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#mythtv IRC Logs for 2007-11-24

---Logopened Sat Nov 24 00:00:33 2007
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01:14<uplinked>hi, quick question- i've been on the google for ~2 hours, and i might be more confused than when i started; is there *any* way to record non-local hd channels in 1080p using mythtv + comcast digital?
01:18<uplinked>shit. users channel. gotcha, thanks :)
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03:48<justinh>why did we need a longer date format?
03:49<justinh>and er.. what attachment? heh
03:50<rgravener>2038 the world ends
03:50<rgravener>thats why
03:50<rgravener>its literally the end of time
03:50<justinh>bah it's only the end of an epoch
04:05<justinh>hmmm new long date format should probably fit ok but I'd have been tempted to make it use the last 2 year digits instead since most recordings won't be a whole century old
04:06<rgravener>new long?
04:06<rgravener>thought the current one was long
04:06<rgravener>strings work for me
04:07<justinh>ddd d MMM yyyy vs ddd MMM d yyyy
04:08<justinh>should be harmless enough
04:09<rgravener>my neck is killing me
04:10<justinh>I'd probably have added ddd dd/mm too. always used to bug me, the ddd mm/dd
04:11<rgravener>i'm american, pisses me off
04:12<justinh>I've always thought the US date convention was funny
04:12<rgravener>haha, do you have any coundom
04:12<rgravener>you pullin hd down justinh ?
04:13<justinh>nope, not yet and probably not for quite some time
04:13<rgravener>standard def?
04:14<justinh>aye all SD
04:16<rgravener>dedicated system?
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04:30<rgravener>ahh crap forgot wasn't in users
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04:54<justinh>I'm keeping my blood pressure down by staying out of there for a bit
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05:49<gbee>justinh: mchou got me going yesterday by claiming that none of the mythtv OSDs were as pretty/legible as the tivo ones and then refusing to conceed he was wrong when someone posted screenshots of tivo (which is ugly compared to some OSD themes)
05:50<justinh>so he's an asshole. what else is new
05:53<justinh>and yeah there are some butt ugly OSDs & UIs out there in embedded land
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06:01<stuarta>justinh: embedded and pretty don't go together
06:01<stuarta>how a few nice text graphics aren't bad in the embedded world :)
06:01<justinh>iPoo kinda disproves that I think
06:01<stuarta>that's consumer electronics
06:02<stuarta>when i think embedded i think machines that do stuff like packaging.
06:02[~]stuarta goes back to DIY
06:02<justinh>I think of anything that runs software pre-loaded, burnt into firmware as embedded
06:03<justinh>Sky's OSD etc really sucks IMHO
06:03<justinh>they need a theme designer :D
06:04<justinh>actually the Dbox2 has an alright UI & OSD (same thing really). same is true of the Dreambox
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10:04<janneg>gbee: inactive categories in the watch recording aren't truncated. I've no idea if it's a theme bug or mythtv's fault but I haven't noticed it with other themes
10:06<gbee>janneg: thanks, I'll take a look
10:06<janneg>displaying the callsign as alternative if no channel icon is found would be nice
10:06<janneg>but I guess someone has to implement it
10:07<justinh>janneg: as in.. if the icon is there, show just the icon? I wouldn't mind that
10:08<janneg>yes, and if the icon is missing show the callsign there
10:08<janneg>s/there/at the same place/
10:09[~]justinh looks at his dev box in bits on the floor. no patch from me for that
10:10<janneg>I guess you could display both and draw the icon over the callsign but that would break for transparent icons
10:11<justinh>maybe a setting for it? I know.. groan! another setting..
10:20<janneg>it is not solveable with settings, someone just have to code it
10:21<justinh>no I mean code it and have another setting.. i.e. "show icon in place of callsign if present"
10:25<janneg>justinh: I would lie that decission in the hand of the theme developers. they may display both, icons with alternate callsign, icon, callsign or just the channel number
10:26<justinh>wonder what happens without the callsign now..
