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#mythtv IRC Logs for 2007-11-09

---Logopened Fri Nov 09 00:00:56 2007
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01:54<BenB>gbee: emusic has or is working on a shop application based on xulrunner.
01:55<BenB>gbee: so, I assume there's a proper API to the store. just look at the code of the app (assuming it has already been published).
01:55<BenB>I can get you in contact with devs.
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04:12<gbee>BenB: don't have time right now to work on something like that, but I've filed it under possible future projects
04:14<BenB>gbee: yeah. I personally think it's way over the top to have something like that on the TV, it's fine to do that on the PC
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05:31<gbee>would someone mind commenting on this one line patch -
05:32<gbee>I'm not 100% certain that erasing the area is the right approach, the intent is to remove the preview pixmap before we start drawing the video since they may be different sizes
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06:02<gbee>probably talking to myself, but has anyone seen strange things happen with the preview images on a setup with frontends of different resolutions?
06:02<justinh>strange things?
06:03<justinh>I've heard reports of various themes displaying garbled previews (like diagonal lines) which weren't present on my themes
06:04<justinh>guessed it might be some kind of 'can't divide by 8' scaling problem
06:05<gbee>nevermind, I was jumping to conclusions about the code but I was wrong
06:06<justinh>I think it's a combination of xv, drivers & the actual size of the preview window
06:07<justinh>I've actually seen it once on my minimyth FE, but switching to the theme I wanted to use anyway fixed it
06:07<gbee>just making changes to allow the preview pixmap to fill whatever dimensions you give the video container (maintaining aspect ratio though)
06:07<justinh>didn't it already do that?
06:07<gbee>at the moment, the video fills the space but the preview image is fixed at 160x120
06:08<justinh>not that I've ever measured it to check
06:08<gbee>if you enable video previews on blt-w for example, the video is at least 1/3 larger when it appears than the pixmap
06:10<justinh>I just about fixed the live tv guide in glass-wide yesterday. the telnet interface came in handy :)
06:16<gbee>used the frame idea that I used for the visualiser in mythmusic for the preview -
06:17<gbee>by the time I'm finished, this theme will have resulted in a dozen commits to make it work like I wanted it to
06:18<rooaus>gbee: wtf? Ah, did you commit the frame stuff? Nice.
06:18<justinh>I was thinking "how the heck did he fit so much info onscreen", but then the fonts are way smaller than what I've used
06:18<gbee>it's all good stuff, the preview vertical centre stuff has bothered me for a while anyway
06:19<gbee>justinh: still works on my TV (with my eyesight), but yeah, you'd get fewer lines if you increase the font size
06:20<gbee>just fixed another issue which had bothered me, the preview image being visible around the edges of the preview video
06:20<justinh>I can live with fewer lines. if the bones of the description aren't in the 1st 3 lines, it's junk anyway IMHO
06:21<justinh>I can see the emails now "why are you wasting so much space on the description?" and "can you reduce the show list area & fill half the screen with the description?"
06:21<gbee>heh, I like the long descriptions
06:22<gbee>justinh: /dev/null
06:23<justinh>and "it's great, but if you move the XYZ image 2 pixels left/up/down/right..."
06:24<gbee>* ^Subject: .*theme.*
06:25<gbee>there we go, procmail rule already in place ;)
06:25<justinh>heheheh. now I'm using thunderbird instead of the $deity awful gmail, I think I'll set up a filter before Monday
06:26<gbee>just need to stick in a high priority rule ... * ^.*money.*
06:28<gbee>"you'll pay me to butcher my theme? ... Will this vomit inducing pink and cute character animation be ok sir?"
06:30<gbee>"I'll add background music to the menus for an extra £5!"
06:31[~]justinh wonders what glass-wide would look like with a background of lift muzak
06:31<gbee>and a background image of a lift ...
06:33<justinh>like I've already said, the user can go hang themselves with whatever background image they want
06:34<justinh>if it's too bright for the text to stand out, it's their fault not mine
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08:38<Tronic>A bug: scanning DVB transport freq=240000000 sr=7146000 fec=none modulation=qam_64 tuned the transport correctly and detected the channels on it, but stored the transport incorrectly in the database:
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08:39<justinh>don't bugs get posted on trac as tickets? ;)
08:39<Tronic>MythTV was unable to get a lock before I fixed the missing data by hand.
08:39<Tronic>Well, that part is up to you, I guess.
08:39<Tronic>I don't have an account, so unless you accept anonymous submissions...
08:40<justinh>that part is up to _you_ actually
08:40<DaveMorris>Tronic: you don't need an account
08:40<Tronic>Ah, then...
08:40<justinh>it helps to register an email address with trac though
08:43<mick_work>justinh: i think it was you who did a few mythtv themes, or?
