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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-07-04

---Logopened Sat Jul 04 00:00:26 2009
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06:40<TrueBrain>who here has IE8 and a normal knowledge of javascript debugging?
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07:24<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16735 /trunk/src/ (saveload/station_sl.cpp station_base.h): -Codechange: had_vehicle_of_type only stored 7 bits, all less that bit 7... but it was a word wasting space etc.
07:27<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16736 /trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: give some station enums a name and use that instead of 'byte'.
07:48<andythenorth_>what direction does the light come from in TTD graphics?
07:51<andythenorth_>that's what I figured
07:51<andythenorth_>Either I misunderstand shading...
07:51<andythenorth_>...or Simon Foster made a deliberate choice to shade houses wrong because it looks better
07:52<planetmaker>gcc / g++ 4.5 from 26 June fails to build OpenTTD:
07:52<planetmaker>Yes, I know, it's not a stable compiler version :)
07:52<TrueBrain>I think he was VERY concerned about realism, yes ...
07:53<planetmaker>But I think the warning on the Korean language might be of interest even now.
07:53<andythenorth_>well whatever the reason, I've got quite a bit of reshading to do :|
07:53<Rubidium>planetmaker: the Korean thing isn't important
07:54<TrueBrain>planetmaker: already taken care of; you are slow ;)
07:54<planetmaker>Rubidium: I know. It's a warning :)
07:54<planetmaker>TrueBrain: ?
07:54<Rubidium>planetmaker: and fixed...
07:54<TrueBrain>Rubidium: well, not 'fixed' as such, just taken care of :)
07:54<planetmaker>ah, the language thing
07:54<Rubidium>planetmaker: w.r.t. gcc; you're not using the apple flavour of gcc
07:55<planetmaker>Rubidium: It's a self-compiled gcc.
07:55<Rubidium>planetmaker: self-compiled vanilla! gcc
07:55<Rubidium>planetmaker: you should self-compile Apple's GCC
07:55<planetmaker>Hm... yes. Hm... I need obviously some apple patches?
07:56<Rubidium>apple uses LLVM + GCC + custom stuff
07:56<Rubidium>i.e. just download the gcc tarbal from darwinsource
07:56<planetmaker>Right... but they direct one to the gcc repository for sources... Well, I guess I'll give it a try with ^^
07:57<Rubidium>but... apple does only do gcc 4.0 and gcc 4.2
07:57<Rubidium>the other solution is just not adding those params to the CFLAGS in config.lib
07:58<TrueBrain>document.getElementById("gender").value <- works on most browsers .. just not on IE :(
07:58<TrueBrain>clearly not many people use IE for WT3 :p
07:58<planetmaker>yes. gcc 4.0 is broken for e.g. nforenum with those C style template messages - which are just not valid
07:59<planetmaker>Ok, I guess I have some more compilation to do then. Thanks Rubidium :)
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08:06<TrueBrain>WT3 is IE compatible .. or at least, so it seems ;)
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08:10<TrueBrain>what is it with the endless hit-and-runs lately?
08:11<JFBelugas>people may beleive we're always talking chooo chooo. so when silence, or no chooo chooo related, they leave... who knows
08:12<JFBelugas>or... not russian, as this guy might have been...
08:20<CIA-1>OpenTTD: frosch * r16737 /trunk/src/newgrf.cpp: -Fix (r15645): When loading a savegame Engine::grffile might be left NULL in certain cases. (dynamic_engines enabled, articulated vehicle with only wagon-override action3s)
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09:41<_ln>apple is shifting away from GCC anyway.
09:45<gleeb>Silly apple-face.
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09:50<planetmaker>_ln: can you backup your statement?
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09:54<TrueBrain>planetmaker: I think _ln doesn't know what LLVM is
09:55<CIA-1>OpenTTD: alberth * r16738 /trunk/src/ai/ai_info.cpp: -Codechange: Remove casting away constness by changing the text before storing.
09:59<planetmaker>nor did I.
09:59<planetmaker>primary components of the LLVM infrastructure are a GCC-based C & C++ front-end,
09:59<TrueBrain>LLVM is the middle man; it doesn't produce executable code
09:59<planetmaker>tells me it's something between IDE and compiler actually :)
10:00<TrueBrain>it does the preprocessing and optimization of a programming language
10:00<TrueBrain>(not limited to C in any way)
10:00<TrueBrain>then it feeds an universal language to a linker, GCC in most cases
10:00<TrueBrain>so it does take over parts of the compiler ;)
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10:09<_ln>TrueBrain: but another thing that can be found out from that article (and other sources) is that Apple considers GPL a problem.
10:09<_ln>TrueBrain: and indeed they are sticking to 4.2 because that's the last version licensed under GPLv2(+).
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10:10<TrueBrain>Apple has given no public knowledge about dropping GCC completely in any way
10:10<TrueBrain>the GPL problem you refer to, is mostly solved via clang (which is a llvm subproject)
10:13<CIA-1>OpenTTD: alberth * r16739 /trunk/src/town_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Initialize internal data before computing the widgets.
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10:19<planetmaker>interesting stuff that LLVM :)
10:20<planetmaker>today again the search function and the related function of wt3 ruled :)
10:20<TrueBrain>:) Glad to hear :)
10:20<planetmaker>I guess compared to wt2 it's twice as fast from the user handling
10:21<planetmaker>One thing I wondered though: I changed two strings and then thought better of it. Is there an undo function?
10:21<TrueBrain>change it back to the original
10:21<TrueBrain>and it should undo itself :)
10:22<planetmaker>Feature request: "revert" ;)
10:22<TrueBrain>yeah, will be done .. some day ;)
10:22<planetmaker>(only in the "pending" category necessary, I guess)
10:32<Alberth>Maybe I should move into 'core0', the room is 28.5 degrees, while my core thinks its temperature is 25 degrees.
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11:35<CIA-1>OpenTTD: alberth * r16740 /trunk/src/ (6 files): -Codechange: Self-sizing widgets in intro screen, town directory, and found town windows.
