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#openttd IRC Logs for 2020-11-22

---Logopened Sun Nov 22 00:00:38 2020
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02:50<andythenorth>yo
02:54<longtomjr>hi
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03:43<andythenorth>wonder if I can read random bits from a neighbouring vehicle
03:46<andythenorth>maybe 0x7A
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05:06<TrueBrain>milek7 / LordAro : you don't make a backup of S3 data because you are afraid S3 loses your data (they have 11 9s? in integrity?); you do it because someone might (accidentally) remove the S3 bucket :)
05:08<TrueBrain>meh; search engines still haven't updated the wiki .. that is annoying
05:10<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/bananas-server] TrueBrain commented on pull request #37: Add: support more than one CDN url https://git.io/Jkrc8
05:11<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/bananas-server] TrueBrain commented on pull request #37: Add: support more than one CDN url https://git.io/JkrcE
05:12<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/bananas-server] TrueBrain commented on pull request #37: Add: support more than one CDN url https://git.io/Jkrci
05:19<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/bananas-server] LordAro commented on pull request #37: Add: support more than one CDN url https://git.io/JkrCs
05:19<TrueBrain>you didn't know %r? I am shocked :P
05:19<TrueBrain>:D <3
05:19<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/bananas-server] TrueBrain merged pull request #37: Add: support more than one CDN url https://git.io/Jk3oL
05:20<TrueBrain>%r can print ANY Python object, where %s needs a str function defined :)
05:21<TrueBrain>I fucking hate the Google Admin bla ... I cannot access the search-index state, as I need to do "something" in the admin panel, just that "something" is completely unclear
05:23<andythenorth>TrueBrain is this google search console?
05:23<TrueBrain>yeah .... finally found it, after having to click through several links in the help ...
05:25<TrueBrain>now how to tell it to crawl ....
05:27<TrueBrain>"Indexing requests are currently suspended"
05:27<TrueBrain>well, that was not useful
05:28<TrueBrain>October 14, ongoing - The "Request Indexing" feature of the URL Inspection Tool has been disabled in order to make some technical updates. We expect it to be re-enabled in the coming weeks. In the meanwhile, Google continues to find and index content through our regular methods, as covered here.
05:28<andythenorth>yeah indexing requests are currently suspended
05:28<TrueBrain>riiggghhhhttttt
05:28<andythenorth>since oct
05:28<TrueBrain>"temporary" ... lol
05:28<andythenorth>they are crawling
05:28<andythenorth>I have some pages indexed within 1 hour of publishing
05:28<andythenorth>others have been waiting days
05:29<TrueBrain>the new ones are indexed on google, it seems
05:29<andythenorth>you could try submitting a site map, but eh
05:29<TrueBrain>but the old ones are there too still :P
05:29<andythenorth>yeah, removal requests seem to be stuck
05:29<andythenorth>you can do temporary removals, but getting it to find a permanent 404 and delete...
05:29<TrueBrain>ironic, I pressed the "test live URL" on one URL
05:29<andythenorth>I am having issues
05:29<TrueBrain>it tells me: yup, this is not working
05:29<TrueBrain>but ... I AM KEEPING IT IN MY INDEX NEVERTHELESS MWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
05:30<TrueBrain>owh, mediawiki has a lot of pages marked as "noindex", funny .. did not know :)
05:31<andythenorth>you could try 410 old paths
05:31<andythenorth>I don't know how well that works
05:31<andythenorth>I assume it keeps 404 indexed for a period, in case it's temporary error
05:32<TrueBrain>it has 1000+ of the new URLs crawled, but not indexed
05:32<TrueBrain>and over a 1000 (out of the 8k) are already marked as 404, but still indexed :)
05:33<TrueBrain>the 16th it already picked them up
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05:35<TrueBrain>"Crawled - currently not indexed: The page was crawled by Google, but not indexed. It may or may not be indexed in the future; no need to resubmit this URL for crawling."
