| --- | Log | opened Fri Aug 29 00:00:40 2008 |
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| 01:33 | <obake-san> | hey, i want to connect a video game console to my pc using mythtv, is there a way to set it so the composite input does not have the delay? i assume that would mean that it would not record the composite input |
| 01:33 | <obake-san> | i already tried using tvtime just for the video games, but it doesnt support my card |
| 01:57 | <clever_> | yet another person trying to do that! |
| 01:57 | <obake-san> | heh |
| 01:57 | <clever_> | no way to make live tv lag free |
| 01:57 | <obake-san> | everything iv read says no |
| 01:58 | <obake-san> | but i figured id check |
| 01:58 | <clever_> | what card? |
| 01:58 | <obake-san> | cant get xawtv or motv to work either |
| 01:58 | <obake-san> | wintv pvr150 |
| 01:58 | <clever_> | thats works just fine under tvtime |
| 01:58 | <obake-san> | it gives an error about ivtv |
| 01:58 | <clever_> | tv out also? |
| 01:59 | <obake-san> | and on the tvtime website it says ivtv isnt supported |
| 01:59 | <obake-san> | well, tv out is on the normal video card |
| 01:59 | <cesman> | obake-san: please take it to the user channel |
| 01:59 | <clever_> | just bypass the whole computer then |
| 01:59 | <clever_> | hook the game console into a 2nd input on the tv |
| 02:00 | <obake-san> | oh, i didnt even see that in the topic |
| 02:00 | <clever_> | cesman: maybe it should be in bright colors? |
| 02:01 | <cesman> | color don't matter if people don't read |
| 02:01 | <clever_> | but it would be more eye catching to draw your attention |
| 02:01 | <clever_> | and posibly make more people read |
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| 03:53 | <justinh> | laga: I can't remember what license I originally used. I can't even look in my subversion log since I started it again |
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| 03:56 | <justinh> | clever_: wild horses couldn't get some people to notice. If they're not paying attention (and lets face it most of the questions people ask when they first join the channel could be answered with ONE google query)... |
| 03:57 | <clever_> | yeah |
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| 04:34 | <justinh> | anyway.. happy Friday :) |
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| 04:37 | <stuarta> | yay for friday |
| 04:37 | -!- | stuarta is now known as fred_basset |
| 04:45 | * | justinh shakes his fist at this version of inkscape for not having a layer dialog |
| 04:46 | <justinh> | .. and at the person who nicked the remote for the 32" LCD monitor again.. grrr |
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| 05:25 | <laga> | justinh: you used Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 3.0 Unported |
| 05:32 | <justinh> | well, it could now be that "do whatever the heck you want" license. GPL will do. I really don't care if anybody tries to pass it off or whatever |
| 05:33 | <laga> | alright then |
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| 05:49 | <justinh> | I'm redoing glass-wide in svg. rather laborious but keeps me off the streets |
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| 05:50 | <stuarta> | justinh: you should get a job doing that |
| 05:50 | <laga> | justinh: would you be OK with me changing the background back to cinema.png? i don't want people complaining because the theme looks different |
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| 05:51 | <justinh> | laga: yeah sure, but some stuff needs to have the contrast improved for that to work better - unless you just darken cinema.png a little |
| 05:51 | <laga> | hum |
| 05:51 | <laga> | not sure i can do that with a simple patch system ;) |
| 05:52 | <justinh> | see how it works for you. I'm never sure about contrast on my laptop monitor |
| 05:52 | <laga> | will do |
| 05:52 | <laga> | it worked well with the older release |
| 05:53 | <justinh> | trying it here over my freenx server |
| 05:55 | <justinh> | I think the only fault, if you could call it that is the number buttons in mythmusic's play screen |
| 05:55 | <laga> | not enough contrast? |
| 05:55 | <justinh> | yeah that, and the progress indicator. red on red |
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| 05:57 | <justinh> | some of those watermarks are damn awful but nobody ever complained ;) |
| 05:57 | <laga> | my progress bar is blue |
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| 05:57 | <justinh> | really? lol |
| 05:57 | <justinh> | did you edit it yourself? |
| 05:57 | <laga> | the theme? no |
| 05:58 | <laga> | i blame my qt theme |
| 05:58 | <justinh> | oh no I meant the music progress indicator |
| 05:58 | <laga> | ah |
| 05:58 | <justinh> | a quick 90 degree colour phase shift with imagemagick would fix that ;) |
| 05:59 | <justinh> | I need to get into scripting to help produce my graphics en-mass |
| 05:59 | <justinh> | that way I could just export all the graphics & composite them in a script |
| 06:00 | <justinh> | either that or just take advantage of more layering in the ui |
| 06:03 | <justinh> | in PSP9 I just slapped everything in one file on loads of layers. each watermark was a layer group on top of the base layers. enable one group at a time & save as.. blech |