08:43<mick_work>i have a question regarding licensing and themes (thought you might be able to help)
08:44<justinh>fire away
08:45<justinh>maybe in a msg though - probably a bit OT for here
08:51<justinh>hint: you need to be registered for that to work
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09:02<justinh>mick_work: are you going to ask or what?
09:06<clever>justinh: if you set a certain mode on yourself(+6 i think) unreg's can msg you(but they can also spam you)
09:06<clever>i think you need to set it thru nickserv
09:06<justinh>I'm not enabling that for all the tea in china
09:07<clever>if you do get spamaged you can allways shut it back off
09:07<justinh>get bugged enough by msgs as it is
09:08<clever>i recently made a change to my highlight
09:08<clever>instead of making the smae old beep from the speakers
09:08<clever>it makes a 15khz beep from the pc speaker(in the case)
09:08<clever>which can bearly be heard
09:08<mick_work>justinh: sorry - i was pulled from my desk
09:08<clever>but dad probly wont complain about it as much
09:09<clever>its probly into the range that adults have trouble hearing
09:09<mick_work>justinh: how do you deal with using outside images for a theme
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09:09<mick_work>i came across a problem where a designer did a theme for me (i'm doing a presentation on MythTV at my local linux user group) and i wanted to submit it upstream -- until i found out that she used a stock photo
09:09<justinh>mick_work: I always ask for permission, whether the displayed licence terms say or not
09:10<mzb_d800>clever: ageism! :)
09:10<mick_work>under a restrictive license
09:10<justinh>mick_work: well, that's their look-out
09:10<justinh>my next release of a theme contains no images that conflict with my licence
09:10<mick_work>so what is a "compatible license" for content in a theme?
09:10<clever>mzb_d800: what?
09:11<justinh>mick_work: whatever you want but it has to be compatible with the terms of the licences of any images used too
09:11<clever>once your over about 30 you begin to loose the ability to hear certain high freq sounds
09:11<mick_work>is a creative commons license GPL compatible (and does it even need to be gpl?)
09:11<justinh>CC isn't GPL compatible
09:11<justinh>and no, it doesn't have to be GPL
09:11<clever>some stores use a high freq sound to anoy and drive away teenages that hang arround outside the store and cause trouble
09:12<clever>some students use it as a ring tone on there phone that teachers in school cant hear
09:12<justinh>I've been trying to find a licence that allows me to forbid redistribution.. so far no dice :(
09:12<mzb_d800>clever: I can hear a TV out of tune, and during a hearing test I can hear the computer turning the tones on|off ... (I like to think I'm an adult;P)
09:12<mick_work>justinh: look at a stock photo license :)
09:12<clever>yeah but most might not be as good at hearing as you
09:12<justinh>mick_work: I know how restrictive they can be, which is why I've always been picky about the ones I've used
09:13<mick_work>this is why i usually do my own work (graphics and photography)
09:14<mick_work>justinh: have any recommendations?
09:14<mick_work>feel free to /msg if it is entirely too OT
09:14<justinh>from what I've seen of skins from the likes of Media portal, nobody seems overly bothered by licence issues ;)
09:14<justinh>like winamp skins.. Copyright? wassatr?!
09:15<clever>mzb_d800: have you seen the 'beep' program?
09:15<mzb_d800>clever: yeah, I've been trained from a young age ... got some friends that call me "dog-boy" coz I can hear a mobile phone ringing when it's in a bag in a room on the other side of a house, when I'm outside ;)
09:16<mzb_d800>yeah, I vaguely remember it (my memory isn't as good as my hearing any more;)
09:16<clever>it can control the speaker connected to the motherboard(in the case)
09:16<clever>and it can output a tone from 1hz to 20khz at any lenght/delay
09:16<gbee>OT guys
09:16<clever>using that and a modified ir blaster script i got it to beep out the channel when it changed
09:17<clever>(mythtv related:P)
09:17<clever>changing to channel 45 in myth would give off 4 beeps then 5 beeps
09:17<laga_>um, why?
09:17<clever>because im bored:P
09:18<gbee>it's not that you are interrupting a development related discussion, just that anyone like me, who tries to read the logs for important stuff has to wade through the OT discussions
09:18<clever>probly also makes the logs oversized(i got 6gig of TXT logs here atleast)
09:18<mzb_d800>clever: I'm way past beeps now ... I've got speech output instead
09:18[~]clever trys to resist the urge to keep talking ot
09:19<clever>i have that on in certain irc channels but my speakers are off atm(to test the new highlight)
09:20<clever>has anybody else noticed a problem with frame grabbers and r14800?
