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#mythtv IRC Logs for 2004-09-18

---Logopened Sat Sep 18 00:00:57 2004
00:13Beirdo Chutt: if you're there, someone just reported in -users that myth CVS is down
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00:45josephk__ still down
00:45josephk__ can't get to the website either
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00:46josephk__ so glad I decided to try cvs tonight
00:46josephk__ lol
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03:32Netslayer i'm in GDB, mythtv screwed up but i can't kill it with ctrl c :-/
03:44Netslayer i ctrl c'd it this time, but why won't this "(gdb) thread apply all bt full" give any output?
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04:19dopester yeah! the scanner is working great..
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06:41o_cee i just entered a new source since i moved and stuff like that.. changed both tuners into the new setup, but the old channels (didn't remove the old source) still shows up in the epg? shouldn't do that when the sources aren't attached, no?
06:46o_cee mikegrb: congratulations :)
06:50o_cee glad we don't have tornados here.
07:12o_cee guess i need to disable visibility on all the old channels.. don't see any reason for them appearing if the source isn't used though
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09:01--- User: *** gfiend is now known as GeckoFiend
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09:26o_cee GeckoFiend: are you familiar with the epg, different sources and stuff like that?
09:27o_cee maybe better to email bruce about it
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09:46GeckoFiend o_cee I've not really looked at the code. I use two sources spread across 3 inputs on mine.
09:47thor_ mikegrb, welcome to the club
09:47GeckoFiend I don't think the EPG does *any* validation of the inputs vs channels. If it's in the channel databse it shows up regardless of antyying else.
09:47GeckoFiend err anything
09:49GeckoFiend chutt: If/when you see this. Did you ever figure out how to get a mobile CPU working properly on that 7NIF2? I can't seem to get mine up to it's full 2ghz since I had to replace the MB. It's stuck at 1.4 or somethign silly like that.
09:49thor_ I think he's running slightly underclocked, but on purpose
09:50GeckoFiend though if it continues to run stable at that sped, and it can keep up with TV, DVDs and Goom I may just leave it there for the reduced heat factor.
09:50GeckoFiend thor_ heh
09:50thor_ hi
09:50thor_ err, heh
09:50* thor_ is still drinking first coffee
09:51GeckoFiend Motherboard fried on my main FE/MBE box last night 1/2hour before my recordings were supposed to start. I got the board replaced and the system up and running with 5 minutes to spare before a later showing.
09:52GeckoFiend it was just sheer dumb luck that I ahppened to have a 7NIF2 on a shelf.
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10:14dopester yawn..
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11:03Earlie Can I use mythtv with a pvr-usb2?
11:14kvandivo nope. penal code 328.43b prohibits that
11:15thor_ oh, and .. it just cannot be justified under any sort of moral imperitive, even assuming a Hegelian interpretation of Descartes
11:22rkulagow earlie: i don't believe the usb2 driver is completed yet.
11:29thor_ bah, must be a british empiricist
11:31dopester morning thor
11:31thor_ heh
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11:33woodrag hello again!
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11:33woodrag The source for the dutch television program is very unstable... Is there any other way the retrieve this information?
11:35woodrag When i run mythfilldatabase is keeps on giving errors about the site...
11:42* Beirdo points at the topic
11:44Earlie I think I might like to work on the usb2 driver
11:44Earlie Are the drivers implemented in such a way that it is straight forward to add a new one?
11:46rkulagow no idea.
11:46Earlie Funny.. I just bought it because I assumed it would be more flexible to move between machines.
11:47Earlie Then a coworker told me he bought the plextor --> divx external encoder with tuner
11:47thor_ Earlie, video drivers are (at least for the most part) a kernel thing, not a myth thing
11:47Earlie Now I know that one has no chance of being supported.. it is way too new
11:48Earlie The tv cards are not really a video driver think ... unless you are talking about the pvr-350
11:57kvandivo thor's comment still applied, though.. myth doesn't deal with the encoders/tuners/video/whatever you want to call it. If a pvr-usb2 driver existed for linux that made it talk v4l or something standard, myth could probably support it with minimal changes
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12:29myth_hangs hey bierdo
12:29myth_hangs <<ivtv_bug
12:30myth_hangs ive muatated
12:30myth_hangs mutated
12:30myth_hangs does anyone one know why myth hangs afetr playing for a while?