| 06:05 | <gbee> | that's how I did the icons in metallurgy |
| 06:05 | <gbee> | change the background even a little and .... :( |
| 06:06 | <gbee> | so in mythui land I'll layer it, which will allow making change the colour scheme easier |
| 06:07 | * | justinh wonders if a <chroma> attribute would be possible to produce mono graphics |
| 06:07 | <gbee> | heh, already thought of that :) |
| 06:07 | <justinh> | ok then.. a <sepia> attribute :P |
| 06:08 | <gbee> | :p |
| 06:11 | <laga> | justinh: hum, the progress bar is barely noticeable, but it's there ;) |
| 06:14 | <justinh> | must be some kind of record that I've not got sick of that theme yet |
| 06:24 | <laga> | justinh: what color would you suggest for the mythmusic progress indicator when used with cinema.png? |
| 06:24 | <justinh> | blue or green would stand out better |
| 06:25 | <justinh> | infact green might be better altogether |
| 06:25 | <laga> | yeah |
| 06:25 | <laga> | ah, it's an image. i hoped it was just a color definition in the XML |
| 06:29 | <laga> | is it correct that the core themes don't have the progressindicator container? |
| 06:29 | <justinh> | laga http://homepage.ntlworld.com/justin.hornsby2/screenshots/progress-filler.png :) |
| 06:29 | <justinh> | laga: probably. I never got round to them |
| 06:29 | <laga> | thanks |
| 06:30 | <laga> | consider yourself hugged :) |
| 06:30 | <laga> | hum, i'll rename the old one and add a README.debian |
| 06:30 | <justinh> | hope I don't turn into an advocate or anything ;) |
| 06:30 | <laga> | you'll be OK |
| 06:31 | <justinh> | or worse still, a community manager :P |
| 06:38 | <laga> | i'm afraid i need to uuencode that png for the package.. gah |
| 06:39 | <clever_> | this is weird |
| 06:39 | <clever_> | im watching plain tv |
| 06:39 | <clever_> | and i keep reaching for the mythtv keyboard to skip comercials:P |
| 06:40 | <clever_> | i allready spent 3mins trying to fix the keyboard before i remembered i wasnt even on the tvout |
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| 06:45 | <justinh> | laga: would it help if I just made a new tarball? |
| 06:45 | <laga> | no. now i've got it working :) |
| 06:47 | <justinh> | yeah the green works much betterer |
| 06:48 | <justinh> | reminds me I need to look at the EPG icons. they're green in the shared dir but on my frontend they come out red. wonder if the files are the same |
| 06:48 | <justinh> | heh now that'd be cool. stream themes from the backend |
| 06:48 | <laga> | yeah, it's much better now |
| 06:48 | <laga> | the german translation seems a bit big for the number buttons *sigh* |
| 06:48 | <laga> | i hope mythui will make stuff like that better |
| 06:49 | <justinh> | there was a patch to make those buttons graphical instead. I'd much prefer that |
| 06:51 | <gbee> | number buttons? |
| 06:53 | <justinh> | edit playlist, shuffle, etc |
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| 06:53 | <justinh> | gerrandomizationsehn .. or something ;) |
| 06:55 | <justinh> | putting text on those buttons makes them a bit of a waste of space with any language though |
| 06:57 | <gbee> | aye |
| 06:58 | <laga> | for future reference: make sure that the power cord is plugged in before removing the battery from the laptop |
| 06:59 | <gbee> | it's hard to see how mythui might handle longer strings in some translations any better than the old ui - scaling the buttons to fit the text is out since it will screw up layouts |
| 06:59 | <laga> | shrink the text size? |
| 06:59 | <laga> | show the full text if the button is highlighted? |
| 06:59 | <justinh> | icons are universal :) |
| 06:59 | <gbee> | maybe |
| 07:00 | <justinh> | use them wherever possible :) |
| 07:00 | <gbee> | I prefer visual representations though, like justinh said |
| 07:00 | <gbee> | a big green tick for OK, big red X for cancel etc |
| 07:00 | <justinh> | or, just make everybody learn English. muhahahah |
| 07:02 | <justinh> | hrm. seems I never got around to theming the miniplayer for glass-wide |
| 07:10 | <justinh> | ooo. flickr have an API. that gives me another 'todo' idea |
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| 07:52 | <justinh> | heh. I had this big-shot idea to rearrange the 'watch recordings' menus but I can't think of a way to get them all on one menu key & not be a mess |
| 07:56 | <gbee> | I think some of the search screens could be combined |
| 07:56 | <justinh> | I think judicious grouping could make my plan possible and keep clutter down |
| 07:57 | <justinh> | for my own purposes I'd rather have programme details available without having to go into recording options |
| 07:58 | <gbee> | justinh: press i |
| 07:58 | <justinh> | yeah that's on the 'i' menu |
| 07:58 | <justinh> | I'd much rather 'i' represented 'info' |
| 07:59 | <gbee> | uh? hmm I must have rebound things, i here goes direct to the programme details |
| 07:59 | <justinh> | as in select a show, press I & see programme details |
| 07:59 | <gbee> | yeah, that's how I have it setup |
| 08:00 | <justinh> | the default is this.. press M when a group is selected & see the 'group (ish)' menu |
| 08:00 | <justinh> | press I when a show is selected & see 'play, add to playlist, mark as watched, yada yada' |
| 08:00 | <gbee> | DETAILS binding in the TV playback context |