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11:39<TrueBrain>lala .. lalalalalalala! lala! lalalalala! La la la!
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12:44*Sacro bops to the ttd theme
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13:10<SSTC>can anyone help me set up an openttd server on a nas server with linux?
13:10<Ammler>SSTC: what did you try and how looks the error message
13:12<SSTC>I tried to upload the data dir, bin file and that config file thing.. after that I tried ssh to it and start it with "openttd -D"
13:13<Alberth>nas = Network-attached storage (ie a NFS/Samba file server)
13:13<SSTC>yes.. also ftp I have link to it
13:14<SSTC>here it is
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13:19<Cutter>why don't you move to freenode?
13:19<Rubidium>because a) we moved away from freenode
13:19<SmatZ>other bug projects, like gcc, have official IRC channel at OFTC too
13:20<Rubidium>b) they're dicks; for example I'm immediately kicked from #openttd on freenode
13:20<TrueBrain>c) why would we move if we like it here?
13:20<TrueBrain>d) what a silly question as introduction of yourself
13:21<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16741 /branches/0.7/src/ (8 files in 4 dirs): (log message trimmed)
13:21<CIA-1>OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
13:21<CIA-1>OpenTTD: - Fix: When loading a savegame Engine::grffile might be left NULL in certain cases (dynamic_engines enabled, articulated vehicle with only wagon-override action3s) (r16737)
13:21<CIA-1>OpenTTD: - Fix: Show Close instead of Cancel when there is nothing to canel in the content downloading window [FS#2991] (r16732)
13:21<CIA-1>OpenTTD: - Fix: [NoAI] AIDepotList contained wrong tiles for hangars when st->xy != st->airport_tile (r16731)
13:21<CIA-1>OpenTTD: - Fix: The Join station window did not show all stations nearby in some cases (r16728)
13:21<CIA-1>OpenTTD: - Fix: Invalidate subsidies with invalid source or destination when converting older savegames (r16710)
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13:21<Rubidium>e) have they finally fixed kicking people for NO reason?
13:21-!-fonsinchen [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:21<Cutter>is your nick registered?
13:21<Rubidium>'NO' reason like 'being idle for 15 minutes'
13:22<Cutter>I'm idle most of the time
13:22<TrueBrain>f) at least OFTC doesn't bug you over and over with useless messages from operators who think they are very important
13:22<TrueBrain>oeh, we can continue with this ranting at freenode for a while
13:23<Cutter>what happened to make #openttd move away from freenode?
13:23<TrueBrain>all the above? :p
13:23<Rubidium>Cutter: have you been following what comments we've got w.r.t. freenode?
13:23<Rubidium>maybe it has become better since lilo died though
13:24<TrueBrain>how ever it might be, I tihnk OFTC is perfectly fine :)
13:24<TrueBrain>and why move again? :)
13:25<Sacro>Rubidium: there is no #openttd on freenode
13:25<Sacro>##openttd maybe
13:25<TrueBrain>Sacro: for a lnog time, if you joined #openttd, you got redirected
13:25<TrueBrain>and kicked a bit later :p
13:25<TrueBrain>because we 'removed' the channel
13:26<Sacro>## is unofficial
13:26<Sacro>like for ##php
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13:27<SmatZ>and the reason to move to Freenode is?
13:28<Rubidium>tss... they don't even provide SSL connections to the IRC server :(
13:28<Sacro>SmatZ: netsplits
13:28<Sacro>they were fun
13:28<TrueBrain>and after every netsplit lilo started to talk .. omg .. that really annoyed the hell out of me
13:28<TrueBrain>NOBODY cares why a server dropepd from the grid
13:28<TrueBrain>it happens
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13:28<TrueBrain>deal with it
13:29<Cutter>SmatZ: freenode is the server where most of the free software project have their channels
13:29<Sacro>TrueBrain: he never dealt with it
13:29<TrueBrain>(although it happened on freenode more often than what would be considered normal)
13:29<Sacro>he just told us :(
13:29<TrueBrain>Cutter: bullshit
13:29<Cutter>that's where I naturally looked for an openttd channel
13:29<TrueBrain>Cutter: OFTC is created for open source software projects ... and if you check the channel list, there are plenty
13:29<TrueBrain>to name #debian, for one
13:29<TrueBrain>your mistake ;)
13:30<TrueBrain>it is silly to require from us to comply to your habbits ;)
13:32<Rubidium>The Open and Free Technology Community aims to provide stable and effective collaboration services to members of the community in any part of the world, while closely listening to their needs and desires. <- those intentions sound more clear than freenode's main page
13:35<Eddi|zuHause>freenode has an experimental irc server with ssl support
13:39<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16742 /branches/0.7/ (15 files in 4 dirs):
13:39<CIA-1>OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
13:39<CIA-1>OpenTTD: - Fix: Only pay for whatever has been actually unloaded and perform the payment when unloading has finished [FS#2995] (r16694)
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: translators * r16743 /trunk/src/lang/german.txt:
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: german - 18 changes by planetmaker
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14:05<_ln>i've been told it's mandatory to carry some sort of ID all the time in the nether lands. what about germany and such?
14:10<Eddi|zuHause>whenever the police asks you, you need to show a valid ID
14:11<_ln>what happens if you don't have anything to show with you?
14:11<Eddi|zuHause>you probably get fined...
14:11<Eddi|zuHause>and they take you to the police station
14:11<Eddi|zuHause>until they figure out your identity
14:12<Eddi|zuHause>especially as a foreign person, i'd rather not recommend that :p
14:12<Alberth>if you start dancing on police cars, there is a good chance they will ask for your ID :p
14:14<_ln>a policeman once stopped me here in finland, and asked for ID, but i didn't have any with me... but we also don't have a law requiring to carry ID.
14:29<_ln>actually, over here it is not even mandatory to own any kind of ID.