12:37myth_hangs thanks thor but it playes for a while...
12:37myth_hangs then live tv hangs
12:37myth_hangs only last night it rebooted once
12:37myth_hangs other than that hasnt crashed
12:37myth_hangs only freezes
12:43GeckoFiend does anyone know whay peopel can't read topics? ;)
12:43* Beirdo chuckles
12:43GeckoFiend err why people
12:52thor_ myth_hangs, and I quote, "Without details, the developers will not be able to determine..."
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13:14thor_ ssh: connect to host port 22: No route to host
13:14thor_ bah
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13:22josephk__ I just noticed...of course I always forget to get mythmusic
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13:45Baylink Is someone banging on the 'log messages' drum? ISTR Kevin might be working on that?
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14:05captbunzo Chutt: you here?
14:06captbunzo any of the core mythtv developers here?
14:06thor_ define core?
14:07captbunzo anyone who know well how the backend server works.
14:07captbunzo I am contemplating a web application that I'd like to code on the front of mythtv.
14:07josephk__ define "works"
14:07thor_ heh
14:07captbunzo perhaps an extension of mythweb.
14:07thor_ and zee question is ....
14:07captbunzo and I am curious whether or not that backend can do something specifically...
14:08captbunzo zee question is....
14:08captbunzo does the backend require a constant connection to the frontend application connecting to it.
14:08thor_ ah, persistence
14:08captbunzo or can the frontend disconnect, with the backend saving state.
14:08captbunzo ah, exactamundo!
14:09captbunzo do you know the answer?
14:09thor_ saving state of what?
14:09captbunzo stuff going on in the backend... :)
14:09captbunzo specifically, I'd like to write a web application that allows marking of cutpoints.
14:09thor_ backend definitely knows what's going on the backend (content, scheduling, and what not)
14:09captbunzo theoretically, it would work like this...
14:10captbunzo someone logs into my web app.
14:10captbunzo selects a video for cutlist marking.
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14:10captbunzo the backend opens up the video, just like in mythfrontend.
14:10captbunzo except instead of rendering the current frame to the tv/computer.
14:11captbunzo my little webapp requests (somehow) the current screen as an image.
14:11captbunzo and, in turn, that image is displayed to the web application.
14:11captbunzo the requirement of persistence is a thing of speed.
14:12thor_ you could (conceivably) add a method to the backend to request a jpeg of any time stamp in a given video
14:12captbunzo if the backend has to reopen the video file and reseek to the appropriate point in the video file for each frame, then the whole thing would be unusably slow.
14:12captbunzo well, that much is pretty much already there.
14:13captbunzo mythweb currently gets a png from the backend for the preview images on the recorded tv page.
14:13thor_ ok
14:13captbunzo currently, that is statically coded to "frame 64" or the preview frame setting in the db.
14:13captbunzo however.
14:14captbunzo using that technique alone would be unusable slow.
14:14captbunzo I need the backend to keep the video file open and "seeked" to the current frame.
14:14captbunzo then the seeking itself would be no slower then when doing this all from the frontend.
14:15captbunzo ignoring the whole network traffic bit and all.
14:16captbunzo hehe.
14:16captbunzo any thoughts?
14:16thor_ " I need the backend to keep the video file open and "seeked" to the current frame."
14:17thor_ if that's really what you need (?), then do so ...
14:17captbunzo well, the question is whether or not the backend can keep the video open even when the frontend (in this case my webapp) disconnects.
14:17thor_ but trying to "stream" frames to/from a static and non-persistent http port sounds more than a bit odd
14:18captbunzo in essence, does the backend support persistence.
14:18captbunzo I don't understand.
14:18captbunzo it'd only be requesting one frame at a time.
