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#openttd IRC Logs for 2019-08-04

---Logopened Sun Aug 04 00:00:37 2019
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02:34<andythenorth>o/
02:44*andythenorth experimenting with Instruments https://developer.apple.com/library/archive/documentation/Performance/Conceptual/PerformanceOverview/PerformanceTools/PerformanceTools.html
02:44<andythenorth>not sure what I'm doing, but I have a lot of charts :P
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02:48<Samu>wwow Beerbelott so much text for 5 lines
02:48<Samu>4
02:50<Beerbelott>Well it's because that's because this small change gets a foot in the door... it needs more changes, whatever is decided
02:51<Beerbelott>and in the past some "obvious" small changes took me a lot of time to explain/format correctly...
02:52<Samu>oh, you're alive, I thought everybody was sleeping
02:53<Beerbelott>Haven't slept yet
02:54<Samu>eh, wiki articles
02:55<Samu>they're usually outdated
02:56<andythenorth>:x
02:56<andythenorth>when I want to run a profiler, I can't get OpenTTD to dump frame rate to 16fps
02:57<andythenorth>but if it's not being profiled, it will do it trivially :P
02:57<andythenorth>there's a lesson in that somewhere :P
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03:05<Samu>i'm not sure how libraries work, "it just works"
03:07<Samu>i tick the AIs i want to download, and that's it, it auto-selects needed libraries
03:07<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7666: Add: [Win32] Select MIDI device by port name https://git.io/fjHYZ
03:08<Samu>their exact version needed are downloaded
03:10<andythenorth>if OpenTTD performance is wildly variable for no obvious reason, and no reproducible trigger
03:11<andythenorth>is the logical conclusion that the problem is my system?
03:14<nielsm>the profiler might affect how certain system timers are handled and that might cause the problem to disappear or change character
03:14<nielsm>(that would match with my suspicion that the issue is not caused by anything actually being slow, but rather by some timers or delays being wrong)
03:15<Samu>high precision event timer?
03:16<andythenorth>the problem isn't reproducible even with the profiler off
03:16<andythenorth>I was going to bisect for performance, as 1.9.1 does not exhibit the issue to the same extent as master afaict
03:16<andythenorth>but I can't bisect without a repro :P
03:18<andythenorth>this is me https://www.kaplaninternational.com/blog/files/styles/device_phone/public/wp/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/CHASE-RAINBOWS.jpg?itok=uw7Q9AVT
03:20<Samu>x86 versions of Mac OS X.
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03:20<Samu>what did I just read?
03:29<andythenorth>??
03:29<Beerbelott>Samu: I don't think the WIki is outdated on the matter I quoted. The Squirrel import function seems to work the way it's documented. and the code just ignores script versions anyway
03:29<Beerbelott>Both are a problem, one way or the other
03:30<Beerbelott>My quick & dirty fix makes the current, illogical "upgrade" mechanism almost useless (as I don't think a script w/ same name & version ever changes MD5 signature
03:31<Beerbelott>brb
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03:40<peter1139>I don't know, what did you just read?
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04:14<Samu>libraries don't update the same manner as AIs
04:15<Samu>but I don't know
04:17<Samu>https://bananas.openttd.org/en/ailibrary/
04:17<Samu>nevermind, I don't know at all
04:20<Samu>new version of a library make the previous version to be hidden from content download
04:20<Samu>but that doesn't force an upgrade
04:20<Samu>when downloading AIs
04:24<Samu>looks like I'm confused
04:24<Samu>inside openttd it lists Pathfinder.Road version 3 and 4
04:26<Samu>on the website, it only lists version 4
04:26<Samu>https://bananas.openttd.org/en/ailibrary/
04:37<andythenorth>ha ha smoke
04:37*andythenorth back to YT
04:38<Samu>i found a problem with my AI
04:38<Samu>when reliability of available engines is too low to be considered
04:38<Samu>it shouldn't bother searching for a route
04:39<Samu>or
04:39<Samu>it should pick the most reliable, even though they both suck
04:39<Samu>after all, they're still available...
04:42<Samu>the transition between tricario helicopter and guru x2 helicopter, reliability period of both engines are below 75%
04:42<Samu>there's a small phase my AI becomes dumb, it builds the heliports and then doesn't build the aircraft
04:43<Samu>then demolishes heliports
04:43<Beerbelott>Samu: If you look at the code, you will see AI & AILibrary are handled the same when compared one to each other
04:43<Samu>and keeps repeatin
04:44<Beerbelott>Well, time for me to have some sleep
04:44<Beerbelott>beuhbye
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04:49<Samu>I need to rewrite the reliability checks
04:52<Samu>maybe I should include it in the estimated income, instead of outright removing them
04:52<Samu>engines<
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06:33<Samu>hmm ai is replacing all darwin 600 with airtaxi a21
06:33<Samu>better reliability on airtaxi, same passenger capacity
06:34<Samu>i think i like this change
06:38<Samu>uhm... weird reliabilities
06:38<Samu>all models have 78%
06:39<Samu>no variance, is this intended? looks bugged
06:39<Samu>only those models that are being retired have lower values
06:41<andythenorth>breakdowns off?
