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#openttd IRC Logs for 2008-02-17

---Logopened Sun Feb 17 00:00:42 2008
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04:01<Alberth>you guys are talking IRC jargon? Can someone point me to a url to learn more of this secret language? :)
04:02<Alberth>hmm, a flash page :(, not compatible with me
04:03<Alberth>tnx anyway
04:03<Gonozal_VIII>no flash? poor you, missing out half of the intarwebs
04:04<Alberth>I haven't yet covered the other half.....
04:05-!-yorick is now known as Yorick|AFK
04:05<Gonozal_VIII>i've read the whole internet! twice!
04:05<Gonozal_VIII>printed it out first :-)
04:06<Gonozal_VIII>for every hyperlink i glued a string between the pages
04:07<Alberth>you bought shares of glue companies first?
04:07<Gonozal_VIII>nope, paper
04:07<Alberth>how does one convert a Money object to something readable at stdout?
04:08<Alberth>(or a CommandCost)
04:08<Gonozal_VIII>afaik money is int
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04:09<Alberth>it's a overflow_safe int, but its value is private :(, bad for debugging
04:09<Gonozal_VIII>cast it^^
04:10<markmc>Mornin' gusie
04:10<markmc>Like, good morning?
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05:26<Gonozal_VIII>money rounding is nogoody
05:26<Gonozal_VIII>there's nothing between 0 and 8 pounds
05:27<Gonozal_VIII>or 0 and 1760 yen...
05:27<Tefad>what the?
05:28<Gonozal_VIII>no 7 pounds or lower possible
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05:30<Gonozal_VIII>that together with nappes daylength effects cargo deivery prices means no income at all for short distance bus routes with daylength >17
05:31<Tefad>sounds like ass
05:31<Tefad>220 yen to pound?
05:32<Gonozal_VIII>seems to be so ingame, no idea how it is in rl
05:33<Gonozal_VIII>the game seems to calculate money in steps of 8 pounds...
05:33<Gonozal_VIII>that's too much
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05:37<Gonozal_VIII>and 8 pounds is 16 euro... that's a bit strange too but doesn't matter
05:41<Tefad>so bitshift money over 3bits?
05:41*Tefad shrugs
05:41<Tefad>or is this an artificial quantization
05:42<Tefad>the data types supports full resolution
05:42<Gonozal_VIII>no idea
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05:52<LordAzamath>hmm.. I've got an idea
05:52<LordAzamath>I'll try to help DaleStan here:
05:52<LordAzamath>but I need to think how will I draw it
05:55<Gonozal_VIII>hmm extra button for invisible trees?
05:56<LordAzamath>like the one in our patch options
05:56<LordAzamath>invisible trees - on/off
05:57<LordAzamath>but I need to think what it should be
05:57<Gonozal_VIII>i don't really understand...
05:57<Gonozal_VIII>the left button toggles tree invisibility...
05:58<Gonozal_VIII>i mean transparency...
05:58<Gonozal_VIII>left button does that...
05:59<Gonozal_VIII>why not make it a three state button?
05:59<LordAzamath>hmm an idea..
05:59<LordAzamath>but still needs another sprite I think..
06:00<Gonozal_VIII>hf drawing invisible^^
06:01<LordAzamath>is the hotkey for transparency in ttdp 'x' too?
06:01<Gonozal_VIII>never played patch
06:02<LordAzamath>need to fire up it through wine then.
06:02<Gonozal_VIII>so they bumped savegame version to 89...
06:04<Gonozal_VIII>completely unrelated to our discussion^^
06:04<LordAzamath>ok brb.. [reboot|windows|install TTDP]
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06:05<LordAzamath>actually.. hmm
06:05<LordAzamath>it doesn't matter
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06:07<Maedhros>LordAzamath: it's 't' in patch, in case you were still interested
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06:40<foe>How do I host a game with planes turned off?
06:41<foe>max_aircraft = 0 in openttd.cfg?
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06:44<LordAzamath>probably yes
06:45<Morloth>Good day :)
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07:21<CIA-1>OpenTTD: smatz * r12166 /trunk/src/ (depot_gui.cpp group_gui.cpp viewport.cpp window.cpp): -Fix [FS#337]: when drag&drop mode was cancelled by keyboard input, depot/group window wasn't updated (original patch by GrimRC)
07:27<Eddi|zuHause2><Alberth> it's a overflow_safe int, but its value is private <-- there should be like a "getValue" function
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07:30<Alberth>Eddi: Hmm, maybe this one? "FORCEINLINE operator int64 () const { return this->m_value; }"?
07:31<Alberth>My C++ knowledge about templated classes is terrible atm
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07:41<Eddi|zuHause2>yes, then just cast it to int64
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07:46<Alberth>Ah, it's a function-call operator, "money_needed()" was the solution.... I was looking for some get(), a << operator
07:46<Alberth>No need to cast it though (or maybe the 'int64' should be 'T'?)