14:18captbunzo have you used the editting feature of mythtv?
14:18thor_ occassionaly
14:19captbunzo with it, you are only ever viewing one frame at a time.
14:19thor_ yup
14:19captbunzo so really, for each "load" of the webpage, it would make a connection back to the (hopefully persistent) backend and request the next frame
14:19captbunzo that frame could be 1/5/10/20(etc) seconds forward, back, etc.
14:19captbunzo just as in the frontend.
14:20captbunzo the mechanics of handing off the request is easy, etc.
14:20captbunzo it's the getting of the frames that is tough.
14:20captbunzo or, I should say getting the frames QUICKLY that is tough.
14:20thor_ so you want to stream (ie. provide a seekable data stream) from a non-persistent client
14:20thor_ which is odd
14:21captbunzo is that a bad thing?
14:22captbunzo I have a practical use for being able to do "editing" remotely.
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14:22thor_ why not run a remote frontend
14:22captbunzo mythbackend running in oklahoma behind a dsl connection.
14:23captbunzo mythfrontend running in virginia
14:23captbunzo is that doable?
14:23thor_ given bandwidth, sure
14:23captbunzo if so, then I am pleasantly astounded.
14:23captbunzo hehe.
14:23captbunzo given bandwidth, all things are possible?
14:23captbunzo read = dsl connection.
14:24captbunzo max outgoing speed ~ 30 kB/s
14:24josephk__ throw in some jelly beans
14:24captbunzo I couldn't watch video remotely.
14:24captbunzo but the bandwidth might work for editting.
14:25thor_ one way to find out
14:25* captbunzo eats a jelly bean...
14:25captbunzo sure, and I might try that.
14:25captbunzo one problem, though.
14:25captbunzo what if I wanted to mark a recording and didn't have access to a local box that had mythfrontend installed.
14:26captbunzo my web idea would be terribly useful.
14:26captbunzo I could walk into a public library, sit down, and mark my vide.
14:26captbunzo the complete story is that I work as a travelling computer consultant.
14:26captbunzo live in oklahoma.
14:26cmorgan wouldn't a simpler method be to use a java version of vnc?
14:26captbunzo but work away during the week.
14:26captbunzo hmmnn...
14:27cmorgan but the bandwith issues will make things difficult i'd imagine
14:27thor_ uhm, laptop?
14:27captbunzo just about to ask about that.
14:27captbunzo yep, laptop.
14:27captbunzo and it is my work laptop.
14:27thor_ knoppix CD?
14:27captbunzo now, while I do have vmware installed.
14:27captbunzo with debian inside of that.
14:27captbunzo hmmnnn...
14:27captbunzo knoppix.
14:27captbunzo hmmnn...
14:28captbunzo I'll give you that this remote frontend idea is a good one.
14:28captbunzo however, I would still love to try to find a way to practically do this editting thing via a webpage.
14:29captbunzo I think that it would be very useful to other.
14:29captbunzo others.
14:29captbunzo also, I could do it then without having to reboot my laptop. :)
14:29Beirdo yeah, for people who are at work and want to slack off
14:30thor_ I doubt the png rendering that's already there is not going to be significantly slower than any other way of converting .nuv streams to still frames
14:30thor_ err,
14:30captbunzo well, that's the first thing I am going to try.
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14:30captbunzo it just has to be modified to allow pnging of an arbitrary frame.
14:31thor_ right, but that sounds pretty trivial
14:31captbunzo I'm working on those mods, which Chutt said he would incorporate if someone submitted.
14:31captbunzo I sincerely hope that works.
14:31captbunzo and it WOULD be horrendously less complicated then trying some persistent backend connection crap.
14:32captbunzo any clue when Chutt will likely be around?
14:32captbunzo I had a question about my modification that I wanted to run by him.
14:33thor_ no idea
14:33Baylink Hey, Capt? Why not run your front end through VNC? it'd probably be Good Enough for what you need. and it requires no rewiring.
14:33captbunzo someone suggested that.
14:33cmorgan yeah
14:33captbunzo but this is more then just finding a solution for myself.
