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#openttd IRC Logs for 2019-09-28

---Logopened Sat Sep 28 00:00:33 2019
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01:51<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7639: Fix: Total reset of DMusic driver once every hour
01:51<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed pull request #7639: Fix: Total reset of DMusic driver once every hour
01:59<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
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04:31<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
04:32<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii updated pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
04:35<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
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04:49<andythenorth>but where is cat?
05:08<TrueBrain>in /usr/bin
05:15<Heiki>or even in /bin
05:19<TrueBrain>as long as it is not in /usr/sbin
05:22<TrueBrain>so .. what was I going to do today ... yeah, come to terms with the fact that managed infrastructure is expensive :P
05:23<TrueBrain>a managed database server is 15 dollar a month
05:23<TrueBrain>are "we" willing to pay for that .. hmm
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05:30<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii updated pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
05:31<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
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05:55<andythenorth>TrueBrain: I always enjoy spending money :D
05:56<andythenorth>then there is someone to blame :P
05:58<TrueBrain>it is just such irony, that I try to keep everything as cheap as possible for OpenTTD .. while at work you are doing the right thing (tm)
05:58<Wolf01>Spending money, hmmm...
06:01<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed pull request #7540: Change: New layout for the Station view window
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06:03<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed pull request #7366: Add: List recently executed commands in crashlog output.
06:07<TrueBrain>stalebot no longer running? :D
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06:09<Wolf01><Wolf01> Spending money, hmmm... <- done
06:13<TrueBrain>seems the stalebot was de-registered or something .. not sure if that was by choice, or because GitHub changed things :D
06:16<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh requested changes for pull request #7486: Fix: AI/GS settings with the flag SCRIPTCONFIG_RANDOM could be altered after loading from a savegame.
06:36<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain opened pull request #7753: Change: [GitHub] switch from stalebot to actions/stale
06:36<TrueBrain>there, that should fix silly stalebot being out to play
06:36<TrueBrain>testing is a bit difficult ... at least it triggers correctly :D
06:37<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7753: Change: [GitHub] switch from stalebot to actions/stale
06:38<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh approved pull request #7749: Fix: Some typos found using codespell
06:39<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7749: Fix: Some typos found using codespell
06:40<TrueBrain>hmm .. no, my PR doesn't do what I want it to do :(
06:40<TrueBrain>a comment doesn't remove the stale label
06:41<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7753: Change: [GitHub] switch from stalebot to actions/stale
06:41<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain closed pull request #7753: Change: [GitHub] switch from stalebot to actions/stale
06:42<TrueBrain>right .. so then I need to know if it was disabled on purpose or not :D (I can imagine both ways)
06:46<TrueBrain>LordAro: you happen to know if stalebot got disabled on purpose? Can we just reactive it? :D
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07:11<LordAro>TrueBrain: on purpose
07:11<LordAro>it was closing things before anyone got to them
07:13<andythenorth>the important thing
07:13<andythenorth>is that the backlog of things to get to should keep growing :)
07:14<TrueBrain>LordAro: and so why not reconfigure to give more time?
07:15<TrueBrain>(honest question btw; trying to understand :D)
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07:42<andythenorth>TrueBrain wonder what the rate of closing PRs is, moving average
07:42<andythenorth>we have the data :P
07:43<andythenorth>stalebot should close at 90% of the average approval time :P
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08:21<LordAro>TrueBrain: can't remember, but also the fact that several of us didn't like things being closed arbitrarily anyway
08:21<LordAro>see if planetmaker or peter1138 can remember
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08:46*andythenorth makes trains
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09:14<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
09:21<+glx>looking at #7752, it seems commit checker doesn't work correctly
09:22<+glx>it's supposed to validate each commit, but it doesn't fail
09:25<LordAro>it usually manages it..
09:26<LordAro>are you surr it's not github ui screwing up?
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09:26<+glx>every where I checked I can see 6 commits
09:32<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
09:38<TrueBrain>LordAro: yeah, we have been up and down that road ;) Keeping them open is not any better :P But tnx, I noticed that probot got a few changes, so good to know it was not a system error :D
09:39<TrueBrain>right, back to the dilemma of: how to run a new database for OpenTTD ..
09:46<frosch123>still master server?
09:46<TrueBrain>currently, yes. But also mediawiki has to be moved sooner rather then later
09:47<TrueBrain>for MS, I can use a simple MongoDB setup
09:47<frosch123>i never understood why masterserver db is so persistent
09:47<andythenorth>what does it do?