| 08:00 | <justinh> | you know I never even considered it'd be possible to use keybindings |
| 08:01 | <gbee> | err, "TV Frontend" |
| 08:01 | <justinh> | having 2 separate menu keys seems counter-intuitive still though |
| 08:01 | <gbee> | true |
| 08:01 | <gbee> | we should only have one menu on each screen, I'm definately behind that |
| 08:02 | <justinh> | now I can't remember what the menu patch I sent ages ago does |
| 08:02 | <justinh> | was something to do with options vs actions IIRC. let's see |
| 08:03 | <justinh> | ah yes |
| 08:04 | <justinh> | #4743 |
| 08:04 | <clever> | just fork bombed myself! |
| 08:09 | <justinh> | gbee: I once saw you say you'd read somewhere that more than 6 menu items is a v. bad idea. there are way more than that in some menus. do you have any thoughts on reducing the vertical area? |
| 08:10 | <justinh> | grouping is one way but that can be bad for inducing submenu hell |
| 08:10 | <justinh> | context can help to an extent but it's not always possible |
| 08:10 | <gbee> | don't remember that, although I might have been talking about the main menus were most themes assume ~6 items |
| 08:11 | <gbee> | I wouldn't enforce just six in other menus |
| 08:11 | <justinh> | heh |
| 08:11 | <justinh> | I think a good limit is 8 or 9 as far as what'll comfortably fit with a decent font size |
| 08:11 | <gbee> | sure |
| 08:12 | <gbee> | I've already grouped the mythvideo menus that way |
| 08:13 | <justinh> | I'll do some mockups & take a peek at the code to have a go at trying the ideas out for real. I know they'll be going the way of mythui eventually but it's only to try possible alternative layouts |
| 08:14 | <justinh> | I can imagine there being some resistance to the idea too |
| 08:14 | <gbee> | ok, changed the log version string to "2008-08-29 13:12:55.004 mythfrontend version: trunk [18225M] www.mythtv.org" and made it the first entry in the log |
| 08:14 | <justinh> | I can but try :) |
| 08:15 | <justinh> | well, time to do some real work. got some samples of a new IR receiver to test |
| 08:15 | <gbee> | justinh: go for it, it needs doing |
| 08:17 | <laga> | gbee: is there any special font i need for your theme? i've already got vera sans covered |
| 08:20 | <gbee> | Bitstream Vera Sans is the only font used |
| 08:21 | <gbee> | fonts are all defined in base.xml |
| 08:21 | <gbee> | err, theme.xml in the 0.21 version |
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| 08:21 | <laga> | thanks |
| 08:22 | <gbee> | may switch it to Dejavu Sans in future (Bitstream Vera Sans but better license and more supported chars) |
| 08:22 | <justinh> | better kerning too :D |
| 08:23 | <laga> | gbee: when did you start working on that theme? i'm supposed to put a year in the copyright file ;) |
| 08:23 | <laga> | c) 2008 Stuart Morgan <stuart@tase.co.uk> |
| 08:23 | <gbee> | late 2007 |
| 08:24 | <laga> | so it's 2007, 2008 |
| 08:24 | <gbee> | yeah |
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| 08:24 | <gbee> | think I started work in November and final-ish version was released in Jan |
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| 08:32 | <laga> | gbee: the osd will live in a separate package. does that just need the osd.xml and the osd subdir? |
| 08:33 | <gbee> | laga: needs the themeinfo.xml too |
| 08:33 | <gbee> | think that's it ... I'll check |
| 08:33 | <justinh> | oh bugger you just reminded me of an unreported bug in glass-wide. one of the OSD graphics needs to be changed. I based it on projectgayhem-osd & forgot to redo one file |
| 08:34 | <laga> | oh, that's ugly. that'd require some patching.. |
| 08:34 | <laga> | ah, let's do it ;) |
| 08:34 | <justinh> | might not manage it today, what with 'real' work getting in the way |
| 08:35 | <justinh> | I want to change the base res anyway |
| 08:35 | <justinh> | it's gone unnoticed for this long ;) |
| 08:35 | <laga> | haha |
| 08:36 | <justinh> | or maybe people are just scared to report problems :D |
| 08:37 | <justinh> | btw felt a pang of tinge of pride watching that latest systm 'mythtv' video |
| 08:38 | <gbee> | ok, osd.xml, themeinfo.xml, osd directory, osd_preview.png (renamed preview.png) should be enough |
| 08:39 | <gbee> | you'll need to edit themeinfo.xml for each, removing the <type> lines as necessary |
| 08:39 | <gbee> | otherwise it will show up twice in the settings |
| 08:39 | <justinh> | how does themeinfo.xml figure when the osd is combined with the main theme? |
| 08:39 | <justinh> | I should've sorted that when I did gw |
| 08:40 | <gbee> | <types><type>ui</type><type>osd</type><type>menu</type></types> |
| 08:40 | <justinh> | duh stupid me |
| 08:41 | <justinh> | eep. 11 screws hold this pcd in place when 4 would do if they had clips at one end |
| 08:42 | <gbee> | pcd? |
| 08:42 | <justinh> | pcb |
| 08:42 | <gbee> | :) |
| 08:44 | <laga> | gbee: yes, thanks |
| 08:45 | <justinh> | nobuddy round here has heard of design for manufacture, it seems |
| 08:46 | <gbee> | how about design for servicing? |
| 08:46 | <justinh> | even less so |
| 08:46 | <justinh> | you should see if insides of our cases |
| 08:46 | <justinh> | s/if/the |
| 08:48 | <justinh> | change a MMC card? oh sure. remove 23 screws to be able to take the lid off, remove lid, remove a fan, unplug 4 sata cables... |
| 08:48 | <justinh> | keeps people in jobs I guess :D |
