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#mythtv IRC Logs for 2007-12-02

---Logopened Sun Dec 02 00:00:02 2007
---Daychanged Sun Dec 02 2007
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00:05<rooaus>xris: Nice work :) Couple of small issues in FF if you are interested?
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00:07<xris>rooaus: I'm running, what's the glitch?
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00:10<rooaus>xris: The #index_header2 float right has dropped below #index_header with normal text zoom setting.
00:11<xris>what res monitor?
00:11<rooaus>want a ss?
00:11<xris>doesn't do it for me at any res
00:11<xris>try a shift-reload first
00:14<rooaus>cleared cache, still the same.
00:20<hads>xris: Colours look nicer than before. Here's what it looks like in Konqueror;
00:21<xris>something about percentage widths not lining up
00:21<xris>I'll just set it to pixel widths at some point, then
00:26<rooaus>hads: Sorry 'bout that before, must have got you mixed up with someone else... thought you also saw the issue with Metallurgy OSD not rendered full screen width.
00:27<hads>rooaus: Sweet as. Sorry I can't help out.
00:27<hads>Everytime I look at that OSD I like it more and more.
00:34<hads>gbee: On my display I'm seeing about 2px or so of gap underneath the program info display on Metallury OSD. I'm trying to figure it out but don't know my way through the XML files.
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00:36<xris>rooaus: how's it look now?
00:37<rooaus>"Like a bought one."
00:37<hads>Better here 'cept the bottom bar.
00:40<xris>hads: reload
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00:42<hads>xris: Now it's aligned right :) It works if I put a 100% width on #footer
00:42<xris>I like to avoid that because IE doesn't like some percentages.
00:42<rooaus>The drop menu doesn't line up with the edge of the "About MythTV" same as in the prev ss, is it meant too?
00:43<hads>xris: Yup, that got it.
00:43<xris>rooaus: I haven't tried to do that yet
00:43<xris>probably should
00:46<xris>there, that was easy. 10px off
00:49<rooaus>heh, nice when it is that simple ;)
00:57<xris>wow, I think I actually have all of the pages figured out.. meaning, I know which pages we need to have.
01:21[~]xris pulls up vmware to see what that page looks like in IE
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01:39<xris>I hate IE
01:45<xris>I REALLY hate IE
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02:00<t0ny-p40>xris, I hate IE too.
02:00<t0ny-p40>So much pain it has caused to me.
02:01<xris>it doesn't like the new menu system I made for
02:05<t0ny-p40>I wish I could do some coding, but my hands hurt :(
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02:27<clever>what area of the myth code does mythtv detect that it reached the end of a recording?
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03:21<justinh>probably recordedseek, at a guess
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06:01<justinh>ooo nice xris
06:17<gbee>colours look better
06:17<gbee>justinh: did you get your JD last night then?
06:21<justinh>yeah. and vodka, and then some JD and some vodka. just about sobered up now
06:22<justinh>well, whatever I was doing yesterday continues, and at least now I know my svideo cable is good
06:22<justinh>maybe I'm just not running new enough xorg & intel drivers
06:22<justinh>compiling X shouldn't take too long on this machine anyway
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06:23<gbee>tried a fresh install of gutsy?
06:23<justinh>no not yet
06:24<justinh>dunno what, if any diff that'd make though
06:24<laga>justinh: i can upload a newer intel driver for you
06:25<justinh>I'd appreciate the chance to try that. I'm not keen on defeat
06:25<laga>ok, wait a second
06:26<justinh>I think it's a problem with the xorg version and/or driver cos xrandr isn't outputting the right guff
06:28<laga>xrandr 1.2 is quite nifty. played with it yesterday.. of course, ubuntu's displayconfig tools are still written for xinerama, but oh well
06:29<laga>justinh: if you get odd display artefacts, add Option "AccelMethod" "XAA"
06:31<justinh>dependency issue here, laga
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09:50<jarle>sorry if this is a stupid question, but wouldn't it make sense to have the configure script check that all needed development packages are installed, instead of waiting until running 'make' to fail compilation?
10:06<gbee>it would increase the size and complexity of configure, but if the patch was submitted then it would probably be applied
10:12<jarle>gbee: I have just been used to the configure script first checking that everything is in place, so I was a bit taken by surprise when I had to run make over and over again, installing a new missing -dev package between each run :)
10:14<gbee>the plugin configure script does check, but no-one has done the same for the main configure
10:15<gbee>jarle: running make multiple times doesn't take longer than running it once, since it continues building at the point it stopped before
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10:17<janneg>jarle: huh, what's missing besides qt?
10:20<jarle>gbee: yeah, I know, but for someone not used to compiling it would be a bit more userfriendly with a more informative feedback than just: "ld couldn't find -lqt-mt" (or something like that..
10:21<jarle>janneg: freetype (but this was discovered by configure), missing libqt-mt and libXxf86vm was failing make..
10:22<laga>ah, you were referring to the configure checks
10:23<jarle>laga: or the lack of such checks actually...
