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#linode IRC Logs for 2018-09-12

---Logopened Wed Sep 12 00:00:46 2018
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02:59<Peng>Hurricane Florence is going to rain lightly on Atlanta, eh? I hope the power stays up.
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04:40<Hactor>Hey Hi Guys
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07:47<dzho>any UX practitioner can tell you 5 minutes is an unacceptable wait
07:55<ponas>It may take up to two hours before your new password works in all our systems.
07:56<ponas>^-- real message at $dayjob
07:56<grawity>"@hourly /etc/"
07:58<ericoc>love the .sh randomly tossed in to /etc/
07:58<grawity>I mean, it's literally the purpose of /etc
07:58<ericoc>what about /usr/local/bin/ tho
07:58<grawity>I actually put shellscripts there because I get etckeeper tracking for free
07:58<ericoc>orrr if you wanna be really out there, /opt/
07:59<ponas>hey, /opt is great
08:00<ericoc>splunk is one of the only things i know that uses /opt
08:00<ericoc>and this enterprisey backup software called commvault
08:01<ponas>we use python + winrm to run powershell commands on an AD DC, where the powershell command contains a base64 coded encrypted GPG message containing the plaintext password
08:02<ponas>if the password change is successful, we toss the message
08:02<dzho>ah, /opt, the N+1 standard of filesystem hierarchies
08:02<ponas>it's really hard to do this right(tm) unless you use AD as one true password store
08:02<grawity>ponas: opposed to just changing the damn thing via LDAP?
08:03<ponas>pretty much
08:03<dwfreed>I mean, you could still change the password via LDAP and not use AD as the source of truth
08:03<dwfreed>instead of flinging powershell commands across a network
08:03<ponas>I wish we could just make some hashes and give that to AD
08:03<grawity>yeah, but changing an AD password via ldap seems several orders of magnitude simpler than winrm|powershell|gpg
08:04<grawity>so I really don't get why one would choose the latter
08:04<ponas>we use the winrm + powershell foo for syncing users and groups as well
08:04<ponas>works pretty great, it's the password part that sucks
08:04<dwfreed>which can also be created via ldap
08:05<grawity>all of my "import this year's students to AD" etc. scripts are just Perl with Net::LDAP
08:05<dwfreed>eww perl
08:05<grawity>the password change website is PHP with a few calls to the LDAP module
08:05<dwfreed>ewww php
08:05<grawity>dwfreed: I get the list of students from a MS Access database.
08:06<grawity>Things You Didn't Want To Know
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10:32<ubuntuuser>hello, has anyone here has the problem of ssh sessions being unresponsive to any keyboard input? when i connect to one of my servers, it just logs in and after a second it's completely unresponsive then. I only can close session by closing my own shell.
10:32<grawity>do you have the same problem over both IPv4 and IPv6?
10:32<ubuntuuser>grawity: yes
10:33<ubuntuuser>and it's only one server, the others work just fine
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10:39<grawity>try logging in to the server's console via Lish, see if e.g. `netstat -tn` shows any connections stuck with a high SendQ, or maybe whether `tcpdump -n -i eth0 "port 22"` shows packets still arriving
10:39<grawity>¯\_(ツ)_/¯ not many ideas
10:47<ubuntuuser>grawity: even lish is extremely slow
10:47<ubuntuuser>like one key press takes about 30 seconds to go through
10:49<grawity>do you mean just the server's console, or including the lish commands themselves?
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10:49<ubuntuuser>after logging into the server on lish
10:49<grawity>if it's just after you attach to the console, check whether the CPU isn't overloaded for example
10:49<ubuntuuser>when i type one key, it takes forever to show up
10:50<ubuntuuser>grawity: it says 2% cpu usage
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10:53<ubuntuuser>i restarted server
10:53<ubuntuuser>now even when i try to log in from lish, it takes a very long time to allow me to input any keys
10:56<ubuntuuser>how can i remove network-manager
10:56<ubuntuuser>aparently that's the cause
10:57<grawity>how did you figure that out
10:57<smallclone>ubuntuuser: why do you think that's the cause
10:57<smallclone>i hate networkmanager more than like, anyone, but that sounds a little far fetched for what you're describing
10:59<smallclone>pretty sure ubuntu doesn't even install networkmanager by default
10:59<smallclone>it's very unlikely that what you're experiencing is due to that, but you could always look at your interfaces file if you want to be sure
10:59<grawity>ubuntuuser: can you check whether your network configuration matches the problem description?