10:26<janneg>I fear we need another theme element for icon with alternate callsign
10:27<janneg>no, metallurgy works fine without callsign
10:28<justinh>what about just a type tag for the icon/callsign area instead?
10:28<justinh>e.g. 'type="callsignwithicon", type="callsign", type="icon"
10:29<justinh>come to think about it, there are a few areas that could benefit from having the choice of image and/or text
10:29<justinh>mythmusic buttons for one
10:31<justinh>this has just reminded me I still need to scribble some notes to bear in mind when doing the mythui port (for whoever does it)
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11:48<gbee>justinh: did you ever find a 'digital clock' font?
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11:52<janneg>gbee: 8 segment display?
11:52<gbee>janneg: yes
11:54<gbee>might help with this icon:
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12:00<justinh>7 segment, not eight :)
12:00<oobe>hi i know this is not a support channel but i thought someone might know where i can find a script like but for tv episodes i been looking everywhere
12:01<justinh>oobe: topic
12:01<justinh>this is not #heyIdidn'tgetananswerinmythtv-users
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12:02<justinh>gbee: got some nice dot matrix fonts from dafont(something).com
12:02<oobe>yeah i know that's why i i phrased my question the way i did i was trying to be polite im not asking for technical support just if someone knows about a good script
12:02<justinh>mixture of licences on there
12:04<janneg>justinh: I've never counted and I guess the 8 comes from all on character
12:04<gbee>justinh: thanks
12:05<justinh>janneg: heheh fairy nuff
12:05<gbee>thought the eigth segment from from the occassional diagonal line in zero
12:05<justinh>gbee: those are called something else. starbusrt IIRC
12:06<gbee>right, well thanks anyway - had a better idea for the guide icon, not sure if I'll use the font now, but at least I know where to find one if I change my mind
12:08<justinh>I never did get around to trying mythmusic with a dot matrix font
12:08<justinh>does mythtv look in the theme dir for fonts or do they need to be installed 'properly' ?
12:09<justinh> - what you had in mind, gbee?
12:10<gbee>justinh: somewhere between that and 7 segment, just getting myself confused I guess :)
12:11<justinh>nice name for this one.. 'fake receipt'
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12:15<gbee>justinh: look at how QT looks for fonts, but my guess is that they need to be properly installed, shouldn't be hard to change that though by adding a "filename" element to the font xml in mythui
12:15<justinh>don't think it's worth it yet
12:16<justinh>there's all sorts of permissions malarkey if I want to use one of those fonts
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14:18<gbee>updated preview released, hopefully fixes the problem janneg was seeing and includes a few more watermarks -
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14:51<janneg>lol: scheduler: Scheduled items: Scheduled 194 items in 4840.4 = 4839.11 match + 1.28 place
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15:11<nsaspook>What are normal sheduler times? With latest svn my results are: 2007-11-24 12:02:33.369 Scheduled 1801 items in 31.6 = 8.39 match + 23.19 place
15:17<janneg>depends on the number and type of recording rules, number of capture cards, ...
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15:43<nsaspook>with 12 cards, 387299 program rows , 2273 channels, 963 recorded programs: 30 seconds seems fairly good. What table(s) would the type and number recording rules be found?
15:44<xris>"record" ?
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17:32<al3x4ndr3>I want to know if MythTV use Linux DVB API v4 ..can anyone anwser me?
17:32<gbee>janneg: still seeing the auto-expire problem, i.e. it's not auto-expiring anything
17:57<janneg>gbee: please paste a log with -v file
17:57<janneg>al3x4ndr3: no, it uses API v3
17:58<janneg>nsaspook: the system status screen shows the number of record rules
18:00<gbee>janneg: np
18:01<gbee>just rebuilding with a distclean to be absolutely sure
18:05<gbee>might also take me a while because I deleted a lot of stuff manually since the frontend/backend became unresponsive when it ran out of space
18:06<gbee>I'll need to create a few recordings that can be safely expired (if it works)
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18:27<rooau1>janneg: Do you have an opinion on expiring recordings from the "Deleted Group" in FIFO order?
