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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-09-11

---Logopened Fri Sep 11 00:00:41 2009
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01:05<Pikkaa>you can't disable drawing foundations for town buildings? D:
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01:14<Pikka>a cookie for whosoever can make callback 30 work on houses? :)
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01:35<nicfer>ALGUNO AWAKEN?
01:35<nicfer>anyone awaken*
01:37<nicfer>oh, I see
01:38<nicfer>is the default trainset too unbalanced?
01:40<Pikka>too unbalanced for what?
01:44<Tefad>maglev ftw?
01:46<nicfer>yup, maglev and mono come too late and regular rail doesn't improve
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02:42<@Rubidium>Pikka: major question is what callback ID to use
02:44<Ammler>\o/ rpm works now with CentOS, Fedora, RHEL, SLE and openSUSE. :-)
02:44<Ammler>(it doesn't with Mandriva)
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02:47<Pikka>Rubidium: 30? :P
02:48<@Rubidium>Pikka: but why are there up to 3 callback IDs for things like starting animation?
02:48<@Rubidium>gives me the feeling TTDP needs them to be different or so
02:50<@Rubidium>besides that the following patch
02:51<@Rubidium>just need DaleStan or some other NewGRF guru to tell me what ID to use
02:51<DaleStan>I'm pretty sure TTDPatch doesn't need different IDs for different features. It just stuffs a number into [curcallback] and calls getsprite.
02:51<DaleStan>And sets the feature somewhere; I've forgotten that detail.
02:51<Pikka>I think yexo used 14E...
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02:53<DaleStan>Same-ID-for-same-task definitely has its benefits, but it's not the current convention.
02:55*DaleStan -> bed
02:56<@Rubidium>hmm, so just reuse 30?
02:56<@Rubidium>night DaleStan
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03:08<Terkhen>good morning
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03:12<Pikkaa>since you put it that way... goodbye! :o
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05:36<@Rubidium>what a boring morning it is :(
05:37<Muxy>go back to bed
05:37<Muxy>start an openttd server
05:43<Vikthor>as if there wasn't enough of them
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06:45<dihedral><Vikthor> as if there wasn't enough of them <- then start playing multiplayer for a change :-P
06:47<Vikthor>hmm I should stop the old cargodist server
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06:50*Muxy is away: Occupé
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08:20<Eddi|zuHause>why does my brain automatically associate "occupé" with a toilet?
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08:21<Eddi|zuHause>it does not do that with "occupied"
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08:37*Muxy is back (gone 01:47:34)
08:38<Eddi|zuHause>Muxy: you should urgently stop these.
08:38<Muxy>hum stio what plz ?
08:38<Muxy>grumpf, stop what plz ?
08:38<Eddi|zuHause>the away messages
08:38<KingJ>[13:37] * Muxy is back (gone 01:47:34)
08:39<Muxy>ok uncheck the rigts check boxes, sory for disturbance and Goulp Kiss
08:40<Eddi|zuHause>don't fix your typing mistakes... it'll take ages :p
08:41<Muxy>yeap i can see that... the longer i write...
08:41<Muxy>better is to stop talking... :p
08:42<Eddi|zuHause>hm... is there someone who could donate me a wireless mouse?
08:43<Muxy>i have 2 of them, but they dont work any more
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08:45<planetmaker>Muxy, he didn't ask for a working mouse...
08:46*Ammler doesn't like to feed wireless mouses.
08:46<Prof_Frink>That's why your hamster died.
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08:46<Ammler>true :'-(
08:47<Muxy>PlanetMaker, that's why i talk about mines who dont work
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08:48<Fuco>hey Ammler, did you check out my AP+ 'fix'?
08:48<planetmaker>yeah. Usually mines don't work. They're worked upon
08:48<planetmaker></nitpick> :-P
08:48<Ammler>Fuco: already installed
08:48<Prof_Frink>planetmaker: Or stepped on
08:48<Ammler>but not finished, rcon and callback support is missing ;-)
08:49<planetmaker>or driven on or worked in.
08:49<Fuco>rcon from ps?
08:49<Eddi|zuHause>mines get more effective with the invention of railroads
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09:32<Akoz>@calc exp(1)
09:32<@DorpsGek>Akoz: 2.71828182846
09:32<Akoz>@calc exp(100)
09:32<@DorpsGek>Akoz: 26881171418161356094253400435962903554686976
09:33<Akoz>@calc exp(-100)
09:33<@DorpsGek>Akoz: 0
09:33<Muxy>@cal 1/0
09:33<Muxy>@calc 1/0
09:33<@DorpsGek>Muxy: Error: float division
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10:05<Muxy>Goulp Kiss
10:11<@Belugas>Salut Muxy
10:11<Muxy>"Bonjour Belugas"
10:15<Aankhen``>Salut Muxy.
