dunno what I got myself into
18:37<James_T>NGINX hasn't bothered adding support for it either
18:37<nate>Nginx at least has SPDY
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18:37<nate>I'm trying to get SPDY into lighttpd
18:37<Eugene>Haven't bothered to turn that on either
18:37<nate>I figure from there getting HTTP/2 working shouldn't be a far step
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18:38<James_T>It's -amazing- how much faster it is over using HTTP/1.1 over TLS
18:38<Eugene>I'm still pleased with myself for setting 'smtpd_tls_security_level = encrypt' and watching the spambots disconnect
18:38<Eugene>It's hilarious
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18:40<nate>Can lose you a lot of legitimate email though too potentially
18:41<Eugene>There isn't any legitimate email to these domains
18:41<Eugene>I only set Postfix up so I can get the hostmaster@ emails from StartSSL
18:42<James_T>Or wosign
18:42<Eugene>Turns out expiration notices are important
18:42<James_T>(they use the same system as startssl for dv's)
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18:47<Kyhwana>Eugene: as github found out.
18:47<Kyhwana>Also lol timezones (UTC+13 for the lulz)
18:47<buhman>you know
18:47<Eugene>Heh, they missed one recently?
18:47<buhman>people could just universally ignore the ietf, and refuse to implement http://
18:47<James_T>Kyhwana: UTC-1 exists as well
18:47*buhman wishes
18:48<James_T>buhman: google has ignored IETF
18:48<Kyhwana>James_T: lies!
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18:48<Kyhwana>Eugene: yeah, their CDN/asset server cert expired
18:48<Kyhwana>So github was all HTML1.0ey this morning
18:48<James_T>Kyhwana: err, -13
18:48<Kyhwana>James_T: well, for cert expiry that doesn't matter so much
18:49<James_T>Wait, github being unprofessional? !!!
18:49*buhman makes UTC+23
18:49<James_T>Kyhwana: yeah, don't really hold github to be the kind of company that keeps track of all their stuff :p
18:49<James_T>buhman: blasphemy?
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18:54<James_T>Kyhwana: ???
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18:59<gthutch>Back with another newbie question lol
18:59<nate>I had a 'rolling restarts' joke to go along with that image but I forgot it already :(
19:00<gthutch>I've got my setup properly with linode, so will all the other domains i use be setup as slave domains?
19:00<gthutch>Or do I want more than one master zone?
19:00<gthutch>slave zones, not domains*
19:01<Peng>You probably want everything to be a "master" zone.
19:01<nate>gthutch: Every domain needs as master zone
19:01<nate>a slave zone means it's a secondary nameserver which takes updates from the master so they have records incase the master (or another secondary) goes down
19:02<gthutch>Ah, so a slave zone is only for redundancy basically
19:02<gthutch>Or a back-up per se
19:03<nate>More or less, like you could run your own nameserver on your linode as a master, and configure linodes nameservers for slave
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19:11<gthutch>Is there a guide for running my own nameservers on linode?
19:11<gthutch>Like, etc
19:11<gthutch>I did it on wiredtree a few months back but I imagine its much different here
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19:17<James_T>gthutch: having your own?
19:17<James_T>as in, hosting dns?
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19:19<linoder>Is it still possible to get a discount when paying annually ?
19:20<James_T>Unfortunately not that I know of
19:20<James_T>But you can add credit in advance
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19:27<SlosHeD>I haven't been disconnected once since i started using znc
19:27<SlosHeD>but on my regular isp....disconnect city
19:34<xar>squeaky wheel gets the grease; complain to your ISP
19:34<MajObviousman>soak your phone in grease before making the call so they know you are serious
19:35<MajObviousman>I worked phone support for a while, and I could always tell when the complainer^Wcustomer hadn't greased his phone first. I knew he wasn't really ready for help
19:35<buhman>can I grease myself too? does that count?
19:36<James_T>do that
19:36<avenj>I prefer to start all technical calls with "you, me, and a stick of butter, baby."
19:36*MajObviousman gets all hot and bothered
19:36<buhman>mmm butter
19:37<gthutch>im at work doing tech support right meow
19:37<gthutch>dsl tech support, the WORST
19:37<gthutch>"why is my internet so slow?"
