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#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-09-19

---Logopened Tue Sep 19 00:00:03 2017
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02:47<Eddi|zuHause><Alberth> well, newgrf has so much control over displayed graphics, that you need that code to decide what to display <- i think, theoretically, that should be solvable by compiling each action3/2-switch-chain into a shader
02:48<Eddi|zuHause>that still would require updating the game state for every frame
02:48<Eddi|zuHause>but all the resolving could be parallelized
02:51<Eddi|zuHause>mind you, i have no idea how shaders work
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05:56<Wolf01>Well, today I have a goal I will not reach, but the important thing is to aim it not to reach it, right?
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06:07<@peter1138>Heh, fainting robots.
06:13<crem>well, specialists say you should split the goal into steps until it's doable in 30 minutes, then do!
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06:48<Wolf01>crem: it's already split, I'm already stuck at the first part
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08:51<Wolf01>I was about to start my train set with prime number lenghts, then I figured out it's too easy to get 16
08:52<Wolf01>3+3+3+7, 11+5, 3+3+5+5
08:52<Wolf01>I need something else
08:52<V453000>I wanted to convert nuts vehicles to something like 1+2+2+2+1 for 8/8
08:52<V453000>you can make both 8/8 and 4/4 with it visually properly
08:53<V453000>problem is that it fucks up curve speed limits completely
08:53<Wolf01>I think I'll make only 2 sets of wagons: 7/8 and 11/8
08:54<V453000>wtf :D
08:54<Wolf01>And all the engines 9/8 even if it isn't prime
08:56<Wolf01>So you can only have 1 tile train at best: 9+7, or 2 tiles one with double head 9+7+7+9
08:56<Wolf01>And I'll do it with voxels
08:57<Wolf01>So I can piss off even more people
08:58<V453000>I don't think I understand perfectly :0
08:59<V453000>so how do you make 3 tile train?
08:59<V453000>9+7 x3?
08:59<Wolf01>3 engines and 3 wagons
08:59<V453000>WTF? :D
08:59<Wolf01>Why should I make a 3 tile train?
08:59<V453000>is that mandatory or can the player build 9 + 7+7+7+7+7+7...
09:00<Wolf01>9+7+7+7+7+7 is fine
09:00<V453000>yeah but that's 44 total
09:00<Wolf01>Don't confuse me with andythenorth, I don't need fitting trains
09:01<V453000>do you have any good reason to do this? :D
09:01<V453000>or just "fuck the rules" ? XD
09:01<Wolf01>Just fuck the rules
09:01<V453000>not a very good concept, but good luck
09:04<Wolf01>Why wouldn't be good?
09:10<V453000>just breaking the tile consistency for no benefit doesn't sound reasonable to me
09:10<V453000>if there is some clear advantage, it's considerable at least
09:15<andythenorth>it has the benefit of trolling andythenorth
09:16<V453000>if that makes andythenorth produce more pixels I'm all for it
09:16<andythenorth>I haz nearly fixed all problems ever
09:19<Wolf01>Meh, if only there was a way to copy the ottd palette automagically...
09:20<V453000>kind of is :P
09:20<Wolf01>I still need to put it in line
09:21<daenerys>Hey everyone and everything (the robots).
09:22<Wolf01>V453000: I need a palette like these
09:22<V453000>you mean all colours in a line?
09:23<V453000>because 2 dimensional array is too high tech and you need 1D? :D
09:23<V453000>or is that another fuck andythenorth thing?
09:23<V453000>well you can generate this thing with python easy? :P
09:23<Wolf01>I can only load that thing
09:24<Wolf01>I first need to learn python
09:26<V453000>or you know, making that line thing in gimp is a matter of a few minutes
09:27<andythenorth>might as well do it in python
09:27<andythenorth>or imagemagick
09:27<V453000>well yeah but if you need to do it once...
09:31<V453000>andythenorth: I'm going to generate the fuck out of NML with python with my train set
09:31<V453000>it's happening right after trees
09:31<V453000>fuck yeah
09:31<V453000>there, it's been said
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09:33<andythenorth>V453000: you’ll want a templating language
09:33<andythenorth>don’t invent your own
09:34<V453000>templating language?
09:34<V453000>but don't you generate stuff with firs and stuff?