05:35<TrueBrain>well, that is helpful ..
05:37<TrueBrain>andythenorth: "Currently Google treats 410s (Gone) the same as 404s (Not found)"
05:37<andythenorth>hmm that makes sense
05:37<andythenorth>is there a site map?
05:37<andythenorth>presumably we could generate one if not?
05:38<TrueBrain>yeah, we could
05:38<nielsm>wouldn't it be best to make as many as possible of the old links be "moved permanently" status pointing to the new url?
05:39<nielsm>although that would probably mean having a straight up database mapping them
05:39<TrueBrain>nielsm: that has been talked over several times already, and it the discussion keeps turning up: no, that is not useful :)
05:39<TrueBrain>but I think we all expected search engines to be quicker with this, honestly
05:40<nielsm>do links from forum posts and such still work?
05:40<TrueBrain>nielsm: the main issue is that many pages got moved or even removed
05:40<TrueBrain>lot of the more popular search results for example pointed to pages that had wrong information
05:40<TrueBrain>like .. flat-out wrong :P
05:41<TrueBrain>one bug I do want to fix today, is that on some URLs it returns a very ugly 404, instead of a more prettier 404, from which you can visit the wiki again
05:41<TrueBrain>and I will see if I can dynamically generate a sitemap, if that helps search engines :)
05:42<TrueBrain>nielsm: unlikely; but frosch123 has the details on these questions :)
05:45<andythenorth>hello nielsm also :)
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05:47<TrueBrain>lol ... should we add "hreflang" header for translated pages?
05:47<TrueBrain>or would that be messy :P
05:48<TrueBrain>wow .. doing that in the sitemap will make the sitemap huge, but we will see if it stays < 50MB :)
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05:54<andythenorth>I use this for site audit, it's actually legit not SEO snake oil https://ahrefs.com/website-checker
05:54<andythenorth>probably overkill here, but eh
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06:13<Wolf01>Hi TrueBrain, did you read about 404 errors on search engines results, like https://wiki.openttd.org/Company_Colours ?
06:21<frosch123>Wolf01: every single wiki url without an language in the url will give you a 404
06:21<frosch123>no need to post a 404 url. i know 10k of them
06:22<Wolf01>So they don't default to english and won't get migrated?
06:22<andythenorth>oof I should write an S3 uploader
06:22<andythenorth>for grf docs
06:22<andythenorth>manual upload is error prone :P
06:23<frosch123>Wolf01: there are 3 options. redirect nothing, redirect top 100, redirect all 10k
06:23<frosch123>"redirect top 100" failed because there is no "top 100"
06:26<Wolf01>I suspect redirect all is not nice either too
06:26<andythenorth>hmm is 100MB of Iron Horse a wise idea?
06:27<frosch123>most users go to the wiki via search engines, so most issues would be solved if search engines would report the new urls
06:28<frosch123>maybe after the search engines are solved, there may be a handful of static links on other sites that may be worth redirecting
06:29<frosch123>maybe the professional excel homework assistance can help us
06:31<Wolf01>The problem is that there seem not to be a new url, there is an archived one
06:33<frosch123>Wolf01: https://github.com/frosch123/gollum-test-data/blob/master/fullmap.json https://github.com/frosch123/gollum-test-data/blob/master/redirects.json
06:40<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/team] frosch123 commented on issue #92: [id_ID] Translator access request https://git.io/Jk21x
06:46<andythenorth>frosch123 any reason not to get random bits from a neighbouring vehicle?
06:46<andythenorth>var 7A appears to offer it
06:47<frosch123>don't use 7A. use 5F
06:47<andythenorth>oh I missed that
06:48<andythenorth>is that documented?
06:48<frosch123>https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/VariationalAction2#Variable
06:48<andythenorth>thanks
06:49<andythenorth>now I have to remember how to mask and shift :)
06:49<frosch123>it's some 8 in the var[] syntax
06:51*andythenorth such copy paste from elsewhere
07:04<andythenorth>3 bytes of random data
07:04<andythenorth>what's the range of possible results?