11:00<grawity>that is, what actual IP address, netmask, bcast do you see configured in `ip addr`?
11:01<grawity>it's a 5-year-old description, so I would usually assume such a bug has been fixed by now
11:26<ubuntuuser>grawity: ok i changed a few things, i isolated the problem to putting sessions
11:27<ubuntuuser>on my linux machines, it works fine, and i am able to ssh from another server to this server using putty too, so i guess there's an issue with putty here?
11:27<smallclone>the answer is almost always yes
11:27<grawity>or with Windows, or with the computer in general
11:28<grawity>which PuTTY version are you using, does PuTTY on your Linux machines have the same problem?
11:28<grawity>actually, since you said the *console* via Lish is also slow
11:29<grawity>does the same happen if you connect to Lish via web?
11:29<ubuntuuser>grawity: putty 0.66, lish has the issue of lag
11:34<ubuntuuser>grawity: yes, putty has the same issue on another machine
11:35<ubuntuuser>grawity: after logging in, a few seconds in, it freezes
11:35<linbot>New news from blog: Linode & Limelight Networks <>
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11:44<ubuntuuser>grawity: i changed network to dhcp on the server, still no change
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11:47<ubuntuuser>grawity: i have a huge send-q on the putty connections
11:48<ubuntuuser>200, and 54
11:49<ubuntuuser>actually nvm, that's not an issue
11:56<dwfreed>sendq is in bytes
11:56<dwfreed>and it's normal for it to be non-zero when running netstat over ssh
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12:02<grawity>ubuntuuser: 0.66? that's fairly old
12:02<ubuntuuser>dwfreed: yes, that's what i realized too, there's something peculiar here
12:02<grawity>I wonder if it depends on something like what ciphers it negotiates
12:02<grawity>or in general on bugfixes that your version is missing
12:02<ubuntuuser>grawity: i don't think so
12:03<ubuntuuser>cause i have no problem on other servers with it
12:03<grawity>why not? have you tried 0.70 or 0.71nightly to confirm?
12:03<ubuntuuser>and this server has the issue of lag
12:03<grawity>if you think the problem is the client, test the client
12:03<grawity>though, this is unrelated, but it somewhat reminds me of last week's OpenSSH 7.8 issue
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12:07<grawity>(it finally got around to replacing its massively outdated TOS values with DSCP markings (which, note, is 16 years old and used by many applications)... and it turns out VMware Workstation has bugs in its DSCP handling. Of course, literally everybody blames OpenSSH for being buggy instead.)
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12:34<ubuntuuser>bbl, this problem isn't getting fixed, i need to get back to work
12:34<ubuntuuser>thanks for the help grawity
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12:56<GeorgeJetson>I'm trying to enter an SPF record and the Record Name given to me was "" with a period .... however when I enter "" with the period I am told invalid name. When I remove the period, there is nothing in the Name field for the SPF TXT record I create in the DNS manager.
12:57<relidy>If your domain is "", then that is the correct behavior.
12:59<GeorgeJetson>relidy: you mean that I should enter it as "" (without a period at the end)?
12:59<GeorgeJetson>and that "" with a period is invalid and the people who told me to do so should be informed that it is incorrect?
13:00<relidy>The Linode UI doesn't need the period at the end. If you're actually managing a zone file by hand, that'd be more important. In this case, the "host" field is used for "subdomains" under your domain, so it should be empty if you're setting up an SPF record for the root domain.