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14:55<SSTC>can anyone help me set up an openttd server on a nas server with linux?
14:59<TrueBrain>[19:10] <Ammler> SSTC: what did you try and how looks the error message
14:59<TrueBrain>you only answered the first part
14:59<TrueBrain>and my glass bowl is still damanged :(
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15:00<SSTC>I was not able to start anything from ssh so I do not have at error message
15:01<TrueBrain>"after that I tried ssh to it and start it with "openttd -D"" <- then you do need to explain why you were not able
15:01<TrueBrain>you are very vague .. don't expect us to guess. Be more specific. What do you do, what goes wrong, ...
15:01<TrueBrain>"I was not able" is not really .. useful ;)
15:02<SSTC>there was no command "openttd -D" I have not startede at server before and knows nothing about what I should do..
15:03<Ammler>SSTC: I would start with installing openttd from the distro you use.
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15:04<@Belugas>ho fuck...
15:05<Rubidium>Belugas: don't tell me your customer called with bad news, please
15:05<TrueBrain>SSTC: also consider using: ./openttd -D ;)
15:05<SSTC>I know
15:05<@Belugas>no today, yet, Rubidium. yesterday evening he did more once often, to day is quite, at least :D
15:06<@Belugas>no, it was about something else... sorry
15:15<TrueBrain>SSTC: on one hand you tell us you know nothing about anything, and when we suggest something, you say you know .. please tell us EXACTLY what you are trying, else we really can't help you
15:15<TrueBrain>(and more: what EXACTLY the system tells you what goes wrong)
15:15<TrueBrain>again: we can't read the starts ... :(
15:15<TrueBrain>starts = stars, lol
15:15<SSTC>i know that it is ./openttd -D
15:16<TrueBrain>and then the system tells you .... what?
15:18<SSTC>./openttd: cannot execute binary file
15:18<TrueBrain>see .. now that is helpful
15:18<TrueBrain>you are trying to execute a binary format which is incompatible
15:18<TrueBrain>for example, if you try i386-elf on a arm-elf system
15:19<TrueBrain>as it is a NAS, it wouldn't suprise me if it was arm
15:19<TrueBrain>what does: uname -a
15:19<SSTC>Linux QNNAS #6 Wed Mar 18 14:51:18 CST 2009 armv5tejl unknown
15:19<TrueBrain>see :)
15:19<Sacro>as well as 'file `which openttd`'
15:19<TrueBrain>and see how important it is to tell us EXACTLY what is going on? Specific, to the point, and copy/pastes :)
15:20<TrueBrain>anyway, either compile a arm version yourself, or download the debian version (if they have it :p)
15:20<TrueBrain>executing 'file openttd' most likely shows you i386 or what ever binary you tried to install
15:20<_ln>although... your ARM might be too slow for openttd.
15:20<Rubidium>TrueBrain: then it's even the question whether you need the arm or armel binary
15:20<TrueBrain>v5 .. should be fine; the only problem might be the memory
15:20<Sacro>yeah, i'd reckon on that _ln
15:20<_ln>and too little memory.
15:21<Sacro>my housemate had his nas indexing id3 tags, 60GB of music, took 10 days
15:21<TrueBrain>Sacro: more an IO problem
15:21<_ln>SSTC: do a "free -m"; what's the number under 'total'?
15:21<TrueBrain>not really related to the CPU, don't you think? :)
15:22<TrueBrain>changing ID3v2 tags on my system even takes N hours for 20GB :p
15:22<Sacro>TrueBrain: hmm, it was only a 40Mhz
15:22<TrueBrain>Sacro: okay, then it does matter ;) :p
15:22<SSTC> 126224
15:23<TrueBrain>126 MB .. might be sufficient ;)
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15:30<TrueBrain>no problem, we loved to help ...
15:30<TrueBrain>next time .. wash your hands before I need to hold them, they were a bit sticky
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15:38<SmatZ>the lost vikings, yay!
15:38<SmatZ>I never finished MSTR
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15:38<SmatZ>I hope I am old enough to finish it finally...
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16:04<@Belugas>MIght Stay Tonigh, Really?
16:17<Muxy>kiss men
16:17<TrueBrain>thank you for that contribution
16:18<Muxy>ur welcome
16:20<Eddi|zuHause>"ur" is not a word, what you mean is "urst" (
16:20<Muxy>ur is just phonetic
16:21-!-Cutter [] has quit []
16:21<Eddi|zuHause>not in my phonetic understanding
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16:22<Muxy>us, gb, or aus i think it is
16:22<Eddi|zuHause>yes, but the people from these places are a minority
16:23<Muxy>sure, but it's phonetic english, isn'it ?
16:23<Muxy>but u said yes just before
16:23<Eddi|zuHause>there is an international standard about how to write phonetically
16:24<TrueBrain>[jore] most likely, with an accent on the e
16:25<Rubidium>Pronunciation: \yər, ˈyu̇r, ˈyȯr, ˌyü-ər\ according to Merriam-Webster
16:25<TrueBrain>with an y, that does suprise me :)
16:26<Rubidium>:O the IPA way of writing is much nicer
16:26<TrueBrain>haha :)
16:27<Rubidium>/jɔː(ɹ)/ <- that's much clearer
16:27<TrueBrain>that I can't even read :p y^or I can ;)
16:28<Muxy>ok, i remove phonetic and i replace with a short way to write.
16:28<TrueBrain>didn;t know you used your mobile to text to IRC :)
16:28<Eddi|zuHause>then you can join yesterday's discussion about overuse of abbreviations
16:29<Muxy>if it was yesterday, i will not be able to join it.
16:30<TrueBrain>oeh, points for Muxy
16:30<TrueBrain>your turn Eddi|zuHause
16:30<TrueBrain>(it feels like Jerry Springer, but than better!)