14:34captbunzo i'd also like to come up with something that could be used EASILY by other mythtv users.
14:34josephk__ right after cvs comes back chutt will appear
14:34Baylink True. *My* personal approach would be to run a frontend locally to me, and tunnel it's connection to the backend.
14:34captbunzo (hehe)
14:34Baylink Get The Glue Right, and Apply your energy in the right place.
14:34captbunzo ...and I would guess that anyone who wants to be able to mark cutpoints remotely will already have mythweb setup.
14:35captbunzo also, I'm doing it for the entertainment value.
14:35Baylink Ah.
14:35Baylink Ok, "for the hack value" is an acceptable motivation. :-)
14:36captbunzo two parts, I guess.
14:36captbunzo 1. "for the hack value"
14:36captbunzo 2. "it MIGHT be useful for others"... :)
14:38thor_ If you can already remotely set recordings and delete recordings, it's not really clear to me why you can't wait till you get home to edit cutlists .... but heh, more power to you
14:42captbunzo because I login via ssh and use transcode (plus some scripts I wrote) to turn 2.2 GB/hour videos into 470 MB/hour videos.
14:42captbunzo and then I download them and watch them remotely.
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14:49onyxsoft Earlie still here? I was scrolling back and noticed your message about the pvr-usb2. This is something I have also been looking at. It isn't supported by Myth yet, but there are v4l2 drivers at .
14:53captbunzo thanks for the help, folks.
14:54captbunzo got some great input here and I really appreciate it!
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14:59Chutt cvs is up
15:00dopester yeah..
15:00Baylink Hey, Bunzo: what are your transcode parms? Cause we can't get it *nearly* that small.
15:01Chutt you probably care about the quality
15:01dopester chutt: do you have any problem with me adding a SetDB function to channelbase?
15:02Chutt new connection?
15:02Chutt i really should make a db connection pool
15:02Chutt simplifiy a lot of things
15:03dopester not a new connection but have its own pointer to db_conn and db_lock
15:03Chutt that's fine with me
15:03dopester ok cool i needed it anyway..
15:03dopester :)
15:03dopester im approaching a testing patch.. i got it scaning and inserting channels now..
15:03dopester and tuning based on proper db structure
15:12Baylink BTW, Isaac, it's not necessarily about quality. We get 42 minute HDTV downsample Enterprise eps off torrent that are ~400MB, and they're network backhaul quality. Is the (total lack of) analog noise the issue?
15:12thor_ Chutt, hmmmm parsing MythUIThemedDialog's ... am assuming we don't want containers (should be separate <screen> on the stack)?
15:15dopester baylink: im not chutt but the noise makes a huge difference
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15:21thor_ also, I think MythScreenType wants a virtual destructor
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15:44rkulagow chutt: here?
15:54Baylink We seem to be having major differences between our 15 and 16 based 250's on the ghosting front with DNR...
16:02jams Baylink, with 15 being worse ?
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16:31Baylink I believe that is actually the case, yeah; you know something?
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17:21jams Baylink, nope just my own experiance
17:29Baylink Ah. 'k.
17:29Baylink We're going to try characterization later; I'm going to cook up a script that changes the settings, and flashes the numbers on the OSD.
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18:07ulitz when I run mythfronend from a different computer... I see the program info for the saved programs but when I try playing it says file not found?
18:08ulitz on the diretory for saved programs it is listed as /video where it is stored on backend machine where they are infact stored
18:08GeckoFiend ulitz /topic
18:09ulitz whoops
18:09ulitz time to copy
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18:27thor_ Chutt, you about
18:27thor_ ?
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18:30riksta sup
18:30riksta hows it goin dopester
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20:45splat1 nn all
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20:54mikegrb moo
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21:12Beirdo Sigh
21:12Beirdo question: any devs aware of any documentation for the lame library, or is it as undocumented as the ffmpeg ones?
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21:39Gene Hi
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23:56dopester riksta: you around?
---Logclosed Sun Sep 19 00:00:22 2004