13:02<GeorgeJetson>I see. Thanks
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14:01<grawity>GeorgeJetson: in other words, this depends on where you're editing the zone
14:01<grawity>in plain-text zonefiles, trailing dot tells the DNS server to *not* append the zone's own name (so that you don't accidentally end up with
14:03<grawity>(to refer to the zone root, you'd use "" with the dot, or just "@" which specifically means 'the zone root')
14:03<grawity>but in web-based control panels, it varies
14:03<grawity>sometimes there's a "subdomain" field that you have to leave completely empty
14:04<relidy>"subdomain", "host", "name" ... it's horribly inconsistent.
14:05<LouWestin>grawity: Is this an issue in Linode’s webpanel?
14:05<grawity>since SPF records are *usually* for the zone root – I just checked Linode's DNS manager, and you can just leave it empty
14:05<LouWestin>Ok thanks.
14:06<grawity>or as GeorgeJetson found out, it autodetects when you're entering the zone root / bare domain name, and autocorrects it
14:08<LouWestin>^this is why I hang out here.
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16:07<Peng>did Limelight and Linode partner because it's alliterative?
16:07<ausjke>if i do 'ping' the ping output shows '', checked has no CNAME, why shows up in ping?
16:07<ausjke>must be some wrong configuration i assume?
16:07<Peng>It's the reverse DNS for the IP address
16:08<ausjke>Peng: that's right, but why ping outputs the reverse DNS instead of using the "forward" dns name
16:08<ausjke>in this case, use ''
16:09<Peng>I don't know. ping was probably designed that way before I was born.
16:09<ausjke>or maybe the reverse ip setting should be the true website instead, so it's not well configured? or linode does the reverse dns using its own hostname by default?
16:10<Peng>Linode sets it to that by default. You can change the PTRs for your IP addresses in the "Reverse DNS" part of the "Remote Access" part of the manager.
16:10<Peng>It's not wrong, it's just the default setting.
16:10<ausjke>my own linode hosts do not show this, so i must have modified the reverse thing
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16:12<ausjke>to verify i logged into linode, but under dns manager, there is no placeholder for ptr
16:15<jaskal>@ausjke: it's not under the DNS manager, it's under the "Remote Access' tab of each individual linode.
16:15<ausjke>and i could not set up a cname either, hostname: ftp, aliases to:, then ping '' never worked...either i'm too dumb, or the dns manager is not intuitive
16:16<ausjke>however if i do:, alias:, it works, i have to use a different domain for cname?
16:16<ausjke>DO's cname can be set up easily, i must be missing something
16:16<ausjke>jaskal: thanks, forgot that, still, wish dns-manager has a help page or something to remind that
16:17<jaskal>To be fair, it is documented:
16:18<ausjke>jaskal: somethings just could not find that page, it will be nice to add a help tips into the UI itself, many UI does this these days
16:18<jaskal>As for the DNS manager, I've used both Linode's and DO's and found them both to be equally intuitive. It's worth nothing that DNS entries are applied only once ever 15 minutes - this is stated at the bottom of the DNS manager. Perhaps you've not waited long enough for the change to apply and propagate?
16:18<ausjke>jaskal: waited 3 days actually, no fish
16:19<jaskal>That being said, without visibility of what you're doing it's hard to provide any support here. If you're certain you've made the correct changes and those changes aren't reflecting in DNS, perhaps a support ticket?
16:20<ausjke>you're right, filing a ticket now, thanks
16:20<ausjke>i host multiple domains on the same IP, so it's better to do the default reverse IP i assume
16:21<ausjke>otherwise ping will show in the output, which is even more confusing
16:21<ausjke>i will let them all show instead
16:21<jaskal>Personally I set the rDNS to be the hostname of the server, in all instances. Multiple hostnames can still resolve to the server for application specific stuff.
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16:42<ausjke>got another free upgrade from linode, nice, when was this started? my linode 4G is now 80GB HDD
16:42<ausjke>moving all DO to linode today or tomorrow
16:43<millisa>May I think was the last set?