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07:51<Alberth>Eddi: Tnx!
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07:53<maverique>hey, everyone
07:53<maverique>after a big cup of sleep now OpenTTD si working on my Ubuntu!
07:54<maverique>thx to the person who agve me the hint on the unix command
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07:54<Gonozal_VIII>sleeping fixes compatibility problems? cool
07:55<maverique>atleast mind problems
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09:08<maverique>ha and now i have internet on my ubuntu ^^
09:08<LordAzamath>after a big cup of sleep, I made this:
09:08<LordAzamath>comments please? :P
09:08<LordAzamath>maverique: It's really not that hard ^^
09:09<maverique>yea over LAN it's just easy
09:09<maverique>Wfif is really hards
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09:09<LordAzamath>not really
09:09<LordAzamath>I have wifi configured here
09:10<maverique>well i ahve a CX100
09:12<Yorick> <-- LA: isn't it OpenTTD instead of OpenTD>
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09:13<SmatZ>Yorick: you need only one T, because both T are the same
09:14<LordAzamath>and I didn't bother to make those R etc. signs too
09:14<LordAzamath>which aren't used anymore
09:15<LordAzamath>a lot less letters :P
09:15<LordAzamath>Shall I code?
09:15<LordAzamath>or improve
09:16<@peter1138>I think they're a bit dull, to be honest.
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09:17<LordAzamath>the original ones are too
09:17<LordAzamath>ok.. the orgiinal ones have more contrast
09:18<LordAzamath>and orange not green background
09:18<LordAzamath>I can change it
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09:23<LordAzamath>peter1138: what about now?
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09:33<LordAzamath>anyone got any idea how to replace sprites from trgir.grf?
09:34<Gonozal_VIII>which one is that?
09:35<LordAzamath>ahh I think I figured out how :)
09:35<LordAzamath>this is intro
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10:16<Yorick>anyone here?
10:17<Yorick>I can see
10:19<Morloth>No, I'm gone
10:25<LordAzamath>hmm can anyone give me quick hint where are the cargo icons used?
10:25<LordAzamath>I just want to see how they look in-game
10:25<Gonozal_VIII>station list
10:26<LordAzamath>and when I don't have stations?
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10:27<LordAzamath>and no, station list doesn't show cargo icons
10:28<Gonozal_VIII>no idea then
10:29<LordAzamath>even refit list doesn't show them...
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10:30<+glx>station windows
10:30<+glx>waiting cargo
10:31<Gonozal_VIII>hmmm no
10:31<LordAzamath>station window that is :)
10:31*LordAzamath looked to sprites.h
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10:41<dih>@seen Bjarni
10:41<@DorpsGek>dih: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 1 day, 18 hours, 28 minutes, and 59 seconds ago: <Bjarni> besides spelled in a stupid way
10:43<@peter1138>What do you need him for?
10:43<@peter1138>LordAzamath, that's a good idea though...
10:44<LordAzamath>what's a good idea?
10:44<@peter1138><LordAzamath> even refit list doesn't show them...
10:44<LordAzamath>yeah :D
10:44<LordAzamath>a good idea
10:45<UnderBuilder>one thing I don't like about the 2x2/3x3 road placement is that each city's roads are disalligned one each other
10:46<dih>peter1138: he wants some documentation from me
10:46<dih>which i mailed to him, just want his feedback
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10:48<LordAzamath>UnderBuilder: I have thought of making a suggestion for it :D
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10:49<dih>use 'no roads' :-P
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10:52<Gonozal_VIII>uhglee owned land
10:54<Eddi|zuHause2>i don't think the road grids can be fully synchronised
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10:54<LordAzamath>Eddi|zuHause2: why not?
10:54<Gonozal_VIII>only if you base town start positions on road layout setting
10:54<Eddi|zuHause2>the only way to achieve that would be to disallow certain coordinates
10:55<Eddi|zuHause2>the town center must be on a road tile
10:55<Gonozal_VIII>but you can change road layout during the game
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10:59<Gonozal_VIII>hmm you could restrict town center positions to every 12th tile... then the grids would always match with 2*2 and 3*3
11:00<LordAzamath>erm.. why not every 6th?
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11:00<Gonozal_VIII>distance of the roads is 3 and 4
11:01<LordAzamath>I was confuzed by 2x2 and 3x3 althought they really should be3x3 and 4x4
11:01<LordAzamath>because it's road layout
11:01<Ammller>Heya guys
11:01<LordAzamath>not free space layout
11:02<LordAzamath>heya Ammller
11:02<Gonozal_VIII>hi ammler
11:02<Ammller>Has someone already done a "little update" for no industry closing?
11:02<Ammller>I meant a little GRF :)
11:05<Ammller>hmm, is that possible anyway, or only appearing?
11:06<Gonozal_VIII>you could set the protection period to maximum i guess...
11:06<Gonozal_VIII>but i know nothing about newgrf industry stuff
11:07<LordAzamath>hmm.. I'm looking at that stuff atm..
