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#openttd IRC Logs for 2019-07-15

---Logopened Mon Jul 15 00:00:08 2019
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03:55<Eddi|zuHause>hm... i can't get it to boot from the win installation stick either...
03:57<@peter1138>My toast was so hot this morning that the butter boiled off it...
03:58<Eddi|zuHause>... are we maybe just incapable of anything?
03:58<@peter1138>Are you?
03:58<Eddi|zuHause>maybe?
04:07*andythenorth maybe
04:14<@peter1138>So melted butter, marmite and very hot toast. It was tasty.
04:23<LordAro>peter1138: nom
04:33<andythenorth>where do we stand on vegemite?
04:53<Eddi|zuHause>never tried, but sounds horrible?
04:54<Eddi|zuHause>"The command "exit 0" failed with exit status "1", program is prematurely aborted" <-- err, what?
04:58<LordAro>Eddi|zuHause: that sounds impressively broken
05:07<Eddi|zuHause>the output line before that was "line 1573: echo: write error: Invalid argument"
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05:10<Eddi|zuHause>it sorta worked, in that i now have a bootable windows installation stick... but when i go in there and say "repair boot problems" it just shrugs...
05:11<Eddi|zuHause>maybe it's because i have the system on an USB device?
05:26<Eddi|zuHause>i probably need a newer windows with multi-partition-usb-support
05:32<Eddi|zuHause>unfortunately i can't hook this disk up to the internal SATA, because it doesn't have any 12V power supply
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07:21<@peter1138>andythenorth, Vegemite is okay but Marmite is better, so why bother?
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08:59<andythenorth>I often have both
08:59<andythenorth>separate slices of toast, obvs.
09:06<@peter1138>For a bit of double blind A-B testing, eh?
09:07<@peter1138>It was lunch time. I had, drumroll... salad. And some cheesecake.
09:07<andythenorth>I had something+cheese
09:07<andythenorth>I can't remember what the approved term is
09:07<andythenorth>tubular pasta + cheese
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09:24<Samu>hi
09:25<nnyby>hi
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09:56<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nikolas closed pull request #7654: Change: Update for French town name "Beaujolais" https://git.io/fjXcY
09:56<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nikolas commented on pull request #7654: Change: Update for French town name "Beaujolais" https://git.io/fjX1q
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10:36<@peter1138>andythenorth, macaroni cheese, yes.
10:37<andythenorth>that
10:38<Eddi|zuHause>tonight there's going to be steak
10:40<andythenorth>peter1138 small wheeled bikes are great https://propelbikes.com/wp-content/uploads/2000/10/Riese-Muller-Tinker-Touring-HS-Black-Matt.jpg
10:40<andythenorth>you don't need to justify them, they're just fun
10:41<Eddi|zuHause>i don't see the point
10:41<@peter1138>That one appears to have an excess of motor.
10:41<andythenorth>yes, other small-wheeel options are available
10:41<@peter1138>And suspension.
10:41<andythenorth>I have a friend who is Brompton obsessed
10:41<andythenorth>I have never had a bike with suspension before
10:42<andythenorth>it's quite different to my old bike, hardtail, hard fork, aluminium, skinny tyres, deep-rim wheels
10:42<@peter1138>Yeah, Bromptons come under the folder category, though.
10:42<@peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, might have a beetroot burger later.
10:42<Eddi|zuHause>i didn't understand a word of those sentences...
10:43<Eddi|zuHause>peter1138: my condolences
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10:43<Beerbelott>How does one rename a city?
10:43<andythenorth>deed poll
10:44<Eddi|zuHause>click on the name, in the window it has a rename button
10:44<reldred>Pagan rituals
10:44<@peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, they're really nice.
10:44<reldred>or, you know, the button thing eddi suggested
10:45-!-arikover [~user@x4db721a0.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:45<@peter1138>And... I had lots of meat over the weekend (and some for lunch in my salad) so don't need more.
10:45-!-Arveen [~Arveen@pD9FD3BBC.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: I like trains]
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10:46<Eddi|zuHause>i'm getting a feeling my forum signature is maybe a tad outdated
10:47<reldred>Mine's a vague reference to a flame war that happened a decade ago so you're probably doing better than me
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10:47<reldred>I should do something about that
10:48<andythenorth>1 meat a day
10:48<andythenorth>is enough
10:48<reldred>also andythenorth, hotels on mixed slops in new firs are happening and shearing sprites :(
10:48<andythenorth>yum
10:48<andythenorth>wonder what I broke
10:48<reldred>Mmmm, sheared sprites. Delicious.
10:48<andythenorth>could you screenshot and put in forums?
