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#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-01-25

---Logopened Wed Jan 25 00:00:16 2017
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04:17<MonkeyDrone> top of your head, what do you think is causing the dedicated server to crash, but the client works fine.
04:22<MonkeyDrone>if i launch a MP server on windows, people can connect, game runs fine. Just having issues with crash on launch on linux with -D. As a client it runs fine.
04:25<MonkeyDrone>ok, it happens on windows too, whenever the server goes into spec mode. :D Time to deduce where that code is , should be a fixer upper :P
04:29<MonkeyDrone> this would be from windows.
04:30<@peter1138>CityMania patched client
04:30<@peter1138>Who cares?
04:31<MonkeyDrone>that's the magical beauty about a chatroom
04:31<MonkeyDrone>someone just might care :P
04:32<MonkeyDrone>well it's not a life ender issue, hehe. Playing around with the code
04:33<@planetmaker>"Please, unless you encounter this bug with unpatched OpenTTD version, report bug to CityMania team" <---
04:33<@planetmaker>use the official OpenTTD client and you likely will not see that issue
04:35<MonkeyDrone>planetmaker: aye, i was just looking for some direction here, i already figured this wouldn't be a quick look and know what's up kind of situation :D
04:35<MonkeyDrone>thanks guys
04:35<@planetmaker>without the debug symbols for that exact version it's very hard to say anything more. Especially as the code is also different than the official code
04:35<@planetmaker>you see the stacktrace roughly which parts / functions are present. I see town, landscape, videodriver...
04:36<MonkeyDrone>aye i can put the source online on github, but i've no intention of taking up your time for this
04:36<@planetmaker>get a proper stacktrace which resolves the debug symbols to actual lines in the source. And then see where it crashed
04:36<@planetmaker>thus build a debug build, and then test again
04:37<MonkeyDrone>roger that, will do that. thank you
04:37<@planetmaker>and... that's code patched only for client usage. Not sure it's suitable for server usage *at all*
04:38<@planetmaker>they probably added many things which are not desync-safe
04:38<@planetmaker>as for their server, they have another version running with server-side code
04:40<MonkeyDrone>planetmaker: indeed, i have their source compiled and working as a server as wellw ith some patches, Right now I was just trying to get 15+ companies to work on that build
04:41<MonkeyDrone>just testing waters, not too worried about it
04:51<@planetmaker>15+ companies... MonkeyDrone : if you want to try that, I strongly suggest to try that first on unmodified OpenTTD
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04:52<@planetmaker>15+ companies, that's a BIG challange without having to deal with hackish code quality on top
04:52<@planetmaker>If you get that to work on unmodified OpenTTD, then it's a piece of cake to merge that into whatever patched version you have
04:54<@planetmaker>But I can ensure you, 15+ companies touches MANY parts. Most of all, you have to modify the landscape array, the parameter passing for ownership. That includes possibly rewriting quite a few functions as all bits of the two acceptable parameters are used-up, thus a lot of refactoring in seemingly unrelated parts is needed
04:56<@planetmaker>I strongly suggest you to look through OpenTTD logs, and find the commits where the company limit was increased from 8 to 15. You would have to do all that in a more extended way
04:56<@planetmaker>that wasn't one commit, but many of the preceeding ones worked towards it
04:58<MonkeyDrone>planetmaker: there is already a patch for 240 companies on the forums.
04:58<MonkeyDrone>I've been trying to integrate that into the CM Source.
04:58<MonkeyDrone>but I will definitely look at what you have stated
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05:14<MonkeyDrone>thanks again for all the help :D i'll see you around
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11:44<_dp_>MonkeyDrone, you're probably the fist one to try running CityMania client as server xD
11:44<_dp_>And as server I doubt it adds anything compared to vanilla so there is not much point trying to use it
11:44<Lejving>fuarking lunatic
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11:45<Lejving>he said he was going out of country for a few days so probably not here though :)
11:48<V453000>reket u get
11:48<@Alberth>hi hi V
11:48<Lejving>V453000 soylent industries on bananaz now :)
11:48<V453000>omfg Lejving
11:48<V453000>graphics still fuckborked?