16:30<Muxy>dont know Jerry Springer
16:30<Eddi|zuHause>and the discussion was never officially closed
16:30<TrueBrain>@kick Eddi|zuHause don't take it out on me :)
16:30-!-Eddi|zuHause was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [don't take it out on me :)]
16:30-!-Eddi|zuHause [] has joined #openttd
16:30-!-[alt]buster [] has joined #openttd
16:31<Eddi|zuHause>sorry, it's a reflex ;)
16:31<TrueBrain>You don't know Jerry Springer?!
16:31<TrueBrain>You should be ashamed!
16:31-!-Polygon [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:31<Muxy>why should i know him, as you dont know what is Goulp
16:31<Rubidium>tbrukbin'm? <- I can do writing in short too
16:31<Eddi|zuHause>the same reflex that hits on "ur" also hits on "than" [when "then" is meant]
16:31-!-[com]buster [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:32<_ln>IF ; THAN ; ELSE
16:32<Rubidium>Eddi|zuHause: rather "then" when "than" is meant
16:32<TrueBrain>Eddi|zuHause: there is a difference :)
16:32<Eddi|zuHause>also compare
16:33*Rubidium wonders why nobody understands what I was writing... they are such simple abbreviations
16:33<Eddi|zuHause>also confusion between "als" and "wie"
16:33<Rubidium>if not sure, rewrite sentence to avoid stuff you're not sure about
16:33<Eddi|zuHause>Rubidium: might as well be a character from stargate :p
16:34<TrueBrain>Rubidium: rewriting without then/than is almost impossible :p
16:35-!-[alt]buster is now known as [com]buster
16:35<Rubidium>a is bigger than b -> a is the bigger of the two, I kicked him then I banned him -> before I banned him I kicked him Q.E.D.
16:36<TrueBrain>hahaha :) So if statement A implies statement B, statement B has to imply statement A?
16:36<TrueBrain>A few math-professors now turn their back in their grave :p
16:37<Eddi|zuHause>even the living ones :p
16:37<TrueBrain>auch ;)
16:42-!-ashchetum [] has joined #openttd
16:44<ashchetum>so whats up here?
16:45<Eddi|zuHause>i have stopped commenting strange nicks long ago, but with this one, i have not even a clue how to pronounce it :p
16:45<@Belugas>yeah! Supper is ready. I serve it in 10 minutes. Everyone is invited at my table!
16:45<TrueBrain>Belugas: let me get on my flight
16:45<_ln>ashchetum: it's the cross product of two vectors parallel to the ground
16:45<TrueBrain>be there in 6
16:45<Eddi|zuHause>"'s ist noch Suppe da"
16:45<ashchetum>ash-chetum (chetum is like chetter chees with a um on the end)
16:45<@Belugas>TrueBrain, not the ^th of JULY :P
16:46*ashchetum shoots off fireworks
16:46<@Belugas>arg... 6
16:46<@Belugas>not ^
16:46<Eddi|zuHause>i'm not a chese person, but i know it as "cheddar"
16:46<TrueBrain>enjoy your supper Belugas :)
16:46<ashchetum>so what if i misspell it?
16:46<@Belugas>Ashepsu !
16:46*Belugas bows
16:47<@Belugas>hmmm... nope
16:47<Eddi|zuHause>if you misspell the pronunciation, i cannot pronounce it
16:47<ashchetum>ahh, I see
16:47*Rubidium wonders how to pronounce Eddi|zuHause's |
16:47<TrueBrain>Eddi Pipes ZuHause!
16:47-!-noogie [] has joined #openttd
16:48<TrueBrain>and if in a bad translation mood I translate that to: Eddi Pipes His House
16:48<Rubidium>TrueBrain: and now translate to Dtuch...
16:48<Eddi|zuHause>Rubidium: the same way you pronounce hyphens and commas in plain text?
16:48<TrueBrain>I am laughing in silent when I translate that in Dutch ;)
16:48<TrueBrain>hehe @ Rubidium :)
16:48<Muxy>hum not his house but at home
16:48<Eddi|zuHause>Muxy: he specified "bad translation"
16:48<TrueBrain>Muxy: NO SHIT?!
16:49<ashchetum>whatch that language
16:49<Muxy>appologies - Kiss then
16:49<noogie>hey if i no longer serve a station with a particular cargo, can i tell the station so that the ..industry doesnt put cargo there?
16:50<Muxy>destroy station
16:50<ashchetum>I cant get ottd to work on my new laptop..... :(
16:50<TrueBrain>Muxy: I am not gay, sorry
16:50<Muxy>hum, kiss does not imply gay
16:50<Rubidium>TrueBrain: but pipes has not the Dutch 'meaning' in English as far as I know; for those that want to know: fellatio is the magic word
16:50*ashchetum slaps face
16:51<TrueBrain>Rubidium: ghehe :)
16:51<noogie>hmm i would but its got like 30 trains running to it
16:51<ashchetum>I cant play openttd :/
16:51<Muxy>reroute trains
16:52<noogie>yeah its hassle
16:52<noogie>a "i'm no longer gonna pick up from this station" button would be much easier
16:53<Eddi|zuHause>yes, but nobody implemented it
16:53<noogie>has been added a feature request?
16:53<Eddi|zuHause>actually, people did implement it
16:53<Eddi|zuHause>but it was open to abuse/cheating
16:54<noogie>what was it called... i wasnt really sure what to google for
16:54<Eddi|zuHause>because it would reset the station rating to the default value
17:03-!-Muxy [] has quit [Quit: Back to the Goulp]
17:04-!-Muxy [] has joined #openttd
17:06<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16744 /branches/0.7/src/ (12 files in 2 dirs):
17:06<CIA-1>OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
17:06<CIA-1>OpenTTD: - Fix: r16660 and r16669 are needed to make r16709 work as it should.