09:47<andythenorth>it's a mystery to me :)
09:47<andythenorth>is it the thing that lists servers?
09:47<TrueBrain>back in those days there was a wish to do more data sciency stuff with that data
09:48<TrueBrain>but I guess that is not really relevant anymore
09:48<TrueBrain>andythenorth: yes
09:48<TrueBrain>frosch123: but it needs some form of persistancy, for a website to list the servers
09:48<andythenorth>ramcache :P
09:48<andythenorth>n processes
09:48<andythenorth>rolling restarts :P
09:48<TrueBrain>yeah, well, we had people who totally freaked out if their server got another ID
09:49<TrueBrain>because they wrote HTML parsing scripts to publish a banner on their site telling how the server was doing
09:49<andythenorth>are they here making PRs? :)
09:49<TrueBrain>(instead of polling their own server directly :P)
09:49<andythenorth>ignore me, I have a scorched earth policy :P
09:49<frosch123> <- surely someone wants to join that server
09:49<TrueBrain>there used to be a script that removed all servers not online for 90+ days
09:49<TrueBrain>it often failed
09:50<TrueBrain>so we no longer have a script that removes old servers :P
09:50<andythenorth>databases are so boring
09:50<TrueBrain>space-wise, it really really doesn't matter
09:50<andythenorth>blah blah
09:50<andythenorth>I have this troll idea of trying to use git as a database
09:50<TrueBrain>so that a server from 2015 is listed .. I really don't care, honestly :P
09:50<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
09:50<frosch123>andythenorth: doesn't moinwiki do that?
09:50<andythenorth>dunno :)
09:51<TrueBrain>still I wonder how I am going to do database stuff for OpenTTD ..
09:51<andythenorth>if complex queries aren't needed, and infrequent writes
09:51<andythenorth>git ftw
09:51*andythenorth back to pixels
09:51<TrueBrain>easiest is to get the managed database from DigitalOcean
09:51<andythenorth>grownups can do grownup things
09:51<TrueBrain>or we want to get ride of mediawiki :P
09:51<andythenorth>TrueBrain serverless no? o_O
09:51<andythenorth>what's that hosted wiki?
09:52<andythenorth>yeah wikia fandom thing
09:52<andythenorth>we even have a page
09:52<TrueBrain>hmm .. for some reason I did not consider hosted wikis .. funny
09:52<andythenorth>delete the wiki, move it to fandom
09:52<TrueBrain>so used to doing everything ourself
09:52<TrueBrain>pretty sure that is a terrible move :P
09:53<andythenorth>let the community do it?
09:54<TrueBrain>yeah, so in 5 years it might have done 2%?
09:54<TrueBrain>I mean .. be realistic :P
09:55<andythenorth>we have to have a wiki?
09:55*andythenorth assumes yes
09:55<TrueBrain>I assumed the same; but, assumption
09:55<TrueBrain>and we need to do something with it ..
09:55<TrueBrain>leaving it as it is, is not an option
09:55<milek7>does server list really needs any DB?
09:55<+glx>can't we move wiki to github ?
09:56<TrueBrain>glx: you could; but who is going to? :)
09:56<milek7>couldn't be just in memory structure in master server daemon?
09:57<andythenorth>delete wiki, see who complains?
09:57<andythenorth>it is useful as docs though
09:57<TrueBrain>we have a lot of hits on our wiki daily
09:57<TrueBrain>like ... a lot
09:57<milek7>and ID could be hash of IP and name or something
09:58<TrueBrain>hmm .. looking more closely at the stats, there is 1 bot that is doing 10% of the hits
09:58<TrueBrain>I should fix that ...