19:37<gthutch>well ma'am you realize this is dsl right
19:37<avenj>solar flares, man
19:38<gthutch>you're 25,000 feet from the DSLAM also ma'am
19:38<gthutch>in rural kansas
19:38<gthutch>factors arent in your favor
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19:38<buhman>25,000 feet is for wimps
19:38<buhman>real internet crosses oceans
19:38*trippeh rubs the fibre while breathing heavily
19:39<xar>I just hate how I know more than front-line support does at my ISP
19:39<SlosHeD>well...i dunno about the rest of the states...but up here DSL is a lot more reliable than the cable network
19:39<gthutch>what ISP
19:39<buhman>xar: would you be better off if you knew less?
19:39<gthutch>i've worked for 2 major ISPs in the states
19:39<SlosHeD>course....we do have a lot of weather variations up here too
19:40<SlosHeD>the local company here offers DSL...which is just resold GCI...which is cable...
19:40<xar>yes I would be better off, ignorance is bliss
19:41<SlosHeD>I think its the IRC network before my ISP
19:41<gthutch>I call my ISP using two cans and a string
19:41<gthutch>But I do live in the south
19:41<SlosHeD>is dualing banjos on the hold music?
19:42<gthutch>I thought so
19:42<gthutch>But those are just the neighbors
19:43<SlosHeD>what state?
19:43<gthutch>originally from california
19:43<gthutch>but meh life takes you places
19:43<gthutch>and originally from stockton so im much safer here at least
19:43<SlosHeD>I lived in washington state
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19:43<SlosHeD>that was all the motivation i needed to never leave Alaska again
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20:10<zifnab>i'd love it if linode released node specs
20:11<zifnab>related, because i aws bored: assume 100k invoices, 2.5 hosts per invoice (pulled out of my ass), and they're all 1gb - thats 1600 nodes per maintenance window to restart
20:11<rnowak>did amazon make you aws bored?
20:11<zifnab>shitty pun is shitty
20:11<zifnab>and i'v always avoided aws - i don't like the pricing model
20:11<zifnab>ddos? $5000 bill
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20:12<James_T>ddos on linode? nullroute
20:12<James_T>quick way to an ipv6-only linode
20:12<zifnab>ddos on aws? meh bill them
20:14<virtual>really, they bill a ddos's traffic?!
20:15<virtual>If that's true, awesome customer service (which is what I thought Amazon was actually good for?)
20:16<zifnab>well, the one time i've used them, and had a stupidly high bill
20:16<zifnab>i opened a ticket, and it was fixed
20:16<zifnab>so there's that
20:16<akerl>They bill on traffic, and let you set alerts for usage, and tell you they bill for traffic
20:16<zifnab>they're pretty good about reversing thigns that are abnormal
20:17<zifnab>reddit hug? they probably won't bill you, at least once
20:17<virtual>ah, okay, so they do actually have customer service.
20:18<virtual>heh @ reddit hug
20:18*James_T waves to gparent
20:18*gparent brofists.
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20:27<Nathanael>new site added. Can't PUT file with FTP. It's logs in, just can't upload file.
20:27<@caker>step 1 is really: don't use FTP. Step 2 is to use sftp, which is built into sshd (you've already got it running)
20:28<pronto>step 3: <-- this video will help
20:31<Nathanael>id di connect via sftp via filezilla
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20:32<trippeh>Nathanael: filezilla support sftp, just prefix the host with sftp://
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20:37<gthutch>also if you changed the SSH port in the beginning you have to use the new one
20:37<gthutch>many guides advise to change SSH port from 22
20:37<James_T>caker: how long till SG is up
20:37<xar>what you got against ftp
20:37<James_T>(do you welcome your new telstra overlords there? (assuming the sale has finalised))
20:38<@caker>a few more weeks. We've been derailed with the XSAs. But: we're working on getting our own transit and peering to improve connectivity there
20:38<James_T>ouch :)
20:38<zifnab>James_T: is telestra good? or are they the comcast of australia?
20:38<@caker>it's a different situation there, network-wise, than everywhere else
20:38<James_T>caker: nice. also noticed you're announcing your ip's out of your own AS
20:39<zifnab>thats always nice to be able to do
20:39<James_T>zifnab: the comcast of australia
20:39<zifnab>James_T: sad
20:39<James_T>but they have good international peering
20:39<zifnab>any idea what telestra's main asn is?