11:09<@peter1138>Feh, cheats!
11:09<Ammller>I would like to use it on a Pass only game
11:10<Gonozal_VIII>why would it matter there if industries close down?
11:10<Ammller>or on coop games, we talking about 50 years until we beginn with building, so most industries are gone then
11:11<Ammller>Gonozal_VIII: there are 2 things: closing and appearing
11:12<Ammller>specially if you like to play a special scenario, you like to have the industries there where set.
11:17<LordAzamath>hmm.. I didn't find that
11:17<Eddi|zuHause2>the ECS grfs set a 5 year protection period for industry closing
11:19<Ammller>Eddi|zuHause2: is this "protection" set in general or per industry?
11:19<Eddi|zuHause2>i'd assume per industry
11:20<Eddi|zuHause2>i also assume it's a callback, so you could react on any kind of event...
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11:41<Gonozal_VIII>what is gitignore?
11:41<Ammller>git is an other Version management tool
11:42<Ammller>Linux Kernel is developing with it
11:43<Gonozal_VIII>and what is gitignore?
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12:01<@peter1138>It's a list of filenames to ignore.
12:01<CIA-1>OpenTTD: smatz * r12167 /trunk/src/ (8 files in 3 dirs): -Feature(tte): change colour of autorail and autoroad selection when Ctrl is pressed
12:01<Yorick>you mean it becomes red on removing-mode?
12:02<LordAzamath>hmm.. is there a hotkey for auto-road?
12:04<LordAzamath>there should be
12:05<LordAzamath>because even now, I don't use autorail to get building rails, but to open rail toolbar
12:05<LordAzamath>eg. if I want to place depots or stuff
12:06<LordAzamath>And it kinda disturbs that I can't do it with road stuff
12:06<@peter1138>SmatZ, nice patch ;)
12:06<SmatZ>thanks peter1138 :)
12:07<LordAzamath>and shift+f8 isn't kinda... quick way to get to raoad toolbar...
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12:08<Gonozal_VIII>f stuff is hard to find
12:08<Gonozal_VIII>the light of the screen isn't very bright up there...
12:09<LordAzamath>hmm.. what's ctrl+a used now?
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12:23<Morloth>Does someone know about any code guidelines put up especially for the NoAI branch?
12:23<Morloth>I'm wondering because all methods in the API are static (or at least should be), is this the it's ment to be?
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12:24<Morloth>*is this the way it's ment to be?*
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12:27<+glx>Morloth: I think it's needed for interfacing in squirrel
12:28<Morloth>glx: You mean squirrel can't cope with non-static functions?
12:29<Ammller>I got accidentially to this channel on freenode
12:29<+glx>binding in squirrel is done with things like SQAIAbstractList.DefSQMethod(engine, &AIAbstractList::Clear, "Clear", 1, "x");
12:30<Ammller>there are about 5-10 users there
12:30<Ammller>topic: This unofficial channel is available as needed. Please consult the project website for its official IRC location. Thank you for using freenode!
12:30<Morloth>Ammller: I know, have been there ;)
12:31<Morloth>glx: But is there going to be a problem -say- when I try to add new non-static functions to the AI API?
12:32<+glx>I don't know
12:32<+glx>but I think it doesn't work
12:32<Morloth>k, I was just curious :)
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12:54<Morloth>glx: Will you have time to review another patch?
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13:07<Morloth>K, wait up I'll post it for you
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13:14<+glx>where is the diff ? ;)
13:14<Morloth>I attached it right?
13:15<+glx>no file attached
13:15<Morloth>That's odd... Let me try again
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13:17<Morloth>That's weird, I can attach files for some reason...
13:18<Morloth>If I try to do it, Flyspray tries to return to the main page but only shows the title bar and only my message without the attachment is posted...
13:19<Morloth>Could it be some kind of virus scanner or something that's blocking that content?
13:19<+glx>out of space I think
13:19<CIA-1>OpenTTD: smatz * r12168 /trunk/src/rail_gui.cpp: -Fix: behave a bit better when 'R' is pressed during rail station dragging
13:20<Morloth>Hmmz... odd
13:20<SmatZ>I think there appears a file with zero size when it is out of disk space
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13:36<LordAzamath>a little thing
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14:00<@peter1138>NEW PBS
14:00*peter1138 dances
14:02<Yorick>new pbs
14:02<@Bjarni>I know that
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14:04<Roujin>!seen Gonozal_VIII
14:04<Roujin>@seen Gonozal_VIII
14:04<@DorpsGek>Roujin: Gonozal_VIII was last seen in #openttd 2 minutes and 23 seconds ago: <Gonozal_VIII> bjarni!