09:59<TrueBrain>at least 40% of the traffic is bots
09:59<TrueBrain>anyway, 0.5 million visits a month hit the wiki
09:59<+glx>andythenorth still wanting to delete everything :)
10:00<TrueBrain>(unique visitors with a window of 1 day)
10:00<andythenorth>there's something appealing about burning everything
10:02<+glx> <-- seems there is some existing automation
10:03<TrueBrain>bitnami seems to be the only one who offers mediawiki in k8s, which requires MariaDB
10:03<TrueBrain>moving FlySpray to GitHub was a no-brainer .. but wikis are more difficult :P
10:05<+glx>hmm the script will lose wiki history
10:05<TrueBrain>but also converts it to a format that might not work :D
10:05<frosch123>it will probably also lose templates and expression magic
10:06<TrueBrain>given the size of our wiki, there will be an issue anyway, to convert it to what-ever :P
10:06<milek7>lots of messages. but false positives mostly
10:07<TrueBrain>all I know we need to do something about the wiki, infrastructure wise; and sooner is better
10:09<+glx>IIRC updating wiki software is usually a pain too
10:10<TrueBrain>owh yes
10:10<+glx>(and ours is outdated)
10:10<TrueBrain>just ... a tiny bit
10:10<TrueBrain>many promises over the years of people updating it ;) It is ... not trivial
10:11<andythenorth>wiki -> jekyll :P
10:11<andythenorth>we could appoint an editor to approve commits
10:11<andythenorth>like we approve translators right? :)
10:11<TrueBrain>the amount of changes to the wiki is ... very low
10:12<TrueBrain>also, lot of pages are out-dated or not useful :P
10:12<TrueBrain>I can make a static copy of the wiki and put that in a git :D
10:12<TrueBrain>(horrible idea :P)
10:12<andythenorth>sometimes I think about making actual official docs
10:12<andythenorth>then I remember not to smoke crack
10:13<+glx>we have readmes ;)
10:13<+glx>nobody reads them though
10:13<TrueBrain>the more I think about it, the more GitHub wiki sounds lovely :P
10:13<TrueBrain>just not sure what the limitations are :D
10:15<TrueBrain>either way, I take any suggestions what to do with the wiki .. but time is running short, as we have been delaying this for over 2 years now :P
10:16<andythenorth>do we fail out pentest if we don't upgrade?
10:17<andythenorth>out / our /s
10:17<TrueBrain>on the topic of things that start to misbehave in ways I have increasingly more difficulty keeping it alive: frosch123, how is BaNaNaS 2 going? :D (any answer goes, not trying to pressure or anything)
10:17<+glx>GitHub Pages sites are subject to the following usage limits:
10:17<+glx> GitHub Pages source repositories have a recommended limit of 1GB .
10:17<+glx> Published GitHub Pages sites may be no larger than 1 GB.
10:17<+glx> GitHub Pages sites have a soft bandwidth limit of 100GB per month.
10:17<+glx> GitHub Pages sites have a soft limit of 10 builds per hour.
10:17<TrueBrain>Pages != Wiki, btw :)
10:17<TrueBrain>but Pages is also a good solution (the website basically is a GitHub Pages)
10:17<TrueBrain>(website ==
10:19<frosch123>i think i have retired from ottd
10:19<TrueBrain>awh :(
10:19<frosch123>so unlikely to continue on anything
10:19<TrueBrain>you think? Who do we need to bribe to change that? :P
10:19<TrueBrain>fair enough frosch123, tnx for the answer :)
10:22<andythenorth>frosch123 :( have you got addicted to Blitz?
10:22<TrueBrain>glx: mind giving that mediawiki to markdown a look? Just for shit and giggles? :P
10:23<+glx>I can fire a VM to test
10:23<+glx>as using windows doesn't seem a good idea for that :)
10:27<+glx>of course the VM needs to check the disks
10:28<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] J0anJosep commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
10:29<TrueBrain>okay; so the master server is kinda done; it just needs some persistent storage and a web component .. but that is easy :P CloudFlare seems to be working fine too on staging to replace the CDN of DO (which often gives timeouts and 404s on files that exist) .. so that is good too. That leaves the wiki and BaNaNaS. The latter I have some ideas to at
10:29<TrueBrain>least bring it in a modern world (without changing functionality in any form) .. if that is done, the main part left is our developers email .. and I am sure we can work that out :P
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10:30<spnda>In NML, does anyone know the variable name for a switch to get a different sprite depending on cargo amount in the vehicle?
10:30<TrueBrain>now all I need is some time, or people actually helping out :D
10:32<+glx>ok very useful comment on the PR :)
10:32<TrueBrain>haha, someone hit send without intending to :P
10:33<andythenorth>spnda: you got the NML docs?
10:37<spnda>Thanks, so I guess cargo_count then
10:37<andythenorth>I can paste example code if you need it, but it's pretty easy
10:37<spnda>Nope, I think I got this
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10:54<spnda>So uh, how do I use 32bpp sprites?
