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#mythtv IRC Logs for 2007-01-15

---Logopened Mon Jan 15 00:00:58 2007
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00:06<Chutt>first checkin in _months_
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06:56<spyro_boy>Is anyone here using Debian?
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07:10<snappe>hi there.
07:11<snappe>in mythweather it shows correctly the degrees in celcius, but on mythweb it shows as fahrenheit
07:11<snappe>any one have any ideas about how to fix this?
07:15<stuarta>snappe: there's a channel called mythtv-users and a configuration setting in mythweb
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07:19<snappe>If you have any questions, you can find me on the #mythtv channel at
07:19<snappe> (IRC Name: moegreen)
07:19<snappe>had a q
07:19<snappe>asked it
07:20<snappe>you could have just told me you didnt know the answer
07:20<stuarta>i told you the answer
07:20<snappe>you popped it out on the counter
07:20<stuarta>[13:15] < stuarta> snappe: there's a channel called mythtv-users and a configuration setting in mythweb
07:20<snappe>its really really big
07:22<adde>Hey i havent been on for a while and need to get hold of a dude who was in here a lot "ille" trying the whowas command cant find him... ANyone got any ideas how i shall go about...
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07:29<stealth>somtimes i can record chans over 1394 and somtimes i cant.. im testing via test-mpeg2.. is this maybe a channel or a specific program on that channel copy flag issue?
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07:34<stealth>of course the chans i want to stream dont work
07:35<stealth>anyone have a link to that fcc 1394 mandate?
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10:00<MrGandalf>any devs around willing to log into my backend and trace a loop in the backend?
10:00<stuarta>MrGandalf: I would, but i'm about to go into a meeting...
10:01<MrGandalf>I can leave it here for you if you like..
10:01<stuarta>if it's still outstanding in a hour i'll have a look
10:01<MrGandalf>k, thanks! :)
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11:12<MrGandalf>stuarta: connect information sent via email..
11:13<MrGandalf>tail /var/log/mythbackend.log for debug output of what's happening
11:17<Dibblah>Anyone know what --only-update-channels does with an xmltv provider?
11:17<Dibblah>mythfilldatabase, I mean.
11:22<stuarta>MrGandalf: cheers. This still be available in 1.5hrs? It's home time here...
11:23<MrGandalf>whenever you get to it.. within reason. :)
11:23<stuarta>thanks, i'll have a look when I get home...
11:23<MrGandalf>have to kick ot eventually
11:24<stuarta>when will you need to kick it?
11:24<MrGandalf>within a few hours.. 3 or 4
11:24<stuarta>okay, no probs.
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11:28<gbee>Dibblah: mean we ignore programme data and only create new (update) channels from the xmltv data
11:29<gbee>no idea if it's currently working or not
11:30<gbee>using xmltv data to populate the channels table is somewhat redundant with analogue and digital scanning implemented
11:30<gbee>doesn't have the necessary info for tuning anyway
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11:54<Dibblah>gbee: Yeah, that's what I've just been discussing on -users.
11:55<Dibblah>I'm wondering if it's worth adding code into mythfilldatabase to only fill rows in the channel table that have xmltvids.
11:55<Dibblah>The rest get added to newchannels or something similar.
11:55<Dibblah>Hmmm. Actually, that's unnecessarily complex.
11:56<Dibblah>A toggle in the guide that allows you to see channels that _don't_ have an xmltvid.
11:56<Dibblah>Then an edit function for channels.
11:56<Dibblah>(Extending the E in liveTV idea)
11:57<Dibblah>Of course, not for datadirect sources.
12:11|-|Defend changed nick to defend
12:12<gbee>Dibblah: users shouldn't be including channels in their xmltv configs unless they exist in the db, it's a waste of bandwidth and processing power
12:14<gbee>we've already got the 'visible' toggle - don't need another
12:15<Dibblah>Okay... But how does the user initially set it up?
12:16<gbee>when you add a new grabber you are prompted to select which channels you want guide data for
12:16<Dibblah>Punishing them by just adding them all as untunable channels seems unnecessarily cruel :)
12:17<Dibblah>gbee: hard to use in it's current incarnation.