06:42<Samu>no
06:42<Samu>8 aircraft models have 78%
06:43<Samu>3 have 77%
06:43<Samu>2 have 76%
06:44<Samu>then 1 of each: 63%, 55%, 47%, 47%, 42%, 40% all of these being retired soon
06:45<Samu>i find these values a bit strange
06:45<Samu>there's nothing better than 78%
06:46<Samu>those 2 that were 76%, are now 75%, they're being retired too
06:49<Samu>heh, speaking of airtaxi a21, it's being retired too
06:49<Samu>already replacing back to darwin 600
06:49<Samu>AI is being too sensible now :o
06:50<Samu>sensitive*
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07:51<andythenorth>quak
07:52<frosch123>moo
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09:07<Samu>when my ai does better with mail than with pass, something's wrong
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09:36<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7658: Add: 'getsysdate' console command https://git.io/fjHWP
10:18<peter1139>Alright, white chocolate and cookie magnums are nice...
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10:31<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7658: Add: 'getsysdate' console command https://git.io/fjHly
10:31<Eddi|zuHause>magnum as in the ice on a stick?
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10:39<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc commented on pull request #7658: Add: 'getsysdate' console command https://git.io/fjHlQ
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11:30<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] telk5093 updated pull request #7658: Add: 'getsysdate' console command https://git.io/fj1oP
11:30<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] telk5093 commented on pull request #7658: Add: 'getsysdate' console command https://git.io/fjH8p
11:31<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] telk5093 commented on pull request #7658: Add: 'getsysdate' console command https://git.io/fjH8h
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12:09<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #7658: Add: 'getsysdate' console command https://git.io/fjHgc
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12:18<peter1139>Bah, no ninjam packages
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13:43<Samu>I think I understand town effects now
13:45<Samu>AITown.GetCargoGoal
13:45<Samu>really tricky to understand
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14:35<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh merged pull request #7658: Add: 'getsysdate' console command https://git.io/fj1oP
14:44<andythenorth>yo
14:45<Eddi|zuHause>hm, i tried timing a crossing light to make it flow better, but i don't think it worked... :/
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15:33<Eddi|zuHause>ok, that did not work... :/
15:34<Eddi|zuHause>i need a road with more lanes, but there aren't any with this tram track configuration :/
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17:13<Samu>milek7: hi
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19:50<Eddi|zuHause>"Free swap = 0kB" ... why? what is cities skylines using all this memory for?
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20:00<Beerbelott>Should pieces of advice like this one be followed? warning: suggest parentheses around ‘&&’ within ‘||’ [-Wparentheses]
20:05<Eddi|zuHause>Beerbelott: more commonly this means you made a logic error, and the parentheses should be the other way around
20:06<Eddi|zuHause>Beerbelott: and yes, this warning should not appear
20:07<Beerbelott>It's nto an error, but a warning, and the logic is perfectly fine. From what I read, it's merely a disambiguation thing to *prevent* errors being made
20:08<Eddi|zuHause>yes
20:08<Beerbelott>it's a line looking like "a && b || c"
20:08<Beerbelott>precedence kicks in alright, no problem
20:08<Eddi|zuHause>so either way, you should set those parentheses
20:09<Beerbelott>but... precedence exist for a reason :\
20:09<Eddi|zuHause>but... the warning also exists for a reason
20:09<Beerbelott>it's an option which seems to have recently been added to the compiler flags
20:10<Eddi|zuHause>... i don't know how more explicitly i should spell out the answer to your question...
20:10<+glx>it's better to use parentheses even when you're sure of precedence
20:11<+glx>because it's a common error
20:12<Beerbelott>Wilco.
20:13<+glx>it's also easier to read (the reader doesn't need to remember the precedence rules ;) )
20:15<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Berbe updated pull request #7328: Improve restart https://git.io/fhxPf
20:17<Beerbelott>Just for my information, does the compile farm fail on warnings like that (I suppose yes)?
20:17<+glx>no, warnings are not errors
20:18<Beerbelott>Aren't you using the flag tranforming warnings into errors?
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20:18<+glx>we could, but we don't
20:18<+glx>OSX build is full of unfixable warnings for instance
20:19<+glx>well "unfixable"
20:19<Beerbelott>Ah yeah, didn't think of cross-platform problems such this one
20:19<Beerbelott>:D
20:19<Beerbelott>Well... I fixed a repushed the PR anyway
20:20<Beerbelott>and*
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20:58<DorpsGek_II>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 opened pull request #7681: Fix: clang and MSVC warnings https://git.io/fjHML
21:03<Eddi|zuHause>i might have a memleak on my hands...
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---Logclosed Mon Aug 05 00:00:39 2019