| 08:50 | <justinh> | hrm, suppose if I edit themeinfo.xml to include the OSD it's going to bugger up the scaling cos it's not the same base res or aspect as the UI theme |
| 08:51 | <justinh> | I'll update the OSD first I think |
| 08:54 | <justinh> | laga: IIRC somebody wanted the scroller lowered didn't they? I'll take it to the bottom of the safe area when I update it |
| 08:55 | <justinh> | should be ready in time for Jinxed Jabberwork or whatever they're gonna call it |
| 08:55 | <laga> | ah, so no new tarball for intrepid |
| 08:55 | <justinh> | when would you need it by? |
| 08:57 | <laga> | september 11th, or september 25th |
| 08:57 | <laga> | but the latter is really pushing it |
| 08:57 | <justinh> | easy then. it'll be a week at most |
| 08:57 | <laga> | great |
| 08:58 | <laga> | ok |
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| 08:58 | <laga> | then stick the red filler thingy in there as well. you dont have to reference it in an xml, i can just copy it around |
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| 09:15 | <laga> | odd. i'm getting "Theme metallurgy-osd missing preview image.". |
| 09:16 | <laga> | gbee: http://laga.ath.cx/themeinfo.xml - here's my themeinfo.xml for the osd package. osd_preview.png is installed into ./usr/share/mythtv/themes/metallurgy-osd/osd_preview.png |
| 09:16 | <laga> | do you see anything odd with thatß |
| 09:16 | <gbee> | hmm, maybe I implemented that part of the code ... didn't think I have |
| 09:17 | <gbee> | laga: ahh, yeah I haven't implemented the osdpreview bit yet, the image needs to be renamed to preview.png |
| 09:18 | <laga> | okay, i can do tht. |
| 09:18 | <gbee> | or better yet, rename the attribute to "preview" instead of "osdpreview" |
| 09:18 | <laga> | oh, that saves me lots of work |
| 09:19 | <gbee> | the format of themeinfo.xml is ahead of the code |
| 09:22 | <laga> | thanks, works now |
| 09:26 | <justinh> | heh I'm really beginning to prefer inkscape over PSP now |
| 09:29 | <laga> | "removed: .bzrignore" |
| 09:29 | <laga> | "added: .bzrignore" - FFS, bzr! |
| 09:30 | <justinh> | hrrrr. no videos on my laptop to test the osd with :-\ |
| 09:32 | * | gbee ponders the irony of justinh working for a CCTV manufacturer but not having any video handy |
| 09:32 | <justinh> | *good quality videos* |
| 09:33 | <justinh> | oh wait I should have an image of a DVD I made here somewhere |
| 09:35 | <justinh> | bah none of it's 16:9 though |
| 09:38 | <justinh> | gbee: we have a choice here, some grotty feeds of the building cameras as analogue video, megapixel mjpeg webcams or stuff we record in some weird propriatary secure watermarked format. the viewer software can save as avi but that's not much cop |
| 09:39 | <justinh> | ahem. so concludes the sales pitch :P |
| 09:39 | <gbee> | ;) |
| 09:43 | <laga> | gbee: i wonder if XMLTV configs should live in the storage groups |
| 09:44 | <gbee> | if we go that route then arguably all configuration stuff should have a storage group |
| 09:45 | <anykey_> | yeah, like, mythvideo covers etc |
| 09:45 | <gbee> | for now just storing the absolute path to the config should be enough of a workaround/ |
| 09:45 | <gbee> | ? |
| 09:45 | <laga> | gbee: my priority right now is getting a fix for fixes, so.. what you said. |
| 09:46 | <laga> | ok, then i'll add a schema update to dbcheck.cpp to store the full path, add code to read that and fall back to the old behavior if there's no entry. |
| 09:46 | <laga> | .. in the database. |
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| 10:24 | <justinh> | gbee: had a wacked out idea at lunchtime btw for a kind of 'general' plugin. goes off & executes some program or other which returns data in a format we know about (say xml) & displays info onscreen. could be anything, program it calls could be written in any language. just a simple info page. could have some uses for people & be a sort of mega-simple plugin API. wouldn't have an immediate use for it myself but it coul |
| 10:26 | <gbee> | justinh: sounds good, has certain parallels with what I'm working on for xmltv configuration - they have an XML configuration API for getting configuration questions into an application UI and then answers back out |
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| 10:27 | <gbee> | so we translate that information into a user friendly UI and you no longer have to go to the console to setup xmltv |
| 10:27 | <laga> | justinh: MythPython? ;) |
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| 10:28 | <justinh> | laga: I thought mythpython was all about latching onto existing objects & making them accessible from outside |
| 10:29 | <laga> | yeah, python bindings for libmyth basically |
| 10:29 | <justinh> | what happened to it btw? |
| 10:29 | <laga> | not much i'm afraid :/ |
| 10:30 | <justinh> | this'd basically be simpler than that AFAIK |
| 10:30 | <laga> | sure |
| 10:30 | <justinh> | if your excuse for doing something like mythpython is that 'the bar for entry' is too high, don't block it with another language ;) |
| 10:30 | <laga> | maybe something distro maintainers could do.. think mythbuntu-control-centre in mythui |
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| 10:31 | <laga> | s/do/use/ |
| 10:32 | <gbee> | now we're cooking with gas |