07:05<frosch123>there is only one byte for vehicles
07:05<frosch123>noone bothered to add more
07:07<andythenorth>so 256 possible results?
07:07<frosch123>yes
07:07<andythenorth>I have a stupid expansion of all the possible results in a switch
07:07<andythenorth>for reasons
07:16<frosch123>TrueBrain: https://github.com/frosch123/wiki-data/issues/new/choose <- do those look reasonable?
07:19<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/wiki-data] frosch123 opened pull request #4: Add: issue templates https://git.io/JkrV9
07:26<andythenorth>anyone remember if temp storage is localised within a varact2 procedure?
07:26<frosch123>no, it's for the whole callback
07:27<frosch123>otherwise you could not pass any parameters to procedures :)
07:27<andythenorth>I thought it would be
07:27<andythenorth>it's puzzling why it works in that case :P
07:27<andythenorth>maybe it's luck :P
07:30<andythenorth>yeah I'm writing over storages that are expired at that point
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07:45<TrueBrain>Wolf01: tnx for telling, and yeah, we know :) I am a bit disappointed how long it takes search engines to update honestly .. now creating a sitemap to speed up that process .. hopefully that will help :)
07:45<Wolf01>:)
07:46<TrueBrain>frosch123: I would guess that "main folder" is rather unclear to many
07:47<TrueBrain>and that table would require us to maintain it, but I am fine with that
07:47<TrueBrain>looks good otherwise
07:48<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/wiki-data] TrueBrain requested changes for pull request #4: Add: issue templates https://git.io/Jkr6L
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07:55<Wolf01>TB: it wouldn't be a problem if it just was to add /en/ or change the _ with %20 (this one was tricky too), the problem is that page had a totally different path and I needed to search for it looking on other pages to find a link and the it didn't even contain the info I needed :P
07:56<Wolf01>*and then*
07:56<TrueBrain>yeah ... as soon as search engines are updated, that is not a problem anymore
07:56<TrueBrain>till then ... it is a bit annoying
07:56*andythenorth wonders if var 0x61 is documented
07:56<andythenorth>yeah must be
07:57<TrueBrain>hmm .. sitemaps needs absolute URLs .. that is annoying too
07:58<andythenorth>var[0x61, 0, 0x0000FFFF, 0xC6] <-I assume that's 0x61, offset, mask, var num
07:59<TrueBrain>what is going on with your x's?
07:59<andythenorth>is there font oddness?
07:59<TrueBrain>some are UTF-8, others are ASCII :P
07:59<andythenorth>dunno
07:59<andythenorth>some are pasted some are not
07:59<TrueBrain>can be my client btw, but it looks weird as fuck :P
07:59<andythenorth>I guess the client is pseudo-clever
08:00<andythenorth>oof this bitmaths stuff :)
08:00<frosch123>TrueBrain: it's your client
08:02<andythenorth>what is the second param on var 61 doing
08:02*andythenorth clueless :D
08:03<frosch123>for var 5F replace the 0 with an 8
08:04<andythenorth>and the mask?
08:04<andythenorth>I guessed var[0x61, 8, 0x00FF0000, 0x5F]
08:04<frosch123>think of the first 3 params as a triple to identify a variable
08:04<frosch123>err, the last 3 params
08:04<frosch123>well, whatever
08:05<frosch123>0x61, 8, 0x00FFFFFF, 0x5F
08:05<andythenorth>no idea how I'm going to slice a single bit out of this using params passed to the procedure :D
08:05<andythenorth>maybe I hit the limit of possibility here :)
08:09<andythenorth>seems var[0x61, 8, 0x000000001, 0x5F] picks the last bit
08:09<TrueBrain>holy crap, the sitemap is a bit big :)
08:09<frosch123>what does it contain? just a list of all urls? or more?