09:34<andythenorth>I use chameleon
09:34<V453000>let's see :D
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09:34<andythenorth>there are other choices
09:34<andythenorth>python has Template built in, but it can’t do loops and shit
09:35<andythenorth>although Eddi probably can make it do that with trees
09:35<andythenorth>recursive lamdbas :P
09:35<V453000>the fact alone that I have no idea what you are talking about isn't very reassuring :D
09:35<andythenorth>you used CPP shit?
09:36<andythenorth>NUTS is all written out by hand?
09:36<V453000>yes :)
09:36<andythenorth>fuck that :)
09:36<andythenorth>that’s for peasants
09:36<V453000>was 100k lines at one point
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09:36<V453000>and with my next train set I want serious switch insanity, doing it by hand would be utter retardation
09:36<andythenorth>all my train properties, ever
09:36<andythenorth>86 lines
09:37<V453000>that's something I imagined
09:37<andythenorth>and loops
09:38<V453000>this might be a lot more complicated than I imagined
09:39<@peter1138>Damn, deliveroo don't deliver here :(
09:39<V453000>still intrigued to give it a try though
09:39<V453000>will probably be hard but good practice
09:40<andythenorth>peter1138: it’s probably worth moving house to get deliveroo
09:40<andythenorth>V453000: I wrote even a tutorial for basic templating
09:41<V453000>where can I find it? :D
09:41<andythenorth>bit blah blah words
09:41<andythenorth>words and more words
09:42<V453000>oh yeah I am pretty sure I saw that page at some point :D
09:42<V453000>I'll check it out :)
09:42<andythenorth>lacks swearing
09:43<@peter1138>andythenorth, they deliver to my house. I'm at work though.
09:43<andythenorth>reason to work at home
09:43<andythenorth>new job?
09:46<@peter1138>If I worked at home I could just pop round to the big Tesco :p
09:52<andythenorth>‘Box Car’, ‘Big Box Car’
09:53<V453000>Ultimately Big Box Car
09:53<andythenorth>MOAR Box Car
09:53<V453000>I dont see a problem andy
09:53<andythenorth>is this ‘short buy menu’ fetish
09:53<andythenorth>but Road Hog has shitload of trucks and trams
09:53<andythenorth>all look good
09:53<andythenorth>problem solved
09:53<andythenorth>long buy menu, all looks good = winning
09:54<andythenorth>short buy menu, looks shit = losing
09:54<V453000>logics is strong today
09:54<andythenorth>should write a book
09:54<V453000>wait when you witness my ultimate train set purchase menu
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09:54<V453000>it will be over 9000
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09:54*andythenorth looking at UKRS 2 with all extras turned on
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10:14<Wolf01>Ok, palette copied
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10:24*andythenorth adds NUTS to game
10:25<andythenorth>V453000: too many wagons in NUTS
10:25<andythenorth>buy menu totally spammed
10:26<V453000>I know right
10:26<V453000>is why ULTIMATE TRAIN SET
10:27<V453000>NUTS Ultimate Train Set
10:27<V453000>duplicite recursive acronyms
10:27<V453000>world ends
10:27<andythenorth>wtf caboose?
10:28<V453000>I win
10:28<andythenorth>such different
10:28<V453000>try to build it :P
10:31<andythenorth>‘Big Box Car'
10:31<andythenorth>‘Big Hopper'
10:31<andythenorth>‘Big Dump'
10:32<Wolf01>Mmmh, I don't think I can paint the voxel faces of different colour :(
10:33<V453000>oh, some obscure voxel editor
10:33<V453000>not master race 3D :P
10:35<Wolf01>Ok, my editor doesn't generate a texture
10:36<V453000>probably just incompatible with the 11/8
10:47<Wolf01>Wait, there is a new update wich also support selections \o/
10:47<V453000>what are you using?
10:49<Wolf01>I use this for the models of my game
10:49<V453000>how big is 1 voxel in translation to openttd?
10:50<andythenorth>such voxels :)
10:50<Wolf01>Dunno, 1px I think, in my game 1 voxel is Vector3(1,1,1)
10:52<V453000>quite intrigued how is that going to translate
10:52<V453000>isometric voxel isn't exactly a square :P
10:53<Wolf01>I can set the isometric camera and the angle and render with that
10:54<V453000>well yeah but the only angle in which a voxel is a square is a side/top/etc view :P
10:59<V453000>off I fuck
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11:35<@peter1138>Wolf01, what game?