14:05<Roujin>hey, would you be so kind as to read my post in your patchpack thread and reply? ;)
14:05<+michi_cc>have fun :)
14:05<Roujin>michi_cc cheers @ new yapp version :)
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14:06<@peter1138>But damn this laptop being so slow ;(
14:06<Roujin>sorry for butting in like this xD
14:06<Gonozal_VIII>you don't have to ask for that ;-)
14:06*peter1138 was coding a new feature but has stopped that for this ;p
14:07<Gonozal_VIII>but maybe you should use the version i made half an hour ago^^
14:07<+michi_cc>oh noes, I'm hindering OpenTTD development :)
14:07<Roujin>well I wanted to ask because it seemed rude for me to just do that without asking you ;)
14:07<Roujin>Gonozal: which revision would that be?
14:08<Roujin>so that's not uploaded yet, but you will soon i guess?
14:08<@peter1138>But that wouldn't be the latest version of YAPP...
14:09<Gonozal_VIII>i'm not talking about yapp, i'm talking about roujins patches
14:09<Roujin>if you want to upgrade to 12168 and include latest YAPP before releasing a new version of your pack, please do so
14:09<Roujin>don't hurry because of me ;)
14:09-!-Diabolic-Angel [] has quit [Read error: No route to host]
14:09<Gonozal_VIII>soon is relative, i'm just updating and testing all the patches... have to check the new yapp too ofcourse
14:10<Gonozal_VIII>i'll pm it to you
14:10<@peter1138>Bonus, I've just been given some warm flapjack...
14:10-!-Diabolic-Angel [] has joined #openttd
14:10*Roujin googles for flapjack oO
14:11*Roujin guesses it's something M-rated
14:11<Roujin>A flapjack can be a kind of hydraulic machine, and it is also a reference to a professional wrestling throw.
14:11<Roujin>A flapjack is also a derogatory term for a person from an indistinguishable country of origin.
14:12<orudge>yum, flapjack
14:12<Gonozal_VIII>now where's the attachement gone to...
14:13*Roujin guesses peter has just been given a warm professional wrestling throw.
14:13<Gonozal_VIII>you've got mail roujin
14:13<@Bjarni>Roujin: thanks for a pointless highlight :/
14:13<Gonozal_VIII>see, not pointless :-)
14:14<@Bjarni>Gonozal_VIII: !thanks for a pointless highlight
14:14<@peter1138>Somehow Roujin's google is broken.
14:14<Gonozal_VIII>[20:13:51] <Gonozal_VIII> bjarni. <-- point!
14:15-!-NukeBuster [] has joined #openttd
14:15<Roujin>gonozal: your message may have contained too few characters, but the attachment was very enjoyable. Thank you ;)
14:15<Gonozal_VIII>now to revert all the stuff belugas changed in unmovable cmd...
14:15<@peter1138>Ah, the signal GUI understands PBS now :D
14:16<Roujin>what? what i wrote was on the wiki page for flapjack, just after the normal meaning, under "Other usage"....
14:16<Yorick>it did before, peter1138
14:16<Roujin>what's wrong with that? :P
14:16<@peter1138>Yorick, maybe I only tested it with version 1...
14:17<Morloth>*noob question*: What does PBS stand for? I read it everywhere and everybody is very excited about it... But what is it!? :)
14:17<@Bjarni>it's great :D
14:17<Morloth>Aaaaaah, ok :)
14:17<@Bjarni>Yorick: you should get your space key checked. It seems to be broken
14:17<Morloth>Yorick: thx :)
14:17<Yorick>no, PBS is written without spaces...
14:18<@Bjarni>since when?
14:18<Yorick>since its called "PBS"
14:18<@Bjarni>I thought we agreed to stick to a non corrupted way of writing English in the game :s
14:19<@Bjarni>DB = Deutsche Bahn, not DeutscheBahn
14:19<Jacy>Yorick, what's the point of leaving the spaces out?
14:19<Roujin>it makes signalling more intuitive for new players that don't understand presignals, and makes all knowledge OpenTTD gurus have about presignals obsolete :P
14:19<Yorick>having to write less spaces, Jacy :-P
14:19<@Bjarni>he wants to butcher a perfectly fine language
14:20<@peter1138>Roujin, and it rocks...
14:20<@Bjarni>I can understand Asian people having problems with spaces but Yorick...
14:20-!-Jortuny [] has joined #openttd
14:20<@peter1138>Bjarni, that's okay, you manage it too.
14:20<Roujin>oh yes it does.
14:20<Yorick>I wanted to answer before anyone else did :>
14:21<Roujin>doesn't mean i don't like pbs, i just wrote a true statement ;)
14:21<@Bjarni>peter1138: you know I write full words only and max one word between each set of whitespace
14:23<LordAzamath>arghh... why don't you do something useful? like comment on this:
14:24<Yorick>because its Bjarni
14:24<LordAzamath>but instead you have conversations about whitespace :S
14:24<Yorick>because its Bjarni
14:24<LordAzamath>that explains everything
14:24<LordAzamath>..or not
14:24<Yorick>because its Bjarni
14:24<LordAzamath>I thought you were a bot
14:25<LordAzamath>not he
14:25<Yorick>maybe I am
14:25<Yorick>..or not
14:25<LordAzamath>ok whatever :D, but comments?