| 10:33 | <jams> | yeah if only someone would do that .... |
| 10:33 | <justinh> | but then - and I have to confess I've never thought of it this way before - I think what some people really mean is "but we could just re-use other people's hard work with some minor tweaks" |
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| 10:36 | <laga> | justinh: that's the spirit of open source :) |
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| 10:57 | <janneg> | isn't a remote storage dir used if there is not enough space on the local one |
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| 11:00 | <gbee> | no? That would require the remote storage dir being nfs mounted I guess, since there is no backend to backend transfer than I'm aware of |
| 11:00 | <gbee> | it would be nice if it did work that way |
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| 11:05 | <gbee> | somehow I don't think that many trade shows will be held in Germany in future - http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/08/29/customs_raids_german_show/ |
| 11:05 | <gbee> | that's the third or fourth time in the last two years that German Police/Customs have effectively shutdown tradeshows by confiscating exhibited gear |
| 11:06 | <gbee> | how long before software patents are used to target Linuxtag etc? |
| 11:07 | <janneg> | gbee: remote means in this context a mounted network filesystem |
| 11:07 | <gbee> | janneg: ok, sorry I don't know then |
| 11:07 | <gbee> | Captain_Murdoch if he's around would know best |
| 11:08 | <janneg> | gbee: those raids started already a couple of years ago |
| 11:08 | <gbee> | janneg: yeah, like I said :) |
| 11:08 | <janneg> | and I think linuxtag is pretty save, at least for the projects |
| 11:09 | <janneg> | gbee: more than 2 |
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| 12:06 | <sphery> | janneg: Did you see http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/256679#256679 and http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/297293#297293 ? |
| 12:18 | <Dubstar_04> | MythCalc screenshot for feed back |
| 12:18 | <Dubstar_04> | http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n106/Dubstar_04/mythcalc.png |
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| 12:35 | <Dubstar_04> | http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n106/Dubstar_04/mythcalc-1.png |
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| 12:47 | <rockyroc1> | hi guys, i have Skystar2 (rev1) DVB card, can i use mythtv on Ubuntu 8.04.1 to watch DVB channels??? |
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| 13:38 | <Dubstar_04> | Updated screenshot for mythcalc (plugin-tutorial) |
| 13:38 | <Dubstar_04> | http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n106/Dubstar_04/mythcalc-2.png |
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| 13:42 | <laga> | looks pretty neat |
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| 13:58 | <teprrr> | Dubstar_04, btw, usually numbers are in their own group and +, -, *, % etc. are aligned right from them |
| 13:59 | <teprrr> | but don't know how that'd work with mythcalc though :) |
| 13:59 | <Dubstar_04> | I don't think the details really matter, as it is only meant as a tutorial |
| 14:00 | <Dubstar_04> | It does look odd |
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| 14:41 | <teprrr> | ok, just wanted to say that. looks simple enough for a nice tutorial indeed :) |
| 14:45 | <justinh> | looks like er.. a calcumulatorifier |
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| 14:58 | <the_alien> | the upnp server is up and running when i have mythtv installed, right? |
| 14:59 | <iamlindoro__> | see topic |
| 14:59 | <the_alien> | oh sorry |
| 15:00 | <justinh> | mmmm topic http://tinyurl.com/5533q4 |
| 15:00 | <iamlindoro__> | sweet delicious topic |
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| 15:18 | <gbee> | eww, topic |
| 15:20 | <gbee> | so I've spent the last couple of nights trying to work out a bug in mythuibuttontree, only it's not a bug there but one with mythgenerictree and the fact that it doesn't give nodes unique IDs making a mockery of the route setting stuff |
| 15:24 | <gbee> | or maybe it's more an issue with mythvideo, think that's probably a more accurate description |
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| 17:36 | <cojonuo> | Hello guys, now I have a API KEY for MiroGuide, soon add this to MythTube |
| 17:36 | <cojonuo> | but now I don't have free time :-( |
| 17:39 | <iamlindoro__> | cojonuo: You've done a really great job so far-- I hope you stick with it-- most people talk about making the plugins they want, you have worked very hard at it |
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| 17:43 | <iamlindoro__> | You should be proud of your work-- it has been a long time since someone did what you've done |
| 17:43 | <cojonuo> | thanks but now I need a small help |
| 17:45 | <cojonuo> | iamlindoro: can you fix my tube-ui.xml?? because I don't have time to do it :-) |
| 17:46 | <iamlindoro__> | cojonuo: What would you like done to it? |
| 17:46 | <iamlindoro__> | and -wide only, or both? |
| 17:46 | <cojonuo> | both |
| 17:46 | <iamlindoro__> | ok, tell me what is broken |
| 17:47 | <iamlindoro__> | I have some time this weekend, so I am happy to help |