08:10<andythenorth>maybe get_bits() will pick these out
08:10<TrueBrain>all URLs and if an URL has a translation what that translation is
08:11<TrueBrain>but tha tlast part is not working, it seems
08:11<TrueBrain>should categories and files also be searchable, I wonder ..
08:12<TrueBrain>it can contain useful information in the mediawiki thingy, of course
08:12<frosch123>no, only Page/
08:12<frosch123>no templates or categories
08:13<TrueBrain>being able to search for categories can be useful, not?
08:13<andythenorth>hmm this does seem to get a useful result
08:13<andythenorth>getbits(var[0x61, 8, 0x00FFFFFF, 0x5F], LOAD_TEMP(${temp_storage_ids.random_bits_offset}), LOAD_TEMP(${temp_storage_ids.random_bits_count}))
08:13<andythenorth>but it's not the same as using getbits(random_bits, LOAD_TEMP(${temp_storage_ids.random_bits_offset}), LOAD_TEMP(${temp_storage_ids.random_bits_count}))
08:13<frosch123>TrueBrain: hmm, okay, then everything :)
08:13<andythenorth>results vary
08:17<TrueBrain>frosch123: the Folder/ I am going to skip; that doesn't seem to add value
08:17<frosch123>true, did not think of those
08:18<TrueBrain>mostly checking if my sanity is intact :)
08:18<andythenorth>maybe the mask is picking out different bits?
08:18<frosch123>haha, you still have hope?
08:19<andythenorth>{'var': 0x5F, 'start': 8, 'size': 8},
08:19<andythenorth>nml definition of random_bits
08:22<TrueBrain>Content-Length: 6126122
08:22<TrueBrain>6 MiB of sitemap data :P
08:22<TrueBrain>lol
08:22<TrueBrain>well, it is below 50MB, so it is fine
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08:47<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/wiki-data] frosch123 updated pull request #4: Add: issue templates https://git.io/JkrV9
08:48<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/wiki-data] frosch123 commented on pull request #4: Add: issue templates https://git.io/JkrHJ
08:50<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/wiki-data] TrueBrain approved pull request #4: Add: issue templates https://git.io/JkrHR
08:50<TrueBrain>https://github.com/TrueBrain/TrueWiki/pull/93 <- I think this is going to work ...
08:50<TrueBrain>let's find out! :D
08:52<TrueBrain>can I check if the XML is a valid sitemap before merging, I wonder .. hmm
08:55<TrueBrain>XML Validation Results - No issues detected
08:55<TrueBrain>w00p
08:57<TrueBrain>LordAro: are the two VPSes ready for use, or did you want to fix the 2 remaining things before that time?
09:04<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/wiki-data] frosch123 merged pull request #4: Add: issue templates https://git.io/JkrV9
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09:14<TrueBrain>right .. tried 10 sitemap validation tools, 10 different results .. this is funny :P Owh well, to production with this, we will see if Google understands it
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09:17<frosch123>the new error message is a bit lolz, but what can you do :)
09:17<frosch123>many google links to the wiki have _ in the page title. so the new 404 is: "_ is invalid in page names" :)
09:18<frosch123>people can click on the main page now though
09:19<TrueBrain>that is exactly why I did this ;)
09:19<TrueBrain>the plain 404 error was completely unintentional
09:23<TrueBrain>10994 pages in the sitemap
09:23<TrueBrain>now added to Google Search Console
09:23<TrueBrain>hopefully that helps a bit with speeding up the search engine resulsts
09:25<TrueBrain>owh, all the "Main Page" entries are wrong in the site map :D oops
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09:39<TrueBrain>andythenorth: should URLs in a sitemap be url encoded, or just html escaped?
09:39<TrueBrain>information about this is rather conflicting :P
09:40<TrueBrain>most examples only use simple characters .. like ... yeah ...