14:25<Yorick>I'm a bot, remember, I can't comment
14:26<LordAzamath>or not
14:26<Yorick>yes, ..or not
14:27<Roujin>hmm.. don't really know what to say - looks well to me but i'm not a graphic expert ;)
14:27<Roujin>it just gave me the idea that the four icons could show the same scenery, just in their respective flavor
14:28<Roujin>don't know if this would look nice or boring ingame though...
14:28-!-Progman [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:28<LordAzamath>I had the same idea, but I think too, it'd look boring in-game...
14:32<ben_goodger>lag 0.2s
14:32<@Bjarni>the Yorick is slow :s
14:32<@Bjarni>we need to fix that bot
14:33<LordAzamath>!fix Yorick
14:33<Yorick>Error: not enough arguments, expected 1, got 2
14:34<@Bjarni>!fix Yorick ASAP
14:35<Yorick>Error: not enough arguments, expected 1, got 2
14:35<@Bjarni>!fix Yorick right away
14:35<Yorick>Error: not enough arguments, expected 1, got 3
14:35<Yorick>Error: not enough arguments, expected 1, got 0
14:35<@peter1138>!fix what?
14:35<Yorick>Error: unknown command
14:35<@Bjarni>this is not going to work
14:35<Yorick>Error: what? no nick/channel
14:35<@peter1138>!fix it for me, jim?
14:36<@Bjarni>luckily I have another idea
14:36*Bjarni takes Yorick to the vet to get it fixed
14:36<Yorick>Error: you can't take a bot
14:36<@Bjarni>watch me
14:36<Yorick>no needles!
14:37<@Bjarni>you would have wished for the needles afterwards though
14:37<@Bjarni>man this is silly
14:37<ben_goodger>fix __self__
14:37<ben_goodger>!fix __self__
14:37<Yorick>Error: you no nick/channel
14:37<@Bjarni>Yorick: you have a degrading influence on the channel
14:37<Yorick>success: fixed __self__
14:38<ben_goodger>actually __self__ calls the bot, not me
14:38<Yorick>one must say: !def __self__
14:38<@Bjarni>#define __self__ Yorick
14:38<Yorick>__self__ set to ben_goodger
14:39<@Bjarni>!fix __self__
14:39<Yorick>Success: fixed ben_goodger
14:39<@Bjarni>ben_goodger: I hope you can explain your future wife that you can't have children due to an IRC bot error
14:40<@peter1138>So, yes, useful stuff...
14:40-!-GoneWacko [] has quit [Quit: I SAID GOOD DAY]
14:40<@Bjarni>either you guys shut up, talk seriously or I'm out of here
14:41<Yorick>Error: shutup unknown command
14:41<Roujin>i choose option 2.
14:41<Roujin>hmm, i guess i should bump the savegame version with my traffic lights patch...
14:41<ben_goodger>I don't intend to be married or reproduce. I think it's ecologically irresponsible
14:41<ben_goodger>Roujin: traffic lights?
14:41<@Bjarni>you make Darwin proud
14:42<@Bjarni>or something
14:42<Roujin>if loading a game saved with it with trunk, the tile owner is shown as "someone" <-- i find that funny ^^
14:42<Roujin>ben_goodger: check my thread in the development forum ;) no release yet though, just some screenshots...
14:43<@peter1138>ben_goodger, marriage is ecologically irresponsible? :o
14:44<LordAzamath>!get_sleep LordAzamath
14:44<Roujin>I hope I didn't break anything by using the m1 bits 5-7 for my traffic lights :P
14:44<Yorick>Success: set LordAzamath.mode to sleep
14:44<Roujin>night LA
14:44<@Bjarni>peter1138: I think it means in his case not generally
14:44-!-LordAzamath [] has left #openttd [Kopete 0.12.5 :]
14:44<ben_goodger>it's a very large amount of wasted time and money. _reproduction_ is ecologically irresponsible :P
14:44<@peter1138>Bjarni, ah... well I've nothing against gay people.
14:44<@Bjarni>and I think he mainly meant reproduction
14:46<@Bjarni>ben_goodger: the Chinese government would love your point of view
14:46<ben_goodger>they share it, in fact
14:47<ben_goodger>britain is not yet nearly as overpopulated, but we face a similar problem. house prices are due to increase by 180% in the next two years, and we need to find 10 million new homes by 2020 to fit everyone in
14:48<@Bjarni>then why not just close the boarders so the problem will go away?
14:48<ben_goodger>because then we'd be no better than the chinese used to be
14:49<@Bjarni>your point is?
14:49<ben_goodger>I don't have a point
14:49<@Bjarni>I noticed
14:50<@peter1138>"find 10 million new homes" ... are they buried then?