12:17<gbee>for some people that seems to be too much effort, so they just add the entire list
12:17<Dibblah>Well, it IS too much effort ;)
12:17<gbee>Dibblah: hard, but not really impossible
12:18<Dibblah>I'm trying to figure out if it's possible to lower this barrier to entry a bit.
12:18<gbee>one of my xmltv changes will be to include support for the xmltv config api - which makes things prettier
12:18<Dibblah>The grabber config file isn't a standard format over all grabbers, is it?
12:19<Dibblah>Yeah, which no grabbers support currently? ;)
12:20<gbee>a couple do - but I can get the xmltv devs to push it along on their end
12:20<gbee>tbh I'm not sure whether the config file is standard, the content obviously isn't as each grabber has it's own config requirements
12:21<gbee>and it seems that the channel identifiers used in the config aren't always the xmltvids (would make things easier if they were)
12:23<gbee>I'm reluctant to let users add hundreds of channels to their xmltv config which they don't need - puts unnecessary strain on the source websites and they'll probably retaliate by blocking us
12:23<Dibblah>So don't make it too easy?...
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12:25<Dibblah>I'm trying to think of a UI where having the grabber configurable through API is easy to use and failing.
12:26<Dibblah>The only configuration for things like tv_grab_uk_rt is the list of channels, in xmltv form.
12:26<gbee>probably won't be any easier than the current configuration, but at least it won't require the user to alt-tab to switch to the terminal
12:28<Dibblah>Argh. --list-channels is not in baseline.
12:29<gbee>it's messy, no question about that and ideas for simplfying it would be appreciated
12:29<gbee>nope, it's in apiconfig
12:30<gbee>3 grabbers currently support apiconfig
12:30<Dibblah>Well, I can do tv_grab_uk_rt, I think.
12:30<Dibblah>However, it doesn't help, still.
12:32<Dibblah>Okay. Whatever. Is the current implementation, in your opinion, of populating untunable channels wrong?
12:32<Dibblah>It may be useful for people going through an STB...
12:32<minra>cheers to open source... keep making things better. dont despair
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12:33<gbee>Dibblah: I'd say that it shouldn't be the default behaviour, maybe add another setting to control it
12:33<Dibblah>I think I'm going to have to go through a setup and make notes.
12:34<Dibblah>I hate settings.
12:34<gbee>so do I
12:34<gbee>maybe we can look at the card/source type and make decisions based on that
12:35<gbee>but at the end of the day I think we'd still come back to wanting/needing a simple checkbox on the videosource page
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12:52<minra>"finely ground" is correct, "grounded" means having a solid base
12:57[~]gbee shifts away
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13:00<marklehmann>Have the issues with the Antec Fusion and MythTV been fixed? The ones with the front display?
13:00<briand>yes, right along with the issues regarding reading the topic when you enter the channel.
13:01<briand>s/reading/reading and understanding/g
13:02<marklehmann>Eeeks. Sorry. Shame on me. I'm come back when I can contribute some development to MythTV, which will hopefully be in a month.
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13:12<stuarta>MrGandalf: i'm in....
13:12<stuarta>so we're trying to work out what the backend is up to?
13:12<MrGandalf>yes, seems to be looping
13:12<MrGandalf>sending global messages
13:13<stuarta>it's iobound atm
13:13<MrGandalf>tail /var/log/mythbackend.log for debug output of what's happening
13:15<stuarta>live-pc4 a frontend?
13:15<MrGandalf>it's very unresponsive now
13:16<MrGandalf>no frontend is active
13:17<MrGandalf>and if you notice, the time stamps (8:14:38) are really old and always the same
13:17<stuarta>hmmm, didn't think those message happened with -v channel
13:18<MrGandalf>they don't
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13:18<MrGandalf>I added some debugging
13:40<stuarta>is it just unresponsive or does it exhibit different behaviour?
13:42<MrGandalf>2007-01-15 09:52:54.007 Connecting to backend server: (try 1 of 5)
13:42<MrGandalf>2007-01-15 09:53:01.009 MythSocket(846aea8:41): readStringList: Error, timeout (quick).
13:42<MrGandalf>2007-01-15 09:53:01.009 Unexpected response to MYTH_PROTO_VERSION:
13:42<MrGandalf>2007-01-15 09:53:01.009 TV: Attempting to change from None to None
13:42<stuarta>is this similar to the ticket you have open?