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16:46<millisa>This is new -
16:48<millisa>am not sure how to make the greenbox go away
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16:50<dwfreed>millisa: does it go away if you set it to automatic?
16:50<millisa>need to find an account that i can do that on. i have at least one that has backups on for everything
16:50<dwfreed>with the follow-on that does it come back if you set it back to manual?
16:51<dwfreed>the account I have full control over doesn't have any Linodes
16:51<millisa>does go away by setting to auto
16:51<millisa>and does come back if its set to manual.
16:52<dwfreed>somebody's probably already complained
16:52<millisa>i can be that jerk
16:52<millisa>i have the abilities
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16:52<dwfreed>mcintosh: it's all your fault
16:58<csnxs>all hail the green box
16:59<ausjke>ok after tue upgrade 'df -h' still shows 48G instead of 80G, checked 'block device assignment' and 'resize', neither has option to grab the extra disk space
16:59<Peng>ausjke: Edit the disk in the manager.
17:00<Peng>ausjke: Upgrading or resizing your plan doesn't automatically do anything to your disk images.
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17:00<csnxs>manage the disk in the editor
17:00<Peng>manage the editor in the disk
17:02<ubuntuuser>hey guys, ubuntu 18.04 doesn't allow worskpaces in wall format, is there a way to get it? can i maybe install a different desktop environment that allows this?
17:05<ausjke>Peng: millisa: thanks, will google for linode doc next time, did not do this for quite a while
17:29<@mcintosh>dwfreed: definitely my fault
17:29<Unit193>We know.
17:29<@mcintosh>millisa: the green box only goes away for people that select automatic, at the moment... can look into making that less annoying
17:30<@mcintosh>!boo Unit193
17:30<linbot>mcintosh: Point taken from unit193! (-1)
17:31<smallclone>ubuntuuser: what are you trying to accomplish that involves using a GUI on a Linode? in general it's not such a fun experience
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17:32<ubuntuuser>smallclone: not on linode, i'm developing on a local machine, using linode as git repo
17:32<smallclone>ah ok
17:32<smallclone>what is "wall format"?
17:36<ubuntuuser>smallclone: desktop grid, i like using a 3 x 3 grid or 4 x 4 when doing web dev, so i can put windows maximized on each workspace and quickly switch workspaces and move things around, the main benefit is that i use less mouse / track pad, and I get to see things at all times easily, the key difference between grid and the linear workspace switcher is that it allows for quicker switches, as you can put the dev window in the middle, and
17:37<smallclone>oh so you mean the way the workspace switcher looks?
17:37<ubuntuuser>smallclone: and behaves
17:38<smallclone>iirc there's a tweak-tool package that allows you to make more changes to ubuntu's desktop
17:38<ubuntuuser>smallclone: with grid / wall format you can press ctrl + alt and different arrow keys and traverse left right, up down quickly
17:38<smallclone>which is weird because now the desktop is gnome3 basically but i believe the tool still exists
17:38<kenyon>ubuntuuser: what you want is called a tiling window manager. for example, xmonad (which is what I use on my main workstation)
17:38<smallclone>yeah i mean you're basically emulating tiling functionality anyway
17:39<ubuntuuser>kenyon: smallclone: ubuntu 16.04 used to have this tweak installable
17:40<ubuntuuser>kenyon: smallclone: ubuntu 18.04 doesn't have any such packages
17:41<ubuntuuser>it's talking about chrome-gnome-shell which only allows for 2 x 2 and that's finnicky as well
17:41<relidy>XFCE for life
17:41<ubuntuuser>i will look into xmonad
17:42<ubuntuuser>relidy: i don't personally like the look of xfce
17:42<smallclone>you could always just install unity if that's what you're used to, though it's no longer maintained
17:44<smallclone>i use cinnamon on a work machine and it's pretty nice, though i'm not at all opinionated about windows as long as i can alt-tab through them
17:44<csnxs>god i hate gnome
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17:46<ubuntuuser>csnxs: i liked unity, but as it's no longer maintained, i don't wanna stick to it, and keep having to spend long bug fix times
17:47<ubuntuuser>csnxs: i'm looking for a solution, i'm open to suggestions for good alternatives
17:47<csnxs>yeah i actually liked unity too, i had a setup i quite liked
17:47<relidy>I use XFCE at the office, but I've gravitated toward tiling window managers (i3wm) on my personal machines these days.