17:06<CIA-1>OpenTTD: - Fix: some small 'errors' in the English language file
17:07-!-Azrael- [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:10<planetmaker>mäh. 500 @
17:10<Rubidium>works fine for me
17:12<ashchetum>OH NO!!!! openttd hates me!: kyle@bigeee:~$ openttd Your 'TRG1R.GRF' file is corrupted or missing! You can find 'TRG1R.GRF' on your Transport Tycoon Deluxe CD-ROM. Your 'TRGIR.GRF' file is corrupted or missing! You can find 'TRGIR.GRF' on your Transport Tycoon Deluxe CD-ROM. Your 'TRGCR.GRF' file is corrupted or missing! You can find 'TRGCR.GRF' on your Tran
17:12<ashchetum>ransport Tycoon Deluxe CD-ROM. Your 'TRGTR.GRF' file is corrupted or missing! You can find 'TRGTR.GRF' on your Transport Tycoon Deluxe CD-ROM. Your '' file is corrupted or missing! You can find '' on your Transport Tycoon Deluxe CD-ROM. Error: Cannot open file '' kyle@bigeee:~$
17:12<planetmaker>ashchetum: well. Get those files
17:12<ashchetum>thats the proplem
17:12<ashchetum>there there
17:12<planetmaker>how so?
17:12<Rubidium>OH NO!!! ashchetum hates reading readme.txt
17:13<ashchetum>no i've installed openttd sevral times, but i just cant get it to work now
17:13<planetmaker>ashchetum: those files are not part of the install... And READ the text :)
17:13<planetmaker>It talks about TTD. Not OpenTTD
17:13<Rubidium>ashchetum: have you read readme.txt?
17:14<ashchetum>do you want me to read it again?!
17:14<planetmaker>Cite the paragraph dealing with those files ^^^^
17:14<Rubidium>yes, especially chapter 4
17:15<planetmaker>Rubidium: your server has a 500 error...
17:15<ashchetum>fine i'll go back to it, but i'm telling you thows filese are there, i'll renstall and take the needed files streaght from my ttd folder and put them there, but every time i renstall it it says that it can't open the file
17:15<Rubidium>planetmaker: my server?
17:16<ashchetum>but the corupeted files are a new problem
17:16<planetmaker>your in the sense of "you OpenTTD dev's website" :)
17:16<planetmaker>plural you :)
17:16<Rubidium>it works fine for me
17:17<ashchetum>um.... wheres the readme?
17:17<Rubidium>that is works fine for me
17:17<planetmaker>hm... ok. Not everything :) but the hg shortlog fails for me
17:17<planetmaker>sorry :)
17:17<planetmaker>ashchetum: I think you read it?
17:17<Rubidium>oh... planetmaker then say so!
17:18<ashchetum>is there a online readme?
17:18<planetmaker>ashchetum: also that
17:18<planetmaker>see the channel topic
17:18<Rubidium>the online readme is the same as the non-online readme
17:18<Rubidium>planetmaker: hmm... what I feared would happen has happened
17:18<ashchetum>ya but i lost the offline version
17:18<planetmaker>Rubidium: ?
17:19<planetmaker>ashchetum: unlikely unless you explicitly deleted it.
17:19<planetmaker>it's in the same dir as your binary
17:19<ashchetum>lol idk what the hell happened
17:19<ashchetum>i'll try a few things and come back later
17:19<planetmaker>yes please
17:19-!-ashchetum is now known as ashchetum_working
17:19<Rubidium>planetmaker: a couple, like 4, processes are constantly 'leaking' memory. They get killed when they reach a certain threshold. Now all those processes are near their 'kill it off' peak
17:20<planetmaker>Doesn't sound good
17:20-!-andythenorth_ [~andy@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:22<Rubidium>planetmaker: yeah... especially when the people of the processes that leak can't be arsed to fix it
17:22<Rubidium>and using another similar tool is even worse
17:22<Eddi|zuHause>hold your finger on the leak
17:22<ashchetum_working>ok, i uninstalled the 0.6.3 version from the reprository, i'm going to get 0.7.1 off of the website now
17:22<Rubidium>Eddi|zuHause: it's not that is 'leaks', it's that it 'caches' WITHOUT limit
17:23-!-Polygon [] has joined #openttd
17:23-!-ashchetum_working [] has quit [Quit: ajax IRC Client]
17:23-!-ashchetum [] has joined #openttd
17:23<Rubidium>their solution of limiting: ulimit and killing the whole thing
17:23-!-ashchetum is now known as ashchetum_working
17:23<Rubidium>welcome to the 21st century of software development :(
17:24<ashchetum_working>downloading, maby openttd does'nt like the intel atom.... lol
17:25<planetmaker>that's most probably not a problem
17:25<Rubidium>don't see a reason why a specific processor wouldn't like OpenTTD
17:26<ashchetum_working>no i was kidding
17:26<Rubidium>maybe the very old and 'fancy' ones, but the recent common stuff
17:26<planetmaker>it runs on so many different platform that a platform with the same OS makes no difference
17:26<planetmaker>hey, it even works here :)
17:27<ashchetum_working>hey does anybody know where the readme is in linux?
17:27<Rubidium>/usr/share/openttd/ ?
17:28<Rubidium>/usr/share/doc/openttd/ ?
17:28<Rubidium>linux is kinda a ... uhm... broad thing
17:28<ashchetum_working>no shit! sorry, i bet it is in usr share openttd
17:28<ashchetum_working>i was looking in usr share games openttd
17:29<Rubidium>it's like asking: what is the default file format of my word processor?
17:29<Rubidium>i.e. it would make sense to mention what flavour of Linux you're using
17:30<ashchetum_working>eebuntu (ubuntu jaunty)
17:30<ashchetum_working>na there isnt any "usr share openttd
17:30<Rubidium>and you installed the .deb, right?
17:31*planetmaker still doesn't understand why people install OpenTTD...
17:31<noogie>usr share doc openttd
17:31<noogie>on debian at least
17:31<ashchetum_working>hmmm. ok
17:31<noogie>i assume its same package
17:32<Rubidium>hmm, didn't I say /usr/share/doc/openttd/ already a few minutes ago?
17:32-!-Nite_Owl [] has joined #openttd
17:32<Rubidium>wasn't that said to be not it?