20:39<James_T>caker: well, hopefully telstra will have good peering into pacnet
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20:40<James_T>zifnab: they have a lot of AS's
20:40<zifnab>wasn't sure: that practice is frowned upon now
20:40<zifnab>something about asn depletion
20:40<Eugene>Something something anycast?
20:40<zifnab>well, aren't asns 16bit?
20:40<Eugene>Nodebalancerbalancers :v
20:40<James_T>a lot of sttale ones
20:41<James_T>with no prefixes
20:41<gparent>that's okay, with ASNv6, we're settled.
20:41<zifnab>32bit asns!
20:41<Eugene>They expanded ASNs to 32 a few years ago
20:41<zifnab>legacy support though
20:41<zifnab>some gear doesn't like more than 16bit, ie ios 12.x
20:41<Eugene>That's a tough bit of shit
20:42<zifnab>James_T: yay, as209
20:42<zifnab>all i cared about
20:43<James_T>announced bogons...
20:43<Peng>15 years from now there's only going to be one Tier 1 ISP,, and they'll use AS1. :-\
20:43<zifnab>James_T: bogons aren't technically bad
20:43<James_T>lol Peng
20:43<zifnab>iirc there's an agreement of sorts to announce some of the rfc1918 shit
20:44<zifnab>well, its 'i will eat this misconfigured address space'
20:45<zifnab>we had an issue with them at one point, where they were re-announcing our addresss space as their own
20:45<zifnab>apparnetly they assumed we wanted that
20:45<zifnab>and its totally legal to do so, but it f ucked up routing for us as we're dual homed
20:45<zifnab>(zayo would always have +1 hop, even on things that were the same asn path difference)
20:46<zifnab>they'll do it anyways in some places
20:46<zifnab>you can request a bgp summararized list from them
20:46<zifnab>so, if i have, and someone has, qwest/centurylink would advertise that they own
20:47<zifnab>only to certain peers that request it though, its for lower-end hardware
20:48<James_T>oh, you wanted to know if telstra peered with qwest?
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20:48<zifnab>yeah, that was it
20:48<zifnab>work stuff
20:48<zifnab>nice to have two servers that i know are one as-hop away
20:48<zifnab>like, i konw that from telestra all traffic on our BGP routes won't go through AS6461
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20:49<zifnab>i have one for zayo from DO already (seattle)
20:49<zifnab>zayo is an as-path length of 3, CL is 4
20:50<zifnab>(it doesn't do that much, because the traffic still gets there if either goes down, but the latency normally jumps)
20:50<Peng>Ah, my mistake.
20:50<Peng>15 years from now there's only going to be one Tier 1 ISP, Zayo*
20:51<James_T>Telstra Global has a craptonne of fibre, too
20:51<zifnab>Peng: they've bought everyone i liked
20:51<Peng>and also AtlantaNAP!
20:51<zifnab>and i'm wrong, not do, ramnode
20:51<zifnab>i have too much shit everywhere
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20:52<gparent>they even bought the local newspaper guy
20:52<gparent>I loved that newspaper!
20:52<zifnab>well they bought 360 networks
20:52<zifnab>who used to be ran out of hte town i'm in
20:52<zifnab>that was a pretty big hit, they pulled their datacenter out
20:53<zifnab>went form 'this is our head end' to 'this is a shitty place things just move through'
20:53<zifnab>(talking ~0.01ms ping to 80ms ping to gateway)
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20:53<James_T>wonder if linode is going to do more of its own BGP
20:56<zifnab>please ask if that means you can move ips between datacenters
20:56<zifnab>(because the answer there is 'only if linode starts doing their own transit between datacenters')
20:57<HoopyCat>because people are clamoring to have their traffic tromboned through the datacenter they are, for some reason, migrating away from
20:58<zifnab>HoopyCat: wouldn't really work that way
20:58<zifnab>picking on OVH, they own the transit between their datacenters
20:58<zifnab>and a ton of other shit in the US
20:58<zifnab>i can move na IP from france to montreal if i wanted
20:59<zifnab>their whole network still advertises that IP block, i still jump on their network in seattle
20:59<zifnab>just internal magic makes it show up in motnreal instead of france
21:00<zifnab>they've replicated the internet, i know
21:00<akerl>That's not exactly how it works
21:00<Peng>zifnab: It only works like that because they have a good network and/or you're lucky.