18:32<janneg>rooau1: are they expired in starttime order?
18:33<rooau1>I think so, it is a while since I looked at the code.
18:34<janneg>gbee: I'm going to bed now and won't come back before tomorrow evening
18:37<gbee>janneg: np, no hurry
18:37<janneg>rooau1: Is it really important? I don't use auto expire instead of delete and I try to have enough space on my discs to avoid the auto expirer
18:38<gbee>goodnight even
18:38<rooau1>janneg: I usually have plenty of space as well, a couple of people have run into unexpected behaviour though. I can work up small patches like this so thought I might try.
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18:51<hads>gbee: Your Metallurgy alpha is very nice. Well done.
18:51<gbee>hads: thanks
18:53<hads>You're quite possibly aware already but in watch recordings I see some text overflow on the right of the category box.
18:54<hads>(with long program names)
18:55<gbee>hads: which version? thought I'd fixed that with the latest version
18:55<gbee>janneg reported the same issue
18:55<hads>Sorry didn't notice there was an update.
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18:57<hads>Yes, definitly fixed already.
18:58<gbee>hads: no problem, I couldn't resist pushing out an update so soon :)
18:58<rooau1>gbee: The clock on the main menu overflows as well, do you know about this or want a screen shot?
18:58<hads>:) Love the OSD by the way, very crisp.
18:59<rooau1>ah hang on, I didn't clear my theme cache, checking again now...
19:00<gbee>rooau1: I know about that, but it only happens at 4:3 resolutions?
19:00<rooau1>cool, 1680x1050 on my laptop.
19:01<gbee>I've not implemented the small/big fonts yet, so that could possibly fix any text which isn't fitting inside the textareas
19:01<gbee>but I'll see if I can tweak the default clock font size to reduce the possibility of it overflowing
19:02<rooau1>np, IIRC the font scaling no longer needs X to be running 100dpi, is that correct?
19:02<gbee>oh, I have done the big/small sizes for the clock font ...
19:04<gbee>rooau1: so I'm told, but I don't know if that is true for all fonts - those loaded by libmythui, libmyth and the OSD
19:04<rooau1>running at 129x126dpi, I will force 100dpi and recheck if you like?
19:05<gbee>rooau1: that would be useful to know, thanks
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19:08<gbee>somehow the OSD came out better looking than the rest of the theme, if I could see how it would work, then I'd go back and redo the theme to match ;)
19:17<gbee>justinh: just had a look at QT4s SVG support, could offer the option to use SVG in themes and so no more ugly scaling artifacts
19:18<justinh>I'd love to see how gl scales textures on the fly
19:20<gbee>lets you render SVG direct to QImage, would be extremely easy to implement in mythui, at the prescaling phase we'd render the SVG to a PNG of the right size instead of rescaling a jpg/png/gif
19:21<justinh>well, if bling & effects are called for at any time some real-time scaling would be cool to have
19:22<rooau1>The OSD doesn't scale to the full 1680x1050 on my laptop, not sure why. I wonder if this has anything to do with the squashed OSD fonts, the OSD is around 1515 or so pixels wide.
19:23<gbee>no idea how fast loading and rendering SVG would be with QT, if it's fast enough, then we could do away with the prescaling phase
19:23<justinh>yeah but.. being limited to pure vectors is er.. limiting
19:24<gbee>freemono ... *shudder*
19:24<justinh>and if the svg had gaussian blur.. I can't imagine that being speedy
19:25<gbee>not suggesting replacing the existing stuff with vector-only themes, just offering the possibility of using vector images to get better quality images
19:25<rooau1>gbee: This is just my laptop, that is a dummy capture card, don't actually use it for anything but testing :)
19:26<justinh>well, just cos it's a vector doesn't mean it's better ;) seen some bloody awful svg icons in my quest to find stuff to pinch for my themes
19:26<justinh>I know what your angle is though, and I agree
19:26<justinh>svg can include bitmaps too FWIW
19:27<justinh>gbee: take it to its logical extension. svg is xml, right.. theme layouts are xml...