10:54<+glx>32bpp blitter is enough IIRC
10:54<frosch123>meh, the cppcon videos seem to be very low quality this year... on this one the talk and the slides are like 30s desynced
10:55<spnda>I saw its something with alternative_sprite. No idea what 32bpp blitter is either
10:55<+glx>blitter is on OTTD side :)
10:55<frosch123>spnda: define the regular spritesets for the 8bpp sprites, then add 32bpp sprites via alternative_sprites
10:56<frosch123>altenative_sprites referenes the spriteset, and has to use the same order of sprites
10:56<spnda>Not exactly sure what you mean. Do you have any example code?
10:57<frosch123>but you can also look at opengfx (which has 2x gui sprites) or yeti/nuts (32bpp sprites)
10:58<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries
10:58<spnda>Do I NEED to add 8bpp sprites aswell?
10:58<frosch123>8bpp 1x zoom sprites are mandatory
10:58<frosch123>V has a script to autognerate them from 32bpp, which doesn't look too bad
10:58<spnda>hmm ok
10:59<spnda>I think he posted it on Discord once
10:59<frosch123>rgbaeater or something
10:59<frosch123>yeah, probably that one
10:59<spnda>ok, thanks
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11:24<spnda>Do I need some switch or new property for adding the 32bpp sprites? nmlc is giving some weird errors about undefined identifiers, which are clearly defined.
11:25<+glx>alternative_sprites should be enough
11:25<andythenorth>supermop_Home_: you here? o_O
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12:28<andythenorth>frexit :(
12:29*andythenorth will stop now :P
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12:33<LordAro>glx: i've never been very impressed with github wikis
12:33<LordAro>they're not very user friendly
12:42<+glx>and the script fails for
12:44<+glx>{|style="width="100%"; border=1" <-- of course it fails
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12:44<+glx>quotes in quotes
12:52<+glx>hmm it doesn't like {{Wikitable}} either
12:55<+glx>ok so converting from wikimedia to gfm is a pain :)
12:56<+glx>and I only tried on the first 1035 pages
13:00<+glx>getting the page list is very annoying
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13:12<andythenorth>now up to 132 different types of intermodal container
13:12<andythenorth>quite addictive drawing them
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13:38<+glx>so many pages with weird code
13:38<TrueBrain>for a while there was some quality control, but I am pretty sure that got lost somewhere :D
13:39<TrueBrain>there are a ton of good pages
13:39<TrueBrain>but even more not-so-good :P
13:40<+glx> <-- broken table with plain html inside
13:40<+glx>converted doesn't like it
13:41<+glx>I already fixed too much in the xml, I give up
13:41<andythenorth>can it spit out a list of malformed pages?
13:42<+glx>no it justs stop on the first error
13:42<+glx>anyway I was only testing on a subset
13:42<+glx>too much human work required to use it
13:43<milek7>could pandoc deal with it?
13:43<+glx>that's using pandoc :)
13:45<+glx>but the most annoying part is to get the xml
13:50<+glx>Error at "source" (line 40, column 1): <-- so easy when the actual line in the xml is 31866
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14:49<Samu>hum... nielsm I can't work on fixes on this computer.
14:54<Samu>I'm still in a temporary situation/solution, I don't even have access to my home
14:54<Samu>I can't do much to remedy any PR until my life stabilizes
14:55<Samu>if it stabilizes. The death of my father turned the situation more complicated for me
14:57<Samu>I was able to make some work on my AI only thx to programs that don't require admin rights
14:58<Samu>but openttd PRs is something I can't do anything about now
15:01<nielsm>family and health obviously come before leisure projects
15:01<nielsm>you asked about that bug earlier so I took another look at it
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15:03<Samu>what I'm saying, basically, I can't fix my own PR's, somebody has to take over
15:05<Samu>I can leave comments, but that's as much as I can do here
15:10<@peter1138>Shit, sorry to hear that :(
15:13<Samu>lung cancer
15:16<Samu>had to give away my cats, too :(
15:16<Samu>oh well
15:20<Samu>can't be living with my brother, my N cousins, my aunts, I'm on a residence kind of place, temporarily
15:20<Samu>with 20's other ppl with problems
15:21<Samu>they say, I don't quite fit here for the type of problems I have
15:23<Samu>awaiting for an answer to my situation, which can take weeks, or months
15:24<Samu>another lair, where I'll be making my life.
15:24<Samu>sharing a room
15:25<Samu>that's when and where I was promissed I'd get my computer
15:26<Samu>personally, I doubt that I'll ever get my hands on my computer ever again
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15:55<andythenorth>is it possible that this be fixed for 1.10.0?