11:35<@peter1138>"A free lightweight 8-bit voxel editor"
11:36<Wolf01>The one with tanks where I'm stuck
11:36<@peter1138>So only 256 colours?
11:36<@peter1138>That'll be 8bpp then.
11:38<@peter1138>There's a load of people who call low resolution graphics "8 bit" :S
11:38<@peter1138>And it winds me up. We were there man!
11:46<andythenorth>this is not 40/8
11:46<andythenorth>clearly 3/8
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13:03<andythenorth>“Big Caboose"
13:03<andythenorth>Big Horse
13:05<@peter1138>Hmm, I've been invited to someone's holiday slide show...
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13:07<andythenorth>run away
13:07<Eddi|zuHause>how exciting
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13:27<supermop>very few people selling braun amplifiers will ship them to the US
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14:35<V453000>the trees don't seem to be doing themselves
14:35*V453000 goes help
14:36<frosch123>i had the impressions some of the hugging ones tried to reproduce
14:36<V453000>yeah but they just produced growth stages not new species
14:37<V453000>I was playing diablo for the last 20 minutes and they produced literally zero new trees
14:37<V453000>like wtf
14:41<Wolf01>Did you see my voxel-lego engines?
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14:42<V453000>the one on the right is dark as fuck
14:42<V453000>the one on the left lacks contrast
14:42<V453000>only thoughts I have for now, but I guess it is work in progress
14:42<Wolf01>I wanted to do it brown, but was darker
14:42<Wolf01>Yes it's WIP, I'll add some other engines and wagons
14:44<andythenorth>in a grf with speed limits
14:44<andythenorth>engines that haul freight and pax are a PITA
14:44<andythenorth>they bridge two linkgraphs
14:45<V453000>self imposed problems :P
14:46<Eddi|zuHause>andy seems masochistic enough to enjoy those
14:46<andythenorth>I guess I just need MOAR
14:47<andythenorth>creating a tiny set is easy
14:47<Wolf01>Also not sure the freight engine should have 4 bogeys
14:47<andythenorth>‘one super awesome train at all times'
14:48<andythenorth>creating a big set is easy
14:48<andythenorth>‘bazillions of trains, with arbitrary useless stats variations'
14:48<Eddi|zuHause>you mean like the 2ccset?
14:48<andythenorth>maybe :P
14:48<andythenorth>creating a set where there’s one-and-only-one train for each common use case....
14:48<andythenorth>is hard
14:49<V453000>is nuts :P
14:49<andythenorth>also that
14:49<andythenorth>also trying to go from 1870 to 2020 in fewest possible generations
14:49<V453000>might not necessarily be a good thing
14:50<V453000>getting new engines often is nice
14:50<andythenorth>I do them every 30 years or so
14:50<V453000>10 generations of nuts is a good amount but having 20 wouldn't hurt either
14:50<V453000>30 years is like 8 hours of game time?
14:50<V453000>is insane
14:50<andythenorth>1870, 1900, 1930, 1960, 1990, 2020
14:50<andythenorth>is 6.5 hours or so
14:50<V453000>yeah that's shitload
14:51<andythenorth>shitload of hours, or trains? o_O
14:53<V453000>when did you play the game for 8 hours last time?
14:53<andythenorth>almost never
14:53<V453000>for servers it's ok since you often log off and see it later
14:53<andythenorth>I usually play the change across one generation of vehicles
14:53<V453000>but for nonstop playing I will even have a parameter for "fast game" where all engines come out in a span of a few hours
14:53<andythenorth>most I get to is 70 years or so
14:54<V453000>so you can customize the grf for BB or other goal servers etc
14:54<andythenorth>so eh, trying to 6 generations of engines, with only 3 generations of wagons
14:54<andythenorth>and also speed limits bollocks
14:55<V453000>speaking of which, is there a way to parametrize release dates of vehicles?
14:55<V453000>as in have a parameter int of range 1950-2000 so the user can choose when a specific vehicle is released?
14:56<V453000>other than if parameter == 1951 then item{ release_date = 1951}
14:56<V453000>or do I just need to do thise 50 times with each of the possible values?