21:01<zifnab>probably a little of both
21:01<zifnab>i mean, its assumign they're announcing the same set of IPs to every provider
21:02<Peng>Incidentally: Traceroute from Atlanta to Dallas: Atlanta -> DC -> Atlanta -> Dallas, thanks to SoftLayer's lovely peering.
21:04<zifnab>i wish charter would update their stupid reverse dns
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21:04<zifnab>according to a traceroute from here, all my traffic goes through polson
21:04<zifnab>which is pretty much the middle of nowhere
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21:05<Peng>(IPv6 traceroute Atlanta -> Dallas is good, though. Down with legacy IP!)
21:05<James_T>my uni's ip space has entry points through both campuses...
21:05<James_T>(they have transit between them)
21:05<Peng>Wait, I spoke too soon. IPv6 is equally dumb now.
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21:08<gparent>Looks like they fixed the path that was incorrect showing a non-standard level of degradation
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21:13<James_T>Peng: how is ipv6 "dumb"
21:13*pronto flings bananna at James_T
21:17<gthutch>If my main domain is already setup, then do I want to "insert a few records to get me started" or no?
21:18<gthutch>I don't want this domain to point to the same directory as my main domain
21:19<zifnab>erm, if you're creating a new thingy in the dns manager
21:19<gthutch>Yes exactly
21:19<zifnab>a) you ahve to point your registrar's nameserver thing at linode
21:19<Peng>James_T: The route happens to be dumb.
21:19<gthutch>Ya I added ns1-ns5 at GoDaddy
21:19<zifnab>b) that adds a few aaaa/a/mx records into the linode dns
21:19<zifnab>you can remove them later
21:20<zifnab>iirc it adds domain.tld, www.domain.tld as a/aaaa pointing at your server
21:20<gthutch>Through the DNS manager I can specify a folder for the domain
21:20<@caker>folders are a webserver duty - so, no :)
21:20<zifnab>do you mean subdomain?
21:20<zifnab>like server.example.tld?
21:20<gthutch>no just /usr/folder
21:20<pronto>.tld should be tld
21:21<gthutch>i have setup right
21:21<gthutch>i just want to be setup
21:21<gthutch>in a second folder
21:21<zifnab>that happens on the webserver itself
21:21<zifnab>specifically, a virtualhost
21:21<zifnab>well fuck you too linbot
21:22<zifnab>specifically, if its ubuntu, and if its apache2, /etc/apache2/sites-availabile/example.tld.conf
21:22<zifnab>the 'ServerName' directive figures out which one to use based on the domain name used
21:22<zifnab>nothing really to do with dns - all you have to do there is point a/aaaa records at your server
21:23<gthutch>Ubuntu and nginx
21:23<gthutch>but same dif i guess
21:24<zifnab>yeah more or less
21:25<gthutch>so it should be just editing the nginx config file?
21:25<gthutch>sorry man this is my first time going unmanaged lol
21:25<zifnab>all good
21:25<gthutch>i really appreciate the help
21:25<gthutch>i have one dedi server with reliablesite but me and a friend run it and he set it all up lol
21:25<gthutch>and it runs centos
21:25<gthutch>vs unbuntu here
21:25<zifnab>totally worth learning
21:25<zifnab>i keep meaning to learn centos7, i can't get past not having chkconfig
21:26<zifnab>i feel naked, i have no idea what i'm doing with systemd
21:28<gthutch>thats how i feel with this tutorial lol
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21:29<SlosHeD>i will never understand why some people feel the need to spam my email with junk
21:30<SlosHeD>theres nothing to even buy....
21:30-!-Dedalo [] has joined #linode
21:30<SlosHeD>its just garbled nonsense
21:30-!-Dedalo [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
21:30<virtual>to break bayesian filters.
21:30<virtual>or 'attempt to' rather.
21:30-!-Dedalo [] has joined #linode
21:30<SlosHeD>i dont get forums arent even advertised yet
21:31-!-Dedalo [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:31<virtual>oh, on forums. Dunno. Perhaps same thing though.
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21:32<Ikaros>That's the internet for you.