19:28<gbee>rooau1: so it happens to all OSDs? - 1680x1050 is an odd aspect, it probably doesn't know what to do with it
19:28<gbee>justinh: heh
19:29<gbee>at least you know what I'm getting at, that it's the scaling which SVG does well and which would most benefit themes in mythtv
19:29<rooau1>gbee: Yeah, tried a couple of different OSDs. Only noticed it on the laptop, but many monitors that people use now would be 1680x1050.
19:30<gbee>rooau1: mind opening a ticket for that?
19:30<gbee>don't think I'll get to look at it this weekend, but maybe someone else will be able to
19:30<justinh>gbee: unless the bitmaps start life as 1280x720 :D
19:31<gbee>justinh: yeah, if you use embedded bitmaps then you'll not see the benefits - thought tracing them might work if they are simple enough
19:31<rooau1>gbee: No probs, is there any further info I should attach? I will have a bit of a look over the code at some point and see if I can spot anything.
19:32<justinh>gbee: tracing sucks. been there, tried that
19:32<gbee>rooau1: did that happen before my recent OSD changes in svn? [14933]
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19:33<hads>gbee: Just noticed a commercial notification that said "Commercial: 3:2"
19:33<gbee>justinh: it does suck, though I've managed to get reasonable results a couple of times by increasing the number of passes to a very high figure
19:33<hads>Let me check with another OSD
19:35<rooau1>I think I noticed when looking at glass-wide OSD when it was released, didn't think anything of it then. I thought the OSD wasn't meant to go full width, keeping SS up to date sucks. Didn't notice any font kerning probs then though.
19:35<hads>Yes it appears to only be the Metallurgy OSD with that issue.
19:36<rooau1>hads: Interesting, Retro does it here as well. What res you using?
19:37<hads>rooau1: I didn't try retro actually. This is on a widescreen CRT, 720x576
19:38<gbee>hads: I don't use the commercial flagger, so I'm not sure what the problem is that you are describing?
19:39<hads>gbee: It's just an OSD popup with the current position indicator. I'll see if I can find the issue myself.
19:39<rooau1>lemme restart X and make sure I have messed anything up with xrandr...
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19:40<gbee>maybe I should setup a couple of flagging jobs
19:46<gbee>err, free space calculations are completely screwed on my backend at the moment, apparently I've only got one driver with over 2 million TB free
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19:51<justinh>gbee - you've had a visit from that future dude again mate. he must've left his atom-arranging HDD plugged into a spare usb port when he came back to get the source for Metallurgy (which proves to be pivotal in the battle against the machines)
19:52<gbee>you should sell the film rights to that story ;)
19:53<justinh><deepvoiceover>Stuart, a rookie theme designer suddenly finds his mythtv storage has inexplicably grown beyond the realms of current technology and finds himself in a battle which will change the future of humankind. FOREVER"
19:54<justinh>wtf did all that come from. oh man. I shouldn't be mixing dance music at this time of night. does things to the mind
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19:58<gbee>see that advert flagging works just as well as it did the last few times I tried, badly
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20:06<jams>gbee any idea how difficult it would be to add a tag to theme.xml so that menu txt is not displayed.
20:07<jams>setting it to 1 used to work, but seems they get bumped up now.
20:08<gbee>by menu text, you mean the "Watch TV" etc?
20:08<jams>i'm using images instead of text.
20:09<gbee>pretty easy I guess
20:09<gbee>jams: well as long as the images don't contain text, or you aren't bothered by translations, then it's doable
20:10<jams>yeah i'm aware of translations, and don't care about it
20:10<jams>and i don't want to display txt on the images.