15:59<Samu> - the comment documentation missing:* @param all Whether to add random deviation to 'start_date' AI setting
15:59<Samu>true - adds random deviation to 'start_date'
16:00<Samu>false - doesn't add random deviation to 'start_date' (was added some other time)
16:00<Samu>it's a problem with random AIs
16:02<Samu>the original bug: random deviation doesn't occur for random ais, then I added a fix, which in turn made it add random deviation twice to random ais, then that bool all was the workaround, making it behave as being added deviation only once
16:02<Samu>referring only about the start_date parameter
16:03<Samu>deviations to other parameters were fine already
16:03<+glx>would be easier to just remove start_date
16:04<Samu>manually selected AIs don't have any issues
16:04<Samu>with the start_date
16:05<Samu>there a PR about reworking start_date too
16:17<Samu>was unable to test it properly
16:19<Samu>somebody plz test multiplayer
16:20<Samu>if it desyncs
16:20<Samu>i can't test here
16:20<Samu>requires firewall permissions, and I have no admin rights
16:21<LordAro>pretty sure it doesn't "require" any firewall changes
16:21<LordAro>especially because it's all local
16:21<LordAro>it might ask for them, but local stuff should work fine
16:21<Samu>nop, doesn't work, it isn't listed
16:22<+glx>no need to be listed
16:22<+glx>just join
16:23<LordAro>listing will require talking externally, yes
16:23<LordAro>but this is just a LAN game
16:24<Samu>ok let me try
16:26<Samu>wow, i didn't know of that
16:26<Samu>it seems to work, no desync
16:32<Samu>base = GameSettings was perhaps an exageration
16:32<Samu>but not too sure
16:33<Samu>could be just a gui setting
16:33<Samu>client setting
16:35<Samu>ah no, it needs to be saved
16:35<Samu>must be GameSettings then
16:35<Samu>it's just that it doesn't require to be sync'ed
16:40<Samu>how big is uint16
16:42<@peter1138>I'd say it is (at least) 16 bits.
16:42<Samu>max value is 3600, it could be less than 65535
16:43<Samu>oh well...
16:43<LordAro>peter1138: i would expect a type named uint16 to be exactly 16 bits
16:43<+glx>uint16 is the minimal size for anything between 256 and 65535
16:44<LordAro>it's not uint_least16_t
16:44<LordAro>(which, coincidentally, is the same as unsigned int)
16:46<Samu>type = SLE_UINT16
16:47<Samu>there is no SLE_UINT12 right?
16:47<+glx>of course not
16:47<Samu>i think SLE_UINT16 is fine then
16:47<LordAro>why would there be?
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16:54<nielsm>peter1138: the uintXX_t types are specified to always be exactly that bit width, but the compiler is not required to offer them if the platform doesn't have a native type of the size
16:55<@peter1138>Sorry I didn't see that Samu had asked "how big is uint16_t"
16:55<LordAro>of course, technically...
16:55<LordAro>oh, there's static asserts just below
16:56<nielsm>well what if you compile on a platform where char is 32 bits
16:56<nielsm>and short is also 32 bits
16:56<nielsm>and int is also 32 bits
16:56<LordAro>i'd punch the compiler writers for being so stupid
16:58<nielsm>it'd be a platform not really suited for ottd anyway :P
16:58<nielsm>a DSP chip or something weird
17:00<@peter1138>Or a 36-bit architecture from the 70s.
17:01<nielsm>but maybe those typedefs should be replaced with stdint.h types
17:01<nielsm>since all supported compilers should have that now
17:02<nielsm>msvc didn't have it until 2013 or something
17:03<+glx>hmm after cmake it would be nice to reorder files in the src
17:04<nielsm>you mean directory structure?
17:04<nielsm>yeah some of it isn't very good
17:04<+glx>MSVC project was nice for that
17:04<nielsm>there's too many random things under the generic "source code" category in current vs projects
17:05<nielsm>I'd love to have things structured by "feature" instead of by "tech"
17:05<+glx>but categories are all virtual, most of stuff was still in src
17:07<+glx>generic "source code" will be worse with cmake
17:23<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7630: Fix warnings from GCC9
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18:08<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/CompileFarm] glx22 commented on issue #18: Linux error messages contain lots of docker "errors"
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---Logclosed Sun Sep 29 00:00:35 2019