14:56<V453000>I mean I will just do it with each of them, it just feels slightly unelegant
14:56<V453000>I'll have about 12 engines so it's no big deal
14:57<frosch123>you can use grf parameters in properties just fine
14:57<frosch123>you just cannot disable the randomisation
14:57<V453000>randomisation I am aware of
14:57<V453000>so I can just put it into the date directly?
14:57<frosch123>but "date(1900,0,0)+365*parameter" is just fine
14:57<V453000>okay! :)
14:57<frosch123>putting it into the "date"... no idea :)
14:57<V453000>thanks, noting
14:58<frosch123>depends on whether nml tries to do the leap year stuff for parameters, or whether it just calls you stupid to try
14:58<V453000>introduction_date: date(1945, 1, 1)+365*intro_date_vehicle1;
14:58<V453000>so this should work?
14:58<V453000>holy shit :) thanks
14:58<V453000>will use
14:58<V453000>this set will wreck shit, I sez
14:59<V453000>am hyped
14:59<frosch123>you can also divide some interval between two parameters
14:59<V453000>I don't understand
14:59<V453000>divide interval between two parameters? which two parameters?
15:00<frosch123>like you set param_year_first_engine, param_year_last_engine
15:00<frosch123>and then define all vehicle dates based on those
15:01<V453000>holy shit that would be even better
15:02<frosch123>you can also use the difference of those two parameters to adjust model life
15:02<V453000>right, that's less important but can be useful
15:02<andythenorth>V453000: you doing daylength-in-newgrf? o_O
15:03<V453000>you can put it that way yes
15:03<V453000>it's just for universal convenience
15:04<frosch123>param_steam_era, param_diesel_era, param_electric_era, param_maglev_era, param_slug_era
15:05<V453000>nah will be just param_start and param_finish :)
15:05<Wolf01>Could I compose an engine from 3 parts?
15:05<V453000>Yes? :)
15:06<andythenorth>what’s wrong with a large buy menu?
15:06*andythenorth has forgotten
15:07<frosch123>pikka flu?
15:07<V453000>the fact that it's large :) nothing else
15:07<andythenorth>think so
15:07<V453000>railtypes are actually super helpful with this, you can effectively split it
15:07<V453000>so you always see just a selection
15:07<V453000>rail, mono, mglv, slugrail, catrail
15:08<Eddi|zuHause>you clearly forgot wetrail
15:08<V453000>iz not in new set
15:08<Eddi|zuHause>how dare you!!
15:09<V453000>don't want to make NUTS2 :) yet
15:09<andythenorth>‘survey sets'
15:10<andythenorth>meh, ultimately V453000 is right :(
15:10<V453000>? XD
15:11<andythenorth>the problem with big train sets is mostly that foamers only draw the engines
15:11<andythenorth>so 900 almost-identical engines, and unfinished range of wagons
15:11<andythenorth>then they have to introduce fake ‘balancing’ reasons to choose one engine instead of another
15:12<frosch123>are you talking about one-wagon-to-rule-them-all-V ?
15:12<V453000>I never thought about it as a disparity between wagons and engines, but yeah
15:12<andythenorth>frosch123: exactly
15:12<V453000>but I don't think any of the sets are making any balancing reasons
15:12<V453000>they just ignore gameplay
15:12<andythenorth>V453000 has same goal as me: almost unique wagons per cargo
15:12<andythenorth>but has a more nuclear route to achieve it :P
15:13<V453000>V453000 has one goal in taht direction, ALWAYS unique wagons per cargo
15:13<V453000>not almost
15:13<V453000>nuclear as fuck
15:13<V453000>now I'm going to even make a better maintainable system for asses who add 666 obscure cargoes with each industry set release
15:14<frosch123>well, without firs i would have never learned about cassava
15:15<V453000>yeah and how does it look in NUTS
15:15<frosch123>they kind of make it interesting :)
15:15<V453000>I like them frosch123
15:15<V453000>but the system of NUTS makes it a total pain to add more cargoes
15:15<V453000>not necessarily because of some system flaw, but because it's simply a shitload of work
15:16<V453000>needs something smart to make it maintainable
15:17<V453000>kind of
15:17<frosch123><insert obligatory xkcd>
15:17<V453000>for example I want to make extensive use of index recolours for same shape cargoes
15:17<Eddi|zuHause>tbh, i never really bought into the minimalistic 10cc approach
15:18<andythenorth>it was an over-shoot