10:48<andythenorth>so I can forget, like all the other bugs :(
10:49<reldred>Only because you asked nicely
10:50<andythenorth>thx
10:51<Eddi|zuHause>reldred: mine is a link to an online game that i stopped really playing before i even joined the forum. and i'm not sure it even still exists
10:51<reldred>hah
10:51<reldred>andythenorth: done, looks like northern most tile is the culprit
10:52<andythenorth>hurrah
10:52<reldred>I hope you appreciate me clearing a hillside so it's actually visible :P
10:52<andythenorth>yus
10:52<Eddi|zuHause>reldred: last time i checked, i had 8 successful hits on the referral, and i needed 10 to actually do anything with them
10:53<reldred>Also RIP in peace diagnosing/fixing that. I took one look at dealing with slopes in newobjects and noped the fuck out.
10:53<reldred>maybe I should actually just do my eventual landscape object set in nml and save myself the misery
10:54<Eddi|zuHause>reldred: and then the owner changed, so even if the website still exists, the referral won't do anything
10:55<reldred>Eddi|zuHause: ahahahah, oh dear.
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11:30<Beerbelott>Eddi|zuHause: The button is greyed out in multiplayer, does that mean it's an owner/admin-only option?
11:40<Eddi|zuHause>probably
11:44<LordAro>https://www.circle-lang.org/
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11:48<Eddi|zuHause>LordAro: i'm not sure i learned anything from this "introduction"
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12:59<andythenorth>hmm
13:00<andythenorth>got some wagons which have open roofs / sides when loading
13:00<andythenorth>should I show cargo sprites?
13:01<andythenorth>probably TMWFTLB, and bad for compile time
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13:21<Eddi|zuHause>... you probably should
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13:22<Wolf01>o/
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14:38<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper updated pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjXmK
14:41*nielsm attempts adding a viewport to the station window
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14:44<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper commented on pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjX9i
14:46<nielsm>https://0x0.st/z997.png works a little bit
14:46<LordAro>:o
14:50<frosch123>restrict station spread to fit inside a viewport?
14:53<nielsm>can a viewport be configured to hide signs? :)
14:56<frosch123>ND_NO_TRANSPARENCY kind of does the reverse
15:05<nielsm>https://0x0.st/z9po.jpg
15:06<nielsm>need some new icons for "close airport" and "show catchment", and the sign icon is also too large compared to the center view
15:06<nielsm>and need to update the viewport position when window resizes or station sign moves
15:13<frosch123>vehicles have the rename button in the caption of details window :p
15:13<nielsm>yeah, that's always seemed a bit hacky :P
15:13<nielsm>even though it was how CS made it
15:13<nielsm>also stations don't have a details window
15:13<frosch123>towns and stations are more similar
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15:27<frosch123>i think the edit button is fine in the caption
15:27<frosch123>but it could be a icon (pencil or similar) instead of a text button
15:27<nielsm>right
15:27<nielsm>that just leaves the number of vertical buttons too low to make the viewport sensible :)
15:28<frosch123>i think there was an old forum topic to add a unified "go to location" button to all captions
15:28<Wolf01>So more usability features coming?
15:28<frosch123>nielsm: towns have no vertical buttons either
15:28<nielsm>unless I do some uglyness with taking the four "show vehicles of type stopping here" and jam into a single button space
15:28<frosch123>Wolf01: no, just more talking
15:29<nielsm>frosch123: the idea is to try to make the various windows more similar
15:29<frosch123>yes, i figured that
15:29<frosch123>but the vehicle gui is the exception
15:30<frosch123>while town/station/industry are more the same
15:30<frosch123>town/station/industry have no vertical buttons
15:31<nielsm>https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7540
15:31<frosch123>while vehicle gui has some vertical buttons which are no vertical buttons for other guis, while missing some vertical buttons at the same time
15:31<frosch123>like timetable gui, go to depot/refit
15:32<frosch123>when you change the tabs, why do you keep the waiting cargo?
15:33<frosch123>"coverage" and "4x vehicles" are more like location+rename
15:34<frosch123>but there could be 4 tabs: waiting / planned / accepts / ratings
15:34<frosch123>instead of two panels which each select from 2
15:35<frosch123>hmm, turns out i do not even know what the selection at the top does
15:35<nielsm>I never use the "planned" view, entirely forget it exists
15:35<frosch123>i know the planned vs waiting
15:35<frosch123>but what is station vs amount?
15:35<nielsm>sort order
15:35<nielsm>station name vs cargo amount
15:36<frosch123>i thought that's what the second dropdown does :p
15:37<nielsm>an RCT2-like floating "centre view here" button in the viewport could be nice
15:37<nielsm>no the second dropdown selects the grouping style
15:38<frosch123>yeah, that fits the labeling
15:38<frosch123>but the planned/waiting is not about sorting, it's about different data, right?
