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#openttd IRC Logs for 2008-02-28

---Logopened Thu Feb 28 00:01:04 2008
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00:08<UnderBuilder>hmmm... I'm asking if Dale Stan and the AVGN have got an ancestral in common
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02:09<DaleStan>Well, I'm not a VGN, A or otherwise. I'm just a TTDN.
02:19<DaleStan>Belugas: How vile does this method of providing extra textref bytes sound to you? <> It's easy, it works well with TTDPatch's internals, and it's coded, but the more I think about it, the less I like it.
02:19<DaleStan>Belugas: On the other hand, I'm not at all certain I can manage to cram the usual "copy registers 100..105" system into all the appropriate places.
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05:31<Gonozal_VIII>i'm here
05:32<Gonozal_VIII>you are all happy now
05:34*keyweed rejoices
05:37*Gekz knifes keyweed
05:37<Gekz>Yes, happy.
05:38*keyweed dies in a rather messy way.
05:39*Gonozal_VIII puts some plastic on the channel floor under keyweed
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05:40*Gekz knifes Gonozal_VIII
05:41*Gekz wraps you both in plastic, places you in the oven and cooks at 400C.
05:41<@peter1138>Your oven goes up to 400°C?
05:41*Gekz then proceeds to cut you into the shape of muffins and serves you to all his friends as the Granny's Cake Festival
05:41<keyweed>that's not cooking, that's incinerating
05:44*Gekz knifes keyweed again
05:44*Gekz doesnt knife peter1138 because peter1138 is an op :)
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06:32<yorick>what is the ideal distance for pax transport using the cheapest aircraft in 1950?
06:33<yorick>at towns of around 500 pop?
06:36<Roujin>yorick: (plane speed factor * e^(1/4 * pi) + 100 tiles)/ size of your thumb
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06:36<Gonozal_VIII>don't forget the +1
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06:36<Roujin>dang, i forgot the +1.
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06:38<yorick>ok, I'll assume as far away as possible, as AI's don't have a thumb
06:41<Roujin>oo... that's true. so my formula actually works ^^
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07:32<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truebrain * r12310 /branches/noai/ (3 files in 2 dirs): [NoAI] -Fix: make MaxSpeed for Aircrafts return the value divided by plane_speed (which in regression is now set to 1/2th)
07:34<Roujin>what? in regression planespeed is halved? oO
07:34<yorick>regression is the regression.txt testing
07:34<yorick>[13:34] <@TrueBrain> I liked it more than the 1/4th :p
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08:01<yorick>I know what km means ingame now (1 tile = 429 km), but what is the km/h timefactor?
08:03<Gonozal_VIII>forget about that
08:03<yorick>no I wont
08:03<yorick>I need it
08:03<Gonozal_VIII>you will!
08:04<Gonozal_VIII>how often do you see busses that are >200km long?
08:08<@peter1138>"Aircrafts" :o
08:09<yorick>& aircrafts 15 0: air crafts, air-crafts, aircraft's, aircraft, crafts, Craft's, craft's, crofts, crufts, grafts, Arafat's, Ashcroft's, Kraft's, croft's, graft's
08:10<yorick>or just do !spell aircrafts
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08:30<divo>I need some help with trigonometry.. I know the circumference of a right-angled triangle is 10. The sides are x, y and 1. x>y. Find x. Any thoughts?
08:31<keyweed_>A^2+B^2=C^2, A+B+C=10
08:32<keyweed_>when i learned it at school i'd never thought i'd either remember it or needed it. i was wrong.
08:33<Gonozal_VIII>triangles are important...
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08:38<divo>Wow thanks
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08:42<Roujin>see you guys..
08:42<Gonozal_VIII>i see me too
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08:50<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truebrain * r12311 /branches/noai/bin/ai/wrightai/main.nut: [NoAI] -Fix: wrightai didn't work anymore
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09:28<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truebrain * r12312 /branches/noai/ (7 files in 3 dirs): [NoAI] -Fix: AIVehicle_vRunningCost didn't exist
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09:30<Phantasm>With the setting that shares of companies can't be bought, AIs can still buy them.