13:43<MrGandalf>well, I suspect they are related.. there are two bugs here I believe, this one and the other segfaulting in Mainserver::customEvent()
13:43<MrGandalf>relating to extradata
13:44<stuarta>the main thread is busy writing stuff out to the logfile using customEvent
13:45<MrGandalf>and sending messages
13:47<MrGandalf>I sometimes get segfaults on the slave backend.. I suspect due to all the messages being sent
13:51<stuarta>i'd suggest adding some extra debugging to find out what the "Unexpected response to MYTH_PROTO_VERSION" actually is
13:52<MrGandalf>I suspect it's because the backend is unresponsive due to it being too busy in customEvent()
13:52<MrGandalf>lemme add some verbose level to the frontend
13:52<stuarta>could be...
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13:55<MrGandalf>2007-01-15 14:55:00.398 write -> 39 21 MYTH_PROTO_VERSION 32
13:55<MrGandalf>2007-01-15 14:55:07.401 MythSocket(8471310:39): readStringList: Error, timeout (quick).
13:55<MrGandalf>2007-01-15 14:55:07.402 MythSocket(8471310:39): state change Connected -> Idle
13:55<MrGandalf>2007-01-15 14:55:07.402 Unexpected response to MYTH_PROTO_VERSION:
13:56<MrGandalf>so timing out
13:57<stuarta>yep, it's busy
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14:03<stuarta>i think i need to make the dynamic ringbuffer sizing, non dynamic when editing
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14:10<stuarta>hi juski
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14:27[~]j-rod wonders how hard it would be to utilize the new fluendo mpeg2/4 codec support for license-hassle-free mythtv...
14:29[~]stuarta googles fluendo
14:29<j-rod>(that may be subscription only, can't remember)
14:31<j-rod>didn't realize those bits weren't free like their mp3 plugin tho...
14:31<stuarta>there goes that idea then....
14:32<j-rod>yeah, never mind
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14:39<janneg>j-rod: second problem is that they have only decoders. but we need encoders too for transcode and framgrabber support
14:41<j-rod>janneg: yeah, I was thinking of a slightly limited scope, where all incoming video is mpeg2 (either via hdtv capture card or hw mpeg2 encoder)
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14:44<briand>MrGandalf: fwiw, your log messages look alarmingly similar to what I was experiencing here before I added the "--noupnp" parameter to my mythbackend startup. ...although my understanding is that the upnp issue has been recently resolved. (I haven't removed the flag from my script since, although my SVN is current). Anyway, worth a try for ya
14:46<MrGandalf>briand: which log messages?
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14:47<stuarta>ahhh. there's a thread buried in SSDP::Run
14:48<stuarta>some form of Service Discovery.
14:48<stuarta>sure Greyfoxx will be able to tell you exactly what
14:49<MrGandalf>is this what briand was talking about with upnp?
14:49<MrGandalf>so you think that's the issue?
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14:49<stuarta>possibly. just looking at the src code noe
14:49<stuarta>(see /tmp/backend.gdb on your box)
14:50<janneg>stuarta: SSDP::Run is proabbly the event loop
14:50<briand>MrGandalf: the backend being non-responsive (and top would show >99% CPU for that process)
14:51<MrGandalf>briand: probably would be 100% CPU if I wasn't doing so much logging out to a file :) you may be on to something
14:51<stuarta>although looking at it, the SSDP is waiting for more data
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15:01<janneg>stuarta: does the bt looks like this
15:01<janneg>then it seems to be normal
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15:13<stuarta>we don't have a null videoout put like mplayer do we?
15:14<stuarta>it would help if we needed to valgrind the frontend.
15:14<Chutt>there is
15:14<Chutt>used for commflagging + the preview, etc
15:14<stuarta>any way of using it for a playback?
15:15<stuarta>like mythtv -vo null file.mpg
15:20<Chutt>sorry, phone :/
15:21<Chutt>i may be having to travel out to chicago tomorrow
15:21[~]stuarta files that one under wishlist....
15:21<Chutt>silly last minute travel stuff sucks
15:22<stuarta>would it be difficult to implement, i'm suspecting it wouldn't be that bad if the code's already there
15:22<Chutt>naw, wouldn't be that hard
15:22<Chutt>just have to add a new thing to select it, really.