17:48<ubuntuuser>i'm looking at xmonad
17:48<ubuntuuser>it's all in one window right
17:48<ubuntuuser>not multiple desktops
17:49<csnxs>i used to use i3 a while back but interestingly i found I liked it more on a laptop than a desktop
17:50<relidy>csnxs: I agree on that front.
17:51<ubuntuuser>i'm going to give xmonad a try
17:51<ubuntuuser>thanks for the suggestion kenyon
18:10<@mcintosh>millisa: okay, you can hide it by clicking the "X" that now appears in the top right corner of the banner
18:10<relidy>!point mcintosh
18:10<linbot>relidy: Point given to mcintosh. (67)
18:10<csnxs>I will keep the green box forever
18:11<@mcintosh>!point csnxs
18:11<linbot>mcintosh: Point given to csnxs. (10)
18:12<csnxs>!point mcintosh
18:12<linbot>csnxs: Point given to mcintosh. (68) (Biggest fan: csnxs, total: 26)
18:12<csnxs>one more til 69!!!
18:16<@mcintosh>( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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20:18<tafa2>are there issues with London?
20:18<tafa2>Glish, Lish
20:18<tafa2>Nothing responding
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20:21<Cromulent>tafa2: All my websites are down in London on 3 different Linodes
20:21<tafa2>Mine *just* came back up
20:21<Cromulent>correction 2 linodes
20:22<Cromulent>hmm mine are still down
20:22<Cromulent>oh wait - back up now
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20:27<Cromulent>tafa2: how long were your sites down for?
20:27<Cromulent>I'm worried I didn't notice for a long time
20:27<tafa2>I was working on them
20:27<tafa2>that's why I noticed
20:28<Cromulent>ah OK - phew I thought it might have been longer than that
20:31<tafa2>Cromulent you not running any server monitoring?
20:32<Cromulent>yeah should have looked at that
20:32<tafa2>What're you using?
20:32<Cromulent>the free pingdom plan
20:33<tafa2>Check this out
20:33<tafa2>For a free plan you get a lot more than Pingdom
20:33<Cromulent>oh that looks nice - SMS alerts
20:35<MrPPS>I'm using them also
20:40<Cromulent>awesome - that was quick and easy to set up
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20:52<ubuntuuser>ok so i tried xmonad and it's definitely not for me. it's too experimental and a lot of things keep changing too fast, and there's a whole lot of settings that you need to do before you even get a terminal
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21:02<MrPPS>yeah, I tried it as well, but ended up settling on i3 for my tastes
21:03<ubuntuuser>MrPPS: i'm trying mate right now
21:03<ubuntuuser>i want something close to unity, that allows workspace grids
21:12<MrPPS>assuming workspace grids = multiple workspaces, i3 does have that ubuntuuser
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21:20<Unit193>That's not exactly close to Unity though.
21:27<MrPPS>no, but I figured if they forayed into xmonad, "identical to unity" is maybe not quite what they're after :P
21:27<MrPPS>I was basing a desire for tiling wm's on that, but just observing that the workspace feature they mentioned is still a thing in i3
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22:03<millisa>@mcintosh gracias!
22:23<ubuntuuser>ok i've decided on mate as unity replacement for ubuntu 18.04
22:24<ubuntuuser>it has everything unity had for me, and i can easily have a workspace grid
22:25<ubuntuuser>MrPPS: yes, I wanted the wall feature to work and unfortunately gnome3 doesn't have that
22:25<MrPPS>great, glad you've found something you like :)
22:27<ubuntuuser>now just need to autostart cairo-dock and my work environemt is set
22:27<ubuntuuser>ty MrPPS
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---Logclosed Thu Sep 13 00:00:47 2018