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10:07<@Belugas>DaleStan, i've read your post, i will read the thread and i will try to understand it.
10:07<@Belugas>but if memory serves me well, i thnk it is Rubidium who implemented it
10:07<@Belugas>I will anyway take a look
10:07<DaleStan>CB37 is what is being discussed there.
10:08*Belugas checks
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10:16<@Belugas>CBID_INDUSTRY_CARGO_SUFFIX = 0x37, // not implemented
10:18<@Belugas>so... i guess it means a todo
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10:39<LA[lord]>does anybody have something to say about Samsung SGH-M610
10:40<LA[lord]>I'm buying a new phone, but I'd like some comments first :D
10:40<yorick>anyone that does should do it in #?
10:40<LA[lord]>correct :)
10:40<Gonozal_VIII>so that channel is for offtopic stuff now?
10:41<yorick>correct :)
10:41<yorick>actually-it's for everythinhg
10:45<@Belugas>DaleStan, cb37 is going to be implemented first.
10:45<@Belugas>just to mention you're not been forgotten ;)
10:46<@Belugas>byt he way, doyou have a diff to show? that would help
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10:52<@peter1138>LA[lord], well, it’s a Samsung, so it’s going to suck.
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10:53<@peter1138>LA[lord], also, what are you on about with ‘grf-slots’?
10:54<LA[lord]>didn't I state that IIRC
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11:09<DaleStan>Belugas: Some of the changes for the produced cargos are in procs, though. newdrawinduproducelist is applied twice, at cs:153234 and cs:15325D; newfinish... is applied 27 (dec) bytes later.
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11:11<@Belugas>noted DaleStan
11:12<DaleStan>And the code that made all 32 bytes of the textrefstack useful is at rev 1829, but I doubt that's interesting.
11:16<@peter1138>Heh, ours is 160 bytes...
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11:17<DaleStan>I thought you had a separate one for the TTD string codes?
11:19<DaleStan>Not that you need one, I just thought that newgrf string-processing was basically completely separate from lang-file string processing.
11:20<@peter1138>Ah, probably... I’ve never looked nor touched any of that.
11:22<@peter1138>Seems to be 48 bytes.
11:24<frosch123>More important: OTTD draws the stockpile amounts with one string per cargo instead of one string for all three cargos.
11:24<DaleStan>But how does it draw non-stockpiled cargoes.
11:26<DaleStan>Patch uses one string for accepted cargos, always; one string for produced cargos in the fund-industry window; and one string for each produced cargo in the industry details window.
11:26<DaleStan>Spitting stockpiled cargos is not a problem. It's splitting the industry details window and non-stockpiled accepted cargos into one string per cargo that worries me.
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11:30*Belugas confirms. newgrf string processing is apart of standard string file
11:33<@Belugas>and sorry, i'm horribly buzy at work
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11:37<DaleStan>Not a problem; I'm going on vacation for a week and a half; nothing development-related will happen on my part in that time.
11:46<@Belugas>lucky you. enjoy it :)
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12:34<CIA-1>OpenTTD: frosch * r12313 /trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): -Fix: YAPF and NTP did not apply penalty for uphill tracks on steep slopes.
12:37<Forked>soon 12345 :)
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12:56<Eddi|zuHause2>this is weird... they closed an industry even though i was servicing it...
12:57<Gonozal_VIII>then you didn't service it good enough
12:57<Eddi|zuHause2>wtf is that supposed to mean?
12:57<Gonozal_VIII><75% transported
12:58<@peter1138>I think he meant ‘well enough’.