09:21<clever>my bitrate has doubled there(causing twice the disk space usage)
09:22<mzb_d800>cepestral voices (the free ones) with a script that removes the "this voice is unregistered" ... and caches phrases for speed
09:22<clever>im using the microsoft agent within winblows
09:22<mzb_d800>each machine+user on the network can have a different "default" voice
09:23<clever>ive got a seemlingly fully free text2wav prog on my laptop though
09:23<mzb_d800>and user simply executes: $ say "Hello $USER. I'm ready for you to push my buttons and click my mouse."
09:23<laga_>OT? :)
09:24<clever>text2wave takes in text and outputs raw wav
09:24<clever> if you want more info
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10:10<justinh>heh I just can't stop fiddling. got some more div lines on my watch recordings screen. horizontal ones this time
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12:07<gbee>think I'm making a mess of this, can anyone see a problem with the scaling change in [14823] and [14824]?
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13:17<MrGandalf>In analyzing a core dump with gdb, does anyone know how to tie threads together to figure out what called a given thread?
13:18<dr_lulz>tie together?
13:19<dr_lulz>you can switch between threads via the "thread command" (list via "info threads"), then work on them individually
13:19<MrGandalf>a bt shows me all the threads. When I look at the culpret thread, I have no idea what it was doing at the time. I was hopeing to figure out what other thread called it.
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13:50<Chutt>xris, hey, uh, how does one deal with spam on the sd boards?
13:51<xris>forums? we move stuff to the "archive" forum
13:51<Chutt>2nd post in the 'approved apps' forum
13:52<Chutt>how do i move it?
13:52<Snow-Man>How about spam from the f'ing wiki registration page
13:52<Chutt>Snow-Man, that just goes to you :p
13:52<Snow-Man>---Mutt: [Msgs:3001 New:1252 Old:1339 11M]
13:55<Chutt>yeah, i can't figure out how to move a post in the forum
13:55<Chutt>i'm a newb
13:56<laga_>ask in the users channel?
13:58<mikegrb>hahahahaha, good one laga_
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14:03<xris>Chutt: I don't know much about the forum stuff, either.
14:03<xris>might have to do it from the admin pannel
14:03<gbee>Chutt: on the right hand side, above the thread and opposite the thread title is a link "[ Moderator Control Panel ]"
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14:04<gbee>or at least it's there on the default theme
14:04<Chutt>yeah, even on the moderator control panel
14:04<Chutt>i'm not seeing a 'move post'
14:05<xris>Chutt: I just used the "delete this post" button
14:05<xris>maybe you don't have admin privs. hang on
14:05<Chutt>oh, ok =)
14:05<Chutt>i do
14:05<Chutt>i could've deleted it, but wasn't sure
14:07<xris>apparently that just moves it to "archive"
14:07<xris>I also went in and changed that user password to something random
14:07<gbee>you're right, can't find the option to move a post/thread either - was a lot simpler with the old version of phpbb
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14:09<gbee>ahh, found the option to move a whole thread
14:09<clever>has anybody else noticed a problem with frame grabbers and r14800?
14:09<clever>my bitrate has doubled there(causing twice the disk space usage)
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15:38<stuarta>wtf does the backend have 29 open fd's on /dev/dvb/adapter0/demux0
15:38<stuarta>admittedly it's recording, but there shouldn't be that many pids it needs to track
15:42<capt-rogers>anyone try the is it?
15:43<laga_>capt-rogers: #mythtv-users #ubuntu-mythtv
15:44<laga_>i have tried it and i like it but i'm probably biased
15:49<GreyFoxx>Maybe a little biased heh
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17:12<gbee>heh, RAF have just released a picture of a Pilot wearing the new helment for use with the Joint Strike Fighter -
17:13[~]stuarta roflmao
17:16<justinh>topic! ;)
17:16<justinh>and rofl
17:17<justinh>looks more convincing than a Dr. Who enemy, fer sure
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17:37<gbee>must have heard you justinh
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17:38<justinh>arghgh I hate taking screenshots
17:38<justinh>been busy tonight, tidied up my site a tad
17:46[~]stuarta decides to write another article on LVS
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18:17<RageMax>anyone know a good box that distributes component audio/video/IR from multiple HD tuners?
18:18<laga_>#mythtv-users knows how to do that. probably.
18:22<justinh>well, have a nice weekend all, I'm off
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18:49<gbee>theming has to be a lot more fun when you don't have to conform to the limitations of the code, because instead you just change the code :)
18:52<gbee>btw, might be a known issue, but when two containers overlap you can get into a nasty paintEvent loop, well at least in statusbox.cpp, but the code there looks pretty similar to the stuff used in playbackbox.cpp so chances are it's a global problem
19:16<rooaus>gbee: Theming from the inside out :)
19:30<stuarta>from what i've seen it needs a good theming from the inside out.