11:48<Lejving>only some
11:49<Lejving>no animations :(
11:49<V453000>no extra zoom?
11:49<Lejving>working on it ok
11:49<V453000>low amount of pixulz = not wurth looking at
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11:49<Lejving>you said 8bpp yourself was da shiet!
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13:14<Guest1584>GUESTE BORA JOGAR
13:15<frosch123>@kban Guest1584 boh
13:15-!-mode/#openttd [+b *!~oftc-webi@] by DorpsGek
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13:16<Eddi|zuHause>how dare he disturb the silence like that...
13:21<andythenorth>for shame
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13:23<frosch123>someone needs to remember to unban the oftc webinterface at some point :)
13:24<Arveen>why is it banned btw ?
13:24<frosch123>check 13 minutes ago
13:25<frosch123>some 11 year old with a broken capslock
13:25<Arveen>ah ok didnt even notice that heh
13:25<ST2>brazilians tends todo that :P
13:27<@Alberth>can't you attach a time to it?
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13:28<frosch123>i could have done that with the ban command, but i forgot
13:28<Eddi|zuHause>the time should be stated in the @kban command
13:28<frosch123>now it is too complicated to add
13:29<@Alberth>fix dorpsgek :p
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13:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r27740 trunk/src/lang/korean.txt (2017-01-25 19:45:36 +0100 )
13:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from Eints:
13:45<@DorpsGek>korean: 1 change by telk5093
13:49-!-mode/#openttd [+o frosch123] by DorpsGek
13:50-!-mode/#openttd [-b *!~oftc-webi@] by frosch123
13:50-!-mode/#openttd [-o frosch123] by DorpsGek
13:50<andythenorth>such news
13:50<andythenorth>and such not news
13:51*andythenorth stops hitting refresh on the internet
13:51<andythenorth>also so did TTDPatch already have all the ponies?
13:51<@Alberth>some of your ponies at least, apparently
13:51<frosch123>conditional ponies :)
13:53<@Alberth>just as much use as having station support in m2nfo, while you work in nml
13:53<andythenorth>I chose to overlook that one :)
13:53<@Alberth>good choice
13:53<frosch123>Alberth: andy does not work in nml
13:54<andythenorth>it’s true
13:54<andythenorth>my nml is shockingly bad
13:54<andythenorth>even worse than my html
13:54<@Alberth>hmm, generate m4nfo? :p
13:54<andythenorth>I could
13:54<andythenorth>I have to look up the nml switch syntax every time I write one :P
13:55<frosch123>oh yeah, generate a 10mib m4nfo source and ask why it doesn't work :p
13:55<@Alberth>sort of nml2 :p
13:55<@Alberth>switch syntax is quite broken, imho
13:56<@Alberth>I still fail to undestand why we can't have name = switch(...) { ...}
13:56<@Alberth>instead of the obscure switch(.. name ..) { .. }
13:57<frosch123>it's the same as for the item :)
13:57<supermop_>what the hell is m4nfo anyway
13:57<frosch123>supermop_: m4 is the last preprocessor
13:57<supermop_>michael blunck for NFO? is that what it stands for?
13:58<andythenorth>I did read the docs for m4nfo
13:58<andythenorth>it looks fine
13:58<supermop_>seems mb uses it
13:58<andythenorth>it’s a big collection of macros afaict, no harm there
13:58<frosch123>m4 was written in 1970 and is considered the final preprocessor
13:58<andythenorth>snail uses it
13:58<frosch123>as in: you cannot make this shit more complicated, noone barely understands thisone
13:58<@Alberth>oh, it's not so bad
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13:59<andythenorth>looks like it could be templated with python :P
13:59<@Alberth>but you must know nfo inside out to read anything
13:59<frosch123>oh, 1977 even
13:59<supermop_>what would be the py name for some newgrf thing?