12:58<Eddi|zuHause2>i only delivered stuff
12:58<Eddi|zuHause2>this is silly, with stable industry, serviced industries should not close
12:59<Gonozal_VIII>they close if you don't pick up at least 75% all the time
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13:00<UnderBuilder>would be too hard to rewrite a (minimal) ottd version in the mobile version of java?
13:00<Eddi|zuHause2>again, this is totally silly
13:00<@peter1138>Using NewGRFs or plain industries?
13:00<@peter1138>UnderBuilder, have fun doing so.
13:00<Gonozal_VIII>mobile version of java?
13:01<Gonozal_VIII>javascript or what?
13:01<Eddi|zuHause2>yes, java has a mobile edition
13:02<Eddi|zuHause2>you can't put a standard JRE on a mobile, you have neither the memory nor the calculation power to run anything
13:02<@peter1138>JavaScript has nothing to do with Java, of course.
13:04<Gonozal_VIII>you can copy a lot of code from java stuff to javascript without changing it (or much of it) so it has something to do with it...
13:04<Eddi|zuHause2>they are totally unrelated
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13:12*Sacro fiddles with OpenTTD and XNA
13:12<Patrick`>mmm, xna
13:13<Patrick`>it's one of the ways that 3d desktops promptly splintered when introduced to the OSS model
13:13<Sacro>Virtual PC 2007 for free :D
13:13<Sacro>Patrick`: no
13:13<+glx>Sacro: it is vista only I think
13:13<Sacro>glx: what?
13:13<Patrick`>oh, sorry, my bad
13:13<Patrick`>game ramewkor
13:13<Sacro>glx: nope, XP/Vista/360
13:16<Sacro>fib = n => n > 1 ? fib(n - 1) + fib(n - 2) : n;
13:16<Sacro>i like it
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13:20<Patrick`>microsoft Haskell Pro (r) (c)
13:22<Sacro>i could try and get openttd onto xbox live
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13:34<De_Ghost>u so need a mouse for openttd
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14:11<Luukland>Heya, I want to set up an dedicated server, but I can't find it in the server list, so no one can join... What i've done for now: opened port 3797 at the router, server_port = 3797, server_bind_ip =, connect_to_ip = (Which is the router, but not the modem!) Anyone who does now what i am doing wrong? :)
14:12<Yorick>set bind ip
14:12<Yorick>try to set server_advertise to on
14:12<Luukland>what should i fill in for it? :S
14:12<Yorick>set the modem IP
14:12<Luukland>server_advertise = true
14:12<Yorick>forward ports from modem to router and router to pc
14:13<Luukland>yeah checked that one, but the ports are forwarded
14:13<Yorick>connect_to_ip to the modem ip
14:13<Luukland>hmmmz, ok
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14:13<Luukland>and server bind ip?
14:13<Luukland>leave it at
14:14<Yorick>server bind ip set to the pc's ip from the router
14:14<Luukland>hmm ok
14:15<Luukland>bind failed on it says
14:15<Luukland>(that my pc)
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14:16<planetmaker>Luukland: that's a local IP. You need your router's IP.
14:16<Yorick>not for bind_ip
14:16<@peter1138>Not for binding.
14:16<Yorick>it probably means you already have a server running
14:16<planetmaker>hm, well ok, I'll shut up on things I don't understand :D
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14:17<Luukland>I do not have anything running at my port
14:17<questionmark>the #? bot is saying hello: hello :)
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14:18<Luukland>ok again, what do I need to fill in: PC_ip Router ip: Modem ip: (Out 85.144.49.XXX)
14:19<@peter1138>You need to do some port forwarding, tcp and udp.
14:19<Luukland>I hope i am being clear now :P server_bind_ip = ???? and connect_to_ip = 85.144.49.XXX
14:19<Luukland>peter1138 port 3797 is open
14:19<Yorick>why XXX?
14:19<Luukland>thats secret you know ^^ :P
14:19<Yorick>you can't make it secret if you run a server
14:20<@peter1138>Open is not the same as forwarded.