14:50<Gonozal_VIII>austrias population doesn't increase, it's been the same for decades
14:50<ben_goodger>well, actually my point is that we need to build 10 million houses in the next decade to cope with increases in population, and that this is bad but no sensible solution presents itself
14:51<ben_goodger>Gonozal_VIII: australia presumably doesn't have millions of eastern europeans flocking to it to do the crap jobs
14:51<@Bjarni>ben_goodger: I just told you one but it looks like you decided to ignore it
14:51<Gonozal_VIII>austria, not australia :P
14:51<Gonozal_VIII>and we have
14:51<ben_goodger>oh, austria.
14:51<ben_goodger>Bjarni: I didn't ignore it, I said it was as bad as the chinese government's former policies
14:52<Gonozal_VIII>most foreigners per native bla in europe
14:52<@Bjarni>ben_goodger: I fail to see what you mean
14:53<@Bjarni>it's your country. You should be able to say "I don't want you to move in here because we don't have room for you"
14:53<ben_goodger>we should be able to, yes
14:53<@Bjarni>I didn't mean closed boarders like North Korea
14:53-!-markmc [] has quit [Quit: Screw you guy, I'm going home and smoke pot]
14:54<ben_goodger>unfortunately, we need this influx of labour
14:55<ben_goodger>anyway, I need to get back to work on my thermoelectrics project
14:55<@Bjarni>either that or start to consider why you need more labour than earlier even though you have machines to do many of the labour demanding tasks
14:55<ben_goodger>we don't need more labour than before
14:55<@Bjarni>then why do you need to import it?
14:56<ben_goodger>the problem is that the pakistanis we imported in the 50s all have children with degrees now, and they're getting decent jobs
14:56<@peter1138>Nobody wants to be a plumber these days...
14:56<Roujin>if i may butt in this .. eh.. interesting discussion about politics; does maybe someone know if there's a svn .diff highlighter for the editor ConTEXT?
14:56<ben_goodger>peter1138: precisely
14:57<@Bjarni>so importing a plumber who will not make his children plumbers will solve the problem?
14:57<@Bjarni>it sounds like it's a short sighted solution
14:57<Eddi|zuHause2>no, it delays the problem to the next generation
14:57<ben_goodger>well, it will probably take a few decades for the problem to reoccur
14:57<Eddi|zuHause2>that's how all western communities work
14:58<ben_goodger>but yes, it's incredibly shortsighted
14:58<ben_goodger>unfortunately, nobody seems to have any better ideas
14:58<Roujin>okay, let me rephrase that. Is someone who is using ConTEXT in possession of a .svn diff highlighter for it and might tell me where he got it from because I was unable to find one myself?
14:58<Roujin>better now, eddi?.. :P
14:58<Eddi|zuHause2>i have never heard of an editor named ConTEXT
14:58<@Bjarni>Roujin: I didn't ignore you, I just don't know the answer :/
14:59<@Bjarni>due to the same reason as Eddi|zuHause2
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15:00<@Bjarni><ben_goodger> unfortunately, nobody seems to have any better ideas <-- that shouldn't be that hard
15:00<ben_goodger>seems to be quite hard
15:00<@Bjarni>if you got the guts to rule
15:00<ben_goodger>the governments have been failing to correct it for some time
15:00<Eddi|zuHause2>actually, germany has other kind of population problems
15:01<Eddi|zuHause2>the academics people have too little growth
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15:01<@Bjarni>they all use a timescale that goes from now to the next election
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15:01<Eddi|zuHause2>and the uneducated people relying on social welfare reproduce like rabbits
15:01<ben_goodger>Eddi|zuHause2: we have them as well.
15:01<@Bjarni>Eddi|zuHause2: solution: stop longtime social welfare
15:02<@peter1138>ben_goodger, well the governments are still obsessed with getting 99% of the kids into university...
15:02<@peter1138>"well duh"
15:03<Roujin>assumption: the educated people have forgotten over their studies how to reproduce
15:03<ben_goodger>not as obsessed as you would think
15:03<@Bjarni>that can only be possible if you lower the quality of the universities enough to allow everybody
15:03<Roujin>solution: teach the educated people how to reproduce
15:04*Yorick got highlighted?
15:05<@Bjarni>Roujin: the solution would be to cut social welfare and use the saved money for making the financial situation for high educated people better so they can afford to get children
15:05<Eddi|zuHause2>peter1138: here, they are trying to get the people to go to university, but they also butcher the finance of these universities
15:06<ben_goodger>none of this solves the housing problem, incidentally.
15:06<ben_goodger>but I must get back to work on my thermoelectrics project.