15:18<V453000>which means adding new colours for hotfix FIRS cargoes will be just a few lines of code
15:18<V453000>wtf is 10cc
15:18<andythenorth>pikka minimal set, became pineapple
15:18<andythenorth>10 engines only
15:18<Eddi|zuHause>in CETS i tried to resolve the "duplicate engines with near-identical stats" by putting them into different companies
15:18<V453000>just arbitrary bollocks
15:19<andythenorth>I just don’t have engines with near identical stats
15:19<andythenorth>I’m still playing ‘my favourite childhood train'
15:19<andythenorth>but I just dibble the stats
15:20<V453000>just define a bunch of classes and make some progressing models inside them
15:20<Eddi|zuHause>that would still make lots of duplicates, but i also tried to sort them into categories of local pax/long distant pax/light freight/fast freight/heavy freight
15:20<V453000>easiest way to do it right
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15:20<V453000>and you can add hybrids after
15:21<Eddi|zuHause>and then have enough reasons to leave out further duplicates
15:21<andythenorth>I have ‘small + fast’, ‘freight’, ‘heavy freight’, ‘pax’ ‘electric powerful but low TE’
15:21<V453000>I can say that balancing them in a way so that each of the classes is actually perfectly viable is not a short process and requires a lot of testing and observation of people playing
15:21<andythenorth>so I will end up with 666 wagons, one per cargo
15:22<andythenorth>V will have one wagon
15:22<V453000>how does electric powerful compare to freight or heavy freight?
15:22<V453000>V will have several wagons actually
15:22<V453000>but they will be kind of the same
15:22<Eddi|zuHause>i don't know what electric powerful is
15:22<andythenorth>too much realism
15:23<andythenorth>same HP as heavy freight, as fast as fastest pax
15:23<andythenorth>it’s nearly ultimate, if you’re prepared to build wires
15:23<Eddi|zuHause>but usually there are duplicates in electric/non-electric
15:23<andythenorth>yeah, duplicates across railtypes seems acceptable
15:24<V453000>you mean ready to press C and drag over whole map? :P
15:24<andythenorth>also that
15:25<Eddi|zuHause>there are electric hybrids that are both strong and fast, but usually freight is limited by wagon speed
15:26<Eddi|zuHause>there's really no other reason to distinguish freight and pax
15:26<andythenorth>it’s just an arbitrary bit of realism
15:26<andythenorth>and low-speed freight messes up your high-speed networks
15:26<V453000>even nuts has that part of realism :P
15:27<Eddi|zuHause>yeah, but you need some kind of challenge :p
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15:27<V453000>it's just nice to see civilized trains in towns and industrial trains in freight lines
15:27*andythenorth drew a train
15:27<V453000>very nice
15:27<V453000>seems inconsistent style with boxcar though
15:28<frosch123>civilized trains in towns? and barbarian trains for freight?
15:28<andythenorth>such realism
15:28<V453000>yeah frosch123, slugs everywhere
15:28<frosch123>sounds like the attillery rain will instead feature a big battle axe :p
15:28<V453000>not impossible :P
15:28<andythenorth>this + this
15:29<V453000>is shoes
15:30<Wolf01> better?
15:30<andythenorth>so if I add one more generation pax coaches?
15:30<andythenorth>will be 4 total, kittens all dead?
15:31<V453000>if I was doing that I'd go apeshit on colour shades Wolf01
15:31<V453000>basically trying to almost never have 2 same neighbouring colours
15:31<Wolf01>I cannot shade
15:32<V453000>you can, it's just puzzle
15:32<V453000>andythenorth: catpocalypse
15:32<V453000>do it
15:32<V453000>I'll have 1 wagon generation, they'll just automatically adjust to the leading engine
15:32<V453000>modern leading engine, modern wagons
15:33<V453000>sick shit eh
15:33<V453000>aye aye sir, fecal sick is
15:34<andythenorth>has to be 1 or 666
15:34<andythenorth>no other valid choices
15:34<V453000>well having 1 cargo for 1 wagon is a nice move for new players who aren't aware of refit button
15:34<andythenorth>64 cargos in FIRS currently
15:34<andythenorth>5 generations
15:35<V453000>but making a batshit insane train set which exploits game mechanics through the roof doesn't need to worry about that I guess
15:35<andythenorth>320 wagons?