14:21<Luukland>K! Port 3797 is open and accepting connections
14:21<Sacro>$this->hasFlavr() ? $nom->nom('nom') : $want->doNot()
14:21<Yorick>you need 3979?
14:21<Luukland>that one is also open :p
14:21<Luukland>or forwarded :p
14:21<Yorick>and your ip?
14:22<Luukland>my pc_ip, modem_ip or rouer_ip?...
14:22<Yorick>the 85... thing
14:22<Luukland> /
14:25<@peter1138>Are you forwarding UDP as well?
14:26<Ammller>ottd can read compressed saves, it also can read tar achives with GRFs, wouldn't it make sense also have the possibitly to read compressed tar archived grfs?
14:26<Luukland> OpenTTD Yes TCP 3797 3797 mer0
14:26<Luukland> OpenTTD Yes UDP 3797 3797 mer0
14:26<Yorick>Ammller: those are compressed using zlib, and
14:27<De_Ghost>u know
14:27<De_Ghost>we can jsut /whois u
14:27<Ammller>Yorick: and?
14:27<@peter1138>Ammller, it's not that simple. With tars you can just read directly from the file...
14:28<Ammller>ah, I understand, it doesn't need to unpack it first
14:28<Ammller>but that would be needed, if its a tar.gz
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14:33<Luukland>Router setting is: Accespoint, i believe that an accespoint just forwards the port automatically?
14:34<@peter1138>No, an access point is just an access point. Nothing to do with port forwarding.
14:34-!-planetmaker is now known as pm|away
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14:35<Luukland>Hmmm, than i should add some portforwarding rules to my router... And since it says: NAT disabled, I am getting nowhere :p
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14:39-!-mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ
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14:40<Rexxars>it's the one they call Bjarni!
14:40<Prof_Frink>It's an impostor
14:41<@Bjarni>to be or not to be
14:41<@Bjarni>that's the question
14:41<@Bjarni>I might be and I might not be
14:41<@Bjarni>it's up to you to figure it out
14:41<Yorick>you are identified...
14:41<Prof_Frink>user has identified to services
14:42<@Bjarni>it could be faked
14:42<Yorick>[20:42] -NickServ- 3 (online, identified by access list)
14:42<Yorick>you must be at bjarni's home...
14:42<@Bjarni>I could have hacked the nickserver
14:43-!-helb [~helb@] has joined #openttd
14:43<Prof_Frink>Or tortured the real Bjarni for his nickserv pass
14:44<Yorick>he's idenified by access list
14:44<Yorick>I only believe someone is real when he's identified using SSL cert
14:44-!-Yorick is now known as yorick_
14:44-!-yorick_ is now known as yorick
14:44<yorick>[20:44] -NickServ- You are connected using SSL and have provided a matching client certificate
14:44<yorick>[20:44] -NickServ- for nickname yorick. You have been automatically identified.
14:44<yorick>[20:44] -NickServ- 4 (online, identified by SSL certificate)
14:48<yorick>hmm...I need something that lets me create #? file under windws
14:58<Luukland>:( I have placed a switch between me and my modem now, but still nothing :( * /me cries out loud *
15:06<+glx>Luukland: bind_ip can stay
15:06<+glx>you don't have to set connect_to_ip
15:06<Luukland>hmmmz ok let me try
15:06<+glx>you just need to open UDP and TCP port on your machine (firewall) and forward them on the router
15:07-!-yorick is now known as Yorick|AFK
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15:08<Luukland>i have no more router :P Just a switch :p
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15:19<Luukland>argh, still nothin'
15:19<Luukland>I am getting crazy
15:20-!-Yorick|AFK is now known as titanic
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15:20<@Bjarni>yet another person going crazy on IRC
15:20<Luukland>The dedicated server starts and loads, even some IP's of people are getting shown with frame numbers, and sometimes a recv error arrives
15:20*HMage is crazy already
15:20<Prof_Frink>Crazy? I passed there ages ago.