10:25<jarle>laga: but it is not something important, I was just curious why mythtv did not have as comprehensive configure script as mplayer for example...
10:25<gbee>not a design choice that I'm aware of, just that no-one has written it
10:26<janneg>actually I tink we check for qt. where do we need libXf86vm
10:28<jarle>janneg: not sure where it is used, but it was when compiling the main mythtv package it was needed
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10:31<gbee>mythtv/libs/libmythtv/videoout_xv.cpp:58:#include <X11/extensions/xf86vmode.h>
10:31<gbee>mythtv/configure:3275: echo "CONFIG_XV_LIBS=-lXinerama -lXv -lX11 -lXext -lXxf86vm" >> $MYTH_CONFIG_MAK
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12:27<gbee>rooaus: have you seen Daniel's reply to your OSD scaling ticket in the -dev list?
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13:45<gbee>anyone think of a way to have a plugin (MythDialog) fail gracefully if a required theme item is missing? I thought MythDialog::reject(); would be enough, but apparently not
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13:47<gbee>actually, nevermind, I can see what needs to be done
13:51<justinh>no more segfaults (tm) ? ;)
13:51<justinh>gbee: just played a 720p h.264 mov from the bbc motion gallery. 30% cpu.. I can't believe it
13:52<gbee>justinh: that's what I was hoping for (no segfaults) but I must be missing something since I can't get MythDialog to close gracefully
13:53<gbee>justinh: very nice, I'm jealous
13:53<gbee>1080p is the real test though
13:53<justinh>grabbing some 1080 clips now
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13:56<justinh>no way way way! mplayer without threading is playing it
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13:57<justinh>ok so X isn't running at a HD res..
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13:57<gbee>justinh: doesn't really matter, still able to decode it :)
13:58<justinh>I can't find the page with the links to bbc hd streams
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14:00<gbee>just can't see what I'm missing here - calling reject() should exit from the dialogue, but instead it keeps running
14:01[~]justinh laughs. 45'C playing 1080p h.264
14:01<laga>justinh: how's the tv-out?
14:02<justinh>laga: great now. just have to work out how the hell to get it to do that every boot
14:02<justinh>playing some HD clips now
14:06[~]gbee turns green
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14:16<gbee>justinh: "2007-12-02 19:15:41.674 Unable to parse themeinfo.xml for glass-wide"
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14:26<gbee>can't see the problem, the syntax is a little out of date but the structure looks fine, just gets rejected by the QT XML parser
14:27<gbee>ahh, I see it - end tag had a type
14:29<gbee>not worth fixing at the moment, since it will break the OSD
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15:00<asathoor>can I use one pc as a server - and stream tv to my LAN?
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15:00[~]justinh points at the topic
15:00<asathoor>i'd like to watch tv on my laptop
15:01<jarle_>asathoor: try repeating the question in #mythtv-users...
15:01<asathoor>ok, sorry & thax
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15:26<xris>gbee: ping
15:37<gbee>xris: hi
15:37<xris>colors should be a little better now
15:37<gbee>definite improvement, saw it in the logs earlier, looking very good
15:38<xris>if you wanted to look into icons, we need some to go in the quick links box on the main page, and might be nice to have some for the menu bar (at least the main sections)
15:39<gbee>I'd probably make the bottom banner smaller, closer to the height of the menu bar up top
15:39<xris>and then the "mythtv in detail" article will need a bunch of stuff, but I'll ask the respective devs to write something up for their own section.
15:39<gbee>but that's my only criticism
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15:39<xris>I can make it smaller.. we're sort of stuck with the logo sizes for the sponsors.
15:39<xris>simech logo will probably turn green for the final version because that's what marketing has been pushing lately
15:40<gbee>xris: yeah, doesn't need to go much smaller, just a few pixels
15:40<xris>that's easy enough
15:40<gbee>I'll play with icon ideas tonight
15:41<xris>reload for slightly smaller
15:42<gbee>much better
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15:42<gbee>only subtle change but the top/bottom seem better balanced
15:43<gbee>for the icons, where you thinking text buttons or icons alongside the text?
15:43<xris>icons next to text
15:43<xris>that way control-f and search engines will still work properly
15:45<gbee>sure, I would have said the same if you were thinking of buttons, but you know what you are doing ;)
15:47<xris>yeah, buttons should be all in one.
15:47<xris>but I'm not a big fan of images-as-text when real text works just as well
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15:56<rooaus>gbee: Not yet, just on my way to work, will check it there.
15:56<xris>oh, we should probably add a FAQ, too
15:56<xris>things like "why isn't there a 'donate' link?"
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16:59<gbee>this is hard, I started with the quick links icons but I wasn't getting anywhere, so I gave a go at an idea for the menu bar
17:01<gbee>the idea there is that the images lie behind the text, so the text itself isn't part of the image ...