15:22<jams>thankfully the chicago snow should be gone by tonight
15:22<stuarta>i'm thinking it would be best as a command line switch.
15:23<Chutt>env var, too
15:23<stuarta>if (!DISPLAY
15:24<stuarta>videoout = null
15:29[~]stuarta goes digging in the source code
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15:34<xris>stuarta: just curious, but what'd be the point?
15:35<stuarta>purely debugging
15:35<Dibblah>Sheesh. Out of the 7 major distros, 1 is shipping QT4 out of the box. Hurry up, people :)
15:36<janneg>which one? gentoo?
15:36<janneg>It will get better when kde4 is out
15:36<Dibblah>Of course. Let your users lead the charge into the unknown.
15:37<Tuomaz>What needs to be done to support qt4? (Complete rewrite?!)
15:37<Chutt>yes, essentially.
15:38<Chutt>i looked into it
15:38<gbee>a fine tooth comb, a QT4 manual and a copy of the code
15:38<Chutt>all of mythwidgets.cpp has to go.
15:38<Chutt>which means all the popup dialogs, all the settings code, mythtv-setup
15:38<Tuomaz>Will MythTV gain something with QT4? Eyecandy, simpler code?
15:38<Chutt>we're using internal interfaces that no longer exist in qt4 for most of that stuff.
15:38<Dibblah>Still not time to look at it, though?
15:39<Dibblah>Tuomaz: Windows, hopefully, will be less painful.
15:39<Dibblah>Okay. A _little_ less painful.
15:39<Chutt>much easier windows port. a bunch of stuff will become simpler (threaded stuff is better in qt4)
15:43<Tuomaz>I'm not a MythTV dev, but I looked a litte at the code. I saw alot of mysql code with qt-(bindings/names). Does qt3 has some sort of mysql-bindings?
15:43<Chutt>err, yes?
15:44<Tuomaz>Ok, are those simplier to use than some native mysql-bindings?
15:45<stuarta>theoretically allows you to abstract away the database you are talking to
15:45<Tuomaz>Ok, sounds nice.
15:45<stuarta>it's better for consistency to use the toolkit
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16:16<cld2>anyone know what NVR: won't work with the streaming interface, falling back means?
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16:24<gbee>has anyone documented the osds theme stuff? in particular what different elements are available for use in the different containers?
16:25<gbee>I'm looking at it now and I'm suprised to find all sorts of stuff that no theme designer has ever used
16:25<gbee>I'm guessing because they all just copy an existing theme :(
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16:27<jams>gbee thats a very good bet
16:28<CDev>Can a class be derived from 2 classes, 1 being QObject and still work correctly with Contect->addListener()?
16:28[~]stuarta nominates juski as "cool theme developer"
16:28<CDev>i.e. class A : public QObject, public B ....
16:29<CDev>I seem to segfault on the call to addListener.
16:29<xris>stuarta: yes.
16:30<stuarta>AFAIK, multiple inheritance doesn't play well with QT unless all the parent classes are QT
16:30<stuarta>i may however be completely wrong
16:30<stuarta>xris: :) i'm still using ProjectGrahem...
16:31<gbee>think a demo theme, using all the possible elements would be good, might inspire theme authors to try something different ;)
16:31<CDev>stuarta: Thanks, I'll try to make class B in the example above also inherit from QObject and see if that helps
16:31<stuarta>CDev: i'd have a search of the trolltech site for more info....
16:32<janneg>CDev: no, that won't work.
16:32<CDev>Already been looking,
16:32<Chutt>CDev, hey, playback on the dsm-320 is so-so
16:32<CDev>Chutt: Wireless... right?
16:32<Chutt>it seems to get stuck in a stuttery loop for 30 seconds at a time, generally 2 or 3 times an hour
16:33<stuarta>knew I should have stopped after "doesn't play well with qt"
16:33<CDev>Any common place in the stream? or when switching shows?
16:33<Chutt>randomly in a show
16:34<Chutt>doesn't repro in the same place when playing it again
16:34<cld2>I hate to be "that guy" but can anyone explain this to me, Im trying to switch from media center to mythtv, I am a unix/linux server admin by trade so Ive got some idea of whats going on, but X gui stuff is not my strong point... so the questions is, in media center all my colors look right/good in mythtv my reds and orange seem bleed together and when things move fast there is a rather obvious "shadow" I have an amd 1.8 ghz and a hauppag
16:34<stuarta>damn, i need to find some time to sort out the overcorrection in the a/v sync code....