15:35<V453000>10 engines
15:35<andythenorth>also need big + small versions of each
15:35<andythenorth>for reasons
15:35<V453000>ah sure
15:35<V453000>close to 666
15:35<andythenorth>not bad
15:35<V453000>just add 26 cabeese
15:35<andythenorth>2 cabeese only
15:35<V453000>no 26
15:35<V453000>big reasons
15:35<V453000>like really big
15:35<andythenorth>no I add more cargos to FIRS
15:35<V453000>XD ok
15:36<andythenorth>@65 * 5 * 2
15:36<andythenorth>@calc 65 * 5 * 2
15:36<@DorpsGek>andythenorth: 650
15:36<andythenorth>16 cabeese
15:36<andythenorth>unique wagon per cargo
15:36<V453000>ok enough reasons
15:36<andythenorth>also 1 universal wagon type
15:36<andythenorth>6 cabeese
15:37<andythenorth>no more refit bollocks, just scroll lots, build needed wagon
15:37<V453000>full retard mode confirmed
15:37<andythenorth>much scroll
15:37<V453000>well you can filter it :P
15:37<andythenorth>refit buggy anyway
15:37<andythenorth>has weird subtypes feature
15:37<V453000>oh wait user who isn't aware of refit button isn't aware of a filter button either :P
15:37<V453000>subtypes are cool for colour refit
15:38<V453000>for rainbow-powered networks
15:38<V453000>critically important obviously
15:39<andythenorth>and liveries
15:39<V453000>good that I started with temperate and end with toyland because my trees are getting more and more fucked up in the head
15:39<andythenorth>dunno why they were called subtypes ever
15:39<V453000>colours = liveries in my world
15:39<andythenorth>nuff authors think that subtypes are actually called liveries
15:39<andythenorth>according to FS
15:39<V453000>well you can refit to steel planks or steel pipes
15:39<V453000>iz subtype
15:39<andythenorth>that’s just texture map :P
15:39<andythenorth>IS NOT REAL CARGO
15:39<andythenorth>just pixels
15:40<V453000>pixel lives matter
15:40<andythenorth>pixels are for life, not just christmas
15:40<V453000>also selecting goods refit to beer is the most important feature of db set
15:40<V453000>rest is disposable
15:42<andythenorth>too many different wagon types here
15:42<andythenorth>lacks consistent schema
15:43<V453000>picture has cows, 10/10
15:44<frosch123>andythenorth: i always liked randomised wagons
15:44<andythenorth>yetis are hiding though V453000
15:44<andythenorth>frosch123: random on build? Or building alternatives yourself?
15:44<frosch123>random on build
15:44<andythenorth>is random lengths a stupid idea?
15:44<andythenorth>irritating eh
15:44<frosch123>i just mean random color
15:45<andythenorth>horse does that
15:45<frosch123>only minimal shape changes
15:45<frosch123>no random tanker vs flat car :p
15:45<andythenorth>I just flip 2cc and 1cc over
15:45<andythenorth>then player can 'disable' random by setting both colours same
15:46<V453000>random wagon graphics are the top feature to make a nice looking train set in my opinion
15:46<V453000>nothing makes that much impact
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16:02<andythenorth>ha ha
16:02<andythenorth>shoebox tiny engine can do 110 mph
16:02<andythenorth>is almost realism also
16:05<V453000>300kmh or go home
16:09<frosch123>randomised railtype?
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16:19<Wolf01> short trains added
16:20<Wolf01>Enough for today
16:20<andythenorth>8-wide? o_O
16:20<Wolf01>Why not?
16:22<supermop>Wolf01: cute
16:23<supermop>andythenorth: if 6 wide how would lego dudes fit inside
16:23<V453000>this with some attempt at shading could be really nice
16:23<andythenorth>supermop: you have to have the right windowas
16:23<andythenorth>windows *
16:23<Wolf01>Maybe I could make them 7-wide, so I could draw a thin divider on the front window
16:24<supermop>what track do they run on?
16:25<supermop>what is the gauge in bumps?
16:26<Wolf01>Or I can make them 15-wide and render as 7-wide so I can add more detail everywhere
16:26<supermop>extra zoom whereby granularity increases?
16:28<Wolf01>Or I can do them with some 3d design software directly
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---Logclosed Wed Sep 20 00:00:04 2017