19:34<gbee>I've barely even scratched the surface, if I had the time I'd being making much bigger changes
19:38<gbee>I was quite serious when I suggested in an email to the list that more devs should try creating a theme
19:58<Chutt>gbee, start porting to new ui?
20:00<gbee>Chutt: not yet, but I'm in a much better position to do it now than I was a week ago and I might just get started on it this weekend
20:01<Chutt>just feel free to ask questions and i can help
20:01<Chutt>cuz i want to start coding again sometime, too, and that's where i'd want to start..
20:03<rooaus>Chutt: How is the xmlparser going? Do you intend on committing that before the bulk of the mythui port or is it more experimental?
20:04<Chutt>the xmlparser's written.
20:04<gbee>just spotted the actual cause of the bug reported by Daniel - typo'd and used x()/y() instead of width()/height()
20:05<rooaus>I thought you were working on an improved version that allowed for better reuse.
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20:05<Chutt>yes, it's written.
20:05<gbee>rooaus: xmlparser is done, all the basic widgets are there, just some of the more specialised widgets which don't exist yet - trees, listareas etc
20:05<gbee>libmythui/xmlparsebase.cpp (from memory)
20:07<gbee>individual ui types each have their own parsing in-class - UIType::ParseXML() (again from memory, might be named differently)
20:07<rooaus>gbee: Yeah, I misunderstood. I thought Chutt was working a improved version to the current libmythui that allowed for includes and other enhancements.
20:07<Chutt>no, the xmlparser in mythui already allows that.
20:07<gbee>ahh, well don't know about that :)
20:08<rooaus>Chutt: Sorry, I *did* misunderstand what you said (many moons ago) then :)
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20:13<rooaus>gbee: Was looking at improving logging for missing theme elements that cause a segfault. I thought adding logging to the parser made a bit of sense. I need to look more at the mythui parser then (maybe it already reports misses).
20:18<gbee>only way to do it in the parser would be to pass a list of required elements when the dialogue is constructed
20:19<gbee>any segfaults caused by missing elements can be easily prevented by not assuming their existance (e.g. null pointer checks)
20:21<gbee>we need to be careful when we decide what is a required element and what isn't - take statusbox, until an hour ago it required you define the heading textarea which isn't what I'd call a must have element
20:22<rooaus>gbee: Yes, #4144 is an example of where a copy and paste error that resulted in a segfault.
20:22<gbee>especially since it wasn't even used by statusbox, it's static text
20:25<gbee>although there are a few elements on each screen which we cannot live without, when we move over to mythui I'd like to rethink exactly what we make compulsory
20:27<rooaus>What made me look at this was a missing text button in glass-wide while testing for justinh. I ended up doing a debug compile and looking at the backtrace to work out why it was segfaulting, even though I suspected a missing element.
20:28<gbee>I'd also like to revisit the wording of text and labels, the example I used earlier was the key/legend for sorting pages, instead of "(1) Sort by Recording Title (2) Sort by Recording Date" it would be better written as "Sort by 1) Title 2) Date"
20:29<gbee>rooaus: that's a pain, but I don't think there is an easier or better solution than just going through the entire codebase and making sure we have those null pointer checks on theme elements
20:31<gbee>one sure way to find those places would be to take a theme and delete each element until you hit a segfault
20:32<rooaus>gbee: true, would the libmythui port affect this type of patch?
20:34<gbee>rooaus: almost certainly since whoever does the port will be going through that code anyway
20:34<gbee>the patch wouldn't be redundant, just a duplication of effort
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20:36<rooaus>Thought so, I really would like to help out with some of this stuff if I can. Just not much of a coder.
20:37<gbee>I'll start with something simple, mythweather most likely since it needs some serious UI fixes anyway
20:38<gbee>""" cerr << "Unknown element: " << e.tagName() << endl; exit(0); """
20:38<gbee>would like to eliminate stuff like that, since unknown elements are not a serious problem at all and it prevents themes being forwards/backwards compatible
20:39<gbee>throw a warning, but don't return early or even exit completely
20:40<rooaus>gbee: Do you want me to look at that then?
20:40<gbee>rooaus: if you want :)
20:41<gbee>not sure if Chutt agrees with me on that subject?
20:41<Chutt>gbee, figured it was safer, that's all.
20:43<rooaus>what about a VB_THEME?
20:45<gbee>I can see that argument, but think that a _really_ broken theme would probably show up in others ways and that unknown elements needn't be a show-stopper
20:46<gbee>I need to get to bed, I tend to ramble when I'm tired
20:50<rooaus>Chutt: Would you accept not exiting if finding unknown elements? I can see why you would do it that way but also see the advantages for 3rd party themers and the like.
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---Logclosed Sat Nov 10 00:00:16 2007