10:16<@Belugas>Salut Eddi|zuHause
10:16<@Belugas>Salut Aankhen``
10:16<Aankhen``>Salut Belugas. :-)
10:16<Eddi|zuHause>Belugas: btw. i really don't understand why you didn't like that song ;) it clearly is a fan favourite over here ;)
10:16<Aankhen``>for (i in #openttd) { say "Salut $i" }
10:16<Muxy>Salut Aankehn``
10:17<@Belugas>Eddi|zuHause, let say that... i'm not too much in "fanfar" :)
10:17<Muxy>it's "le fan club" of "francophone Open TTD" players
10:18<Eddi|zuHause>Belugas: anyone seriously playing that song would understand "fanfar" as insult :p
10:19<Eddi|zuHause>but seriously, that is the most frequently requested song when we play anywhere...
10:20<@Belugas>Eddi|zuHause, or we do not agree on definition of "fanfar" or i did not heard the same song that you pointed me to
10:20<Eddi|zuHause>yes, you did hear the right song ;)
10:20<@Belugas>Muxy, je crois qu'il y a plus de francophones ici qu'on ne le penses. Juste qu'on a la sacro sainte regle de l'anglais seulement...
10:21<@Belugas>a la quelle je ne suis pas oppose..
10:21<Muxy>me neither
10:21<Muxy>so do me (c)
10:22<Eddi|zuHause>i read that as "i believe there are more french speaking people here than you think, just the 'sacred rule' enforces english only, which i am fine with"
10:23<@Belugas>congrats, Eddi|zuHause :)
10:23<Muxy>no, he said he has no opposite
10:23<Eddi|zuHause>yes, it's a little freely translated ;)
10:23<Muxy>but the idea is ok
10:24<Muxy>and also "la sacro sainte regle" is "the sacred holly rule"
10:24<Muxy>oups sory
10:25<Eddi|zuHause>isn't "sacred" and "holy" the same thing?
10:25<@Belugas>related, Eddi|zuHause, i think, but not same, i think
10:26<Eddi|zuHause>maybe the nuances don't translate well...
10:27<Eddi|zuHause>but i have never heard "sacred" and "holy" used simultaneously
10:27<Muxy>just few minutes ago
10:28<Muxy>you can be sacred without beeing holy
10:29<Eddi|zuHause>like i said, it might just be lost in translation
10:29<Eddi|zuHause>neither french nor english are my native language
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11:34<Eddi|zuHause>so... i'm going away over the weekend...
11:34<Eddi|zuHause>with no internets...
11:35<@petern>OH MY GOD
11:36<Aankhen``>THE HORROR, THE HORROR!
11:36*petern ponders banning all use of this stupid term 'internets'
11:36<Aankhen``>What do you have against it?
11:36<@petern>it's stupid
11:36<Aankhen``>It's a funny way to add some variety.
11:36<@petern>it's not variety if everyone does it
11:37<Aankhen``>Yes it is. The people you interact with on the Internet are a tiny subset of the total population.
11:37<Aankhen``>Hmm, poorly phrased. Better version of the first sentence: everyone doesn't do it.
11:38<@Belugas>there is only one internet. it's THE internet. If everyone is doing a mistake, does it means that in the end it's becoming the right thing to say?
11:38<@petern>the first version is at least grammatically correct
11:39<Aankhen``>First version of?
11:39<Aankhen``>The sentence? The second was correct as well.
11:39<@petern>"everyone doesn't do it" does not make sense
11:39<Aankhen``>It's just grammatically ambiguous, like a lot of useful English sentences.
11:39<Eddi|zuHause>fine, i say "intertubes" then
11:39<@petern>"not everyone does it" does make sense
11:40<@petern>your versions means that "everyone" "does not" "do it"
11:40<@petern>Eddi|zuHause, better ;)
11:40<Aankhen``>It can be parsed both ways.
11:40<Aankhen``>But your version is indeed better.
11:40<Aankhen``>So point taken.
11:40<@petern>both? that's the only way
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11:42<@petern>Belugas, two wrongs make a right, only if you're playing music ;)
11:42<Aankhen``>petern: Hmm, some research shows you're right. Fair enough.
11:52<@Belugas>or keep on playing the wrong notes until they become right :)
11:52<@petern>at least, when you're playing it
11:53<@petern>but not when you play it back :s
11:53<@petern>never mind
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12:04<@Belugas>i know what you mean, don't worry :)
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12:31<@Belugas>how nice... 2 days of certification, with the examinator on site with me, and it failed because they did not injected the right version of the firmware in the pinpad...
12:31<@Belugas>nice job guys, nice job...