17:32<ashchetum_working>ok, found the readme, personally i think that it was hidden or something.... oh whell
17:32<Nite_Owl>Hello all
17:32-!-ashchetum_working is now known as ashcetum_reading-readme
17:33<Rubidium> <- might've been easier ;)
17:33<noogie>also has any ever though about implementing like a counter way point, that will count trains going through it
17:33-!-Lakie [~Lakie@] has joined #openttd
17:33<Rubidium>based on the patches on the forum: guess so
17:34<ashcetum_reading-readme>Rubidum: well I asked for the online version a while agao....
17:34<noogie>ah yeah
17:34<planetmaker>ashcetum_reading-readme: you said a while ago also that you already read the readme.
17:34<Rubidium>ashcetum_reading-readme: I gave you a correct answer on the online version, didn't I?
17:35<ashcetum_reading-readme>I did, but you guys told me to read it again, besides I had read the windows xp readme
17:35<planetmaker>so, if you've got a problem with your washing machine your read the manual of your TV?
17:36<ashcetum_reading-readme>the linux readme is lots shorter...
17:36<_ln>since when are ... acceptable?
17:36<Rubidium>that's the same version (only with different newlines)
17:36<ashcetum_reading-readme>ok, moving files to data folder
17:36<Rubidium>ashcetum_reading-readme: that's the debian-ish readme and not ours
17:37<Rubidium>you did read /usr/share/doc/openttd/README.Debian
17:37<Rubidium>and not /usr/share/doc/openttd/readme.txt.gz
17:37<Rubidium>yes, I know Debian is doing 'stupid' things with hiding readmes and stuff and making their stuff the 'preferable' read
17:38-!-ashcetum_reading-readme is now known as ashchetum
17:38*ashchetum slaps forehead
17:38<ashchetum>ok i moved files and look what I still get: kyle@bigeee:~$ openttd Error: Cannot open file '' kyle@bigeee:~$
17:39<Eddi|zuHause>then you forgot a file
17:39<Muxy>and the winner is ... ?
17:39<ashchetum>no its there, read carefully "cannot open file
17:39-!-a [] has joined #openttd
17:39<ashchetum>the file is there, it just cant open it
17:39-!-a [] has quit []
17:39<planetmaker>then make it readable
17:40<Eddi|zuHause>and you need an explanation of chmod now?
17:40<ashchetum>planetmaker :.... ya lost me..... sorrry
17:40<planetmaker>chmod a+r path/to/
17:40<planetmaker>as root
17:41-!-noogie [] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Iceweasel 3.0.6/2009061212]]
17:41<Rubidium>the file most likely doesn't exist
17:41<planetmaker>Rubidium: I bet :P
17:41<Rubidium>can't open *includes* file does not exist
17:41<ashchetum>na it exists
17:41<ashchetum>trust me on that
17:41<planetmaker>all small letters?
17:41<planetmaker>not or sample.CAT?
17:42-!-NeO_Anderson [~Founder@] has joined #openttd
17:42<planetmaker>(dunno whether it matters here, though)
17:42<Eddi|zuHause>the letters are called "lower case" ;)
17:42<NeO_Anderson>hello all
17:42<Eddi|zuHause>yes, english is weird :p
17:42<planetmaker>thx @ Eddi. I was missing the correct word :)
17:42<NeO_Anderson>is it possible to increase the max initial loan beyond 500,000?
17:42<planetmaker>and couldn't be arsed to look up in a dictionary
17:42<ashchetum>planetmaker: yes linux is case-sensitive
17:42<Rubidium>NeO_Anderson: it's Neo or Mr. Anderson, not both ;)
17:42<planetmaker>ashchetum: but it doesn't mean that OpenTTD is.
17:43<ashchetum>yes but that does'nt make a difference
17:43<Rubidium>NeO_Anderson: nope, besides 'faking' it by using another currency but that doesn't change the value of the loan
17:43<ashchetum>linux is excuting the game
17:43<ashchetum>linux is haveing the proplem
17:44<planetmaker>ashchetum: the game decides which files to read... and if it choses to look for all, lower and upper case and so on?
17:44<Eddi|zuHause>ashchetum: do you actually ever do something you get told?
17:44<planetmaker>_I_ know how linux handles letters :)
17:44<Eddi|zuHause>or do you paste one random line and then complain that people (possibly) misunderstood your problem
17:44<ashchetum>ok..... sorry for the lecture you didnt need
17:44<Nite_Owl>if you use dollars the loan limit is $1,000,000
17:44<Eddi|zuHause>it is YOU who has the problem
17:45<ashchetum>your just saying that cuz u want me to shut up
17:45<Eddi|zuHause>yes, because when you are not helping the discussion you grow annoying very fast
17:46<NeO_Anderson>Rubidium, It's both if your clan/team is called NeO_ and your name is Anderson
17:46<Eddi|zuHause>and you did still not tell whether you did chmod and what kind of effect that had
17:46*ashchetum needs to take a class in irc eticutte
17:46<NeO_Anderson>and ty :)
17:46<_ln>ashchetum: etiquette
17:46<NeO_Anderson>Nite_Owl, I've seen on a server it has like 2,250,000 max initial loan
17:47<NeO_Anderson>I think it was in dollars
17:47<NeO_Anderson>It's a "beginners world" server
17:47<ashchetum>chmod didn't work..... :(
17:47<Rubidium>NeO_Anderson: you can hack the savegame/OpenTTD to provide a bigger initial loan
17:47<NeO_Anderson>I'm trying to create my own server (theirs is laggy as hell)
17:47<NeO_Anderson>but I find it quite hard to make profit...
17:48<NeO_Anderson>with the default settings so first thing is to increase loan from the tiny 500k lol
17:48<NeO_Anderson>Rubidium, Is that allowed? :S
17:48<Eddi|zuHause>ashchetum: and for the how-many-time-th you were told by now that "doesn't work" is not a proper problem description?