15:38<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7540: Change: New layout for the Station view window https://git.io/fjXH6
15:39<nielsm>yeah "planned" is how much cdist is routing towards the station from other sources, as far as I understand
15:41<frosch123>aw, andy deleted a wiki page i wanted to look something up :p
15:42<nielsm>anyway, accepts and ratings can definitely be merged into a single view
15:43<nielsm>and that could also later allow displaying "potential accepts" and "potential supplies" so you could tell how close you were to accepting something, and add a button to begin taking supplies of a cargo without a vehicle there to pick it up yet
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15:49<nielsm>tried the quad-button: https://0x0.st/z9pJ.png
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15:50<nielsm>great timing
15:50<frosch123>https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1068385#p1068396 <- there was a topic about the location buttons
15:50<frosch123>but very little content :p
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15:51<frosch123>nielsm: in that screenshot the window has now 3 panels
15:51<frosch123>which is kind of complicated
15:51<nielsm>yea
15:52<frosch123>do you ever need to see both "waiting cargo" and "accepts"?
15:52<nielsm>if you see my beautiful hand drawn sketch in the above PR you can see I tried to unify the cargo lists
15:52-!-mode/#openttd [+v SmatZ] by ChanServ
15:52<frosch123>ah, there are more pictures when scrolling down
15:55<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7540: Change: New layout for the Station view window https://git.io/fjXH5
15:55<frosch123>hmm, i think i am not a fan of the vertical buttons
15:56<frosch123>i would rather remove them from the vehicle gui, if the vehicle gui wasn't the most used gui in the game, and everyone would have to relearn :p
15:57<nielsm>how about the viewport-less redesign in the initial version of the PR? (the first screenshot)
15:57<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Gymnasiast commented on pull request #7540: Change: New layout for the Station view window https://git.io/fjXHx
15:59<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7540: Change: New layout for the Station view window https://git.io/fjXHj
15:59<frosch123>the order gui once had many buttons in one row, now there are two rows
15:59<frosch123>but it has both rows a the bottom, not one in the middle
16:00<frosch123>otherwise i still like moving location and rename as icons into the caption
16:00<+glx>and order GUI is still not easy to understand ;)
16:02<frosch123>it's not harder than the orders themself :p
16:03<frosch123>factorio order gui is a lot easier, but it takes way longer to set up orders
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16:10*andythenorth paints trains
16:12*peter1138 paints voxels
16:14<frosch123>are those codewords for "lunch"?
16:14<@peter1138>Nah, Minecraft.
16:14<@peter1138>And it's |
16:14<@peter1138>And it's ~9 hours too late for lunch.
16:15<andythenorth>Horse 93%
16:15<andythenorth>regressed again :P
16:16<+glx>usually last 10% take 90% of the total time
16:16<andythenorth>added 6 more trains :P
16:16<andythenorth>since yesterday
16:17<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on pull request #7540: Change: New layout for the Station view window https://git.io/fjXQ8
16:36<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh requested changes for pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjXQi
16:37<nielsm>commentdump...
16:38<frosch123>the "using Map =" is funny
16:38<frosch123>i wonder which other programming language names stuff "Map"
16:38<nielsm>doesn't C# ?
16:38<frosch123>usually people add those aliases to twist c++ into some other language they are more familar with
16:39<frosch123>c# seems to have Dictionary
16:40<nielsm>okay let's try to build that PR...
16:40<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #7540: Change: New layout for the Station view window https://git.io/fjXQX
16:45<nielsm>https://0x0.st/z9fs.jpg
16:47<frosch123>wasn't there something about columns and columnfilters the other day?
16:47<nielsm>yeah we talked a bit about making a generic filter gui
16:47<nielsm>filter/sort
16:47<frosch123>hmm, oh, this is more than a filter
16:47<frosch123>there are widgets for weight and slope
16:48<frosch123>so, some acceleration code
16:48<nielsm>there is one minor bug I can find, it doesn't work without wagon speed limits (or with wagons without speed limit)
16:48<nielsm>you have to set the max speed down to zero to get any of the default ones to show up
16:49<nielsm>yeah it does some magic calculation for ability to pull a train of a certain weight up a slope at a certain speed
16:49<frosch123>well, i don't think i would use that gui
16:49<frosch123>in other games i usually create external spreadsheets until i have a feeling for the mechanics
16:49<frosch123>then i eyeball stuff
16:50<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper updated pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjXmK
16:55<+glx>"Take the train parameters from the from" is weird
16:55<nielsm>yeah that's broken text
16:59<nielsm>gn
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17:14<LordAro>Eddi|zuHause: any chance of you ever updating #7000?
17:14<LordAro>it is our oldest open PR :p
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17:29<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper commented on pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjX7W
17:33<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper commented on pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjX74
17:36<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper commented on pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjX70
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17:46<Eddi|zuHause>LordAro: probably, but not today
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17:49<Eddi|zuHause>youtube: "15 facts you might not have known about satisfactory" – me: "thanks, i'll continue to not know them, then."
17:56<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper updated pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjXmK
18:15<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper updated pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjXmK
18:19<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper updated pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjXmK
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18:47<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] imcasper commented on pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjX5m
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19:23<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7653: Add: BuildVehicleSmartGUI https://git.io/fjX5g
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---Logclosed Tue Jul 16 00:00:10 2019