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13:10<Lakie>Hmm... Belugas / Devs. With Bananas I don't suppose OpenTTD would have the option to download a missing grf file assuming that its on bananas (same version) when joining or give the option to?
13:11<@Rubidium>Lakie: you tried clicking on 'newgrf settings', 'find online content', 'select all' and 'download' (in that order)?
13:13<Lakie>Nope, I was just wondering if it had been linked up like that
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13:18<CIA-4>OpenTTD: yexo * r17500 /trunk/src/ai/api/ (ai_controller.cpp ai_object.cpp ai_object.hpp): -Fix (r16502): The wrong value was restored to SetAllowDoCommand possible resulting in an AI that wasn't allowed to do any actions
13:27<Sacro>ooh a nice number
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13:28<Alberth>you have until the next commit to admire the number
13:29<Alberth>(in about 15 minutes probably)
13:29<Prof_Frink>All hail the Number!
13:33*Alberth doesn't think 100010001011100 is special.
13:36<MyCatVerbs>♪ Binary solo!
13:37<Sacro>we used poisonous gasses and we poisoned their asses
13:40<@Belugas>ho... good
13:40*Belugas goes back to sleep
13:45<CIA-4>OpenTTD: translators * r17501 /trunk/src/lang/ (catalan.txt traditional_chinese.txt):
13:45<CIA-4>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<CIA-4>OpenTTD: catalan - 20 changes by arnau
13:45<CIA-4>OpenTTD: traditional_chinese - 19 changes by josesun
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14:53<CIA-4>OpenTTD: alberth * r17502 /trunk/src/ (misc_gui.cpp osk_gui.cpp querystring_gui.h): -Codechange [FS#3184]: Extend QueryStringBaseWindow to support windows with nested widgets (by Terkhen with a few tweaks).
14:54<CIA-4>OpenTTD: alberth * r17503 /trunk/src/window_gui.h: -Fix (r17502): Save all files before commit.
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14:59<Terkhen>Alberth: I hope you didn't had to do much tweaking :)
15:00<Alberth>nah, mainly ordered the SetFocusedWidget code by widget type rather than by computation step.
15:02<Terkhen>yes, it looks much cleaner now
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15:10<Zuu>In the development version of PAXLink there was two bugs. The first bug limited the number of vehicles it could buy at a time to only one. The second bug was that the AI didn't keep track of the usage of airports. So it slowly bought to many airplanes. Now I first fixed the first bug and in a loaded game where it had 4 bilion it could spend 1.6 bilion a year on new aircrafts. :-) But now also the second bug is fixed so it won
15:10<Zuu>'t spend all its money on tons of aircrafts. :-)
15:12<CIA-4>OpenTTD: alberth * r17504 /trunk/src/ (window.cpp window_gui.h): -Codechange: un-inlining SetFocusedWidget() as it is not often used.
15:12<Prof_Frink>Zuu: Does it build small aircraft for small airports, or do you end up with a massacre like wrighty tends to?
15:12<Zuu>It doesn't build big aircrafts on small airports.
15:13<Zuu>It used to, but stopt doing that a few versions ago.
15:18<Yexo>Prof_Frink: does wrightai still do that? I seem to remember I fixed that quite a long time ago
15:19<Yexo>hmm, there is indeed no check for that
15:19<Yexo>oh well, it's only an example AI anyway
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15:26<CIA-4>OpenTTD: alberth * r17505 /trunk/src/ (widget.cpp widget_type.h): -Codechange: WWT_EMPTY is not a special case any more for invalidating widgets.
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15:31<Prof_Frink>Yexo: I last played with them ages ago.
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17:04<Nite_Owl>Hello all
17:05<@Belugas>night all
17:05<Nite_Owl>later Belugas
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17:39<ctibor>Hi, I have created rather big grf sets in my openttd.cfg, switching to some of them crashes openttd with error:Error: File 'pikkindw.grf' lost in cache. or similar depending on the grf first listed in the set. What is the cause and how to get rid of it?
17:41<frosch123>did you move some files?
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17:42<frosch123>while ottd is running
17:43<ctibor>unless openttd moves them itself, which I doubt
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17:44<ctibor>is it possible that some of the files are donwloaded through the openttd online content and thus they reside in different folder than others I got manualy?
17:44*ctibor can't make normal sentence...
17:45<ctibor>and could that be problem?
17:45<ctibor>should move them all to data instead of donwload_content/data?
17:45<Nite_Owl>it should not be a problem
17:46<frosch123> <- ctibor: can you put your openttd.cfg there (the relevant part)
17:48<ctibor> - ok, heres how the grf set looks like
17:49<ctibor>And I get this error when I try to switch to it in the main game menu
17:49<ctibor>Error: File 'db_double_deck_coaches.v0.1/dbddw.grf' lost in cache.