09:41<TrueBrain>I think it should be done .. but funny enough, the Google Search Console now tells me some URLs are not in the sitemap, which are all because in the sitemap is the escaped variant, so it seems
09:41<TrueBrain>what-ever, we will see what google indexes :)
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09:56<andythenorth>TrueBrain sorry no idea :)
09:57<andythenorth>I never make any
09:57<TrueBrain>it is okay .. it is a mess :P
09:57<andythenorth>google always wants me to add one
09:57<andythenorth>but it has 100% index coverage of my sites, so eh
09:58*andythenorth wonders why random bits vary
09:58<andythenorth>do I have to read more nml internals? :P
10:00<andythenorth>https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/blob/master/nml/expression/functioncall.py#L273
10:01<TrueBrain>okay, because of the navigation header on the wiki, google shows a nice breadcrumb too with the results .. that is pretty sweet, honestly
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10:02<TrueBrain>or it uses the URL for that .. what-ever :P
10:02<TrueBrain>no, seems to be the navigation
10:02<TrueBrain>it is skipping the language indicator
10:02<andythenorth>can we include rich results? :P
10:03<andythenorth>hmm maybe I imagined the different random result
10:03<TrueBrain>"OpenTTD | Installation FAQ - OpenTTD Wiki" <- not sure why Google adds "OpenTTD Wiki" to it, honestly
10:03<andythenorth>I can't repro a difference now
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10:04<andythenorth>me neither TrueBrain, I don't see that in source?
10:04<TrueBrain>also weird .. sometimes it does this as title: "Developers - OpenTTD"
10:05<TrueBrain>on new URLs
10:05<TrueBrain>but .. that is not the title of the page :P
10:05<andythenorth>title of root is "OpenTTD | OpenTTD's Wiki"
10:05<andythenorth>maybe Google is parsing that
10:05<andythenorth>it usually respects page titles as set
10:05<andythenorth>meta descriptions get rewritten algorithmically
10:06<andythenorth>but title is normally what the author sets, for accessibility amongst other reasons
10:06<TrueBrain>it is the title of the old wiki
10:06<andythenorth>https://www.lockedownseo.com/google-can-rewrite-titles-descriptions/#:~:text=Adding%20the%20Brand%20Name,results%20with%20your%20home%20page.
10:06<andythenorth>yeah ok, so they do rewrite
10:06<andythenorth>clearly google doesn't rewrite *my* titles because I am awesome :D
10:07<TrueBrain>it seems that google noticed it was mostly the content of an older page
10:07<TrueBrain>changed the URL
10:07<TrueBrain>but not yet the metadata of it
10:07<TrueBrain>or something :)
10:08<TrueBrain>google for "site:wiki.openttd.org/en" and be surprised about the randomness
10:08<TrueBrain>I FOUND YOUR RANDOMNESS andythenorth !
10:08<andythenorth>lol
10:12<TrueBrain>lol, I can see how many other websites link to the wiki
10:12<TrueBrain>that is funny
10:12<TrueBrain>#3 is Todo_list :P
10:12<TrueBrain>#4 is User:Zuu :D
10:13<TrueBrain>(from tt-forums, btw)
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10:13<andythenorth>frosch123 random now works reliably in articulated vehicles, (afaict, it's random) :) Thanks!
10:15<frosch123>TrueBrain: so we finnally have our top 100?
10:16<TrueBrain>well, I gave you a top 100 already, but this is another top 100, yes
10:16<TrueBrain>2cc-trains, newgrf, cheat, todo_list, main_page .. that is it, basically :P
10:16<frosch123>should we add redirects for these?
10:17<frosch123>andythenorth: i am so glad we added "zero all registers before each callback" some years ago :)
10:18<TrueBrain>top 30 externally linked: https://gist.github.com/TrueBrain/c5b8de22a6ece764cb9cb91614b2b52e
10:18<TrueBrain>NewGRF_development_tools is 90% from tt-wiki :P
10:19<frosch123>what are the numbers?