15:06<ben_goodger>see you later-ish
15:06<@Bjarni>also we need to get away from the red economy model where everybody has to get such a high salary that it's better for a university professor to take time off to spend a long time setting up say a toilet than to pay a professional to do so
15:07<Eddi|zuHause2>housing problems? we have 50% empty living space
15:07<Eddi|zuHause2>we did have housing problems, but they magically solved themselves in 1989
15:08<@Bjarni>I mean the time needed to work to pay the paycheck of the professional is like 5-10 hours. It could take say 2 for an untrained guy to set it up meaning it's faster to do it yourself
15:08-!-thgergo [] has joined #openttd
15:08<@Bjarni>btw I didn't make up this example
15:08<@Bjarni>I know it to be true
15:08-!-Osai [] has joined #openttd
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15:08<@Bjarni>and it's not about toilets only
15:08<@Bjarni>it's everything
15:08<@Bjarni>doors, windows and everything like that
15:10<ln->welll what can you expect from a species descending from telephone sanitizers.
15:11<@Bjarni>what is telephone sanitizers?
15:14<@Bjarni>nobody knows?
15:14<ln->a person who sanitizes telephones, of course.
15:15<CIA-1>OpenTTD: smatz * r12169 /trunk/src/sound.cpp:
15:15<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Change [FS#1696]: play sounds when there is only small part of tile/vehicle visible too (original idea by Dominik)
15:15<CIA-1>OpenTTD: It improves the game appearance when playing with very small screen resolution
15:15<ln->i'm guessing Bjarni is currently in transition from W-T to F.
15:15<@Bjarni>no... google define: didn't make sense of it either
15:16<@Bjarni>I meant your sentence
15:16<Prof_Frink>ln-: And hairdressers
15:19<ln->yes, hairdressers and management consultants should not be forgotten.
15:24-!-Axamentia [] has joined #openttd
15:26<ln->anyway, 20:56 -!- Bjarni [] has joined #openttd 21:02 < Gonozal_VIII> bjarni! 21:02 < Yorick> Bjarni!
15:27<Prof_Frink>ln -s!
15:28-!-Axmentia666 [] has joined #openttd
15:28<Prof_Frink>for name in *; do echo ${name}!; done
15:28<Yorick>Axmentia666! wait...I don't know you
15:28<Yorick>Prof_Frink: just say @seen * and it will be executed...sort off
15:28<ln->Bjarni: you know, if you idled here 24/7, you could come and go without your join being celebrated like the second coming of Bjarni every time.
15:29<Prof_Frink>Also, you could use a superior client.
15:30<@peter1138>People celebrate Bjarni's return? :o
15:30<Axmentia666>maybe you dont yorick lol
15:30<Yorick>Axmentia666! (wait-I don't know him...)
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15:35<ben_goodger>ln-: I think there were also marketing analysts
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15:40<Eddi|zuHause2>never trust a statistics that you did not fake yourself
15:41<Axamentia>Eddi: hahaah
15:41<Eddi|zuHause2>well, it's the first thing they teach you ;)
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16:13<@Bjarni>I'm out of here
16:13<@Bjarni>now you all the time until tomorrow to prepare celebrating me again
16:13<@Bjarni>(if you like)
16:14<@Bjarni>knowing this channel I presume some of you will in fact do that o_O
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16:27<Eddi|zuHause2>hm, it's 1984 an i have a E16 that is still good for over 20 years...
16:28<CIA-1>OpenTTD: smatz * r12170 /trunk/src/ (road_cmd.cpp tunnelbridge_cmd.cpp): -Fix: do not draw trees along road and street lights under low bridges (spotted by _minime_)
16:30<Roujin>thats funny
16:31<Eddi|zuHause2>well, E16 was constructed like in the mid 20's
16:31<Roujin>i also spotted this short time ago
16:31<Roujin>sorry eddi, but i meant the commit :P
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16:31<Eddi|zuHause2>sorry Roujin, i meant Gonozal_VIII :p
16:32<Eddi|zuHause2>PS: i spotted that quite a while ago, but it didn't bother me enough
16:32<Roujin>time for me to get some food, so i'm away for now ^_^
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16:44<Mwa>Hi. ^_^
16:44<Mwa>I was just wondering, what are Transmitters, and can I remove them in any way?
16:45<Gonozal_VIII>radio, tv, cell phone stuff...
16:45<Gonozal_VIII>can't remove them
16:45<Eddi|zuHause2>like lighthouses, their only purpose is to annoy the player ;)
16:45-!-Maedhros [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
16:46<Gonozal_VIII>exactly :-)
16:48<Mwa>Curses. There's one that is only just stopping me from making an intercontinental airport
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16:57<Gonozal_VIII>those 10000000 newlines at the end of main_gui.cpp and rail_gui.cpp keep confusing tortoise, can't somebody remove them? please...
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17:25<Mwa>airports should be rotatable. >:
17:36<Eddi|zuHause2>Gonozal_VIII: i think it's something wrong at your end
17:36<Eddi|zuHause2>like mixup between different line endings or something
17:37<+glx>the main problem is tortoise :)
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17:44<Gonozal_VIII>no eddi... happens with all patches that change those files
17:45<+glx>only with tortoise, so the problem is tortoise
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17:54<Morloth>Hmmz... are some devs online ATM? I notice there are some functions I need for my AI (like getting the cost to build a certain vehicle), which are online declared in *.cpp files. I can't include them so I can't use them right now.