20:10<jams>the images are the txt
20:10<gbee>jams: ok, I'll take a look at the best way of handling that
20:10<jams>thank you
20:11<gbee>I'd probably just set it so that omitting the <text> and <activetext> elements mean that no text is displayed
20:11<jams>i tried setting the font size to 0, but something checks for that and increases the font size
20:11<gbee>but let me look at the code first
20:13<jams>heh i just deleted the text and activetext blocks, and it seems to work
20:14<jams>yeah it's working..thanks gbee
20:14<jams>now thats service!
20:15<gbee>telepathic manipulation of the code. It's a gift of mine ;)
20:15<jams>i was fully expecting a segfault
20:15<gbee>you should probably thank Chutt since it seems he anticipated this scenario
20:17<jams>i shall
20:18<jams>looking nice, hopefully people will enjoy the updated version of midnight
20:18<justinh>btw gbee did you see the gadget show this week? nice prizes again
20:19<gbee>haven't watched it yet
20:19<gbee>still haven't got over my disappointment of not winning last time
20:19<justinh>saturday's edition has the woman at a rave dancing on half the picture all the way through
20:20<justinh>but I need another tuner to be able to record it on mondays
20:22<gbee>cool, found a recording where flagging found the start of the programme - first time I've ever seen it markup anything correctly
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20:22<justinh>are all those lovely 'playback' flags in the stream yet?
20:23<gbee>they are supposed to be, the gadget show was trialling a capable DVR last week which suggests it's gone live
20:24<rooaus>gbee: Saw this in my log "2007-11-25 12:13:38.825 OSD Theme Dimensions W: 1280 H: 720 | 2007-11-25 12:13:38.839 Error: already have a font called: small" using metallurgy OSD.
20:27<gbee>rooaus: thanks, fixed, don't think it will cause a problem though
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20:52<rooaus>gbee: See the same OSD scaling issue with r14932 FYI.
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23:17<map777>When debugging mythtv plugins in kdevelop should we add them as a sub project?
23:21<xris>map777: that's probably up to your personal preference.
23:26<map777>How do we get our development version of mythtv to search for our plugin libraries in a different directory?
23:36<map777>xris is there a better way to debug plugins than symlink our development plugin shared object to /usr/lib/mythtv/plugins?
23:40<xris>map777: I just edit the files.... vim, nano, jedit, etc.
23:41<GreyFoxx>same here, and I just do a make install inbetween compiles
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23:41<GreyFoxx>if it's one of the regular libs I use LD_PRELOAD to load mine rather than the installed libmythtv or whichever
23:41<xris>I build an rpm from the code to install.. easier to uninstall that way
23:43<map777>do you use gdm command line or via a gui?
23:43<GreyFoxx>commandline most of the time
23:43<GreyFoxx>sometimes I'll use kdbg
23:43<GreyFoxx>but usually just gdb at thge commandline
23:44<GreyFoxx>I assume you meant gdb and not gdm
23:47<map777>yes i did
23:49<jams>GreyFoxx- any ideas on how to send a "mouse click" from the command line?
23:50<GreyFoxx>hmmmm can;t say I've ever seen anyone send one via a cmdline util
23:51<jams>or more to the point, a command line utility that will let me take a snapshot of the current window
23:51<GreyFoxx>import -window root file.jpg
23:51<GreyFoxx>or file.png
23:51<GreyFoxx>after you set the DISPLAY variable of course :)
23:51<jams>that gets only the current window?
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23:51<jams>let me try
23:51<GreyFoxx>nope, the -window root gets the whole thing
23:52<jams>ah i want only the current window
23:52<GreyFoxx>but you can specify specific windows
23:52<GreyFoxx>so without the -window root it might get just current
23:53<jams>nope it sits there wiating for me to click on something
23:54<jams>let me try with the window id
23:55<jams>first i need to find out how to find the window id
23:56<jams>there we go
23:57<jams>well close enough i suppose, thanks GreyFoxx
---Logclosed Sun Nov 25 00:00:09 2007