10:19<TrueBrain>there is a header ;)
10:19<frosch123>yes, but it makes no sense to me :)
10:19<TrueBrain>Target, the target URL
10:19<TrueBrain>Page, how many pages refer to it
10:19<TrueBrain>Incoming, how many domains
10:20<TrueBrain>euh, my header is off, but you get the point
10:20<TrueBrain>target, links, sites
10:20<TrueBrain>is a better way of saying it :P
10:20<frosch123>ok, so because the old {{other_languages}} linked to the main page, it has 24k?
10:20<TrueBrain>Main_Page, 17k comes from openttd.org :P
10:20<TrueBrain>5k from tt-forums
10:20<TrueBrain>91 from reddit, and smaller numbers after
10:21<frosch123>so, how to add redirects? should truewiki gain a feature for that?
10:21<TrueBrain>I still wonder if it is worth it
10:22<TrueBrain>most of these numbers are generated by openttd.org itself, it seems
10:22<TrueBrain>Google found the wiki on an alternative URL, and indexed it .. lol .. I can fix taht ..
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10:22<andythenorth>maybe this should be an nml builtin? o_O https://github.com/andythenorth/iron-horse/blob/master/src/templates/procedures_alternative_var_random_bits.pynml
10:23<andythenorth>extensible nml, using procedures :P
10:23<TrueBrain>lol .. it even mentions URLs on openttd.org that haven't existed in years now
10:24<frosch123>andythenorth: do you need a cool name for your nml library?
10:24<andythenorth>nml.farm
10:24<TrueBrain>frosch123: https://gist.github.com/TrueBrain/d62697df625bbb39615ace719598d9a2 <- this is Community page
10:25<frosch123>do we have 15k pages on openttd.org?
10:25<frosch123>no, only 1200
10:26<TrueBrain>most of them are old URLs that really do not exist anymore
10:26<frosch123>no idea how to get to 16k links
10:26<TrueBrain>not sure when google considers a link REALLY death :P
10:27<TrueBrain>but it picked them up from the navigation bar on every news item etc
10:27<TrueBrain>those github.com hits, are all the forks of OpenTTD, basically
10:27<andythenorth>forks!
10:27<andythenorth>how rude!
10:28<frosch123>yes, but the jekyll website only 445 pages
10:28<TrueBrain>of that whole list ... only https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1162667&sid=4045e2a0b6be6c4ef4f91000ea2b4c7c#p1162667 was the first REAL hit
10:28<TrueBrain>frosch123: it has the previous website crawled too, including all translations (which were not really translations)
10:28<frosch123>lol, translations :)
10:28<TrueBrain>basically, you can just ignore that openttd.org number honestly
10:29<TrueBrain>a page like 2cc_Trainset is used a bit more
10:29<frosch123>it's probably linked from some forum's user signature
10:29<TrueBrain>4500 links from tt-forums, but tt-forums is indexed at least 3 times (3 different domains)
10:30<TrueBrain>owh, 6 different ways
10:30<TrueBrain>yes, a signature :)
10:30<frosch123>zuu has 4554 posts
10:30<TrueBrain>Purno, in a random case I opened
10:30<frosch123>so, 1579 links is kind of incomplete
10:30<TrueBrain>the reddit links are also funny
10:31<TrueBrain>https://gist.github.com/TrueBrain/c71f86d75d7f2718dfb7265805f449a1
10:31<TrueBrain>2 URLs, but 6 hits :P
10:31<TrueBrain>so the numbers sound HUGE, but in reality ....
10:32<TrueBrain>and a lot of stale links ...
10:32<TrueBrain>https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=903868#p903868 <-this signature explains "Todo list"
10:32<frosch123>planetmaker: fix your signature!
10:33<TrueBrain>https://www.linguee.com/english-dutch/translation/15+game+levels.html <- this is also responsible for a lot of these hits
10:33<frosch123>i think i moved that page into the archive though :p
10:33<TrueBrain>~20k sites .. not even counting the links
10:33<frosch123>what? 15 game levels?