17:02<gbee>works a little better with the shine at the top
17:03[~]gbee goes to try some other ideas
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17:06<xris>gbee: easy to add a background image like that... light from the top is probably better given that's how most people's eyes expect things to look
17:07<xris>if you want, go ahead and make me a transparent png of just the shiny white bits and I'll drop it into the site.
17:07<xris>should be fine with a single image
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17:26<xris>css is fun. :)
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17:28<xris>not sure whether I prefer left or right shine
17:30<xris>I think it may have to be left shine because of the light effects on the mythtv logo
17:36<Chutt>xris, i don't know why, but the fonts on there are all non-AA
17:37<Chutt>no anti-aliasing
17:37<Chutt>they're jaggie
17:37<xris>odd.. they are for me
17:38<xris>some of the fonts might be too small for AA, though
17:38<Chutt>no, they're all big enough
17:38<Chutt>they're larger than most of the fonts in other windows on my screen, which are all AA'd
17:47<xris>that's all controlled client-side, though... no css settings for antialias
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18:05<xris>hmm, this one is pretty
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18:07<justinh>xris: way better than anything I mocked up so far - I really like it
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18:09<xris>except that it's not particularly practical
18:10<xris>at least, not for how would best be laid out
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18:23<gbee>the lack of space makes icons difficult -
18:24<justinh>small icons are very very tricky
18:25<justinh>one bit of advice xris gave me was to stop scaling bigger images down &start at the pixel level
18:25<justinh>use a svg template as a guide if you like though
18:27<gbee>I'm drawing these actual size, but the problem is finding something that represents the link and can be recognisable at that scale
18:28<justinh>yep. that's the kink with icons
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18:29<gbee>there are a few things that could represent "news archive" but few that would be recognisable in a 21x21 pixel icon
18:33<xris>gbee: or just make them bigger.. for the quicklinks section, you could aim for 24x or 32x pixels
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18:42<hads>xris: Have you finished with the backgrounds on the navigation? This is what I see;
18:43<gbee>went to 25x25 (even number might be better ... ) and flipped the shine:
18:44<xris>ah, interesting... my firefox stretches to fit, or something.. annoying
18:44<gbee>xris: just let me know if I'm on the right track and if not, whether you've got a specific style in mind
18:45<xris>I like the monochrome icons.. not sure what I think about the shiny bits
18:45<xris>hads: I'll make sure it gets cleaned up before any final version happens
18:46<gbee>xris: shine on the icons or the menu bar? or both?
18:47<xris>gbee: I guess I meant the blue bubble stuff.
18:47<xris>I'm not in love with the menu bar shine, either, but it looks better than without it
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18:52<xris>gbee: I'm a bigger fan of subtle.. been staring at while designing things.
18:53<xris>that wouldn't work great for mythtv, but I've always liked their designer's style.
18:53<gbee>ok, in this one I've removed the glassy effect, then picked a range of backgrounds - first section graded, second section solid with a choice of colours:
18:53<gbee>xris: ok, I'll take a look at that, maybe it will give me some ideas
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18:53<xris>they don't really have icons anymore, though
18:54<xris>it boils down to me really not knowing what I want, artistically
18:54<xris>the mockup collection is here:
18:55<xris>jeanphilippe and lundin styles are my current favs
18:56<xris>but studies show that light text on dark background tends to push people away from websites... even though it's easier on the eyes, people who aren't used to it unconsciously don't want to spend time looking at it
18:57<hads>Hadn't seen lundin, looks nice.
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19:04<xris>hads: yeah, he sent it to the mailing list last month -- I just posted it today
19:06<xris>should be relatively easy to tweak his style a bit to fit the current needs, though
19:10<justinh>blimey. BBCHD is launched already.. er yesterday even
19:15[~]justinh goes to bed, safe in the knowledge that he's this close '' to being able to play BBC HD real time. only need a dvb-s card & dish now... oh gawd
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19:32<gbee>xris, I'm starting to go in circles now, so I'll start fresh tomorrow, think the menu bar in this one is an improvement:
19:32<gbee>whether it's any closer to what you want is another question :)
19:32[~]hads agrees
19:36<gbee>as far as the icons go, the wiki and news archive images are weak and I'll try to think of a better way of representing those
19:37<gbee>the shadow I've tried on the icons at the bottom could work, but might be too subtle in this version
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19:47<gbee>there is something I saw when looking at pigdin screenshots which I might try tomorrow
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20:18<orkid>is it possible to have a mythtv 'server' remotely, and use it from a local computer, like vnc ?
20:19<orkid>i'm guessing it's possible, but wanted to make sure before i make plans for an installation. would i be also able to use an IR remote (for example) that sends a signal to the client, and this is sent to the server?
20:20<kormoc>orkid, please read the topic *and* the notice you received when you joined this channel
20:21<orkid>sigh. it scrolled by . ty and sorry.
20:21<orkid>i didn't get a notice, just the topic, btw :S
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22:43<xris>justinh: you still awake?
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---Logclosed Mon Dec 03 00:00:56 2007