13:59<frosch123>Alberth: so can you count ` and ' ? :)
14:00<@Alberth>somewhat yeah
14:00<supermop_>anything my dad may have used in gradschool i am probably not going to learn
14:00<@Alberth>I have written m4 scripts :)
14:00<supermop_>unless we re write openttd in fortran
14:00<@Alberth>no 'make' for you then :)
14:01<@Alberth>or cpp
14:01<supermop_>Alberth: i dont know how to use those either
14:02<frosch123>Alberth: i have seen people who run stuff through a cpp | m4 | cpp | gcc pipe
14:02<@Alberth>haha :)
14:02<frosch123>someone used a ` in some text, and it broke the compilation, and noone knew why
14:02<andythenorth>it’s less bloated than, for example, what I do
14:03<frosch123>then we removed the "m4" and the "cpp" from the pipe, and everything worked
14:03<frosch123>no functionality lost
14:04<@Alberth> :)
14:04<andythenorth>the nice thing about m4nfo is that you could run it on something like a watch, because it’s small and not bloated
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14:04<@Alberth>it's horribly slow at windows, afaik
14:04<andythenorth>whereas things like nml+extra python layers require an overpowered and overpriced workstations-class machine
14:04<frosch123>Alberth: so you invented m4nfo? :)
14:05<@Alberth>much less advanced :)
14:05<andythenorth>convergent evolution
14:05<andythenorth>I invented python -> CPP -> nfo
14:05<andythenorth>which was…painful
14:05<andythenorth>or python -> CPP -> nml, can’t remember which
14:05<@Alberth>code had too much repetition not to throw something generator at it
14:06<andythenorth>the syntax here is preferable to the nml syntax
14:06<frosch123>andythenorth: because you prefer numbers?
14:06*andythenorth considers porting 5 newgrfs to m4nfo o_O
14:06<andythenorth>less boilerplate
14:07<supermop__>which 5?
14:07<andythenorth>missing boilerplate is 1 of my top 3 compilation failure causes
14:07<frosch123>andythenorth: there is an osx screenshot on that page
14:07<andythenorth>that’s snail
14:08<andythenorth>all that def(2) stuff
14:08<andythenorth>looks a bit clunky
14:08<andythenorth>I’d have to automate that
14:08<andythenorth>maybe it could be templated with a pre-processor
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14:16<andythenorth>hmm, articulated RVs on crossings :|
14:18<frosch123>you should invest into tunnel drilling machines now
14:19<frosch123>the demand is about to raise in mexico
14:19<Arveen>i can almost hear the ottd "ding ding ding" crossing sound when looking at that
14:19<andythenorth>Arveen: the funny thing is
14:19<andythenorth>that I also had this playing
14:20<andythenorth>which has the crossing sound effect around about 0:45
14:20<andythenorth>which I think is the same sound effect as TTD, probably both from the same sample CD around released around 1990
14:20<Arveen>+horn :D
14:21<frosch123>why sheep, though
14:21<andythenorth>just because the KLF
14:21<andythenorth>reasons aren’t the primary rationale
14:23*andythenorth wonders if we should have sheep in ottd
14:23<@Alberth>GarryG has them
14:23<Arveen>doesnt firs2 have wool ?
14:23<Arveen>so there must be sheeps
14:23<andythenorth>it does
14:24<andythenorth>could be llamas
14:24<@Alberth>close enough :p
14:24<andythenorth>or ponies
14:24<@Alberth>wool? :)
14:24<andythenorth>pony wool
14:25<@Alberth>maybe yourlittleponies then :)
14:25<andythenorth>has anyone tried Sam?
14:25<andythenorth>it’s really bad and good
14:25<@Alberth>:O sam does something already?
14:25<andythenorth>I played a game with it
14:26<andythenorth>bad: only – angles are drawn, and some of those are broken
14:26<andythenorth>good: range of ships
14:26<@Alberth>sounds promising
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14:34<@Alberth>andy, I have firs2 of dec 1st (version 6179), is it worth finding a newer version?