| 17:48 | <cojonuo> | you send me a mail, about overscan |
| 17:49 | <cojonuo> | Now i send you my last tube-ui.xml |
| 17:50 | <iamlindoro__> | ah, ok... send me the whole current tarball if you like |
| 17:50 | <iamlindoro__> | I will adjust them this weekend |
| 17:50 | <cojonuo> | ok, thanks |
| 17:50 | <iamlindoro__> | maybe tonight when I am bored :) |
| 17:50 | <cojonuo> | you are robert MacNamaran?? |
| 17:50 | <iamlindoro__> | You are welcome, you are doing a very good job |
| 17:51 | <iamlindoro__> | yes |
| 17:51 | <cojonuo> | ok |
| 17:51 | <iamlindoro__> | well, close enough anyway :) |
| 17:56 | <cojonuo> | other question, about convert MythTube to official plugin, what is necessary?? any special thing?? |
| 17:57 | <cojonuo> | And other, To process MiroGuide request they use Python diccionary and I need add libPython to my program to evaluate it |
| 17:57 | <cojonuo> | MythTV now need libPython or MythTuve add a new requeriment?? |
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| 18:02 | <iamlindoro__> | I think the "official plugin" question is better left to the core group of guys in here, but I would guess that some of the requirements would be a) the code be clean and not too crashy, and 2) you would be willing to maintain it when something breaks |
| 18:03 | <iamlindoro__> | I don't believe that libpython is currently a Myth dependency, but a new one wouldn't be the end of the world |
| 18:04 | <cojonuo> | ok |
| 18:05 | <iamlindoro__> | Out of curiosity, cojonuo, if MythTube became an official plugin, are you okay with continuing to support and develop it? |
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| 18:13 | <tdseth> | hey all. can someone tell me how to add netflix to my mythtv install in ubuntu? |
| 18:21 | <iamlindoro__> | see topic |
| 18:23 | <tdseth> | oh, I see. thanks. |
| 18:25 | <iamlindoro__> | speaking of which, if Mythflix with its need to pull out RSS information and insert it directly into the DB with mysql can become an official plugin, then there *must* be hope for MythTube ;) |
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| 18:44 | <gbee> | I don't see the parallel :) |
| 18:46 | <gbee> | speaking personally I'd be happier if we didn't add a dependancy on Python - I know MythArchive already uses it, but perl is already more widely used and does the same job |
| 18:47 | <gbee> | I recognise that I'm probably in a minority on that point |
| 18:49 | <gbee> | and this isn't an anti-python thing, even though I'm not it's biggest fan, it's just about keep dependencies down |
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| 18:52 | <justinh> | heh. mythbrowser pulls in half of kde |
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| 18:54 | <gbee> | used to, doesn't anymore |
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| 18:55 | <sphery> | gbee: if the dependency is only in MythTube, then it could be disabled just like MythArchive--at least until some Python-hater writes a Perl replacement/alternate script :) |
| 18:55 | <gbee> | and mythmusic hopefully won't pull in libmad, libfaad, libvorbis and libogg among others in 0.22, mythgallery no longer pulls in libtiff etc |
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| 18:57 | <gbee> | sphery: oh I agree that's probably what will happen, but suggesting that it be would better to write everything in perl from the start ;) |
| 18:58 | <gbee> | like I said, I doubt enough people will agree with me to change things |
| 18:58 | <iamlindoro__> | Then again, if his only option to add the feature is a set of python bindings, he's sort of limited optionwise |
| 19:02 | <gbee> | not sure where the python bit comes in, you have to use some python library they provide? Seems strange |
| 19:02 | <justinh> | what about just not having miroguide? that an option? |
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| 19:07 | <gbee> | I think disabling certain grabbers based on finding python installed is definately an option, but packagers will still want everything enabled so most poor sods will still need to install a ton of packages |
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| 19:19 | <rooaus> | cojonuo: I had an idea for mythtube... I was going to try and add a "-n" option to the grabber scripts to return a "pretty" grabber name, then use that in the UI in the selection box. Also could use the "-i" return for a grabber description. What do you think? |
| 19:20 | <rooaus> | ^^^ Inspired by the way the tv_find_grabber stuff works in mythtv-setup. Seems a nice alternative to "script1.pl" "script2.pl" etc |
| 19:21 | <gbee> | mythweather does that, works well |
| 19:21 | <gbee> | also returns author and version information |
| 19:22 | <rooaus> | gbee: Cool, another place to steal code from (pattern code on) :D I was worried about the threading stuff, but I guess I just need to try it. |
| 19:23 | <cojonuo> | is a good idea |
| 19:23 | <cojonuo> | the -n and -i |
| 19:23 | <cojonuo> | please to no forgot send me on trac |
| 19:23 | <cojonuo> | ok?? |
| 19:24 | <rooaus> | cojonuo: ok, will see what I can do. |
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| 19:24 | <cojonuo> | about python, I need it because MiroGuide provide me a python diccionary on your API request |