15:20<@Bjarni>we noticed
15:21<Gonozal_VIII>people that aren't crazy are missing out all the fun
15:22<Prof_Frink>Sanity is overrated.
15:22<@Bjarni>but you never tried it?
15:22<@Bjarni>so how do you know?
15:24<Sacro>I'M SPARTA
15:25<Sacro>[20:20] * titanic has quit (Quit: Eccess flood) <- pmsl XD
15:26<@Bjarni>do you guys know ARToolKit?
15:26<Prof_Frink>Sacro: I'm afraid that's classed as [FAIL]
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15:27<Roujin>Bjarni: AR as in...?
15:27*Sacro gets on the failboat
15:27<@Bjarni>I guess not
15:27*SpComb sinks Sacro's battleship
15:27<@Bjarni>it's a tool to put 3D objects into video streams
15:28<@Bjarni> <--- it actually looks pretty nice
15:28<Prof_Frink>i can has iceburg?
15:28<@Bjarni>real time rendered o_O
15:28<Sacro>OpenTTDreamCast :D
15:29<@Bjarni>Sacro: in your dreams :P
15:29<Sacro>Bjarni: you don't know my dreams
15:29-!-Luukland [] has quit [Quit: Bye for now!]
15:29<@Bjarni>and I'm thankful for that
15:33<@Bjarni>no comments about 3D graphics?
15:34<@Bjarni>damn you even give geeks a weird idea about this channel :s
15:35<planetmaker>^^ people are watching the movie :P
15:35<Roujin>aahh, so AR in ARToolKit does stand for augmented reality like i suspected, cool
15:35<planetmaker>pretty amazing, if done in real time.
15:36<Roujin>I've held a proseminar at university about augmented reality
15:36<Roujin>AR rocks ^^
15:37<@Bjarni>I think it's done in real time
15:37<@Bjarni>but I didn't really try it
15:37<@Bjarni>haven't had the time to do so (yet?)
15:37<@Bjarni>but it's freeware :D
15:39<Roujin>the universities of graz and wien in austria have done a lot of AR stuff aswell, i've noticed during research for my proseminar -
15:46-!-Roujin is now known as Roujin[afk]
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16:08<Sacro>oh noes
16:08<Sacro>what are you doing here
16:09<@Bjarni>dragonhorseboy: are you here to bully Sacro?
16:10<@Bjarni>it's a question, not a statement
16:10<Sacro>so is this
16:11<dragonhorseboy>very funny :p
16:11<dragonhorseboy>I was just curious about one thing...
16:11<dragonhorseboy>anyone ever talked about putting cooperation gameplay back into openttd or its probably just going to be stuck to the old mini-in and no further?
16:12<Sacro>dragonhorseboy: different companies but same tracks?
16:16-!-Osai [] has quit [Quit: bye bye]
16:16<dragonhorseboy>sacro no idea I presume? :p
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16:17<Sacro>dragonhorseboy: not heard owt from LOTP for ages
16:20<dragonhorseboy>thanks anyhow
16:21<dragonhorseboy>I used to like that thought some time ago....
16:21<dragonhorseboy>you wouldn't believe how much of my trains were not ever on my own rails at all even for a few express trains too *rolls eyes*
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16:35*Vikthor will do some shameless advertising
16:35<Sacro>KICK HIM XD
16:35<Vikthor>dragonhorseboy: Check out this thread
16:36<Vikthor>Sacro: It's on-topic advertising as you can see :D
16:37<dragonhorseboy>vikthor :p
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16:44<CIA-1>OpenTTD: peter1138 * r12314 /trunk/src/newgrf_engine.cpp: -Fix (r4896): Include prop 25 data for all train parts, not just those that carry cargo.
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16:55<Prof_Frink>Will there be a party in 31 commits time?