17:55<Morloth>Would it be possible to declare all functions in the roadveh_cmd / aircraft_cmd / etc. in seperate header files?
17:55<@peter1138>Isn't getting cost a command function?
17:56<Morloth>well, I could go into 'test mode', build what I want and check how much money it cost me. But I figured it would be cleaner to ask it directly instead of simulating it
17:57<@peter1138>The old AIs use DC_QUERY_COST, I suspect NoAIs should too, but I know pretty much nothing about NoAI...
17:58<@peter1138>Sleepy time
17:58<Morloth>nn peter1138, thx for your comments :)
17:59<@peter1138>Good night :)
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17:59<NukeBuster>anyone here with some experience with linking object files?
18:01<Morloth>NukeBuster: Some, not an awfull lot :)
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18:03<NukeBuster>Morloth, I get this error:
18:04<NukeBuster>Also the compile command for map.o
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18:06<Morloth>let me see
18:06-!-KritiK [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:08<Morloth>(not to familiar with g++), but shouldn't you use 'ld' for linking?
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18:09<NukeBuster>not sure... it says ld returned exit status
18:09<Morloth>Yeah, that's kinda odd...
18:10<NukeBuster>so i guess g++ uses ld to link
18:11<Morloth>but what happens if you try: 'ld -L/usr/local/lib -o te map.o calender.o client.o client_reactions.o themes.o gridarray.o exco.o gui.o  renderer.o render_page.o server.o task.o main.o' ?
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18:13<NukeBuster>map.o: file not recognized: File format not recognized
18:14<Morloth>try 'ls -al map.o'. How big is that file?
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18:15<NukeBuster>11133760 feb 18 00:00 map.o
18:16<NukeBuster>around 10MB?
18:17<Morloth>I don't really know what goes wrong, have you tried cleaning all your objects and recompiling?
18:17<NukeBuster>yes, several times...
18:17<NukeBuster>could it be because of libraries not included?
18:18<NukeBuster>Is this line correct? :
18:19<Morloth>look ok to me, although I don't know all the options you've included...
18:19<Morloth>but then again, never used OGRE :)
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18:20<NukeBuster>well you'll have to talk to Uzurpator about that... I'm just trying to port the code so it compiles with gcc
18:21<Morloth>Well I don't see any errors in your compile / link lines to be honest
18:23<Morloth>although you don't need al the -I options during linking
18:23<Morloth>but that shouldn't cause this problem...
18:24<NukeBuster>the -i or the -l
18:26<Morloth>you need the -L :)
18:26<Morloth>but are all object files bad?
18:26<NukeBuster>I have tried changing the order but then the next in line is bad
18:27<Morloth>So client.o gives the same error?
18:27<Morloth>but then with client.o nog being recognized?
18:38<Morloth>ok, try renaming all your objectfiles from *.o to *.obj
18:38<Morloth>see if it works that way
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18:43<NukeBuster>It is compiling
18:44<Morloth>it's working?
18:44<NukeBuster>it's not linking yet
18:45<NukeBuster>nou compiling the last obj
18:45<Morloth>ok :)
18:46<NukeBuster> forgot 2 files
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18:48<Morloth>Net zo makkelijk toch? ;)
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18:53<Eddi|zuHause2>hm, i still have not connected half the map...
18:53<Eddi|zuHause2>and i only have very few towns
18:53<Audigex>i just realised
18:53<Audigex>that my ping to my FTP server
18:54<Audigex>is 10ms
18:54<Audigex>and my seek time on my laptop hard drive
18:54<Audigex>is an average of 12ms
18:54<Audigex>so in theory
18:54<Audigex>i can access my FTP server
18:54<Audigex>faster then my hard drive
18:54<Eddi|zuHause2>seek time != transfer speed
18:54<Audigex>shh ;)
18:54<Audigex>shattering my dream
18:54<Audigex>i was about to revolutionise the world of electronics
18:55<Audigex>"Just put all your shit on my FTP server"
18:55<Audigex>i'd make milliomns
18:55<Eddi|zuHause2>yeah, go do that
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20:42<CIA-1>OpenTTD: smatz * r12171 /trunk/src/tunnelbridge_cmd.cpp:
20:42<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Fix [FS#609]: return correct bridge price for AI when DC_QUERY_COST is set (patch by Raimar Falke)
20:42<CIA-1>OpenTTD: It never happens in current code, but it is better to be ready for it
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21:52<UnderBuilder>anyone know the parodius games?
21:52<UnderBuilder>it's gradius done funny
21:52<UnderBuilder>well, toyland should be TTD did so
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22:08<CaptObvious>anyone know of any announced titles or even rumours of new games in the TTD genre?
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23:01<Morloth>Good night!
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---Logclosed Mon Feb 18 00:00:35 2008