21:32<Ikaros>You're always a target nowdays. Even if random.
21:35<SlosHeD>People that do that stuff need cancer of the nuts.
21:35<gthutch>So I'm really new at this and never actually created a public_html folder in the beginning right
21:35<gthutch>Is it fine just to have my sites like
21:35<James_T>i do /var/www/$DOMAIN/public_html
21:36<SlosHeD>i thought the pages lived in /var/www/
21:36<gthutch>See I avoided that /var/ all together
21:36<gthutch>I'm using /home/site1
21:36<gthutch>Then /home/site2
21:36<gthutch>Is that really bad?
21:36<James_T>not a problem if those are sep user accounts
21:36<gthutch>Only separate sites really
21:37<gthutch>Trying to figure out users and privileges and stuff
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21:38<gthutch>I can still change it all
21:38<gthutch>Cause I'm going to prob have 4-5 sites on this one VPS
21:39<gthutch>Not really anyone else using it
21:39<James_T>/var/www or /src/www is the standard place to put sites
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21:40<@caker>you've been srved
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21:41<James_T>caker: i assume pacnet has good transit options for you
21:41<Peng>caker: vary funny
21:42<James_T>linonde is growing up! managing its own BGP!
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21:43<gthutch>My /srv/ folder is currently empty
21:43<gthutch>Is that normal?
21:43<gthutch>No folders or anything on default install
21:43<tonyyarusso>gthutch: Yes.
21:44<Peng>You're not srving anything yet.
21:44<Peng>So it's normal.
21:44<gthutch>Dang I just got served
21:44<tonyyarusso>gthutch: /srv and /var/www are usually used for roughly the same stuff, so most people use only one or the other, not both.
21:45<tonyyarusso>but if you're using /home/$user/public_html, then you won't use either.
21:46<James_T>so, there is an unlimited isp in australia with 100 customers
21:46<gthutch>nah i think i got it tho
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21:48<@caker>James_T: so, basically, all of Australia, then?
21:48<James_T>caker: yup
21:48<James_T>get some telstra peering ;)
21:49<@caker>you're like a broken record :)
21:50<James_T>kind of annoying that no isp's can compete with telstra on their wholesale network
21:50<ajmitch_>James_T: funny, quite a few ISPs in NZ have unlimited plans now
21:50<Peng>kind of annoying that most of Earth is Internet Hell.
21:50<James_T>ajmitch_: none on T-Wholesale
21:51<James_T>ajmitch_: NBN has ulim plans :( no NBN here till at least 2019
21:51<James_T>Peng: yes indeed ;)
21:51<ajmitch_>James_T: I guess I won't mention that we just got 1Gbps fibre plans last week (still unlimited)
21:52<ajmitch_>now if we can convince caker to get some space in a datacentre in australia or NZ...
21:52<gthutch>how do aussies feel about kim dotcom
21:52<gthutch>or whomever
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21:53<virtual>caker: If you visit Australia, we'll promise the wildlife won't actually kill you immediately.
21:53<gthutch>and also how do aussies feel about iggy azalea
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21:53<gthutch>now ive got all my australian questions in the open
21:53<gthutch>virtual i just saw a video on worldstar of two kangaroos fighting outside a guys front door in australia LOL
21:54<virtual>You know, I've still (in my 10 months here) only seen a live kangaroo once. And that was almost road kill.
21:54<gthutch>here it is
21:54<gthutch>friggin hilarious
21:55<gthutch>i'd be scared to death of one of those things
21:55<gthutch>and i wouldnt be able to carry my gun to protect myself from kangaroos?
21:56<virtual>I'm sure we could make an exception if you felt like you wanted a gun to protect yourself from kangaroos. Who knows, I might use that excuse too, and the rest of the population. :P
21:56<virtual>"oops, I thought it was a kangaroo" :)
21:57<gparent>but then the kangaroos would eventually be armed. do you really want to watch that video with the kangaroo on the left pulling out a glock and capping the other one in the head?