| 19:25 | <rooaus> | gbee: I guess I will need to use the data (QVariant) stuff for mythuibuttonitem? ie Store the pretty name in the text and the actual script name in the data part, is that correct? |
| 19:25 | <cojonuo> | and need use function "eval" to evalueate it, if any body know other mothod... |
| 19:26 | <cojonuo> | (eval is a python funtion) |
| 19:26 | <gbee> | rooaus: that's one way of doing it, or create a ScriptInfo struct/class which you store in the data part and which contains all the script info you might need |
| 19:26 | <cojonuo> | iamlindoro__: about "continuing to support and develop it", yes |
| 19:27 | <iamlindoro__> | There you go, you heard it here first |
| 19:27 | <iamlindoro__> | But then, I have no authority in such matters :) |
| 19:27 | <cojonuo> | as far as possible |
| 19:27 | <rooaus> | gbee: Sounds like a better idea. Cheers |
| 19:28 | <justinh> | well, to win those over who may be against one more dependency.. better make it kick ass ;) |
| 19:28 | <iamlindoro__> | info re the Miro API: https://develop.participatoryculture.org/trac/democracy/wiki/MiroGuideApi |
| 19:29 | <iamlindoro__> | "datatype: the type of data you want back. Either 'python' (the default) or 'json' (optional)" |
| 19:29 | <iamlindoro__> | dunno if JSON might be more easily used |
| 19:29 | <cojonuo> | ups jeje |
| 19:29 | <cojonuo> | I don't read it |
| 19:29 | <justinh> | could the stuff just be converted into xml on the fly by the plugin? ;) |
| 19:29 | <cojonuo> | I don't now, i need investigate |
| 19:29 | <gbee> | define "overuse it " |
| 19:30 | <gbee> | python is now a data type? |
| 19:30 | <cojonuo> | no |
| 19:30 | <cojonuo> | but return a python dictionary |
| 19:30 | <justinh> | why not just parse it? doesn't look too complicated |
| 19:31 | <justinh> | ok it'd be like reinventing the wheel but it'll save another dependency |
| 19:31 | <gbee> | I like the sound of JSON :) |
| 19:31 | <justinh> | why the heck they didn't just use xml anyway.... |
| 19:31 | <justinh> | bandwidth saving by the looks of it |
| 19:31 | <gbee> | cojonuo: ok, until now I didn't know what a python dictionary was :) |
| 19:31 | <cojonuo> | is a way |
| 19:31 | <kormoc> | justinh, mod_deflate/mod_gzip == bandwidth win |
| 19:32 | <gbee> | justinh: the option of JSON strongly suggests that yes, they are trying to save bandwidth |
| 19:32 | <justinh> | kormoc: yeah but zipping each query result would eat their cpu |
| 19:32 | <rooaus> | I need to do some gardening now, but as I have jury duty on Monday I will look at the mythtube stuff then. |
| 19:32 | <kormoc> | justinh, it's surprisingly not that bad |
| 19:33 | <gbee> | but then again things like JSON are actually overused and in situations where they don't really make significant gains over gzip'd xml etc |
| 19:33 | <gbee> | justinh: a lot of pages you browse daily are probably gzipped and you don't even notice |
| 19:34 | <gbee> | they are inflated on the fly by the browser with very little speed impact |
| 19:34 | <justinh> | heh yeah true |
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| 19:35 | <cojonuo> | then JSON is the best choice?? |
| 19:35 | <cojonuo> | and QT provide JSON support?? |
| 19:37 | <gbee> | I don't know if it does, but I'd probably still use a perl script for all grabber support |
| 19:37 | <justinh> | heck I could maybe write perl to parse that |
| 19:37 | <cojonuo> | but i need do many call to MiroGuide API |
| 19:38 | <cojonuo> | I need use it into my code |
| 19:38 | <justinh> | why? |
| 19:38 | <justinh> | the API is just a description of what to do isn't it? |
| 19:38 | <gbee> | hardcoding makes updates harder - in the future all scripts will be held on mythtv.org and when an API changes a new script will be published, then automatically downloaded to the users frontend |
| 19:40 | <cojonuo> | yes, but to do a good guide UI I think I need add it to code |
| 19:40 | <cojonuo> | or I need use more script call |
| 19:41 | <gbee> | cojonuo: it's your plugin, I'm just giving my opinion |
| 19:41 | <cojonuo> | ok, and I appreciate it :-) |
| 19:42 | <gbee> | mythweather is the best example of how I think it should be done, but xmltv is another and in future mythflix, mythvideo, mythmusic will all use external scripts to interact with 3rd party websites |
| 19:43 | <justinh> | cojonuo: I'll try to scribble some kind of mockups to work from on the UI part. I need to install miro to see how it works on there first though |
| 19:43 | <cojonuo> | ok, I know scripts is the best way but I need think who do it... |
| 19:44 | <gbee> | scripts can be installed by the user and just work, they can be released and automatically downloaded by the frontend without us having to release a new mythtv version |
| 19:44 | <justinh> | yeah how long was mythweather broken? ;) |
| 19:44 | <gbee> | cojonuo: I know it's extra work, I'm sorry. You don't have to listen to me :) |
| 19:45 | <cojonuo> | no but is a good way |
| 19:45 | <hads> | JSON has the advantage of being able to create an object/dictionary/mapping easily in most languages where as if you use XML it can take more work to parse. |
| 19:45 | <justinh> | the best road is not always the easiest ;) |