16:56<Prof_Frink>Or even better, make 0.6.0 == r12345
16:57<Gonozal_VIII>somehow i doubt that
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17:02<@peter1138>Hmm, I can’t even be bothered to reply to OzTransLtd...
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18:44<Progman>checking out the openttd svn via fisheye takes about 3 days o_O
18:46<Sacro>inConnection = new MySqlConnection(conStrBuilder.GetConnectionString(false));
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19:18<CIA-1>OpenTTD: truebrain * r12315 /branches/noai/ (4 files in 2 dirs): [NoAI] -Fix: AITunnel::GetOtherTunnelEnd() now also works to estimate where a non-existing tunnel would end (Morloth / glx)
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19:22<Gonozal_VIII>non existing tunnel :S
19:25<+glx>Gonozal_VIII: when planing a route
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19:37<fjb>Nice to see all the work on the ai.
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19:50<fjb>Playing with the original road vehicles only in a game has one big disadvantage. They hardly make enough profit to buy new vehicles when they are getting old.
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20:36<fjb>My sand-castle is more important than your sand-castle.
20:36*fjb should stop reading the forum.
20:39<Poopsmith>i'll sand-castle you in a minute
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20:40<fjb>Try it. :-)
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20:43<Poopsmith>nah, the beach is too far away
20:45<fjb>That is really sad.
20:46<lobster>NO U
20:46*Poopsmith is bored.
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20:46<Poopsmith>it's one of those days where you think "oh, must be about 5pm" then look at the clock and discover it's only quarter to three
20:48<fjb>My multiplayer game is boring now.
20:48<Poopsmith>yeah, thats the problem i'm having
20:48<Poopsmith>was thinking of trying a coop game for something different, but its using a nightly that doesnt seem to work on mac
20:48<Poopsmith>(it being the openttdcoop public server)
20:49<+glx>try the ppc mac nightly
20:49<Poopsmith>oh, ok... i'll give it a try
20:51<fjb>We are having a friendly competitive game.
20:52<fjb>The problem ist that the original road vehicles are the only vehicles in the game. Sounded like fun at first, but it is a bit boring.
20:54<Poopsmith>problem on my game seems to be that the others don't seem to be playing anymore
20:54<fjb>That is also boring.
20:54<fjb>I'm spending all my money on replacing old vehicles.
20:55<Poopsmith>glx: thanks, the ppc version works
20:56<Poopsmith>i think thats the first non-universal app i've run on this mac o_O
20:56<fjb>Should be a bit smaller then.
20:57<Sacro>that's what she said
20:57<Poopsmith>yeah, but a bit slower, cos of the emulation
20:58<fjb>Sacro: Don't talk about thinks you don't know about.
21:04<fjb>That vehicles have a small payload.
21:06<Gonozal_VIII>payload? are you delivering to your moonbase or something?
21:08<fjb>How else do you call the load that gets payed for.
21:09<Gonozal_VIII>payload is for rockets and maybe planes...
21:09<fjb>That truck has a small cargo. Sounds wrong.
21:09<Gonozal_VIII>well... payload may be correct but it sounds strange too
21:10<fjb>I don't think is sounds that strange. Why should that term be limited to flying objects?
21:10<Eddi|zuHause3>i would translate "payload" with "useable capacity"
21:11<Gonozal_VIII>maybe it's just my association...
21:12<fjb>Better your association than your assasination.
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21:16<fjb>Profit is only about 20% of the running costs.
21:16<Gonozal_VIII>sounds good
21:16<Gonozal_VIII>good investment :-)
21:18<fjb>Original road vehicles only in that game. No trains, no ships, no planes, no vehicle grf.
21:20<Eddi|zuHause3>grr... autoroad urgently needs a visual representation of the selected road bit
21:20<fjb>272 vehicles, income 9798336, running costs 7544028.
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21:20<fjb>Eddi|zuHause3: That would sometimes help.
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---Logclosed Fri Feb 29 00:00:21 2008