17:51<frosch123>when do you get that error, when selecting the preset? when starting a game?
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17:53<ctibor>selecting the preser
17:54<ctibor>however if i put it to [newgrf] it crashes before it loads the main menu
17:55<Terkhen>good night
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17:56<ctibor>what's the newgrf static section for?
17:56<frosch123>some newgrfs are static safe, that means you can activate them on the client and join a multiplayer server which does not use it
17:57<frosch123>e.g. landscape sets, which have no influence on the gamestate
17:57<frosch123>however, i cannot reproduce your problem on my side
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17:59<frosch123>though, you have quite a lot of grfs there, does it work if you only use 5 or so?
18:00<Ammler>the order is bad, either.
18:00<Ammler>the more important a grf the more down it should be.
18:00<Ammler>i.e. vehicels at bottom
18:00<Ammler>landscape at top
18:01<frosch123>Ammler: what makes you think that is important?
18:01<Ammler>he :-)
18:01<ctibor>well striping down helps, i think I should not create huge monster sets than :-)
18:02<Ammler>frosch123: maybe that is a old behaviour from TTDPatch usage :-)
18:03<Ammler>as you did overwrite
18:03<Ammler>well, in some parts you still do with openttd.
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18:04<frosch123>when did a vehicle grf override a landscape grfs?
18:04<frosch123>except the stupid monolithic things like canse
18:04<Ammler>well, that is the order
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18:05<Ammler>houses, industries, infra is between
18:05<Ammler>infra does overwrite land
18:05<Ammler>vehicle sets do overwrite infra
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18:06*frosch123 ponders disabling grfs that use more than one feature
18:06<Ammler>well, I also complained about that.
18:07<Ammler>like the usroad sets with the roadcars
18:07<Ammler>or how they are called, at least he added a parameter to disable.
18:08<Zuu>maybe they are street cars aka trams
18:08<Ammler>maybe he missunderstood set
18:08<Ammler>Zuu: yes.
18:08<Ammler>but I had best experience with the order from our pack.
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18:10<Ammler>TTRS is also evil
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18:11<ctibor>Well I found the solution... I had included OpenGFX to the set, but it is also configured in the game settings and it was being loaded twice, I think
18:22<CIA-4>OpenTTD: rubidium * r17506 /trunk/src/ (smallmap_gui.cpp viewport.cpp): -Fix [FS#3191]: signs partly drawn out of the rectangle in 4/8x zoom out.
18:27<frosch123>well, for me it only says "maximum number of GRFs has been reached", no crashing
18:29<ctibor>well for me both trunk and 0.7.2 says the error I posted
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18:32<@Rubidium>can you provide a log with -d 9 including the error?
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18:35<Nite_Owl>check your list of grf's again - you have both ECS and Pikka's industries in there - do they not conflict ??
18:37<@Rubidium>conflicting NewGRFs shouldn't crash OpenTTD
18:38<ctibor>Rubidium: working on the log, it's huge, wget paste is having hard time :-)
18:40<ctibor>Nite_Owl: Doesn't seem so, but haven't made any tests so far, because I just created the sets and was stopped by the "lost in cache" err
18:41<ctibor>Rubidium: Well the log is indeed very huge, about 70 MB, i think this is not suitable for upload...
18:42<@Rubidium>what with -d grf=2?
18:42<@Rubidium>might not give enough information though :(
18:47<Yexo>Rubidium: previously you suggested "-d 9" and now "-d grf=2", maybe "-d grf=9" could work?
18:48<@Rubidium>Yexo: unlikely, if it crashes at start, most of the spam is from parsing the NewGRFs for the first time
18:48<@Rubidium>and he probably has hundreds of them lingering around
18:48<Yexo>ah, ok
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18:50<ctibor>Rubidium: I'll upload the full debug to the ftp, but it will be slow to download I think
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18:51<@Rubidium>slow download doesn't bother me, as long as you upload finishes 'soon'
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19:18<ctibor>Rubidium: try ftp://ftp:ftp@ , but I am not 100% sure it will work :-)
19:19<ctibor>If it won't I'll hang up later and deliver the log the other way...
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19:24<frosch123>rb went to bed, but i cannot dl it either :(
19:25<frosch123>ftp logs in, but then cannot enter passive mode
19:26<frosch123>ah, active works
19:27<ctibor>yeah, now I don't have energy to reconfigure ftpd, will look at it tomorow and give you ring about it here..
19:27<ctibor>good night :-)
19:30<frosch123>transfer finished :)
19:31<ctibor>very well then
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19:38<frosch123>oh, you have 0.5-style non-newgrf-grfs
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19:40<frosch123>maybe when loading them is aborted something is not cleaned up properly
19:40<frosch123>well, but, good night from me
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---Logclosed Sat Sep 12 00:00:44 2009