10:33<TrueBrain>so I have a REALLY hard time finding legit cases
10:34<frosch123>ok, so still the same: wait for search engines to update. in 50 years check the log for 404s
10:35<TrueBrain>basically
10:35<TrueBrain>the logs from the server were a lot more useful :P
10:35<TrueBrain>not sure what Google thinks to add with these pages ...
10:36<TrueBrain>I guess now we wait for Google to process the sitemap or something
10:42<TrueBrain>Bing Webmaster services could not be reached :(
10:42<TrueBrain>seems I cannot do the same for Bing atm :P
10:42<frosch123>pff. i just took a look at bananas urls. the first one to wiki.openttd.org is a site that was already "deleted" on the old wiki
10:42<frosch123>lol, same for the second
10:43<frosch123>i guess same author
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10:44<andythenorth>bing is about 10% of my search traffic, and that's unusually high I'm told
10:44<frosch123>3rd the same, 4th links to an overview page instead of a content-specific page...
10:44<frosch123>why are our users so stupid?
10:44<andythenorth>so we could wait for Bing to recover
10:44<TrueBrain>bing allows you to use CNAMEs to validate a domain .... but it doesn't seem to invalidate its cache ...
10:44<andythenorth>frosch123 because people?
10:44<andythenorth>same as "why can't andythenorth bit-shift correctly?"
10:45<andythenorth>what colour should tarpaulins be on cargo wagons?
10:45<andythenorth>CC is ugly, it blends with the vehicle
10:45<frosch123>whether-dependant
10:45<TrueBrain>"We did not detect verify.bing.com in the CNAME records for the host."
10:45<andythenorth>yes!
10:45<TrueBrain>........ IT IS FUCKING TWATS
10:45<andythenorth>or like in Blitz, where there is different camo for temperate, snow, desert
10:45<andythenorth>Blitz is basically OpenTTD
10:48<andythenorth>hmm I could do tarpaulins in the poo brown-green colour
10:48<andythenorth>realism
10:50<frosch123>*weather, just in case
10:51<andythenorth>I figured :)
10:51<andythenorth>extensible nml vars for 'rain'
10:51<TrueBrain>Bing tells me the sitemap has 11 URLs :P
10:51<TrueBrain>not sure Bing, but that is a lie :D
10:51<frosch123>they probably estimate from the file size
10:52<frosch123>at ms, they need a few kib to store an url
10:52<TrueBrain>I am just going to close that window now
10:53<TrueBrain>guess Bing doesn't like the hreflang or what-was-it-called ..
10:54<frosch123>so 11 global.yaml link to something at openttd.org, i can fix 2, 6 were dead before or never existed, 3 we deleted independently from the wiki
10:55<frosch123>both rb and me linked to dev.openttd.org for one set each. the 3rd one links to noai.openttd.org, but replacing that with coop is just a different kind of dead link
10:56<andythenorth>what OpenTTD colour is the sheet on this wagon? :P https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/img/s/v-10/p336463390-4.jpg
10:56<andythenorth>oh it's CC_PALE_GREEN
10:56<andythenorth>ok
10:56<andythenorth>very close match
10:58<frosch123>mostly 24 to 31
10:58<frosch123>maybe 88 to 95
11:01<frosch123>oh, it's not even on coop
11:01<frosch123>maybe it never existed on noai.openttd.org, and the author just c&p some url, because they thought that was a requirement
11:03<TrueBrain>noai.openttd.org only ever served the documentation for NoAI
11:03<TrueBrain>(which it still does)
11:03<TrueBrain>URLs changed, but content-wise nothing changed
11:04<frosch123>we once hosted ais and ai libraries in hg on ottd
11:04<TrueBrain>on hg.openttd.org, yes
11:04<frosch123>http://noai.openttd.org/projects/show/lib-event <- so that was never a thing?