21:57<HoopyCat>U WOT M8
21:58<zifnab>virtual: you should go kickbox one, i hear they're quite fragile
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21:59<virtual>gparent: LOL
21:59<James_T>roos can kill uuuuuuuuuu
22:00<James_T>tourists have been kicked to death by roo's
22:00<HoopyCat>annnd rooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooos can always kill yoooooooooouooooooooooooooooouoooooooooooooooooooo
22:00<HoopyCat>... sorry, got whitney houston songs stuck in my head tonight
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---Logopened Mon Mar 02 22:01:09 2015
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22:01<zifnab>wonder if that was due to linode maintenance
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22:02<ajmitch_>I should probably migrate my linode & get the upgrade
22:02<James_T>zifnab: afaik lots of splits have been because of that?
22:02<virtual>I am still sad that Nintendo didn't call the console after the Wii, the 'Puu'.
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22:02<James_T>ajmitch_: as long as you don't have a migration queued soon
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22:02<James_T>$1 letters!
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22:03<ajmitch_>host reboot scheduled for sunday, I'm still on an older host without SSDs
22:03<ajmitch_>it's only been almost a year since they were available
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22:04<virtual>ajmitch_: lol
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22:07<HoopyCat>when a linode host with an OFTC server reboots:
22:10<nate>the big dude holding his soda with the "shit wait whoa hey wat dude cmon stahp not involved" expression going on, lol'd
22:12<virtual>heh, that was one weird litle video.
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22:13<MJCS>HoopyCat: that about sums it up
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22:18<gthutch>Using FileZilla, I tried to create a folder in the /srv/ directory, permission denied
22:18<trippeh>slow days at work so I figured I'd clean up a application I wrote 10 years ago.. so far down to 1% memory usage, much faster and way more robust. whoops
22:20<zifnab>anyone know what package it is in ubuntu that suggests packages to install if you type an invalid command?
22:20<trippeh>zifnab: command-not-found
22:20<zifnab>trippeh: thanks
22:20<gthutch>was happening earlier w/ me w/ gedit
22:20<zifnab>doing a minimal install, its driving me crazy not having it
22:21<gthutch>ended up using nano instead lol
22:21<zifnab>gthutch: do it in ssh, use sudo
22:21<zifnab>probably don't have permissions to create things in /srv
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22:22<gthutch>so how many people here actually use a control panel of some sort? (cpanel, zpanel, plesk, etc)
22:22<gthutch>im guessing prob none
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22:22<James_T>XSAmageddon has been taxing linodes mail servers... nice
22:22<trippeh>this program is doing 90% of the b2b here (multi-national big corp), now it could probably run just fine from a raspi 1.0
22:22<virtual>gthutch: at the same time, if you don't know unix permissions, be a good idea todo a short tutorial on them.
22:22<trippeh>oh well
22:23<virtual>If you do know, then I apologise for telling you something you already know, gthutch!
22:31<gthutch>lol just consider me as knowing nothing
22:31<gthutch>cause im close enough to it that it doesnt matter
22:31<gthutch>sorry for delayed response at work
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22:33<Nathanaekl>Any minecraft players here that can help test a craftbukkit server for 5 minutes?
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22:33<sqpat>i used cpanel long ago
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22:41<zifnab>gthutch: i'm using zpanel's new thingy at work
22:41<zifnab>becaues i'm lazy and my coworkers are stupid
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22:48<gthutch>how do you like zpanel
22:48<gthutch>can you add mysql databases and such from it
22:48<gthutch>domains, etc?
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23:32<zifnab>ipv6 is a pain in the ass
23:33<Ikaros>When is it NOT?
23:35<James_T>you don't own one of those
23:38<zifnab>really its just ovh's shitty implementation of IPs
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23:43<James_T>they don't do slaac
23:43<James_T>is all
23:43<zifnab>James_T: those fucking routes
23:44<James_T>fe80:: is slaac magic
23:44<zifnab>i do get things over slaac
23:44<zifnab>specifically the /56 my /64 is in
23:45<zifnab>or raad
23:45<zifnab>not sure which
23:45<James_T>why are you using the long form of ip -6 route add
23:47<zifnab>i copied it from their example
23:48<James_T> i somehow doubt this will -ever- be fixed
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23:52<zifnab>should have used hat
23:52<James_T>i had that on
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23:52<James_T>will add back
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23:55<zifnab>i forgot i had that
23:56<zifnab>its busybox for arm, but good in some cases ('how do i root my $PHONE')
---Logclosed Tue Mar 03 00:00:37 2015