16:34<CDev>It maybe when the backend is sending out notifications. !?
16:35<Chutt>CDev, dunno =)
16:35<CDev>I believe the default is every 1800 seconds.
16:36<Chutt>i think it was happening more often than that, though
16:36<CDev>I can't remember if the DSM-320 requests the stream as one big file, or many smaller chunks (I think it's many small...)
16:37<CDev>If it is many small, then it may be getting interrupted responding to other devices asking about it.
16:38<CDev>Trying to think of the best way to figure out what's happening... drawing a blank.
16:39<CDev>Are you using the search feature of the 320?
16:39<CDev>(where you enter the time)
16:46<CDev>janneg: thanks for the link. Interesting reading.
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16:49<janneg>CDev: you're welcome. If you can't figure out that's wrong Daniel probably can say it
16:49<CDev>It made complete sense. I just restuctured the classes to fit in with the "QT" design.
16:50<gbee> /me bookmarks that page
16:54<gbee>#2518 - I'm adding a new textarea to the container for the extra info, but I'm struggling to think of a succinct name for it
16:54<gbee>any ideas?
16:55<gbee>current in the status container we have statusslider, slidertext, statusposition etc
16:55<Chutt>CDev, not using the search
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17:00<gbee>well I asked, don't blame me if I go with "moreslidertext", "slidertextdesc" or "extendedslidertext" :p
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17:04<cld2>how do I use zap2it with myth?
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17:05<GreyFoxx>cld2: try #Mythtv-users
17:06<cld2>oh, im very sorry #mythtv , I didnt realize I was bugging all you developers. thanks .
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17:07<GreyFoxx>Chutt: Do you care if I change MythContext::SaveSettingOnHost to return a bool assuming I update everyt reference too it? There is duplicate code in every dbcheck that I could remove by using it instead. Plus it would be nice to know if it failed :)
17:07<Chutt>sure, go for it
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18:07<GreyFoxx>Chutt: What is the proper "failed" response to send when a mythprotocol SET_SETTING fails? Currently we just return OK but now that it can detect a failed setting I want to return a failure. I'm just not 100% on what the proper Failed error is
18:08<xris>GreyFoxx: isn't it usually just ERROR?
18:08<GreyFoxx>Cool, that works
18:08<GreyFoxx>and I just found another place that is used
18:08<GreyFoxx>so I'll keep it consistant
18:09<GreyFoxx>From what I can tell nothing in the code actually uses it
18:09<GreyFoxx>unless mythweb does
18:10<xris>perl bindings. :)
18:10<xris>I don't think mythweb does
18:11<GreyFoxx>ok, nothing in the perl bindings uses SET_SETTING either
18:11<GreyFoxx>cd ..
18:11<xris>GreyFoxx: ah, yeah. I was just referring to ERROR
18:24<Chutt>i think it may be BAD in other places
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18:52<xris>anyone know where the default key bindings live in the code?
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19:05<Chutt>xris, everywhere.
19:05<Chutt>xris, they're defined in the area of use, mostly.
19:06<Chutt>plugins define their own on init, etc
19:06<xris>ahh. so each plugin/etc resets the defaults if the setting is gone?
19:06<xris>ah, annoying.
19:06<Chutt>hard to make it flexible and all in one place :p
19:07<xris>I'd like to add a "reset" option to mythweb, but it's only helpful if the data resets rather than coming back blank if some/all frontends aren't running
19:08<Chutt>dunno how to do that best
19:08<xris>you'd probably have to have each plugin define its defaults somewhere... not a very clean option
19:13<xris>oh well
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19:21<Smirnov>I'm trying to add mythtv to my existing linux box.. how do i know what kind of TV-IN card to buy?
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19:29<Smirnov>ah, sers
19:29<Smirnov>sorrrry, i shoulda read topic first
19:29<Smirnov>i'll be back here later once its time for me to develop plugins ;)
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20:03<MrGandalf>damn it
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---Logclosed Tue Jan 16 00:00:43 2007