11:04<TrueBrain>not as far as I can remember ... but ... 13 years of development, I might be wrong
11:04<frosch123>https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=807077#p807077 <- there are tons of links of that form
11:05<TrueBrain>only developers ever had write-access on openttd.org
11:07<TrueBrain>it might have been in the very early days of NoAI, but .. shrug
11:07<TrueBrain>haven't exited for years at least
11:07<TrueBrain>last updated, 2009-08-05
11:08<TrueBrain>so yeah, they once did exist
11:09<TrueBrain>script that was providing that ran up to 2018 :P
11:09<TrueBrain>it basically made every AI / Library upload to BaNaNaS available via another URL
11:10<TrueBrain>pretty sure that was not compliant with the ToS
11:10<frosch123>https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=50260 <- look, who's the annoying one? :)
11:11<TrueBrain>so yeah, I stand corrected, there was something on noai.openttd.org
11:11<TrueBrain>but that "projects" folder is nowhere to be found
11:12<TrueBrain>but I see you found the date it was deprecated :P
11:12<+glx><andythenorth> maybe this should be an nml builtin? o_O https://github.com/andythenorth/iron-horse/blob/master/src/templates/procedures_alternative_var_random_bits.pynml <-- I don't understand the return part
11:13<andythenorth>glx is there a way to just return the checked value?
11:13<andythenorth>obvs. I could STORE_TEMP and read it later
11:13<andythenorth>but I wanted to yield the result to the caller
11:13<+glx>you mean computed value ?
11:13<andythenorth>yes
11:14<+glx>just retrun
11:14<+glx>*return
11:14<+glx>without nothing else
11:15<+glx>"return; returns the computed value directly as a callback result. Note that the maximum value for callback results is 32511 (0x7EFF)." <-- from wiki about switches
11:15*andythenorth tests
11:15*andythenorth never read how switches work, I just cargo cult them :)
11:16<andythenorth>thanks glx
11:22<frosch123>https://github.com/OpenTTD/BaNaNaS/pull/71/files <- 2 of 11 urls fixed. the rest was already dead before the new wiki
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12:23<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Berbe commented on pull request #7286: Add #2155: newheightmapgame command https://git.io/JkoZD
12:26<DorpsGek_III>[OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Berbe updated pull request #7286: Add #2155: newheightmapgame command https://git.io/fhNZl
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12:57<TrueBrain>frosch123: it tells me the commit is out-of-date
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13:02<frosch123>that's a harsh check
13:02<frosch123>there is only one more commit in master, and it does not touch the same files
13:02<TrueBrain>normally it is better at indicating that it is a merge-free commit
13:04<frosch123>i disabled that requirement
13:04<frosch123>it's silly if it works like that
13:04<TrueBrain>it normally doesn't, honestly
13:04<TrueBrain>it detected something odd, it seems
13:06<frosch123>the explanation of that setting says, "This ensures pull requests targeting a matching branch have been tested with the latest code"
13:06<TrueBrain>did they change that recently or something?
13:06<frosch123>so they want to test whether changing apples breaks any oranges
13:07<frosch123>it's not enabled on openttd
13:07<frosch123>it's not enabled on nml
13:07<TrueBrain>https://github.blog/changelog/2020-11-16-packages-organization-admins-access-to-containers/ <- they finally fixed this :D
13:07<frosch123>so, was it freshly enabled on bananas?
13:07<TrueBrain>maybe we never noticed it was enabled?
13:08<TrueBrain>normally we don't approve PRs, we just use our admin powers to merge :P
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14:08*andythenorth draws trains
14:13<frosch123>TrueBrain: duckduck also works for site:wiki.openttd.org/en
14:13<frosch123>it may even make sense to make the search language specific
14:13<TrueBrain>yup
14:13<TrueBrain>was planning to do so :)
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15:49<andythenorth>too much democracy! https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1238354#p1238354
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---Logclosed Mon Nov 23 00:00:39 2020