17:48<Rubidium>NeO_Anderson: why wouldn't it? Guess you don't know how OpenTTD is developed
17:48<NeO_Anderson>I don't
17:49<NeO_Anderson>I just play it
17:49<NeO_Anderson>and in most cases, editing someones work is usually wrong lol
17:49<Rubidium>Eddi|zuHause: that doesn't work... how many times have we told eachother that?
17:49<_ln>the string that is used for ending sentences is ".", not "lol".
17:49<planetmaker>NeO_Anderson: anyone can grab the source and have a happy hacking session or two - or how many s/he likes
17:49<NeO_Anderson>ah I see
17:50<ashchetum>Eddi|zuHause: I say it does'nt work because that is as much discreption that the terminal gives me
17:50<NeO_Anderson>do you guys know a lot about the openttd.cfg and the settings within them?
17:50<Eddi|zuHause>NeO_Anderson: that's what "open" licenses are supposed to change
17:50<planetmaker>NeO_Anderson: and in order that you can know, you have a license.txt along with your binary.
17:50<NeO_Anderson>I'm finding it near impossible to find a guide that explains exactly what each setting does :S
17:50<planetmaker>if not, that IS wrong
17:50<Eddi|zuHause>/ignore ashchetum
17:50<ashchetum>nice job
17:51<ashchetum>If you dont
17:51<Rubidium>NeO_Anderson: <- it's somewhat documented, but I think nobody really bothered to document everything
17:51<NeO_Anderson>like for example, "construction_cost = 2" if I make that 1 will it make it cheaper? :S
17:51<Eddi|zuHause>i am really the nicest and most helpful person on the planet... but when people do not show even the slightest sign of progress...
17:51<NeO_Anderson>yeah no ones documented em
17:51<NeO_Anderson>u click them and it takes u to a weird empty box lol
17:52<ashchetum>hmm. progress
17:52-!-JFBelugas [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:52<planetmaker>NeO_Anderson: usually higher should mean higher cost... Or just test it :)
17:52<Rubidium>NeO_Anderson: lower values usually tend to mean lower, less etc.
17:52<planetmaker>you can test that live in a single player game
17:53<NeO_Anderson>oh I can test it live?
17:53<NeO_Anderson>would I be able to test it live thru the server console?
17:53<planetmaker>I *think* so. No, not in multiplayer, I think
17:53<Eddi|zuHause>most of the settings you can change in the ingame console with "set <name> <value>"
17:53<NeO_Anderson>ill try it xD
17:53<Eddi|zuHause>where "name" is the same as in the cfg
17:53<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: construction costs would desync. So it probably won't work in multiplayer
17:54-!-Chris_Booth [] has joined #openttd
17:54<Nite_Owl>a lot can also be edited off of the menus and options on the start up screen
17:54<Eddi|zuHause>planetmaker: usually the changes (that are allowed) are synchronised via do_command
17:54<NeO_Anderson>it tells me this cmd is not available during network games
17:54<NeO_Anderson>ur right planetmaker @ desync
17:54<ashchetum>I want to ask Eddi|jzuHause how to use cmod to make a readable, is he still ignoring me?
17:54<NeO_Anderson>thats probably why its blocked
17:55<NeO_Anderson>ashchetum, type chmod 777 from the terminal
17:55<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: yes, they usually are. But some just don't work that way...
17:55<NeO_Anderson>assuming you're inside the terminal and in the directory where is
17:55<NeO_Anderson>or just type: chmod 777 /path/to/
17:55<planetmaker>ashchetum: read back. I gave you the anser
17:56<Eddi|zuHause>NeO_Anderson: it's a hopeless case... planetmaker already said the exact command line...
17:56<NeO_Anderson>777 is probably not the best chmod as it's then given full permissions
17:56<NeO_Anderson>and people always advise me against such things
17:56<Eddi|zuHause>you can't teach people who do not listen...
17:56<NeO_Anderson>but seriously... I never had a probw ith it
17:56*NeO_Anderson hopes he is listening as he thinks the ppl here are much nicer than most networks...
17:56<planetmaker>:) Not having a problem with not listening? ;)
17:56<Eddi|zuHause>well, you usually have no problem with it, until you are on a network share with 10000 people having access
17:57<NeO_Anderson>well Im the only one wih acess to it
17:57<planetmaker>I usually make my home dir accessible but not readable :)
17:57<ashchetum>tell EddizuHause, sorry, but he can still ignore me....
17:57<Eddi|zuHause>like, a public pool in a university or somesuch
17:58<NeO_Anderson>ashchetum, something tells me he doesn't need your approval to ignore u xD
17:58<NeO_Anderson>ashchetum, just follow what hes said and u'll be fine :)
17:58<planetmaker>then people can access files, if I give them the path, but won't find other things as they don't get a listing
17:58<NeO_Anderson>ashchetum, from what I've been told, hes answered your question thats why hes a little annoyed at the mo with you
17:59<NeO_Anderson>so yeah, just what was advised and see what happens :)
17:59<NeO_Anderson>should work
17:59<ashchetum>ya i noticed he's annoyed.
17:59<Eddi|zuHause>planetmaker: you get funny effects if you make a directory not executable :p
17:59<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: :) Yes, it's executable :) Haven't actually tried that
17:59<planetmaker>what happens?
17:59<NeO_Anderson>question, if I set something in th config file
17:59<NeO_Anderson>higher than the max
17:59<NeO_Anderson>it would just revert to the highest wont it?
18:00<Eddi|zuHause>well, you can not cd or ls it
18:00<planetmaker>It will revert to the value last used
18:00<NeO_Anderson>like say if the max value is 6 and I set it to 10
18:00<NeO_Anderson>it would set to 6 or something else?
18:00<Eddi|zuHause>but technically you can still read its contents ;)
18:00<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: can you copy a file to it?
18:00<planetmaker>or read a file from it?