| 19:45 | <gbee> | justinh: yeah, old one was hardcoded, took months before a new working version was available - now users could just download the fixed scripts and have it working again in hours/days |
| 19:46 | <justinh> | gbee: assuming they can chmod :P |
| 19:46 | <justinh> | well time to reboot into linux so I can start doing my menu doodles |
| 19:46 | <cojonuo> | i use script to search on youtube.com... jeje |
| 19:47 | <gbee> | hads: I'm not drinking the JSON cool aide ;) I like JSON, it has it's place but I'm not convinced that it's any harder to work with than XML |
| 19:48 | <cojonuo> | well, good night, I will sleep |
| 19:48 | <hads> | Don't get me wrong, I use and like both, it's just that an obj = eval($JSON) or obj = loads($JSON) is in some situations a lot easier than parsing an XML tree to get what you want. |
| 19:48 | <gbee> | huh, apparently it's Kool-Aide, not Cool Aide |
| 19:49 | <gbee> | or better yet, Kool-Aid .. no e |
| 19:49 | <gbee> | those wacky Americans |
| 19:49 | <hads> | heh, wouldn't have known that |
| 19:50 | <sphery> | shouldn't kormoc be in here for the JSON discussion since MythWeb is using it? :) |
| 19:51 | <gbee> | hads: most languages have libraries which do the same thing with XML - e.g. Perl has XML::Simple (or something like that) |
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| 19:51 | <justinh> | wonder if perl has a python dictionary thingy |
| 19:52 | <hads> | It's a hash or whatever. |
| 19:52 | <justinh> | would not be surprised if it has |
| 19:52 | <gbee> | for JavaScript (read AJAX), yes JSON is what you want, XML would be nonsenical |
| 19:53 | <hads> | gbee: Agreed, although from my usage of both (in web services) I find JSON a little simpler to deal with most of the time. |
| 19:54 | <gbee> | if it's the API for something serving hundreds of thousands of hits a day, again JSON for it's relative compression compared to XML |
| 19:56 | <hads> | If I want to read it myself XML is much easier :) |
| 19:56 | <justinh> | well, perl has json stuff so I guess that wins for me |
| 19:56 | <justinh> | not that I'm a big lover of perl, mind |
| 19:56 | <gbee> | "Darling warns of economic crisis" << FFS, sack that man for telling the country what we all knew over a year ago and yet he denied time after time |
| 19:57 | <justinh> | Darling.. a more inapt name there has never been for a chancellor ;) |
| 19:58 | <justinh> | heh looking at this json example I've just found it's not a billion miles off from what the python dictionary stuff is. to my ignorant eye |
| 19:58 | <gbee> | politicians live on another planet |
| 19:59 | <gbee> | I imagine they are very similar, one probably inspired the other - as in "Crap, java(script) has JSON and we're losing the battle for hearts and minds, lets copy them!" |
| 20:00 | <gbee> | standardising probably never even occured to them once |
| 20:01 | <hads> | It's because Python has a convention to represent it's objects in string format so that they can be eval'd back into an object. JSON is basically the same thing from Javascript. |
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| 20:15 | <kormoc> | gbee, the x in ajax stands for XML :P |
| 20:15 | <gbee> | heh, true |
| 20:16 | <kormoc> | thing is, deflate on xml gives surprisingly nice results, so at times xml isn't all that bad |
| 20:18 | <hads> | Yeah, deflate is great with XML usually |
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| 20:24 | <justinh> | hrmph. so much for my cunning plan so far. recording list menu is 10 items long |
| 20:27 | <justinh> | wonder if there's any scope for a 'more menu' affair, so you could press M to bring up _a_ menu, then press it again to switch it to the other options - or would that be too confuzzling? |
| 20:28 | <kormoc> | Hrm. I'd personally be more for scrolling to more options or a next page of options idea |
| 20:28 | <kormoc> | next page being a button/ui indication |
| 20:28 | <justinh> | yeah, the submenus don't have anything like as many options so they could easily have a 'back' feature |
| 20:29 | <kormoc> | As long as there's indication that's used elsewhere, I'm for it |
| 20:29 | <justinh> | I think 9 items is as many as you can get onscreen at 1280x720 with a good font size, so hitting 10 is a nono |
| 20:29 | <kormoc> | the thing I hate most about UI is when there's a different way to indicate more of something every place |
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| 20:30 | <justinh> | yeah well that's one of the things mythui is all about innit ;) |
| 20:31 | <kormoc> | Sure, I just felt like preaching to the choir |
| 20:31 | <justinh> | I think if a themer decides the popup isn't high enough, the buttons'd scroll under mythui's goodness anyway - but then too many options in one list is bad even when you're scrolling |
| 20:32 | <justinh> | myth gets a lot of stick for its UI but to be fair, a lot of us have SOs who figured it out easily enough - and we do have a lot of options compared to consumer gear |
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| 20:58 | <justinh> | think I have it worked out now. all I have to do is code it up. heh |
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| 22:47 | <Chutt> | hrm |
| 22:48 | <Chutt> | trunk's not compiling here |
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| --- | Log | closed Sat Aug 30 00:01:16 2008 |