14:35<@Alberth>didn't Trump want to stop collaborating of us scientists with foreign scientists too?
14:35<@Alberth>I picked something like that up, during the campaign, I think
14:38<andythenorth>Alberth: FIRS from Dec 8th or so has a lot of string changes, eventually needing a nightly ottd version as it uses a new string formatter
14:38<andythenorth>there are few / no other useful changes afaict
14:38<@Alberth>I use quite recent trunk
14:39<@Alberth>ok, I can live without major string changes for a while longer :)
14:39<andythenorth>it’s a mess right now
14:40<@Alberth>I hope there is a not-so-long way to get out of it
14:41<andythenorth>just work
14:41<andythenorth>and finding the right words
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15:01<@Alberth>oh, I had a silly idea about the wild-west idea, we could have the GS remove anything you build outside the allowed zone
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15:02<@Alberth>you could evenhave to pay for it :p
15:02<andythenorth>interesting idea
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15:19<@Alberth>coke cargo in iron horse 1.9.1 switches on/off at 100%, instead of the usual 50%
15:22<andythenorth>I think it’s 0, 1-99, and 100
15:23<andythenorth>with an intermediate state for 1-99 that might be hard to see in some cases
15:23<@Alberth>could be
15:23<andythenorth>luxury passenger ships: such luxury they look
15:24<@Alberth>mini trawler and mini freighter look a bit same-ish
15:24<@Alberth>and in the same era too
15:25<@Alberth>pax is really nice
15:25<andythenorth>I need to do some drawing :)
15:27<@Alberth>green pax look a bit freighter-ish still, tome
15:28<@Alberth>oh, also a temp sprite, I guess
15:29<@Alberth>livestock and reefer ship is good too
15:36<andythenorth>about 50% of sprites are temp :)
15:47<@Alberth>so that's how it's unsinkable, it uses the same ship layout for different ships, so it looks like sinking one has no effect :p
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15:55<V453000>SINK IT
15:57<andythenorth>I considered calling it Sinkable Sam :P
15:57<andythenorth>seems better somehow
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16:05<Lejving>The Unsinkable 2
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16:42<andythenorth>forest -> pulpwood -> papermill
16:42<andythenorth>or forest -> wood -> sawmill -> pulpwood -> papermill
16:45<supermop_>papertown economy?
16:46<supermop_>MDF? plywood? osb?
16:46<supermop_>cardboard, vellum,
16:46<supermop_>high gloss,
16:46*andythenorth is just expanding Arctic Basic by one cargo
16:46<andythenorth>it’s slightly too basic
16:46<supermop_>100% post consumer content
16:47<supermop_>95% post consumer content
16:47<supermop_>Arctic Medium?
16:47<andythenorth>I did not know that ‘deal’ is spruce
16:48<andythenorth>every day, school day
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17:04<andythenorth>dunno about pulpwood
17:05<Wolf01>I want a velcro factory
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17:07<Wolf01>No idea where to deliver the product, but it could be interesting
17:08<andythenorth>to children’s shoe factory
17:08<andythenorth>and spacesuit factory
17:09<Wolf01>Toupee factory
17:10<andythenorth>so many unexplored cargo chains
17:12<supermop_>powdercoating, electroplating, PVD coating
17:17<andythenorth>electroplating is in steeltown :P
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17:20<andythenorth>also bed
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17:20<Wolf01>Bed factory, so he can work at it while sleeping
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18:10<__ln__>should they build another wall on the canadian border while they're at it?
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18:24<Eddi|zuHause>to drive out all these illegal canadian immigrants?
18:27<Eddi|zuHause>or to drive out the mexican immigrants who first travel to canada?
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18:38<__ln__>also to control the rate at which their own citizens can leave the country
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---Logclosed Thu Jan 26 00:00:17 2017