18:00<planetmaker>that's nice :)
18:00<Eddi|zuHause>i'm not exactly sure what you actually can do
18:01<planetmaker>NeO_Anderson: OpenTTD writes a config file upon closing
18:01<Eddi|zuHause>just remember that directories need +x ;)
18:01<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: nearly calls for an experiment :)
18:01<Eddi|zuHause>i should go to bed... need to get up at 7
18:02<planetmaker>wow. Tomorrow is like Sunday... or rather now already.
18:02<planetmaker>what'ya doing up so early?
18:02-!-Zorn [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
18:02<Eddi|zuHause>well, yes, sunday is the day where people order music and stuff
18:02<NeO_Anderson>what does the "economy" variable do? anyone know?:S
18:03<Eddi|zuHause>NeO_Anderson: stable/unstable
18:03<planetmaker>I mean... I'll probably wake up... Nasty birds being too loud in the early hours
18:03<Eddi|zuHause>i have never had a problem with birds
18:03<planetmaker>So, I guess... I should possibly go to bed, too :)
18:04<planetmaker>Oh, I have here a nice backyard. They inhabit it :)
18:04<Eddi|zuHause>i do have a problem with toads, though
18:05<Eddi|zuHause>well, i live in a village, there are plenty of birds ;)
18:05<NeO_Anderson>and reload_cfg?
18:05<NeO_Anderson>reloads the config file at the end of the year?
18:05<Eddi|zuHause>things that make "quaaaak"
18:05<planetmaker>NeO_Anderson: right then wen you type it...
18:05<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: yes :)
18:05<planetmaker>NeO_Anderson: uh.... I guess the config var is for the case that you restart.
18:06<Eddi|zuHause>every year they gather around anything that is remotely wet
18:06<Eddi|zuHause>like a pond or a stream
18:06<Eddi|zuHause>of which we have either one
18:06<planetmaker>:D Nice I must say :)
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18:06<Eddi|zuHause>and they get extremely loud when in masses
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18:08<planetmaker>and slimy on the street :P
18:09<Eddi|zuHause>well, there are people who help avoiding that :p
18:09<Eddi|zuHause>building fences and holes
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18:09<planetmaker>well... makes sort of sense, does it?
18:09<Eddi|zuHause>and then collect the toads and carry them over the street every day
18:10<Eddi|zuHause>in some places i even have seen "toad tunnels"
18:11<planetmaker>I've seen bridges built for them
18:11<Rubidium>bridges to heaven I hope
18:11<Rubidium>or tunnels to hell ;)
18:11<Rubidium>noisy twats
18:12<planetmaker>well.... I guess tiredness is catching me. So good night folks!
18:12<Nite_Owl>you still have to beat the wandering alligators
18:12<Nite_Owl>later planetmaker
18:13<Eddi|zuHause>the strange thing is, the english "toad" and the german "Kröte" are not etymologically related, while many other animals are
18:13<Eddi|zuHause>e.g. "frog" vs. "Frosch"
18:14<Eddi|zuHause>(sorry for highlight :p)
18:15<Nite_Owl>what is even scarier is that the wandering alligators are learning to look both ways before they cross the street
18:16<Eddi|zuHause>i have not yet witnessed an alligator crossing the street :p
18:16<Eddi|zuHause>neither a crocodile
18:16<Eddi|zuHause>(whatever the difference is)
18:16<Nite_Owl>fortunately they only tend to wander during mating season
18:17<Eddi|zuHause>yes, that's what the toads do, too
18:17<Nite_Owl>crocodiles are bigger and have a wider snout
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18:18<Eddi|zuHause>"snout" is an interesting word
18:18<Eddi|zuHause>i have not heard this before ;)
18:18<Eddi|zuHause>related to german "Schnauze" i presume ;)
18:19<Nite_Owl>around here the crocodiles only gather at the outflow pipe of the nuclear plant as they prefer a VERY warm climate
18:20<_ln>do they have three eyes?
18:21<Nite_Owl>I hope not
18:23<Eddi|zuHause>yay for book search ;)
18:23<Eddi|zuHause>says "Schnauze" is derived from old high german "snûta"
18:24<Eddi|zuHause>same root as "Schnute"
18:25<_ln>"snyte" in swedish, it seems.
18:26<Nite_Owl>not being able to read German I hope it translates out to something similar to 'nose'
18:26<Eddi|zuHause>interesting, it says that "Schnecke" [snail] is related to old high german "snahhan" [compare: sneaking]
18:27<Eddi|zuHause>Nite_Owl: no, translates to mouth
18:27<Eddi|zuHause>well, something inbetween
18:27<Eddi|zuHause>combination of both mostly
18:27<Nite_Owl>that would work as well
18:28<Eddi|zuHause>like a dog commonly has a "Schnauze"
18:28<Nite_Owl>right - a long snout with a mouth at the bottom and a nose at the end
18:28<Eddi|zuHause>"schnauzen" usually means using a handkerchief
18:29<Eddi|zuHause>and "anschnauzen" means yelling at someone
18:29<Eddi|zuHause>(both words appear in the text)
18:31<Eddi|zuHause>german is funny... by changing a tiny prefix you can completely change the meaning of the word
18:31<Eddi|zuHause>and when constructing sentences, that prefix can jump to the other end of the sentence ;)
18:31<Eddi|zuHause>and inbetween there can be a whole nested story
18:32<Eddi|zuHause>and you can only derive the meaning of the first word when you have fully parsed the sentence ;)
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18:35<Eddi|zuHause>problem when reading such old texts, the "s" and "f" look very alike...
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18:38<@petern>that makes our AlignPtr wrong ;p
18:44<Nite_Owl>Need to feed - later all
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19:13<SmatZ>petern: yeah :(
19:14<SmatZ>intptr_t would be better
19:14<SmatZ>but they are not "mandatory" by the standard
19:14<SmatZ>maybe ptrdiff_t
19:14<SmatZ>but it's signed...
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---Logclosed Sun Jul 05 00:00:27 2009